Internet Movie Firearms Database - Guns in Movies, TV and Video Games - User contributions [en]

The Fate of the Furious

2017-01-18T16:39:32Z

Gunner313:

{{Upcoming}}
{{Infobox Movie|{{PAGENAME}}
|name=The Fate of the Furious
|picture=FF8.jpg
|caption=poster
|country=[[File:USA.jpg|25px]] United States
|director=F. Gary Gray
|date=2017
|language=English
|studio=Original Film One Race Films
|distributor=Universal Pictures
|character1=Dominic Toretto
|actor1=[[Vin Diesel]]
|character2=Luke Hobbs
|actor2=[[Dwayne Johnson]]
|character3=Letty Ortiz
|actor3=[[Michelle Rodriguez]]
|character4=Deckard Shaw
|actor4=[[Jason Statham]]
|character5=Roman Pearce
|actor5=[[Tyrese Gibson]]
|character6=Tej Parker
|actor6=[[Chris "Ludacris" Bridges]]
|character7=Mr. Nobody
|actor7=[[Kurt Russell]]
|character8=Cipher
|actor8=[[Charlize Theron]]
}}

'''''The Fate of the Furious''''' (aka ''Fast & Furious 8'') is the eighth installment in the [[:Category:Fast & Furious|Fast and the Furious film franchise]]. The 2017 sequel finds Dom ([[Vin Diesel]]) betraying his team and appearing to return to a life of crime while under the influence of a mysterious woman known as Cipher ([[Charlize Theron]]). The film was directed by F. Gary Gray, who is reunited with some of his cast from ''[[The Italian Job (2003)|The Italian Job]]'' ([[Jason Statham]] and Theron). Among newcomers to the series include [[Helen Mirren]] and [[Scott Eastwood]].

{{Film Title|The Fate of the Furious}}
__TOC__ 

{{spoilers}}
=Assault Rifles=
==AKMSU==
An operative on a snowmobile can be seen firing an [[AKMSU]] modified with a Magpul MOE handguard and Magpul Zhukov buttstock.
[[Image:AK-Krinkov.jpg|thumb|none|450px|AKMSU Krinkov - 7.62x39mm.]]
[[File:FF8 217.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
[[File:FF8 234.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

=Machine Guns=
==M134 Minigun==
[[File:M134.JPG|thumb|none|400px|General Electric M134 - 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[File:FF8 112.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

==M249E2 SAW==
Luke Hobbs ([[Dwayne Johnson]]) uses an [[M249-E2 SAW|M249E2 SAW]] fitted with an Trijicon MRO red dot sight.
[[File:Fn m249saw mk2 10-1-.jpg|thumb|none|450px|M249 SAW with 200-round ammo drum - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:FF8 305.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

{{Fast Furious}}
[[Category:Fast & Furious]]
[[Category:Movie]]
[[Category:Action Movie]]
[[Category:Crime]]

The Blacklist - Season 2

2015-04-05T01:57:32Z

Gunner313: /* Unknown */

{{ongoing}}

{{Infobox TV|The Blacklist - Season 2
|picture = TheBlacklistPoster.jpeg
|country = [[File:USA.jpg|25px]] USA
|channel = NBC
|genre = Crime
|dates = 2014-2015
|episodes = 22
|character1= Raymond "Red" Reddington
|actor1=[[James Spader]]
|character2= Elizabeth Keen
|actor2=[[Megan Boone]]
|character3= Harold Cooper
|actor3=[[Harry Lennix]]
|character6= Donald Ressler
|actor6=[[Diego Klattenhoff]]
}}

{{TV Title Season|2|Blacklist, The{{!}}The Blacklist}}

__TOC__ 

=Pistols=

==Browning Hi-Power==
Near the end of "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)", Raymond Reddington uses a Browning Hi-Power as his main sidearm.

[[File:BrowningHiPowerStd.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Browning Hi-Power "Type 73" - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 06.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reddington aims the Hi-Power at the door.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 07.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reddington checks the empty kitchen.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E03 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Hi-Power is aimed at Tom during a confrontation in a dream at the start of Dr. James Covington (No. 89)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 04.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A silenced Hi-Power is used by Reddington to assassinate Geoff Perl near the end of "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)".]]
[[File:BlacklitsS2E08 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A good closeup of the Hi-Power used to threaten Berlin near the end of "The Decembrist" (No. 12)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reddington with the Hi-Power after aiming it at gunmen employed by the King family in "T. Earl King VI (No. 94)".]]

==Colt M1903==
In a brief continuity error in "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)", Duncan Prince's Colt M1911A1 changes for a few seconds to a Colt M1903.

[[File:ColtM1903HammerlessWoodGrips.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Colt 1903 Hammerless - .32 ACP]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 06.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Prince holds the M1903 on his left hand when Dr. Creel confronts him.]]

==Colt M1911A1==
Duncan Prince is seen wielding a [[Colt M1911A1]] near the end of "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)".
[[Image:Colt-M1911A1.jpg|thumb|none|350px|The actual M1911A1 Pierce Brosnan used in ''The World Is Not Enough'' - .45 ACP]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The M1911A1 seen at Prince's left hand.]]

==Colt M1991A1==
A Colt M1991A1 version is seen in the hands of Yabari ([[Sahr Ngaujah]]) near the end of "T. Earl King VI (No. 94)" with Reddington using it later to settle the score with the Kings.
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Yabari aims the pistol at Reddington's head.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|You can see the Colt markings on the slide.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reddington aims the pistol at Tyler King.]]

==CZ 75B==
Berlin and his men in Russia are armed with the [[CZ 75B]] in the middle of "The Decembrist (No. 12)".
[[Image:Cz75b9mm.jpg|thumb|none|300px|CZ 75B - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklitsS2E08 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Berlin's men take out a VIP's security detail in the middle of "The Decembrist (No. 12)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E08 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A good closeup of the CZ 75B markings on the slide.]]

==CZ 75 SP-01 PHANTOM==
A [[CZ 75 SP-01 PHANTOM]] appears to be the sidearm of Dembe Zuma ([[Hisham Tawfiq]]) throughout the season, first appearing in "The Scimitar (No. 22)". One of Lord Baltimore's men uses a CZ 75 SP-01 PHANTOM as his sidearm when he raids the Hyland residence in "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)".

[[File:CZ 75 SP-01 Phantom.jpg|thumb|300px|none|CZ 75 SP-01 PHANTOM - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 17.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The silenced SP01 Phantom held on the right hand.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E07 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Dembe aims his sidearm at the Scimitar's head.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E10 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Dembe secures Braxton after he disarms him of his Glock 19 in "Luther Braxton Conclusion (No. 21)".]]

==Glock 17 (FAB Defense KPOS Glock to Carbine Conversion)==
Glock 17s outfitted with FAB Defense KPOS Glock to Carbine PDW Conversion Kits are used by some of the escapees who seized the CIA black site in "Luther Braxton (No. 21)".

[[File:KPOS G17.jpg|thumb|none|350px|A Glock pistol fitted in a FAB Defense KPOS Glock to Carbine PDW Conversion Kit]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E09 05.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Khalid Sankar aims his carbine at a wounded Samar during a shootout.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E09 06.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A good shot of the carbine.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E09 04.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An escapee aims his carbine at Ressler after being disarmed.]]

==Glock 19==
FBI agents, most notably Elizabeth "Liz" Keen ([[Megan Boone]]) and Donald Ressler ([[Diego Klattenhoff]]) are seen using Glock 19s throughout season 2. Tom Keen ([[Ryan Eggold]]) uses one in a dream at the start of "Dr. James Covington (No. 89)". Mossad agent Samar Navabi ([[Mozhan Marnò]]) uses the Glock 19 while in the task force under the cover of a FBI agent. A Front cultist named Chris Perez ([[Blake DeLong]]), infected with the Apophis Strain, uses Navabi's Glock 19 to shoot her near the end of "The Front (No. 74)". A Berlin agent disguised as a Homeland Security agent use it to shoot Fitch's aide in "The Decembrist (No. 12)".

[[File:Glock19pistol.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Glock 19, 3rd generation - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Liz grips her Glock 19 at the start of "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E03 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tom aims Liz's Glock 19 at her during the start of "Dr. James Covington (No. 89)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 04.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ressler aims his Glock 19 at a couple of university students in a raid in "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 05.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Navabi corner Dr. Creel after he takes Liz hostage.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E05 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The cultist wounds Navabi after using her own sidearm against her.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 07.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Glock 19 is aimed at Ezra when Liz finds him in "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E07 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Liz corners The Scimitar near the end of "The Scimitar (No. 22)".]]
[[File:BlacklitsS2E08 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Berlin agents aims his sidearm at Fitch in "The Decembrist (No. 12)".]]

==Makarov PM==
A Makarov PM is used by Ruslan Denisov ([[Faran Tahir]]) as his main sidearm throughout "Ruslan Denisov (No. 67)".

[[Image:PM.jpeg|thumb|none|300px|Russian Makarov PM - 9x18mm.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E11 04.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ruslan shoots a hostage after he did not receive a ransom.]]

==Smith & Wesson M&P Shield==
Raymond Reddington carries a [[Smith & Wesson M&P Shield]] as his sidearm when he confronts Maddox Beck to secure Apophis Strain vaccines in "The Front (No. 74)".
[[Image:Smith_Wesson_Shield.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Smith & Wesson M&P Shield - 9x19mm.]]
[[File:Blacklist_s2-shield-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Raymond pointing the S&W Shield at Maddox.]]
[[File:Blacklist_s2-shield-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Shield aimed at Maddox while he chats with him.]]
[[File:Blacklist_s2-shield-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Sights and manual safety visible on the Shield.]]
[[File:Blacklist_s2-shield-4.jpg|thumb|none|600px|In this shot, you can see the pistol's rear, which shows the thin frame and slide and distinctive slide/frame fit of the M&P series.]]

==Tokarev TT-33==
Yabari is seen showing off his Tokarev TT-33 at the start of "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)". One of Reddington's men pulls one out when he and Dembe corner the Major near the end of "The Major (No. 75)".

[[Image:TT-33.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Tokarev TT-33 - 7.62x25mm Tokarev. Tula Arsenal (Soviet Union) Note CCCP printing around the star on the plastic grips.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 16.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Yabari shouts to his men while he waves his TT-33.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E15 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reddington's man aims the TT-33 at the Major.]]

==X26 Taser==
Most of Lord Baltimore's men are armed with X26 Tasers when they storm the Hyland residence in "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)".

[[Image:X26-tazer.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Advanced Taser X26]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 17.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Taser is fired at a civilian.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 20.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Marcus ([[Adam David Thompson]]) fires his X26 to take out Liz.]]

==Walther PPK==
A Berlin turncoat named Vargas ([[Paul Reubens]]) uses a silenced Walther PPK near the end of "Dr. James Covington (No. 89)" with Reddington using it later to take care of his turncoat associate. A stainless steel version is used by Dr. Linus Creel ([[David Costabile]]) near the end of "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)". Tom Keen uses a silenced PPK during a mission in Dresden, Germany to take out an arms dealer in the middle of "The Major (No. 75)" and uses it without a silencer in "Tom Keen (No. 7)".

[[Image:WaltherPPkSilenced.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Walther PPK .380 with a sound suppressor - .380 ACP (Brown factory grips)]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E03 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Berlin arms dealer turncoat aims his silenced PPK at Reddington.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E15 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tom fires the silenced PPK at the arms dealer in Dresden.]]

[[File:PPK stainless.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Walther PPK stainless - 9mm Kurz aka .380 ACP]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Dr. Creel shoves the PPK on Liz's chin.]]

[[Image:Walther PPK-L right.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Walther PPK-L - .32 ACP]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E16 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tom does a brass check on his PPK in "Tom Keen (No. 7)".]]

=Revolvers=

==Enfield No. 2==
Most of Yabari's men are armed with [[Enfield No. 2]] revolvers throughout the start of "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)". Human traffickers uses the No. 2 as their sidearm at the start of "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)" uses one as his main sidearm.

[[File:Enfield No2.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Enfield No. 2 Mk I* - .38 S&W]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 10.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Cameroonian child soldier fires his Enfield No. 2 over Reddington's head.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 11.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Yabari's men threats Reddington with his loaded revolver.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 12.jpg|thumb|none|600px|You can see a good closeup of the No. 2 revolver.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Human trafficker fires his revolver at the Zuma family livestock.]]

==Smith & Wesson Number 3==

A [[Smith & Wesson New Model No.3]] with a pearl grip is used throughout "T. Earl King VI (No. 94)" as the sidearm used by the King family to settle differences by Russian roulette. Reddington uses it to execute the patriarch after escaping captivity.
[[Image:S&wno3nm.jpg|thumb|none|400px| Smith & Wesson New Model No.3]]

[[File:BlacklistS2E14 04.jpg|thumb|none|600px|You can see the pearl grip of the Number 3.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 05.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Francis King ([[Erik Jensen]]) aims the Number 3 at his temple.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 06.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tyler King ([[Alex Manette]]) aims the revolver at his temple before spotting Reddington.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 07.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reddington ([[James Spader]]) shoots Earl King with said revolver.]]

==Smith & Wesson Model 29==
Duncan Prince uses a Smith & Wesson Model 29 as his main weapon when he confronts Dr. Creel near the end of "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)".

[[File:Smith & Wesson Model 29-8.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Smith & Wesson Model 29]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Duncan aims the revolver at Dr. Creel.]]

==Smith & Wesson Model 686==
A Smith & Wesson Model 686 appears to be used by Maddie Thornhill ([[Meredith Holzman]]) to shoot people inside a bank at the start of "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)". Ali Hassan ([[Ramsey Farrahgallah]]) uses it as his sidearm in "The Scimitar (No. 22)" after he sees Reddington in his estate.

[[Image:S&W686Short.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson Model 686 -.357 Magnum]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 07.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Maddie opens fire inside a bank at the start of "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E07 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ali Hassan aims his sidearm at Reddington after he sees him trepass on his estate in "The Scimitar (No. 22)".]]

=Submachine Guns=

==Heckler & Koch MP5K==
The bank robbers in "The Monarch Douglas Bank (No. 112)" are all armed with Heckler & Koch MP5Ks.

[[File:MP5K-SEF.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MP5K - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E02 10.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A bank robber disguised as a painter aims his MP5K at bank customers in Warsaw, Poland.]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5A3==
The Heckler & Koch MP5A3 is seen in the hands of Francis King's men in "T. Earl King VI (No. 94)." GSG-9 operators use them during a raid in Munich in the middle of "Tom Keen (No. 7)".

[[File:MP5A3 F stock.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Heckler & Koch MP5A3 with Navy trigger group and MP5F stock - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 08.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The MP5A3 aimed at Reddington's back.]]

[[File:MP5A3RIS.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch MP5A3 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E16 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A GSG-9 operator interrogates an arms smuggler restrained in "Tom Keen (No. 7)".]]

==KRISS Vector==
One of Lord Baltimore's men was armed with a KRISS Vector in "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)", seen next to his corpse.

[[Image:KRISSVectorBlank.jpg|thumb|none|400px|TDI / KRISS USA Vector Blank Fire with EOTech red dot sight - .45 ACP]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 15.jpg|thumb|none|600px|You can see the buttstock and lower portion of the frame at the right side of the photo.]]

==IMI Micro Uzi==
Samar Navabi uses an IMI Micro Uzi to cover the advance of Agents Keen and Ressler in "The Monarch Douglas Bank (No. 112)". A Micro Uzi with a silencer is used by an assassin working for the Scimitar in "The Scimitar (No. 22)".

[[File:MicroUziPistol02.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Micro Uzi - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E02 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Samar opens fire at advancing Policja BOA operators.]]

[[Image:Miniuzi.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Micro Uzi with 32 round magazine and suppressor.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E07 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The assassin fires the sienced Micro-Uzi at Keen.]]

=Assault Rifles=

==AK-47==
An AK-47 is used by a human trafficker at the start of "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)".

[[Image:AK47WeWereSoldiersHeroGun.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Authentic AK-47 built from US Receiver. This is an '''Actual Screen used AK-47''' from the film We Were Soldiers (built by Cinema Weaponry) - 7.62x39mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An AK-47 held by a human trafficker at the right. The foliage makes the rifle a bit hard to see.]]

==AKS-47==
AKS-47 assault rifles are seen with some Uzbek Army commandos during a raid in "Ruslan Denisov (No. 67)".

[[Image:Poly Tech Model AK-47S Semi-Auto Carbine "Legend Series".jpg|thumb|none|400px|AKS-47 7.62x39mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E11 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Uzbek Army commandos open fire at SRU fighters during a raid.]]

==AKM==
An AKM rifle is used by an ex-Kenyon Family member turned survivalist before Liz disarms him of it near the end of "The Kenyon Family (No. 71)". An arms dealer in Dresden, Germany is seen holding it in the middle of "The Major (No. 75)".

[[Image:AKMRifle.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AKM, Stamped Steel Receiver w/ slant muzzle brake 7.62x39mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E12 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Liz shoulders the seized AKM at the survivalists.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E15 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The arms dealer practices handling with the AKM in Dresden.]]

==AKMS==
An AKMS rifle is used by a human trafficker at the start of "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)". Supreme Republic of Uzbekistan fighters and an Uzbek Army special forces soldiers use them throughout "Ruslan Denisov (No. 67)".

[[Image:AKMS.jpg|thumb|none|450px|AKMS, stamped steel receiver w/ slant muzzle brake and under-folding stock - 7.62x39mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The AKMS is fired at Dembe's family in "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E11 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A SRU fighter aims his AKMS at Orthodox Church worshipers in "Ruslan Denisov (No. 67)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E11 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|In this shot, you can see that the AKMS stock is folded.]]

==AKMSU==
Most of Reddington's men operating in Warsaw, Poland are armed with AKMSUs modified to carry railed foregrips near the end of "The Monarch Douglas Bank (No. 112)". A SRU fighter and an Uzbek Army commando use them in "Ruslan Denisov (No. 67)".

[[Image:AKPDW01.jpg|thumb|none|450px|AKMSU with RIS handguard - 7.62x39mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E02 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Reddington's men aims his railed AKMSU at Keen and Ressler.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E11 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A SRU fighter aims his AKMSU at Orthodox Church worshipers in "Ruslan Denisov (No. 67)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E11 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An Uzbek Army commando fires his assault rifle at SRU fighters during a raid.]]

==Colt Law Enforcement Carbine==
Colt Law Enforcement Carbines are seen in the hands of police officers and military personnel throughout the season.

[[File:Colt LE6920 SOCOM.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Colt LE6920 SOCOM Carbine - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E02 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Policja BOA officers attempt to breach the covert safehouse used by Keen and Ressler in the middle of "The Monarch Douglas Bank (No. 112)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E05 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|FBI SWAT officers clear an underground biological lab used by Maddox Beck in "The Front (No. 74)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 06.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A FBI HRT team advances with Liz to a log cabin in Sitka, Alaska near the end of "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)". The slight darkness is due to the scene being shot at night.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E09 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|US Marines in South Korea secure the transport holding Reddington at the start of "Luther Braxton (No. 21)".]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E12 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A FBI SWAT officer stacks up on the church in the Kenyon Family compound with Liz behind him in "The Kenyon Family (No. 71)".]]

==FN FS2000==
FN FS2000s are uncovered by GSG-9 operatives during a raid in "Tom Keen (No. 7)".

[[Image:Fnfs2000_1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|FN FS2000 flat-top version 5.56x45mm NATO]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E16 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ressler examines an arms cache of FS2000s during a raid in Munich, Germany.]]

==Norinco Type 56==
Norinco Type 56s are used by Yabari's men at the start of "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)".

[[File:M22.jpg|thumb|none|450px|M22, early milled receiver model without under-folding ("pig sticker") bayonet - 7.62x39mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 13.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Yabari's child soldier open fire with their Type 56s.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 14.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Type 56 held by a Yabari child soldier.]]

=Battle Rifles=

==FN FAL==
A FN FAL with a solid stock is used by human traffickers at the start of "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)".

[[Image:FN FAL 50 00.jpg|thumb|none|500px|FN FAL 50.00 - 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A human trafficker walks while porting the FAL.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E06 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|You can see two of the traffickers armed with FALs.]]

==Springfield M1A==
A Springfield M1A is seen in the hands of a young Nora Mills in a photo in "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)".

[[Image:SFA M1A.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory M1A - 7.62x51mm (.308 Winchester)]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 21.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Nora handles the Springfield M1A in a photo.]]

==Winchester 1873==
What appears to be a Winchester 1873 is used by an ex-Kenyon Family member turned survivalist to shoot David Kenyon after he does not go through with blowing the explosives inside the van near the end of "The Kenyon Family (No. 71)".

[[File:Uberti1873.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Winchester Model 1873 carbine - 1st generation rifle - 44-40 Cal]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E12 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The survivalist aims the 1873 at David from the top of a tree.]]

=Shotguns=

==Remington 887 Nitro Mag Tactical==

[[File:BlacklistS2E09 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

=Machine Guns=

==Browning M9191A4==
A Browning M1919A4 appears to be visible in Francis King's stash in "T. Earl King VI (No. 94)".

[[File:M1919a4 pre 1943.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Browning M1919A4 fitted with bolt latch - .30-06]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E14 09.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The machine gun is seen next to a parked WWII vintage Indian motorbike.]]

==M61 Vulcan==
M61 Vulcans are used by USAF F-22 fighters taking off from USAF Wright-Patterson near the end of "Luther Braxton (No. 21)".

[[Image:M61vulcan.jpg|thumb|none|500px|M61 Vulcan - 20mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E09 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|F-22s prepare to take off for a bombing run.]]

==PKM==
A possible PKM is mounted on top of a Cameroonian Humvee pursuing a kidnapped Reddington at the start of "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)".

[[Image:HungarianPKM.jpg|thumb|500px|none|PKM with latest version of Flash hider - 7.62x54mm R]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 09.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The PKM being fired at the jeep.]]

=Sniper Rifles=

==Desert Tactical Arms Stealth Recon Scout==
A Berlin agent has a Desert Tactical Arms Stealth Recon Scout at the front passenger seat of his sedan at the end of "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)". Ezra, the man shadowing Liz, uses the SRS as his main weapon, which was first seen at the end of "Dr. James Covington (No. 89)".

[[Image:DTA SRSB.jpg|thumb|none|500px|DTA Stealth Recon Scout - .338 Lapua Magnum. This rifle is from the inventory of The Specialists, LTD.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 08.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The SRS positioned at the Berlin agent's front passenger seat.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E03 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A SRS is seen in a portable gun case.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E04 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ezra walks off after he assassinates Dr. Creel near the end of "Dr. Linus Creel (No. 82)".]]

==Nemesis Arms Vanquish==
Nora Mills aka Lord Baltimore ([[Krysten Ritter]]) uses a Nemesis Arms Vanquish with a mounted riflescope and suppressor in "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)" to take out US Marshals guarding the Hyland residence.
[[File:Nemesis arms vanquish bare.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Nemesis Arms Vanquish - .308 Winchester]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Nora secures the riflescope.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 03.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The suppressor attached on the Vanquish's barrel.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 04.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Nora shoulders the Vanquish's buttstock after she takes out the second US Marshal.]]

==Remington 700PSS==
A Remington 700PSS is used by a CIA SAD agent operating in Tashkent near the end of "Ruslan Denisov (No. 67)".

[[Image:RemingtonPSS700.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Remington 700PSS .300 Win Mag with Leupold Mark 4 scope and Harris bipod]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E11 05.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A CIA SAD agent takes aim with the 700PSS at Reddington.]]

=Rocket Launchers=

==RPG-7==
Cameroonian child soldier use a RPG-7 in "Lord Baltimore (No. 104)" to take out a pursuing Humvee.

[[Image:Rpg-7-1-.jpg‎ |thumb|none|450px|RPG-7 - 40mm]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A RPG-7 is fired at the Humvee.]]

=Grenades=

==Model 7290 Flashbang==
A Model 7290 Flashbang is used by a Mossad kidon unit that apprehends Reddington in the middle of "Lord Baltimore" (No. 104). One is used at the start of "The Kenyon Family (No. 71)", which is erroneously shown as a smoke grenade.

[[Image:Model 7290.jpg|thumb|none|130px|Model 7290 flashbang grenade]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E01 05.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Model 7290 hurled on the ground after the pin is removed.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E12 00.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Model 7290 hurled inside the church of the Kenyon Family compound.]]

=Grenade Launchers=

==Defense Technologies 1315==
A DefTech 1315 grenade launcher is used by a CIA black ops site guard when Luther Braxton attempts to conduct a siege on the CIA prison site in "Luther Braxton (No. 21)".

[[Image:DefTech1315.jpg|thumb|none|400px|DefTech 1315 - 37mm.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E09 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|thumb|A CIA black ops guard prepares to use the grenade launcher. The smoke partially obstructs the view.]]

=Others=

==Warsaw Small Arms arsenal==
A hidden small arms arsenal at the kitchen of a doughnut shop in Warsaw is seen in "The Monarch Douglas Bank (No. 112)".

[[File:BlacklistS2E02 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The small arms arsenal.]]

==Black Market arsenal==
Vargas is seen checking out a variety of small arms in "Dr. James Covington (No. 89)".

[[File:BlacklistS2E03 04.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A variety of pistols are seen as Vargas checks out a FN Five-seveN. Note the FN F2000 Tactical on the lower right side.]]
[[File:BlacklistS2E03 05.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Another shot of the trunk after Vargas picks up the Five-seveN.]]

==Compound Bow==
Matthew Kincaid uses a compound bow to kill Lee Chung in "The Mombasa Cartel (No. 114)".

[[File:BlacklistS2E06 05.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Matthew with the bow as he sits at a campfire.]]

[[Category:Action]]
[[Category:Crime]]
[[Category:Detective]]
[[Category:Drama]]
[[Category:Mystery]]
[[Category:Television]]
[[Category:Thriller]]

Talk:The Blacklist - Season 2

2015-04-04T03:59:02Z

Gunner313:

==Unknown==

[[File:BlacklistS2E01 18.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]
:The silver pistol behind the right thigh of the first guy looks to me like a Smith and Wesson 5946, although I cannot be certain because of the distance. Does anyone else agree? --[[User:L.J. Gibbs|L.J. Gibbs]] ([[User talk:L.J. Gibbs|talk]]) 11:39, 26 December 2014 (EST)

[[File:BlacklistS2E05 02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

The unknown shotgun looks like a Remington 887 nitro mag tactical, with an Eotech. Gunner313

Demolition Man

2013-02-07T08:12:11Z

Gunner313: /* Smith & Wesson Model 686 snub */

[[Image:Demolition-man-poster.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''Demolition Man'' (1993)]]

''Demolition Man'' is a 1993 science-fiction action film starring [[Sylvester Stallone]] as John Spartan, a Los Angeles cop with a reputation for destruction who is found guilty of a crime he didn't commit and is sentenced to be frozen in a cryogenic prison along with his nemesis Simon Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]). When Phoenix escapes from the prison in the future world of San Angeles, Spartan is then unfrozen and asked to use his old school tactics to take down his archenemy. The film's cast also includes [[Sandra Bullock]], [[Benjamin Bratt]], and [[Denis Leary]]. The film is notable for featuring one of the first and only appearances of the [[Heckler & Koch G11]], an experimental rifle at the time that was portrayed as futuristic magnetic pulse rifle.

'''The following weapons were used in the film ''Demolition Man'':'''

__TOC__ 

=Handguns=

== Beretta 92FS ==
During the 1996 prologue, LAPD officer John Spartan ([[Sylvester Stallone]]), aka "The Demolition Man", carries only a [[Beretta 92FS]] as he jumps from an LAPD helicopter onto the roof of the building Simon Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) is holed up in. He also later uses one in his battle with Phoenix in the cryo prison.
[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Beretta 92FS - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Stallone_with_Beretta.jpg‎ |thumb|500px|none|A production still of Stallone as Spartan with Beretta.]]
[[Image:DemoMan 011.jpg‎ |thumb|600px|none|John Spartan ([[Sylvester Stallone]]) aims his Beretta 92FS at Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) at the beginning of the film.]]
[[Image:DemoMan 1211.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Spartan questions Phoenix about the whereabouts of the hostages, the [[Beretta 92FS]] still trained on him. ]]
[[Image:DemoMan 013.jpg‎ |thumb|600px|none|Close-up of the Beretta - Spartan prepares to fire, but Phoenix quickly points out that he is standing in a sea of gasoline. And Phoenix just happens to have a blowtorch handy.]]
[[File:DemoMan 269.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]

== Beretta 92FS Inox ==
In the future world of San Angeles, Spartan is seen using a [[Beretta 92 pistol series#Beretta Inox|Beretta 92FS Inox]], as identified by its slide-mounted safety, as his main sidearm. He retrieves it from the Hall of Violence during his shootout with Phoenix. He uses it most notably to shoot up the display screens and one of the ticket-dispensing machines in the office of Dr. Raymond Cocteau ([[Nigel Hawthorne]]).
[[Image:Beretta-Inox.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Beretta 92FS Inox - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:DemoMan 042.jpg‎ |thumb|600px|none|John Spartan ([[Sylvester Stallone]]) fires his Beretta 92FS Inox during the shootout in the museum.]]
[[Image:DemoMan - BerettInoxIsSpy 2.jpg|thumb|601px|none|After swearing once too often, John Spartan ([[Sylvester Stallone]]) prepares to use his Beretta Inox to shoot one of the ticket machines.]]

== IMI Desert Eagle Mark VII ==
Among the weapons used by the people living in the San Angeles sewer system is a [[Desert Eagle|IMI Desert Eagle]].
[[Image:DesertEagle357Black.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Desert Eagle MK VII - .357 Magnum.]]
[[Image:DemoMan - DeagleIsSpy 2.jpg|thumb|601px|none|One of the men in the underground aims his [[Desert Eagle|IMI Desert Eagle]] at Spartan.]]

==Smith & Wesson 3913NL==

A [[Smith & Wesson 3913]] is used by Phoenix, Spartan, and one of Phoenix's "CryoCons" ([[Jesse Ventura]]).
[[Image:S&W Model 3913.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Smith & Wesson 3913NL - 9x19mm. This is a screen used 3913 from the film ''[[Demolition Man]]'']]
[[Image:DemoMan 033.jpg‎ |thumb|601px|none| Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) fires his Smith & Wesson 3913NL at Spartan.]]
[[Image:DemoMan 069.jpg‎ |thumb|601px|none| Phoenix is dazed when he can´t bring himself to shoot Dr. Raymond Cocteau.]]
[[Image:DemoMan - S&WIsSpy 3.jpg |thumb|601px|none|Closeup. The Smith & Wesson logo is clearly visible but the "Lady Smith" inscription is absent which is indicative of the Smith and Wesson Model 3913NL "No Logo" or "Non-LadySmith".]]
[[File:DemoMan 258.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]

==Smith & Wesson 59==
During the final shootout in the cryo-lab, Spartan is seen dual-wielding the Beretta 92FS and what appears to be a [[Smith & Wesson 59]] handgun.
[[Image:Smith & Wesson 59.jpg|300px|thumb|none|Smith & Wesson 59 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:DemoMan 265.jpg|thumb|600px|none|During the final shootout in the cryo-lab, Spartan is seen dual-wielding the Beretta 92FS and what appears to be a [[Smith & Wesson 59]] handgun.]]
[[File:DemoMan 266.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]

== Smith & Wesson Model 686 snub==
Spartan uses a [[Smith & Wesson Model 686]] snub during the final shootout in the lab.
[[Image:S&W686Short.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Smith & Wesson Model 686 with 2 1/2" Barrel - .357 Magnum.]]
[[Image:DemoMan - S&WIsSpy.jpg|thumb|601px|none|One of the outcasts aims his Smith & Wesson Model 686 at Spartan, with Jack Black in the back ground.]]
[[Image:DemoMan - S&WIsSpy 2.jpg|thumb|600px|none|A [[Smith & Wesson Model 686]], about to be picked up ... ]]
[[Image:Sandra Bullock-S+W-DM.jpg|thumb|600px|none|... and subsequently used by Lenina Huxley ([[Sandra Bullock]]).]]
[[Image:Sandra Bulloc-DM.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Lenina points the gun at John Spartan ([[Sylvester Stallone]]).]]

== LAR Grizzly Win Mag ==
A [[LAR Grizzly Win Mag]] is used by Phoenix very briefly near the end of the film.
[[Image:3ecb78674deb2746bd03dd71b60ca782.jpg‎|thumb|400px|none|LAR Grizzly Win Mag .45 Winchester Magnum Mk1 with magazine removed]]
[[Image:DemoMan 051.jpg‎|thumb|601px|none|Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) takes cover, his [[LAR Grizzly Pistol]] in hand.]]

=Submachine Guns=

== Cobray M11/9 ==
A [[Cobray M11/9]] is among the weapons procured by Phoenix from the museum. It is later used by Phoenix to shoot at Spartan during the final scene in the cryo-lab.

[[Image:M11SMG.jpg|thumb|none|350px|SWD M11/9 - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:DemoMan - ShotgunIsSpy 2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Cobray M11/9 (left), next to the Remington 870.]]
[[Image:DemoMan - MAC10IsSpy 2.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) discards the now empty Cobray.]]

== Heckler & Koch MP5K ==
A [[Heckler & Koch MP5K]] is used by one of Phoenix's men at the beginning of the film. Phoenix also acquires a number of MP5Ks from the museum armory in 2032, which are used by henchmen, as well as Phoenix himself.

[[Image:MP5K-SEF.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Heckler & Koch MP5K - version with SEF Plastic Trigger Pack - 9x19mm.]]
[[Image:DemoMan 004.jpg‎|thumb|600px|none|A thug employed by Phoenix fires at Spartan down an elevator shaft.]]

The MP5K used by Phoenix in the museum shootout is fitted with a PDW folding stock to emulate an [[Heckler & Koch MP5K-PDW|MP5K-PDW]] (though it is not a genuine MP5K-PDW, as evidenced by the lack of an extended barrel and Navy trigger group).

[[Image:MP5K-PDWEarly.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch MP5K with PDW folding stock - 9x19mm ]]
[[Image:DemoMan 036.jpg‎|thumb|601px|none|Phoenix firing a [[Heckler & Koch MP5K]] (this one fitted with the PDW folding stock) and [[Smith & Wesson 3913]]]]

== Heckler & Koch MP5A2 ==
A [[Heckler & Koch MP5A2]] is seen used briefly during the fight at the museum.
[[Image:H&KMP5A2WideForearm.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Heckler & Koch MP5A2 with "tropical" wide handguard - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:DemoMan 030.jpg‎|thumb|601px|none|Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) once again faces off with John Spartan ([[Sylvester Stallone]]), his [[Heckler & Koch MP5|MP5A2]] at the ready. ]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5A3==
[[File:DemoMan 218.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]
[[File:DemoMan 222.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]

=Shotguns=
== Remington Spartan Sawed-off Double Barrel Shotgun ==
The double barreled shotgun that John Spartan takes out of the display case is the [[12 Gauge Double Barreled Shotgun#12 Gauge Side by Side Shotgun|Remington Spartan]].
[[Image:IGA-Coach-Gun.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Stoeger/IGA Coach imported side by side shotgun - 12 Gauge]]
[[Image:DemoMan 037.jpg‎|thumb|600px|none|Spartan ([[Sylvester Stallone]]) goes after Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) during the museum shootout with his Remington double barreled shotgun.]]
[[File:DemoMan 235.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]

== Remington 870 Shotgun (Sawed-off) ==
Phoenix also uses a sawed-off [[Remington 870 Shotgun]] in the museum shootout.
[[Image:SawnoffShotgun2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Remington 870 with sawed off barrel and stock - 12 gauge]]
[[Image:DemoMan 026.jpg‎|thumb|none|600px|An excited Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) checks his [[Remington 870]].]]

=Rifles=
=="Magnetic Accelerator" Rifle (Heckler & Koch G11 mockup)==
During the museum shootout, Phoenix wonders, "Wait a minute, this is the future. Where are all the phaser guns?" So he finds a futuristic particle Beam gun which is called a "Magnetic Accelerator". This rifle in reality appears to be the [[Heckler & Koch G11]] fitted with a laser sight and other embellishments. As the actual G11 was in the experimental stage at the time and the fact it was never actually fired in the film, this rifle was most likely a mockup.

[[Image:G11-1.jpg‎|thumb|500px|none|Heckler & Koch G11 K1 - 4.73x33mm]]
[[File:DemoMan 249.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]
[[Image:DemoMan 043.jpg‎ |thumb|601px|none|Simon Phoenix ([[Wesley Snipes]]) aims the "Magnetic Accelerator" (a mockup of the [[Heckler & Koch G11]]) at Spartan.]]
[[Image:DemoMan 044.jpg‎ |thumb|601px|none|Closeup of the rifle as it's about to discharge a particle beam.]]
[[Image:DemoMan - G11IsSpy.jpg|thumb|601px|none|Phoenix ponders the question were he might find batteries for his newly acquired "Magnetic Accelerator".]]
[[File:DemoMan 223.jpg|thumb|600px|none]]

== Ruger AC556F ==
An [[Ruger Mini-14|AC556F]] is used by one of Phoenix's new gang members in the fight in the sewers.

[[Image:RugerAC556folder.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Ruger AC556F with stock folded - 5.56x45mm]]
[[Image:DemoMan 062.jpg|thumb|601px|none|A [[Ruger Mini-14|AC556F]] lies on the table while Phoenix explains to the defrosted criminals that they finally have a chance to get even with John Spartan.]]
[[Image:DemoMan 063.jpg|thumb|601px|none|One of Phoenix´s men fires his [[Ruger Mini-14|AC556F]] at Spartan and officer Huxley.]]

== Norinco Type 56-1==

The Chinese [[Norinco Type 56-1]] is used by Phoenix and his future gang at many points in the movie, most notably to execute all the workers in the cryoprison.

[[Image:Type56S.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Norinco Type 56-1 (under-folding stock variant) - 7.62x39mm]]
[[Image:DemoMan 048.jpg‎ |thumb|none|601px|Phoenix mows down the unarmed cryoprison workers with his Chinese Type 56-1 assault rifle.]]

=Machine Guns=

== M60 ==
An [[M60]] is briefly seen mounted near a window of the building Spartan goes into to find Phoenix at the beginning.
[[Image:M60.jpg|thumb|none|500px|M60 machine gun - 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:DemoMan 007.jpg‎|thumb|600px|none|One of two [[M60]] in the hideout used by Phoenix.]]

=Other=
== Double Barreled Flare Pistol==
Edgar Friendly ([[Denis Leary]]) is seen using a double barreled pistol as his weapon of choice. According to [https://secure.longmountain.com/just-for-fun/movie-guns/DemolitionMan/ Long Mountain Outfitters], the weapon is a Japanese double-barreled flare pistol, possibly a 28mm Kayaba Type 90, adopted by Japanese Imperial Navy in 1930.
[[File:DMFlare.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Japanese double-barreled flare pistol used in the film, from the [https://secure.longmountain.com/just-for-fun/movie-guns/DemolitionMan/ Long Mountain Outfitters site].]]
[[Image:DemoMan 066.jpg|thumb|601px|none|Mr. Friendly ([[Denis Leary]]) with his pistol.]]
[[Image:DemoMan 068.jpg|thumb|601px|none|Friendly fires the pistol.]]

="Hall of Violence" Armory=
In the future, Phoenix visits the "Hall of Violence", which numerous other handguns, rifles and machine guns (apparently along with copious amounts of spare ammunition) are displayed for the citizens. Both Phoenix and Spartan procure their old-school weapons from this armory. (All weapons only seen in the armory and not actually used by the characters will be put here.)

== IMI Uzi ==
A [[Uzi|IMI Uzi]] is among the firearms on display in the museum's armory.
[[Image:Uzi.jpg|thumb|none|400px|IMI Uzi - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:DemoMan - IMIIsSpy 2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A [[Uzi|IMI Uzi]] in a display case. Right above the SMG is an [[Ithaca 37]] "Stakeout" shotgun.]]

==Gatling Gun==
A [[Gatling Gun]] is prominently displayed in the hall next to various cannons.
[[Image:Gatling.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
[[Image:DemoMan 030.jpg‎|thumb|601px|none|The Gatling gun is seen next to the cannons. ]]

==Various Weapons==
[[Image:DM 105.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Two Colt Single Action Army revolvers are seen on the Wild West mannequin as Phoenix enters the armory.]]
[[Image:DM 109.jpg|thumb|600px|none|In addition to the M1928A1 Thompson right above him, Phoenix is seen looking at what appears to be a shorthand history of U.S. infantry rifles, with the Winchester lever actions, what might be a Krag-Jørgensen carbine, a M1903 Springfield, an M1 Garand, and a post-war M1 Carbine. ]]
[[Image:DM 112.jpg|thumb|600px|none|There appears to be here a good H&K representation in the armory. The weapons are (from top to bottom): An MP5A2, an MP5K with PDW stock, MP5A3, Steyr AUG, Uzi, Ruger AC556K, two sawed-off shotguns (possibly the Remington 870 used by Phoenix), a regular MP5K, FN FAL 50.61, and HK21.]]
[[Image:DM 113.jpg|thumb|600px|none|A G3, an AKM, an M16, FN FAL's and on the far right, an M11/9.]]
[[Image:DM 114.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Several revolvers and automatic handguns are seen at the bottom.]]
[[File:DemoMan 230.jpg|thumb|600px|none|An MG42 and a Lewis gun are seen.]]

[[Category:Movie]]
[[Category:Science-Fiction]]
[[Category:Comedy]]
[[Category:Action Movie]]

Talk:Get Carter (2000)

2013-01-10T01:05:33Z

Gunner313:

In the opening credits a revolver is seen next to the Beretta 92 (assuming it is Carter's). Does any body know what kind of revolver it was? I was thinking a K-frame but was not sure.

Mickey Rourke was also using a nickel snub revolver in the film. Just saw it on TV, so do not expect screencaps. *sadface* 
One more thing: First Carter was packing a 92FS, then he used a Centurion throughout the film, and switched back to a 92FS in the end. Is it possible that he was carrying a 92FS '''and''' a Centurion slide so he could swap them anytime? Or more likely was this a goof... *trollface* - [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 16:45, 20 August 2011 (CDT)

The revolver in the opening credits is a S&W Model 38/49 Bodyguard with pearl grips and Carter does start out with a Centurion and keeps it until he drops it in the woods, when he gives the rich tech guy a second chance. --[[User:Gunner313|Gunner313]] ([[User talk:Gunner313|talk]]) 19:46, 9 January 2013 (EST)

Talk:Get Carter (2000)

2013-01-10T00:46:53Z

Gunner313:

In the opening credits a revolver is seen next to the Beretta 92 (assuming it is Carter's). Does any body know what kind of revolver it was? I was thinking a K-frame but was not sure.

Mickey Rourke was also using a nickel snub revolver in the film. Just saw it on TV, so do not expect screencaps. *sadface* 
One more thing: First Carter was packing a 92FS, then he used a Centurion throughout the film, and switched back to a 92FS in the end. Is it possible that he was carrying a 92FS '''and''' a Centurion slide so he could swap them anytime? Or more likely was this a goof... *trollface* - [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 16:45, 20 August 2011 (CDT)

The revolver in the opening credits is a S&W Model 38 Bodyguard with pearl grips and Carter does start out with a Centurion and keeps it until he drops it in the woods, when he gives the rich tech guy a second chance. --[[User:Gunner313|Gunner313]] ([[User talk:Gunner313|talk]]) 19:46, 9 January 2013 (EST)

Talk:The Avengers (2012)

2012-10-18T03:16:45Z

Gunner313:

== Nick Fury's pistol ==

Didn't see it in the trailer, but you saw Nick Fury with a pistol in a promo image released a while ago. Can't make it out very well, but my guess would be a [[SIG-Sauer P228]]. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 17:55, 11 October 2011 (CDT)
[[File:Nick-fury-avengers.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]

== Airtronic RPG-7 ==

That is one...ugly ugly...What are all those rails for? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:55, 11 October 2011 (CDT)

:I guess the makers of the weapon wanted it to be all... 'tacti-cool'? But I agree, the rails on that weapon are too much. What the hell is the shooter going to put on them? ACOG sights? M68 Aimpoints? Night vision scopes? Heartbeat sensors? Sorry, those would not look right on an RPG. --[[User:ThatoneguyJosh|ThatoneguyJosh]] 03:40, 12 October 2011 (CDT)

:You could put a PEQ2 on it. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 00:42, 7 May 2012 (CDT)

==Add'l Screenshots==

[[File:Avengers-promos-pictures-03.jpg|thumb|501px|none|A production photo of Black Widow firing the Glock 26s.]]

[[Image:AvengersG26.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A pic from the trailer shows Black Widow with her holstered Glock 26s.]]

== Hawkeye's Bow ==

It plays an important role in the film (like with Rambo & his bow). If we can identify it can we include it? --[[User:ZombieKiller|ZombieKiller]] 01:26, 14 October 2011 (CDT)
[[File:Avengers-promos-pictures-03.jpg|thumb|601px|none|]]
:I think it can be listed as it has a pretty prominent role but that is just my oppinion. I believe the bow is a modified Hoyt Buffalo, with a sight and cosmetic fake hinges added where the limbs attach (at least I assume they are fake for the working model). --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 15:25, 16 October 2011 (CDT)
:[[File:Hoyt Buffalo.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Hoyt Buffalo]]
:: At least one model of bow is a compact one that can fold up tightly. When Hawkeye needs to use it, he thrusts forward and the arms snap into place. I think that was a special prop due to the difficulties in getting a stringed bow to fold up and snap out like that, and they switch to a slightly modified composite bow after.

==Weapon==
I think soem of the SHEILD Agents had SIG 552s, and there may have been an AUG A3. Can anyone confirm that?--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 18:01, 6 May 2012 (CDT)
I know I saw an AUGA3. I'm not sure about the SIG though I was too busy enjoying the film.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 18:19, 6 May 2012 (CDT)
: Definatly an AUG A#, some ofthe Diplomats, some SIG 552s, and the first guy into the bridge seemed to have a Micro Galil.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 18:03, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

== Hawkeye's Pistol ==

Just to be pedantic, how can we be sure Hawkeye's sidearm is a P30 and not an HK45? Because when I saw the film today I didn't see anything to swing it either way. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:52, 7 May 2012 (CDT)
:The HK45 has a squared trigger guard, I'm not 100% sure but Hawkeye's looked to have the curved trigger guard of the P30. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 16:10, 7 May 2012 (CDT)
:: Well I just got caught up on the fact the holster he's wearing looks like [http://www.imidefense.com/Products/Polymer-Holsters/Heckler-and-Koch/IMI-Z1220.html the one IMI makes for the HK45] (Although it's mounted on a Safariland leg rig for some reason), since it has the same style of trigger-guard retention and the cut over the ejection port that the [http://www.imidefense.com/Products/Polymer-Holsters/Heckler-and-Koch/IMI-Z1380.html P30 holster] lacks. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 16:41, 7 May 2012 (CDT)
:::You could be right, I was too engrossed in the film to be looking carefully at the guns being used to be honest. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 16:44, 7 May 2012 (CDT)
::::All HK45s have a frame safety don't though? This pistol doesn't which is why I ID'd it as a P30? Could be wrong though, was just going off that one promo image. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:45, 7 May 2012 (CDT)
:::::Yes, it does. Said safety can also be moved to the other side of the weapon for left-handed shooting, as appears to be the case here. Quoting from [http://www.hk-usa.com/military_products/hk45_general.asp HK USA]: "An improved USP-style control lever, a combination safety and decocking lever, is frame mounted on the HK45 and is quickly accessible. The HK45 control lever has a positive stop and returns to the “fire” position after decocking.

:::::By using the modular approach to the internal components first pioneered by HK on the USP, the control lever function of the HK45 can be switched from the left to the right side of the pistol to accommodate left-handed shooters (additional parts required). Left and right mounted control levers provide safety and/or decocking functions as required and can be fitted to the pistol simply by changing parts. For true ambidextrous use, a control lever can also be mounted on both sides of the pistol if required." [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 17:18, 7 May 2012 (CDT)

::::::I still think it is a P30. Below is a larger cropped and brightened image:
::::::[[File:Hawkeye pistol.jpg|thumb|400px|none|]]
::::::First off, I think the holster is just a Blackhawk CQC serpa holster made for the P30 (although I think it does also fit the HK45C, which is the version of the HK45 it would be if it was one). If you look at the above pistol there is a join on the grip that sweeps upwards to the back of the grip which is present on the P30, but on the HK45 there are no markings on the side of grip aside from the textured panels. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 17:39, 7 May 2012 (CDT)
:::::::OK, I stand corrected. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 17:48, 7 May 2012 (CDT)

== M&P ==
There's an extreme close up of it in the credits, just making a note of that. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 16:38, 7 May 2012 (CDT)

== Alien Weapons ==

Has anyone been able to get a screen capture of the alien rifles used in the movie?

Even if we did, we don't do alien guns unless it is really necessary or if it was a prop built on a real gun [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 12:18, 15 May 2012 (CDT)

:You can see them well enough in [http://www.uruloki.org/felipeblog/images2012-1/20120414_the_avengers_villanos_2-xl.jpg this] promo image (might actually be concept art but that is exactly what the weapons look like in the film) to tell that they are not based on anything, and there is no chance they would be mistaken for a real gun, so don't think they should be included. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 12:24, 15 May 2012 (CDT)

:Most of them look like sticks with blades on them, but that huge rifle Coulson used looked to at least have parts of real guns. I didn't get a good look, but I think that's the only fiction gun worth worrying about. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 04:08, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

== Mercenaries? (spoilers) ==

Right now the page describes the people accompanying Hawkeye when he attacks the heli-carrier as mercenaries, but this isn't the case is it? Unless I missed something they are brainwashed SHIELD agents aren't they? --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 05:38, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

This was my thought also, I think it should be changed. --[[User:Sidewinder Forge|Sidewinder Forge]] 08:47, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

Chances are at least some of them are mercenaries '''*SPOILER*''' it is referenced in the movie when Loki is talking to Hawkeye in the cave before they go to germany that Hawkeye was able to get so many people to join Loki because of the amount of enemies SHIELD had. This implies that the people helping Loki outside of Hawkeye and Erik Selvig are not members of SHIELD. [[User:Dover500|Dover500]] 09:18, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

:I don't remember that line, but I would imagine that other SHIELD personnel must have been turned as I doubt things like the Quinjet are off the shelf and would have to have come from a shield base somewhere presumably with some personnel. Regardless, I don't think they should be referred to as mercenaries as that is purely an assumption. I think it would be simpler (and less spoilery) just to refer to them as "Hawkeye's team". If you have seen the film you will know what that means, and if you haven't it gives nothing away. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 09:54, 16 May 2012 (CDT)
::This might be a little old but i also remmeber mentioning that there were people who would gladly help since they hated SHIELD--[[User:Dillinger|Dillinger]] ([[User talk:Dillinger|talk]]) 04:07, 4 October 2012 (EDT)

== Grenade ==
I think the grenade is an old style ALS flashbang (NFDD), same as the one used on The Unit.
gunner313

Talk:Call of Duty: Black Ops

2011-01-30T00:17:22Z

Gunner313: /* SOG Knife */

= Wonder Weapons and Miscellaneous Weapons =

== Ray Gun ==

The Ray Gun is available in Call of Duty: Black Ops, only in the Nazi Zombies game mode. While still being very powerful, the gun has a tendency to make crawlers on later rounds more often. Although this can be very useful, it can also create problems for the player, as the player may be caught unaware by them.

[[Image:446px-BORayGun.png|thumb|none|400px|The Ray Gun in-game.]]

== Wunderwaffe DG-2 ==

The Wunderwaffe only appears in Shi No Numa and Der Riese as part of the hardened and prestige editions. In the new maps, the weapon is replaced by its spiritual successor, the Thundergun. When Pack-a-Punched in Der Riese it becomes gold-plated. In one of the intel pieces, a group of wunderwaffe projects are referred to. One of the projects listed is the Die Glocke.

[[Image:Wunderwaffe_DG-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Wunderwaffe DG-2 in-game.]]

== Thundergun ==

This is a weapon featured in the level Kino der Toten. It pushes back zombies with such force that it kills them and should be used only to push back zombies if the player(s) are crowded and cornered considering its low ammunition it starts out with. It becomes the "Zeus Cannon" when upgraded. It also appears in as a easter egg in the Call of Duty: Black Ops campaign level Numbers. It is strongly hinted that it was created by Dr. Maxis.

[[Image:621px-Thundergun.png|thumb|none|400px|The Thundergun in-game.]]

== Winter's Howl ==

This weapon is featured in "Five" and Zombie Verruckt, but only in Call of Duty Black Ops. It is able to freeze zombies on impact, lowering their health drastically. In later rounds, it seems to make zombies health go down and takes a couple of seconds to freeze. It has a 6 round magazine and 24 shots in reserve. When pack-a-punched, it becomes Winter's Fury, and has a 9 round magazine and 36 shots in reserve. Frozen zombies have ice surrounding them. It is currently unknown who created it, but it is possible that the Americans created it because of where you find it (the Pentagon).

[[Image:WintersHowl.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Winter's Howl in-game.]]

== SOG Knife ==
The SOG Knife is a special knife used by the player (as Alex Mason) in the mission "Victor Charlie". This is the only time the SOG Knife is in use.

It is not a SOG knife it is a Randall Model #14 Attack. Gunner 313 I don't know why you erased my comment if you don't believe me just look up the model of knife I posted or do some research. The SOG knife has a different blade design.
Gunner 313
[[Image:Shot0159.jpg|thumb|none|600px|SOG Knife in idle.]]

[[Image:Shot0167.jpg|thumb|none|600px|SOG Knife been drawn.]]

== Tomahawk ==
The Tomahawk axe is a melee weapon that replaces the throwing knife (or tactical knife) from ''[[Modern Warfare 2]]'' in mutliplayer. In single-player, it's only available on the mission "Rebirth" after obtaining it from a Russian harbor worker and killing him with it.
[[Image:Tomahawk-BO.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tomahawk in Create-a-Class.]]
[[Image:Tomahawk-BOthrow.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A Tomahawk being thrown.]]

== Ballistic Knife ==
The ballistic knife is a powerful melee weapon that available only in multiplayer and zombie modes. The knife is firing blades with a spring inside the body. In real life, this knife is used by Russian special forces units like Spetsnaz.
[[Image:BK-BO.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The ballistic knife being reloaded.]]

== Crossbow ==

The Crossbow is a new weapon that featured in ''Call of Duty: Black Ops''. It is speculated to fulfill the role of a quiet, long range weapon. The crossbow appears in the campaign mission "WMD", which is set in the Ural Mountains, 1968. Crossbows can have different types of bolts which it can fire, such as normal bolts and Explosive bolts. The crossbow is a military grade crossbow that can attach a scope, which the player can steady.

[[Image:Shot0205.jpg|thumb|none|550px|Crossbow in idle.]]

[[Image:Shot0206.jpg|thumb|none|550px|Crossbow in reloading.]]

== Flamethrower ==

A flamethrower of unknown model has been confirmed to be in Call of Duty: Black Ops as found in the "GKnova6 document" which can be found here: [http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr135/priceman14/doc10.jpg]
The document only refers to it as "Improvised Weaponry" in "Phase 1 Testing" with most of the other information redacted.

Another model appears as an underbarrel attachment.

The image used by www.codblackopsblog.com
[http://www.codblackopsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Black-Ops-Weapons-Flamethrower.jpg]

Reference image of Flamethrowers in Call of Duty: World at War, a past Treyarch game that featured flamethrowers. Image from www.gameinformer.com
[http://blog.al.com/techcetera/2008/12/Pelilucodwaw.jpg]

[[Image:PSG1pic.JPG|thumb|none|500px|Flamethrower mounted on FAMAS F2 FELIN. ''Note ankward M16 handguard'']]

== Main Knife ==

The knife returns in Call of Duty: Black Ops. It is still a one-hit kill, but unlike the previous versions, seems to cause a very large fountain of blood to appear after knifing an enemy.

[[Image:659px-KnifeBlackOpsMultiplayer.png|thumb|none|500px|The Main Knife in-game.]]

== Prison Knife ==

The Prison Knife is a melee weapon used in the mission "Vorkuta" in Call of Duty: Black Ops. It appears to be a jagged piece of scrap metal, similar to a 'shank' or 'shiv'. After Mason acquires another weapon, the prison knife is no longer equipped, and is only used by pressing the melee button. You can see blood on the blade, probably from stabbing the prison guard. Upon closer expection though, I found out it is just a piece of glass with black tape around the handle.

[[Image:624px-Prisonknife.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Prison Knife in-game.]]

== Karambit Knife ==

The Karambit Knife is a combat knife used in the Call of Duty: Black Ops mission Executive Order. It is used to kill a Russian soldier by sticking it into the soldier's spinal cord, killing him, allowing the player and Frank Woods to take their uniform and infiltrate the launch site. Though this blade is used only by US Federal Air Marshals currently, Mason and Woods could have used it instead of a normal blade to aid in the purpose of the mission. Unlike a normal blade, it is shaped like a jungle cat's claw.

[[Image:561px-Karambit_Knife.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Karambit Knife in-game.]]

== Bowie Knife ==

The Bowie Knife is a special melee weapon which can be bought for 3000 points in Der Riese, Kino der Toten and Five. It is larger and wider than the standard combat knife in Call of Duty: Black Ops (or any Call of Duty game for that matter). It increases Knife damage from 150 to 1150, making it a one-hit-kill for zombies from Round 1 to Round 11. It is a one-hit-kill to Hellhounds all the way up until the third hellround.

[[Image:BowieKnifePolkCompetition2-1024.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Bowie Knife in Real Life.]]

[[Image:Bowie.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Bowie Knife in-game.]]

=Discussion=
This game has a cold war look to it

==AK74u==

In game, it is a ak74u, not an aks74u. U=carbine S=folding stock.
The in game models are all mssing stocks, so are only an ak74u, as they are called in game. It should be noted as such, im sick of having to re change the main page and want to get this cleared up/

I don't care if there's no stock, there's no such designation as "AK-74u". Also, try unlocking the "grip" attachment for it. That adds the stock back on. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:00, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

AK74 is base model, u means shortened, s means folding stock, etc. So chopping stock off makes it a 74u

I am fully aware of what the designations mean. Find me an actual AK-74 carbine produced from the factory without the side-folder and actually labelled "AK-74u" (cannot be simply an AKS-74U with the stock detached), and I'll gladly change it back. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:16, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

It doesnt matter how it left the factory, it matters how you modify it. If you put a 4.25 inch barrel and slide on a full sized 1911 do you call it a government model or a commander? I mean its a commander model but left the factory a government.....

This isn't the Call of Duty Wiki, kid. We don't promote misinformation as fact like they do there. We refer to and classify firearms as they are in the ''real'' world, not the ''game'' world. That means referring to it by its ''actual'' name (AKS-74U, not AK-74U) and classification (carbine, not SMG). It doesn't matter what it's called in the game. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:09, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Im trying to put the corerect designation, maybe even note there is a ak74 u and a aks74u, remember that we cant say a gun has a folding stock if it has NO stock. a 7.5 inch barreled ar with a stock is a carbine, taking the stock of its an ar pistol, not a ar stockless rifle.

But "AK-74U" is ''not'' the correct designation. Look at the [[I Am Legend]] page and you'll note that even though Will Smith's AR is modified to appear as an M4A1 in the movie, we still classify it based on what it ''came out of the factory as'', a Colt Law Enforcement Carbine. Also not that the most recent AK iterations as well as the AN-94 all have side-folding stocks, yet no "S" in their designations. Your AR "pistol" comparison also has no validity in that those so-called "pistols" all fire the same full-sized .223 cal./5.56mm ammunition and as such are pistols ''in name only''. So like HashiriyaR32 said, unless you can provide proof of an actual real life AK-74 carbine ''factory-produced'' without a folding stock and bearing the in-game designation, it stays AKS-74U. You're in the domain of the "gun nerds" and real life fact takes priority over in-game fiction. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:38, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

I've got to say I totally back Spartan. There isnt such a designation as the AK-74U, and while the 'S' does signify the side folding stock, if you took an AKS-74 and removed the stock, would you call it a regular AK-74? [[User:Chablar|Chablar]]

==Accuracy of Game==
I have Black Ops and have beaten the campaign, while the missions range from 1961 to 1968 the game is LOADED with anachronisms, im not sure an alternate reality would explain for having FAMAS F1s ( ''In fact, FELIN´s'' --[[User:Werc|Werc]]) and AUG A1s in the 1960s. Also they have the M16 in Vietnam with a so-called Masterkey system on it, im not sure that they had Masterkeys in Vietnam but it looks to be an Ithaca 37 stakeout attatched to the M16, also nearly ALL of the NVA soldiers are armed with SPAS-12 which is completely wierd. Any comments from people who have played the game?
: Yeah, you are right. If this game would be atleast fun. But its boring, MP is even worse than in MW2 ( ''And MW2 had worst MP of all'' ''times'' ), SP is boring like hell. There is nothin such as AI. Storyline is boring an unoriginal. Weapons are both anachronistic and unrealistic. Nothing like kicback even on Mosin Nagant ? '''THIS GAME SUCKS, just like MW2 did''' --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:09, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
::Do you get a nickel from EA every time you rag on the game? And there are many things I can say about the story, but "unoriginal" is not one of them. I have yet to play another FPS where the player is mentally ill and one of the main characters is merely a hallucination. (Unless there's an "A Beautiful Mind" FPS I don't know about.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:50, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

well i enjoyed it , and if i tape a shotgun under the barrel of my M16 why cant i call it a masterkey . simmons 8492

I know that most of the weapons in the game are anachronistic and that's a little bit sad for a cold war game, but a lot of those firearms are never seen in video games, that's one thing that made me like it. Perhaps,I enjoyed the stroryline from the begining to the end, I love the Zombie mode and the multiplayer is great (at least when I play with my friends). --[[User:VillageFroid|VillageFroid]] 19:19, November 11 2010 (UTC)
:If you guys are wondering, the Masterkey was invented around the 1980s and 1990s so it's anachronistic for it to be there. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:27, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

==AKS74U a RIFLE, not a SMG!!!!==

It seems like its cool to put the 74u as a subgun these days, WTF. Its a Short carbine.
:It's an SMG.
:: '''LoL.'''
::Traditionally, a carbine is defined as a shorter variant of a full sized rifle, which the AKS-74U clearly is. The definition is a bit looser today. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:54, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:::The AKS-74U is a Carbine, meaning shortened assault rifle. The AK-74 is the main model. The "S" means its a Carbine. The "U" means it has a folding stock. --ZEER
:::: No :) "S" ( Sklopnyj - somehing like "foldable") means folding stock and "U" ( Ukrochenyj - Shortened ) means carbine :)
::::: "Sklopnyj" - from what language is this word? In Russian is no such word. At least I have in 41 years that have not heard:) In Russian "foldable" sounds - "Skladnoy". But also begins with the letter S.[[User:Slow Rider|Slow Rider]] 21:41, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

An SMG is a machine gun shooting pistol caliber rounds, which 5.45x39mm doesn't qualify as.

At least this time around they managed to get the name of the gun right. :/ [[Special:Contributions/124.148.203.141|124.148.203.141]] 07:41, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

A carbine is a short rifle, not a shortened assault rifle. I don't think the Mosin Nagant is a assault rifle or the M44 Carbine Mosin Nagant is a shortened assault rifle. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:38, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:From tactical point of view AKS-74U can be classified as SMG because of its size, as well as Mk 18, 9A-91, SR3 etc. But from a technical view all those are of course ultra-short assault rifles.

Just to confuse everyone a bit more, Colt marketed the CAR-15 as a Sub-machine Gun. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:02, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

::The manufacturers are actively MARKETING these ultra short full auto 'carbines' to fulfill the submachine gun role in both military and law enforcement applications (both The M16 and the AKs have been sold this way). That's why people call them SMGs. The guns makers routinely muddy the waters as to the difference between the two definitions themselves. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 14:49, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

:::Guys, IMFDB has always classified the AKS-74U as an assault rifle (see my recent page for the movie ''[[Icarus]]'', for example). It may be used in the submachine gun role, but it is a derivative of the AK-74, which is unmistakably an assault rifle. So I am going to defer to tradition here; we have to be consistent.

:::Also, bear in mind that the original AK-47 (the weapon we all think of as the classic assault rifle) was once thought of as a submachine gun in many of the armed forces that carried it (including the People's Liberation Army of China). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:53, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

::::Video Games are ruining young minds. assault rifles shoot rifle rounds, not pistol rounds. put down the Modern Warfare and Bad Company.

It's an Intermediate rifle, like the P90 or MP7A1, slightly smaller caliber but with an effective range between a rifle's range and a sub gun's range.
:No, that is an incorrect comparison. The AK-74U is just a compact rifle since it fires an assault rifle round, not an assault rifle "styled" rifle. The P90 and the MP7 are designed from the ground up to be PDWs that fired ammo that are necked down rifle rounds instead of pistol rounds designed with the same armor piercing power as the full size rifle. It's like the Colt Model 733 or the 933 or any of the other shorten assault rifle variants. A submachine gun is always compared to weapons that fire pistol caliber ammo. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:15, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

But weapons like the SAM-R use the same caliber as 933 and 733, 5.56x45, and the SAM-R is used as a DMR. i doubt the 5.45x39 could be a marksman rifle cartridge. even though its longer than the 5.7 or 4.6, its range and accuracy are not that of a true assault rifle.

==IGN reviews the Call of Duty: Black Ops trailer==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=292tCSCvFQY

I wish that IGN would actually hire people who know what the hell they're talking about, instead of a couple of conceited pricks who think that the M4 Carbine assault rifle existed thirty years before it was produced. Not to mention the fact that they also erroneously refer to it as "a machine gun" and the Steyr AUG assault rifle series as "submachine guns". [[Special:Contributions/203.59.108.117|203.59.108.117]] 11:36, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
::nerd rage
: You gotta cut people some slack when it comes to these kind of things, why would we expect the guys who analyze video game trailers to know any more about guns than what they see in video games? Although calling the AUG a sub-machine gun was pretty boneheaded...[[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:03, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well even though the M4 Carbine wasn't around at the time. This game takes place during the Cold War, Vietnam, and the rest of the time period was not yet announced. You can't be sure when the game takes place until you see it, even though they announced an era, they didn't announce a time line. I'm sure you know that the M4 was made to replace the CAR-15, but the SOG got their hands on the newest weapons before they went into service. Which means, once the M4 was made, it would be sent straight to them. And besides, like he said, its just a game.

::I love how the only defense for the anachronistic weapons is "SOG got it before everyone else". That must mean that when US Army Rangers charged up onto Omaha Beach in 1944, they must have had M4A1s and M16A4s kitted out with EOTechs, Aimpoints, ACOGs, and PEQ-16 laser/light modules, right? Or when SEALs were hunting VC in the Mekong Delta, they must have had SCARs and M249s, right? Or how about the Battle of the Alamo, where Davy Crockett was picking off Mexican soldiers with an XM29 OICW, right? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:38, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

: Yes the excuse is a bit weak, but don't you think that analogy is a bit extreme? So far the differences have only been maybe 2 or 3 years, not 20 or 30 like in your analogy. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 14:41, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

We've been having this reoccuring conversation that the AR-15 in the game should not exist at all. There might have been conceptual designs for a flat top AR-15 carbine, but it isn't like SOG could hold up a picture of an M4 that hasnt been thought up yet and tell some gunsmith to make this with flip up iron sights, which also shouldnt exist. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:51, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Now I'm actually hearing rumors is that this is an alternate history themed game, so that would just debunk weapons that shouldn't exist if it is alternate history [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:54, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

: Oh I wasn't even thinking of the wierd AR-15 when I said that, I guess you're right. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:07, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

:So what if ''Call of Duty: Black Ops'' takes place in an alternate timeline? ''Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater'' and ''Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker'' feature alternate histories and yet they still managed to retain a sense of realism when it came to firearms. Treyarch needs to take a leaf out of Kojima Productions' book. Also, while we're at it, I wonder just how much they have paid these so called SOG veterans to keep their mouths shut about the inconsistencies of this game and instead talk about how their old buddies in the unit regularly included crossbows (equipped with explosive rounds, no less) in their field arsenal while completing missions. [[Special:Contributions/203.206.7.125|203.206.7.125]] 06:03, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

==zombie mode==
Hey guys, Zombie mode on Black Ops includes 2 maps, each bringing there own unique cast of characters
-Kind Der Untoten-
-All classic Nazi Zombies Characters

-Five-
-Fidel Castro (Holding Colt Python)
-John F. Kennedy (Holding China Lake Launcher)
-Richard Nixon
-Robert McNamara
These maps i have not played that much but from what i have there are these weapons
-Kind Der Untoten-
-Olympia (Over & Under)
-Walther MPL
-PM-63
-MP-40
-Mystery Box (Any number of assorted weapons)

-Five-
-Olympia
-Walther MPL

-will they have it? It is treyarch, but i havent heard anything solid yet.
:The article that I read (and summarized below) seemed to indicate that they had something other than zombies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:22, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Hopefully not copying spec ops.....

Maybe it's aliens.

Area 51 anyone? Eh? Eh? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 22:17, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

its been confermed . for news hit up black ops 24/7 . they dont have 100 percent accurate weapons lists but its the best site out there

==What's the type of grenade under the M18 smoke grenade on the breaching artwork?==

Is it just me, or there's some type of White Phosphorus grenade under M18 smoke grenade on the breaching artwork? The guy who wields the MAC-10 has it. http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/1458/uknowngrenade.jpg

Here is the original version: http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100522160405/callofduty/images/4/4b/100355837.jpg

==add m16 to page==

It was delted since there was no in game footage, but then there is a m16 slung to the main guy's back on the cover. i say add it. I know theres no in ge screenshot yet, but look, theres no in game shots of 1911s either.

Buddy, that stuff has been added already-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

m16 has been removed, only "ar-15 carbine" is there.

==='''M16 is in.'''===

I am not sure which version is that, but i added it as A1.
:I see no forward assist and a three-prong flash hider in the screenshots, so it looks to be an original M16. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:05, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

It have been confirmed in '''Call of Duty:Black ops INSIGHT''' trailer.

Oh crap, they mentioned Sonny Puzikas, I remember that name from the spetsnaz episode of Deadliest Warrior.

==Weapons that would make sense==
M72, M60, M14, Stoner 63, M40A1, M16A1, MAC-10, Remington 1100, Smith & Wesson M76, Browning Hi-Power, Hawk MM1, Smith & Wesson 39

AK-47, AK-74, Mosin-Nagant, PM Makarov, Steckin APS, SKS, Dragnnov, PKM

-Add any other weapons that would make sense
:M3A1 "Grease Gun"/Suppressed M3A1, Carl Gustav M/45/Suppressed M/45, suppressed Uzi, CAR-15 w/CGL or M203, Ithaca 37, Remington 870, Remington 7188 Automatic Shotgun, SOG modified RPD, M-60 "Death Machine"(M-60 w/ cut down barrel and ammo pack), HK-33(Harrington and Richardson T223).
:RPD, MAT-49/suppressed MAT-49--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 13:08, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Dirty Harry's Smith & Wesson Model 29 and Tony Montana's "Little Friend"
:What the hell do you have with those movie guns ? Why should they be in ?

It would be amazing to see Sa. Vz. 58 there. It was frequently used by vietcong fighters as USSR´s help.

::The M60D, the M1928 Thompson, the PPSh-41, the StG44, the Winchester 1200, the RPG-2, the SKS, Norinco Type 54, M1 Carbine, and the Sten. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 00:14, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

:::It would be good if they could do a proper tactical reload? If you reload a gun with a round in the chamber you will have an extra round which means you should have a 31 rounds on let's say an M16A2.

''''''Some good proofs''' :'''

http://nam64-75.hill.cz/download/file.php?id=691&sid=c3ccbd4348543db02c420df186cb428c ('' '''NVA training''''' )

http://www.quansuvn.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=41.0;attach=4972;image

http://nam64-75.hill.cz/download/file.php?id=1169 ('' '''SSG Patrick Tadina with his Vz. 58''''' )

http://www.psywarrior.com/rewardforguns.gif ( '''''Vietcong fighters firearms info poster, left side, third from down''''' )

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/1164/biethaisamopal9wq.jpg ( '''''Captured Vz. 58 on left''''' )

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff164/joshuadowdle/Dad.jpg ( '''''In hands of SSG Patrick Tadina''''' )

''SSG Patrick Tadina - Legendary, five-tour Vietnam ranger. He is in rangers´s hall of fame.''
Lee Enfield SMLE/ Jungle Carbine, M1 carbine, M2 carbine, SKS, Webley, Skorpion, M1 grand, RPG-2[[User:Greywolverene|Greywolverene]]

==Should be==
There should be M72 LAWs, M60s and M14s. cause this is Vietnam baby!

Nah. They just arent cool enough for Treyarch. And if they will add those weapons - They will all have RIS rails, scopes, lasers, GL attachemnts, silencers.... --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 11:16, 15 June 2010 (UTC)No need for your cheap sarcasm here. This game doesn't seems to pursue that Nam atmosphere with rocknroll, massive chopper assaults, jungle patrols and "smell of napalm in the morning"

I'm sure you will also be able to pick up laser weapons and crap like that. [[User:SargeOverkill]]

if anything there going to have those guns , and ruinthem buy adding rails and underbarell shit.simmons8492

==E3==

Added E3 screens - .357 Python and AR15 .

== Not an AK-47 ==
Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that the mag isn't curved enough to be a 7.62x39 mag? It could be a -74 prototype, without the flash hider. Given the time frame, this may make sense.

Thanks for that, I also didn't note it before. It looks to be a WASR-2/3.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 16:19, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

:This game seems to have a lot of rendering issues when it comes to the guns [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:40, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
OMG it is damn videogame for god's sake, the guns aren't real and are nothing more than 3d drawings -of course they aren't going to be exactly like such and such gun. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 17:08, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

'''3D drawning''' ? Hell, that would be interesting. And GTFO, this is '''firearms site''' and ''YES'', we care about reality. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 17:44, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

:Thanks for pointing that out. We are a gun site and we pay attention to details. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:24, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
Well guess what, THESE ARENT GUNS!!! They aren't effing real they are nothing more than 3d models that someone threw together in 3DS MAX or whatever the hell they use so of course its not going to be up to every detail, That's why I don't do VG pages anymore--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 19:47, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

::You appear to have missed the point of this website...

::Yea. The prop guns in movies aren't real, or air-soft guns. This website is for identifying fire arms, and if you didn't know that then you obviously missed the point of the website, like he said.

AsAstra, the point that I don't think you're understanding, is that even if they're merely three dimensional renderings of the guns, and not the guns themselves, we should try to be as correct as possible. If something says that it's an Ak-74, but actually looks more like a different gun, we should call it the different gun, so as not to confuse anyone new to the site. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 15:53, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

On the topic of the AK, knowing video game developers the AK being used by the Vietcong will most likely be the same one in those snow picks. I don't think we can call it a 47 right of the bat.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

Fixed the WASR-2 messup. It's not a WASR-2. NO WASR series of rifles have the stamped steel MAGWELL DIMPLES. When looking at the screenshots the AK in game HAS those magwell dimples. That right there shows it's not a WASR.
Some people are still saying it could be WASR-2. It's not a WASR-2. WASR-2's are new production (within the past few years) rifles from Romania made ONLY for semi-automatic use and for importation into the US. There's no way on God's green earth that the rifle in game is a WASR-2.

More than likely this is just an AK-47 with an incorrectly modeled mag. They ARE modeling these things after airsoft guns ya know.

== Degtyarov ==
It just cant be DPM. Lok - It totally doesnt have ironsights - And MAG isnt on top. + Its very unlikely some guy will cary Spas12 and Degtyarev. I just think its some AK type - Or it may be some different gun, but it isnt Degtyarev.
You may keep it there, but it will be false information.

==ummmm==
This page really needs a cleanup or a deletion.
There is also too much informal talk on the page itself, infact all of it is. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 04:47, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

===Moved from main page--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 04:49, 2 May 2010 (UTC)===
== AR-10 ==

Another unknown M16 family gun. But this one seems more like [[Armalite AR-10]] A4

[[Image:AR10-4.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Armalite AR-10 A4 7.62x51mm.]]
[[Image:AR10.JPG|thumb|none|400px|M16 Family unknown gun as appeared in Black Ops teaser.]]

:The magazine seems too long to be an AR-10
::Thats looking a bit like a STANAG Magazine. The STANAG Magazines are compatible with many NATO weapons, including the SCAR-L Carbine, the M4 Carbine and the M16 Rifle. Even if it were an AR-10 its likely that it would be chambered for the standard NATO round and accept the STANAG type magazine.

Also the AR10 is a civilian gun right? So why would special forces like that guy above be holding it? I personally think its an M16(either A1 or A2) with a scope attached to its carrying handle/iron sight.

:It's a strange AR-15 Carbine with a flat top [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:20, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

AR-10 is not necessarily civilian. It is entirely possible that SOF would use one.

I think is not AR10.AR10 use .308 or 7.62x51mm round and the magazine large and short than AR15.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

: Its uselles to keep AR-10 discussion here. We all know its that ankward AR-15 or XM177 or whatever.

== Un-identified guns ==

[[Image:MP5G3.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''1''' : Possibly [[MP5]] or [[G3]].]]
[[Image:UNKNOWNLOL.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''2''' : I totally dont know.But it may be some russian one.]]
It seems to look like a [[MAC-10]] or an [[Uzi]] with the stock extended-[[User:SargeOverkill]]
[[Image:UNKNOWN THE MOST.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''4''' : Its hard to tell which gun this one is, but it looks like [[Beretta AR-70/223]] or Daewoo K2. I think that this gun could be any gun I see and AK there but it could be a siper rifle for all we know]]
As to the first unknown gun, it's too short to be a G3, so I believe it's an MP5. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:50, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

im not sure but with those ironsites id say a g36 . i hope they brink the one from COD4 back i loved it. simmons 8492

In black ops there appears also a weapon that an elicoptero is in use for throwing .. it appears in the game in the level 2 as harpoon
[[Image:Harpoon.jgp]]

Unidentified gun No.4 looks like a Galil.---Matchgradeweapon

== RPK ==

From the looks of it, it might be an RPK-74. Note the 45-round banana mag and the flash suppressor.

The "RPK" and the "Valmet" are the same guns - look carefully at the screenshot. Given that the 7.62mm AK-47 appears in game and the timeline, I'm gonna say that it's not an RPK-74, but a 7.62x39mm RPK or one made to look like a Valmet for some reason. Maybe Treyarch modelers are using 80's action movies as a reference for their RPK model. *shakes head*

No. Look on that "RPK" an you will see typical RPK stock. Look on "Valmet" and you will see it doesnt look like Valmet :)--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 03:53, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Look at the front of the Valmet trigger guard. Now look at that same exact place on the "Valmet" in the game picture. Different. There is no Valmet, it's an RPK.

Moved "Unknown LMG" stuff to the RPK-74 section. Whoever posted those images under there originally failed to notice the way the RPK-74 front sight is canted compared to the Valmet. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 14:18, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

==M1911==

In the title screen there is a soldier holding a 1911 i believe it also says something on the side.

It says "Sally" on the slide.

The 1911 looks more like the first and not the A1, look at the ejection port.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:17, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Here's to hoping it's 1911s will be in the arsenal in multi-player, and not the tease in MW2 --[[Special:Contributions/67.181.114.114|67.181.114.114]] 07:13, 1 June 2010 (UTC)JanG

well am i the only one who thinks WAW did a horible job of represting the stoping power of the .45 . i mean the gun does nothing in the game , but in real life its a man stoper. simmons 8492

Game balance. That's why [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:36, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

i under stand but the walther is better in that game than the 1911. at least the .45 in COD4 had some good stopingpower to it . i know its a diffrent model but still . simmons 8492

and lucky for me , the boys at trayarc made the M1911A1 the manstoper that it is .SEMPER FI!!! simmons 8492

one thing i noticed is that some times the player racks the slide and it stays back like its empty . i dont get it. simmons 8492

Its a useless flair that can be done with a real gun by pushing up on the Slide release as you pull it back and then release it after its locked. I did it on my Hi Power after seeing it.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:30, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

== good decision ==

As well as Weapon customization there will also be a character customization feature.
- That game is gonna be just awesome. Character customization ? Damn, just in R6:V style (ha-ha)

* Custom characters? hell yeah --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 00:38, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
i agree with that customization policy, i liked how in R6V2 they did that, and i can only hope they bring back CoD4s M4A1 Grenadier back, and i also completely agree with the historic battle/ war thing as compared to a (***Spoiler) nuclear warfare and a domestic terrorist plot, i would much rather see Black Hawk Down pop up in a newer game as opposed to Vietnam, but i would settle for a Operation Acid Gambit type game also.

Customizable characters in a game where... you can't actually ''see'' the character? FAIL.
* Customizable characters in game where will be 3rd person mode, and where other players can see it ? Your post '''fail'''.
:When did Black Ops become third person? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 00:42, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

It isn't. He's saying that other characters will see your 3rd person form. Also, it's noteworthy that MW2 DID have third person mode.
:So then I've gotta agree. Character customization in a game where you can't actually see your guy seems like a fail to me, too. It's not like anybody in MP is really gonna stop shooting at you to say "hey, cool guy, what kind of vest is that?" And how do I activate this third person mode in MW2? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:50, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

:: Well, i dont know. But what about trying "3RD PERSON" in "Play" screen ?

I think it's hilarious how people are whinig about the customization... Go play R6. Custom characters work in FPS games.
:Yeah, i bought R6:V2 not so long ago and its amazing. I think that game has best character customization ever. Its only pity you cant do anything with your teammates.
:R6V also has a cover system where you can actually ''see'' the guy/girl you're playing as, a third person mode cheat, and player characters who actually have voices and speak rather than being mutes with no form of personality whatsoever, none of which Black Ops has. I simply think character customization is unnecessary. That's not whining, it's called ''having an opinion". [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:09, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

How does the post fail it was an update its not like i'm wrong. its not like i said there would be some sort of Grizzly Bear cannon. it was a NEWS UPDATE!!! THINK next time a stupid comment is thought by yourself.
Also heres the ANSWER the other players can see you just like AVP. so thats how customization comes in handy. [[user:moviemaster1993|moviemaster1993]]
:First off, I never said ''your post'' failed. That was ''your'' response to ''me'', smart ass. I was commenting on a feature of the game I think is unnecessary, something I'm fully allowed to do. You aren't the lord of opinions around here. Second, comparing Rainbow Six to Call of Duty is about as much of a failure as one can accomplish. Lastly, who the hell cares if another player can see you? I wouldn't be customizing my character for other people, just like other people aren't going to be customizing their characters for me. It's not like everybody's gonna stop shooting and comment on every other player's individual character, is it? The only stupid comments on here are coming from ''you''. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:30, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

I think it's more for identification than anything. So if you're pissed at one guy, you can just look at him ans say "Hey it's that one guy, Imma kill 'em", instead of reading the little tiny red words above their head that is often jibberish anyway. Just my opinion, though. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:45, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

== MP5k ==

You think they're putting that in there to copy MW2?
:No I think they're doing it to fulfill their MP5 quota. MW2 wasn't the first game to feature the MP5K, broski.-protoAuthor 00:23, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't know about that. They also have an AUG in the game and a SPAS-12. Not a coincidence that MW2 also has these. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

- Heh. Spas and AUG were in tons of other games. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

But THIS game is directly part of the COD franchise. It's a bit repetitive to show guns that has been in previous games. Well ok WWII games don't count because they cant help having the same guns, but this is supposed to be Treyarch's turn at making a new game, but so far, none of the weapons are new. What about instead of the SPAS-12, we get an 870, or instead of the AUG, we get...any other bullpup rifle of the time. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:36, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm thinkin' maybe they showed off the MW2 guns first to get MW2 fans interested in this game. Then maybe later they'll show off some new guns. Here's to hopin'. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 22:29, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I derinitely think they're putting the MP5k in to copy MW2. They could have put in any other variant of the MP5, variants that weren't in prototype stage and would probably be more combat effective, but they went with the k variant. That said I don't think it's any coincidence the SPAS-12 and AUG is in there either.

You don't get the fans back with the same old guns. You draw interests with NEW guns that hasn't been used before. Variety and distinctions. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Well, Treyarch apparently didnt start copying first. MW2´s specops get idea fairly sure from WaW´s coop system :D
:The latest issue of the official xbox magazine says that they originally had planned on having co-op throughout the entire campaign in MW2, but cut it because it messed with the narrative. Or, it would've been way too fun. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:06, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
the AUG was stupid in the game, no1 in USSOCOM uses that gun
* Would you mind telling what do you have against bullpup designs, beside "the looks"?--[[User:WhiteSlift|WhiteSlift]] 11:58, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
* Heh. MP5k get into service 20 years after Vietnam war. There was only prototype in latest parts pf Vietnam war. MAC10 or UZI would be much more realistic in hands of US soldiers. Atleast much more than prototype gun. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:49, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
*"MP5K get into service 20 years after Vietnam war"...the MP5K isn't that new. Considering that the war ended in 1975, and the MP5K was introduced in 1976, you are way off.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 01:30, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

true why would they be carrying a Prototype in to combat

Well how much differently could essentially just a shortened MP5 with a foregrip work from the regular MP5?

Because it's a video game that doesn't care about accuracy and realism. I mean what loser actually waits until Picatinny rails to be invented? Go ahead and put them on your rifle in Nam, it's the new trend.

Why are you complaining about the AUG in particular, I mean USSOCOM doesn't use it? Yeah, well they sure as hell don't use the deagle or the AA12 or the FAMAS but I don't see you complaining

"I mean what loser actually waits until Picatinny rails to be invented?" Picatinny rails have been around since 1913, broski.
:Not in their modern version, Broseph Stalin.

You all are forgetting..this is SOG, not SOCOM. SOG could carry into battle whatever they wanted to. Could they have carried a prototype MP5K? Sure! Keep in mind..they had access to stuff that NOBODY ELSE in the military had access to at that time. Hell..one time they brought an airhorn with them and scared the crap out of an entire NVA division with it.
:Look, I can understand having access to weapons no one has ever heard of at the time, but you can't have access to weapons if it doesnt EXIST in the world yet. I mean just because they are SOG doesn't mean they have their own special gunsmith to factory make new parts and designs for weapons that haven't been thought up yet. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:21, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

== What the hell is up with this AR-15 Carbine? ==

It looks like a 733, but at the same time, not since it also has a flat top, but the scenes in the trailer that showed this rifle is assumed to be Vietnam era, so a flat top AR-15 shouldn't exist at the time much less a rail system for it. Also the same AR also has a rear iron sight on the flat top. This doesn't make sense [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

- I think its XM177, but customized way to much. Its mucb more possible that Treyarch just failed. I think they just added rail system/flat top just because MP. You know, attachments. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

::It cannot be an XM177 if it has a flattop receiver. Those did not exist when the XM177s were introduced. The flash hider is also Vortex, not the XM177-type. The game's 3D artists might have been ignorant about what AR carbines existed at the time. But that is not an XM177. Not by a long shot. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 05:23, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I think the game's 3D rendering tech was mostly like stone because it's the 60s and 70s, but the trailer animation is horrible! I could barely tell what was going on and the weapon details are no where like MW2. Say what you want about MW2 when it comes to consistencies, but at least they can render their weapons correctly. My first upload of that funky AR-15 shows the handguard as this polygon like thing. And did flat top receivers exist during Nam? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:34, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

:::''And did flat top receivers exist during Nam?''

:::No, not at all. My recollection is that the Colt ACR (introduced in the 1980s) was the first AR-type rifle to feature a flattop receiver. Even though the ACR was a bust, flattops were subsequently carried over into future AR generations. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 05:39, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

With these seemingly anachronistic flat top recievers and flip up sights I think this game is headed towards failure. Seems like they're taking the MW2 route and making their "balanced" and cosmetically changed multiplayer weapons also appear in single player. I hope by some miracle they don't or else they don't get my money.

:And here I remember talking to my brother about how they can fuck up the M16 by either putting A2s or burst A1s, but this is WAY over there in the incorrect area. Haven't they seen any Nam movies? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:03, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

: Excalibur01 - or use five minutes just f-i-v-e f**king minutes of their time and try to google some Vietnam-era photos. Or they could hire someone with at least basic knowledge of era background and weaponery. You know, they spent money on countless other things. But I guess that Call of Duty is now like B-rated action movies. Make as many as you can and don't worry about the quality. Nobody gives a s*it about how it looks like or if it is correct as far as it would look cool and geek teen age kiddos would pay the money so they could play multiplayer on their lagging net servers. [Ragnar - 22:25, 19 May 2010]

Hopefully they at least have the M16 have full auto instead of burst, would make it more fun that way. I did read that this isn't taking place in vietnam on yahoo news which probably is incorrect but this is ridulous of the weapons they are putting in.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:48, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

:I read an IGN article that it'll take place throughout the Cold War, from the end of Nam to Cuba and also Princess Gates London [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:17, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

I researched the history of picatinny rails, turns out Treyarch may have actually done very good research. This is what I found: "The MIL-STD-1913 standard was developed out of efforts during the M16A1 Product Improvement Program which eventually resulted in the M16A2. One of the abandoned ideas was a receiver with a built-in rail. In the 1970s, Rock Island Arsenal experimented with a sniper AR-10 with a Weaver rail. In Vietnam, the Model 656 had a built-in rail." Source:http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/archive/index.php/t-18737.html
I don't know about you guys, but I'm now willing to believe the rails on this AR (Model 656?) isn't a goof at all.
:Well, its always good to know new thing :) But i think it still wasnt regular Vietnam equipment. And i also think there wont be even M16 or M16A1 ingame.--[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:35, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
::True, it wasn't regular Vietnam equipment. But these aren't regular soldiers either. These guys are top secret black ops, higher than tier one operators. They can use any weapon in the world, even ones that are in secret development. And you're probably right, I doubt there'll be an M16, simply because these experimental ARs look cooler, have a bit of mystery around them, and can accept multiple attachments. But I wouldn't be surprised if they name the rifles M16.

The model 656 looked like this:

[[Image:model 656.jpg]]

It was just an early M16 with an early style rail system. So far, I have not found images of a Carbine with these types of rails, experimental or not. Rails were not on the forefront of military minds before the 90s. The military didn't even decided to put rails on the M16 until a decade after the M4 came out. And even the Model 656 rails were not on a flat top receiver like the ones on an M4. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 13:57, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
:Aw crap, there goes my theory. Looks like it's back to just being a Treyarch fail.

I'm not one to justify inaccuracy in videogames but, the upper receiver on the 656 could easily be swapped with that of an AR-15 carbine. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 00:50, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Sure...but the one we see in the game is not the same rail receiver as the one the 656 has. It has a flat top like an M4 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:22, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

I just noticed that the front sight isn't removed when an optic attachment is present, an improvement over other COD games. Maybe Treyarch realized an AR would be bolt-action if the gas block was removed.
:Low-profile gas block is not visible from first-person perspective. And 3-d person gun models were made as low-poly as possible to minimise system loads(this was crucial because games was intended for Xbox in first place)

Who know CAR-15 with rear flip up sight use in vietnam war? I see a south vietnam flag in picture.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]
: No. Though, prototype flat-top receiver and flip-up like on your screen could be possible, but it just doesn't look authentic to the time period. I wouldn't mind if they put in something like Model 656(pictured above). But they really need to get rid of that modern-looking AR.
[[Image:CODBOAR-15b.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

It's just like the Aperature sight in W@W, but no where near as bad. I don't see why people are making such a big deal out of it, sure it's not exactly authentic, but it's far from game ruining like what a lot of people here are saying.

== Complaints ==
Hey, it's a game, not a history lesson. It's all about fun and style and so. I do like a realistic movie or game, but I don't hate a game just because the artists created something they think it's better this way. Nobody complains when a director sums up a car ride that would take 1 hour in real life in one scene in the movie, or when he puts the light where the sun can never be just to make it look good, but when someone puts a cool looking AUG in a game set before 1977, because it looks cool, or creates his own creative vision of an AR-15 everyone freaks out. All the time you hear people say "They should have done better research!" or "They don't know anything about history!", but maybe the did research, and they know history, and they discussed it and decided that they want to create something own, because they feel it fits better in their creative work than what real life history can give them.

*Yeah, you are right. Now we need M1 Abrahams tank in some Napoleonic Wars strategy. Cause that tank is just cool - right ? Or maybe M4 Carbine in WW2 shooter ?--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:28, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

::Treyarch is legally obligated to keep the timeline from going beyond Vietnam. [http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/03/04/the-activision-lawsuit-what-it-means-and-where-it-s-going.aspx] If that means they have to cheat a bit regarding the weapons, I'm willing to give them some leeway. Let's face it, we're probably the only people who truly care anyway. None of these inaccuracies are going to keep any of us from buying this game when it comes out and playing the heck out of it. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:41, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

They're not legally obligated to keep it from going beyond Vietnam. As that article says..all they need is full approval from West and Zampella. Considering those two aren't rampant assholes..it's a total possibility.
:That's a bit like saying other people can write Harry Potter novels as long as JK Rowling is okay with it, or other studios can make Star Wars movies as long as George Lucas is okay with it. Have you looked at the games IW has made? Have you noticed a pattern? (For those who don't want to look, all they make are CoD games. That is literally all they have going for them.) Sure, they COULD give away their golden goose and let someone develop else something Activision has given them exclusivity with, but I can't imagine a single scenario where they would. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 10:45, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

* Well, msot of CoD players wont even recognize M16 and M4 or HK416. So yep - We are maybe only ones who care about it :/ --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:44, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
::And mind you, Treyarch is the same developer that had Japanese troops using suppressed MP40s with reflex sights in WaW. Oh, and a RAY GUN TO SHOOT ZOMBIES. That being said, I was devastated when I found out that MW2 wouldn't have zombies, and I'll be even more devastated if BO doesn't have them. IMHO, zombies was the best part of WaW. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 17:39, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
* And IW had OMOH with FN2000´s and IMI Tavor´s - So whats the difference :D Hope zombies will be includeProxy-Connection: keep-alive
Cache-Control: max-age=0

too.

:Ok the Zombie thing in WaW was a side game. It's not part of the "story". If the zombies and the ray gun appeared in the actual missions, then we'd called bullshit but with a smile cause zombies are awesome to fight. The suppressors and red dot sights were for multiplayer to compete with COD4 at the time, so those don't count. We're talking historically accurate, period piece weapons. It's like we do a game taking place during the Civil War but we all got 1911s as handguns and M1 Garands as rifles. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:22, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
::You're telling me you wouldn't play a Civil War game where you can use an M1 Garand? ;)True, they tried that with Darkest of Days, but it was terribly done. And second, you CAN get the ray gun for one of the campaign missions, and it is awesome. (You can take down a tank with two shots.) But I know what you're getting at. I'm just saying we shouldn't let the nitty gritty get in the way of good gameplay, especially since Treyarch already has one hand legally tied behind their backs. Would they want to make a Modern Warfare-like game set in present day or the near future? Sure, but they can't, they're legally handcuffed to inflexible historical fact. Besides, no game has ever gotten its weapons exactly right. We have an entire generation of kids who believe an M1 Garand can't be reloaded without firing the entire clip, or it has less stopping power than a K98K. I won't lose any sleep if BO has AR-15s with flat top receivers, but I will if the game sucks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 06:34, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
You know if there gonna screw this game why don't the just add a bunch of laser guns or crap. I mean i could understand if the weapons in the game where off, but i have a feeling this game is going to be a cluster F***
::We're basing a lot on two trailers and some scanned images from a magazine 5.5 months from release. I'm going to reserve judgment until I actually play it or at least hear from people who have actually played it. Treyarch has little to lose here. If it's great, people will praise them, if it's not, people already think they're the Fredo Corleone to IW's Michael Corleone in the Activision family. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:40, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
:::And while we're here, we've been talking about how the angle of the AK mag is slightly off, but is anyone else annoyed that if you do a tactical reload and drop half a mag, those rounds in the discarded mag magically go back into your ammo stockpile and you don't lose them? This has been true in 99.7% of all FPS's I've ever played. Gamers have accepted the idea of the consequence-free tactical reload for over a decade now. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:40, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::::You're right it's a crying shame. Not only because it's more accurate when the game keeps track of ammo in specific mags but it also adds another challenge and element of strategy. I also enjoy the one game I've played that keeps track of the +1 round in your gun when you reload. I wish more games were like that. Sad thing is I don't see COD heading in the right direction ever again.
:::::The one time I saw them do the tactical reload correctly was... Navy SEALs Quake, a mod for Quake II. Yes, it was a mod made by amateurs over ten years ago. The big game companies aren't doing it right because they don't want to. I remember the first time I played a game that had different animations for reloading with a round in the chamber and one without. Operation Winback on the N64, also ten years ago. It was a nice touch. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:48, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::::::'''Operation Flashpoint''', '''Rainbow Six: Raven Shield''' and '''Insurgency''' all did tactical reloads properly (ammunition is a number of magazines, not bullets, and if you reload a partially-empty mag it goes back in the pool), and the latter two also simulated +1 capacity. Insurgency is a mod but the other two are retail games. --[[User:MattyDienhoff|MattyDienhoff]] 20:00, 23 July 2010 (UTC)

* But we arent complaining here about animation and bullet system, damn. We are critising look of those guns ! That stramge XM177/AR15 hybrid was seen many times in reveal trailer, so we can judge it. And it failed. Its still better when you have realistic gun without realistic ammo system than crazy-unrealistic looking gun with realistic ammo system. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:06, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::I don't think it'd be that hard to replace the skin. [[Black]] didn't give a damn about realism, but it was still enjoyable as hell. The way I see it, ultimately, it's just a game, to be played because it's fun, not as an interactive history lesson. If you want accuracy, watch the Military Channel or actually go out to the range. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:48, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::: Well, it doesnt have to be "interactive history lesson" but atleast a bit of realism would be nice. '''''BTW''': I visit shooting range once or twice in month :)''

As pointed out, we don't want TOTAL realism. Otherwise, one bullet hit to the chest is enough to kill you. At least head shots are instant kills in the game. But we're doing a game based on a particular period and it has to be accurate. I mean, if you were watching a WWI movie and see soldiers with M16s. That's a bit jarring right? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:03, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
:: Now he will answer it isnt jarring. If the movie has cool effects and famous actors.
:::Jarring, maybe, but I don't know if it'd ruin it for me. (Is it a sci-fi film? Surrealism? A film by Uwe Boll?) It'd be one thing to have blatant mistakes, like M16s in WWI, but would it have ruined [[Saving Private Ryan]] if Sgt Horvath had a post war M1 Carbine with a bayonet lug and adjustable rear sights instead? Did the fact that the officers had Webley Mark VI's instead of Adams Mark III's ruin [[Zulu]]? Did the fake M72 LAW in [[Ronin]] take you out of the movie? If it didn't, it's because you chalked it up as a goof, moved on, and enjoyed the rest of an otherwise good movie. If it did, then I don't know what to tell you. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:52, 25 May 2010
(UTC)

Here's a hypothetical question: This game is called Black Ops, so theoretically, they can make up whatever they want, what do we know, it's a black op, and thus classified. What if all the weapons in the game were all fake, either outright, or fictional modifications of real weapons? Would we still be up in arms? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:14, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
: I hate to say it but you might be onto something. I've heard rumors that Black Ops will rewrite history and take place in an alternate past. This is probably how Treyarch can get around the legal restrictions of not being able to make post-Vietnam games and explain these BS weapons. Personally I think it's pretty weak but it explains it.
:: Well, if it does... Wait-It doesnt! I read some article with one of Treyarch members which strictly denied possibility of alternate reality. Ill repat it again : its just some Treyarch modeller fail. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:39, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
It's not rewriting history at all basically it's saying that during the Cold War what if there were some Black Ops that went down to keep the whole thing from escalating into an actual official war. Which is completely possible.
:::It doesn't have to be alternate history, just a secret history. It's implied that the JFK assassination will be in the game. Is the player the second gunman on the grassy knoll? Is he supposed to stop the second gunman on the grassy knoll? Does he successfully stop a possible third gunman? They can make up anything they want in that scenario. A mission can have the player equipped with a prototype laser rifle, but it's scripted so the rifle is damaged or lost along the way, and the technology is lost forever. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:53, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

It would be great if they do include Dirty Harry's gun and Tony Montana's "Little Friend".

The Steyr AUG (Armee Universal Gewehr - Universal Army Rifle) had been in development since the late 1960s, as a replacement for venerable but obsolete Stg.58 (FN FAL) battle rifles for Austrian army. It was developed by the Austrian Steyr-Daimler-Puch company (now the Steyr-Mannlicher AG & Co KG) in close conjunction with Austrian Army.See? It's not that wrong. Got it from http://world.guns.ru/assault/as20-e.htm
:It's still wrong. Just because the AUG was in development doesn't mean a working prototype existed. And if it's supposed to be the prototype, why does the AUG in the game look like the production version, only without the grip, and not as depicted in the prototype drawing shown on the World Guns page? I think the whole prototype explanation is a lame excuse in order to include more modern weapons in the game. I would much rather see the weapons that SOG actually used included in Black Ops, instead of an assault rifle that we've seen about 5 billion times in other shooters. I already posted below how Treyarch could have used the Remington 7188 full auto shotgun in the game. This weapon was actually used in Vietnam, and as far as i know has never been used in a video game, but instead they chose the SPAS-12, which didn't exist at the time and has been used in dozens of other shooters.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 22:50, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

== Unknown ==
The rocket launcher under unknown is an M202 FLASH rocket launcher. Ashdude01 20:20 19 May 2010

Yes there is i added it to the guns page but some moron removed it

moviemaster1993 11:58 may 2010

== Carcano M91/38? ==

The images provided doesn't shot much and it is said that it can't be a mosin Nagant because the barrel is too short. Well it could be the carbine length variant or any other short barrel bolt action rifle. I can't see anything in the picture. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:26, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

It seems like its picture of that gun. Remember that game has to do something with JFK asassination and there can be barelly seen "Lee Harvey Oswald" on paper under that gun. So i think it have to be that gun - As some reference. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 03:48, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Ever heard of the Mosin Nagant M44 carbine or the finnish retooled M38?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 11:56, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

== M16 and XM177 ==

[[Image:Colts.JPG|thumb|none|500px|]]

Looks like the guy here has either an M16 as you can tell by the barrel pointing to the left and the barrel on the right looks like an XM177 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:26, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Looks like a M16A1 to me..which makes sense..since the A2 didn't come around until the early to mid 80's.

== Embargo lifts tomarrow, the 28th ==

Ones the embargo lifts we will be flooded with info, especially about guns

What embargo? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:45, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

There was an embargo for some journalist who previewed the game(they also could have played it too)and tomarrow it ends and info will get flooded all over the web

* It ended and only few informations and no new guns appeared. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 07:24, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

== Valment m78 ==
:The M78 does have its own page here, separate from the RPK. But yeah, I don't think the designers are gun-savvy enough to have both of these guns in this game.--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:55, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

What the year of Valmet M78 build? I think is not use in vietnam war the NVA don't have a finnish weapons during the war.And i think in the picture the gun is not Valmet M78.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

: And Spas-12 was in vietnam ? It may not be Valmet, but it fairly sure isnt RPK. Or another Treyarch modeller fail ? --[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 11:40, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

Anyone notice that the picture of the unknown AK-type LMG has a front sight that upright on the front side and canted forward on the back side like the RPK-74's front sight? --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 17:11, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:The Valmet M78 was invented after the production of the M76 in 1976, which is another weapon considered anachronistic for the Vietnam War era if there's any in the game. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:45, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

== Time travel (well that would explain it) ==

[http://pc.ign.com/articles/109/1093572p1.html Another preview]
--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:22, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

The page doesn't exist [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:48, 29 May 2010 (UTC)
* Fixed that link. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:49, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Launching an SR-71 from an aircraft carrier? Is that even possible? O_o [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 21:04, 30 May 2010 (UTC)
:They were able to operate a U-2 from a carrier, but that wouldn't be nearly as sexy as flying an SR-71, now would it? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:32, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't think it is, You know how these game designers do ALL of their research. (Man I'm sarcastic tonight)--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:11, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
::It's pretty obvious that since MW2, the main source of research is action movies and Futureweapons reruns.

Damn straight.

[[Special:Contributions/72.189.150.170|72.189.150.170]]

Not that I have anything against the SPAS-12, AUG, or AK47s, but we need to see different types of weapons. What about an 870, or the AK-74? What about other types of Bullpup? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:41, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

: You think 12-year old child knows difference between AK-74, AK-47 and AKs-74u ? That wont make sence..... Why making more weapons when you can add only those "cool" and overused ones ? --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 15:14, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

My 11 year old brother can, just saying-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

well the ak-74 would be good , but no one would notice the difference. most kids playing this game dont know am1911a1 from a m14 . id like to see both

== Prototypes ==

Just to let you know: German games magazine ''PC Games'' had an interview with the developers. In the latest issue, they write, that the black special ops team can get any equipment they want, including non-standard weapons, brand new prototypes and even customized and special built single pieces, <quote>which no one outside the team will ever get to see</quote>. So that is the official in-game explanation for every crude weapon you can see in the hands of the player.
:That's what I figured their reasoning would be. It makes sense but it's still a pretty weak explanation if you ask me.
:So super elite 1337 black ops delta teams can even get weapons ''that don't yet exist''? WTF? Why didn't our SF and SEALs in 'Nam have M4A1s with KAC rail systems, lasers, ACOGs, EOTechs, and bullets that can home in on enemy soldiers from 50 miles away, then??? It's a conspiracy to disarm the public, I tell you! But in all seriousness, I think it's an explanation that doesn't hold water. That mentality might work in 2016 during MW2, but not in a past setting like Vietnam where small arms development has been chronicled and we know where and to what it led. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 15:29, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
::I think it does hold water. Of course these finalized weapons weren't around in the late '60s to mid '70s. But how do you know their prototypes weren't? Most of the weapons in-game will either be early prototypes or in the case of the AR custom-built weapons made by the SOG operatives.
::Ok, they could at least make it look like prototypes, not like modern weapons.
::Okay, then how about when the next WWII game comes out, they give all the troops M16s, M60s, Mark 48s, G36s, AKMs, XM29s, and XM8s because, you know, super secret black ops teams can get any piece of kit they want, even if it doesn't exist yet. All they have to do is jump in Doc Brown's time machine, travel through time and grab the latest kit, then head back. 1.21 gigawatts! [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:03, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:::I've said it once before, if it's done well, I will absolutely play it. Most people play game as a means of escape, so would it really make a difference if I shot a Nazi with an M16 or an M1 Garand? He's not REALLY dead. He's not even real, and we've contributed nothing to the winning of WWII, or any war. In fact, we've contributed nothing but to our own satisfaction. They're called video GAMES. Playing games is about having fun. I'm sure many if us here loved Nazi Zombies from WaW. Why? Because we love shooting Nazis, and we love shooting zombies, and Treyarch did us a favor by combining the two activities. And we love it even more if we can shoot them with a ray gun that comes out of a magic box. Was it historically accurate? No, but believe me, the history major in me learned to live with it. (Hell, now you've got me all worked up, because as I'm typing this, I can't wait to get the chance to catch Hitler and bin Laden in a meeting and spray the room with a minigun.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:02, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
Ok i get your point, it's a video game, and fun or not it should have realism, i mean c'mon!-[[User:sargeOverkill]]
::::BTW, they already sort of did that with the Time Splitters series. And those games were awesome. (At least 2 and Future Perfect were. I never played 1.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:30, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:::::I quite frequently have lots and lots and lots and lots of fun playing games, especially shooters, that adhere to reality. The reason I play a Vietnam or WWII shooter is because I want to immerse myself in the environment. That includes having weapons accurate to the period. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:07, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
::::::I guess that depends if you consider these games historical or not. I just lump it in with Halo and GoW now, as CoD flew off the historical rails about two or three games ago, straight into "anything goes" territory, which was good from a story telling perspective. Even when it tried to be historical (up to CoD 2) you were still one or two men who personally killed half the German army. That's why I thought releasing WaW on Veterans Day was a backhanded tribute, because nothing honors veterans like a game that allows you to win WWII singlehandedly. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:31, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

==M14==

What with this being a Vietnam War game, I'm gonna be pretty pissed if you can't use a normal M14 rifle, without all the rails and crap.
[[Image:M14Rifle.jpg|thumb|none|500px|I want to use an M14 like this in-game]]

Well, it doesnt look cool enough. Expect it with scope, silencer, thousands of rails and plastic stock. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 18:04, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

1. They'll Probably put it in.
2. the rails are the modern demands of a soldier including the ability to easily mount optics and other accessories easily. theres nothing wrong with it.

:I'd like a regular wood stocked M14, and if you want optics, they did make a scope riser mount for M14s before rail systems. As for silencers, well that's easy, and heartbeat sensors shouldn't bother to return. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::If they want to be accurate with attachments, then they should have a sniper scope and a suppressor (suppressors were available at that time).

Randy Shughart a delta force sniper never had anything fancy on his. as stated in BlackHawk down he had a vietnam era M14, with a scope. nothing fancy there. besides in vietnam there really wasnt a need for anything fancy. silencer, hell the vietcong already knew they were there because of the helo. Lam- hadn't been invented. and a tac light is slightly useless seeing how they were in a jungle 95% of the time. [[Special:Contributions/71.194.219.9|71.194.219.9]] 01:46, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

: All of these attachments really ''WONT'' make sence. '''But its Treyarch'''.

== AUG sans grip ==

What the hell is up with the AUG without a foregrip? I don't mind the fact the AUG is anachronistic, but come on...why take off something central to firing the gun. Maybe the gun is semi-automatic in the game, because our character has to plunge his hand into a bucket of ice to stop the burning after each shot.
:Yeah, I don't understand that decision. The only possible explanation I can come up with is that they used the AUG with a grenade launcher as a model, like this one [http://www.steyr-aug.com/240.jpg], and then just deleted the grenade launcher. But this would mean that no one working on the project A) ever saw a movie with an AUG, including [[Die Hard]], which I would think every male between the ages of 21-49 in the english speaking world has seen, or B) could put two and two together and figure out that putting your hand directly on a barrel is not practical. That, or the plot involves that character severely burning his hand. If not, it's an utterly indefensible and boneheaded decision by the Treyarch staff. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:29, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
::And to be absolutely fair, the character is wearing heavy gloves while holding the barrel. But it still doesn't make sense. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:21, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

::What doesn't make sense to me is that they have a military advisor on staff. How come, at no point in the development, did this man point out that holding a gun barrel while firing is a bad idea, and has he not seen an AUG before? - Opening Poster.

::Doesn't the grip fold up?-protoAuthor
:::Yes, but you'd still be able to see it. [http://www.murdoconline.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/NEW-STEYR-AUG-right.jpg]--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:12, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:I wrote that without seeing the image. Sorry.-protoAuthor
::::I agree with the grenade launcher theory, especially since multiplayer was done first. Who knows, they might actually change the standard AUG model before the game actually comes out.

The AUG without vertical grip.I think a gun barrel is very hot.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

In third person it's just a character model fail. In first person you grip I guess what you could call the "finger guard."

I've seen pics of the Austrian Army holding their AUGs by the trigger guard like a P90 but not the barrel itself, that's stupid. Plus, who the hell in 1968 would even take a design like the AUG seriously. The M16 was just starting to be taken seriously by military brass around 1968.

......Why the hell wouldn't they take it seriously? You do know that the British had actually adopted a bullpup design in 1951 for a very short time. Search Em-2 Rifle. It even had a built in optical sight on the
carrying handle. We Yanks then bossed everybody into adopting the 7.62 and the EM-2 was abandoned because it was in the .280 round so they went with the FAL which could be much more easily changed to use the 7.62
Actually, the EM-2 would be a better choice for this game or the SA80 prototype that appeared in The Professionals. I am aware of the EM-2.
=== Bullpup guns ===

If they want bulpup gun in game why didnt they coice Em-2 ? Or Famas ? WHY THAT ANACHRONISTIC AUG, damn.
The FAMAS is even more anachronistic than the AUG. The FAMAS was adopted in the early eighties and it used a different type of 5.56 ammo than the NATO standard.

: Yeah. It get into service in eighties. But atleast there '''WERE''' first prototypes in 1968. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:04, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

ummm...the prototypes of both the FAMAS and AUG were developed in the seventies. A better choice might be the Stoner 63 which had a history of use by the Navy SEALs and other clandestine units

== OXM article ==

Official XBox Magazine did a feature on Black Ops (July 2010, issue 111,) and I figure I'd share some highlights:

- It was inspired by the book "SOG: The Secret Wars of America's Commandos," by Major John Plaster. [http://www.amazon.com/SOG-Secret-Americas-Commandos-Vietnam/dp/1581606761/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1275440842&sr=8-1]

- The SPAS-12 you use during the Tet Offensive uses Dragon's Breath rounds.

- At least from their description, the "WMD" level sound suspiciously like the airfield level in MW2.

The whole game looks suspiciously like MW2, just my opinion though. Hughjefender

- The M202 FLASH is confirmed.

- The M1911s with "Sally" etched on them also have tally marks on them.

- They mention a co-op feature that "appears to be a successor" to zombies, which seems to me would indicate no zombies. Bummer.

- Multiplayer was ready before the campaign, so some of the campaign levels are based on the multiplayer maps.

- Regarding anachronistic guns, "'In this world, anything was possible' for these soldiers, [Treyarch head Mark] Lamia explains. All equipment requests were granted by their superiors. Cost, apparently, was no object."

- And finally, a quote from the military advisor, Lt. Col. Hank Keirsey (ret) (and something I've been trying to point out for a while now) "The Historical Advisor fights to get every last bit of accuracy, but always has to concede to the need for excitement." Keirsey appears to be the military advisor for the whole franchise, not just this game or for Treyarch.

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:18, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

:Money is no object is one thing, but designing a different rifle system like you would design a James Bond car is a different thing. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:20, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

: So, basically they said those soldiers can have any gun. Come on, Treyarch ! Give them FN2000´s , Plasma Rifles and Gravity Guns !
No, really. Off course they can have special weapons. But only those which were designated before 1968. Not those which were designated 10 years after.--[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:30, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
::Yes, but since everything is secret, how do we know the CIA DIDN'T develop the AUG, or the SPAS-12, and cover it up by giving it to Steyr and Franchi, respectively? How can we be sure we DIDN'T capture any energy-based weapons from crashed UFOs? (Mind you, I don't work for Treyarch or owe them anything, but I have to give them credit for giving themselves such a clever out.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:51, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:::It seems like all these SOG's have custom-made pieces. And since Weaver rails did exist in Vietnam it would have been totally possible to make these weird AR's we keep seeing. Not saying I agree with this decision, but this is probably how Treyarch is getting away with it.

You guys are so wrong, My friend the NAVY SEAL told me something not to tell anyone else but I don't care. They are issued laser rifles just like the ones in Fallout 3 but have a disntegration setting meant for vaporizing. At least thats Treyarches logic. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:55, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:Calm down. I don't think any of us know when these weapons were in their first stages of prototypes and what they looked like in the prototype stage. Prototype weapons are definitely a recurring theme in Black Ops. Since these guys are above top-secret they can have experimental weapons that are also above top-secret. In the GKnova6 files, it specifically states the AUG in-game will be a prototype version. I wouldn't be surprised if the SPAS is also experimental and the weird AR is completely custom.
:::Cool

RC planes instead of predator missiles?

== Document from viral site ==

Over at the CoD wiki I found this "document" from an viral site connected to Black Ops: [http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100601175649/callofduty/images/3/3d/Doc10.jpg]. It describes the AUG as "very early prototype weapon; not in production". It also mentions the [[G11]]

and also the delicious China Lake Launcher
-Double Agent M

:It would be better if they included more of these prototype weapons. I would love to see weapons like BRG-15, H&K CAWS, Ster ACR, Colt SCAMP,etc. Even better would be a underwater level with the H&K P11! After all the inclusion of such weapons in the game will be better than the monotonous selection of Cold War-rea weapons like M1911,M21,G3,FN FAL,AK-74,etc.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 09:37, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

:I'll shit bricks of joy if the G11 is in there. I've wanted that gun in a Call of Duty game for as far as I remember. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

G11 eh?? im guessing its going to turn into the MP40 from WaW except in speed instead of power

== M202 FLASH ==
I made a couple of changes in this section including adding of screencaps. I rechanged it back to FLASH because everything is anachronic in this came and it can't be the more rarer XM191. Plus I added a M202 FLASH image, which is actually from Far Cry Instincts Predeator, since I could not find a single good picture of it in the web.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 15:43, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
:There's not anachronism, Treyarch keeps saying that all these weapons are prototypes. I'm not sure what people aren't getting about that. I'm pretty sure every weapon we've seen in American hands so far are a prototype of some sort. I think that the FLASH is the prototype version; why can't it be?
::The reference specifically said "M202." We're not going solely by the picture, but by what was actually written by someone who either played it or watched the game be played. And since I doubt the average game journalist is an ordnance expert, he only knew because it was probably labeled "M202" in the game itself. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 23:00, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You know just as well as I do video games often mislabel their guns either by mistake or just to give the public who don't know much about guns an idea of what that gun is instead of confusing them with specifics. I don't argue that it's going to be labeled M202, but I guarantee you Treyarch is intending it to be the prototype XM191.

:: XM191 was M202 prototype, just for your information. --[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:34, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
:::Yes, I'm aware of that. But given the shall we say, unique, circumstances of the game, wouldn't it make more sense to go with what the game says, rather than what's historically correct? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:10, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes XM191 is a M202 prototype.American send to test during late 1970s in vietnam.And i see a picture of XM191 in vietnam war museum. info from http://world.guns.ru/grenade/gl50-e.htm [[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]
Here is what it shoots

[[IMAGE:Treyasuckers.png]]

Wow look like a RPG7 rocket.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

==Not being able to go past vietnam?==

What is this crap I hear about treyarch LEGALLy not being able to go past vietnam in game? A comapny can do whatever the hell they want.

[[User:k9870]]

:I know, I was about to make this same post.-protoAuthor 20:25, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
::From the article posted above (emphasis mine)
::"-Activision eventually convinced West and Zampella to stay with them by offering up a Memorandum of Understanding. In addition to extending their contracts through to October 2011, this legally-binding document gave West and Zampella some major financial bonuses as well as a couple other hefty promises. Chiefly, it gave the two "creative authority over the development of any games under the Modern Warfare brand (or any Call of Duty game set in the post-Vietnam era, the near future, or the distant future) including complete control over the Infinity Ward studio." '''In other words, Activision could not publish a Modern Warfare-branded game (or a Call of Duty game set any time later than Vietnam) without West and Zampella's full approval."'''
::West and Zampella were the two heads at IW who were fired in April. Now that they're no longer with the company, this might open the door for Treyarch's next CoD game to be Modern Warfare-esque, but there's a lot of litigation right now. The firing was way too late to affect BO, so they operated under the restrictions above. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:50, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

I am still waiting for a WWI CoD with single- and multiplayer featuring France, the UK, the German Empire, the Austro-Hungarian Empire, the Ottoman Empire, Russia, Japan, Italy and the USA. Unfortunately this would be too expensive and only few people would buy it. Thus such a CoD will never be made. Sorry for half offtopic. --[[Special:Contributions/84.181.247.180|84.181.247.180]] 20:31, 9 June 2010 (UTC)Paul_Baeumer
:I would love to play a CoD WWI game. (CoD: Great War? CoD: Over the Top?) I'd like to see them change it so you can change out your melee weapon, so instead of a knife, you can equip yourself with an e-tool, brass knuckles, or a spiked club. (Sorry to continue the off-topic.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:02, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
::And to stay on topic, how would they define "distant future?" Why not a CoD game set in 2110? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:02, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

== Why did someone add possible weapons? ==

Someone added possible weapon prototypes like the G11 and the Pump 40mm? I am removing them tomarrow if no one says anything about why they should be left on. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:22, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

: This document (http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100601175649/callofduty/images/3/3d/Doc10.jpg) from the Black Ops viral site could be the reason --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 03:34, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

:There aren't possible anymore, it has been '''confirmed''' that they will be in the game, with other sites like Call of Duty wikia including them in their weapons list.

[[Image:DOC10.jpg]] 
--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 04:28, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

:Yeah, and the Call of Duty wiki is a beacon of truth... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 13:49, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

The AUG and M202 have see in game trailer.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

== Still a little chance ==

Well, they are gonna include dedicated servers. So they apparently release modtools - So it seems like its gonna be possible change guns models, just like in CoD4. --[[Special:Contributions/88.208.103.46|88.208.103.46]] 09:09, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

== M16 on magazine cover ==
It should be removed for now, seeing as there's currently no evidence to support its inclusion in the game. IMFDB chronicles weapons appearing in movies, television, and video games, not on magazine covers. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:12, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Game mags are a great source of weapons, thats where half the screenshots we see come from, game informer and the such.
:Screenshots are one thing, but there's no evidence that the image is actually from the game, it might just be an illustration the magazine drew up. I would heap the image of the guy sitting cross-legged with the two .45s in there as well. It wouldn't be the first time that weapons on cover art don't actually appear in the game itself. ([[Medal of Honor: European Assault]] comes to mind.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:01, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
:Is it bothering you that much?
::Well, considering the site has rules against printed media, yes it does bug me. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:44, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
:90% possibility that's a box-art. Don't be nerdy.

The game sure went into a lot of detail on the 1911 not to use it, and besides, what else would they have, they cant screw up history enough to throw in deegs and berettas.......oh wait, never mind, they can....

vietcong with a spas 12, damn at this rate my dream of marching into the reichstag waist firing an aa12 may come true
:That could be multiplayer screens

== SPAS 12 Folded Stock ==

All i can say is: FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK!!!!
--[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 15:17, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Its more tacticaler and badassish to keep it folded, only noobs use a stock, not hardcore 1337 operators! (video game maker logic))
[[User:k9870]]

At least thay didn't put a goddamn XM8 in the game, if they do, i'll throw my goddamn PC outta the window, 'nuff said --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 03:04, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:'''nerd'''

At least the developers weren't stupid enough to put a rifle concept weapon into a game that takes place during the cold war. At least we can forgive them with the inaccurate AR-15s. And has any game developer ever fired a shotgun without a stock? It's a pain and you can slap yourself in the face if you don't brace yourself. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:I can only think of two possibilities, 1) you're firing Dragon's Breath rounds with the SPAS-12, and using it as small flamethrower, so you can get away with firing it from the hip, and 2)more importantly, WHEN HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A SPAS-12 FIRED FROM THE SHOULDER WITH THE STOCK EXTENDED? The only time I ever saw it was briefly in [[Jurassic Park]]. Even that famous scene in [[Miami Vice - Season 1#Franchi SPAS-12|Miami Vice]], a show that did guns pretty well, with [[Jim Zubiena]], a professional shooter would presumably knows guns pretty well, had him firing a SPAS-12 from the hip. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Q2Il86-38A] Do you think most people even realize that thing on top is a folding stock? Yes, you, me, and everyone who's ever fired a shotgun ([http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgptDs_Nncw| and now this guy]) knows it's stupid to fire a shotgun without the stock extended. But I don't think the general public knows. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:45, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:It's not stupid. You don't really have to aim at point-blank range. I'm curious how aiming down the sights of SPAS with folded stock will work.

I'd love to know the reasoning behind including the SPAS-12 in this game. It didn't exist at the time, and I don't buy the "it's supposed to be a prototype" line. If it's a prototype, why does it look exactly like the production model?(I could make the same argument about the AUG)
Most likely this is Treyarch just being lazy, or including a weapon simply because it has been popular in video games, or both. They could have included an automatic shotgun that really was used in Vietnam, the Remington 7188. It was basically a Remington 1100 with an extended tube magazine, modified to fire full auto. It was used mostly by the Navy SEALS, but I believe SOG made some use of it as well. It's a weapon, as far as I know, that has never been used in a video game. Instead we get the anachronistic SPAS-12 that has appeared in about 5 million games. If anyone is interested in the weapons SOG really did use in Vietnam, get a copy of "SOG: A Photo History of the Secret Wars" by John Plaster. It includes a chapter that specifically covers weapons, and there are ton of great photos. It's expensive, but worth the price.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 02:01, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

:[[Image:MV-FSP-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ludovici Armstrong ([[Jim Zubiena]]) fires his SPAS-12 at two drug dealers, while posing as a chauffeur.]]

I thought it was supposed to be a homage to 80's action movies. Or at least that's why I'm accepting it, because then I'll feel like I'm in an 80's action movie whenever I play this game. And what would an 80's action movie be without the SPAS-12 or the AUG? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:22, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

a littel of topic but, that guy has one of the shitties grips that i have ever seen

== Snake ==
The guy with the AR-15 and the USMC and MACVSOG tattoo the guy looks bad ass, I'm pumped for this dude.

I'm sorry but that sounded a little gay.

i dont think he has the globe and anchor tat , but because of him im going to grow a mullet and wear a head band shhhing people. simmons8492

== .357 ==

A .357, in a tunnel? I hope the game makes it so you won't be able to hear anything for a few minutes after you fire it, so you'd have to make the choice between shooting the bad guy or just meleeing him. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:27, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

:Anyone noticed reloading animation ? He just throwed out shells ( ''STILL HOLDING FLASLIGHT IN LEFT HAND - VISIBLE'' ) And then moved .357 out of screen ('' STILL HOLDING FLASLIGHT IN LEFT HAND - VISIBLE'' ) and than returned .357 to screen. Fully loaded. So it means he reloads revolver in few seconds with one hand ? ...... I just hope BF:BC2:VIïetnam will be much better.

Hey, I'll take that over reloading ''two'' double barrel shotguns at the same time without dropping one anyday. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 04:22, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

It is a game.

youd be suprised what i can do with one hand. simmond 8492

== Grenade Launcher ==

Can anyone identify the grenade launcher used in-game? Here's the link to the video where you can find it. http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2010-call-of/101273 The game labels it "Grenade launcher." It looks like an M203 but that didn't exist in Vietnam...
Also, here's some breaching footage: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2010-call-of/101260

Yeah they did, they went into service around 1969 I think
:Can't believe I got caught without doing my research. My bad.

It's an M203. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:15, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

== SPAS-12 ==

Anyone noticed (In first gameplay video) that EVEN RUSSIANS are equipped with SPAS-12 ? Can be seen around 2:53 lying on the ground next to russian guy....
:Yeah... This is turning out to be pretty fail...

Guys who cares, achronisms don't kill a game. Does it really matter if the guns are slightly innaccurate, all that matters to me is gamplay, good and fair online and ZOMBIES!!
:Call of Duty has always been accurate in the kinds of guns they present to you in single player, with the exception of Modern Warfare 2. So I think I can speak for many fans of the franchise, it matters to us.

Again..it is a pre-release trailer...game is still 5 months from release...

At least it's European, the Russians in MW2 carried Vectors and TAR-21s. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:24, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

== "AR" Sling ==
I'm not one to complain too much about the achronisms, but I do care when things don't make funtional sense, like that the AR's sling, which for some reason is wrapped all around the gun, is stuck UNDER THE BOLT CATCH. It's not like they don't understand it's a funtional part of the gun, cause every AR varient in every COD that's had them has the empty reload where you press the catch... Also I noticed on the non-empty reloads the AR just kinda dips out of the screen and moves a bit then comes back up loaded, you don't see the mag, same goes for the .357; THAT'S lazy... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

I liked the AR-15 reload, it looked real. He pressed the mag release, he let the magazine fall to the ground, and he held it there until he put the new mag in. It's alot more realistic than the MW2 reloads, were you wave your gun around the screen while reloading either to look cool or to make it obvious that you are, in fact, reloading your weapon. Most of the time though, people don't do that when they reload in real life, unless they're an idiot. The .357 reload was kinda lazy though, but I let it slide because he actually whips the cylinder back in instead of the light tilt that's all it takes to swing the cylinder back in in MW2 and most other video games. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:35, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

I love reading these things to see how much constant griping there is..considering the game is still 5 months from release.

[sarcasm] You don't need to reload your guns if you are black ops, just lower them and they will be full again![/sarcasm] seriously thought, this game is REALLY start to be a dissapoint, and it haven't even been released yet --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 22:58, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

I have noticed weapons in game have muzzle jump. MW2 and COD4 had none the guns stayed on target and took no skill to use. In this even the ar-15s rose. I like it.
:It's just cosmetic rise up, the sights will come back right on target after each shot.

Actually WAW some guns would go off target, like an mp40 or DP machine gun. More noticeable at range. Treyarch has recoil effects, which i like.

:It could just be that modern weapons were designed with a better understanding of reducing recoil. Most modern automatic weapons have straight-line stocks, which reduces recoil, as opposed to bent stocks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:26, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Actually look at mw2 ak, fal, m4, whatever, no recoil. WAW, mp40s would be shooting high after half a mag. I like recoil effects means you need more skill to shoot.

== M16 ==
Unknown [[M16]] ( Seems to be A1 ) covered with some kind of cloth or tape appeared in hands of soldier on one of BO´s artworks.

[[Image:M16-SP1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M16A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[Image:BLACKOPSM16.JPG|thumb|none|500px|M16 on cover of French Xbox 360 magazine.]]

I moved it from the main page because like we discussed earlier, it's just a magazine cover with nothing to back it up. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 11:58, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah, that was nice turn. I added it on the page just because it ''HAD SOMETHING TO DO'' with game :) There arent any proofs that M16 will be featured (''unofrtunately'') --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:15, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
::Let's be honest fellas, it's hard to have a game that has much to do with Vietnam without having the old three pronged, triangular handguarded M16. My bet is that it will show up, armed with full auto and 20 round mags. Also, I'm pumped for the G11, that thing is gonna be epicly epic. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:Is it me or is the picture in the magazine a reverse shot? Because I see the forward assist on this A1 as well as the ejection on the right side. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:07, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

== Bad Feeling ==

After realizing all the goofs that are popping up and watching more gameplay footage, I'm getting the feeling I got before Modern Warfare 2 released. Like they're throwing what was once a pretty legitimate game out the window for the coolness effect. And with MW2 that feeling turned out to be correct. Anyone else sensing the same thing?

Yeah, I've got the same bad feeling, except a lot sooner than I got it with MW2, maybe just cause I'm not really expecting much better after the disaster that MW2 was. Oh and COD4 is still fun ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:42, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

MW2 sucked..but MW2 was IW..CoD:BO is Treyarch. Are they perfect? No..but now a days they're better than IW.

I must say i really enjoyed MW2, and, in my opinion, Infinity Ward is still better than Treyarch, oh well, games can't please everybody, can they? --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 11:49, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Hopefully multiplayer is a bit different, mw2 multiplayer was old when it started since it was just like cod 4, at least WAW had vehicles.

-k9870

With luck they'll fix the problems '''before''' the game ships this time. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 16:56, 17 June 2010 (UTC)
:I hope you're right but I doubt it. I've never seen a game change much of anything five months before release.

Everyone here talking shit about IW? You're a bunch of idiots. IW makes far better games. I don't know why you don't like MW2, but it's one of the best of the series so far. This game, on the other hand, looks like it'll be a disaster (as nearly all of Treyarch's iterations are).
:Fuckin right.--[[User:Pølaris|Pølaris]] 03:47, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

I didn't say I hated MW2. Doesn't stop it being loaded with bugs that make the game seem like it was rushed out to meet the deadline. Now, if you're done fanboying... [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 07:35, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
::I don't think it's entirely fanboyish. I'm pretty sure the general consensus of CoD fans is that IW games are better than Treyarch games. IW started the franchise, and CoD games are the only games they make. Treyarch is just along for the ride. But now that IW has lost almost a third of their employees in the last month, that dynamic may change. I have a lot of hope for BO, and I think it's silly to write it off based on a few trailers and three minutes of gameplay footage. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 12:50, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
::: My point was that MW2 was ruined by Acitvision trying to force IW to meet the due date, meaning they had to ship it with a whole range of bugs. However, some of the above poster's comments do seem to boil down to "It's gonna be shit cos it's not an IW game."[[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 07:04, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I personally think that this game looks awesome, and i dont see what the problem is

IW gets the cred since they made the modern games, which people wanted. WW2 was old that siad Treyarch couldve done just as good making mw1 and 2. They had better fire lighting, recoil effects, etc.

:Bottom line is this. IW failed to have MW2 be better than CoD: 4, and this is why they've been put on hold. Treyarch's WaW was a brilliant game, and I still love to play it to this day. Treyarch has shown more promise then IW lately, and I'm sure they won't disapoint with Black Ops, as they plan to remove and fix all the shit MW2 got wrong. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Let's replace your opinion with some fact. MW2 was better than CoD 4 based on the storyline and sales alone, without going into all the new multiplayer features. Was multiplayer a bit buggy? Yeah, for around a month. Treyarch's installments are considered, by those who have played the series, crap in comparison. WaW? That game was garbage. It was basically a recycling of levels from other games in the series that were reskinned. The game was a knockoff of CoD4 that took place in WWII.
:::I'm going to have to call BS on the better storyline in MW2. It's the first CoD game where you get to not only gun down civilians, but also kill American servicemen. That's better? Are you and your buddies playing MW2 in a cave in Kandahar? Big Red One was disappointing, but then again, it wasn't supposed to be a "real" CoD game. CoD3 did suck, I certainly won't argue that. I hated the idea of WaW at first, because WWII was so overdone, but I liked it once I actually played it. (There might be a lesson in there.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Now let's talk about Treyarch. Aside from their lameass 'cash-in' port of CoD4 for the wii (which was garbage), what did they do in the series? Call of Duty 3, Big Red One, World at War, and the current work in progress Black Ops. I don't know if you played any of those, but they were all terrible entries in the series. CoD3 was a gimmick game. 'Oooooh motion control and button mashing'. Big Red One was garbage, and WaW was a hack-job. What does that record suggest their next game will be like?

: Big Red One was awesome, shut up.-protoAuthor 18:54, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Oh, and Treyarch couldn't have made MW1 or 2. They lack originality; every game they released was a knockoff of either IW's designs and ideas or of another developer. The only reason Treyarch is getting to make more CoD's is because IW's execs left because they were being denied their contractually obligated bonuses. --[[User:Asmkillr323|Asmkillr323]] 11:33, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
::Your timeline is off. Development of BO started well before the recent upheaval at IW. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

:Also, World at War is a superb game. Sure you have the god like MP40, but that's nowhere near as bad as OMA danger close noob tubes in MW2, and to anybody who's into WWII and it's weapons it's a hell of a game. It's no CoD: 4, but thank fuck it's no MW2. Treyarch shows promise, and if IW was doing Black Ops I would hold no hope at all. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

No offense but what your saying is that WAW was great in comparison. Thats not good logic at all, CoD4 is the best out of the three. No clue on BO but I have a feeling that since they wanted to justify cool guns that are anchoristic with that they are prototypes is just half-assed which may relate to the rest of the game. Also have you seen the reload animations?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:24, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
:When WaW was first announced, I was appalled. I couldn't believe they were staying in WWII, even after CoD4 skipped ahead to modern day. Looking back though, the fact that it's a WWII game is the only flaw I can think of. (Although, yes, it's a big one.) It restricted the plot, and WWII has been done to death. It was otherwise a pretty good game. I really liked the co-op campaign missions, the vehicle missions were well done, the voice acting was superb, and Zombies takes the game to a whole new level. Aside from the setting, is CoD4 really that much better? Is it time to give Treyarch the benefit of the doubt? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:48, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

:I agree with all of your points chinaman, and you're right, CoD 4 wasn't really all that better. Besides the modern warfare setting, it lacked many of the cool features and such that WaW introduced, and while everyone including me loves it, it wasn't overly better than WaW. I always applauded Treyarch for making WaW not so noob friendly, something IW did massively with MW2. Now the guys at Arch have been watching people complain everywhere about the shit in MW2, and so they know what to do to fix it. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

== Goofs and screw-ups ==
Alright no offense but SHUT UP!!! You guys are complaining about the anachroistic guns in it but it's supposed to be that way. The freaking name is BLACK-OPS which means no one knows about it. What they are doing are saying what Cpt. Price said: History is full of lies. So, what they're saying is that this is not what they thought really happened but they are using their imagination to come with these historical ideas that fall in to the game. But like I said everything in it is supposed to TOP SECRET, so it's going to be anachroistic. But that's how it's supposed to be. It's TOP SECRET so none of us would even know about it.

and P.S. For all butt-holes who said MW2 sucks, Opinions are like butt-holes every body's got one, and nobody wants to hear the other one. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 12:14, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

: Yeah. You act like 12-years old. But we all know you are 10 years old.
::For your information I am actually 12.

Look up mw2 bad spawns on youtube and you'll see how its flawed. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:28, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

::I take it that you don't want fans of the COD series to actually question the developers for making questionable (or stupid) weapons choices for the sake of a compelling narrative. Unfortunately, that only works if we didn't have already have lots of knowledge of the 1960s-1970s era of covert operations from the military and numerous books, which only makes the anachronisms more glaring to anyone who isn't 12 years old.Just like movie watchers, people playing games set in a particular historical era have a certain set of expectations of what ought to be present and what shouldn't. To dismiss all those concerns with a "TOP SECRET" excuse is ridiculous, since Call of Duty 1-3 all managed to be interesting without adding things that didn't exist in the same timeframe. Cursing at people because they disagree doesn't make your defence of Treyarch seem anything more than juvenile. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 16:52, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

No, I just wanted everybody to shut up about saying crap about the guns. So they maybe think that a AUG without a foregrip looks stupid, I think it looks cool. The graphics look good and it looks realistic. I am 12 so I don't care about anachrosism, but I know a heck of alot about guns and Call of Duty so yeah, I was a little mad but because alot of you guys are like in your thirties they are targeting this for people in the younger phase and are not expecting people to go Hey! The AR-15 wasn't introduced then and neither was the Grenade Launcher. I don't think Treyarch are expecting a Riot of AUG foregrip lovers to burn down their studio but come on guys, seriously. Do you have to take this that seriously, your calling me juvenile while your sitting in your chair going hey that trigger guard is rounde then it can't be a M9 so it has be a 92SB therefore they lied! I'm going to kill them! etc. etc. so hey try to be a little compassionate and maybe think about going outside your mom's basement. Ha Ha just joking. (not sarcasm) So what i'm saying is can you not be so depndive on every little detail. Would you like to make a Call of Duty game. Just please voice your honest opinions and not go on about gun mixups because it's really not about the guns it's more about the plot and story. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 18:08, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I think that you people are taking these things too seriously. Since cod 4, these games are like action movies, rather than historical war role-playing type shit. Yes the anachronisms are disappointing, but I'm not really bothered by it and they were done for the sake of making the game cooler (and in my opinion any game set in Vietnam AND including a spas-12 is badass). If you want realism, than check out the new Medal of Honor. If you want Hollywood type action, buy cod games, because thats the direction the franchise is going in, which isnt a bad thing.

:Alright kiddies, let's sit down and have a nice list of what's wrong with Modern Warfare 2.
-One Man Army
-Danger Close M203s
-Commando
-The Spawn system
-Deathstreaks (especially Painkiller)
-Overpowered and unbalanced guns (ACR, FAMAS, UMP)
-Overpriced map packs
-non-dedicated servers, which leads to lag and host migration up you yin yang
-the OMA/Danger Close noob tube combo
-boosters galore
-10 Prestige hack lobbies
-The F2000 is a pile of garbage

So all said and done, that's a pretty big list of whats wrong with the game. You're free to disagree, but let it be known anyone claiming noob tubes are legit will be lynched. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The new Metal of Honor is just trying to cash in on the whole Modern Warfare craze we got going. Modern Warfare is the new WWII game of this generation. And because this IS a site that points out specific weapons, whether or not it should exist in the time period is our jobs on this site. Those of us who do take this site serious has an obligation to point out the holes and inconsistencies. That's what we do here. Call it bitching or whining, but that's what this site is solely for, nitpicking, pointing out obvious holes when we see guns in a movie, game, etc. We're looked up all sorts of history involving the AR-15 and just saying it's "Black ops" doesn't mean they defy the laws of historical consistency. In some of the Indiana Jones movies that takes place before WWII, we do point out MP40s and 98Ks should not exist as a fact. Even black ops of today would use the latest technology, not weapons that haven't been field tested or even made yet. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:12, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

: You, Excalibur, look like one of those very few inteligent people in this discussion. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:42, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. Also, I've seen Beta footage and Medal of Honor just looks a lot like Bad Company 2. And to be honest, I could care less if the AUG or AR-15 or what have you is an anachronism in this game, as long as we're not talking lasers I'm fine. We're here to point out weapons in film, give pictures and descriptions of them, and talk about them, not bitch that a gun being in a game set 2 days before it was produced makes it a failure [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Those guns arent 2 days befor prouction. Its ''8 years''. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:42, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Pointing out achronistic guns is part of what we do here, that said, for me it won't kill the game, unless there's a Modern Warfare 2-like pile of other stuff wrong with it too. Oh and yes the Russians & Vietnamese wouldn't use SPAS-12s but you're forgetting the only guns they've REALLY intended to show off so far are the AUG, SPAS-12, AK-47, M202, Python, and Crossbow, that's only what, six? I think they only picked these few guns to go in the trailers, and then reveal more later, so maybe the guns will be more where they should in the final version... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 21:42, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, God forbid we talk about firearm mistakes in TV/Movies/Video Games on a website DEDICATED TO DISCUSSING FIREARMS IN TV/MOVIES/VIDEOGAMES! I will continue to make comments on what, in my opinion, are idiotic firearm choices for this game. If anyone disagrees, feel free to reply, but don't tell me to shut up. Some of the comments above just prove my theory that weapons, such as the SPAS-12, were simply included because they are popular in video games, with Treyarch using the whole "prototype" B.S. as justification for their presence.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 05:08, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
:Yes, how DARE they try to give players what they want?! You'd think they were in this to make money or something. What a bunch of whores! --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:27, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
::Really? So the only way for this game to make money is to include a SPAS-12? Is there that much demand for a SPAS-12 it has to be inluded to make gamers happy? Would the game be a financial failure if it wasn't there, and weapons more appropriate to the time period were included instead?--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 06:12, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You said it yourself, it's what players want. And like you also said, it's minor. Games are made for the general public, not gun dorks like us. As a gun dork, I'm a bit bothered, but as a gamer, I'm thrilled that I can light people on fire with a shotgun. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 09:43, 20 June 2010 (UTC) (gun dork and gamer)
^Hell yeah! [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:44, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

:::: Does the success of the game depend that much on specific weapons that appear in it? You said yourself that as long as a game is fun, accurate/inaccurate depictions of weapons doesn't matter that much. If that's the case, weapons more correct to the time period can be included, and the game will still be a success ''as long as it's fun''. And I highly doubt Treyarch polled gamers and asked them what weapons they wanted to see in Black Ops. I think they were just acting on their ''perception'' of what weapons are popular in video games. So I don't know if I can say this is a case of "what players want", more a case of Treyarch saying "we think we know what players want". This is just a theory I came up with as to why certain weapons were included, I don't have any idea if it's true(although some comments from other posts seem to confirm it). For all I know, Treyarch is just being lazy and it's easier for them to include the well known weapons rather than do real research. At any rate, I can't see the inclusion/exclusion of specific weapons making or breaking a game.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 01:17, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
:::::"At any rate, I can't see the inclusion/exclusion of specific weapons making or breaking a game." My thoughts exactly. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

You know, those that find it stupid that we are pointing out the anachronisms in this game should really just go to the treyarch forums, not post on a website dedicated to firearm identification. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:32, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
:Ok, if those anachronistic weapons supposed to be '''early''' prototypes then they at least could make it look '''different''' from production models! That would be much more believable. Tryesuckarch is just being f-ing lazy. I don't mind flat-top AR, but they could make it not look like a modern one. And also if there is no simple M16A1 then it's a total fck-up in the Vietnam themed game.
::If they made it look different5 from the final gun, you guys would be even more pissed! You'd be like "How can they call that a M16A1! Look at it it looks nothing like the original!" Plus. how could Treynot-suckarch know what they would like? You guys wouldn't be pissed if this was a modern warfare game. In fact I bet that Treyarch probably wanted to do that but they couldn't(breathes deeply)you know what this is my last comment. I'm done arguing with all the stupid people on this site. If you have anything else to say you can take it up with me on my talk page. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 13:44, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You don't know what you're talking about. Photos or drawings of the prototypes can easily be found on the internet. A drawing of the AUG prototype is on the World Guns page, and the prototype SPAS-12(along with a photo of the SPAS-11) is shown on the SPAS-12 webpage: [http://spas12.com/spas12not.htm] And if Treyarch clearly states a weapon is supposed to represent a prototype and it actually looks like the prototype, no one is going to complain.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 00:09, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

:Are these mistakes any worse than some of MW2s fuck ups? Like the L86 with a made up drum magazine and iron sights that wouldn't be usable as it has a straight stock, the AUG cosmetically having a 30 round mag when it says 42? The MP5K having a rail system only seen on an airsoft gun in real life and so on. Let's remember Black Ops isn't set only in 1968, and so they have a bit of play when it comes to weapons. The M16 is confirmed (I have a friend doing beta testing) and is Vietnam styled. Now if anyone wants to instantly write off the game because it has a few anachronisms and shit in it, then your missing the point. So what if your using an AUG in 1968? It's not like lasers in WWI, and it's still fun to do. Don't focus on the hate, try and just enjoy it for what it is, a video game. If you want reality, go join the army and head off to Iraq or something, cause in video game land, reality will be broken. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]
:So you're trying to justify Treyarch fuckups comparing it to MW2? Fuckup is fuckup

One, I tottaly agree. Two, did your friend say if there is an M14?

:Yes, the M14 should be in there. Also, I hardly see mild anachronisms as "fuck ups" in a game that pretty much goes on alternate reality anyways. Treyarch has created a game all about the operations we don't know about, the cover ups, and the spec ops weaponry we don't see for years, so having an AUG earlier then it's commercial release can be forgiven. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]\

::Treyarch has the right to depict an alternate Cold War for all they desire, but as long as they try to play it off as the historical "truth" that no one knows about while maintaining all sorts of obvious (and IMO not minor at all) anachronisms, they are only leaving themselves open to criticism. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 23:41, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

:They aren't trying to play it off as historical truth, they're trying to go with an alternate truth, which makes perfect sense. Also, if I hear another person commenting on how rails are anachronistic, I'm going to snap. It's fucking rails on a gun in a video game, get over it. Black Ops will be an awesome game, and despite these possible anachronisms, I'll be gladly killing Russians in 1968 with my AUG thank you [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I don't think I'm going to get this game. I'm getting a vibe that it's filled with silly crap much like Modern Warfail 2. I'll be playing the next Medal of Honor instead. -Frank T

:Medal of Honor looks like Bad Company 2 with Taliban, so that's the game I won't be getting. Treyarch impressed me with World at War, and they're aiming to please this time, removing and modifying all the bullshit Modern Warfare 2 bestowed on us. From deathstreaks to Commando, they're out to fix it all! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I never really got that mindset "It's BFBC2 but slightly different so I'm not getting it". Well, if you don't like Bad Company 2 to begin with that's fine, but there's more of a difference between Bad Company 2 and Medal Of Honor than between COD4 and World At War, most of the difference was the setting so it seemed like a bigger difference, but the core gameplay was very close, and they were made by two DIFFERENT companys while BFBC2 and MOH are made by the SAME ONE. I'm not saying anything bad about them, I like the first three and the MOH Beta. And yes, Modern Warfare 2 failed in two ways: First, it was WAY too noob-friendly, like, before it came out I would've never thought it possible for a game to be that noob-friendly, and second, it traded realism for coolness in pretty much every way, while COD4, the game they'd JUST MADE, had a believable story, weapons that were almost perfect in terms of appearance and who used them, and the only real nooby stratagy was the M16 Red Dot, but oh well, there was almost only that one. I know Treyarch has said they're trying to get rid of the cheap MW2 stuff, and that's good, but I'm really not liking the direction this is going, picking the guns because they're cool and not because they make sense, even a little bit, the exploding crossbow bolts, how almost every weapon we've identified so far is either achronistic or has something wrong with it (go look), the Hind A with tandam seating, and when you get in you go through the long cool animation of getting in and starting up, but then it takes off in 2 seconds flat, and the lazy, lazy reloads... I'm not saying it's going to suck, I'm saying my hopes aren't high, sure it'll be better than MW2, but that's not saying much. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 23:36, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

:Arguably Black Ops has issues, but don't forget that E3 footage comes months before the final product. So what if the Hind has tandem seating, does that make it any less cool to blast VC with it? So what if the reload isn't uber detailed, does that detract from you shooting people? So what if there's minor anachronisms, isn't this both a video game and an alternate reality? I'll agree the crossbow is kind of odd, but this game should be nowhere near as noob friendly as the god awful MW2. Modern Warfare 2 was built on the idea of helping bad players, but it only resulted in much rage for good players such as myself. Call of Duty 4 was made to break the mold on FPs games of the time, and it did and still does kick ass. MW2 was built to top it, and instead of that, they gave us an over dramatic, noob friendly game that overall makes me just want to buy a copy of CoD 4 again. And on MOH, I've seen some footage, and now I actually like it, sure it looks BC2 like, but thats no biggy, and overall that looks ready to rock too! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Okay, sorry, that came off as too bad against Black Ops, I know it's months away from coming out and no, the Hind's seating isn't really a problem, I was just pointing out that it was wrong, same with a lot of the stuff we've seen so far. My point was there's a lot of incorrect things in the game, not neccecarily game-breaking, just pointing out that COD4 and WAW were better in that regard, though so far the game overall looks pretty good :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 05:29, 29 June 2010 (UTC)

:To be really honest, it won't matter if there's minor issues and anachronisms, cause as long as Black Ops isn't as noob friendly and shitty as MW2, I'll be fine and dandy [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Exactly, but we still do need to point them out though. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

I dont see MW2 as "noob friendly", just as balanced. It tried too hard to make no gun any better than another. It also felt like cod4, like the core gameplay mechanics were all old when you started playing.

-k9870

:Face it dude, MW2 basically reeks of noob friendliness. You have deathstreaks, solely designed to help shitty players, noob tubes which when coupled with OMA and danger close are the noobs cannon of choice. You have the ACR and FAMAS, both of which are overpowered, then you get stuff like the UMP which at close range does more damage then an M4 Carbine. Not to mentionthe marathon lightweight commando set up used by knife fags so they can knife you from 12 feet away. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

And the overpowered Harriers, that killed everyone all the time and you could have 2 up at once, and they always beat the helos in fights, and Chopper Gunner, and Tactical Insertions, allowing people to boost really easily for the Nuke, that ended the game, and Slight Of Hand Pro that let everyone quickscope, yeah the list keeps going... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 19:49, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

I always find a stinger to be good against harriers and because you can have 2 on you, most of the time, you can take even 2 of them out. Not Gunner choppers are a pain to take down [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

:Chopper gunners are a pain, AC-130s are worse. Not only can they not be hit by bullets or tubes or anything of that sort, but they have TWO sets of flares that can deploy without any delay. Tact inserts mixed with cold blooded and good old FFA is great for boosting, luckily now Sandy Ravage deals some booster justice (hell, even I serve justice to them now). Either way though, MW2 was clearly IW's attempt to top CoD: 4, which was a game built to revolutionize FPS games. MW2 was built to be playable by even the noobiest kids, over the top, reference movies every two seconds, and overall be a fairly shitty game. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The problem with the Harriers is they're way too good... unless you just pull out a stinger and then they're dead, which is a little too extreme both ways. The reason the helicopter was so much better in COD4 was because there were no guided rockets, you couldn't shoot the rotor (so you couldn't just hipfire the thing to death), and UAV Jammer didn't help you against it, it killed you anyway, not to mention it never seems to manage to hit you in MW2. What I hate is hearing "Helicopter Inbound", then seeing it shot down in literally 5 seconds... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 17:05, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Death streaks were only like 10 seconds long and didnt bother me, no guns were eoverpowered, there all balanced, too much if you ask me. C130s were easy to hide from and rare to see and i downed tons of harries with stingers. The noob tube didnt bother me, i used a m16 with m203 and iron sights as my primary weapon. Knife noobs are easy to shoot The problem was cheap tactics, like camping spawn points and getting your friends to camp with you in free for all so you could stab them and boost your way to a nuke.

-k9870

The only streak thats ten seconds long is painkiller, and it still sucks. The ACR has no recoil and can outshoot sniper rifles, so can the FAMAS. AC-130s are easy to hide from on SOME maps, but if you get spawn trapped outside, your screwed. The fact you use a noob tube on your primary gun choice sickens me, because ANYONE who uses them, unless to get the shotgun unlocked or in a tactical, non spam way is a complete noob and should be banned for using such a cheap weapon. Knife noobs are easy to shoot at times, but if they get within ten feet, commando is your demise. MW2 is a shit game, end of story, Black Ops is doing everything to solve the problems it caused, amen. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The m203 is useful to launch through windows and take out campers, and i use iron sights so might as well have an attachment. I dont use the m203 as my primary, but have it on my primary. And the ACR has low power at range taking on snipers. I countersniper with my m16 though, love irons, they have no sway like a scope. I hate snipers the most, there like socially acceptable campers. Its funny to lay out some noob who tries to quickscope though. It seems like no matter what you get called a noob though, m4 noob, noob tuber, shotgun noob, dual wield noob, knife noob....it seems everyoned thinks if yo dont use whaty they do your a noob, and c-130s dont bother me, there rare, people need 13 kills to get them. I hated when i tried to play free for all with some friends in a party and people are just boosting to nukes each round and cheating there asses off

[[user:k9870]]

agreed. it is always considered noobing. Snipers are annoying. it takes no skill at all to snipe. however there are worse things in MW2 then Snipers. for example- the people who camp in buildings like Wasteland or Scrapyard. "noob tubers" really arent annoying at all anyway. aggravating maybe, but if someone hits you with a M203 its your fault anyway. you should have been more alert. [[Special:Contributions/71.194.219.9|71.194.219.9]] 22:48, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

People always camped hallways and alleys and just shot anyone coming around the corner. Easy to just poke in and launch 40 mil at them. Besides, the thing has an aring distance, you need to arc it at range and reload was slow. Balanced.\

-k9870

:Face it, the M203 is a noob piece of shit. the combo of an M203 with Danger Close and OMA makes you a mini artillery battery. Also, how are you supposed to dodge a tube when people are shooting them cross map to your spawn? Nothing says pro like getting hit by a 40mm grenade shot hundreds of feet over buildings into your face. The M203 has no place in MW2, and I'd be one to have it removed. If retards can't use guns well, don't give them bullshit to help them, let them suck and they'll quit the game. When I pull my FAL out, I feel like a pro, knowing everyone else has the overpowered ACR and FAMAS and the tubes out, all ready to be scrubs, while I'm using something that's balanced and yet awesome. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Well said, though I wish the G3 was still in, and the fact that the ACR does a little less damage, like 1 bullet, maybe two different, makes no difference when there's absolutly no recoil, they still can't do anything by the time you kill them across the map from one huge sustained burst... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:37, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

Are you all playing hardcore or something? And i have no people launching 203s around problem, you only get 2. And i could care less about harriers and 130s, you need a lot of kills to get them. There is a call of duty cultuure to nae some guns as oaky and some as cheap. I dont give a shit personally though. i just play. No matter what somebody will bitch about your gear.

I remember back when everyone hated p90s, that thing had no range or power and overall sucked.

You only get two M203s if your not using scavenger or the more common One Man Army. I literally see two or three people on my team per game using that stupid backpack, it's complete bullshit. The ACR may not do high damage, but it's high rate of fire and zero recoil means you can full auto the damn thing at any range. I think retards who dare to say the noob tube is a legit way to play should be banned from PSN or XBL and never allowed on any Call of Duty again. It's called a first person shooter, not first person grenade launchers. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:I wasn't aware that we can't SHOOT grenade launchers. I better go tell the guys at Activision/IW/Treyarch. -Chris_Hun7er 02:05, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

The problem is more that games are good and balenced when everything has a place, if people start using snipers at close range and beating shotguns (that's more of a Halo thing, but the snipers quickscope and the shotguns are rather terrible), or shooting 40mm rounds at any range for any reason, it's dumb. The launchers in BFBC2 are well balenced, because they have a purpose and they fill it, and nothing else. The assault rifles in MW2 have a purpose, fill it, and then beat SMGs and shotguns at close range, and half the time snipers at long range. And the Javelin, not that I see it too much, is good against tanks, except, there aren't any, there's infantry and helicopters. A game works when things have a purpose and fill that purpose, but not anything else's purpose, and that's half of what's screwed up in MW2. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:36, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

:Excactly Alex. Bad company 2 had 40mms that had to virtually land on the person to kill them, but with Danger Close an MW2 noob tube will kill people even if they're up to fifteen feet away from the landing. To be honest, I think noob tubes should just be plain removed from Black Ops, and the tube fanboys can suck it while us normal players use our guns. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:Reality is fanboy the US 40mm rounds have a 5 meter kill radius. meaning that if you are 15 feet away from the blast you are dead as a doornail. the 40mm grenades in bad company are more useful as doorway makers and cover destroyers than as proper suport weapons. what is pissing off alot of us who care about little things called historic accuracy is the fact that even though they say that everyone had to read about MACV:SOG they have gotten few details right. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 18:44, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

It's true that the 40mm is not terribly powerful in BC2, but explosives need to be less powerful in games than they would in real life, imagine Claymores with realistic spread, damage, and range, without those stupid little lasers, and without bomb squad. Or frag grenades, they're overspammed as it is. Doing something like that is less realistic, but needed for the game to work. Having something like and AUG in 1968, or a SPAS-12 used by Vietcong around the same time... not so much. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

:I agree Alex, because Claymores are really designed to take out a huge radius of enemies, it could easily wipe out an eight man squad. and a frag in a 10 by 10 room would really kill everything inside. If they went for realism, all the 5.56 assault rifles in MW2 would have the same damage and virtually the same recoil, but for balance the TAR is portrayed as extremely powerful, and the ACR weak. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Yeah, it just bothered me that they were THAT different, they could have chosen different weapons if they wanted to balence them like that or something, the part that bugs me the most is that COD4 was better balenced AND made more sense, it's just such a step back... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

All you people whining and crying about grenade launchers and snipers need to quit bitching and cowboy up. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:38, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Grenade launchers are balanced, mininum detonation range, slow reload, not very accurate (need to arc) only 2 rounds, and besides, use it to take down campers.

== Linked to World at War ==

It has been conformed that Reznov from World at War will appear in this game and even make comments about Dimitri Petrenko. This was seen on the Call of Duty Wiki

:Yes, as Reznov is more or less confirmed to be the bearded man you meet and then split from in the tunnel rat scene at E3. I'm happy to see him back, as he made World at War even better for me, maybe now he'll continuously yell "Fire the Javelin!" [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::"now he'll continuously yell "Fire the Javelin!"" What's a Javelin doing in the cold war? Oh wait I forgot, it must be a secret prototype no one knew about.

:Alright, I was thinking in an MW2 state of mind, lemme see. I know, how about him always yelling "FIRE THE LAW" in your ear every two seconds when something as small as a jeep shows up
[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Any links to zombies?

Yes. Confermed on callofduty.com

as lon as he goes all predator on some one like in wold at war , im fine with in, and being as that hes a soviet why is he with the us? defector or what? simmons 8492

== Has it occured to anyone that the AR-15 variant is probably custom made? ==

Treyarch has said that these guys could have guns custom built just for them, which I feel explains things much more adequately than just saying that they're prototypes of future (to them) guns. My theory is that he had a CAR-15 custom made with a flat-top reciever for tactical reasons. Maybe this caught on with the rest of the team, and whatever manufacturer they got to make these guns for them sold the idea later on. Of course this is just an excuse for the guns having the rails just to free it up for attacthments in Multiplayer, but at least there is some kind of excuse. Unfortunately this theory doesn't cover the anachronistic appearances of the SPAS-12 and the AUG, but hey, no game ever get's all of it's guns 100% correct. 

Edit: Actually it just might explain the AUG, because all it really is is a combination of ideas taken from the Enfield EM-2, 
Korobov TKB-022, and several other abandoned designs from before or shortly after World War 2. The only thing it doesn't explain is why it has the production-style built in telescopic sight, instead of the original prototypes open sights:
[[http://world.guns.ru/assault/aug_pr1.gif]]

:I can deal with the CAR-15 because it's at least ''plausible'', but the "SOG got it first" excuse doesn't work with the guns that didn't yet exist. The AUG isn't just a customized version of another gun, it's a standalone design on its own. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:48, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

== For those of you who may be confused about the supposed MP5/UMP hybrid ==

This is what I'm talkin about: 

[[Image:CODBO-SMG.jpg]] 

As you can see, it appears that it has the reciever and magazine housing of an MP5 or MP5K, while the barrel housing (correct me if I'm incorrect in calling it that) looks like that of a somewhat shortened UMP. If you look closely, you will note that it has the MP5Ks finger guard (I'm guessing that's what that is) directly below the muzzle that looks like a cut down version of the full handguard found in this picture: 

[[Image:MP5Kprototype.JPG]] 

My point is I don't think it's a hybrid at all, merely an MP5K missing it's forward vertical grip, for some reason or another. And seeing as every other aspect of the gun is that of an MP5Ks, I think it's safe to say that's what it is, so I'm gonna change it to that on the front page. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:38, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

It ain't a hybrid, it is a real gun altogether. After doing some research I think I've found the gun or rather guns that it could potentially be. My first guess is:
*The H&K SMGI & II
http://www.hkpro.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=103:smg-i-a-ii&catid=11:rare-prototypes&Itemid=5
*And second guess being the MP5 PIP
http://www.hkpro.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=102:mp5-pip&catid=11:rare-prototypes&Itemid=5
[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 19:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

== G11 ==

Anyone else as excited as I am for the inclusion of the G11? [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:16, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
:Just another anachronistic gun. Thats all. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 04:49, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

I sure as heck am. --[[User:AK-74Fan|AK-74Fanc]] 23:18, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

Eh the gun itself isn't that big of a deal to me, but I definitely am excited to see something that to my knowledge hasn't been in an FPS before. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 23:29, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
: Well, it have appeared already in few other FPS games. For example [[Delta Force: Land Warrior]], [[Global Operations]], [[IGI 2: Covert Strike]] or Code of Honor: The French Foreign Legion --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 04:58, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
::Those games are not up to the modern standard, though. ;) [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 12:11, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

:Really, you could say this is the G11s first appearance in a well known game, and will finally show it off to the masses. I love the weapon itself, and to see it finally make a big appearance like this makes me quite happy.[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The G11 was in Syphon Filter 2 [[Special:Contributions/98.237.107.108|98.237.107.108]] 02:25, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Can someone link me the video of the G11 being used? I don't want to search through all the reposts and copies of other videos.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 13:23, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== XM214 Microgun ==

Since it's going to cover the Vietnam era, and the way these types of games like to go over the top, do you think there's a chance that the XM214 Microgun is going to make an appearance? I know it was only a prototype, and was it was made in the 70's, but I thought I read somewhere that the SF guys tried it out only to find that it was not feasable having a gun fire at 4,000 rpm.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 03:14, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

:I think putting a Minigun in the game would be kind of stupid. I mean sure they could make it heavy and awkward to carry, but that thing would simply decimate anyone in it's path, whether they're behind light cover, in a vehicle or just in the open. I'd love one, but methinks not. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Not to mention it's impossible to actually fire one with live rounds. -Mandaloin

== A more plausable fictional AR-15 ==

I can understand a frankengun, like some special forces guy back then would take several kinds of AR-15 designs and mash them together until he gets an awesome gun that works. And being special forces, they can get whatever they want to suit their mission, so it would make sense for whatever they take to not be standard issue or that it is known, but I don't like the flip up iron sights since I don't know when flip up irons came about or the flat top receiver. It's like they just took a Colt Model 933 and replaced the stock with an old style stock from the CAR-15. I mean, put a telescoptic stock on an M16A1 rifle, or A2 upper reliever on the Car-15 and swap out the pistol grip or something. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:16, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

:That would make sense considering the special forces style of the game. Also, Sonny (from Deadliest warrior and such) was on as an advisor for Spetsnaz and tactics, so look for both some epic Spetsnaz moves and even a character of him in game! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Do we even officially know yet what model AR-15 it is, aside of course from the flattop reciever and flip-up sights? [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 02:31, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

It pretty much is a Colt Model 933 without a brass deflector or forward assist, which actual does not exist. I have not seen a flat top reciever without the forward assist and the brass deflector. I don't even think flip up irons were invented back then. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:58, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

I mean if they threw in a CAR-15 tricked out like the ones seen in Black Hawk Down, I'd have no complaints [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:04, 22 July 2010 (UTC)
:+1. but they though it would look too bulky from first person perspective.

agreed. that movie was amazing. i wouldnt even care if you couldnt use the tac-lights but still the CAR-15s they had in that movie were amazing. does anyone no what the difference between CAR-15 and Colt Commando models are??? [[Special:Contributions/24.15.103.231|24.15.103.231]] 23:55, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
:I associate the CAR-15 with the XM177 style flash hider and the Commando to me is the M733 for it's short barrel [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:55, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

== New weapons! ==

Here's [[http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:GunWall.png]] a pic of a bunch of airsoft guns Treyarch has on a wall in their studio which pretty much confirms that they'll be in the game. 
From left to right, starting at the top: 
-M16A2 (?) 
-MAC-10 w/ supressor 
-AUG 
-Mini-Uzi 
-L85 
-Scorpion SA Vz 61 
-AKs-74u 
-Another Skorpion 
-SPAS-12 
-MP5 (?) 

Not sure exactly what the MP5 is doing as there already is the K variant prototype, and no idea what the HELL the M16A2 is doing there as there's already an M16A1 AND a CAR-15. What do you all think?
Sorry it's a bit blurry.

It could be a very blurry M16A1 or maybe because they somehow can bullshit their way into saying they got a prototype M16A2. And I prefer us to use the full size MP5 again. Looks like they got an L85 here. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:59, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

: That pic is here too :) Check out "extras" section in article :D

:The L85 got my gun-boner up, been wanting that since the MW2 L86 LSDisapointment. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Dude, put that away. :P [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 12:23, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

We might also see the Browning HP because of the rumored "Iranian Hostage Situation" level. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

:I wouldn't be surprised, but if I see another Desert Eagle, then I'll have to wtf. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Deagle prototype and AA12 prototype + level is moved to Buckingham Pallace to add more drama to the game. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::Sorry, Buck Palace? Explain this? I assume this is a rumour, since so far Operation Nimrod has yet to be confirmed aswell. Sounds interesting though (if a little rediculous and implausible)
::::just kidding. I just jumped on the Black Ops bandwagon [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

Im guessing the a2 is used since its more availible and when they do motion capture it would look the same. showing how someone moves with a m16 s what they're looking for,

:Also, the footage showing the Spetsnaz game models doing rolls shows the player holding and firing a clearly Vietnam era M16A1, so that's there for sure. Also, I do believe the Iranian Embassy raid will be tacked on much like Mile high Club in CoD 4, simple as a fun epilogue style bonus mission. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

"Black Ops is said to be set in various locations, including Vietnam and Cuba, [3] and judging from weaponry and dates given in the trailer, it is set between 1960 and 2010."
a quote from here: http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops

I really hope there's a Browning HP, cause it's cool and cause I'm Canadian lol. It might be in to be honest because in COD4 the Overkill and Last Stand pics had a Glock and then it was added in MW2, and the Overkill pic in WAW was a Browning HP :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 21:56, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I hope its just "iranian embassy raid inspired", not the real thing, i want more than 6 guys to shoot.

:This is Call of Duty, so you'll always have plenty of enemies to shoot. And yeah Alex, as a fellow Canadian, a Hi-Power would be a nice handgun to have in the game, and period correct. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

As much as I love the Hi Power and actually owning one, I don't want to see one in a game such as call of duty just because of the attention it will recieve from nerds spamming videos on youtube "HEY THIS GUN IS IN CALL OF DUTY!!!!1" It gets really annoying and that kind of attention seems negative to those that actually collect guns. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:29, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

:Partially agree with you there. I hate the attention guns get from these games (and suddenly every 12 year old becoming a firearms expert [yes, obviously the M16 is better than the AUG just because CoD says so]) but, I enjoy being able to play with them. Win some, loose some. Well, one or two firearms forums have noticed a HUGE increase in the number of people looking for the 'ACR'. As have a few rifle stores in the 'States that I know of have been plagued by idiot teens looking for hi-tech military grade gear...

I hope there is a HP, they need a 9mm gun for MP (more ammo, less recoil, but less damage) and Id rather see a cool gun then a lame generic beretta coming in.

I wouldn't mind seeing a Browning HP, (heck Indiana Jones used one, who wouldn't?) But then again it may look just a little bit too similar to the M1911 that's already confirmed for this game, so it's addition might be just a little visually redundant. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 05:04, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

:Hi-power and m1911...look similar? It sounds like "Elephant&Rhino look alike" or "M16 looks like AK 47".

I said they look similar. Not exactly alike. Besides, when it comes to COD, all of the guns are supposed to be easily distinguishable on the fly. If they gave one a different finish it'd be perfectly fine.

:Maybe so, maybe not, but all I'd like to hope is that the bloody ACR doesn't return, or else I'm burning down Treyarch studios. Honestly, MW2 just had cool and shiny guns that everyone would like, as opposed to realistic and proper guns used by militaries and militias. Of course the AK needs rails and a retractable stock, that makes it cooler! And of course we have the Barret, because it's big and makes a loud boom! And of course we have a Glock 18, because it's a Glock! I swear, it's like the IW developers had no idea what real special forces, Rangers, Spetsnaz and Militia would be equipped with, and instead went solely with cool, popular and impractical guns. Black Ops sounds like it's trying to be period correct, or at least have some different guns that other games. Sure there's an anachronistic AUG, but atleast it's not an ACR or Intervention in 1968! Rant complete! Also, I've heard lots of rumours of the Beta being released August 1st, anyone got any info on that? [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I've heard that rumor too, but as far as I know it has no information to back it up

some guy was selling beta codes on ebay (£12 for a demo!!!) but they have been pulled. unluckey for the 10 people that bought them as the guy was new and had (0)--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 22:04, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

They don't really need a high cap 9mm, while it wouldn't be realistic but they could do it like they did in WaW. I remember reading something about a old guy that was killed in his home and over 30 guns stolen and he had a Uzi and a FAL. The guy was in his 70s as I recall and someone said "a uzi and a fal? LOL someone plays to much MW2!" even though the guy most likely never heard of MW2. The FAL used to be fun to look up on Youtube, I discovered it through sportsman guide as a parts kit so I looked it up on youtube and it was just educated comments about the gun. Same video a few months later after MW2 came out it was just gaming nerds that thought they knew guns commenting. I don't want to see this happen to the gun thats in my shoulder holster. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:49, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

:COD nerds. Sooner or later they`ll grow out of it(like i did with Counter Strike) [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

Or not.

Who gives a damn if they do, what are you gonna do, buy a brand new gun, buy the most obscure handgun you can think of? Every profession, field of study, or interest gets its day in the limelight(save for the really boring ones), and videogames are doing this for guns. Do you think that symbologists enjoyed when the Da'Vinci code came out? They were probably just as annoyed as you for all the dilettantes who thought they suddenly knew something about symbology. What the hell are you gonna do? Nothing, I say. --[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 05:32, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

:I plan on owning guns when I grow up, have already handled and shot many guns, and yet I still plan to play CoD as an adult. You know why? Because I enjoy online gaming, and because oddly IRL you can't shoot people and get away with it (outside of airsoft, which I also play) [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Jigsaw, it appears as though you misread my post, I don't want them to include it because I hate the negative and dumbass attention guns online already attract. I feel as though my sport is tainted because of all these idiots. I'm fine with other games including it that aren't as mainstream but CoD is idiot infested. The 1887 Winchester is a perfect example, I learned about it from terminator 2 and thought it was cool and all and comments on those videos were either people that found out about it the same way and shooters. Now they are filled with nerds talking about it in MW2. Its seriously annoying. Seeing how you people come from video games and not shooting you won't be able to understand. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:43, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

Well you never addressed the negative attention bit in your original post, but still, how are you going to stop them? Sure it's annoying but it's nothing to stew over. And I like how you assume that we're 'from' gaming and not a shooting history so we obiously can't know how you feel. Also, your page says you're seventeen, I didn't realize that minors could get CCWs, or was that shoulder holster talk figurative, or do you live on a ranch or something?

It was in my own home and it was for real. Don't need a CCW to carry anyway. I never said I'm gonna stop them or make a petition or anything, I was just expressing my point. Yes I did address the negative attention. Alot of you on here in the video game section have more experiance with video games than actual firearms. I know someone that has made it so you he has to approve comments because of the videos of his Beretta M93r.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:18, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

:I'm also extremely proud that even at 16, I came from liking and learning about guns from sources outside of video games. Hell, even if I first see a gun in a game, I'll research it to learn some proper information, not the awesome CoD-Knowledge so many kids think they have nowadays. Literally, I had a kid telling me the ACR was better then the AK-47 the other day because "It's better in MW2, which is really close to real life". I laughed at him for a minute, then went on to own him with a five minute talk on the AK-47, which he promptly retorted to by leaving the game. Cod kids 0, Me 1 [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Eh I shoot when I can, but I mostly just read up on just about everything I can learn about a certain gun once I see it in a movie/game/real life. I wish I had more time to shoot. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 04:50, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

i hate it when people talk about the intervention sniper as being amazing. ok in real life its very powerful, and i first learnt about it from a film and i thought it looked ugly. i also hate the annoying 10 year olds with the duel shotguns, modern warfare 1 was a great game and tactical, MW2 was more tacticool. especially when you get kids, that shouldnt own the game but are spoilt enbough to get there parents buy it, they lecture you on guns like they have them in their living room and use them constantly. i like the ACR it looks cool, i know it as the 'magpul masdasa' but no one on COD as ever hear of the name. i would like to see pistols as secondary, they balance out the game and dont make it unfair. i would like them to make pistols louder to make them feel powerful rather than a crappy sound that seems quieter than a hole puncher--[[user:smish34|smish34]] 13:44, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

: Well, i always though that ACR looks terrible. First seen it in Future Weapons and only thing that i liked was fact that i can fire both 5.56 and 7.62. Intervention ? This is one of first guns that i heard about first in MW2. I imediattly googled some real life info about it :)

So did I. By the way, is it even called the Masada anymore? I thought Remington bought the rights and renamed it 'Remington ACR'. Oh well, either way I'm still gonna call it the Masada, it sounds better, and MW2 kiddies won't know what I'm talking about. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:10, 31 July 2010 (UTC)
:I always thought it was a silly name for a weapon. You ARE aware of what happened to Masada, correct? Yes, it's a great example of defiance in the face of incredible odds, but the fact remains, everyone eventually killed themselves. (Or each other, but you know what I mean.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:38, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

It was designed by Magpul under the Masada name and then Bushmaster started building them. Then came Freedom group that bought Remington and they decided to buy bushmaster. So now the bushmaster ACR has the remington name on it even though they have nothing to do with design or manufacturing.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 16:42, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Ah, I see. And I had no idea that happened to Masada, I'll have to look into that. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 17:49, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

:Well, from what I've heard as a heavy rumor from many places, tomorrow could be the release of the Black Ops Public Beta. It seems logical, as it gives roughly two and a bit months of Beta before it's closed so Treyarch can finish the game off for the November release, but then again maybe not. All I can say is, fingers crossed, because tomorrow we could be going deep and going hard men![[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Tommorrow? Now I seriously doubt that. I don't think they can just drop a public beta on us like that without an official announcement. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:27, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

:::It's happened before, and if not released tomorrow, maybe they announce it tomorrow then release for Monday. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

well they havent confirmed nor denied the beta but some hackers found the codes a few months ago, they also found the halo reach beta codes months before it was announced. but i think they would give some indication on wether or not they are, also there was this guy selling codes on ebay a few days ago, definatly fake, and they have been pulled [[user:smish34|smish34]]

While i'm not fully aware of the differences between the ACR and the Masada, but the most notable is the location of the charging handle. The Masada has it over the ejection port while the ACR has it over the forend. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:16, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Correct me if i'm wrong, but I heard on youtube I heard that it was originaly call the magpul masada, but they changed the name because they didn't want the name masada on there gun so they changed it to the name acr. Liek I said if I'm way of correct me.

==Anyone Take Notice?==

During one of the gameplay videos, did anyone take notice to the AK-47 icon (where it said "Hold X For AK-47)? It looks a bit colored instead of grey (meaning i noticed some orange in it as well) [[SeanWolf]]

Those Icons are only grey, no color. It had to be behind it giving it the appearance of orange.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:27, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Well...i was looking at this image and it LOOKS colored (the stock)[[User:SeanWolf]]:

[[Image:CODBO-AK47blip.jpg]]

: That looks coloured to me too. Hmm, that's interesting. And it's not like it's all one color, like something could be behind it giving it the illusion of colour, the reciever seems to be some kind of a metallic blue while the wooden handguard and stock seem to be orange-ish. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:12, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah it is, Thats what I get for not looking at it. Thought it would have been the same as before. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:17, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

== New Trailer ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_fsM6LBi54

Straight off the bat, there's a FAMAS, Ballistic Knife, and what some people on the CoD wiki have claimed to to be an Arctic Warfare type sniper rifle. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:55, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:...and an exploding RC car. Interesting...--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:12, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
::''Holy hell...they've stopped trying. Depending on how any demo and reviews are, I might just buy it for the single player, but the multiplayer is completely out of the question. They took Modern Warfare 2 - which wasn't the best of bases to start with - and made it worse. Just like Treyarch, I suppose.'' --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 18:14, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

: It looked a lot better than MW2 to me. A lot of the minor details looked the same, like the kill medals at the top of the screen, but other than that not much looked the same. And I do believe that was an Arctic Warfare, but I'll have to look a little closer before I'm sure. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 18:30, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

: Watched it again: Yes, that is an Arctic Warfare. And another thing to note, the FAMAS was missing it's carry handle! Again, Treyarch? Really? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 19:14, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

:There IS a FAMAS without the carrying handle, but it's a DMR and the carrying handle is removed solely to mount a scope on it [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:39, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::kind of like this.--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 19:58, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
[[image:Famascoddmr.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

:The one in the game is EXACTLY like this thing. Even though it's a FAMAS again, it does look kinda cool despite the fact that this gun never existed during the Cold War...this is stupid. They got an AR-15 that shouldn't exist, an Accuracy International Arctic Warfare that shouldn't be in the game, the AUG, which might not exist in the game either, and now a FAMAS that shouldn't exist. They going to pull anything else out of their asses? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:02, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::Unless they've gone down the "we don't care that it's not historically accurate, we're trying to make it fun" route. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 20:27, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Mind you, all of this is from multiplayer. It's multiplayer, there's no story, no setting. Why can't they use anything they want? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:31, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

:::: You do know this places THROUGH OUT the cold war. This is also a MULTIPLAYER trailer, so a number of weapons that appear through out the game can appear. Now, I'm not defending this game, I don't even play CoD anymore. But I'm just saying the fact's about the game. I mean...Yes, if the Accuracy International Arcticle Warfare appeared in single player in a Vietnam mission, then yes, "What the hell..." But this is a multiplayer teaser. (Just to say the Accuracy International Article Warfare started producing in 1982 which the Cold War was still up and running) Please don't rant at me, as I'm just giving the fact's about the game. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 20:34, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::::::Ok, if a gun appears in the MILTIPLAYER, then it most likely will appear in the game. I have yet to see a shooter game that has guns that appear in the multiplayer mode NOT appear in single player. I've seen the reverse, like in MW2, the SVD appears in singleplayer, but not multi. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:36, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

And to ADD to that, yes we know this game takes place THROUGHOUT the cold war, which was official between the end of WWII and 1989 ish. The FAMAS wasn't even in production until 1995. The AUG might be excused but the year the mission took place when it made an appearances is 68 and the weapon wasn't even patented until 77. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:40, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Could someone edit the Famas section?It says that it appeared in multiplayer foor

The creators said that the guns that they have are prototypes so some of them will be used when not in service.
:Well the creators are bullshitters. You're telling me the French created the FAMAS carrying handleLESS prototype almost 20 YEARS before it was put into service? And the G2 rail version even which was made in 2001? I might forgive the AUG somewhat, but there is so much bullshit I can take here. There are so many other weapons Treyarch could use, but they had to try to somehow bullshit the weapons from MW2 into this game instead of being original. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:47, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah I agree that Treyarch could have picked another gun, but if you think about it all the recent call of duty game (Modern Warfare, Modern Warfare 2) not all the guns that are used in the game would be used at that time, but they are little thing like the w1200 wouldn't be used in 2011 and the wa2000 in 2016 so maybe the famas and the ar 15 are the acceptions.

MW2 is a different kind of weapon selection. It takes place in an unspecified "near future" kind of storyline or present day. All the weapons in the game exist in the current timeframe. MW2 isn't a period piece game, COD from 1 to 3 were all WWII games and Modern Wafare is well, as the title goes, "Modern Warfare." Black Ops takes place within the Cold War, a time before 1989, so any guns before than is acceptable. Sure, seeing a gun that won't be out in the open market for another 2-3 years, yeah I can accept that. A lot of prototype weapons are like that, but the FAMAS is in a game that is more than a decade before the concept inception of said weapon. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

It's a bit more than a decade. The game's set in 1967/68, so a good thirty-odd years before it was conceived. The problem is, they could have inserted the real FAMAS prototype, no problem (1971, compared with 1974 for the AUG). [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 23:13, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

I heard that treyarch isn't going past the 1980 mark.

Ok I agree with maybe Treyarch just abused the prototype thing, but they can always take the famas out, they look at the forums.
:I don't think they do [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:24, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

On the new multiplayer video did anyone see the guy roll out the way around the :36 mark? - the marksman.
:Looks like he jumped and slide away from the gunfire. I hope we get to do that. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:55, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

: We can. If everything else from that old Multiplayer rumor is also true, which is a very real possibillity as a lot of it was confirmed or all but confirmed in that trailer, it will be a standard mechanic and won't need any kind of a perk or anything. Also, I've just gone ahead and decided to completly disregard this game realism. It's obviously trying to be some sort of "Modern Warfare back in time" deal, so at this point I'm just hoping it's fun. And that's all that will really matter in the end, right? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:39, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
::No, I can't accept that! Call of Duty originated as a game that takes place in a set time frame and immerses you in it with historical accuracies. Every game except for MW2 has been very accurate, especially when compared to other video games. If they wanted all these modern guns, then why make the time frame set in Vietnam/the Cold War? Why all of a sudden do they only care about making it look cool instead of providing us with realism like they always have? With the FAMAS G2 FELIN and the Accuracy International Rifle, they are officially bullshitting about the fact that these are prototypes in the Vietnam War. There can be no more arguments against that fact. But why do they have to do that to what was once such a legitimate series?
:::Look around on this page, and we go into why they chose the time period they did. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:11, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

: Money. Most consumers don't care or even know that most of these guns weren't around in the game's time period, they don't even really care about the Singleplayer, they just want cool guns in their Multiplayer. Of course I don't agree with this at all. 02:50, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::That still doesn't make sense to me. Call of Duty got its very successful start making realistic games. When it came out Call of Duty 4 was one of the best selling games ever and it's one of the most legitimate modern war games I've ever seen. Based on that you would think that people like seeing an accurate game.
:::First off, a game where you can single-handed kill half the German army is not that realistic. In fact, I personally think it's a bit insulting to the real veterans who only had one life and no continues to play with. Second, MW2 wasn't realistic and it still sold a bajillion copies. Yes, it's about the money. Don't like it? Then don't spend your gaming dollar on it. Our wallets are our votes. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:00, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Obviously being able to kill a million people isn't realistic. Perhaps a better word would be accurate. You can tell in the first 5 Call of Dutys they made a good effort to get their shit right. Now they don't even try. I don't understand why they stopped trying with MW2 and now why Treyarch is following suit. I wouldn't buy any of these games but there's no more realistic or accurate games coming out anymore and I can only play the old Rainbow Six and Ghost Recon games so much before I get tired of them.

I'd like to make a small correction, the FAMAS was designed from 1967-1971 and the first generation FAMAS's entered service in 1978. Dose this mean you'd see a G2 in the Vietnam war, no but a prototype without a carry handle could hypothetically have exited in the time of the game.

=== I think this is actual FAMAS Prototype ===

Isn it ? Whatever. It will be awesome if actual prototypes of guns will get in.
[[image:FAMAS_PROTOTYPE.JPG|thumb|none|400px]]

If it is than they won't put it in, doesn't look as cool you know, thats what counts.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:34, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Pepole please acquant yourself with the FAMAS's history here. Thank you. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FAMAS]

== The COD wiki ==

I just looked over at the COD wiki and it is a nightmare over there on their format and what little info they put on their pages and disregard the "gun nerds" on any contributions. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:46, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

That's because there's a policy against adding IRL info to the weapon articles. Although I've just been having an argument with someone who was convinced the FAMAS here was an F1. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:52, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Have they ever seen the F1 FAMAS, it has the carrying handle. Only the FAMAS G2 had the option of getting no carrying handle. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:53, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

His initial argument was that it couldn't be a G2 because it had a small trigger guard and was using the proprietary magazine, rather than the large hand-guard and a STANAG magazine (despite the G2 being able to fit+feed both). [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:57, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:Then this FAMAS don't exist either in the real world like the Ar-15. The developers are also looking at "Black Ops" history wrong. The concept of today's special forces were really different back then during the Cold War. It's not the same kind of people or style as it hasn't been refined like today Spec Ops. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:12, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm over at Cod wiki right now.

==Those are definitely explosive tips==

The attachment on this picture:
http://www.imfdb.org/images/7/77/Codblackopsunkownattachment.jpg
is definitely explosive tip for crossbow.
just watch the trailer and stop at 0:30 and look in the killfeed.
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/804/callofdutyblackopsmulti.png

==A nice detail==
Look at 0:09 in the new trailer, there is clan tag written on the AR-15 charging handle.

Yeah, I noticed that. I like that little touch. But I hope it doesn't just copy his clan tag from next to his name and paste it on the charging handle, I hope I can have something written on my gun without having to have a clan tag. I don't particularly like clan tags, mostly because I hate clans. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:55, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

==Ballistic knife==
would the Ballistic knife be listed as a firearm or not?

Maybe it does shoot a projectile even thought it is not a firearm.

No because its not a firearm.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:43, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

To be fair though, the crossbow isn't a fire arm, but it is a ballistic weapon. And isn't the Punisher's compound bow up even though THAT isn't a firearm? Just put up the ballistic knife.--[[User:True Night]]

I have a better idea: Since they aren't firearms, let's remove the crossbow from this page and the compound bow from the ''Punisher'' page. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:44, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

just for that tom jane is going to kill you with a bow and arrow. good job . and the balistic knive uses high tention (missspeled) springs, so id call it a projectial if anything. not to mension that , if you look at the rock on this site , it has the little dart shot gun that nick cage uses in the begining. simmons 8492

== Snub Nose ==

I went over to cod wiki and there is a page about a snub nose attachment for the colt python
Confirm?

I swear I saw snub nose in the new Multi-player trailer. Maybe faster draw?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Went back to the video and I saw it, the guy is switching to it. http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/319/snubnose.png[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:20, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Hmm...Snubnosed=less accuracy+shorter range= more XP per kill? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:51, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Probably the same logic that it somehow gets more damage with a shorter barrel like the double barrel shotgun in WaW. I'm leaning more towards a faster draw.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:36, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Apparently, it leads to more accuracy and less damage. Hmm [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 02:15, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Anachronisms ==

Can we please not say that the guns are anachroistic on the actual page? Because Me, along with alot of other people, agree that we really don't care about anachrosisms so please can we just limit comment about anarchistic guns to th talk page please? Thank you. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 20:54, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

:Then what's the point of a discussion page if we can't DISCUSS about shit? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:34, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Also, since this ISN'T the Call of Duty Wiki, where it is full of people who can't accept REAL facts, I am undoing all the erasing of pointing out that the guns are anachronistic. Cause that's how I roll [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:45, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
:I'm one of those people who don't think it'll affect the quality of the game, but I do believe it should be pointed out. I also believe we'll be able to make a better judgement call on whether or not these are truly anachronistic or just victims of an alternative timeline once the game actually comes out. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:59, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

:Drjuki, the whole point of this whole site is the guns and this page is to discuss the ones in the game. And like Excalibur said, this isn't the Call of Duty Wiki where factual real world information about said guns is against the rules. So, yes, we ''are'' going to point out anachronisms. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:13, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

:: Although I do think it should be noted on the page when a certain firearm is anachronistic, I also think it should be simply noted, not ridiculed. Not sure if there really is any on this page, actually haven't looked at it in a while, but it's been a problem on other pages, with commments such as "Aparently they did no research" and such. Our job here is to jot down the facts, not intermingle them with our own thoughts. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:04, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Well that's just it, we don't have the facts. We have images, and no context. Why not just wait until the game actually comes out? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:11, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
The context of the trailers and images is that the game takes place during the Cold War period and we have a gun like that AR-15 carbine. No forward assist or brass deflector and the weird magazine. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:24, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:The context of a three minute trailer, or multiple three minute trailers that tell us nothing? I'm fairly certain I've seen all the trailers, and yet I can't tell you what the overall goal of the campaign is. What are we fighting for? To prevent nuclear war? Assassinate rogue agents? Who's the villain? Is there one? It can all be a dream, or a fevered hallucination for all we know. And it wouldn't surprise me at all if the plot was paper thin. It's MP that sells the game. The only reason why there's a campaign at all is because they can't sell the game for full price if it's only MP. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:03, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::We can ridicule anachronisms if we want, it's a discussion page where we can say what we want. And yeah they didn't do their research or worse straight up ignored the fact these guns didn't exist back then. I think more of us would agree that Treyarch failed on the firearms.
::: Seriously. Only firearms ?
I wasn't talking about the discussion page, I was talking about the main page. Say whatever you want here. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 15:24, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:No one was really talking in the main page. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:25, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

::Well good, let's keep it that way. It's been a problem on other pages, with ''much'' less incorrect details than this game, so I was just trying to keep it clean here. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 15:35, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

--[[User:Jackie.45Cal|Jackie.45Cal]] 12:18, 12 August 2010 (UTC)Im sorry but if you are going to put a gun that wasn't even in development until 2001 in a game set pre 1989 then you may asweel put an ipod in too. It's just silly, those guns were made with materials and machinery that didn't even exsist. I'm personally hoping that there is a surprise mission that takes place in a more modern setting.--[[User:Jackie.45Cal|Jackie.45Cal]] 12:18, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

== Watch the ending of the Campaign reveal that.... ==

The SOG soldiers are back in time to prevent a nuclear war, and they brought all their guns and equipment from the future with them. That would just make my day, would be so awful it's hilarious. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:26, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:Honestly, I'll cry if that happens. In the metaphorical sense, of course. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 22:46, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

== Dragunov? ==

In the new Prestige Trailer [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4HreDGcQus]], people have speculated that the rifle the sniper is carrying at the end is a Dragonuv. Anyone concur?

watch ust before he blows up, the stock and the positioning are from the draganuv --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:02, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Its a dragonuv. Also I noticed the Dragonuv style scope in the very begining. Do we finally get different redicles for the different rifles?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:17, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

I think the action diver had one, too

== R/C car ==

For Modern warfare 2 it was the nvgs and now we have a R/C car with a camera and a microphone. what are your thoughts on this?

Dumb crap makes my wallet giggle... --[[Special:Contributions/99.65.211.227|99.65.211.227]] 09:51, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Retarded gimmick is retarded.

== Some prototypes photos ==

So... When Treyarch decides to put prototype guns, why not choose actual prototypes ?

For exmaple '''prototype Famas'''.[http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Talk:Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops#I_think_this_is_actual_FAMAS_Prototype]

Post more prototype photos. I wish to see ''AUG, SPAS'' or ''AWM'' prototype.

And i have one question - May be Stg. RH-70 some kind of AUG Prototype ?
[[image:2757881.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

I just looked it up, its not a AUG Prototype, its a gun that was meant to be a 5.56 x 45 rifle to replace the G3 as the service arm but its not a AUG prototype.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:02, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

The way things are nowadays if it doesn't look cool its not gonna be in the game. Wouldn't surprise me if the G11 is covered by rails.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:42, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:Probably. It also bothers me that in WaW and CoD4 they actually tested and recorded most of the weapons. We all know there is no way they got their hands on a G11 to test it or record sounds from it.

Probably gonna take sounds from another gun. IMO though that gun is UGLY! --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:03, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:Who would know what a G11 sounds like? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:22, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

There is a youtube video which i'll post here for you guys of it, probably already infested with CoD nerds posting dumbass things and arguing about MW2.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:45, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6JWCEmCgD8--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Huh, so that's what caseless ammo looks like. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:11, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

The SPAS 12 prototype: (note the shorter barrel and different folding stock): [http://spas12.com/spas/franchimod12a.jpg]
The AUG prototype (with many differences from the final product): [http://world.guns.ru/assault/aug_pr1.gif]----[[User:Markit|Markit]] 03:13, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Looks just like the shorter model, combat model I think. I forgot.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:56, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Never mind that gun is pretty much the AUG prototype. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:04, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

If the AUG in the game looks like the prototype, I can ignore it, but it looks like the modern variant [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:14, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Looks like it's made by Heckler and Koch judging by the stock.But that's just me.It could be and AUG prototype but who knows?---Matchgradeweapon

==RPG-7==
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100812011017/callofduty/images/9/93/RPG7BO.png

Can someone put that pic on the page in "RPG-7" section? I got this image from here: http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/RPG-7

==Time period and Guns==

There is a lot of stuff on this page so I don't know if this has been said or not, but this game takes place in different time periods so that's probably why there is such an array of anachronistic weapons. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Finally someone said it. The developers said the game takes place in the '''COLD WAR''' not just Vietnam. Everyone keeps complaining about this gun and that gun being anachronistic to 1968 but it looks like a decent amount of this game will take place after that time. I've heard talk as late as the 80's so wouldn't that then make the AUG, SPAS, and FAMAS technically time period correct? --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 17:35, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

:That point has been made before, and it becomes moot when a SPAS-12 (developed in the mid 1970s) turns up in the middle of the Tet Offensive in 1968, or likewise when an unchanged AUG A1 rifle appears in the late 1960s when it wasn't even patented until 1974. The "but black ops are so awesome they get secret prototype weapons!" argument would have made more sense if the weapons in question actually existed in the years that specific levels take place in. What the developers are doing is tantamount to giving you an AK-47 in 1943 and telling you that its presence is historically accurate because it was designed in the same era. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 19:27, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

: Even if the game would take place in 1989 ( ''And i guess it wont'' ) FAMAS FELIN will be still anachronistic.

== The Best Thing About Black Ops..... ==

.. '''None of that goddamned overpowered burst-fire weapons!!!!!!'''
Now, before you all fly off the handle at me. I just want to say a few things. 1- I am not a member of this site, but I visit it every time I want to identfy a gun used in a movie. 2- I do have real-life gun knowledge, unlike the fools who play Call of Duty and suddenly assume they're gun experts.
I do realize that many people find 3-round bursts useful in real-life. I see it as unecessary and useless. I'm also going to add that I am a Call of Duty player and I know for a fact that they intentionally make the burst-fire weapons overpowered, which is why I am so glad that it won't be featured in Black Ops.
:While I can agree with you that the kids who think that playing CoD automatically qualifies them as firearm experts are annoying (I've actually had a kid try to tell me that the AUG, the normal one, is a machine gun and not an assault rifle), and while I can also agree that I don't prefer burst fire weapons to automatic ones in real life, I have to disagree on your main point. The three shot burst weapons in Modern Warfare 2 are not overpowered. How many shots, without stopping power, does it take to kill with the M16A4 or the Famas? One burst, or three bullets, though on extremely rare occasions, it takes four bullets. How many shots does it take, again without stopping power, to kill with a SCAR-H, or a TAR-21? Again, three. So no, the burst weapons aren't over powered. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 20:49, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

: That doesn't neccessarily mean it's balanced. It also has a ''much'' higher rate of fire, even ''less'' recoil, if that's even possible, and a farther range, if I remember correctly. Now the M16A4 in MW2 was pretty balanced, but really only because it had a bit of spread with it's shots. The FAMAS, however, was the most unbalanced piece of work in gaming history. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 00:42, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::Which is really strange to me, since I was much better with the M16 then I was with the FAMAS. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 08:02, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Actually they may have the M16 be some sort of burst fire prototype, after all they got the cool stuff before it exsisted and produced so they just might.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:58, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Well in Metal Gear Solid 3, they got away with having an XM16E1 with a 4 selector capability [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:17, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

first , i had a kid tell me that the moddel 1887 is a rifel , based only on the fact that it has a lever and not a pump. i own no guns and also only pop on this site to win bets with my brother but i know that. but dose any one know if the m16 or famas have selector switches that can be changed?

Yes they do. The FAMAS can shoot on semi auto, and the M16a4 also has semi auto.[[user:Greywolverene|Greywolverene]]

== New pics ==

IGN has some new BO pics:

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054555152.html?page=mediaFull]

Theeeere's that forward grip on the AUG.

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054602839.html?page=mediaFull]

Okay, the AK mag IS a little off. And the holster looks like the holster for a Walther P38/P1. Any ideas on that shotgun (?) on his back? Or is it an M79?
:AK has a proper 545 plastic clip with little ribs on the side. But I would more like to see AKS74 in game...
::Magazine is the proper term.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:55, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
Shotgun is probably china lake laucher.
: Yes, it is. '''Russians with China Lake GL'''? Yeah, thats even more stupid, anachronistic and epic failing than Russians with SPAS.
::dude...thats the KS-23 shotgun. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
::What makes you think he's Russian? And even if he is, it could be multiplayer for all we know. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:36, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::: He has SP´s russian model. And i think its SP mission - Because all other "new" screens are from SP :)
[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054551731.html?page=mediaFull]
::::What about the Russians running around with FALs in MW2? or TAR 21s?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:00, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::::: Yeah. It was really stupid too...
Inception had the MW2 dream, so you know people are going to call this the "Inception level."

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-treyarch-project/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054558715.html]

A) This doesn't really look like a new picture, and B) it looks like he's using 20 round mags, but with 30 round ammo pouches. (Epic fail. WTF?! I'm going to cancel my preorder this instant!)

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:32, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

== I think they did it again... ==
With the fictional flattop ARs, I mean. A screenshot of Frank Woods on the Call of Duty Wiki looks like the M16 he's holding has a flattop just like the AR Carbine. Take a look for yourself [http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100730204211/callofduty/images/6/6b/M16A1.jpg]. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:53, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

It does look like the carry handle is missing. Wouldn't surprise me if this M16 is also burst fire.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:27, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
: You are wrong. It will have burst fire ( well, you are right in that ) but it will have RIS Rails all over the place. NV Scope and lasers.... sure.

I can believe it if it has the early night optics that are as large as a professional camera. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:41, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

:Eww.. Its Treyarch. Those optics will be even smaller than they are in our days.
::Oh right, they'd just take something that DID exist and turn it into something stupid for its time and say black ops can do it [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:27, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

==Galil and KS-23 confirmed at Gamescom 2010==
http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Galil & http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/KS-23 [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
: + Makarov. But get some proper screenshots first. Those from cod wiki are terrible quality.
::Couldn`t find anything better. Well see more in the upcoming days. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::I'm impressed. I don't think I've ever seen either in a game before. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:14, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
::::KS-23 maybe, but the Galil was Counter Strike. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKtnJkjxhog Crap quality! I know, but that was the only way he could smuggle the footage. Makarov pistol around 9:50, KS-23 near end. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

:Makarov! :D, Then again we are gonna get a crapload of new Makarov "experts"--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 15:12, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
::I counter them with my Hi-Power! [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::No! Then there will be Hi Power "experts"! Not my favorite handgun!--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:38, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

I wonder if they classify KS-23 as shotgun or rifle/ carbine.
:Given the capacity (four rounds) and the fact a lot of the available rounds appear to be grenades, maybe a grenade launcher, a Russian equivalent to the China Lake launcher. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:48, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
::The guys at Treyarch must have heard your rants about "Spetsnaz didn`t use the SPAS" and the put the KS in. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:KS is yet another anachronism.
:: I think at this point that's a given. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:58, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
:OMG GUYS STOP IT! If you point out any more of them we`ll be walking into a soviet base with nothing more then knives and pointy sticks, forced to do roundhouse kicks every 10 seconds to conserve ammo! Treyarch means serious biznis! [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

"Black Ops is said to be set in various locations, including Vietnam and Cuba, [3] and judging from weaponry and dates given in the trailer, it is set between 1960 and 2010."
I must paste it once again...[(BTW in CoD4 we had that Pripyat mission in 1995, so I guess Treyarch made another "American/English commandos in Russia after Cold War" mission)(Sorry for my crappy English)]
: It seems like you are trying to protect Treyarch´s weapons choice, right ? But dont forget that both already seen missions took place in 1968. And they had SPAS-12 and AUG......

I find it hard to believe when they say that this game will take place during the Cold War and now you say there will be a mission taking place in present day? How did you come across that information? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:47, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Info is from CoD wikia, but yeah, I forgot that in leaked video those guys had "CCCP" written on their backs, so the mission takes place before 1990s. Sorry for mistake.
: And what is even better. It has been confirmed that WMD mission takes place in 1968.

== AI Arctic Warfare ==

Man, That sucks! IW now decides to put in the awesome AI Arctic Warfare and now it doesn't even fit because it's very anachronistic in this game (as is the Walther WA 2000 and other weapons). Why was it not in the MW series? It would of fit perfectly in the first MW, it would of made more sense in the mission All Ghilled Up than the M14s because )1 it's British )2 it was available at that time (1995 right?). And it would have been far better than stupid Remington 700 in MP, I mean come on, the Remington 700 IS the M40A3! They just decided to make the scope wobble more and gave it the same damage as the .50 cal Barrett M82A1 WTH! MW2's main menu art even has a sniper with AI AW (and also a soldier with a SCAR-L) but it's not even in the game. Well, at least they put the CheyTac M200 Intervention in the game.

You seem to have overlooked the fact that this isn't an Infinity Ward game, it's being developed by Treyarch, who have no affiliation with IW. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:30, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well, they do share the same parent company, Activision. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:39, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
:Even so, I doubt Treyarch would have any say in what weapon IW would put into their game, or vice versa. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:48, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
::OK, Then I meant Treyarch/IW. By the way, did Treyarch make both MW games? I'm just making sure.
:::Treyarch had nothing to do with Modern Warfare, IW made both. Treyarch did COD5. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 10:23, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Alright thanks for clearing that up. I'm just saying it would have made more sense if IW had the AW in the MW games. As I said, it would have fit well both sense wise and realism wise.
::: "The Accuracy International Arctic Warfare rifle is a family of bolt-action sniper rifles designed and manufactured by the British company Accuracy International. It has proved popular as a civilian, police and military rifle since its introduction in the '''1980s'''." If you want the real date, it's actually 1982 when the L96A1 came into British Military service. Oh, and the Walther WA 2000 was desgined in the 1970s - 1980s and first produced in the same year as the L96A1 came into service, 1982. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 08:35, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Thank you. Didn't the mission All Ghilled Up take place in 1995? That's why I think the AW/L96 would have fit better in MW because your playing as British snipers, Price and the other guy (sorry, can't remember his name). As for the WA2000, what the hell is it doing in MW2?! it's not a Military rifle! (guess it's in there cus they thought in looked cool *sigh*). And in BlackOps, both the AW and WA2000 are highly anachronistic.

:Seriously, why can't Treyarch pick weapons that have NOT been in the previous game? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 13:35, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::I think they're trying to compromise, including familiar favorites like the SPAS and the FAMAS and putting in more obscure (at least by gaming standards) weapons like the Galil and the KS-23. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:31, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Who the hell is using the Israelite Galil in the this game?! I hope not the Russians.
::::They just needed to have a jew gun in the game instead of TAR.
:::::Oh course, it's that vast international Jewish video game weapon conspiracy. How could we forget? (Jew gun? What are you, a hillbilly?) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:13, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::Don't forget that most of those "Jew guns" could rip you apart, or are you forgetting the Uzi family, Desert Eagle, Jericho, and Tavors? Not to mention what they can do in the hands of Mossad. Don't make the mistake of underestimating Israel, it'll likely be the last mistake you ever make.:D -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:21, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::I don't see nothing good about those "kosher" weapons. All of them are inferior compared to western (and even russian) designs.
:::::::Great the WA2000 again, That thing is ugly, rare, and definatly not a combat rifle. IW was playing too many hitman games when they thought of that. Treyarch copying it is just really stupid.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:24, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::You gotta admit, Israels got some great weapons; this coming from a guy who loves German and Russian weapons, and also good ol' Browning's designs. :D Oh, and the big reason the WA2000 is not used in the Military is the same reason the awesome HK PSG1 is not used: it's too heavy and delicate for Military use.
:::::::::The WA2000 is a expensive and rare gun. I believe that 200 something of them were made. There are many better guns in all aspects than the WA2000. Its not just that its too delicate, its expensive, bulky, and rare. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::::::::Name a few?
Somebody needs to stop learning everything they know from movies and games. Open your eyes, or maybe you should just go back to your Klan rally. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:24, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
:My facts about guns are only based on REAL LIFE information, never games or movies. (by the guy who started the AW discussion)

::Should make an account and sign your posts, easier that way.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:39, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

You should also get me some "real life" statistics that PROVE beyond a doubt that Israeli designs are "inferior." -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 14:22, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:Are you a hater like that guy who hates the Beretta 92? Oh and thanks FIVETWOSEVEN, I will consider making a account. :)
::Not at all, I happen to love the Beretta 92, I think it's one of the best handguns ever made. I just don't like when people make biased statements like that without giving a reason to back it up. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:44, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
:::I was talking about a guy on the Beretta 92 discussion page that hates the 92 for no real reason. and what IS wrong with the Uzi, Jericho, and the Tavor? What "facts" do you have that make these weapons "inferior"? Do you hate Israel or something? (note, I am not trying to rude, a jerk, or a wise-ass) The Uzi is more or less the SMG equivalent of the AK, it is simple, reliable, and cheap like the AK, the Jericho is, from what I heard, is a very good all-steel handgun, and the Tavor is a great step forward for Israel's assault weapon technologies. If I'm wrong, please tell me and prove it with real facts.
::::Correct me if I'm wrong, but you may have misread something, cuz it seems like that post was directed at me. I agree 100% with every point you just made there. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 18:07, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::I honestly think you two have gotten confused and started arguing with each other when you both support the same position. This is why it would be much easier if everyone had an account. As to my opinion on the topic, I love Israeli made weapons. You're right about the Uzi family. It's extremely rugged, though not terribly accurate (But you can always do worse). As to the Tavor and the Jericho? I've only fired the Jericho once, but it handled great, though I still prefer the 92FS to it. And the Tavor, I love the Tavor. Honestly, if I was going into combat and I was given the choice, I'd take the TAR-21 over an M4A1 any day. I mean, the M4A1 is a great gun, but I just have a thing for bullpups. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:43, 30 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::I'm really sorry about that, my mistake, I thought you were the same guy who said "I don't see nothing good about those "kosher" weapons. All of them are inferior compared to western (and even russian) designs."

Nah, I think he ran away under our combined onslaught. xD Anywho, if it isn't signed as K, it isn't me. :) -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 14:42, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Just pitching in here but isnt the Galil what the israelis made as an improved AK-47 ? I think i heard that on the millitary channel or something (btw the price for the WA2000 these days is minimum 40 000 $ THE 2ND VERSION IS MIN 75 000 $ there was only 176 built (thank you wikipedia)--[[User:Patrickgt|℗Λ✝r][©Κ]] 04:29, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

== SKS ==
:Hopefully there will be an SKS in game because with the part of the game taking place in Vietnam, it would make sense to see it in the hands of the Viet Cong.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 21:17, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::'''It would make sense.''' This is only and biggest reason why they wont put it in.
::As much as I agree with you, I wouldn't get my hopes up. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 22:11, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Even if they include it, would anyone use it? It doesn't do anything better than any other weapon you can get in the game. As much as I like the SKS in real life, I wouldn't use one if I had an AK or an AR-15 available. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:16, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
Oh you silly people, even if they included an SKS they'd bastardize it with enough railmounts to drive a train on, and then make it have an attachable grenade launcher/katana/lasersight/ammo dispenser. :) -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:34, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well. It would be RAIL with SKS attached.
: I never really had my hopes up.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 22:06, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::If they have the correct grenade launcher on it, probably will work just like it did in WaW. Firing a round through the grenade.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:58, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:Actually, only the yugoslavian version of the SKS had the grenade launcher. Not the Russian or Chinese version that would appear in game if it is put in.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 01:56, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Oh I was wrong then, never have payed too much attention to the SKS, also doesn't help that the most common seems to be a Yugo.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:41, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
: Its Romanian WASR there. So why not yugoslavian SKS ? Oh, and i think they will put it there with M203 or GP-25 on it.
::Tats not WASR but just a retarded AK-74
::: Well, i think they just googled "AK" and modelled first gun they have seen.
::::Or some crappy airsoft gun. I can't wait till a game is made where EVERY ASPECT of firearms is 100% CORRECT and not tacticool.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:05, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::Blame the internet then, not the 3d artists or the company. It's hard enough to find a high enough resolution orthographic picture of the gun you want to model. Sometimes you have to make do with a similar model. 3d artists just can't model a gun out of thin air, you need references to use as a backdrop during modeling, and let's face it, the artist is going to use the high res sideview of an AK-74 over a low res slightly off sideview of a genuine AK-47. As for airsoft, take note that airsoft companies often provide a perfectly aligned sideview of their guns, which works great for modeling. I'd take a 1000x700 picture of an airsoft M4 over a 400x300 picture of the genuine gun. And if you were a 3d modeler, you would too.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 02:30, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
::omgz they could check this site. Or... photograph a real deal when they were recording gun sounds. And if they for some f-ing reason left off muzzle break from AK74 that would be a fail
:::Or maybe get a real gun, don't even have to guy one, just rent or borrow one from someone that owns one. That isn't so hard is it? They did that with Lord of War with about 3,000 CZ rifles.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 14:09, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Lord of War was a feature film, starring Nicholas Cage. I'm sure they had a lot more money than the average game does. Why pay extra money on something that isn't integral to the quality or enjoyment of a game? Besides, airsoft guns are relatively cheap, and a number of companies sell full metal near exact(and exact in some cases) copies of the real weapons. But ultimately, if you can't look beyond an Mp5's lack of a paddle release, you are playing games for all the wrong reasons. And really, no muzzle brake is fail? Seriously, learn to live with it. Also, most of the pictures on this site are too small for modeling accurately off of. Some are large enough, but most aren't. And not all games record real guns in person for their sounds, and some that do simply use similar models or completely different guns.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 21:00, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::You do realize that this game is gonna rake in millions. They can't rent or buy a $400 AK 47?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:08, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::This is not exclusive to this game. You said you wanted to see ''any'' game that got everything right. Also, Treyarch is based in Santa Monica, ''California''. If you knew anything about Californian gun laws, you would realize how difficult it would be for them to get their hands on a genuine Ak47. Besides, the 3d artists don't really get to decide how all the company's money is spent. And I doubt a higher up would care enough(for somewhat good reason) to waste a thousand bucks on a post-ban Kalashnikov that is not the correct model anyway.

:::::::Once again, they could either rent or borrow one. Doesn't even have to be an actual Russian AK 47. It would be fine if it was a Yugo, Bulgarian or whatever, they are similar enough to not be a problem. The point is going alittle further and not basing the model off a crappy airsoft gun or the wrong picture.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:10, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

:The always present problem with game designers is that they forget the extreme details on a gun and when they do CGI modeling, they always make mistakes and forget somethings. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:26, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
::I think you missed a word.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:11, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
== AS VAL ==
: I think it would be cool if they put the AS VAL in as a weapon of the Soviet Forces
::No.

== AKS-74U? ==

Where in Sam Hill did you guys get that from? I never saw anyone holding one in the Teaser. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:23, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

It's on that wall of guns in the insight video, and theres apparently a pic at Call of Duty Wiki with someone holding it from the teaser. If you ask me, its still not 100% confirming it --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 02:19, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

This is the image they're saying is an AKS-74U [http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:AK-74uBO.png]. Not very convincing, if you ask me, but I wouldn't put it past Treyarch as they've already failed epically by the looks of things so far. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:27, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Definatly is a short AK something.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:05, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
:Yeah, it looks like a short AK, but we can't be sure exactly what it is. Hell, it could be a full length AK at a weird camera angle. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:47, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

There are so many AK variants out there they can pull out of their asses, why another AK-74U? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:15, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Because I doubt they know any others and they don't want to confuse players.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:53, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

== New details released ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kg_8mPoloBo

This confirms a whole bunch of stuff, too much for me to list. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 02:10 2 September 2010 (UTC)

: Almighty, there's a mini-gun....a ''handheld'' minigun...
::Wow! I'm so pumped for spaying batches of n000bs with that thing WOW

:: Who cares?! An Ithica! And an L96! I'm in love. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 02:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:::I just watched the video...HOLY CRAP...A MINIGUN?!...Im in heaven! [[User:SeanWolf]]
:: [[Predator#GE_M134_Minigun_Handheld|"Payback Time!"]] [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 03:22, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:::New weapons we see are the WA2000, Makarov, Ithica, RPK (first in first person), MP5K (first person), Skorpion, HK21 (Awesome!), M14 (wood!), M134 (nicknamed Death Machine), M16 (first person, burst), AKS-74u, and also that new blue-tinted scope, maybe a new version of thermal? [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:09, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

You can THROW A TOMAHAWK?! That's awesome! Now if only you can melee with it... --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:16, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

== Over and Under shotgun, HK21 plus even moar footage ==
As seen in this video: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/team-deathmatch-call-of/703936

There's also more new MP footage up on Game Trailers and floating around YouTube. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:If you didn't notice, the handgun at the beginning was an ASP. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 07:08, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:This killicon, taken from this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToRG_z3ib-o looks like a full sized Uzi: http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/1143/uzi.png -The Unsigned

== Create A Class Video ==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAM5AZxmT_M

WAY too much to write, just take a look, and at his other BO vids while youre there. Also, awesome pistol selection :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 07:03, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:While looking at the Create-a-class 2.0 vid shown here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCzSImy-xm4, I found it rather odd for the choice that Treyarch was going with on the weapon selection for the pistols at the 0:23 mark. Wouldn't it make more sense to place the Makarov PM as the starting pistol because of it's weak 9x18mm cartridge? I'd personally would have liked to see it like this:

*Makarov PM
*ASP
*1911
*Colt Python
*CZ75

[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 10:52, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

== Full Weapon List ==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jatp6Fgs-ak
The video's not too interesting, most of this is stuff from other videos, the cool part is in the description. Note that he wrote MAC-11 instead of CZ-75.

SMG: MP5K, Skorpion, MAC-11, AKS-74u, Uzi, PM63, MPL, Spectre

Assault: Enfield, M14, FAMAS, Galil, AUG, FAL, AK-47, Commando, M16, CLASSIFIED (There's actually no M1 Garand)

Shotguns: Olympia, Ithica 37, SPAS-12

LMG: HK21, RPK, M60

Sniper Rifles: Dragunov, WA2000, L96A1

Pistols: ASP, M1911, Makarov, Python, CZ-75

Launchers: M72, RPG-7, Strela, China Lake

M202 & M134 are apparently Kill Streaks and personally I think the Classified AR is the G11

:ASP seems like an odd choice to put in a CoD game. Relative to the game, it seems like they went out of their way to put in a pistol that isn't that much different in function to a Makarov. (A small pistol with a small magazine.) Why not just a Walther P1? Or a SW M39? Looking down the sights of the guttersnipe will be interesting though. And I again applaud Treyarch for bringing in guns that have been otherwise neglected in gaming. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:58, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I don't know if these are all the weapons or if there are less in this public version, though since it is a full reveal and they make sense how they are, it's reasonable to assume these are all of them. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

EDIT: The KS-23 isn't on the list for some reason, meaning this build may not have all the weapons, or the person who made the list simply missed it as it is the only known weapon not there. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 09:55, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Someone found a screencap of the ingame M60. http://a.imageshack.us/img834/7093/m60j.jpg

::I don't think the M202 or the M134 are Killstreaks as if you look at the "Create a class" video above around the 0:36 mark it lists all the Killstreaks. As far I've seen in the trailers, the M134 is rather ironically called "Death Machine", so it might just be a high level machine gun class weapon that the user has to buy. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 13:28, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

: I think the M202 and M134 might only be in the "Wager" game modes, were everyone has a chance to earn one.

== Seriously.... ==

This is going to be worst CoD game. Minigun ? Flamethrower attachment ? Jesus . Even most stupid game from most stupid studio with most stupid gameplay will be better than this shit.

: If you say so.

Whatever you say, man, and what's wrong with a flamethrower attachment? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:48, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Its completely idiotic.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:32, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:I think it sounds fucking AWESOME. No, it won't be realistic. But it's rule of cool, brohan.-protoAuthor 11:00, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, once you get over the fact that this game is inaccurate as hell, it starts to look pretty badass [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 11:38, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Peh, I'm past the point of even expecting this to be a realistic game. I'll enjoy it for what it is, but there's no way in hell that we're getting realism out of this. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:46, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

. reality and videogames are like an amish hacker , never gonna happen . this is going to be FUCKIN EPIC . simmons 8492

== Iron sights ==

Whats with all the guns having that same back sight, i was ok with the CAR 15 and even the FAMAS having it, then i thought that it was pushing it with the AUG. Then i saw that the M60 has those sights too??!!! I hear you can customuzie your sights and i hope to god you can, cause i would be pissed if all the guns had extremely similiar iron sights --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 11:43, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

'''IS WONT BE CUSTOMIZATED !''' Its just cool to have them, you dont understand ? 7-year kids / 99% of BO players ) wont even recognize M16 and M4. SO WHATS THE PROBLEM ? Epect nuclear grenade flamethrower tactical launcher screen in nearliest days.

: ...a little excited there, bro?

From what I've heard, there will be an 'improved iron sights' attachment. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:49, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

it looks like famas had a field day and fucked everything up . the pig dosent deserve that . and for all the idiots out there reading this and thinking"whats the pig, can you use farm animals as weapona" the pig is the name for the m60 , that gun hold a special place in my heart . simmons 8492

It really looks like they just took a lot of stuff from mw2 (like those god damned iron sights) and whats the deal putting Troy industries sight on an AUG? How stupid does that even look, couldnt hit shit in real life cuz there is no spacing between the front and rear post! Come on Treyarch i tough u could do better --[[User:Patrickgt|℗Λ✝r][©Κ]] 02:45, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

== Enfield ==

Has anyone else noticed then in the create a class trailer when he goes in to primary weapons it says enfield ? anyone wanna put that up ?

:I would but it's too little info to draw a conclusion on what EXACTLY "Enfield" is. It could be the SA80 but at the same time it could be something else, it's best to hold off for now until more info shows. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 15:50, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Yeah, it is most probably a SA80 but it can also be the L1A1.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 15:55, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

::When I saw Enfield, I had assumed it would be the EM-2. When was the last time anyone referred to either SA-80 or L1A1 as an "Enfield?" I google in "enfield prototype," and a picture of the EM-2 is the first thing that comes up. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:01, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Ya id say its going to be the EM-2 because on the killfeed for a teamdeathmatch i saw there was a weapon that looked like it

If not the EM-2, it could be one of the Enfield SA80 prototypes (E60-, XL70-...etc) - Enfield did start the SA80 program in the late 60's so it could be possible for them to show up. It might also explain why Treyarch had that airsoft L85 on their wall.

It's an XL64, at least according to the create-a-class picture. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 17:06, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I think - not sure though - in the multiplayer overview video, at 6.41 to 6.49, it is possible to view the Enfield with iron sights in first person - it has the SA80 type rail, a green-ish cheek rest on the left of the reciever and a green-foreguard. I could be mistaken though. If someone could get the screen shots up for closer inspection, it might be easier to tell. [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

You mean like [http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:L85_7.png this?] [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 19:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Bingo! You can see the real SA80/British 'dovetail' 19mm optics mounting rail (under those weird iron sights...)Cheers [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

It's the XL64 for sure, saw it in the video a couple sections down ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 20:53, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Which is the same video I pulled the create-a-class image from in the first place. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:00, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Yeah... not my best moment there, lol. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 04:21, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

== Burst M16? ==

When I saw the recent multiplayer trailer, I coulda sworn that the M16 was firing in 3 round bursts. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:57, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:It was, and while idont mind it being Burstfire, i do mind that they call it the M16 Raffica.--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 17:03, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Well I do cause there's no such thing as a burst firing M16A1. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:In the Black Ops world there is. GET WITH THE TIMES EXCALIBER!!!!1--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:11, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

And why should they call it the "Raffica"? (I know it's Italian for burst, but whatever.) [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 18:17, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

On the extended trailer thing on the xbox dashboard there is a Burst M16 and its called M16 raffica

A burst M16A1 is stupid. Havent these guys seen a Vietnam era movie? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:22, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

I agree it's stupid, but I suppose it will help make up for all of those full-auto A4s that are in every single movie. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 05:41, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

First off, FIVETWOSEVEN, what does "get with the times" have to do with anything? That made no sense. In the Black Ops world, they operate outside of ordinary methods of operations and tactics. They go into extreme conditions and use the best equipments they can get their hands on but as I said before, they don't acquire guns that havent been invented yet and the military mentality of soldiers back then are different than they are now. A soldier during the Cold War would see any new technology pointless instead of an advantage because of the training and mentality, the if it isn't broken, don't fix it. Special Forces were no exception. Sure they were outside the ordinary, but they wouldn't have just say "hey, I want a gun that can do the following thing, can I have one? If it doesn't exist, I'll just get a gun smith, invent the parts and materials and make it exist." That's not how things work in real life. Yes this is a game and I've just given up on trying to convince people otherwise. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

:*WHOOSH* That was the sound of the obivious sarcasm flying over your head.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:31, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:I think he means it's now obvious Treyarch doesn't care, so why fret over it? Short of some weird plot twist that we're currently unaware of (and again, we know absolutely nothing about the plot,) Treyarch simply doesn't seem to care about historic or technical accuracy. They're selling games to kids and stoners, not history buffs and gun dorks. After seeing all the recent videos, I'm resigned to the fact that all we're going to get is a vastly enjoyable game with a lot of replay value. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:53, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Remember, it's still full-auto in Singleplayer, as it should be. It's just 3-shot burst in MP so it doesn't make pot-head COD kids heads explode. Also, where do they call it the M16 "Raffica"? In the Create a Class videos they're listed simply as M16. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:36, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh it's only burst in multiplayer? Good. In multiplayer, anything goes. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:28, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Another video ==

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G94SolEtpnc]

You get the see the M14 stock, the Enfield, and it confirms the G11 (There's a contract called "G11 Cruelty." --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Ah, that would explain that one single classified weapon. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 21:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:Looks like they're leaving a lot of old stuff in - killstreaks, perks, sentry guns, weapons.
::As opposed to a CoD game without weapons? [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:54, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

== A Question about guns ==

Do you think there are any possibilities of Daewoo K1A or K2 appearing in this game?

I think its about time some major game has put in guns made in Asia.

K2 is a really accurate rifle, it could serve as the 'ACR' of this game and K1 can be like MP5K or UMP of this game
:[[Men of Valor]] had a Type 56. Does that count? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:14, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

We've already seen all the guns that are going in game. So quite slim chances there. Also, sign your posts. [[User:The Wierd It|The
Wierd It]] 08:56, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

: I don't think we've quite seen all of them. We've seen all of the Assault Rifles and Handguns, and only some of the LMG's, SMG's, Sniper Rifles, and Shotguns. And that video a few sections up with supposedly all of the weapons in the game in it's description, is most likely incomplete. I seriously doubt there are only 3 sniper rifles. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:41, 4 September 2010 (UTC)
::Didn't people doubt only 4 sniper rifles with MW2?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:30, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

: Perhaps, but they only needed 4 to fill out the basic sniper rifles roles of COD. A bolt-action, a large caliber, a jack-of-all-trades, and a low recoil-low power. But with only 3, and moreso because of the 3 that we've seen, we should expect more, because so far we've only seen the bolt-action and two normal semi-auto sniper rifles that shouldn't be all too different from each other. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 05:33, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

==FAMAS correction==
That's not a G2 FELIN, it's a F1 FELIN prototype. The one in the screenshots is based off the F1 model (note the small triggerguard and straight magazine). The G2 FELIN platform is based off of the FAMAS G2 and is distinguishable by the sheer massive amount of stuff strapped to it.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 18:47, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

All the photos of the G2 FELIN I've seen have the small trigger guard. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:57, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7f/FAMAS_Felin_501556_fh000002.jpg [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:16, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

==Unknown Machine gun or Assault rifle?==
[[Image:Codbp_uklmg.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
Here is a picture seen in new multiplayer tralier.

:It's a HK21. Watch in HD, it says in the bottom right. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:57, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

==Unknown rocket launcher guide missile==
I seen in new multiplayer tralier.

The only thing I've seen that sounds like that is the 'Arch Angel' killstreak weapon, a missile guided by the player via a camera. (Similar to the Predator guided missile from Modern Warfare 2's killstreaks except that 'Arch Angel' appears to be a shoulder-fired system) [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

Thank for information guy.In cod wiki they call "Valkyrie Rockets".
http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Archangel
[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

== Flamethrower ==
I seen few second on enemy hand in new multiplayer tralier.

:It's an underbarrel attachment, too. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:54, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

== Grim Reaper? ==
In the wager match video, after the player gets a kill with the WA2000, you see him switch to something called the grim reaper but you never get to see what it is, any ideas?
:It's what they've dubbed the M202. It's kinda like how they called the M79 the Thumper. As I recall, the M202 is a killstreak reward. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:54, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Yeah aparently this game has several 'super weapons', but I'm not sure of the context of their use. But surely they won't be unlockable for custom classes, the "Death Machine" had a 400-somethin round belt.

::: The Death Machine (M136) and Grim Reaper (M202) are obtained from care packages now. Also, sign your posts. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:32, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

in the same video they show parts froma game called "gun game " the player swaps the M14 for the m136 . im gonna go all jessie ventura up in that bitch . simmons 8492

== Opinions on the game so far ? ==

I know everyone is going to have a different opinion but i personally think this game is gonna be the worst one yet. The weapons,the attachments,the killstreaks look so bad and the game is just gona be filled with little 10 year olds who only quickscope and camp! The next one by sledgehammer games sound better! Anyone else agre? -- GunGunGun
::I haven't seen anything about the sledgehammer installment. Is there anything out there? I just know that officially, what's left of IW is still working on MW3. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:00, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
: Call Of Duty is dead since MW2. Last good one was CoD5 ( ''But it wasnt nothing more than good'' ). So i dont expect things get better after Black Ops. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:59, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
: Considering that there's been no news at all on the Sledgehammer Games one yet, I have no idea how you could know that it will be better. Sounds like you, like some others here, are just angry that the guns and add-ons in the game make no sense for the era rather than whether or not it's fun to play. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 18:31, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
::The guns don't make sense at all, not just because of the era. I mean flamethrower attachments, handheld miniguns, the same rear sight on many guns, 20-round mags holding 30 rounds, semi-auto shotguns impossibly cycling with dragonsbreath ammo. Before MW2 the Call of Duty series was known for its accuracy and attention to how the guns really work, as well as the weapons for the time periods the games take place in. And GunGunGun has a point, it's just going to be the same chaotic multiplayer as MW2, a bunch of stoners and kids making themselves feel better by corner camping, tubing, and quickscoping. Treyarch only seems to have done things to promote those playing techniques, not discourage them like they should. -Mandaloin
::: Cry some more then? It's pretty obvious that you don't like the gameplay style. There are many, MANY gamers out there that would disagree with your tastes, and those are the ones that Treyarch is aiming to please (along with those on the fence over some of MW2s perks/killstreaks which were changed for the better). So what if it's not all realistic, the key point in a video game is if it's any fun to play or not. Last I checked, I couldn't actually survive crashing a Ferrari at 100MPh at Laguna Seca either, but it is sure as hell fun to play a game that allows me to get back up and try again without it being "game over" for me. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Meh, quit complaining, it's a video game. If you want realism go play ARMA or Operation Flashpoint. It does look better than MW2, that I will say. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 21:41, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

I just love how people can criticize a game, when yet, they haven't even played it. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 21:43, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
:I just love how people keep saying that. We don't have to play it to criticize what we've already seen of it. -Mandaloin
:: Yeah, you kinda do. If you have not actually sat down and played this game, you're only assuming it's gonna be bad by just looking at it. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Medal of Honor pwns Call of Duty in every way. ''That's'' my opinion of Black Ops. Anyone who doesn't like it can go cry a river. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:13, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

== PM-63? ==

Where did we see that? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 13:29, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

:[http://blackops.digitalwarfare247.com/weapons/sub-machine-guns/pm63].--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 16:27, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Unknown SMG ==

[[Image:MPLdual.png|thumb|none|450px|]]

: They look like MPL's to me, and those are said to be in this game so I'm betting that's what they are. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 23:33, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
::Those don't look anything like MPLs. It's probably something we haven't seen yet. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 02:35, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
:::Actually, I found this picture under Walther MPL on COD: Wiki, but I thought they looked nothing like MPLs, so I decided to put it as unknown and see if someone else knew what these were. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]]
:They kind of look like Arsenal Shipkas. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

The weapons in this game may be achronistic as hell, but at least they made them interesting, most of the weapons on the page right now are things you don't see much of in games or even movies, especially nowadays, there's even this, a gun we can't seem to identify with a clear first-person shot of both sides of the gun. I've gotten bored of knowing every gun in a game when I first get it, so, regardless of whether this game turns out to be good, which I hope it is, at least the weapon selection is nice and original, especially for a modern mainstream FPS. :D [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:51, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well I just went through the entire world.guns SMG database and the only thing that looks remotely similar to this is the Walther MPL, so if it's not a souped-up version of that than I don't know what it is. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 15:19, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
:::Nothing is in the right place. Either it's something else, or the modelers were told some other gun was an MPL and they didn't know any better. Did anyone else notice the icon on the left in the feed? Maybe it's whatever that's supposed to be. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:42, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Maybe they're just modified Skorpions? [[User:Tanaj|Tanaj]] 15:45, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

i also went through the world.guns database and figured is could be a OTs-02 Kiparis http://world.guns.ru/smg/kiparis2.jpg
:Nice find, I agree. Wow, they must've dug pretty deep. I don't see how it'd be possible for this to be a modeling mistake, as I would think it's much harder to find one of these than an MPL. The above link doesn't work, here it is again. [http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg04-e.htm] --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 11:33, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well whatdaya know, the one I missed. Good find. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:11, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

They are Skorpians in 9x18mm without the stocks. Looks awesome to me.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 00:29, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

: We've already seen what the Skorpions look like, these look alot like that OTs-02 Kiparis --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 00:41, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

== KS-23 ==

The KS-23 isn't 12 gauge, it's 6 gauge or something like that. I know that it's 23mm, which is not 12 gauge, so that should probably be changed. --[[User:ColonelTomb|ColonelTomb]] 00:58, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

According to Wikipedia it's 6.27 gauge by American standards and 4 gauge in Euros. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 08:59, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Ummm how are they going to balance that? I'm assuming that a 6.27 gauge packs a hell of a lot more lead than a 12 gauge so I'd take a guess that it would probably be pretty powerful --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 22:41, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

:I presume the KS-23 is likely to have heavy recoil, small capacity (3 rounds) and a delay between shots. Also can't the KS-23 also function as a Grenade launcher as well firing firing a variety of shells such as Tear Gass, Flash Bang and White Phosphorous? I would marry Treyarch if they finally added Slugs to this baby! [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:13, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Draco i think your my new friend. JK. i always wondered why they never put chokes or slugs as attachments for guns in video games.-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

::They have added slugs to some games. But to name few, Bad Company 2, Fallout: New Vegas and STALKER are one's that come to mind, though I don't think even the majority of game designers (save for a small collection of the minority) that know what a Choke on a shotgun even is. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 15:43, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

English version of Wikipedia erroneously indicates that the KS-23 was created in 1970. This weapon was created in mid-1980's. Rifled barrel has been borrowed from anti-aircraft weapons systems. English version of Wikipedia erroneously indicates that the KS-23 was created in 1970. This weapon was created in mid-1980's. The 23 mm rifled barrel has been borrowed from anti-aircraft weapons systems. At present it is not used Russian police, because it is too heavy and uncomfortable [[User:Slow Rider|Slow Rider]] 11:12, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

== Stoner 63? ==

Hey Guys, I believe I've identified what seems to be a Stoner 63 fitted with some sort of telescopic scope, in this video: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOAAWWjfG_g]
--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 08:14, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Looks like a AR-18 but don't we have the full assault rifle list?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:55, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

: It's not an AR-18, the recievers don't match. It looks more like the 63, although it doesn't appear to have the ventilated barrel housing. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:32, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

After actually looking at a 63, this gun looks like it.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:10, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

[[Image:Stoner63-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Stoner 63 in rifle and LMG configuration.]]
[[Image:COD7Stonerpossible.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Here's a screencap from gameplay footage of the possible Stoner 63. Compared to the stock image I'd say it is.]] . - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Reflex sights==
Just wondering about the reflex sights, were they even developed back during the periods the game is set in? Another thing I was curious about is that the M4 Spectre in the list shows it having a reflex mounted on it. While it is using a side-mount, wouldn't the stock get in the way if you try to fold/unfold it since it folds to the top of the gun?--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 14:41, 12 September 2010 (UTC)
: '''1,''' Yeah, i am almost sure reflex sight existed during cold war. There is even patent on internet, dating it into seventies.
: '''2,''' All SMG´s have apparently stocks removed for some reason. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 15:50, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

==Not exactly on topic==
Alright, I am having a pretty bad day with dealing all the crap my professors are throwing at me and then my roommate says something that is kinda pissing me off so I am gonna rant a little bit. Last night(this early morning actually, around 1), he decided not to do his homework and decided to watch a show about snipers and the amazing feats they pulled off including one about Hatchcock. It was pretty interesting until he ruined it after watching a sniper take out VietCongs using kentucky windage with his scoped (now busted) m14 after his helo was shot down by saying, "So what, I don't see how that is impressive, I can do that all the time in Modern Warfare 2." Now he wants to go buy Black Ops when it comes out because he wants to "pwn some noobs" and all the feature look really realistic just like in MW2. He goes on to say that he wants to become a Ranger because he thinks it is easy enough since he is smart since he was on a debate team, ran for state assembly, etc. and strong because he can do MMA and finishes that with he can drink a lot beer. I give him credit for having the balls to join the Rangers but at the same time, it feels like he is insulting them. Sorry for writing all this but I was having a shitty day and just had to let is all out and I figured it since he was talking of COD, that I would put it here. Alright, rant over, feeling much better now. --[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 15:43, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh boy, is actual real military service gonna shit on his cereal, lets see just how easy pwning noobs is when your actually getting shot at, oh and apparently theres this thing called recoil in reality, suprising i know. Oh and no respawns either. On an actual related note this game is gonna suck, I do love the return of the 1911 to COD i just can forgive the erronious amounts of just horrendous anacronisms, and the flamethrower undermount is so retarded --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 02:10, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Here's a fun idea, hand a CoD fanboy an AR-15 with the bolt locked back, hand them a magazine, and tell them to fire it. See how long it takes them to realize that the weapon isn't magically ready to fire just because you slap in a fresh magazine. You get five points for every ten seconds it takes before they realize what the bolt catch is. You get bonus points if they pull the charging handle.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 06:01, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Brilliant! Oh and pop that elusive saftey on too, just for good measure.--[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 09:52, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd be impressed if they would give the back stock a flat slap after loading a fresh mag and charged the gun like a real badass.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 12:46, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Even better would be actually getting through the first phase of basic to even hold a weapon.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 21:19, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd be even more surprised to find a gamer doing a proper tactical reload, instead of letting a mag drop to the ground and becoming confused as to why it doesn't magically appear back in his pouches.

first of id slap the shit out of your roommate , the second he hit basic hes gonna be crying for mommy shitting him self , and i cant wait for the m1911 to make its return .simmons 8492

==Kinda liking the weapons list==

Well, they are things you never see in other games, although the awp and famas and spas12 can go, and id love the a1 to be full auto. But, a revovler that makes sense, old school submachine guns, a pump action grenade launcher its kind of cool.

I do wish they didn't decided the nearly the same weapons from the other MW series like the AUG, SPAS-12, or the MP5K. They could have picked other pump action shotguns like the Remington 870, or another weapon aside from the MP5K. They should have stuck with the full size MP5. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:44, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
:Well, they do have the Ithaca 37. And at least the AUG is a rifle and not a LMG in this one. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:18, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I do know most of these guns really shouldn't exist but you can believe I will have a ton of fun with the under-barrel flamethrower with a smily face reflex sight on the G11(they better not mess up the G11).--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 21:15, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

At this moment, I am not bothered about weapons that don't exist at the time, but more on original choices. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:17, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

:Kinda of agree with you there, sorta disappointed though that they made the M16A1 burst fire in Multiplayer. Though it's hard to say exactly when all these guns appear, while yes we were told it was starting in Vietnam but IT could possibly star in other timezones too. From what I've gathered, you play as multiple characters so it's possible you could play as multiple characters in different time periods, 1 in Vietnam, another in Cold War and maybe a few fictional war zones in the early 2000's [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 08:10, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Well, it seems that original M16 without forward assist is in game. Anyway - As far as i know M16A1 fired in 3-round bursts, no ?
:::The A1 is full-auto. The A2 and A4 variants fire bursts. [[User:Ramell|Ramell]] 10:10, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

I dont like how they use the correct 20 round mag model but make it hold 30. Hopefully the burst/30 rounds is online only, like in cod 4 where the m16 was full auto SP but burst MP.

== CZ75 ==

JUst curious, does anyone think that the CZ-75 might be the Automatic version of the weapon. Granted Treyarch wasn't going to add Machine Pistols but since it's the last handgun in the list and it costs 750 credits would it be possible? I mean Bad Company 2 had their 93R as their last unlock which was a machine pistol [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 08:28, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well, it doesnt have to be automatic. CZ-75 is superior to all other handguns from list in real life.( maybe besides Colt Python ) - Its better than Makarov, ASP and even M1911 in all "stats" . Its probably best 9mm handgun.

::Not too sure as to how it would be better than a .45 caliber 1911. I can see it being better than the ASP or Makarov due to their small magazines of 7-8 rounds compared to the 75's 16 (9mm). Of course it does open the slight possibility that an Automatic conversion kit is available as an attachment [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:05, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
::: Its not just about calibre or mag capacity. CZ-75 is more accurate, bullet is faster and i think its lighter. Anyway - Its sure that heavier cartrigde is allways better :) But i would take CZ75 to combat instead of M1911.

:Maybe the developers just read a lot of Gunsmith Cats, and took Rally's speech to heart, but the possibility that it may be an automatic makes me sigh. I hope it isn't.-protoAuthor 16:08, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Firstly, The CZ-75 is not more accurate than a 1911
Secondly, there is no "best" 9x19 millimeter pistol, its all personal preference,
Thirdly, the .45 is a better combat round due to its lager grain bullet and more dispersion of energy on contact,
and Lastly, while caliber is not the most important factor, the .45 A.C.P is superior to the 9x19mm because the 9 is a small lightweight bullet, while the .45 is a large heavyweight bullet.
P.S. sign your posts.
~~ PunisherDave
: Well, i tested both CZ75 and 1911. I was doing better with CZ. Anyway - I would take it into combat because of for example mag size. And 9mm bullets are way much more common... --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 13:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Military 1911s almost universally sucked, with ultra loose fitting parts and 7 pound triggers, and nearly useless sights. 1911s in the civilian world, or the uber built special forces 1911, are nice. But your average GI 1911....not so. Im sure a cz75 would kick its ass in accuracy and reliability if you wanted to use more than ball ammo.
~~k9870
: Ágreed. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 13:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Those old 1911's had one thing going for them though, there was a hell of a lot of abuse you could put them through before they malfunctioned. Reliability is a factor. I'm not saying the CZ isn't reliable though, don't get me wrong. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 17:24, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

It was once said "the colt 45 will drop a charging bull dead in its tracks, but good luck hitting it.

Haha, while I do know (note how I'm just basing what I say off of research, so I am open to corrections. Hopefully one day I can fire a 1911 and CZ to really know the differences)that the old GI 1911's were often maligned for their lack of accuracy, I've also heard people say it isn't that big of a deal considering that it is a handgun. In a military capacity, the pistol is there when shit gets up close and personal and you need to defend yourself. When the guy is close enough that you can see the whites of his eyes, I'm sure you're not gonna have to be a deadeye to land shots on target. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 18:21, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
:My buddy's father was a Marine in Vietnam, and at least according to him, a lot had to do with the fact that their M1911s were just really old and worn. I would think that WWII production of M1911s would've been more enough to supply US forces for decades. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:29, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Ive heard they manuactured no new 1911s after ww2, and that they just swapped parts, keeping frame and slide. They were loose fitting, and rattled in holsters. a 7 pound single action trigger, and the sights are just awful, especially against a dark background, cheap 3 dot sights would be better. problem is when people think "1911" they think of the sweet modern ones. To be fair, military berettas are beat to hell too, and have known countless people to say the sights were misaligned, magazines had weak springs, etc.
The cz-75 though, this is the first time ive seen it in a game, its pretty cool. I cant wait to use it, im sick of the beretta being the staple 9mm.
-k9870

Misaliged sights are from them getting knocked around and is easily fixed, worn mag springs is through use and they are easily replaced.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:33, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

It is true that no new 1911's were purchased after World War 2. The same .45's that were on G.I's hips in Europe and The Pacific were being carried by U.S troops during the Gulf War in the 1990's. I've heard that the quality of the 1911's varied from gun to gun. Some were actually were in decent shape while others were just horrid. I don't believe they all suffered from the problems that K9870 is saying. Although I admit the standard sights on those guns are just awful, Most of the time I can't even make out the front post. A lot of soldiers I've read actually preferred a 1911 to the M9 and carried it when possible. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 22:37, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

I dunno about the automatic thing... I myself have only heard of the machine pistol variant of the CZ-75 until very recently, plus I don't think it has a place in media history as a well-known variant of the CZ-75 (much less the CZ-75 itself, outside of [[Gunsmith Cats]]), so I don't know how Treyarch could know about it. Most of the guns they got ideas for the game from are the airsoft guns they had in their office, and last I checked no one makes an airsoft automatic CZ-75. So I would bet my money on that this is just the game's Desert Eagle - the pistol that outshines the rest (and it's about time! The CZ-75 is very underused in the media, IMO). [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 09:23, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Actually I'm thinking that the Python is gonna be the Power Pistol of this game followed by the 1911. The CZ is probably gonna be the 9mm hi cap of the game.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 10:52, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

I hope they dont neuter it for "balance" and that it is awesome, who cares if they need to balance with the makarov and asp? When you buy better guns, they should actually be better, not just change one stat for another.

==asp==

was the asp pistol any good or even used much? It seems the grips would be slippery and the sights are weird.
-k9879
:According to a random site I found, it wasn't used much. Originally, only 100 were produced, and if they are still produced, they are produced only on a pistol-by-pistol basis by custom gunsmiths or shops or something along those lines. The grips were smooth because the original designer intended it to be the ultimate concealed carry pistol, and the smooth grips helped this keeping the chance for the hand to snag on the grips while pulling, aiming, and firing to a minimum. In addition, the sights are weird but when aimed through, due to the design of the sight which employed fluorescent panels, would point at the target when properly aligned, making it easier to shoot reflexively. -Chris Hun7er 23:42, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

It is a S&W Model 39 which was a really good pistol. It looks as though its in the game because of the size of the Makarov. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:34, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

== The Over-Under Shotgun ==

The Over-Under Shotgun AKA "Olympia", seems to be based off of a Browning Citori XT shotgun. I don't have a screenshot of the gun ingame (It was on the ground, and in HD, but the page was protected so I couldn't save it). But I am pretty sure that the Browning Citori XT is the real-life inspiration for the Olympia.

==Snubnose more accurate?==

What game designers brilliant idea was this? i could understand faster switch or something, but higher accuracy?

I think they were too stupid to make the snubnose version default and a 6" barrel an attachment. --[[User:Xarex|Xarex]]

A 4 inch python is a great service handgun, they should just have 4inch standard, the 6 inch a slower draw but more accurate, the snubby less accurate but faster draw, and unlocks like a nickle finish, different grips, pimp it out however you please.

I can't think of any reason why anyone would think that a snub makes it more accurate, this is just stupid.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:30, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

On the COD wiki it shows the stat page ffor snubnose, down one bar power, up one accuracy.
k9870
:It could be that one of the developers mixed it up by mistake, if its not a mix up..... then why bother making videogames with real guns anymore if Treyarch is just going to make up stuff. --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 08:11, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

::A snub nosed revolver has less power AND accuracy than a full size revolver.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 10:47, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

:::I mean in a video game sense (balance over realism), wouldn't a shorter barrel logically mean less accuracy? Sorry if what i said earlier sounded like i wanted Treyarch to make the game like real life. I just meant that Treyarch would be messing with logic to make a shorter barrel mean higher accuracy. --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 12:41, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

== Black Ops Zombies weapons ==

For those that are wondering, this is the "teaser" trailer for Black Op's Zombie mode www.gknova6.com

So far the weapons I can see and identify are the HK21E, Ithaca M37 Trench Gun, a sniper rifle that looks similar to the design of an Artic Warfare Super Magnum and a tricked out AK variant.

Also it seems we may have Zombies in modern arenas like Office complexes and Labs [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 06:59, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

== Makarov with target sights. ==

I just noticed that the Makarov has target sights instead of the Military sights. That definatly seems wrong for Military use.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:43, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Military sights suck, im sure special forces would replace them.

Maybe but as I recall they didn't have target sights back then, plus they are Dropped by the Russians so they would have the military sights. They aren't that bad by the way, I have personal experiance with them and they are fine.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:24, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

Saw on COD wiki "upgraded iron sights" as an attachment.

==Strela-3 Missile launcher! Latest Trailer!==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0_r4-eTmlA 1:10 "Vehicle Lock-On Only". Also whats that gun at 2:03, it makes me confus
--[[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]] 17:04, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

==Who Wants to Ice Castro?==
Apparently you can do it, and there's even an achievement for doing it in one shot!
http://www.gamesradar.com/xbox360/call-of-duty-black-ops/news/call-of-duty-black-ops-achievementstrophies-reward-you-for-murdering-monkeys-and-fidel-castro/a-20101001104021980032/g-20100430155437473001
[[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 18:35, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

tell ya what , if you can do that cuba is gonna be pissed . simmons 8492
Oh, oh, I DO!!! :D [[User:Young Gun]]

== Clues from leaked Achievements list ==

Full list here. SPOILERS! [http://planetcallofduty.gamespy.com/View.php?view=CODBOGameInfo.Detail&id=2]

:-The player gets to use TOW missiles in the game.
:: MP killstreak list is more than few days old.
:-It's DEFINITELY alternative history.
:: That was clear.
:-The Grim Reaper is in the campaign somewhere.
:: Seen already in one of first trailers.

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:41, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

== Found a PSG1 ==

[http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101001181628/callofduty/images/f/f9/Psg1better.jpg Here], to the right of the G2 --[[User:Ghostdigga|Ghostdigga]] 19:17, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

: '''Oh. My. God'''. 2000 Famas with flamethrower and M16 handguard. I beg it would sound crazy month ago. Looking forward MoH much more. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:56, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
:Sharp eye, dude. You have my respect. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:13, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

== PM-63 RAK ==

@ 2:04 in the new trailer here: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0_r4-eTmlA] Looks like a PM-63 RAK
[[Image:BO Unidentified.JPG]]--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 01:54, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

:He he, monkey.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 02:31, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

== Galil ==

Hey guys, found an ingame image of the Galil, head over to the Black Ops page to see it --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 09:14, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

== Explanation for Impossibly Inaccurate Weapons ==

It is possible that the explanation is that not all of this game is 1968. By looking at www.gknova6.com viral ad site for black ops, reading the trophy/achievemnt list, and by piecing together all the nova-6 gas based missions I believe that one of the playable characters will be killed or severely wounded in the Bay of Pigs Invasion in Cuba(due to the Sacrifice tropy found on the list at http://planetcallofduty.gamespy.com/View.php?view=CODBOGameInfo.Detail&id=2). The Gk Company or the Russian goverment then has him revived or recovered to relate what happened with his Ops in the year 1993(www.gknova6.com) or 2010(reveal) at Rebirth Island(Vozrozhdeniya Island) home to the Russian Microbioligical Warfare Unit(source wikipedia). This is not fannon look at the all the raw info of GKNOVA, the mission objectives of sevarel missions, and this GKNOVA6 Web site. Sorry for the long windedness but hopefully you will all understand.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 17:46, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

So...how does any of this new information explain the inaccurate weapons? The missions with the weapons in question like the AR-15 and the AUG really did took place in a time when they shouldn't exist. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:20, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Its confirmed this game is alternate reality/timeline so inaccurate weapons is less of a deal.
[[User:K9870|K9870]]

I was more or less talking about way off ones like the WA2000, FAMAS Felin, Artic Warfare, and Spectre M4.Trust me Im not saying thats a good excuse for F-ing up with the CAR-15 hybrid thing and the production "protoype" AUG but that might be the excuse for the G11 and all other post 1970 weapons.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 04:48, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Of course there's always the point that this is just a video game that has events based off of real life occurrences too... [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 03:02, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

== The Model 1887 is back ==
In before complaining. Seen in the newest trailer around the 00:42 second mark.
http://kotaku.com/5661296/a-look-at-black-ops-single-player-gameplay-and-story

Definitely a shout out to Terminator 2 there. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 02:54, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

It has been confirmed for single player campaign only, by trearch. Dunno about zombies --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:31, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Oh-ho, my friend, they are here. The best part is that the zombies are still of the Nazi variety. http://www.gknova6.com/agegate.php

:I mean dont know if its on zombies--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:47, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Only in one sequence within the campaign, don't think it's in zombies --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 22:26, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

What did enough people bitch about "how unfair" it is by blaming their lack of skill on "noob guns"?
:Honestly, I can understand why people complained about Akimbo 1887s. They definitely weren't balanced, since you could fire them almost constantly by staggering your shots until you had to reload. They also had almost insane range (For a video game shotgun), and very high power. I was fine with the single 1887, but I was glad that they nerfed the Akimbos. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 17:02, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

And I hope the zombies arent nazis, i want to fight commie zombies......

:Looks more like there may be a possibility of fighting not only Commie Zombies but Vietcong Zombies and regular civi zombies too, some of those screens look like their wearing office uniforms and lab coats besides military armor. In some ways I'm glad the 1887 is in singleplayer but at the same time I was kinda hoping it would also be added in multiplayer minus the silly akimbo models, they just looked wrong in my opinion. Also sign your posts with "~ ~ ~ ~" without quotations and spaces. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 17:25, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

== The Deer Hunter ==
Looks like theres a scene in the new trailer similiar to the roulette scene in The Deer Hunter, I wonder how that will work in the game. (just a cut scene or a playable moment?) --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 03:27, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

'MOW" haha that shit gets me every time . simmons 8492
:Nips? Wow, you're doubly ignorant. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:25, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

*Actually, there is no proof the Vietcong actually did anything like that, and it is widely agreed among film critics that the Russian Roulette scenes are actually allegories for the American involvement in Vietnam. We also have a few Asian members on this site, so you should keep your racism to yourself. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 01:31, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

:Well I'm not Vietnamese, so that won't offend me. Besides, sticks and stones. I'm more American than I am Asian [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:01, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

Dont want to look bad to future members, i know some is just joking but some people take everything seriously.

know what , your right . my bad guys . ill take it down. simmons8492

== Walther MPL confirmed ==

Found a video on G4 containing confirmation that the MPL SMG is in-game. For reference it's the gun painted all green http://g4tv.com/videos/49177/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops---Jungle-Multiplayer-Map-Exclusive/ [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 16:34, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

== 'Grip attachment' on Sub Machine Guns ==

I've heard that the grip attachment on SMGs in fact deploys the stock. That would explain why they all seem to be removed/folded ont the SMGs.

:This is most proven on the Skorpion, attaching a grip actually attaches the wire folding stock [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 14:24, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

==Is it just me...==

or is using the same flip up sights on every damn gun just friggin lazy?

[[User:k9870|k9870]]

It's an attachment called 'improved iron sights'. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:32, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

No, there standard in game sights. The improved adds outiline and dots to pistols, the flip up sights on guns is laz and trying to look tacticool. Even the m60 has them

And because the standard factory iron-sights for the M60 and the FAMAS, well, SUCK. I really was not a fan of the M60's irons in COD4 and the Battlefield Bad Company games. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 03:19, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
: Agreed. Kinda bugged by the repetitive sights on some guns myself, but I'm not gonna let it get me down. Most of the guns have their own, correct sights. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 08:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah, thats Treyarch development style. Put everything they want in any time etape. This game is already dead to me - actually, MoH with its 5 hour campaign is much better than MW2 and Black Ops ('' MW2 with different textures and anachronistic guns'' )
:: Wow dude, you must be from the future seeing as how you are able to form this opinion with a game that hasn't even been released yet. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 08:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
Meh, I usually play games because they are fun. MOH was pretty realisitc, (compared to Call of Duty anyway...) but it definetly wasn't fun (online). I'll just revel in the ridiculousness of it all... Akimbo HS-10 FTW
--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 05:16, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

I just finally see these old obscure guns in games and they put lameass sights on, BTW medal of honors single player was cool (ending was abrupt and anticlimactic though) but online is glitchy and feels unpolished. I want to play COD.

Not really sure about the LAME part, but I'd rather have USABLE sights even if they aren't the originals and seem LAME in other people's eyes. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:46, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Is it so hard to ask for variety, im sure the stock sights are usable for a game, i may just use an AK online since it doesnt have flip ups.

Is it so much to ask them to give us variety in the same type of gun, like stock and stockless MP5 or underfolder AK. performances, it makes no difference, but I like variety in what you pick to shoot with. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 01:19, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

== *SPOILER* Zombie Mode Characters. ==

Hey, just saw the intro video for zombie mode. It seems you play as John F Kennedy, Richard Nixon, Some CIA Bloke and Fidel Castro... Heres the link:[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnbhcHCP24g]r
::That fourth guy would appear to be Robert McNamara, JFK and LBJ's Sec of Defense. Why not just LBJ? Or Bobby Kennedy? They couldn't find two voice actors to do bad Bahston/Kennedy accents? ("Er-eh, toss me another maaahg!") --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:52, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
Awsome.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 23:59, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

: These guys are only on bonus map that you get after finishing campaign. There are some random US sosldiers fighting Nazi Zombies in normal zombie mode. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:11, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Damn, i love cigars but hate commies. [[user:k9870|k987]]

Zombies better be commies, killing nazis got old i want to shoot commie zobies.

:Is it just me, or would LBJ be better replaced by LHO? (Lee Harvey Oswald.)
::Only if he could only carry three bullets at one time. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:47, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

=="escape the past"==

Its a achievemnet listed, does this imply time travel?
-k9870

Or that something one of the characters did is going to come back to bite them in the arse. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:34, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

If it's time travel I'm tearing someone at Treyarch a new one--[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:21, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

:Don't get so defensive over a title. It could be a really cool section, forcing the player to battle his way out of his hometown. Or, maybe time travel. >.> [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 23:31, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Nah I meant it all in good humour XD --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:44, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

I highly doubt that it's actual time travel. From what we've seen and has been speculated, the majority of the campaign will take place as memories of Black Ops missions that the main characters participated in. No time travel, just photographic memories. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:51, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

==New Videos confirm various unknowns==

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrNoLz4gC60&feature=mfu_in_order&playnext=1&videos=dvWBYFCAcck]

Among a few things, this video confirms that the G11 is burst fire only, and at the exceptional rate we expect. The poster has posted about many other of the weapons, also confirming that Full Auto is a pistol attachment for the CV-75. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 20:19, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

== Golden Guns are Fugly ==

I mean take a look at this!

[[Image:Golden_PSG1.jpg‎|200px|thumb|none|Golden PSG1]]

[[Image:Golden_WA2000.jpg|200px|thumb|none|Golden WA2000]]

[[Image:Golden_Stakeout.jpg‎|200px|thumb|none|Golden Ithaca Stakeout]]

[[Image:Golden_HS-10.jpg|200px|thumb|none|Golden HS-10]]

Also, it would appear the the Ithaca M37 IS the Stakeout version and not the Trench Gun version we initially believed [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 13:39, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

:I thought golden guns were fugly before. >> [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 21:18, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

:That doesn't even look like real gold, it looks spray painted on! [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:50, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

The gold guns look terribad, probably will avoid using gold camo altogether :C --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 00:05, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:Why spend money on gun colours, when you can just buy gun attachements? :D [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 20:58, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:^ This. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:01, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Eh, still gonna make my Duke of New York class with a gold Mac-10 and a nickel (I swear I saw a nickel or 'silver' camo) Python. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:23, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:Not sure it was confirmed, I think there was rumors flying around but nothing concrete. Besides, I don't think camo patterns can be applied to secondaries, which is lame. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 09:09, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

:: Have you heard that even ACOG´s can be added on pistols ? This game is gonna suck.
:::Because the fact that you can put a scope on a high powered revolver (Something that's doable and often useful in real life) means that the game automatically sucks. Thank you for your insight. Also, sign your posts. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:54, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Only python can take an acog. And as to golden guns you only use them if you want to and it looks like you can do it for individual guns instead of the whole damn class its in.

The Python's recoil with the ACOG looks pretty balanced, I'm not too bothered about it. Besides, is pretty cool that Treyarch are doing something a bit different. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 17:51, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

:I just added pictures of all the golden guns, they are pretty gross. I would never waste any fake money to buy them.

==just watched zomie gameplay==

pentagon level, the zombies were amix of original nazi zombies and pentagon workers turned to zombies (were wearing shirt/tie)

Why cant they have communist zombies, seriously?

[[user:k9870|k9870]

:I guess they don't want to offend anyone who might be communist. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:07, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

I still hope there's some Nazi ones left. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:28, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Nazis made sense in ww2, but thats been done, we want something new, commie zombies.

From what I've seen, the WaW characters are returning to fight straight Nazi zombies, JFK and friends fight Pentagon zombies in the Pentagon, and there's another with Russian zombies in Winter camo (that's shown on that GKNOVA6 website right now). [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 04:30, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

The JFK/Nixon/Castro/McNamara level is a bonus level at the end of the game, not the actual zombies mode. The real zombies mode features some new guys in some labs (as seen on GKNOVA6) most probably russian special forces. It will include communist zombies. and the characters from W@w are in it if you buy hardened --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 11:39, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

I hope the pentagon level is 4 player co op so i can play with friends

==Interview with the military advisor==
Here is the link to the interview with the Call of Duty: Black Ops military advisor if anyone is interested in reading it. [http://www.3news.co.nz/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops-military-advisor-interview/tabid/418/articleID/185313/Default.aspx] --[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 16:13, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

:Unfortunately, that Advisor doesnt know anything about weapons. Or any kind of warfare. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 11:45, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Of course your in a position to judge him right...--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 02:56, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
:Yes, god forbid Treyarch try and make a fun game, instead of a military simulator. Fun? What's that?! [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 10:52, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
:: But game can be fun even with realistic weapons or good AI of enemies.
Unfortunately, Treyarch went in MW2 way and instead of making enemy AI better, they spawned twice as much of them.
:::No one says COD was ever a military simulator, but a M16/M203 turning up during the Bay of Pigs invasion would seem to be a "bit" out of place. Now that we know the singleplayer is set between 1961 and 1968, any arguments about the game taking place in some era that justifies the anachronisms has become irrelevant.

==Just putting this out there==
Does anyone else believe that now that the game's actually out and we can get higher quality screenshots, that the old low quality caps be removed? Or maybe the entire page be redone so it looks a little more consistent because you have a low quality shot from an online video then a high quality ingame cap from the game. I'm just saying it probably would look better. --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 01:33, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree that the low-quality screencaps should be removed ASAP. I'll try to post some as I go through the single-player campaign, but eventually, they too may need to be replaced. I'm running it on 960x600 with no AA for playability. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 02:17, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:This page also need screencaps from the Zombies mode. I was unable to get the Thundergun (a two-shot sound wave gun that resembles a modern rocket launcher) and the Ray gun due to the constant waves of zombies that may sneak up on you and kill you easily, large number of barriers (too many to defend), and the poor weapons you receive in the early rounds. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 20:29, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

I just finished single-player, and I've got tons of caps available. I'll try to upload that are relevant and in need later --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 04:18, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

== Impressions So Far? ==

What do you guys thinks of the game so far? My only dissapointment is that they have decided to remove the front sight when you use optics. Other than that, the guns look fantastic.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 05:36, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:I think it's alright, I haven't played campaign yet since the game is my roommate's so we've only been playing on Live. I think the only thing I'm not really liking so far is that they took away the slip-screen Special Ops. As for the guns, pretty much the same as yours along with the whole flame thrower thing, I just think it is rather ridiculous.--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 06:13, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

:Boring. SP is short, unoriginal ('' This wont matter as MoH had short SP too. But it was atleast fun. Atmospheric and realistic fun. While its boring, unatmospheric and completely unoriginal in BO'' ) . There isnt anything like AI. Too many boring scripts. To the guns : They are anachronistic and unrealistic. It feels strange encountering NVA with Spas-12. MP is same like in MW2 ('' Read - Crappy'' ) with tons of spammed killstreasks etc.
:This game deserves '''5/10''', nothing more. Oh, and do not think i have something against Treyarch. I hated MW2 too. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:00, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
I like it. SP was a bit of a mind fuck at times, and the AI could have been better, but 98% of the time I was having fun. MP is mostly good, better than MW2, though over the last 12 hours I started seeing some tubers. Yes it's anachronistic and ridiculous, but if I wanted an exact simulation of war I'd join the CF. Aside from some maps, I like it far more (In every way) than MW2. Galil w/ red dot & suppressor + 1911 w/ extended mags = awesomeness. --[[User:Crazycrankle|Crazycrankle]] 15:09, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The story is actually pretty decent, better than the sponataneous betrayals of MW2. The voice acting is also, suprisingly, very well done. I really don't play multiplayer alot, but it's more balanced than MW2. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 15:20, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The constant flashes on the screen is annoying as hell. Almost gave me a seizure. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:53, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The campaign was a bit hard to follow at first, but it comes together nicely in the end. Yes, the weapons are ludicrous (not even ridiculous, beyond ridiculous,) but oh well, I can live with it. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:30, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:Pretty much, I'll give this game a 9.2/10. The multiplayer and content is better and improved from Modern Warfare 2, but the campaign is a bit too short (only 15 missions :() and there's some minor complicated glitches in frame rate. Overall, the game is much better than Modern Warfare 2 and a good recommendation. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 20:24, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

To be honest guys I just ignore the ancronistic weaponry as it really doesnt matter in the long run. Lets face it, saying a game will suck because theres some AUGs in the 'nam era is just plain ludacris. If Treyarch decided to stick to realistic guns of that period, we would just end up with a bunch of bland, unoriginal guns we have all seen before, making this game both an unnecisary COD sequel and just another crappy Vietnam game that flops. Now that thats out of my system I can say with all honesty that this game is very addicting and its finnally a challenge to kill people(5-6 shots for a kill rather than 3-4 shots a kill in MW2). This game is a way more fun experince than MW2 and finally shows the potential of Teyarch development team. ---P226 21:24, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

: I agree, you people take the weapons accuracy way too seriously. What the hell did you expect from a mainstream video game? The only games that are ever 100% accurate with the guns, lets face, are awful. At least this games fun. Hate it for any other reason, that's fine I'll respect that. Hate it for innaccuracies when you really should be used to by know, and that's just ridiculous. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:38, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
:: You and P226 have both just contradicted yourselves. On the one hand you state it's ridiculous to say a game sucks because of the guns, but then go on to say games that have accurate depictions of guns suck. If the game is fun, it's going to be fun whether the guns are accurate or not. I can't believe that if Black Ops had the correct weapons in it that it suddenly wouldn't be fun anymore. Perhaps you can give an explanation of how this would be so?
::''If Treyarch decided to stick to realistic guns of that period, we would just end up with a bunch of bland, unoriginal guns we have all seen before, making this game both an unnecisary COD sequel and just another crappy Vietnam game that flops.''
::I have to totally disagree with this statement. If Treyarch had used firearms of the period, we would have ended up with weapons that, to my knowledge, have never before been used in a video game. I have mentioned in other posts how the Remington 7188, an automatic shotgun that was really used by the NAVY seals in Vietnam could have been used in Black Ops. Instead we get the SPAS-12, which didn't exist at the time, and has been used in a million other video games. Which is the "bland, unoriginal" gun here? I'm gonna have to say the SPAS-12. Of course, if Treyarch had used the period correct shotgun the game would all of a sudden not be fun anymore and would suck, right?
::''The only games that are ever 100% accurate with the guns, lets face, are awful.'' I find this statement hard to believe. Would you care to back this up with some examples?--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 04:39, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

I never said having a game with correct guns of that period is going to be bad, I was trying to make a point that if Black Ops were to have just your standard m16's,Ak47's and colt Commando's, it would be just some normal Vietnam game. Also, all the guns above have been done to death in every video game none to man (though they are nice to have to fill in weapon slots), in my opinion I find the Galil as sweet( and different) Assualt Rifle, Ancronistic or not. If your the kind of guy who can't get over the fact that your using guns lke the AK'''74'''u and the CZ'''75''' in 1968, then this isn't the game for you. ---P226 18:47, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

:I don't know if you guys remember "Men of Valor," but it was a Vietnam FPS that came out a few years ago. It was developed by the same studio that did MoH: AA, so it felt a lot like MoH: Vietnam.) All the weapons were historically accurate, nothing was out of place, but if you've never heard of it, I'm not surprised. The game isn't bad, but it's not great, and it's flawed. The weapons were correct, but there weren't that many, and many of the weapons were just variations on the same weapon. (M16 and CAR-15, M14 and M21, and AK-47 and Type 56, and you couldn't share ammo for some reason.) Thus, you can make a game like BO that has ludicrously anachronistic weapons and have the biggest media launch of all time, or a game like Men of Valor that has historically accurate (and yes, boring) weapons and have it be unknown to the general gaming public. (You should try out Men of Valor though. If you have an original Xbox, you can get it new for a penny. It's not backwards compatible though.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:36, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

: I just might have to pick that up. And when I said the games with 100% accurate weapons suck, I didn't mean they sucked because of the guns, I meant that every game I could think of that was ultra-realistic just simply wasn't fun. No contradiction. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 00:54, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
:You all seem to say the guns don't matter, but then show your disdain for having the correct weapons in the game, as if this would somehow make it boring. ''I never said having a game with correct guns of that period is going to be bad, I was trying to make a point that if Black Ops were to have just your standard m16's,Ak47's and colt Commando's, it would be just some normal Vietnam game.'' So if Black Ops had the exact same story, but the correct guns it would just be a normal Vietnam game? Why? The story makes the game, not the guns. And there's plenty of weapons that would be correct to the period that haven't been "done to death" (HK-33 w/ 40 rd mag, used by Navy SEALS, Carl Gustav m/45, Remington 7188, the list goes on) What exactly qualifies as bland,unoriginal guns, that if they were included would make the game boring? I just get the impression from you that the only interesting guns in this game are the ones that dont' belong there. My point is that they could have had period correct weapons and it wouldn't have affected the fun factor of the game at all--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 04:00, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
::I am more bothered by the guns that didn't make the cut. Why not an M76, a Carl Gustav, a Madsen M50, or an M3 Grease Gun? Sure, they could've, but they didn't, probably on purpose. That brings leads me to what can be an interesting exercise: what would've been better weapons on each level? For the first level (the Cuban one) I would've put in an M2 Carbine and a PPK instead of the M16 and ASP. Other levels? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:20, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

:::You pose an interesting question, but there are actually a lot of different choices so it's one not easily answered. I agree with you on the M-2 carbine, it would be very appropriate for the Cuban level. I feel another good choice would have been one of the Czech SA series of submachine guns. If you've ever seen photos from the Bay of Pigs Invasion, you would have noticed that SA 25 quite a common weapon in the hands of Castro's forces. The FAL is actually historically correct for that level, but it's more likely that was an accident than by design.
:::I haven't played the game yet, so I'm not familiar with all the levels, but I have some general ideas of what they should have included. For pistols a Browning Hi-Power, and if Treyarch absolutely had to have a machine pistol, they could have used the Stechkin. For SMG's, the Carl Gustav M/45 standard model or suppressed version, and if not that then the Madsen M50. The SA 23,24,25,or 26, a Beretta model 12 w/ 40 round mag instead of the Spectre, maybe the MAT-49 for the NVA/Vietcong, if not the standard version then the suppressed model that was supposedly employed by NVA counter-SOG teams. If the MP-5 is going to be included then the standard MP5A3 should have been used instead of that ugly ass prototype MP5K.
:::Of course replace the damn SPAS-12 with the Remington 7188. HK33 instead of the AUG. The correct model CAR-15 instead of the flat top Commando. How about the AMD-65 instead of an AKS-74U? I think they should have axed the RPK altogether and perhaps used 2 different Russian machine guns, maybe an older model like the RP-46, and then the PK for the Spetsnaz.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 02:53, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

::: RPK instead of "''RPK''" in first level. Also AK-47 instead of "''AK-47''" in second one. Vladimirov KPV instead of Minigun would be awesome. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:51, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Also, this game doesnt suck just because of guns. It sucks because its boring, it doesnt have AI and MP is shitty just like in MW2. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:51, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

How is the MP shitty, its definitly not, It developed to be much more balanced than MW2 in every way. Although it isnt perfect,(commando lunges...)it certainly makes modern warfare 2 look like crap as a SUBMACHINE GUN....*cough*UMP45*cough* had more power and range than most assualt rifles. As for the people listing the guns that should have been in the game, all I can say is 'sure I wish they added more time appropriate guns like the Carl Gusav and the Greese Gun, but its too late now and its going to be somthing we have to live as there is no point complaining about it on the internet(not trying to say that in harsh or disrespectful way). I feel if we can all sit down , forget all those anchronisms, and just enjoy this game for what it is, a FICTIONAL cold war/ Vietnam Game. Also on a side note, I think if Treyarh were to have focused this game on Vietnam mainly, then we would have all the correct weaponry, but since there going for a 'top secret CIA' type game,they add all these ludacris guns to accomidate the feel and presence of the cold war.---P226 20:03, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

== Pistol grips ==

Anyone noticed that there isnt gun without pistol grip ? Jeez. They put one even on Mosin. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:00, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

Mosin and ppsh dont have them, characters just hold them like they do.

: Maybe in first person. But mosin has actually pistol grip when its in hands of NPC´s.

No, they just hold their hand as if they were, when its on their backs or they die and drop it doesnt, its probably due to all other characters carrying pistol grips and they dont want too redo characte rmodeling.

I was taking a closer look at when they hold it (Mosin) and guess what, the world models are normal, but when they hold them they DO have pistol grips.... but i do agree, they probably didn't want to make new models. They probably put grips on them while their holding the weapon just so they didn't look even more awkward (floating hands). --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 22:13, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Not all the weapons have pistol grips. If you watch them carefully there are no pistol grips EXCEPT on Steiner's Mosin that is given to him my a Soviet soldier. It is actually modeled as having a pistol grip that is quite visable. Otherwise they do not have pistol grips on anything, it just looks like it. --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 16:00, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Steiners Mosin does not have a pistol grip, its a modeling error because its really a P38 in his hands along with the Rifle--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:11, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

== Gold weapon images ==

Do we really need all those pictures of the gold camo? [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:32, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah. It shows how silly and disguisting tis game is.
Disgusting? It's not THAT bad, man. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:42, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Sign your posts. But, I agree that the gold weapon pictures are rather unnecssary. If someone has the PC version of the game, taking pictures of the standard weapons in multiplayer would be greatly appreciated.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 20:31, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

== Semi Auto FAL ==

Since it is semi auto only, shouldn't it be renamed to the SLR? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:56, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

It has a metric reciever and handguards but a SLR-style flash hider... Its a Franken-gun but nowhere near as bad as MW2's FN-FAL was...--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 00:59, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

== Snub-nose ==
Could the effect of this actually reduce the visual recoil of the Python, allowing you to fire off your next shot faster, and thus make it "more accurate"? --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 16:56, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

But wouldn't it instead exacerbate recoil, without the weight of the barrel to mitigate it? If anything, a snub-nose would make the recoil more pronounced, and thus less accurate for quick follow-up shots.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 23:13, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Huh.....looks like I really suck at gun physics when it comes to recovery time and barrel lengths >_> --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 02:32, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Though it may be incorrect for real life, I'd say Hashiriya's idea is most probably how it works in game. Since all weapons in COD are perfectly accurate when aiming, the accuracy stat is there to show how easy it is for the player to accuratly shoot the weapon, not the actual weapon's accuracy as we would think of it. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:35, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

== Tunnel Rat Revolver ==
When in the tunnels, the report of the Python is fairly muted. Is the implication therefore that is it loaded with "closed circuit" shotgun ammunition as used by the experimental [http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg213-e.htm Quiet Special Purpose Revolver] as tested by Tunnel Rats in Vietnam?

When ever its fired inside a building its strangely quieter yet louder when you step outside.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:31, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Maybe it's your eardrums preemptively ('prolly didn't spell that right) exploding? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:18, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

Oh yeah, wasn't that ammunition meant for a .44 magnum? Also its just the way it sounds when its indoors.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:46, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

==Stop Complaining==

Please just stop. Who cares if the guns aren't accurate? Just sit back and enjoy the Game! If you don't like the game, don't play it! [[User:SAMBAMA|SAMBAMA]]

: 1, I dont play game, because its boring and its just ripoff of MW2. Which was crap too.
: 2, This is firearms site. Not some gaming one. So it doesnt make sense to stop complaining.
: 3, I wont be complaining if those guns would be 3 or 4 years from future. But ''30-40'' ?
--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 07:38, 4 December 2010 (UTC)
Your late to the party, we for the most part don't care anymore.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:45, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

^ Hahahahaha! [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 19:08, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

==Crossbow==
I was playing zombies the other day and got the crossbow out of the box. I do't know if anyone else has seen this but, at least I think, it bears a major resemblance to the PSE Tac 15 crossbow. Again this is just me but if that's true I'm pretty sure that would make it the most anachronistic weapon in the game seeing as it was made maybe 2 or 3 years ago? --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 16:05, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

The PSE TAC 15 uses either an AR15 lower, or is included with basically a reciever shaped the same. Looking at it, it does not appear to have an AR15 type lower reciever on it, judging from the lack of the empty magazine well in front of the trigger. Maybe the upper does a little, I would agree, but in it's entirety in my opinion I don't think it does.--[[User:Fnlover|Fnlover]] 20:44, 05 January 2010 (UTC)

==1911 in Zombies==
The 1911 in zombies is just the regular nickeled finish like in multiplayer it looks black because of the low light in the starting room. If you go outside by the 'double tap' vending machine you can see it in daylight.

In FIVE where the lighting is fine, its still a Blued finish.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:08, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Really? It looks just like the Multiplayer's nickle plated M1911, I checked just a few minutes ago. Not an expert on this, but if it was a blued finish then wouldn't that make it a lot less shiny? For all the poorly lit rooms in Nazi Zombies, it seems to reflect like a spotlight at times.

In Kino, its the Nickle plated one but in FIVE it looks blued or actually poorly done lighting. Blued is shiny by the way, I have actual guns to prove that.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:52, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

It was Five that I checked, it looks nickle plated to me, so iunno. And thanks for clearing the shine thing up, I thought blueing made the metal duller and not very reflective, I must have mixed that up with something else.

You could be thinking of Parkerizing, which results in a dull finish. --[[User:Graybass 20x6|Graybass 20x6]] 02:59, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Ohyah, parkerizing. I knew it was something with -izing in it, thanks.

== Did alittle overhauling ==

Removed the misimformation (Shiny black finish is called a Blued finish) and another things.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:11, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

==Front Cover 1911==

Is it just me or is the 1911 in the soldier's hand on the title picture (the right hand when you're looking at it) missing its hammer? I've been looking as closely as I can, but I just can't seem to find it. An error on the artists part perhaps? Strange though, the pistol marked "Sally" has its proper hammer.--[[User:august.allocco|august.allocco]] 17:32, 30 December 2010

Looks like a combination of the light and the angle making it hard to spot. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:30, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

== Silencer or Suppressor ==

I was looking at some of the images on this page and noticed that some said they were "silenced" or "with silencer", yet others used suppressor. I always thought suppressor was correct, and silencer only described the effect (although Call of Duty games are notorious for spreading this word around). I have not played black ops, so I was wondering if we would call the attachments silencers or suppresors? --Fnlover 05:42, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
:From what I've heard, both are technically correct, and when the original device was created by Maxim, he patented it as a 'silencer'. Yes, it technically doesn't make the gun silent, but that's it's official name. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 02:36, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
::They both are correct, even the BATF calls them silencers on the paperwork.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 05:23, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

== Possible Identity of Over/Under Shotgun ==

Hey everyone, long-time fan of the site, first-time contributor here. I believe I have come across the true identity of the over/under shotgun. I've tried to do as much homework as I could before submitting.

The shotgun appears to be a Beretta: the S-686. Here is the picture for your perusal: [http://armpou.com/images/BERETTA%20686%20SILVER%20PIGEON%20S.jpg Beretta S-686]. Note the identical engraving and design of the barrel pivot assembly.

I don't believe that it could be a Rottweil Olympia. The only picture I could come up with (it's pretty elusive) looked nothing like the in-game model: [http://www.guncity.co.nz/images/162403.jpg Rottweil Olympia]. It's rather plain in comparison, with a much different pivot assembly design and geometry.

What do you guys think? --[[User:Graybass_20x6|Graybass_20x6]] 1:45, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

== You know... ==

The more and more I read the discussion page, the more and more I realize you guys should develop a game. Maybe not go that far, maybe just have the developers of a game contact you guys for some info, rather than watch Predators, or Commando, or some other action movie and call it good.

:Together we would create the most weapons realistic game ever! But we don't have the funds or the people to program at least that I know of.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:43, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

::Well, since CoD4:MW, CoD series is known by its many small detail mistakes the developers did to vehicles, factions, weapons, character's clothing, etc.
::This mistakes cannot stop you from playing, but if it's really bothers you, you can use the mod tool to create a mod that accurate every aspect of the game/s, of course if you have the desire for it... I would do that to many games I could, if I had the desire too. --[[User:RaNgeR|RaNgeR]] 23:01, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

:::Sounds like the Project Reality Mod for Battlefield 2.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:19, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

Actually, my uncle does that stuff for IW maybe I should give him a few notes...

:More than a few I would say, ask him to check this site and ask for opinions. We would be happy to help!--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:34, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

I've been on board for a couple of game projects involving other people over the net, mainly as a story writer and overall ideas man. The main problem with developing games through the internet is the lack of interest over time. At the beginning of the projects I've seen, it seems there is never a lack of volunteers and collaboration. However, the projects I've undertaken (over the internet) have always seemed to lose steam after a whirlwind of work and progress, and within a month or two it's left to a bare-bones cast of a few people who eventually drop it due to lack of manpower. I'd absolutely love to have another project to do (I've had ideas for an FPS milling about in my head for ages), but I also fear that it will be all for naught within a few weeks. --[[User:Graybass 20x6|Graybass 20x6]] 02:59, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

:I completely agree. I myself, writing an idea for a game which in the meantime it's called "Lead Storm" - an FPS game based on other existing games/series like CoD, MoH, Crysis, BF, Tom Clancy's, etc. This game is also involves the accuracy of small details, from weapons to equipment to cloths and many other things. I really want this game to be exists, but it's hard to do it alone. I need people who can program, animate and generally design stuff using various programs. --[[User:RaNgeR|RaNgeR]] 14:44, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

I'm so down for that, but it does seem like something that people would lose their dedication to pretty quickly.

Talk:Call of Duty: Black Ops

2011-01-30T00:13:53Z

Gunner313: Undo revision 381294 by The Wierd It (Talk)

= Wonder Weapons and Miscellaneous Weapons =

== Ray Gun ==

The Ray Gun is available in Call of Duty: Black Ops, only in the Nazi Zombies game mode. While still being very powerful, the gun has a tendency to make crawlers on later rounds more often. Although this can be very useful, it can also create problems for the player, as the player may be caught unaware by them.

[[Image:446px-BORayGun.png|thumb|none|400px|The Ray Gun in-game.]]

== Wunderwaffe DG-2 ==

The Wunderwaffe only appears in Shi No Numa and Der Riese as part of the hardened and prestige editions. In the new maps, the weapon is replaced by its spiritual successor, the Thundergun. When Pack-a-Punched in Der Riese it becomes gold-plated. In one of the intel pieces, a group of wunderwaffe projects are referred to. One of the projects listed is the Die Glocke.

[[Image:Wunderwaffe_DG-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Wunderwaffe DG-2 in-game.]]

== Thundergun ==

This is a weapon featured in the level Kino der Toten. It pushes back zombies with such force that it kills them and should be used only to push back zombies if the player(s) are crowded and cornered considering its low ammunition it starts out with. It becomes the "Zeus Cannon" when upgraded. It also appears in as a easter egg in the Call of Duty: Black Ops campaign level Numbers. It is strongly hinted that it was created by Dr. Maxis.

[[Image:621px-Thundergun.png|thumb|none|400px|The Thundergun in-game.]]

== Winter's Howl ==

This weapon is featured in "Five" and Zombie Verruckt, but only in Call of Duty Black Ops. It is able to freeze zombies on impact, lowering their health drastically. In later rounds, it seems to make zombies health go down and takes a couple of seconds to freeze. It has a 6 round magazine and 24 shots in reserve. When pack-a-punched, it becomes Winter's Fury, and has a 9 round magazine and 36 shots in reserve. Frozen zombies have ice surrounding them. It is currently unknown who created it, but it is possible that the Americans created it because of where you find it (the Pentagon).

[[Image:WintersHowl.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Winter's Howl in-game.]]

== SOG Knife ==
The SOG Knife is a special knife used by the player (as Alex Mason) in the mission "Victor Charlie". This is the only time the SOG Knife is in use.

It is not a SOG knife it is a Randall Model #14 Attack. Gunner 313

[[Image:Shot0159.jpg|thumb|none|600px|SOG Knife in idle.]]

[[Image:Shot0167.jpg|thumb|none|600px|SOG Knife been drawn.]]

== Tomahawk ==
The Tomahawk axe is a melee weapon that replaces the throwing knife (or tactical knife) from ''[[Modern Warfare 2]]'' in mutliplayer. In single-player, it's only available on the mission "Rebirth" after obtaining it from a Russian harbor worker and killing him with it.
[[Image:Tomahawk-BO.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tomahawk in Create-a-Class.]]
[[Image:Tomahawk-BOthrow.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A Tomahawk being thrown.]]

== Ballistic Knife ==
The ballistic knife is a powerful melee weapon that available only in multiplayer and zombie modes. The knife is firing blades with a spring inside the body. In real life, this knife is used by Russian special forces units like Spetsnaz.
[[Image:BK-BO.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The ballistic knife being reloaded.]]

== Crossbow ==

The Crossbow is a new weapon that featured in ''Call of Duty: Black Ops''. It is speculated to fulfill the role of a quiet, long range weapon. The crossbow appears in the campaign mission "WMD", which is set in the Ural Mountains, 1968. Crossbows can have different types of bolts which it can fire, such as normal bolts and Explosive bolts. The crossbow is a military grade crossbow that can attach a scope, which the player can steady.

[[Image:Shot0205.jpg|thumb|none|550px|Crossbow in idle.]]

[[Image:Shot0206.jpg|thumb|none|550px|Crossbow in reloading.]]

== Flamethrower ==

A flamethrower of unknown model has been confirmed to be in Call of Duty: Black Ops as found in the "GKnova6 document" which can be found here: [http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr135/priceman14/doc10.jpg]
The document only refers to it as "Improvised Weaponry" in "Phase 1 Testing" with most of the other information redacted.

Another model appears as an underbarrel attachment.

The image used by www.codblackopsblog.com
[http://www.codblackopsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Black-Ops-Weapons-Flamethrower.jpg]

Reference image of Flamethrowers in Call of Duty: World at War, a past Treyarch game that featured flamethrowers. Image from www.gameinformer.com
[http://blog.al.com/techcetera/2008/12/Pelilucodwaw.jpg]

[[Image:PSG1pic.JPG|thumb|none|500px|Flamethrower mounted on FAMAS F2 FELIN. ''Note ankward M16 handguard'']]

== Main Knife ==

The knife returns in Call of Duty: Black Ops. It is still a one-hit kill, but unlike the previous versions, seems to cause a very large fountain of blood to appear after knifing an enemy.

[[Image:659px-KnifeBlackOpsMultiplayer.png|thumb|none|500px|The Main Knife in-game.]]

== Prison Knife ==

The Prison Knife is a melee weapon used in the mission "Vorkuta" in Call of Duty: Black Ops. It appears to be a jagged piece of scrap metal, similar to a 'shank' or 'shiv'. After Mason acquires another weapon, the prison knife is no longer equipped, and is only used by pressing the melee button. You can see blood on the blade, probably from stabbing the prison guard. Upon closer expection though, I found out it is just a piece of glass with black tape around the handle.

[[Image:624px-Prisonknife.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Prison Knife in-game.]]

== Karambit Knife ==

The Karambit Knife is a combat knife used in the Call of Duty: Black Ops mission Executive Order. It is used to kill a Russian soldier by sticking it into the soldier's spinal cord, killing him, allowing the player and Frank Woods to take their uniform and infiltrate the launch site. Though this blade is used only by US Federal Air Marshals currently, Mason and Woods could have used it instead of a normal blade to aid in the purpose of the mission. Unlike a normal blade, it is shaped like a jungle cat's claw.

[[Image:561px-Karambit_Knife.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Karambit Knife in-game.]]

== Bowie Knife ==

The Bowie Knife is a special melee weapon which can be bought for 3000 points in Der Riese, Kino der Toten and Five. It is larger and wider than the standard combat knife in Call of Duty: Black Ops (or any Call of Duty game for that matter). It increases Knife damage from 150 to 1150, making it a one-hit-kill for zombies from Round 1 to Round 11. It is a one-hit-kill to Hellhounds all the way up until the third hellround.

[[Image:BowieKnifePolkCompetition2-1024.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Bowie Knife in Real Life.]]

[[Image:Bowie.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Bowie Knife in-game.]]

=Discussion=
This game has a cold war look to it

==AK74u==

In game, it is a ak74u, not an aks74u. U=carbine S=folding stock.
The in game models are all mssing stocks, so are only an ak74u, as they are called in game. It should be noted as such, im sick of having to re change the main page and want to get this cleared up/

I don't care if there's no stock, there's no such designation as "AK-74u". Also, try unlocking the "grip" attachment for it. That adds the stock back on. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:00, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

AK74 is base model, u means shortened, s means folding stock, etc. So chopping stock off makes it a 74u

I am fully aware of what the designations mean. Find me an actual AK-74 carbine produced from the factory without the side-folder and actually labelled "AK-74u" (cannot be simply an AKS-74U with the stock detached), and I'll gladly change it back. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:16, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

It doesnt matter how it left the factory, it matters how you modify it. If you put a 4.25 inch barrel and slide on a full sized 1911 do you call it a government model or a commander? I mean its a commander model but left the factory a government.....

This isn't the Call of Duty Wiki, kid. We don't promote misinformation as fact like they do there. We refer to and classify firearms as they are in the ''real'' world, not the ''game'' world. That means referring to it by its ''actual'' name (AKS-74U, not AK-74U) and classification (carbine, not SMG). It doesn't matter what it's called in the game. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:09, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Im trying to put the corerect designation, maybe even note there is a ak74 u and a aks74u, remember that we cant say a gun has a folding stock if it has NO stock. a 7.5 inch barreled ar with a stock is a carbine, taking the stock of its an ar pistol, not a ar stockless rifle.

But "AK-74U" is ''not'' the correct designation. Look at the [[I Am Legend]] page and you'll note that even though Will Smith's AR is modified to appear as an M4A1 in the movie, we still classify it based on what it ''came out of the factory as'', a Colt Law Enforcement Carbine. Also not that the most recent AK iterations as well as the AN-94 all have side-folding stocks, yet no "S" in their designations. Your AR "pistol" comparison also has no validity in that those so-called "pistols" all fire the same full-sized .223 cal./5.56mm ammunition and as such are pistols ''in name only''. So like HashiriyaR32 said, unless you can provide proof of an actual real life AK-74 carbine ''factory-produced'' without a folding stock and bearing the in-game designation, it stays AKS-74U. You're in the domain of the "gun nerds" and real life fact takes priority over in-game fiction. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:38, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

I've got to say I totally back Spartan. There isnt such a designation as the AK-74U, and while the 'S' does signify the side folding stock, if you took an AKS-74 and removed the stock, would you call it a regular AK-74? [[User:Chablar|Chablar]]

==Accuracy of Game==
I have Black Ops and have beaten the campaign, while the missions range from 1961 to 1968 the game is LOADED with anachronisms, im not sure an alternate reality would explain for having FAMAS F1s ( ''In fact, FELIN´s'' --[[User:Werc|Werc]]) and AUG A1s in the 1960s. Also they have the M16 in Vietnam with a so-called Masterkey system on it, im not sure that they had Masterkeys in Vietnam but it looks to be an Ithaca 37 stakeout attatched to the M16, also nearly ALL of the NVA soldiers are armed with SPAS-12 which is completely wierd. Any comments from people who have played the game?
: Yeah, you are right. If this game would be atleast fun. But its boring, MP is even worse than in MW2 ( ''And MW2 had worst MP of all'' ''times'' ), SP is boring like hell. There is nothin such as AI. Storyline is boring an unoriginal. Weapons are both anachronistic and unrealistic. Nothing like kicback even on Mosin Nagant ? '''THIS GAME SUCKS, just like MW2 did''' --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:09, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
::Do you get a nickel from EA every time you rag on the game? And there are many things I can say about the story, but "unoriginal" is not one of them. I have yet to play another FPS where the player is mentally ill and one of the main characters is merely a hallucination. (Unless there's an "A Beautiful Mind" FPS I don't know about.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:50, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

well i enjoyed it , and if i tape a shotgun under the barrel of my M16 why cant i call it a masterkey . simmons 8492

I know that most of the weapons in the game are anachronistic and that's a little bit sad for a cold war game, but a lot of those firearms are never seen in video games, that's one thing that made me like it. Perhaps,I enjoyed the stroryline from the begining to the end, I love the Zombie mode and the multiplayer is great (at least when I play with my friends). --[[User:VillageFroid|VillageFroid]] 19:19, November 11 2010 (UTC)
:If you guys are wondering, the Masterkey was invented around the 1980s and 1990s so it's anachronistic for it to be there. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:27, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

==AKS74U a RIFLE, not a SMG!!!!==

It seems like its cool to put the 74u as a subgun these days, WTF. Its a Short carbine.
:It's an SMG.
:: '''LoL.'''
::Traditionally, a carbine is defined as a shorter variant of a full sized rifle, which the AKS-74U clearly is. The definition is a bit looser today. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:54, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:::The AKS-74U is a Carbine, meaning shortened assault rifle. The AK-74 is the main model. The "S" means its a Carbine. The "U" means it has a folding stock. --ZEER
:::: No :) "S" ( Sklopnyj - somehing like "foldable") means folding stock and "U" ( Ukrochenyj - Shortened ) means carbine :)
::::: "Sklopnyj" - from what language is this word? In Russian is no such word. At least I have in 41 years that have not heard:) In Russian "foldable" sounds - "Skladnoy". But also begins with the letter S.[[User:Slow Rider|Slow Rider]] 21:41, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

An SMG is a machine gun shooting pistol caliber rounds, which 5.45x39mm doesn't qualify as.

At least this time around they managed to get the name of the gun right. :/ [[Special:Contributions/124.148.203.141|124.148.203.141]] 07:41, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

A carbine is a short rifle, not a shortened assault rifle. I don't think the Mosin Nagant is a assault rifle or the M44 Carbine Mosin Nagant is a shortened assault rifle. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:38, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:From tactical point of view AKS-74U can be classified as SMG because of its size, as well as Mk 18, 9A-91, SR3 etc. But from a technical view all those are of course ultra-short assault rifles.

Just to confuse everyone a bit more, Colt marketed the CAR-15 as a Sub-machine Gun. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:02, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

::The manufacturers are actively MARKETING these ultra short full auto 'carbines' to fulfill the submachine gun role in both military and law enforcement applications (both The M16 and the AKs have been sold this way). That's why people call them SMGs. The guns makers routinely muddy the waters as to the difference between the two definitions themselves. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 14:49, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

:::Guys, IMFDB has always classified the AKS-74U as an assault rifle (see my recent page for the movie ''[[Icarus]]'', for example). It may be used in the submachine gun role, but it is a derivative of the AK-74, which is unmistakably an assault rifle. So I am going to defer to tradition here; we have to be consistent.

:::Also, bear in mind that the original AK-47 (the weapon we all think of as the classic assault rifle) was once thought of as a submachine gun in many of the armed forces that carried it (including the People's Liberation Army of China). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:53, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

::::Video Games are ruining young minds. assault rifles shoot rifle rounds, not pistol rounds. put down the Modern Warfare and Bad Company.

It's an Intermediate rifle, like the P90 or MP7A1, slightly smaller caliber but with an effective range between a rifle's range and a sub gun's range.
:No, that is an incorrect comparison. The AK-74U is just a compact rifle since it fires an assault rifle round, not an assault rifle "styled" rifle. The P90 and the MP7 are designed from the ground up to be PDWs that fired ammo that are necked down rifle rounds instead of pistol rounds designed with the same armor piercing power as the full size rifle. It's like the Colt Model 733 or the 933 or any of the other shorten assault rifle variants. A submachine gun is always compared to weapons that fire pistol caliber ammo. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:15, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

But weapons like the SAM-R use the same caliber as 933 and 733, 5.56x45, and the SAM-R is used as a DMR. i doubt the 5.45x39 could be a marksman rifle cartridge. even though its longer than the 5.7 or 4.6, its range and accuracy are not that of a true assault rifle.

==IGN reviews the Call of Duty: Black Ops trailer==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=292tCSCvFQY

I wish that IGN would actually hire people who know what the hell they're talking about, instead of a couple of conceited pricks who think that the M4 Carbine assault rifle existed thirty years before it was produced. Not to mention the fact that they also erroneously refer to it as "a machine gun" and the Steyr AUG assault rifle series as "submachine guns". [[Special:Contributions/203.59.108.117|203.59.108.117]] 11:36, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
::nerd rage
: You gotta cut people some slack when it comes to these kind of things, why would we expect the guys who analyze video game trailers to know any more about guns than what they see in video games? Although calling the AUG a sub-machine gun was pretty boneheaded...[[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:03, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well even though the M4 Carbine wasn't around at the time. This game takes place during the Cold War, Vietnam, and the rest of the time period was not yet announced. You can't be sure when the game takes place until you see it, even though they announced an era, they didn't announce a time line. I'm sure you know that the M4 was made to replace the CAR-15, but the SOG got their hands on the newest weapons before they went into service. Which means, once the M4 was made, it would be sent straight to them. And besides, like he said, its just a game.

::I love how the only defense for the anachronistic weapons is "SOG got it before everyone else". That must mean that when US Army Rangers charged up onto Omaha Beach in 1944, they must have had M4A1s and M16A4s kitted out with EOTechs, Aimpoints, ACOGs, and PEQ-16 laser/light modules, right? Or when SEALs were hunting VC in the Mekong Delta, they must have had SCARs and M249s, right? Or how about the Battle of the Alamo, where Davy Crockett was picking off Mexican soldiers with an XM29 OICW, right? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:38, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

: Yes the excuse is a bit weak, but don't you think that analogy is a bit extreme? So far the differences have only been maybe 2 or 3 years, not 20 or 30 like in your analogy. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 14:41, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

We've been having this reoccuring conversation that the AR-15 in the game should not exist at all. There might have been conceptual designs for a flat top AR-15 carbine, but it isn't like SOG could hold up a picture of an M4 that hasnt been thought up yet and tell some gunsmith to make this with flip up iron sights, which also shouldnt exist. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:51, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Now I'm actually hearing rumors is that this is an alternate history themed game, so that would just debunk weapons that shouldn't exist if it is alternate history [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:54, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

: Oh I wasn't even thinking of the wierd AR-15 when I said that, I guess you're right. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:07, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

:So what if ''Call of Duty: Black Ops'' takes place in an alternate timeline? ''Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater'' and ''Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker'' feature alternate histories and yet they still managed to retain a sense of realism when it came to firearms. Treyarch needs to take a leaf out of Kojima Productions' book. Also, while we're at it, I wonder just how much they have paid these so called SOG veterans to keep their mouths shut about the inconsistencies of this game and instead talk about how their old buddies in the unit regularly included crossbows (equipped with explosive rounds, no less) in their field arsenal while completing missions. [[Special:Contributions/203.206.7.125|203.206.7.125]] 06:03, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

==zombie mode==
Hey guys, Zombie mode on Black Ops includes 2 maps, each bringing there own unique cast of characters
-Kind Der Untoten-
-All classic Nazi Zombies Characters

-Five-
-Fidel Castro (Holding Colt Python)
-John F. Kennedy (Holding China Lake Launcher)
-Richard Nixon
-Robert McNamara
These maps i have not played that much but from what i have there are these weapons
-Kind Der Untoten-
-Olympia (Over & Under)
-Walther MPL
-PM-63
-MP-40
-Mystery Box (Any number of assorted weapons)

-Five-
-Olympia
-Walther MPL

-will they have it? It is treyarch, but i havent heard anything solid yet.
:The article that I read (and summarized below) seemed to indicate that they had something other than zombies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:22, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Hopefully not copying spec ops.....

Maybe it's aliens.

Area 51 anyone? Eh? Eh? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 22:17, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

its been confermed . for news hit up black ops 24/7 . they dont have 100 percent accurate weapons lists but its the best site out there

==What's the type of grenade under the M18 smoke grenade on the breaching artwork?==

Is it just me, or there's some type of White Phosphorus grenade under M18 smoke grenade on the breaching artwork? The guy who wields the MAC-10 has it. http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/1458/uknowngrenade.jpg

Here is the original version: http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100522160405/callofduty/images/4/4b/100355837.jpg

==add m16 to page==

It was delted since there was no in game footage, but then there is a m16 slung to the main guy's back on the cover. i say add it. I know theres no in ge screenshot yet, but look, theres no in game shots of 1911s either.

Buddy, that stuff has been added already-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

m16 has been removed, only "ar-15 carbine" is there.

==='''M16 is in.'''===

I am not sure which version is that, but i added it as A1.
:I see no forward assist and a three-prong flash hider in the screenshots, so it looks to be an original M16. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:05, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

It have been confirmed in '''Call of Duty:Black ops INSIGHT''' trailer.

Oh crap, they mentioned Sonny Puzikas, I remember that name from the spetsnaz episode of Deadliest Warrior.

==Weapons that would make sense==
M72, M60, M14, Stoner 63, M40A1, M16A1, MAC-10, Remington 1100, Smith & Wesson M76, Browning Hi-Power, Hawk MM1, Smith & Wesson 39

AK-47, AK-74, Mosin-Nagant, PM Makarov, Steckin APS, SKS, Dragnnov, PKM

-Add any other weapons that would make sense
:M3A1 "Grease Gun"/Suppressed M3A1, Carl Gustav M/45/Suppressed M/45, suppressed Uzi, CAR-15 w/CGL or M203, Ithaca 37, Remington 870, Remington 7188 Automatic Shotgun, SOG modified RPD, M-60 "Death Machine"(M-60 w/ cut down barrel and ammo pack), HK-33(Harrington and Richardson T223).
:RPD, MAT-49/suppressed MAT-49--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 13:08, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Dirty Harry's Smith & Wesson Model 29 and Tony Montana's "Little Friend"
:What the hell do you have with those movie guns ? Why should they be in ?

It would be amazing to see Sa. Vz. 58 there. It was frequently used by vietcong fighters as USSR´s help.

::The M60D, the M1928 Thompson, the PPSh-41, the StG44, the Winchester 1200, the RPG-2, the SKS, Norinco Type 54, M1 Carbine, and the Sten. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 00:14, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

:::It would be good if they could do a proper tactical reload? If you reload a gun with a round in the chamber you will have an extra round which means you should have a 31 rounds on let's say an M16A2.

''''''Some good proofs''' :'''

http://nam64-75.hill.cz/download/file.php?id=691&sid=c3ccbd4348543db02c420df186cb428c ('' '''NVA training''''' )

http://www.quansuvn.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=41.0;attach=4972;image

http://nam64-75.hill.cz/download/file.php?id=1169 ('' '''SSG Patrick Tadina with his Vz. 58''''' )

http://www.psywarrior.com/rewardforguns.gif ( '''''Vietcong fighters firearms info poster, left side, third from down''''' )

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/1164/biethaisamopal9wq.jpg ( '''''Captured Vz. 58 on left''''' )

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff164/joshuadowdle/Dad.jpg ( '''''In hands of SSG Patrick Tadina''''' )

''SSG Patrick Tadina - Legendary, five-tour Vietnam ranger. He is in rangers´s hall of fame.''
Lee Enfield SMLE/ Jungle Carbine, M1 carbine, M2 carbine, SKS, Webley, Skorpion, M1 grand, RPG-2[[User:Greywolverene|Greywolverene]]

==Should be==
There should be M72 LAWs, M60s and M14s. cause this is Vietnam baby!

Nah. They just arent cool enough for Treyarch. And if they will add those weapons - They will all have RIS rails, scopes, lasers, GL attachemnts, silencers.... --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 11:16, 15 June 2010 (UTC)No need for your cheap sarcasm here. This game doesn't seems to pursue that Nam atmosphere with rocknroll, massive chopper assaults, jungle patrols and "smell of napalm in the morning"

I'm sure you will also be able to pick up laser weapons and crap like that. [[User:SargeOverkill]]

if anything there going to have those guns , and ruinthem buy adding rails and underbarell shit.simmons8492

==E3==

Added E3 screens - .357 Python and AR15 .

== Not an AK-47 ==
Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that the mag isn't curved enough to be a 7.62x39 mag? It could be a -74 prototype, without the flash hider. Given the time frame, this may make sense.

Thanks for that, I also didn't note it before. It looks to be a WASR-2/3.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 16:19, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

:This game seems to have a lot of rendering issues when it comes to the guns [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:40, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
OMG it is damn videogame for god's sake, the guns aren't real and are nothing more than 3d drawings -of course they aren't going to be exactly like such and such gun. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 17:08, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

'''3D drawning''' ? Hell, that would be interesting. And GTFO, this is '''firearms site''' and ''YES'', we care about reality. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 17:44, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

:Thanks for pointing that out. We are a gun site and we pay attention to details. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:24, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
Well guess what, THESE ARENT GUNS!!! They aren't effing real they are nothing more than 3d models that someone threw together in 3DS MAX or whatever the hell they use so of course its not going to be up to every detail, That's why I don't do VG pages anymore--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 19:47, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

::You appear to have missed the point of this website...

::Yea. The prop guns in movies aren't real, or air-soft guns. This website is for identifying fire arms, and if you didn't know that then you obviously missed the point of the website, like he said.

AsAstra, the point that I don't think you're understanding, is that even if they're merely three dimensional renderings of the guns, and not the guns themselves, we should try to be as correct as possible. If something says that it's an Ak-74, but actually looks more like a different gun, we should call it the different gun, so as not to confuse anyone new to the site. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 15:53, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

On the topic of the AK, knowing video game developers the AK being used by the Vietcong will most likely be the same one in those snow picks. I don't think we can call it a 47 right of the bat.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

Fixed the WASR-2 messup. It's not a WASR-2. NO WASR series of rifles have the stamped steel MAGWELL DIMPLES. When looking at the screenshots the AK in game HAS those magwell dimples. That right there shows it's not a WASR.
Some people are still saying it could be WASR-2. It's not a WASR-2. WASR-2's are new production (within the past few years) rifles from Romania made ONLY for semi-automatic use and for importation into the US. There's no way on God's green earth that the rifle in game is a WASR-2.

More than likely this is just an AK-47 with an incorrectly modeled mag. They ARE modeling these things after airsoft guns ya know.

== Degtyarov ==
It just cant be DPM. Lok - It totally doesnt have ironsights - And MAG isnt on top. + Its very unlikely some guy will cary Spas12 and Degtyarev. I just think its some AK type - Or it may be some different gun, but it isnt Degtyarev.
You may keep it there, but it will be false information.

==ummmm==
This page really needs a cleanup or a deletion.
There is also too much informal talk on the page itself, infact all of it is. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 04:47, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

===Moved from main page--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 04:49, 2 May 2010 (UTC)===
== AR-10 ==

Another unknown M16 family gun. But this one seems more like [[Armalite AR-10]] A4

[[Image:AR10-4.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Armalite AR-10 A4 7.62x51mm.]]
[[Image:AR10.JPG|thumb|none|400px|M16 Family unknown gun as appeared in Black Ops teaser.]]

:The magazine seems too long to be an AR-10
::Thats looking a bit like a STANAG Magazine. The STANAG Magazines are compatible with many NATO weapons, including the SCAR-L Carbine, the M4 Carbine and the M16 Rifle. Even if it were an AR-10 its likely that it would be chambered for the standard NATO round and accept the STANAG type magazine.

Also the AR10 is a civilian gun right? So why would special forces like that guy above be holding it? I personally think its an M16(either A1 or A2) with a scope attached to its carrying handle/iron sight.

:It's a strange AR-15 Carbine with a flat top [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:20, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

AR-10 is not necessarily civilian. It is entirely possible that SOF would use one.

I think is not AR10.AR10 use .308 or 7.62x51mm round and the magazine large and short than AR15.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

: Its uselles to keep AR-10 discussion here. We all know its that ankward AR-15 or XM177 or whatever.

== Un-identified guns ==

[[Image:MP5G3.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''1''' : Possibly [[MP5]] or [[G3]].]]
[[Image:UNKNOWNLOL.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''2''' : I totally dont know.But it may be some russian one.]]
It seems to look like a [[MAC-10]] or an [[Uzi]] with the stock extended-[[User:SargeOverkill]]
[[Image:UNKNOWN THE MOST.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''4''' : Its hard to tell which gun this one is, but it looks like [[Beretta AR-70/223]] or Daewoo K2. I think that this gun could be any gun I see and AK there but it could be a siper rifle for all we know]]
As to the first unknown gun, it's too short to be a G3, so I believe it's an MP5. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:50, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

im not sure but with those ironsites id say a g36 . i hope they brink the one from COD4 back i loved it. simmons 8492

In black ops there appears also a weapon that an elicoptero is in use for throwing .. it appears in the game in the level 2 as harpoon
[[Image:Harpoon.jgp]]

Unidentified gun No.4 looks like a Galil.---Matchgradeweapon

== RPK ==

From the looks of it, it might be an RPK-74. Note the 45-round banana mag and the flash suppressor.

The "RPK" and the "Valmet" are the same guns - look carefully at the screenshot. Given that the 7.62mm AK-47 appears in game and the timeline, I'm gonna say that it's not an RPK-74, but a 7.62x39mm RPK or one made to look like a Valmet for some reason. Maybe Treyarch modelers are using 80's action movies as a reference for their RPK model. *shakes head*

No. Look on that "RPK" an you will see typical RPK stock. Look on "Valmet" and you will see it doesnt look like Valmet :)--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 03:53, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Look at the front of the Valmet trigger guard. Now look at that same exact place on the "Valmet" in the game picture. Different. There is no Valmet, it's an RPK.

Moved "Unknown LMG" stuff to the RPK-74 section. Whoever posted those images under there originally failed to notice the way the RPK-74 front sight is canted compared to the Valmet. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 14:18, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

==M1911==

In the title screen there is a soldier holding a 1911 i believe it also says something on the side.

It says "Sally" on the slide.

The 1911 looks more like the first and not the A1, look at the ejection port.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:17, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Here's to hoping it's 1911s will be in the arsenal in multi-player, and not the tease in MW2 --[[Special:Contributions/67.181.114.114|67.181.114.114]] 07:13, 1 June 2010 (UTC)JanG

well am i the only one who thinks WAW did a horible job of represting the stoping power of the .45 . i mean the gun does nothing in the game , but in real life its a man stoper. simmons 8492

Game balance. That's why [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:36, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

i under stand but the walther is better in that game than the 1911. at least the .45 in COD4 had some good stopingpower to it . i know its a diffrent model but still . simmons 8492

and lucky for me , the boys at trayarc made the M1911A1 the manstoper that it is .SEMPER FI!!! simmons 8492

one thing i noticed is that some times the player racks the slide and it stays back like its empty . i dont get it. simmons 8492

Its a useless flair that can be done with a real gun by pushing up on the Slide release as you pull it back and then release it after its locked. I did it on my Hi Power after seeing it.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:30, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

== good decision ==

As well as Weapon customization there will also be a character customization feature.
- That game is gonna be just awesome. Character customization ? Damn, just in R6:V style (ha-ha)

* Custom characters? hell yeah --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 00:38, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
i agree with that customization policy, i liked how in R6V2 they did that, and i can only hope they bring back CoD4s M4A1 Grenadier back, and i also completely agree with the historic battle/ war thing as compared to a (***Spoiler) nuclear warfare and a domestic terrorist plot, i would much rather see Black Hawk Down pop up in a newer game as opposed to Vietnam, but i would settle for a Operation Acid Gambit type game also.

Customizable characters in a game where... you can't actually ''see'' the character? FAIL.
* Customizable characters in game where will be 3rd person mode, and where other players can see it ? Your post '''fail'''.
:When did Black Ops become third person? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 00:42, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

It isn't. He's saying that other characters will see your 3rd person form. Also, it's noteworthy that MW2 DID have third person mode.
:So then I've gotta agree. Character customization in a game where you can't actually see your guy seems like a fail to me, too. It's not like anybody in MP is really gonna stop shooting at you to say "hey, cool guy, what kind of vest is that?" And how do I activate this third person mode in MW2? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:50, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

:: Well, i dont know. But what about trying "3RD PERSON" in "Play" screen ?

I think it's hilarious how people are whinig about the customization... Go play R6. Custom characters work in FPS games.
:Yeah, i bought R6:V2 not so long ago and its amazing. I think that game has best character customization ever. Its only pity you cant do anything with your teammates.
:R6V also has a cover system where you can actually ''see'' the guy/girl you're playing as, a third person mode cheat, and player characters who actually have voices and speak rather than being mutes with no form of personality whatsoever, none of which Black Ops has. I simply think character customization is unnecessary. That's not whining, it's called ''having an opinion". [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:09, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

How does the post fail it was an update its not like i'm wrong. its not like i said there would be some sort of Grizzly Bear cannon. it was a NEWS UPDATE!!! THINK next time a stupid comment is thought by yourself.
Also heres the ANSWER the other players can see you just like AVP. so thats how customization comes in handy. [[user:moviemaster1993|moviemaster1993]]
:First off, I never said ''your post'' failed. That was ''your'' response to ''me'', smart ass. I was commenting on a feature of the game I think is unnecessary, something I'm fully allowed to do. You aren't the lord of opinions around here. Second, comparing Rainbow Six to Call of Duty is about as much of a failure as one can accomplish. Lastly, who the hell cares if another player can see you? I wouldn't be customizing my character for other people, just like other people aren't going to be customizing their characters for me. It's not like everybody's gonna stop shooting and comment on every other player's individual character, is it? The only stupid comments on here are coming from ''you''. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:30, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

I think it's more for identification than anything. So if you're pissed at one guy, you can just look at him ans say "Hey it's that one guy, Imma kill 'em", instead of reading the little tiny red words above their head that is often jibberish anyway. Just my opinion, though. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:45, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

== MP5k ==

You think they're putting that in there to copy MW2?
:No I think they're doing it to fulfill their MP5 quota. MW2 wasn't the first game to feature the MP5K, broski.-protoAuthor 00:23, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't know about that. They also have an AUG in the game and a SPAS-12. Not a coincidence that MW2 also has these. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

- Heh. Spas and AUG were in tons of other games. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

But THIS game is directly part of the COD franchise. It's a bit repetitive to show guns that has been in previous games. Well ok WWII games don't count because they cant help having the same guns, but this is supposed to be Treyarch's turn at making a new game, but so far, none of the weapons are new. What about instead of the SPAS-12, we get an 870, or instead of the AUG, we get...any other bullpup rifle of the time. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:36, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm thinkin' maybe they showed off the MW2 guns first to get MW2 fans interested in this game. Then maybe later they'll show off some new guns. Here's to hopin'. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 22:29, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I derinitely think they're putting the MP5k in to copy MW2. They could have put in any other variant of the MP5, variants that weren't in prototype stage and would probably be more combat effective, but they went with the k variant. That said I don't think it's any coincidence the SPAS-12 and AUG is in there either.

You don't get the fans back with the same old guns. You draw interests with NEW guns that hasn't been used before. Variety and distinctions. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Well, Treyarch apparently didnt start copying first. MW2´s specops get idea fairly sure from WaW´s coop system :D
:The latest issue of the official xbox magazine says that they originally had planned on having co-op throughout the entire campaign in MW2, but cut it because it messed with the narrative. Or, it would've been way too fun. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:06, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
the AUG was stupid in the game, no1 in USSOCOM uses that gun
* Would you mind telling what do you have against bullpup designs, beside "the looks"?--[[User:WhiteSlift|WhiteSlift]] 11:58, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
* Heh. MP5k get into service 20 years after Vietnam war. There was only prototype in latest parts pf Vietnam war. MAC10 or UZI would be much more realistic in hands of US soldiers. Atleast much more than prototype gun. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:49, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
*"MP5K get into service 20 years after Vietnam war"...the MP5K isn't that new. Considering that the war ended in 1975, and the MP5K was introduced in 1976, you are way off.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 01:30, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

true why would they be carrying a Prototype in to combat

Well how much differently could essentially just a shortened MP5 with a foregrip work from the regular MP5?

Because it's a video game that doesn't care about accuracy and realism. I mean what loser actually waits until Picatinny rails to be invented? Go ahead and put them on your rifle in Nam, it's the new trend.

Why are you complaining about the AUG in particular, I mean USSOCOM doesn't use it? Yeah, well they sure as hell don't use the deagle or the AA12 or the FAMAS but I don't see you complaining

"I mean what loser actually waits until Picatinny rails to be invented?" Picatinny rails have been around since 1913, broski.
:Not in their modern version, Broseph Stalin.

You all are forgetting..this is SOG, not SOCOM. SOG could carry into battle whatever they wanted to. Could they have carried a prototype MP5K? Sure! Keep in mind..they had access to stuff that NOBODY ELSE in the military had access to at that time. Hell..one time they brought an airhorn with them and scared the crap out of an entire NVA division with it.
:Look, I can understand having access to weapons no one has ever heard of at the time, but you can't have access to weapons if it doesnt EXIST in the world yet. I mean just because they are SOG doesn't mean they have their own special gunsmith to factory make new parts and designs for weapons that haven't been thought up yet. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:21, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

== What the hell is up with this AR-15 Carbine? ==

It looks like a 733, but at the same time, not since it also has a flat top, but the scenes in the trailer that showed this rifle is assumed to be Vietnam era, so a flat top AR-15 shouldn't exist at the time much less a rail system for it. Also the same AR also has a rear iron sight on the flat top. This doesn't make sense [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

- I think its XM177, but customized way to much. Its mucb more possible that Treyarch just failed. I think they just added rail system/flat top just because MP. You know, attachments. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

::It cannot be an XM177 if it has a flattop receiver. Those did not exist when the XM177s were introduced. The flash hider is also Vortex, not the XM177-type. The game's 3D artists might have been ignorant about what AR carbines existed at the time. But that is not an XM177. Not by a long shot. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 05:23, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I think the game's 3D rendering tech was mostly like stone because it's the 60s and 70s, but the trailer animation is horrible! I could barely tell what was going on and the weapon details are no where like MW2. Say what you want about MW2 when it comes to consistencies, but at least they can render their weapons correctly. My first upload of that funky AR-15 shows the handguard as this polygon like thing. And did flat top receivers exist during Nam? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:34, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

:::''And did flat top receivers exist during Nam?''

:::No, not at all. My recollection is that the Colt ACR (introduced in the 1980s) was the first AR-type rifle to feature a flattop receiver. Even though the ACR was a bust, flattops were subsequently carried over into future AR generations. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 05:39, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

With these seemingly anachronistic flat top recievers and flip up sights I think this game is headed towards failure. Seems like they're taking the MW2 route and making their "balanced" and cosmetically changed multiplayer weapons also appear in single player. I hope by some miracle they don't or else they don't get my money.

:And here I remember talking to my brother about how they can fuck up the M16 by either putting A2s or burst A1s, but this is WAY over there in the incorrect area. Haven't they seen any Nam movies? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:03, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

: Excalibur01 - or use five minutes just f-i-v-e f**king minutes of their time and try to google some Vietnam-era photos. Or they could hire someone with at least basic knowledge of era background and weaponery. You know, they spent money on countless other things. But I guess that Call of Duty is now like B-rated action movies. Make as many as you can and don't worry about the quality. Nobody gives a s*it about how it looks like or if it is correct as far as it would look cool and geek teen age kiddos would pay the money so they could play multiplayer on their lagging net servers. [Ragnar - 22:25, 19 May 2010]

Hopefully they at least have the M16 have full auto instead of burst, would make it more fun that way. I did read that this isn't taking place in vietnam on yahoo news which probably is incorrect but this is ridulous of the weapons they are putting in.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:48, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

:I read an IGN article that it'll take place throughout the Cold War, from the end of Nam to Cuba and also Princess Gates London [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:17, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

I researched the history of picatinny rails, turns out Treyarch may have actually done very good research. This is what I found: "The MIL-STD-1913 standard was developed out of efforts during the M16A1 Product Improvement Program which eventually resulted in the M16A2. One of the abandoned ideas was a receiver with a built-in rail. In the 1970s, Rock Island Arsenal experimented with a sniper AR-10 with a Weaver rail. In Vietnam, the Model 656 had a built-in rail." Source:http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/archive/index.php/t-18737.html
I don't know about you guys, but I'm now willing to believe the rails on this AR (Model 656?) isn't a goof at all.
:Well, its always good to know new thing :) But i think it still wasnt regular Vietnam equipment. And i also think there wont be even M16 or M16A1 ingame.--[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:35, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
::True, it wasn't regular Vietnam equipment. But these aren't regular soldiers either. These guys are top secret black ops, higher than tier one operators. They can use any weapon in the world, even ones that are in secret development. And you're probably right, I doubt there'll be an M16, simply because these experimental ARs look cooler, have a bit of mystery around them, and can accept multiple attachments. But I wouldn't be surprised if they name the rifles M16.

The model 656 looked like this:

[[Image:model 656.jpg]]

It was just an early M16 with an early style rail system. So far, I have not found images of a Carbine with these types of rails, experimental or not. Rails were not on the forefront of military minds before the 90s. The military didn't even decided to put rails on the M16 until a decade after the M4 came out. And even the Model 656 rails were not on a flat top receiver like the ones on an M4. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 13:57, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
:Aw crap, there goes my theory. Looks like it's back to just being a Treyarch fail.

I'm not one to justify inaccuracy in videogames but, the upper receiver on the 656 could easily be swapped with that of an AR-15 carbine. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 00:50, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Sure...but the one we see in the game is not the same rail receiver as the one the 656 has. It has a flat top like an M4 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:22, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

I just noticed that the front sight isn't removed when an optic attachment is present, an improvement over other COD games. Maybe Treyarch realized an AR would be bolt-action if the gas block was removed.
:Low-profile gas block is not visible from first-person perspective. And 3-d person gun models were made as low-poly as possible to minimise system loads(this was crucial because games was intended for Xbox in first place)

Who know CAR-15 with rear flip up sight use in vietnam war? I see a south vietnam flag in picture.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]
: No. Though, prototype flat-top receiver and flip-up like on your screen could be possible, but it just doesn't look authentic to the time period. I wouldn't mind if they put in something like Model 656(pictured above). But they really need to get rid of that modern-looking AR.
[[Image:CODBOAR-15b.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

It's just like the Aperature sight in W@W, but no where near as bad. I don't see why people are making such a big deal out of it, sure it's not exactly authentic, but it's far from game ruining like what a lot of people here are saying.

== Complaints ==
Hey, it's a game, not a history lesson. It's all about fun and style and so. I do like a realistic movie or game, but I don't hate a game just because the artists created something they think it's better this way. Nobody complains when a director sums up a car ride that would take 1 hour in real life in one scene in the movie, or when he puts the light where the sun can never be just to make it look good, but when someone puts a cool looking AUG in a game set before 1977, because it looks cool, or creates his own creative vision of an AR-15 everyone freaks out. All the time you hear people say "They should have done better research!" or "They don't know anything about history!", but maybe the did research, and they know history, and they discussed it and decided that they want to create something own, because they feel it fits better in their creative work than what real life history can give them.

*Yeah, you are right. Now we need M1 Abrahams tank in some Napoleonic Wars strategy. Cause that tank is just cool - right ? Or maybe M4 Carbine in WW2 shooter ?--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:28, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

::Treyarch is legally obligated to keep the timeline from going beyond Vietnam. [http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/03/04/the-activision-lawsuit-what-it-means-and-where-it-s-going.aspx] If that means they have to cheat a bit regarding the weapons, I'm willing to give them some leeway. Let's face it, we're probably the only people who truly care anyway. None of these inaccuracies are going to keep any of us from buying this game when it comes out and playing the heck out of it. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:41, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

They're not legally obligated to keep it from going beyond Vietnam. As that article says..all they need is full approval from West and Zampella. Considering those two aren't rampant assholes..it's a total possibility.
:That's a bit like saying other people can write Harry Potter novels as long as JK Rowling is okay with it, or other studios can make Star Wars movies as long as George Lucas is okay with it. Have you looked at the games IW has made? Have you noticed a pattern? (For those who don't want to look, all they make are CoD games. That is literally all they have going for them.) Sure, they COULD give away their golden goose and let someone develop else something Activision has given them exclusivity with, but I can't imagine a single scenario where they would. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 10:45, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

* Well, msot of CoD players wont even recognize M16 and M4 or HK416. So yep - We are maybe only ones who care about it :/ --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:44, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
::And mind you, Treyarch is the same developer that had Japanese troops using suppressed MP40s with reflex sights in WaW. Oh, and a RAY GUN TO SHOOT ZOMBIES. That being said, I was devastated when I found out that MW2 wouldn't have zombies, and I'll be even more devastated if BO doesn't have them. IMHO, zombies was the best part of WaW. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 17:39, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
* And IW had OMOH with FN2000´s and IMI Tavor´s - So whats the difference :D Hope zombies will be includeProxy-Connection: keep-alive
Cache-Control: max-age=0

too.

:Ok the Zombie thing in WaW was a side game. It's not part of the "story". If the zombies and the ray gun appeared in the actual missions, then we'd called bullshit but with a smile cause zombies are awesome to fight. The suppressors and red dot sights were for multiplayer to compete with COD4 at the time, so those don't count. We're talking historically accurate, period piece weapons. It's like we do a game taking place during the Civil War but we all got 1911s as handguns and M1 Garands as rifles. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:22, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
::You're telling me you wouldn't play a Civil War game where you can use an M1 Garand? ;)True, they tried that with Darkest of Days, but it was terribly done. And second, you CAN get the ray gun for one of the campaign missions, and it is awesome. (You can take down a tank with two shots.) But I know what you're getting at. I'm just saying we shouldn't let the nitty gritty get in the way of good gameplay, especially since Treyarch already has one hand legally tied behind their backs. Would they want to make a Modern Warfare-like game set in present day or the near future? Sure, but they can't, they're legally handcuffed to inflexible historical fact. Besides, no game has ever gotten its weapons exactly right. We have an entire generation of kids who believe an M1 Garand can't be reloaded without firing the entire clip, or it has less stopping power than a K98K. I won't lose any sleep if BO has AR-15s with flat top receivers, but I will if the game sucks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 06:34, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
You know if there gonna screw this game why don't the just add a bunch of laser guns or crap. I mean i could understand if the weapons in the game where off, but i have a feeling this game is going to be a cluster F***
::We're basing a lot on two trailers and some scanned images from a magazine 5.5 months from release. I'm going to reserve judgment until I actually play it or at least hear from people who have actually played it. Treyarch has little to lose here. If it's great, people will praise them, if it's not, people already think they're the Fredo Corleone to IW's Michael Corleone in the Activision family. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:40, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
:::And while we're here, we've been talking about how the angle of the AK mag is slightly off, but is anyone else annoyed that if you do a tactical reload and drop half a mag, those rounds in the discarded mag magically go back into your ammo stockpile and you don't lose them? This has been true in 99.7% of all FPS's I've ever played. Gamers have accepted the idea of the consequence-free tactical reload for over a decade now. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:40, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::::You're right it's a crying shame. Not only because it's more accurate when the game keeps track of ammo in specific mags but it also adds another challenge and element of strategy. I also enjoy the one game I've played that keeps track of the +1 round in your gun when you reload. I wish more games were like that. Sad thing is I don't see COD heading in the right direction ever again.
:::::The one time I saw them do the tactical reload correctly was... Navy SEALs Quake, a mod for Quake II. Yes, it was a mod made by amateurs over ten years ago. The big game companies aren't doing it right because they don't want to. I remember the first time I played a game that had different animations for reloading with a round in the chamber and one without. Operation Winback on the N64, also ten years ago. It was a nice touch. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:48, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::::::'''Operation Flashpoint''', '''Rainbow Six: Raven Shield''' and '''Insurgency''' all did tactical reloads properly (ammunition is a number of magazines, not bullets, and if you reload a partially-empty mag it goes back in the pool), and the latter two also simulated +1 capacity. Insurgency is a mod but the other two are retail games. --[[User:MattyDienhoff|MattyDienhoff]] 20:00, 23 July 2010 (UTC)

* But we arent complaining here about animation and bullet system, damn. We are critising look of those guns ! That stramge XM177/AR15 hybrid was seen many times in reveal trailer, so we can judge it. And it failed. Its still better when you have realistic gun without realistic ammo system than crazy-unrealistic looking gun with realistic ammo system. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:06, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::I don't think it'd be that hard to replace the skin. [[Black]] didn't give a damn about realism, but it was still enjoyable as hell. The way I see it, ultimately, it's just a game, to be played because it's fun, not as an interactive history lesson. If you want accuracy, watch the Military Channel or actually go out to the range. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:48, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::: Well, it doesnt have to be "interactive history lesson" but atleast a bit of realism would be nice. '''''BTW''': I visit shooting range once or twice in month :)''

As pointed out, we don't want TOTAL realism. Otherwise, one bullet hit to the chest is enough to kill you. At least head shots are instant kills in the game. But we're doing a game based on a particular period and it has to be accurate. I mean, if you were watching a WWI movie and see soldiers with M16s. That's a bit jarring right? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:03, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
:: Now he will answer it isnt jarring. If the movie has cool effects and famous actors.
:::Jarring, maybe, but I don't know if it'd ruin it for me. (Is it a sci-fi film? Surrealism? A film by Uwe Boll?) It'd be one thing to have blatant mistakes, like M16s in WWI, but would it have ruined [[Saving Private Ryan]] if Sgt Horvath had a post war M1 Carbine with a bayonet lug and adjustable rear sights instead? Did the fact that the officers had Webley Mark VI's instead of Adams Mark III's ruin [[Zulu]]? Did the fake M72 LAW in [[Ronin]] take you out of the movie? If it didn't, it's because you chalked it up as a goof, moved on, and enjoyed the rest of an otherwise good movie. If it did, then I don't know what to tell you. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:52, 25 May 2010
(UTC)

Here's a hypothetical question: This game is called Black Ops, so theoretically, they can make up whatever they want, what do we know, it's a black op, and thus classified. What if all the weapons in the game were all fake, either outright, or fictional modifications of real weapons? Would we still be up in arms? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:14, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
: I hate to say it but you might be onto something. I've heard rumors that Black Ops will rewrite history and take place in an alternate past. This is probably how Treyarch can get around the legal restrictions of not being able to make post-Vietnam games and explain these BS weapons. Personally I think it's pretty weak but it explains it.
:: Well, if it does... Wait-It doesnt! I read some article with one of Treyarch members which strictly denied possibility of alternate reality. Ill repat it again : its just some Treyarch modeller fail. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:39, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
It's not rewriting history at all basically it's saying that during the Cold War what if there were some Black Ops that went down to keep the whole thing from escalating into an actual official war. Which is completely possible.
:::It doesn't have to be alternate history, just a secret history. It's implied that the JFK assassination will be in the game. Is the player the second gunman on the grassy knoll? Is he supposed to stop the second gunman on the grassy knoll? Does he successfully stop a possible third gunman? They can make up anything they want in that scenario. A mission can have the player equipped with a prototype laser rifle, but it's scripted so the rifle is damaged or lost along the way, and the technology is lost forever. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:53, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

It would be great if they do include Dirty Harry's gun and Tony Montana's "Little Friend".

The Steyr AUG (Armee Universal Gewehr - Universal Army Rifle) had been in development since the late 1960s, as a replacement for venerable but obsolete Stg.58 (FN FAL) battle rifles for Austrian army. It was developed by the Austrian Steyr-Daimler-Puch company (now the Steyr-Mannlicher AG & Co KG) in close conjunction with Austrian Army.See? It's not that wrong. Got it from http://world.guns.ru/assault/as20-e.htm
:It's still wrong. Just because the AUG was in development doesn't mean a working prototype existed. And if it's supposed to be the prototype, why does the AUG in the game look like the production version, only without the grip, and not as depicted in the prototype drawing shown on the World Guns page? I think the whole prototype explanation is a lame excuse in order to include more modern weapons in the game. I would much rather see the weapons that SOG actually used included in Black Ops, instead of an assault rifle that we've seen about 5 billion times in other shooters. I already posted below how Treyarch could have used the Remington 7188 full auto shotgun in the game. This weapon was actually used in Vietnam, and as far as i know has never been used in a video game, but instead they chose the SPAS-12, which didn't exist at the time and has been used in dozens of other shooters.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 22:50, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

== Unknown ==
The rocket launcher under unknown is an M202 FLASH rocket launcher. Ashdude01 20:20 19 May 2010

Yes there is i added it to the guns page but some moron removed it

moviemaster1993 11:58 may 2010

== Carcano M91/38? ==

The images provided doesn't shot much and it is said that it can't be a mosin Nagant because the barrel is too short. Well it could be the carbine length variant or any other short barrel bolt action rifle. I can't see anything in the picture. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:26, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

It seems like its picture of that gun. Remember that game has to do something with JFK asassination and there can be barelly seen "Lee Harvey Oswald" on paper under that gun. So i think it have to be that gun - As some reference. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 03:48, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Ever heard of the Mosin Nagant M44 carbine or the finnish retooled M38?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 11:56, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

== M16 and XM177 ==

[[Image:Colts.JPG|thumb|none|500px|]]

Looks like the guy here has either an M16 as you can tell by the barrel pointing to the left and the barrel on the right looks like an XM177 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:26, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Looks like a M16A1 to me..which makes sense..since the A2 didn't come around until the early to mid 80's.

== Embargo lifts tomarrow, the 28th ==

Ones the embargo lifts we will be flooded with info, especially about guns

What embargo? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:45, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

There was an embargo for some journalist who previewed the game(they also could have played it too)and tomarrow it ends and info will get flooded all over the web

* It ended and only few informations and no new guns appeared. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 07:24, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

== Valment m78 ==
:The M78 does have its own page here, separate from the RPK. But yeah, I don't think the designers are gun-savvy enough to have both of these guns in this game.--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:55, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

What the year of Valmet M78 build? I think is not use in vietnam war the NVA don't have a finnish weapons during the war.And i think in the picture the gun is not Valmet M78.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

: And Spas-12 was in vietnam ? It may not be Valmet, but it fairly sure isnt RPK. Or another Treyarch modeller fail ? --[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 11:40, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

Anyone notice that the picture of the unknown AK-type LMG has a front sight that upright on the front side and canted forward on the back side like the RPK-74's front sight? --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 17:11, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:The Valmet M78 was invented after the production of the M76 in 1976, which is another weapon considered anachronistic for the Vietnam War era if there's any in the game. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:45, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

== Time travel (well that would explain it) ==

[http://pc.ign.com/articles/109/1093572p1.html Another preview]
--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:22, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

The page doesn't exist [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:48, 29 May 2010 (UTC)
* Fixed that link. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:49, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Launching an SR-71 from an aircraft carrier? Is that even possible? O_o [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 21:04, 30 May 2010 (UTC)
:They were able to operate a U-2 from a carrier, but that wouldn't be nearly as sexy as flying an SR-71, now would it? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:32, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't think it is, You know how these game designers do ALL of their research. (Man I'm sarcastic tonight)--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:11, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
::It's pretty obvious that since MW2, the main source of research is action movies and Futureweapons reruns.

Damn straight.

[[Special:Contributions/72.189.150.170|72.189.150.170]]

Not that I have anything against the SPAS-12, AUG, or AK47s, but we need to see different types of weapons. What about an 870, or the AK-74? What about other types of Bullpup? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:41, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

: You think 12-year old child knows difference between AK-74, AK-47 and AKs-74u ? That wont make sence..... Why making more weapons when you can add only those "cool" and overused ones ? --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 15:14, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

My 11 year old brother can, just saying-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

well the ak-74 would be good , but no one would notice the difference. most kids playing this game dont know am1911a1 from a m14 . id like to see both

== Prototypes ==

Just to let you know: German games magazine ''PC Games'' had an interview with the developers. In the latest issue, they write, that the black special ops team can get any equipment they want, including non-standard weapons, brand new prototypes and even customized and special built single pieces, <quote>which no one outside the team will ever get to see</quote>. So that is the official in-game explanation for every crude weapon you can see in the hands of the player.
:That's what I figured their reasoning would be. It makes sense but it's still a pretty weak explanation if you ask me.
:So super elite 1337 black ops delta teams can even get weapons ''that don't yet exist''? WTF? Why didn't our SF and SEALs in 'Nam have M4A1s with KAC rail systems, lasers, ACOGs, EOTechs, and bullets that can home in on enemy soldiers from 50 miles away, then??? It's a conspiracy to disarm the public, I tell you! But in all seriousness, I think it's an explanation that doesn't hold water. That mentality might work in 2016 during MW2, but not in a past setting like Vietnam where small arms development has been chronicled and we know where and to what it led. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 15:29, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
::I think it does hold water. Of course these finalized weapons weren't around in the late '60s to mid '70s. But how do you know their prototypes weren't? Most of the weapons in-game will either be early prototypes or in the case of the AR custom-built weapons made by the SOG operatives.
::Ok, they could at least make it look like prototypes, not like modern weapons.
::Okay, then how about when the next WWII game comes out, they give all the troops M16s, M60s, Mark 48s, G36s, AKMs, XM29s, and XM8s because, you know, super secret black ops teams can get any piece of kit they want, even if it doesn't exist yet. All they have to do is jump in Doc Brown's time machine, travel through time and grab the latest kit, then head back. 1.21 gigawatts! [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:03, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:::I've said it once before, if it's done well, I will absolutely play it. Most people play game as a means of escape, so would it really make a difference if I shot a Nazi with an M16 or an M1 Garand? He's not REALLY dead. He's not even real, and we've contributed nothing to the winning of WWII, or any war. In fact, we've contributed nothing but to our own satisfaction. They're called video GAMES. Playing games is about having fun. I'm sure many if us here loved Nazi Zombies from WaW. Why? Because we love shooting Nazis, and we love shooting zombies, and Treyarch did us a favor by combining the two activities. And we love it even more if we can shoot them with a ray gun that comes out of a magic box. Was it historically accurate? No, but believe me, the history major in me learned to live with it. (Hell, now you've got me all worked up, because as I'm typing this, I can't wait to get the chance to catch Hitler and bin Laden in a meeting and spray the room with a minigun.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:02, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
Ok i get your point, it's a video game, and fun or not it should have realism, i mean c'mon!-[[User:sargeOverkill]]
::::BTW, they already sort of did that with the Time Splitters series. And those games were awesome. (At least 2 and Future Perfect were. I never played 1.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:30, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:::::I quite frequently have lots and lots and lots and lots of fun playing games, especially shooters, that adhere to reality. The reason I play a Vietnam or WWII shooter is because I want to immerse myself in the environment. That includes having weapons accurate to the period. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:07, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
::::::I guess that depends if you consider these games historical or not. I just lump it in with Halo and GoW now, as CoD flew off the historical rails about two or three games ago, straight into "anything goes" territory, which was good from a story telling perspective. Even when it tried to be historical (up to CoD 2) you were still one or two men who personally killed half the German army. That's why I thought releasing WaW on Veterans Day was a backhanded tribute, because nothing honors veterans like a game that allows you to win WWII singlehandedly. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:31, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

==M14==

What with this being a Vietnam War game, I'm gonna be pretty pissed if you can't use a normal M14 rifle, without all the rails and crap.
[[Image:M14Rifle.jpg|thumb|none|500px|I want to use an M14 like this in-game]]

Well, it doesnt look cool enough. Expect it with scope, silencer, thousands of rails and plastic stock. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 18:04, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

1. They'll Probably put it in.
2. the rails are the modern demands of a soldier including the ability to easily mount optics and other accessories easily. theres nothing wrong with it.

:I'd like a regular wood stocked M14, and if you want optics, they did make a scope riser mount for M14s before rail systems. As for silencers, well that's easy, and heartbeat sensors shouldn't bother to return. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::If they want to be accurate with attachments, then they should have a sniper scope and a suppressor (suppressors were available at that time).

Randy Shughart a delta force sniper never had anything fancy on his. as stated in BlackHawk down he had a vietnam era M14, with a scope. nothing fancy there. besides in vietnam there really wasnt a need for anything fancy. silencer, hell the vietcong already knew they were there because of the helo. Lam- hadn't been invented. and a tac light is slightly useless seeing how they were in a jungle 95% of the time. [[Special:Contributions/71.194.219.9|71.194.219.9]] 01:46, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

: All of these attachments really ''WONT'' make sence. '''But its Treyarch'''.

== AUG sans grip ==

What the hell is up with the AUG without a foregrip? I don't mind the fact the AUG is anachronistic, but come on...why take off something central to firing the gun. Maybe the gun is semi-automatic in the game, because our character has to plunge his hand into a bucket of ice to stop the burning after each shot.
:Yeah, I don't understand that decision. The only possible explanation I can come up with is that they used the AUG with a grenade launcher as a model, like this one [http://www.steyr-aug.com/240.jpg], and then just deleted the grenade launcher. But this would mean that no one working on the project A) ever saw a movie with an AUG, including [[Die Hard]], which I would think every male between the ages of 21-49 in the english speaking world has seen, or B) could put two and two together and figure out that putting your hand directly on a barrel is not practical. That, or the plot involves that character severely burning his hand. If not, it's an utterly indefensible and boneheaded decision by the Treyarch staff. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:29, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
::And to be absolutely fair, the character is wearing heavy gloves while holding the barrel. But it still doesn't make sense. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:21, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

::What doesn't make sense to me is that they have a military advisor on staff. How come, at no point in the development, did this man point out that holding a gun barrel while firing is a bad idea, and has he not seen an AUG before? - Opening Poster.

::Doesn't the grip fold up?-protoAuthor
:::Yes, but you'd still be able to see it. [http://www.murdoconline.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/NEW-STEYR-AUG-right.jpg]--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:12, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:I wrote that without seeing the image. Sorry.-protoAuthor
::::I agree with the grenade launcher theory, especially since multiplayer was done first. Who knows, they might actually change the standard AUG model before the game actually comes out.

The AUG without vertical grip.I think a gun barrel is very hot.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

In third person it's just a character model fail. In first person you grip I guess what you could call the "finger guard."

I've seen pics of the Austrian Army holding their AUGs by the trigger guard like a P90 but not the barrel itself, that's stupid. Plus, who the hell in 1968 would even take a design like the AUG seriously. The M16 was just starting to be taken seriously by military brass around 1968.

......Why the hell wouldn't they take it seriously? You do know that the British had actually adopted a bullpup design in 1951 for a very short time. Search Em-2 Rifle. It even had a built in optical sight on the
carrying handle. We Yanks then bossed everybody into adopting the 7.62 and the EM-2 was abandoned because it was in the .280 round so they went with the FAL which could be much more easily changed to use the 7.62
Actually, the EM-2 would be a better choice for this game or the SA80 prototype that appeared in The Professionals. I am aware of the EM-2.
=== Bullpup guns ===

If they want bulpup gun in game why didnt they coice Em-2 ? Or Famas ? WHY THAT ANACHRONISTIC AUG, damn.
The FAMAS is even more anachronistic than the AUG. The FAMAS was adopted in the early eighties and it used a different type of 5.56 ammo than the NATO standard.

: Yeah. It get into service in eighties. But atleast there '''WERE''' first prototypes in 1968. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:04, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

ummm...the prototypes of both the FAMAS and AUG were developed in the seventies. A better choice might be the Stoner 63 which had a history of use by the Navy SEALs and other clandestine units

== OXM article ==

Official XBox Magazine did a feature on Black Ops (July 2010, issue 111,) and I figure I'd share some highlights:

- It was inspired by the book "SOG: The Secret Wars of America's Commandos," by Major John Plaster. [http://www.amazon.com/SOG-Secret-Americas-Commandos-Vietnam/dp/1581606761/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1275440842&sr=8-1]

- The SPAS-12 you use during the Tet Offensive uses Dragon's Breath rounds.

- At least from their description, the "WMD" level sound suspiciously like the airfield level in MW2.

The whole game looks suspiciously like MW2, just my opinion though. Hughjefender

- The M202 FLASH is confirmed.

- The M1911s with "Sally" etched on them also have tally marks on them.

- They mention a co-op feature that "appears to be a successor" to zombies, which seems to me would indicate no zombies. Bummer.

- Multiplayer was ready before the campaign, so some of the campaign levels are based on the multiplayer maps.

- Regarding anachronistic guns, "'In this world, anything was possible' for these soldiers, [Treyarch head Mark] Lamia explains. All equipment requests were granted by their superiors. Cost, apparently, was no object."

- And finally, a quote from the military advisor, Lt. Col. Hank Keirsey (ret) (and something I've been trying to point out for a while now) "The Historical Advisor fights to get every last bit of accuracy, but always has to concede to the need for excitement." Keirsey appears to be the military advisor for the whole franchise, not just this game or for Treyarch.

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:18, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

:Money is no object is one thing, but designing a different rifle system like you would design a James Bond car is a different thing. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:20, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

: So, basically they said those soldiers can have any gun. Come on, Treyarch ! Give them FN2000´s , Plasma Rifles and Gravity Guns !
No, really. Off course they can have special weapons. But only those which were designated before 1968. Not those which were designated 10 years after.--[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:30, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
::Yes, but since everything is secret, how do we know the CIA DIDN'T develop the AUG, or the SPAS-12, and cover it up by giving it to Steyr and Franchi, respectively? How can we be sure we DIDN'T capture any energy-based weapons from crashed UFOs? (Mind you, I don't work for Treyarch or owe them anything, but I have to give them credit for giving themselves such a clever out.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:51, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:::It seems like all these SOG's have custom-made pieces. And since Weaver rails did exist in Vietnam it would have been totally possible to make these weird AR's we keep seeing. Not saying I agree with this decision, but this is probably how Treyarch is getting away with it.

You guys are so wrong, My friend the NAVY SEAL told me something not to tell anyone else but I don't care. They are issued laser rifles just like the ones in Fallout 3 but have a disntegration setting meant for vaporizing. At least thats Treyarches logic. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:55, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:Calm down. I don't think any of us know when these weapons were in their first stages of prototypes and what they looked like in the prototype stage. Prototype weapons are definitely a recurring theme in Black Ops. Since these guys are above top-secret they can have experimental weapons that are also above top-secret. In the GKnova6 files, it specifically states the AUG in-game will be a prototype version. I wouldn't be surprised if the SPAS is also experimental and the weird AR is completely custom.
:::Cool

RC planes instead of predator missiles?

== Document from viral site ==

Over at the CoD wiki I found this "document" from an viral site connected to Black Ops: [http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100601175649/callofduty/images/3/3d/Doc10.jpg]. It describes the AUG as "very early prototype weapon; not in production". It also mentions the [[G11]]

and also the delicious China Lake Launcher
-Double Agent M

:It would be better if they included more of these prototype weapons. I would love to see weapons like BRG-15, H&K CAWS, Ster ACR, Colt SCAMP,etc. Even better would be a underwater level with the H&K P11! After all the inclusion of such weapons in the game will be better than the monotonous selection of Cold War-rea weapons like M1911,M21,G3,FN FAL,AK-74,etc.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 09:37, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

:I'll shit bricks of joy if the G11 is in there. I've wanted that gun in a Call of Duty game for as far as I remember. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

G11 eh?? im guessing its going to turn into the MP40 from WaW except in speed instead of power

== M202 FLASH ==
I made a couple of changes in this section including adding of screencaps. I rechanged it back to FLASH because everything is anachronic in this came and it can't be the more rarer XM191. Plus I added a M202 FLASH image, which is actually from Far Cry Instincts Predeator, since I could not find a single good picture of it in the web.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 15:43, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
:There's not anachronism, Treyarch keeps saying that all these weapons are prototypes. I'm not sure what people aren't getting about that. I'm pretty sure every weapon we've seen in American hands so far are a prototype of some sort. I think that the FLASH is the prototype version; why can't it be?
::The reference specifically said "M202." We're not going solely by the picture, but by what was actually written by someone who either played it or watched the game be played. And since I doubt the average game journalist is an ordnance expert, he only knew because it was probably labeled "M202" in the game itself. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 23:00, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You know just as well as I do video games often mislabel their guns either by mistake or just to give the public who don't know much about guns an idea of what that gun is instead of confusing them with specifics. I don't argue that it's going to be labeled M202, but I guarantee you Treyarch is intending it to be the prototype XM191.

:: XM191 was M202 prototype, just for your information. --[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:34, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
:::Yes, I'm aware of that. But given the shall we say, unique, circumstances of the game, wouldn't it make more sense to go with what the game says, rather than what's historically correct? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:10, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes XM191 is a M202 prototype.American send to test during late 1970s in vietnam.And i see a picture of XM191 in vietnam war museum. info from http://world.guns.ru/grenade/gl50-e.htm [[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]
Here is what it shoots

[[IMAGE:Treyasuckers.png]]

Wow look like a RPG7 rocket.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

==Not being able to go past vietnam?==

What is this crap I hear about treyarch LEGALLy not being able to go past vietnam in game? A comapny can do whatever the hell they want.

[[User:k9870]]

:I know, I was about to make this same post.-protoAuthor 20:25, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
::From the article posted above (emphasis mine)
::"-Activision eventually convinced West and Zampella to stay with them by offering up a Memorandum of Understanding. In addition to extending their contracts through to October 2011, this legally-binding document gave West and Zampella some major financial bonuses as well as a couple other hefty promises. Chiefly, it gave the two "creative authority over the development of any games under the Modern Warfare brand (or any Call of Duty game set in the post-Vietnam era, the near future, or the distant future) including complete control over the Infinity Ward studio." '''In other words, Activision could not publish a Modern Warfare-branded game (or a Call of Duty game set any time later than Vietnam) without West and Zampella's full approval."'''
::West and Zampella were the two heads at IW who were fired in April. Now that they're no longer with the company, this might open the door for Treyarch's next CoD game to be Modern Warfare-esque, but there's a lot of litigation right now. The firing was way too late to affect BO, so they operated under the restrictions above. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:50, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

I am still waiting for a WWI CoD with single- and multiplayer featuring France, the UK, the German Empire, the Austro-Hungarian Empire, the Ottoman Empire, Russia, Japan, Italy and the USA. Unfortunately this would be too expensive and only few people would buy it. Thus such a CoD will never be made. Sorry for half offtopic. --[[Special:Contributions/84.181.247.180|84.181.247.180]] 20:31, 9 June 2010 (UTC)Paul_Baeumer
:I would love to play a CoD WWI game. (CoD: Great War? CoD: Over the Top?) I'd like to see them change it so you can change out your melee weapon, so instead of a knife, you can equip yourself with an e-tool, brass knuckles, or a spiked club. (Sorry to continue the off-topic.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:02, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
::And to stay on topic, how would they define "distant future?" Why not a CoD game set in 2110? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:02, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

== Why did someone add possible weapons? ==

Someone added possible weapon prototypes like the G11 and the Pump 40mm? I am removing them tomarrow if no one says anything about why they should be left on. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:22, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

: This document (http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100601175649/callofduty/images/3/3d/Doc10.jpg) from the Black Ops viral site could be the reason --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 03:34, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

:There aren't possible anymore, it has been '''confirmed''' that they will be in the game, with other sites like Call of Duty wikia including them in their weapons list.

[[Image:DOC10.jpg]] 
--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 04:28, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

:Yeah, and the Call of Duty wiki is a beacon of truth... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 13:49, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

The AUG and M202 have see in game trailer.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

== Still a little chance ==

Well, they are gonna include dedicated servers. So they apparently release modtools - So it seems like its gonna be possible change guns models, just like in CoD4. --[[Special:Contributions/88.208.103.46|88.208.103.46]] 09:09, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

== M16 on magazine cover ==
It should be removed for now, seeing as there's currently no evidence to support its inclusion in the game. IMFDB chronicles weapons appearing in movies, television, and video games, not on magazine covers. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:12, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Game mags are a great source of weapons, thats where half the screenshots we see come from, game informer and the such.
:Screenshots are one thing, but there's no evidence that the image is actually from the game, it might just be an illustration the magazine drew up. I would heap the image of the guy sitting cross-legged with the two .45s in there as well. It wouldn't be the first time that weapons on cover art don't actually appear in the game itself. ([[Medal of Honor: European Assault]] comes to mind.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:01, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
:Is it bothering you that much?
::Well, considering the site has rules against printed media, yes it does bug me. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:44, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
:90% possibility that's a box-art. Don't be nerdy.

The game sure went into a lot of detail on the 1911 not to use it, and besides, what else would they have, they cant screw up history enough to throw in deegs and berettas.......oh wait, never mind, they can....

vietcong with a spas 12, damn at this rate my dream of marching into the reichstag waist firing an aa12 may come true
:That could be multiplayer screens

== SPAS 12 Folded Stock ==

All i can say is: FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK!!!!
--[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 15:17, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Its more tacticaler and badassish to keep it folded, only noobs use a stock, not hardcore 1337 operators! (video game maker logic))
[[User:k9870]]

At least thay didn't put a goddamn XM8 in the game, if they do, i'll throw my goddamn PC outta the window, 'nuff said --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 03:04, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:'''nerd'''

At least the developers weren't stupid enough to put a rifle concept weapon into a game that takes place during the cold war. At least we can forgive them with the inaccurate AR-15s. And has any game developer ever fired a shotgun without a stock? It's a pain and you can slap yourself in the face if you don't brace yourself. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:I can only think of two possibilities, 1) you're firing Dragon's Breath rounds with the SPAS-12, and using it as small flamethrower, so you can get away with firing it from the hip, and 2)more importantly, WHEN HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A SPAS-12 FIRED FROM THE SHOULDER WITH THE STOCK EXTENDED? The only time I ever saw it was briefly in [[Jurassic Park]]. Even that famous scene in [[Miami Vice - Season 1#Franchi SPAS-12|Miami Vice]], a show that did guns pretty well, with [[Jim Zubiena]], a professional shooter would presumably knows guns pretty well, had him firing a SPAS-12 from the hip. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Q2Il86-38A] Do you think most people even realize that thing on top is a folding stock? Yes, you, me, and everyone who's ever fired a shotgun ([http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgptDs_Nncw| and now this guy]) knows it's stupid to fire a shotgun without the stock extended. But I don't think the general public knows. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:45, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:It's not stupid. You don't really have to aim at point-blank range. I'm curious how aiming down the sights of SPAS with folded stock will work.

I'd love to know the reasoning behind including the SPAS-12 in this game. It didn't exist at the time, and I don't buy the "it's supposed to be a prototype" line. If it's a prototype, why does it look exactly like the production model?(I could make the same argument about the AUG)
Most likely this is Treyarch just being lazy, or including a weapon simply because it has been popular in video games, or both. They could have included an automatic shotgun that really was used in Vietnam, the Remington 7188. It was basically a Remington 1100 with an extended tube magazine, modified to fire full auto. It was used mostly by the Navy SEALS, but I believe SOG made some use of it as well. It's a weapon, as far as I know, that has never been used in a video game. Instead we get the anachronistic SPAS-12 that has appeared in about 5 million games. If anyone is interested in the weapons SOG really did use in Vietnam, get a copy of "SOG: A Photo History of the Secret Wars" by John Plaster. It includes a chapter that specifically covers weapons, and there are ton of great photos. It's expensive, but worth the price.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 02:01, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

:[[Image:MV-FSP-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ludovici Armstrong ([[Jim Zubiena]]) fires his SPAS-12 at two drug dealers, while posing as a chauffeur.]]

I thought it was supposed to be a homage to 80's action movies. Or at least that's why I'm accepting it, because then I'll feel like I'm in an 80's action movie whenever I play this game. And what would an 80's action movie be without the SPAS-12 or the AUG? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:22, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

a littel of topic but, that guy has one of the shitties grips that i have ever seen

== Snake ==
The guy with the AR-15 and the USMC and MACVSOG tattoo the guy looks bad ass, I'm pumped for this dude.

I'm sorry but that sounded a little gay.

i dont think he has the globe and anchor tat , but because of him im going to grow a mullet and wear a head band shhhing people. simmons8492

== .357 ==

A .357, in a tunnel? I hope the game makes it so you won't be able to hear anything for a few minutes after you fire it, so you'd have to make the choice between shooting the bad guy or just meleeing him. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:27, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

:Anyone noticed reloading animation ? He just throwed out shells ( ''STILL HOLDING FLASLIGHT IN LEFT HAND - VISIBLE'' ) And then moved .357 out of screen ('' STILL HOLDING FLASLIGHT IN LEFT HAND - VISIBLE'' ) and than returned .357 to screen. Fully loaded. So it means he reloads revolver in few seconds with one hand ? ...... I just hope BF:BC2:VIïetnam will be much better.

Hey, I'll take that over reloading ''two'' double barrel shotguns at the same time without dropping one anyday. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 04:22, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

It is a game.

youd be suprised what i can do with one hand. simmond 8492

== Grenade Launcher ==

Can anyone identify the grenade launcher used in-game? Here's the link to the video where you can find it. http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2010-call-of/101273 The game labels it "Grenade launcher." It looks like an M203 but that didn't exist in Vietnam...
Also, here's some breaching footage: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2010-call-of/101260

Yeah they did, they went into service around 1969 I think
:Can't believe I got caught without doing my research. My bad.

It's an M203. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:15, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

== SPAS-12 ==

Anyone noticed (In first gameplay video) that EVEN RUSSIANS are equipped with SPAS-12 ? Can be seen around 2:53 lying on the ground next to russian guy....
:Yeah... This is turning out to be pretty fail...

Guys who cares, achronisms don't kill a game. Does it really matter if the guns are slightly innaccurate, all that matters to me is gamplay, good and fair online and ZOMBIES!!
:Call of Duty has always been accurate in the kinds of guns they present to you in single player, with the exception of Modern Warfare 2. So I think I can speak for many fans of the franchise, it matters to us.

Again..it is a pre-release trailer...game is still 5 months from release...

At least it's European, the Russians in MW2 carried Vectors and TAR-21s. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:24, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

== "AR" Sling ==
I'm not one to complain too much about the achronisms, but I do care when things don't make funtional sense, like that the AR's sling, which for some reason is wrapped all around the gun, is stuck UNDER THE BOLT CATCH. It's not like they don't understand it's a funtional part of the gun, cause every AR varient in every COD that's had them has the empty reload where you press the catch... Also I noticed on the non-empty reloads the AR just kinda dips out of the screen and moves a bit then comes back up loaded, you don't see the mag, same goes for the .357; THAT'S lazy... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

I liked the AR-15 reload, it looked real. He pressed the mag release, he let the magazine fall to the ground, and he held it there until he put the new mag in. It's alot more realistic than the MW2 reloads, were you wave your gun around the screen while reloading either to look cool or to make it obvious that you are, in fact, reloading your weapon. Most of the time though, people don't do that when they reload in real life, unless they're an idiot. The .357 reload was kinda lazy though, but I let it slide because he actually whips the cylinder back in instead of the light tilt that's all it takes to swing the cylinder back in in MW2 and most other video games. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:35, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

I love reading these things to see how much constant griping there is..considering the game is still 5 months from release.

[sarcasm] You don't need to reload your guns if you are black ops, just lower them and they will be full again![/sarcasm] seriously thought, this game is REALLY start to be a dissapoint, and it haven't even been released yet --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 22:58, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

I have noticed weapons in game have muzzle jump. MW2 and COD4 had none the guns stayed on target and took no skill to use. In this even the ar-15s rose. I like it.
:It's just cosmetic rise up, the sights will come back right on target after each shot.

Actually WAW some guns would go off target, like an mp40 or DP machine gun. More noticeable at range. Treyarch has recoil effects, which i like.

:It could just be that modern weapons were designed with a better understanding of reducing recoil. Most modern automatic weapons have straight-line stocks, which reduces recoil, as opposed to bent stocks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:26, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Actually look at mw2 ak, fal, m4, whatever, no recoil. WAW, mp40s would be shooting high after half a mag. I like recoil effects means you need more skill to shoot.

== M16 ==
Unknown [[M16]] ( Seems to be A1 ) covered with some kind of cloth or tape appeared in hands of soldier on one of BO´s artworks.

[[Image:M16-SP1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M16A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[Image:BLACKOPSM16.JPG|thumb|none|500px|M16 on cover of French Xbox 360 magazine.]]

I moved it from the main page because like we discussed earlier, it's just a magazine cover with nothing to back it up. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 11:58, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah, that was nice turn. I added it on the page just because it ''HAD SOMETHING TO DO'' with game :) There arent any proofs that M16 will be featured (''unofrtunately'') --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:15, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
::Let's be honest fellas, it's hard to have a game that has much to do with Vietnam without having the old three pronged, triangular handguarded M16. My bet is that it will show up, armed with full auto and 20 round mags. Also, I'm pumped for the G11, that thing is gonna be epicly epic. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:Is it me or is the picture in the magazine a reverse shot? Because I see the forward assist on this A1 as well as the ejection on the right side. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:07, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

== Bad Feeling ==

After realizing all the goofs that are popping up and watching more gameplay footage, I'm getting the feeling I got before Modern Warfare 2 released. Like they're throwing what was once a pretty legitimate game out the window for the coolness effect. And with MW2 that feeling turned out to be correct. Anyone else sensing the same thing?

Yeah, I've got the same bad feeling, except a lot sooner than I got it with MW2, maybe just cause I'm not really expecting much better after the disaster that MW2 was. Oh and COD4 is still fun ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:42, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

MW2 sucked..but MW2 was IW..CoD:BO is Treyarch. Are they perfect? No..but now a days they're better than IW.

I must say i really enjoyed MW2, and, in my opinion, Infinity Ward is still better than Treyarch, oh well, games can't please everybody, can they? --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 11:49, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Hopefully multiplayer is a bit different, mw2 multiplayer was old when it started since it was just like cod 4, at least WAW had vehicles.

-k9870

With luck they'll fix the problems '''before''' the game ships this time. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 16:56, 17 June 2010 (UTC)
:I hope you're right but I doubt it. I've never seen a game change much of anything five months before release.

Everyone here talking shit about IW? You're a bunch of idiots. IW makes far better games. I don't know why you don't like MW2, but it's one of the best of the series so far. This game, on the other hand, looks like it'll be a disaster (as nearly all of Treyarch's iterations are).
:Fuckin right.--[[User:Pølaris|Pølaris]] 03:47, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

I didn't say I hated MW2. Doesn't stop it being loaded with bugs that make the game seem like it was rushed out to meet the deadline. Now, if you're done fanboying... [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 07:35, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
::I don't think it's entirely fanboyish. I'm pretty sure the general consensus of CoD fans is that IW games are better than Treyarch games. IW started the franchise, and CoD games are the only games they make. Treyarch is just along for the ride. But now that IW has lost almost a third of their employees in the last month, that dynamic may change. I have a lot of hope for BO, and I think it's silly to write it off based on a few trailers and three minutes of gameplay footage. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 12:50, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
::: My point was that MW2 was ruined by Acitvision trying to force IW to meet the due date, meaning they had to ship it with a whole range of bugs. However, some of the above poster's comments do seem to boil down to "It's gonna be shit cos it's not an IW game."[[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 07:04, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I personally think that this game looks awesome, and i dont see what the problem is

IW gets the cred since they made the modern games, which people wanted. WW2 was old that siad Treyarch couldve done just as good making mw1 and 2. They had better fire lighting, recoil effects, etc.

:Bottom line is this. IW failed to have MW2 be better than CoD: 4, and this is why they've been put on hold. Treyarch's WaW was a brilliant game, and I still love to play it to this day. Treyarch has shown more promise then IW lately, and I'm sure they won't disapoint with Black Ops, as they plan to remove and fix all the shit MW2 got wrong. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Let's replace your opinion with some fact. MW2 was better than CoD 4 based on the storyline and sales alone, without going into all the new multiplayer features. Was multiplayer a bit buggy? Yeah, for around a month. Treyarch's installments are considered, by those who have played the series, crap in comparison. WaW? That game was garbage. It was basically a recycling of levels from other games in the series that were reskinned. The game was a knockoff of CoD4 that took place in WWII.
:::I'm going to have to call BS on the better storyline in MW2. It's the first CoD game where you get to not only gun down civilians, but also kill American servicemen. That's better? Are you and your buddies playing MW2 in a cave in Kandahar? Big Red One was disappointing, but then again, it wasn't supposed to be a "real" CoD game. CoD3 did suck, I certainly won't argue that. I hated the idea of WaW at first, because WWII was so overdone, but I liked it once I actually played it. (There might be a lesson in there.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Now let's talk about Treyarch. Aside from their lameass 'cash-in' port of CoD4 for the wii (which was garbage), what did they do in the series? Call of Duty 3, Big Red One, World at War, and the current work in progress Black Ops. I don't know if you played any of those, but they were all terrible entries in the series. CoD3 was a gimmick game. 'Oooooh motion control and button mashing'. Big Red One was garbage, and WaW was a hack-job. What does that record suggest their next game will be like?

: Big Red One was awesome, shut up.-protoAuthor 18:54, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Oh, and Treyarch couldn't have made MW1 or 2. They lack originality; every game they released was a knockoff of either IW's designs and ideas or of another developer. The only reason Treyarch is getting to make more CoD's is because IW's execs left because they were being denied their contractually obligated bonuses. --[[User:Asmkillr323|Asmkillr323]] 11:33, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
::Your timeline is off. Development of BO started well before the recent upheaval at IW. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

:Also, World at War is a superb game. Sure you have the god like MP40, but that's nowhere near as bad as OMA danger close noob tubes in MW2, and to anybody who's into WWII and it's weapons it's a hell of a game. It's no CoD: 4, but thank fuck it's no MW2. Treyarch shows promise, and if IW was doing Black Ops I would hold no hope at all. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

No offense but what your saying is that WAW was great in comparison. Thats not good logic at all, CoD4 is the best out of the three. No clue on BO but I have a feeling that since they wanted to justify cool guns that are anchoristic with that they are prototypes is just half-assed which may relate to the rest of the game. Also have you seen the reload animations?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:24, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
:When WaW was first announced, I was appalled. I couldn't believe they were staying in WWII, even after CoD4 skipped ahead to modern day. Looking back though, the fact that it's a WWII game is the only flaw I can think of. (Although, yes, it's a big one.) It restricted the plot, and WWII has been done to death. It was otherwise a pretty good game. I really liked the co-op campaign missions, the vehicle missions were well done, the voice acting was superb, and Zombies takes the game to a whole new level. Aside from the setting, is CoD4 really that much better? Is it time to give Treyarch the benefit of the doubt? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:48, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

:I agree with all of your points chinaman, and you're right, CoD 4 wasn't really all that better. Besides the modern warfare setting, it lacked many of the cool features and such that WaW introduced, and while everyone including me loves it, it wasn't overly better than WaW. I always applauded Treyarch for making WaW not so noob friendly, something IW did massively with MW2. Now the guys at Arch have been watching people complain everywhere about the shit in MW2, and so they know what to do to fix it. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

== Goofs and screw-ups ==
Alright no offense but SHUT UP!!! You guys are complaining about the anachroistic guns in it but it's supposed to be that way. The freaking name is BLACK-OPS which means no one knows about it. What they are doing are saying what Cpt. Price said: History is full of lies. So, what they're saying is that this is not what they thought really happened but they are using their imagination to come with these historical ideas that fall in to the game. But like I said everything in it is supposed to TOP SECRET, so it's going to be anachroistic. But that's how it's supposed to be. It's TOP SECRET so none of us would even know about it.

and P.S. For all butt-holes who said MW2 sucks, Opinions are like butt-holes every body's got one, and nobody wants to hear the other one. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 12:14, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

: Yeah. You act like 12-years old. But we all know you are 10 years old.
::For your information I am actually 12.

Look up mw2 bad spawns on youtube and you'll see how its flawed. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:28, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

::I take it that you don't want fans of the COD series to actually question the developers for making questionable (or stupid) weapons choices for the sake of a compelling narrative. Unfortunately, that only works if we didn't have already have lots of knowledge of the 1960s-1970s era of covert operations from the military and numerous books, which only makes the anachronisms more glaring to anyone who isn't 12 years old.Just like movie watchers, people playing games set in a particular historical era have a certain set of expectations of what ought to be present and what shouldn't. To dismiss all those concerns with a "TOP SECRET" excuse is ridiculous, since Call of Duty 1-3 all managed to be interesting without adding things that didn't exist in the same timeframe. Cursing at people because they disagree doesn't make your defence of Treyarch seem anything more than juvenile. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 16:52, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

No, I just wanted everybody to shut up about saying crap about the guns. So they maybe think that a AUG without a foregrip looks stupid, I think it looks cool. The graphics look good and it looks realistic. I am 12 so I don't care about anachrosism, but I know a heck of alot about guns and Call of Duty so yeah, I was a little mad but because alot of you guys are like in your thirties they are targeting this for people in the younger phase and are not expecting people to go Hey! The AR-15 wasn't introduced then and neither was the Grenade Launcher. I don't think Treyarch are expecting a Riot of AUG foregrip lovers to burn down their studio but come on guys, seriously. Do you have to take this that seriously, your calling me juvenile while your sitting in your chair going hey that trigger guard is rounde then it can't be a M9 so it has be a 92SB therefore they lied! I'm going to kill them! etc. etc. so hey try to be a little compassionate and maybe think about going outside your mom's basement. Ha Ha just joking. (not sarcasm) So what i'm saying is can you not be so depndive on every little detail. Would you like to make a Call of Duty game. Just please voice your honest opinions and not go on about gun mixups because it's really not about the guns it's more about the plot and story. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 18:08, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I think that you people are taking these things too seriously. Since cod 4, these games are like action movies, rather than historical war role-playing type shit. Yes the anachronisms are disappointing, but I'm not really bothered by it and they were done for the sake of making the game cooler (and in my opinion any game set in Vietnam AND including a spas-12 is badass). If you want realism, than check out the new Medal of Honor. If you want Hollywood type action, buy cod games, because thats the direction the franchise is going in, which isnt a bad thing.

:Alright kiddies, let's sit down and have a nice list of what's wrong with Modern Warfare 2.
-One Man Army
-Danger Close M203s
-Commando
-The Spawn system
-Deathstreaks (especially Painkiller)
-Overpowered and unbalanced guns (ACR, FAMAS, UMP)
-Overpriced map packs
-non-dedicated servers, which leads to lag and host migration up you yin yang
-the OMA/Danger Close noob tube combo
-boosters galore
-10 Prestige hack lobbies
-The F2000 is a pile of garbage

So all said and done, that's a pretty big list of whats wrong with the game. You're free to disagree, but let it be known anyone claiming noob tubes are legit will be lynched. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The new Metal of Honor is just trying to cash in on the whole Modern Warfare craze we got going. Modern Warfare is the new WWII game of this generation. And because this IS a site that points out specific weapons, whether or not it should exist in the time period is our jobs on this site. Those of us who do take this site serious has an obligation to point out the holes and inconsistencies. That's what we do here. Call it bitching or whining, but that's what this site is solely for, nitpicking, pointing out obvious holes when we see guns in a movie, game, etc. We're looked up all sorts of history involving the AR-15 and just saying it's "Black ops" doesn't mean they defy the laws of historical consistency. In some of the Indiana Jones movies that takes place before WWII, we do point out MP40s and 98Ks should not exist as a fact. Even black ops of today would use the latest technology, not weapons that haven't been field tested or even made yet. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:12, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

: You, Excalibur, look like one of those very few inteligent people in this discussion. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:42, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. Also, I've seen Beta footage and Medal of Honor just looks a lot like Bad Company 2. And to be honest, I could care less if the AUG or AR-15 or what have you is an anachronism in this game, as long as we're not talking lasers I'm fine. We're here to point out weapons in film, give pictures and descriptions of them, and talk about them, not bitch that a gun being in a game set 2 days before it was produced makes it a failure [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Those guns arent 2 days befor prouction. Its ''8 years''. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:42, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Pointing out achronistic guns is part of what we do here, that said, for me it won't kill the game, unless there's a Modern Warfare 2-like pile of other stuff wrong with it too. Oh and yes the Russians & Vietnamese wouldn't use SPAS-12s but you're forgetting the only guns they've REALLY intended to show off so far are the AUG, SPAS-12, AK-47, M202, Python, and Crossbow, that's only what, six? I think they only picked these few guns to go in the trailers, and then reveal more later, so maybe the guns will be more where they should in the final version... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 21:42, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, God forbid we talk about firearm mistakes in TV/Movies/Video Games on a website DEDICATED TO DISCUSSING FIREARMS IN TV/MOVIES/VIDEOGAMES! I will continue to make comments on what, in my opinion, are idiotic firearm choices for this game. If anyone disagrees, feel free to reply, but don't tell me to shut up. Some of the comments above just prove my theory that weapons, such as the SPAS-12, were simply included because they are popular in video games, with Treyarch using the whole "prototype" B.S. as justification for their presence.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 05:08, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
:Yes, how DARE they try to give players what they want?! You'd think they were in this to make money or something. What a bunch of whores! --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:27, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
::Really? So the only way for this game to make money is to include a SPAS-12? Is there that much demand for a SPAS-12 it has to be inluded to make gamers happy? Would the game be a financial failure if it wasn't there, and weapons more appropriate to the time period were included instead?--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 06:12, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You said it yourself, it's what players want. And like you also said, it's minor. Games are made for the general public, not gun dorks like us. As a gun dork, I'm a bit bothered, but as a gamer, I'm thrilled that I can light people on fire with a shotgun. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 09:43, 20 June 2010 (UTC) (gun dork and gamer)
^Hell yeah! [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:44, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

:::: Does the success of the game depend that much on specific weapons that appear in it? You said yourself that as long as a game is fun, accurate/inaccurate depictions of weapons doesn't matter that much. If that's the case, weapons more correct to the time period can be included, and the game will still be a success ''as long as it's fun''. And I highly doubt Treyarch polled gamers and asked them what weapons they wanted to see in Black Ops. I think they were just acting on their ''perception'' of what weapons are popular in video games. So I don't know if I can say this is a case of "what players want", more a case of Treyarch saying "we think we know what players want". This is just a theory I came up with as to why certain weapons were included, I don't have any idea if it's true(although some comments from other posts seem to confirm it). For all I know, Treyarch is just being lazy and it's easier for them to include the well known weapons rather than do real research. At any rate, I can't see the inclusion/exclusion of specific weapons making or breaking a game.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 01:17, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
:::::"At any rate, I can't see the inclusion/exclusion of specific weapons making or breaking a game." My thoughts exactly. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

You know, those that find it stupid that we are pointing out the anachronisms in this game should really just go to the treyarch forums, not post on a website dedicated to firearm identification. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:32, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
:Ok, if those anachronistic weapons supposed to be '''early''' prototypes then they at least could make it look '''different''' from production models! That would be much more believable. Tryesuckarch is just being f-ing lazy. I don't mind flat-top AR, but they could make it not look like a modern one. And also if there is no simple M16A1 then it's a total fck-up in the Vietnam themed game.
::If they made it look different5 from the final gun, you guys would be even more pissed! You'd be like "How can they call that a M16A1! Look at it it looks nothing like the original!" Plus. how could Treynot-suckarch know what they would like? You guys wouldn't be pissed if this was a modern warfare game. In fact I bet that Treyarch probably wanted to do that but they couldn't(breathes deeply)you know what this is my last comment. I'm done arguing with all the stupid people on this site. If you have anything else to say you can take it up with me on my talk page. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 13:44, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You don't know what you're talking about. Photos or drawings of the prototypes can easily be found on the internet. A drawing of the AUG prototype is on the World Guns page, and the prototype SPAS-12(along with a photo of the SPAS-11) is shown on the SPAS-12 webpage: [http://spas12.com/spas12not.htm] And if Treyarch clearly states a weapon is supposed to represent a prototype and it actually looks like the prototype, no one is going to complain.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 00:09, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

:Are these mistakes any worse than some of MW2s fuck ups? Like the L86 with a made up drum magazine and iron sights that wouldn't be usable as it has a straight stock, the AUG cosmetically having a 30 round mag when it says 42? The MP5K having a rail system only seen on an airsoft gun in real life and so on. Let's remember Black Ops isn't set only in 1968, and so they have a bit of play when it comes to weapons. The M16 is confirmed (I have a friend doing beta testing) and is Vietnam styled. Now if anyone wants to instantly write off the game because it has a few anachronisms and shit in it, then your missing the point. So what if your using an AUG in 1968? It's not like lasers in WWI, and it's still fun to do. Don't focus on the hate, try and just enjoy it for what it is, a video game. If you want reality, go join the army and head off to Iraq or something, cause in video game land, reality will be broken. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]
:So you're trying to justify Treyarch fuckups comparing it to MW2? Fuckup is fuckup

One, I tottaly agree. Two, did your friend say if there is an M14?

:Yes, the M14 should be in there. Also, I hardly see mild anachronisms as "fuck ups" in a game that pretty much goes on alternate reality anyways. Treyarch has created a game all about the operations we don't know about, the cover ups, and the spec ops weaponry we don't see for years, so having an AUG earlier then it's commercial release can be forgiven. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]\

::Treyarch has the right to depict an alternate Cold War for all they desire, but as long as they try to play it off as the historical "truth" that no one knows about while maintaining all sorts of obvious (and IMO not minor at all) anachronisms, they are only leaving themselves open to criticism. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 23:41, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

:They aren't trying to play it off as historical truth, they're trying to go with an alternate truth, which makes perfect sense. Also, if I hear another person commenting on how rails are anachronistic, I'm going to snap. It's fucking rails on a gun in a video game, get over it. Black Ops will be an awesome game, and despite these possible anachronisms, I'll be gladly killing Russians in 1968 with my AUG thank you [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I don't think I'm going to get this game. I'm getting a vibe that it's filled with silly crap much like Modern Warfail 2. I'll be playing the next Medal of Honor instead. -Frank T

:Medal of Honor looks like Bad Company 2 with Taliban, so that's the game I won't be getting. Treyarch impressed me with World at War, and they're aiming to please this time, removing and modifying all the bullshit Modern Warfare 2 bestowed on us. From deathstreaks to Commando, they're out to fix it all! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I never really got that mindset "It's BFBC2 but slightly different so I'm not getting it". Well, if you don't like Bad Company 2 to begin with that's fine, but there's more of a difference between Bad Company 2 and Medal Of Honor than between COD4 and World At War, most of the difference was the setting so it seemed like a bigger difference, but the core gameplay was very close, and they were made by two DIFFERENT companys while BFBC2 and MOH are made by the SAME ONE. I'm not saying anything bad about them, I like the first three and the MOH Beta. And yes, Modern Warfare 2 failed in two ways: First, it was WAY too noob-friendly, like, before it came out I would've never thought it possible for a game to be that noob-friendly, and second, it traded realism for coolness in pretty much every way, while COD4, the game they'd JUST MADE, had a believable story, weapons that were almost perfect in terms of appearance and who used them, and the only real nooby stratagy was the M16 Red Dot, but oh well, there was almost only that one. I know Treyarch has said they're trying to get rid of the cheap MW2 stuff, and that's good, but I'm really not liking the direction this is going, picking the guns because they're cool and not because they make sense, even a little bit, the exploding crossbow bolts, how almost every weapon we've identified so far is either achronistic or has something wrong with it (go look), the Hind A with tandam seating, and when you get in you go through the long cool animation of getting in and starting up, but then it takes off in 2 seconds flat, and the lazy, lazy reloads... I'm not saying it's going to suck, I'm saying my hopes aren't high, sure it'll be better than MW2, but that's not saying much. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 23:36, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

:Arguably Black Ops has issues, but don't forget that E3 footage comes months before the final product. So what if the Hind has tandem seating, does that make it any less cool to blast VC with it? So what if the reload isn't uber detailed, does that detract from you shooting people? So what if there's minor anachronisms, isn't this both a video game and an alternate reality? I'll agree the crossbow is kind of odd, but this game should be nowhere near as noob friendly as the god awful MW2. Modern Warfare 2 was built on the idea of helping bad players, but it only resulted in much rage for good players such as myself. Call of Duty 4 was made to break the mold on FPs games of the time, and it did and still does kick ass. MW2 was built to top it, and instead of that, they gave us an over dramatic, noob friendly game that overall makes me just want to buy a copy of CoD 4 again. And on MOH, I've seen some footage, and now I actually like it, sure it looks BC2 like, but thats no biggy, and overall that looks ready to rock too! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Okay, sorry, that came off as too bad against Black Ops, I know it's months away from coming out and no, the Hind's seating isn't really a problem, I was just pointing out that it was wrong, same with a lot of the stuff we've seen so far. My point was there's a lot of incorrect things in the game, not neccecarily game-breaking, just pointing out that COD4 and WAW were better in that regard, though so far the game overall looks pretty good :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 05:29, 29 June 2010 (UTC)

:To be really honest, it won't matter if there's minor issues and anachronisms, cause as long as Black Ops isn't as noob friendly and shitty as MW2, I'll be fine and dandy [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Exactly, but we still do need to point them out though. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

I dont see MW2 as "noob friendly", just as balanced. It tried too hard to make no gun any better than another. It also felt like cod4, like the core gameplay mechanics were all old when you started playing.

-k9870

:Face it dude, MW2 basically reeks of noob friendliness. You have deathstreaks, solely designed to help shitty players, noob tubes which when coupled with OMA and danger close are the noobs cannon of choice. You have the ACR and FAMAS, both of which are overpowered, then you get stuff like the UMP which at close range does more damage then an M4 Carbine. Not to mentionthe marathon lightweight commando set up used by knife fags so they can knife you from 12 feet away. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

And the overpowered Harriers, that killed everyone all the time and you could have 2 up at once, and they always beat the helos in fights, and Chopper Gunner, and Tactical Insertions, allowing people to boost really easily for the Nuke, that ended the game, and Slight Of Hand Pro that let everyone quickscope, yeah the list keeps going... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 19:49, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

I always find a stinger to be good against harriers and because you can have 2 on you, most of the time, you can take even 2 of them out. Not Gunner choppers are a pain to take down [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

:Chopper gunners are a pain, AC-130s are worse. Not only can they not be hit by bullets or tubes or anything of that sort, but they have TWO sets of flares that can deploy without any delay. Tact inserts mixed with cold blooded and good old FFA is great for boosting, luckily now Sandy Ravage deals some booster justice (hell, even I serve justice to them now). Either way though, MW2 was clearly IW's attempt to top CoD: 4, which was a game built to revolutionize FPS games. MW2 was built to be playable by even the noobiest kids, over the top, reference movies every two seconds, and overall be a fairly shitty game. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The problem with the Harriers is they're way too good... unless you just pull out a stinger and then they're dead, which is a little too extreme both ways. The reason the helicopter was so much better in COD4 was because there were no guided rockets, you couldn't shoot the rotor (so you couldn't just hipfire the thing to death), and UAV Jammer didn't help you against it, it killed you anyway, not to mention it never seems to manage to hit you in MW2. What I hate is hearing "Helicopter Inbound", then seeing it shot down in literally 5 seconds... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 17:05, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Death streaks were only like 10 seconds long and didnt bother me, no guns were eoverpowered, there all balanced, too much if you ask me. C130s were easy to hide from and rare to see and i downed tons of harries with stingers. The noob tube didnt bother me, i used a m16 with m203 and iron sights as my primary weapon. Knife noobs are easy to shoot The problem was cheap tactics, like camping spawn points and getting your friends to camp with you in free for all so you could stab them and boost your way to a nuke.

-k9870

The only streak thats ten seconds long is painkiller, and it still sucks. The ACR has no recoil and can outshoot sniper rifles, so can the FAMAS. AC-130s are easy to hide from on SOME maps, but if you get spawn trapped outside, your screwed. The fact you use a noob tube on your primary gun choice sickens me, because ANYONE who uses them, unless to get the shotgun unlocked or in a tactical, non spam way is a complete noob and should be banned for using such a cheap weapon. Knife noobs are easy to shoot at times, but if they get within ten feet, commando is your demise. MW2 is a shit game, end of story, Black Ops is doing everything to solve the problems it caused, amen. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The m203 is useful to launch through windows and take out campers, and i use iron sights so might as well have an attachment. I dont use the m203 as my primary, but have it on my primary. And the ACR has low power at range taking on snipers. I countersniper with my m16 though, love irons, they have no sway like a scope. I hate snipers the most, there like socially acceptable campers. Its funny to lay out some noob who tries to quickscope though. It seems like no matter what you get called a noob though, m4 noob, noob tuber, shotgun noob, dual wield noob, knife noob....it seems everyoned thinks if yo dont use whaty they do your a noob, and c-130s dont bother me, there rare, people need 13 kills to get them. I hated when i tried to play free for all with some friends in a party and people are just boosting to nukes each round and cheating there asses off

[[user:k9870]]

agreed. it is always considered noobing. Snipers are annoying. it takes no skill at all to snipe. however there are worse things in MW2 then Snipers. for example- the people who camp in buildings like Wasteland or Scrapyard. "noob tubers" really arent annoying at all anyway. aggravating maybe, but if someone hits you with a M203 its your fault anyway. you should have been more alert. [[Special:Contributions/71.194.219.9|71.194.219.9]] 22:48, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

People always camped hallways and alleys and just shot anyone coming around the corner. Easy to just poke in and launch 40 mil at them. Besides, the thing has an aring distance, you need to arc it at range and reload was slow. Balanced.\

-k9870

:Face it, the M203 is a noob piece of shit. the combo of an M203 with Danger Close and OMA makes you a mini artillery battery. Also, how are you supposed to dodge a tube when people are shooting them cross map to your spawn? Nothing says pro like getting hit by a 40mm grenade shot hundreds of feet over buildings into your face. The M203 has no place in MW2, and I'd be one to have it removed. If retards can't use guns well, don't give them bullshit to help them, let them suck and they'll quit the game. When I pull my FAL out, I feel like a pro, knowing everyone else has the overpowered ACR and FAMAS and the tubes out, all ready to be scrubs, while I'm using something that's balanced and yet awesome. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Well said, though I wish the G3 was still in, and the fact that the ACR does a little less damage, like 1 bullet, maybe two different, makes no difference when there's absolutly no recoil, they still can't do anything by the time you kill them across the map from one huge sustained burst... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:37, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

Are you all playing hardcore or something? And i have no people launching 203s around problem, you only get 2. And i could care less about harriers and 130s, you need a lot of kills to get them. There is a call of duty cultuure to nae some guns as oaky and some as cheap. I dont give a shit personally though. i just play. No matter what somebody will bitch about your gear.

I remember back when everyone hated p90s, that thing had no range or power and overall sucked.

You only get two M203s if your not using scavenger or the more common One Man Army. I literally see two or three people on my team per game using that stupid backpack, it's complete bullshit. The ACR may not do high damage, but it's high rate of fire and zero recoil means you can full auto the damn thing at any range. I think retards who dare to say the noob tube is a legit way to play should be banned from PSN or XBL and never allowed on any Call of Duty again. It's called a first person shooter, not first person grenade launchers. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:I wasn't aware that we can't SHOOT grenade launchers. I better go tell the guys at Activision/IW/Treyarch. -Chris_Hun7er 02:05, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

The problem is more that games are good and balenced when everything has a place, if people start using snipers at close range and beating shotguns (that's more of a Halo thing, but the snipers quickscope and the shotguns are rather terrible), or shooting 40mm rounds at any range for any reason, it's dumb. The launchers in BFBC2 are well balenced, because they have a purpose and they fill it, and nothing else. The assault rifles in MW2 have a purpose, fill it, and then beat SMGs and shotguns at close range, and half the time snipers at long range. And the Javelin, not that I see it too much, is good against tanks, except, there aren't any, there's infantry and helicopters. A game works when things have a purpose and fill that purpose, but not anything else's purpose, and that's half of what's screwed up in MW2. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:36, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

:Excactly Alex. Bad company 2 had 40mms that had to virtually land on the person to kill them, but with Danger Close an MW2 noob tube will kill people even if they're up to fifteen feet away from the landing. To be honest, I think noob tubes should just be plain removed from Black Ops, and the tube fanboys can suck it while us normal players use our guns. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:Reality is fanboy the US 40mm rounds have a 5 meter kill radius. meaning that if you are 15 feet away from the blast you are dead as a doornail. the 40mm grenades in bad company are more useful as doorway makers and cover destroyers than as proper suport weapons. what is pissing off alot of us who care about little things called historic accuracy is the fact that even though they say that everyone had to read about MACV:SOG they have gotten few details right. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 18:44, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

It's true that the 40mm is not terribly powerful in BC2, but explosives need to be less powerful in games than they would in real life, imagine Claymores with realistic spread, damage, and range, without those stupid little lasers, and without bomb squad. Or frag grenades, they're overspammed as it is. Doing something like that is less realistic, but needed for the game to work. Having something like and AUG in 1968, or a SPAS-12 used by Vietcong around the same time... not so much. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

:I agree Alex, because Claymores are really designed to take out a huge radius of enemies, it could easily wipe out an eight man squad. and a frag in a 10 by 10 room would really kill everything inside. If they went for realism, all the 5.56 assault rifles in MW2 would have the same damage and virtually the same recoil, but for balance the TAR is portrayed as extremely powerful, and the ACR weak. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Yeah, it just bothered me that they were THAT different, they could have chosen different weapons if they wanted to balence them like that or something, the part that bugs me the most is that COD4 was better balenced AND made more sense, it's just such a step back... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

All you people whining and crying about grenade launchers and snipers need to quit bitching and cowboy up. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:38, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Grenade launchers are balanced, mininum detonation range, slow reload, not very accurate (need to arc) only 2 rounds, and besides, use it to take down campers.

== Linked to World at War ==

It has been conformed that Reznov from World at War will appear in this game and even make comments about Dimitri Petrenko. This was seen on the Call of Duty Wiki

:Yes, as Reznov is more or less confirmed to be the bearded man you meet and then split from in the tunnel rat scene at E3. I'm happy to see him back, as he made World at War even better for me, maybe now he'll continuously yell "Fire the Javelin!" [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::"now he'll continuously yell "Fire the Javelin!"" What's a Javelin doing in the cold war? Oh wait I forgot, it must be a secret prototype no one knew about.

:Alright, I was thinking in an MW2 state of mind, lemme see. I know, how about him always yelling "FIRE THE LAW" in your ear every two seconds when something as small as a jeep shows up
[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Any links to zombies?

Yes. Confermed on callofduty.com

as lon as he goes all predator on some one like in wold at war , im fine with in, and being as that hes a soviet why is he with the us? defector or what? simmons 8492

== Has it occured to anyone that the AR-15 variant is probably custom made? ==

Treyarch has said that these guys could have guns custom built just for them, which I feel explains things much more adequately than just saying that they're prototypes of future (to them) guns. My theory is that he had a CAR-15 custom made with a flat-top reciever for tactical reasons. Maybe this caught on with the rest of the team, and whatever manufacturer they got to make these guns for them sold the idea later on. Of course this is just an excuse for the guns having the rails just to free it up for attacthments in Multiplayer, but at least there is some kind of excuse. Unfortunately this theory doesn't cover the anachronistic appearances of the SPAS-12 and the AUG, but hey, no game ever get's all of it's guns 100% correct. 

Edit: Actually it just might explain the AUG, because all it really is is a combination of ideas taken from the Enfield EM-2, 
Korobov TKB-022, and several other abandoned designs from before or shortly after World War 2. The only thing it doesn't explain is why it has the production-style built in telescopic sight, instead of the original prototypes open sights:
[[http://world.guns.ru/assault/aug_pr1.gif]]

:I can deal with the CAR-15 because it's at least ''plausible'', but the "SOG got it first" excuse doesn't work with the guns that didn't yet exist. The AUG isn't just a customized version of another gun, it's a standalone design on its own. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:48, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

== For those of you who may be confused about the supposed MP5/UMP hybrid ==

This is what I'm talkin about: 

[[Image:CODBO-SMG.jpg]] 

As you can see, it appears that it has the reciever and magazine housing of an MP5 or MP5K, while the barrel housing (correct me if I'm incorrect in calling it that) looks like that of a somewhat shortened UMP. If you look closely, you will note that it has the MP5Ks finger guard (I'm guessing that's what that is) directly below the muzzle that looks like a cut down version of the full handguard found in this picture: 

[[Image:MP5Kprototype.JPG]] 

My point is I don't think it's a hybrid at all, merely an MP5K missing it's forward vertical grip, for some reason or another. And seeing as every other aspect of the gun is that of an MP5Ks, I think it's safe to say that's what it is, so I'm gonna change it to that on the front page. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:38, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

It ain't a hybrid, it is a real gun altogether. After doing some research I think I've found the gun or rather guns that it could potentially be. My first guess is:
*The H&K SMGI & II
http://www.hkpro.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=103:smg-i-a-ii&catid=11:rare-prototypes&Itemid=5
*And second guess being the MP5 PIP
http://www.hkpro.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=102:mp5-pip&catid=11:rare-prototypes&Itemid=5
[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 19:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

== G11 ==

Anyone else as excited as I am for the inclusion of the G11? [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:16, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
:Just another anachronistic gun. Thats all. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 04:49, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

I sure as heck am. --[[User:AK-74Fan|AK-74Fanc]] 23:18, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

Eh the gun itself isn't that big of a deal to me, but I definitely am excited to see something that to my knowledge hasn't been in an FPS before. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 23:29, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
: Well, it have appeared already in few other FPS games. For example [[Delta Force: Land Warrior]], [[Global Operations]], [[IGI 2: Covert Strike]] or Code of Honor: The French Foreign Legion --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 04:58, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
::Those games are not up to the modern standard, though. ;) [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 12:11, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

:Really, you could say this is the G11s first appearance in a well known game, and will finally show it off to the masses. I love the weapon itself, and to see it finally make a big appearance like this makes me quite happy.[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The G11 was in Syphon Filter 2 [[Special:Contributions/98.237.107.108|98.237.107.108]] 02:25, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Can someone link me the video of the G11 being used? I don't want to search through all the reposts and copies of other videos.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 13:23, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== XM214 Microgun ==

Since it's going to cover the Vietnam era, and the way these types of games like to go over the top, do you think there's a chance that the XM214 Microgun is going to make an appearance? I know it was only a prototype, and was it was made in the 70's, but I thought I read somewhere that the SF guys tried it out only to find that it was not feasable having a gun fire at 4,000 rpm.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 03:14, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

:I think putting a Minigun in the game would be kind of stupid. I mean sure they could make it heavy and awkward to carry, but that thing would simply decimate anyone in it's path, whether they're behind light cover, in a vehicle or just in the open. I'd love one, but methinks not. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Not to mention it's impossible to actually fire one with live rounds. -Mandaloin

== A more plausable fictional AR-15 ==

I can understand a frankengun, like some special forces guy back then would take several kinds of AR-15 designs and mash them together until he gets an awesome gun that works. And being special forces, they can get whatever they want to suit their mission, so it would make sense for whatever they take to not be standard issue or that it is known, but I don't like the flip up iron sights since I don't know when flip up irons came about or the flat top receiver. It's like they just took a Colt Model 933 and replaced the stock with an old style stock from the CAR-15. I mean, put a telescoptic stock on an M16A1 rifle, or A2 upper reliever on the Car-15 and swap out the pistol grip or something. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:16, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

:That would make sense considering the special forces style of the game. Also, Sonny (from Deadliest warrior and such) was on as an advisor for Spetsnaz and tactics, so look for both some epic Spetsnaz moves and even a character of him in game! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Do we even officially know yet what model AR-15 it is, aside of course from the flattop reciever and flip-up sights? [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 02:31, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

It pretty much is a Colt Model 933 without a brass deflector or forward assist, which actual does not exist. I have not seen a flat top reciever without the forward assist and the brass deflector. I don't even think flip up irons were invented back then. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:58, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

I mean if they threw in a CAR-15 tricked out like the ones seen in Black Hawk Down, I'd have no complaints [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:04, 22 July 2010 (UTC)
:+1. but they though it would look too bulky from first person perspective.

agreed. that movie was amazing. i wouldnt even care if you couldnt use the tac-lights but still the CAR-15s they had in that movie were amazing. does anyone no what the difference between CAR-15 and Colt Commando models are??? [[Special:Contributions/24.15.103.231|24.15.103.231]] 23:55, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
:I associate the CAR-15 with the XM177 style flash hider and the Commando to me is the M733 for it's short barrel [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:55, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

== New weapons! ==

Here's [[http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:GunWall.png]] a pic of a bunch of airsoft guns Treyarch has on a wall in their studio which pretty much confirms that they'll be in the game. 
From left to right, starting at the top: 
-M16A2 (?) 
-MAC-10 w/ supressor 
-AUG 
-Mini-Uzi 
-L85 
-Scorpion SA Vz 61 
-AKs-74u 
-Another Skorpion 
-SPAS-12 
-MP5 (?) 

Not sure exactly what the MP5 is doing as there already is the K variant prototype, and no idea what the HELL the M16A2 is doing there as there's already an M16A1 AND a CAR-15. What do you all think?
Sorry it's a bit blurry.

It could be a very blurry M16A1 or maybe because they somehow can bullshit their way into saying they got a prototype M16A2. And I prefer us to use the full size MP5 again. Looks like they got an L85 here. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:59, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

: That pic is here too :) Check out "extras" section in article :D

:The L85 got my gun-boner up, been wanting that since the MW2 L86 LSDisapointment. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Dude, put that away. :P [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 12:23, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

We might also see the Browning HP because of the rumored "Iranian Hostage Situation" level. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

:I wouldn't be surprised, but if I see another Desert Eagle, then I'll have to wtf. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Deagle prototype and AA12 prototype + level is moved to Buckingham Pallace to add more drama to the game. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::Sorry, Buck Palace? Explain this? I assume this is a rumour, since so far Operation Nimrod has yet to be confirmed aswell. Sounds interesting though (if a little rediculous and implausible)
::::just kidding. I just jumped on the Black Ops bandwagon [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

Im guessing the a2 is used since its more availible and when they do motion capture it would look the same. showing how someone moves with a m16 s what they're looking for,

:Also, the footage showing the Spetsnaz game models doing rolls shows the player holding and firing a clearly Vietnam era M16A1, so that's there for sure. Also, I do believe the Iranian Embassy raid will be tacked on much like Mile high Club in CoD 4, simple as a fun epilogue style bonus mission. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

"Black Ops is said to be set in various locations, including Vietnam and Cuba, [3] and judging from weaponry and dates given in the trailer, it is set between 1960 and 2010."
a quote from here: http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops

I really hope there's a Browning HP, cause it's cool and cause I'm Canadian lol. It might be in to be honest because in COD4 the Overkill and Last Stand pics had a Glock and then it was added in MW2, and the Overkill pic in WAW was a Browning HP :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 21:56, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I hope its just "iranian embassy raid inspired", not the real thing, i want more than 6 guys to shoot.

:This is Call of Duty, so you'll always have plenty of enemies to shoot. And yeah Alex, as a fellow Canadian, a Hi-Power would be a nice handgun to have in the game, and period correct. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

As much as I love the Hi Power and actually owning one, I don't want to see one in a game such as call of duty just because of the attention it will recieve from nerds spamming videos on youtube "HEY THIS GUN IS IN CALL OF DUTY!!!!1" It gets really annoying and that kind of attention seems negative to those that actually collect guns. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:29, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

:Partially agree with you there. I hate the attention guns get from these games (and suddenly every 12 year old becoming a firearms expert [yes, obviously the M16 is better than the AUG just because CoD says so]) but, I enjoy being able to play with them. Win some, loose some. Well, one or two firearms forums have noticed a HUGE increase in the number of people looking for the 'ACR'. As have a few rifle stores in the 'States that I know of have been plagued by idiot teens looking for hi-tech military grade gear...

I hope there is a HP, they need a 9mm gun for MP (more ammo, less recoil, but less damage) and Id rather see a cool gun then a lame generic beretta coming in.

I wouldn't mind seeing a Browning HP, (heck Indiana Jones used one, who wouldn't?) But then again it may look just a little bit too similar to the M1911 that's already confirmed for this game, so it's addition might be just a little visually redundant. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 05:04, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

:Hi-power and m1911...look similar? It sounds like "Elephant&Rhino look alike" or "M16 looks like AK 47".

I said they look similar. Not exactly alike. Besides, when it comes to COD, all of the guns are supposed to be easily distinguishable on the fly. If they gave one a different finish it'd be perfectly fine.

:Maybe so, maybe not, but all I'd like to hope is that the bloody ACR doesn't return, or else I'm burning down Treyarch studios. Honestly, MW2 just had cool and shiny guns that everyone would like, as opposed to realistic and proper guns used by militaries and militias. Of course the AK needs rails and a retractable stock, that makes it cooler! And of course we have the Barret, because it's big and makes a loud boom! And of course we have a Glock 18, because it's a Glock! I swear, it's like the IW developers had no idea what real special forces, Rangers, Spetsnaz and Militia would be equipped with, and instead went solely with cool, popular and impractical guns. Black Ops sounds like it's trying to be period correct, or at least have some different guns that other games. Sure there's an anachronistic AUG, but atleast it's not an ACR or Intervention in 1968! Rant complete! Also, I've heard lots of rumours of the Beta being released August 1st, anyone got any info on that? [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I've heard that rumor too, but as far as I know it has no information to back it up

some guy was selling beta codes on ebay (£12 for a demo!!!) but they have been pulled. unluckey for the 10 people that bought them as the guy was new and had (0)--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 22:04, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

They don't really need a high cap 9mm, while it wouldn't be realistic but they could do it like they did in WaW. I remember reading something about a old guy that was killed in his home and over 30 guns stolen and he had a Uzi and a FAL. The guy was in his 70s as I recall and someone said "a uzi and a fal? LOL someone plays to much MW2!" even though the guy most likely never heard of MW2. The FAL used to be fun to look up on Youtube, I discovered it through sportsman guide as a parts kit so I looked it up on youtube and it was just educated comments about the gun. Same video a few months later after MW2 came out it was just gaming nerds that thought they knew guns commenting. I don't want to see this happen to the gun thats in my shoulder holster. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:49, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

:COD nerds. Sooner or later they`ll grow out of it(like i did with Counter Strike) [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

Or not.

Who gives a damn if they do, what are you gonna do, buy a brand new gun, buy the most obscure handgun you can think of? Every profession, field of study, or interest gets its day in the limelight(save for the really boring ones), and videogames are doing this for guns. Do you think that symbologists enjoyed when the Da'Vinci code came out? They were probably just as annoyed as you for all the dilettantes who thought they suddenly knew something about symbology. What the hell are you gonna do? Nothing, I say. --[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 05:32, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

:I plan on owning guns when I grow up, have already handled and shot many guns, and yet I still plan to play CoD as an adult. You know why? Because I enjoy online gaming, and because oddly IRL you can't shoot people and get away with it (outside of airsoft, which I also play) [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Jigsaw, it appears as though you misread my post, I don't want them to include it because I hate the negative and dumbass attention guns online already attract. I feel as though my sport is tainted because of all these idiots. I'm fine with other games including it that aren't as mainstream but CoD is idiot infested. The 1887 Winchester is a perfect example, I learned about it from terminator 2 and thought it was cool and all and comments on those videos were either people that found out about it the same way and shooters. Now they are filled with nerds talking about it in MW2. Its seriously annoying. Seeing how you people come from video games and not shooting you won't be able to understand. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:43, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

Well you never addressed the negative attention bit in your original post, but still, how are you going to stop them? Sure it's annoying but it's nothing to stew over. And I like how you assume that we're 'from' gaming and not a shooting history so we obiously can't know how you feel. Also, your page says you're seventeen, I didn't realize that minors could get CCWs, or was that shoulder holster talk figurative, or do you live on a ranch or something?

It was in my own home and it was for real. Don't need a CCW to carry anyway. I never said I'm gonna stop them or make a petition or anything, I was just expressing my point. Yes I did address the negative attention. Alot of you on here in the video game section have more experiance with video games than actual firearms. I know someone that has made it so you he has to approve comments because of the videos of his Beretta M93r.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:18, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

:I'm also extremely proud that even at 16, I came from liking and learning about guns from sources outside of video games. Hell, even if I first see a gun in a game, I'll research it to learn some proper information, not the awesome CoD-Knowledge so many kids think they have nowadays. Literally, I had a kid telling me the ACR was better then the AK-47 the other day because "It's better in MW2, which is really close to real life". I laughed at him for a minute, then went on to own him with a five minute talk on the AK-47, which he promptly retorted to by leaving the game. Cod kids 0, Me 1 [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Eh I shoot when I can, but I mostly just read up on just about everything I can learn about a certain gun once I see it in a movie/game/real life. I wish I had more time to shoot. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 04:50, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

i hate it when people talk about the intervention sniper as being amazing. ok in real life its very powerful, and i first learnt about it from a film and i thought it looked ugly. i also hate the annoying 10 year olds with the duel shotguns, modern warfare 1 was a great game and tactical, MW2 was more tacticool. especially when you get kids, that shouldnt own the game but are spoilt enbough to get there parents buy it, they lecture you on guns like they have them in their living room and use them constantly. i like the ACR it looks cool, i know it as the 'magpul masdasa' but no one on COD as ever hear of the name. i would like to see pistols as secondary, they balance out the game and dont make it unfair. i would like them to make pistols louder to make them feel powerful rather than a crappy sound that seems quieter than a hole puncher--[[user:smish34|smish34]] 13:44, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

: Well, i always though that ACR looks terrible. First seen it in Future Weapons and only thing that i liked was fact that i can fire both 5.56 and 7.62. Intervention ? This is one of first guns that i heard about first in MW2. I imediattly googled some real life info about it :)

So did I. By the way, is it even called the Masada anymore? I thought Remington bought the rights and renamed it 'Remington ACR'. Oh well, either way I'm still gonna call it the Masada, it sounds better, and MW2 kiddies won't know what I'm talking about. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:10, 31 July 2010 (UTC)
:I always thought it was a silly name for a weapon. You ARE aware of what happened to Masada, correct? Yes, it's a great example of defiance in the face of incredible odds, but the fact remains, everyone eventually killed themselves. (Or each other, but you know what I mean.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:38, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

It was designed by Magpul under the Masada name and then Bushmaster started building them. Then came Freedom group that bought Remington and they decided to buy bushmaster. So now the bushmaster ACR has the remington name on it even though they have nothing to do with design or manufacturing.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 16:42, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Ah, I see. And I had no idea that happened to Masada, I'll have to look into that. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 17:49, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

:Well, from what I've heard as a heavy rumor from many places, tomorrow could be the release of the Black Ops Public Beta. It seems logical, as it gives roughly two and a bit months of Beta before it's closed so Treyarch can finish the game off for the November release, but then again maybe not. All I can say is, fingers crossed, because tomorrow we could be going deep and going hard men![[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Tommorrow? Now I seriously doubt that. I don't think they can just drop a public beta on us like that without an official announcement. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:27, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

:::It's happened before, and if not released tomorrow, maybe they announce it tomorrow then release for Monday. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

well they havent confirmed nor denied the beta but some hackers found the codes a few months ago, they also found the halo reach beta codes months before it was announced. but i think they would give some indication on wether or not they are, also there was this guy selling codes on ebay a few days ago, definatly fake, and they have been pulled [[user:smish34|smish34]]

While i'm not fully aware of the differences between the ACR and the Masada, but the most notable is the location of the charging handle. The Masada has it over the ejection port while the ACR has it over the forend. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:16, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Correct me if i'm wrong, but I heard on youtube I heard that it was originaly call the magpul masada, but they changed the name because they didn't want the name masada on there gun so they changed it to the name acr. Liek I said if I'm way of correct me.

==Anyone Take Notice?==

During one of the gameplay videos, did anyone take notice to the AK-47 icon (where it said "Hold X For AK-47)? It looks a bit colored instead of grey (meaning i noticed some orange in it as well) [[SeanWolf]]

Those Icons are only grey, no color. It had to be behind it giving it the appearance of orange.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:27, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Well...i was looking at this image and it LOOKS colored (the stock)[[User:SeanWolf]]:

[[Image:CODBO-AK47blip.jpg]]

: That looks coloured to me too. Hmm, that's interesting. And it's not like it's all one color, like something could be behind it giving it the illusion of colour, the reciever seems to be some kind of a metallic blue while the wooden handguard and stock seem to be orange-ish. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:12, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah it is, Thats what I get for not looking at it. Thought it would have been the same as before. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:17, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

== New Trailer ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_fsM6LBi54

Straight off the bat, there's a FAMAS, Ballistic Knife, and what some people on the CoD wiki have claimed to to be an Arctic Warfare type sniper rifle. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:55, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:...and an exploding RC car. Interesting...--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:12, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
::''Holy hell...they've stopped trying. Depending on how any demo and reviews are, I might just buy it for the single player, but the multiplayer is completely out of the question. They took Modern Warfare 2 - which wasn't the best of bases to start with - and made it worse. Just like Treyarch, I suppose.'' --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 18:14, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

: It looked a lot better than MW2 to me. A lot of the minor details looked the same, like the kill medals at the top of the screen, but other than that not much looked the same. And I do believe that was an Arctic Warfare, but I'll have to look a little closer before I'm sure. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 18:30, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

: Watched it again: Yes, that is an Arctic Warfare. And another thing to note, the FAMAS was missing it's carry handle! Again, Treyarch? Really? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 19:14, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

:There IS a FAMAS without the carrying handle, but it's a DMR and the carrying handle is removed solely to mount a scope on it [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:39, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::kind of like this.--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 19:58, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
[[image:Famascoddmr.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

:The one in the game is EXACTLY like this thing. Even though it's a FAMAS again, it does look kinda cool despite the fact that this gun never existed during the Cold War...this is stupid. They got an AR-15 that shouldn't exist, an Accuracy International Arctic Warfare that shouldn't be in the game, the AUG, which might not exist in the game either, and now a FAMAS that shouldn't exist. They going to pull anything else out of their asses? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:02, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::Unless they've gone down the "we don't care that it's not historically accurate, we're trying to make it fun" route. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 20:27, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Mind you, all of this is from multiplayer. It's multiplayer, there's no story, no setting. Why can't they use anything they want? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:31, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

:::: You do know this places THROUGH OUT the cold war. This is also a MULTIPLAYER trailer, so a number of weapons that appear through out the game can appear. Now, I'm not defending this game, I don't even play CoD anymore. But I'm just saying the fact's about the game. I mean...Yes, if the Accuracy International Arcticle Warfare appeared in single player in a Vietnam mission, then yes, "What the hell..." But this is a multiplayer teaser. (Just to say the Accuracy International Article Warfare started producing in 1982 which the Cold War was still up and running) Please don't rant at me, as I'm just giving the fact's about the game. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 20:34, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::::::Ok, if a gun appears in the MILTIPLAYER, then it most likely will appear in the game. I have yet to see a shooter game that has guns that appear in the multiplayer mode NOT appear in single player. I've seen the reverse, like in MW2, the SVD appears in singleplayer, but not multi. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:36, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

And to ADD to that, yes we know this game takes place THROUGHOUT the cold war, which was official between the end of WWII and 1989 ish. The FAMAS wasn't even in production until 1995. The AUG might be excused but the year the mission took place when it made an appearances is 68 and the weapon wasn't even patented until 77. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:40, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Could someone edit the Famas section?It says that it appeared in multiplayer foor

The creators said that the guns that they have are prototypes so some of them will be used when not in service.
:Well the creators are bullshitters. You're telling me the French created the FAMAS carrying handleLESS prototype almost 20 YEARS before it was put into service? And the G2 rail version even which was made in 2001? I might forgive the AUG somewhat, but there is so much bullshit I can take here. There are so many other weapons Treyarch could use, but they had to try to somehow bullshit the weapons from MW2 into this game instead of being original. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:47, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah I agree that Treyarch could have picked another gun, but if you think about it all the recent call of duty game (Modern Warfare, Modern Warfare 2) not all the guns that are used in the game would be used at that time, but they are little thing like the w1200 wouldn't be used in 2011 and the wa2000 in 2016 so maybe the famas and the ar 15 are the acceptions.

MW2 is a different kind of weapon selection. It takes place in an unspecified "near future" kind of storyline or present day. All the weapons in the game exist in the current timeframe. MW2 isn't a period piece game, COD from 1 to 3 were all WWII games and Modern Wafare is well, as the title goes, "Modern Warfare." Black Ops takes place within the Cold War, a time before 1989, so any guns before than is acceptable. Sure, seeing a gun that won't be out in the open market for another 2-3 years, yeah I can accept that. A lot of prototype weapons are like that, but the FAMAS is in a game that is more than a decade before the concept inception of said weapon. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

It's a bit more than a decade. The game's set in 1967/68, so a good thirty-odd years before it was conceived. The problem is, they could have inserted the real FAMAS prototype, no problem (1971, compared with 1974 for the AUG). [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 23:13, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

I heard that treyarch isn't going past the 1980 mark.

Ok I agree with maybe Treyarch just abused the prototype thing, but they can always take the famas out, they look at the forums.
:I don't think they do [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:24, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

On the new multiplayer video did anyone see the guy roll out the way around the :36 mark? - the marksman.
:Looks like he jumped and slide away from the gunfire. I hope we get to do that. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:55, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

: We can. If everything else from that old Multiplayer rumor is also true, which is a very real possibillity as a lot of it was confirmed or all but confirmed in that trailer, it will be a standard mechanic and won't need any kind of a perk or anything. Also, I've just gone ahead and decided to completly disregard this game realism. It's obviously trying to be some sort of "Modern Warfare back in time" deal, so at this point I'm just hoping it's fun. And that's all that will really matter in the end, right? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:39, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
::No, I can't accept that! Call of Duty originated as a game that takes place in a set time frame and immerses you in it with historical accuracies. Every game except for MW2 has been very accurate, especially when compared to other video games. If they wanted all these modern guns, then why make the time frame set in Vietnam/the Cold War? Why all of a sudden do they only care about making it look cool instead of providing us with realism like they always have? With the FAMAS G2 FELIN and the Accuracy International Rifle, they are officially bullshitting about the fact that these are prototypes in the Vietnam War. There can be no more arguments against that fact. But why do they have to do that to what was once such a legitimate series?
:::Look around on this page, and we go into why they chose the time period they did. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:11, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

: Money. Most consumers don't care or even know that most of these guns weren't around in the game's time period, they don't even really care about the Singleplayer, they just want cool guns in their Multiplayer. Of course I don't agree with this at all. 02:50, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::That still doesn't make sense to me. Call of Duty got its very successful start making realistic games. When it came out Call of Duty 4 was one of the best selling games ever and it's one of the most legitimate modern war games I've ever seen. Based on that you would think that people like seeing an accurate game.
:::First off, a game where you can single-handed kill half the German army is not that realistic. In fact, I personally think it's a bit insulting to the real veterans who only had one life and no continues to play with. Second, MW2 wasn't realistic and it still sold a bajillion copies. Yes, it's about the money. Don't like it? Then don't spend your gaming dollar on it. Our wallets are our votes. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:00, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Obviously being able to kill a million people isn't realistic. Perhaps a better word would be accurate. You can tell in the first 5 Call of Dutys they made a good effort to get their shit right. Now they don't even try. I don't understand why they stopped trying with MW2 and now why Treyarch is following suit. I wouldn't buy any of these games but there's no more realistic or accurate games coming out anymore and I can only play the old Rainbow Six and Ghost Recon games so much before I get tired of them.

I'd like to make a small correction, the FAMAS was designed from 1967-1971 and the first generation FAMAS's entered service in 1978. Dose this mean you'd see a G2 in the Vietnam war, no but a prototype without a carry handle could hypothetically have exited in the time of the game.

=== I think this is actual FAMAS Prototype ===

Isn it ? Whatever. It will be awesome if actual prototypes of guns will get in.
[[image:FAMAS_PROTOTYPE.JPG|thumb|none|400px]]

If it is than they won't put it in, doesn't look as cool you know, thats what counts.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:34, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Pepole please acquant yourself with the FAMAS's history here. Thank you. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FAMAS]

== The COD wiki ==

I just looked over at the COD wiki and it is a nightmare over there on their format and what little info they put on their pages and disregard the "gun nerds" on any contributions. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:46, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

That's because there's a policy against adding IRL info to the weapon articles. Although I've just been having an argument with someone who was convinced the FAMAS here was an F1. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:52, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Have they ever seen the F1 FAMAS, it has the carrying handle. Only the FAMAS G2 had the option of getting no carrying handle. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:53, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

His initial argument was that it couldn't be a G2 because it had a small trigger guard and was using the proprietary magazine, rather than the large hand-guard and a STANAG magazine (despite the G2 being able to fit+feed both). [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:57, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:Then this FAMAS don't exist either in the real world like the Ar-15. The developers are also looking at "Black Ops" history wrong. The concept of today's special forces were really different back then during the Cold War. It's not the same kind of people or style as it hasn't been refined like today Spec Ops. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:12, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm over at Cod wiki right now.

==Those are definitely explosive tips==

The attachment on this picture:
http://www.imfdb.org/images/7/77/Codblackopsunkownattachment.jpg
is definitely explosive tip for crossbow.
just watch the trailer and stop at 0:30 and look in the killfeed.
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/804/callofdutyblackopsmulti.png

==A nice detail==
Look at 0:09 in the new trailer, there is clan tag written on the AR-15 charging handle.

Yeah, I noticed that. I like that little touch. But I hope it doesn't just copy his clan tag from next to his name and paste it on the charging handle, I hope I can have something written on my gun without having to have a clan tag. I don't particularly like clan tags, mostly because I hate clans. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:55, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

==Ballistic knife==
would the Ballistic knife be listed as a firearm or not?

Maybe it does shoot a projectile even thought it is not a firearm.

No because its not a firearm.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:43, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

To be fair though, the crossbow isn't a fire arm, but it is a ballistic weapon. And isn't the Punisher's compound bow up even though THAT isn't a firearm? Just put up the ballistic knife.--[[User:True Night]]

I have a better idea: Since they aren't firearms, let's remove the crossbow from this page and the compound bow from the ''Punisher'' page. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:44, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

just for that tom jane is going to kill you with a bow and arrow. good job . and the balistic knive uses high tention (missspeled) springs, so id call it a projectial if anything. not to mension that , if you look at the rock on this site , it has the little dart shot gun that nick cage uses in the begining. simmons 8492

== Snub Nose ==

I went over to cod wiki and there is a page about a snub nose attachment for the colt python
Confirm?

I swear I saw snub nose in the new Multi-player trailer. Maybe faster draw?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Went back to the video and I saw it, the guy is switching to it. http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/319/snubnose.png[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:20, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Hmm...Snubnosed=less accuracy+shorter range= more XP per kill? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:51, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Probably the same logic that it somehow gets more damage with a shorter barrel like the double barrel shotgun in WaW. I'm leaning more towards a faster draw.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:36, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Apparently, it leads to more accuracy and less damage. Hmm [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 02:15, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Anachronisms ==

Can we please not say that the guns are anachroistic on the actual page? Because Me, along with alot of other people, agree that we really don't care about anachrosisms so please can we just limit comment about anarchistic guns to th talk page please? Thank you. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 20:54, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

:Then what's the point of a discussion page if we can't DISCUSS about shit? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:34, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Also, since this ISN'T the Call of Duty Wiki, where it is full of people who can't accept REAL facts, I am undoing all the erasing of pointing out that the guns are anachronistic. Cause that's how I roll [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:45, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
:I'm one of those people who don't think it'll affect the quality of the game, but I do believe it should be pointed out. I also believe we'll be able to make a better judgement call on whether or not these are truly anachronistic or just victims of an alternative timeline once the game actually comes out. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:59, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

:Drjuki, the whole point of this whole site is the guns and this page is to discuss the ones in the game. And like Excalibur said, this isn't the Call of Duty Wiki where factual real world information about said guns is against the rules. So, yes, we ''are'' going to point out anachronisms. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:13, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

:: Although I do think it should be noted on the page when a certain firearm is anachronistic, I also think it should be simply noted, not ridiculed. Not sure if there really is any on this page, actually haven't looked at it in a while, but it's been a problem on other pages, with commments such as "Aparently they did no research" and such. Our job here is to jot down the facts, not intermingle them with our own thoughts. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:04, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Well that's just it, we don't have the facts. We have images, and no context. Why not just wait until the game actually comes out? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:11, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
The context of the trailers and images is that the game takes place during the Cold War period and we have a gun like that AR-15 carbine. No forward assist or brass deflector and the weird magazine. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:24, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:The context of a three minute trailer, or multiple three minute trailers that tell us nothing? I'm fairly certain I've seen all the trailers, and yet I can't tell you what the overall goal of the campaign is. What are we fighting for? To prevent nuclear war? Assassinate rogue agents? Who's the villain? Is there one? It can all be a dream, or a fevered hallucination for all we know. And it wouldn't surprise me at all if the plot was paper thin. It's MP that sells the game. The only reason why there's a campaign at all is because they can't sell the game for full price if it's only MP. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:03, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::We can ridicule anachronisms if we want, it's a discussion page where we can say what we want. And yeah they didn't do their research or worse straight up ignored the fact these guns didn't exist back then. I think more of us would agree that Treyarch failed on the firearms.
::: Seriously. Only firearms ?
I wasn't talking about the discussion page, I was talking about the main page. Say whatever you want here. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 15:24, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:No one was really talking in the main page. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:25, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

::Well good, let's keep it that way. It's been a problem on other pages, with ''much'' less incorrect details than this game, so I was just trying to keep it clean here. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 15:35, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

--[[User:Jackie.45Cal|Jackie.45Cal]] 12:18, 12 August 2010 (UTC)Im sorry but if you are going to put a gun that wasn't even in development until 2001 in a game set pre 1989 then you may asweel put an ipod in too. It's just silly, those guns were made with materials and machinery that didn't even exsist. I'm personally hoping that there is a surprise mission that takes place in a more modern setting.--[[User:Jackie.45Cal|Jackie.45Cal]] 12:18, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

== Watch the ending of the Campaign reveal that.... ==

The SOG soldiers are back in time to prevent a nuclear war, and they brought all their guns and equipment from the future with them. That would just make my day, would be so awful it's hilarious. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:26, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:Honestly, I'll cry if that happens. In the metaphorical sense, of course. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 22:46, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

== Dragunov? ==

In the new Prestige Trailer [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4HreDGcQus]], people have speculated that the rifle the sniper is carrying at the end is a Dragonuv. Anyone concur?

watch ust before he blows up, the stock and the positioning are from the draganuv --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:02, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Its a dragonuv. Also I noticed the Dragonuv style scope in the very begining. Do we finally get different redicles for the different rifles?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:17, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

I think the action diver had one, too

== R/C car ==

For Modern warfare 2 it was the nvgs and now we have a R/C car with a camera and a microphone. what are your thoughts on this?

Dumb crap makes my wallet giggle... --[[Special:Contributions/99.65.211.227|99.65.211.227]] 09:51, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Retarded gimmick is retarded.

== Some prototypes photos ==

So... When Treyarch decides to put prototype guns, why not choose actual prototypes ?

For exmaple '''prototype Famas'''.[http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Talk:Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops#I_think_this_is_actual_FAMAS_Prototype]

Post more prototype photos. I wish to see ''AUG, SPAS'' or ''AWM'' prototype.

And i have one question - May be Stg. RH-70 some kind of AUG Prototype ?
[[image:2757881.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

I just looked it up, its not a AUG Prototype, its a gun that was meant to be a 5.56 x 45 rifle to replace the G3 as the service arm but its not a AUG prototype.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:02, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

The way things are nowadays if it doesn't look cool its not gonna be in the game. Wouldn't surprise me if the G11 is covered by rails.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:42, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:Probably. It also bothers me that in WaW and CoD4 they actually tested and recorded most of the weapons. We all know there is no way they got their hands on a G11 to test it or record sounds from it.

Probably gonna take sounds from another gun. IMO though that gun is UGLY! --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:03, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:Who would know what a G11 sounds like? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:22, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

There is a youtube video which i'll post here for you guys of it, probably already infested with CoD nerds posting dumbass things and arguing about MW2.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:45, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6JWCEmCgD8--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Huh, so that's what caseless ammo looks like. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:11, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

The SPAS 12 prototype: (note the shorter barrel and different folding stock): [http://spas12.com/spas/franchimod12a.jpg]
The AUG prototype (with many differences from the final product): [http://world.guns.ru/assault/aug_pr1.gif]----[[User:Markit|Markit]] 03:13, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Looks just like the shorter model, combat model I think. I forgot.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:56, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Never mind that gun is pretty much the AUG prototype. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:04, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

If the AUG in the game looks like the prototype, I can ignore it, but it looks like the modern variant [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:14, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Looks like it's made by Heckler and Koch judging by the stock.But that's just me.It could be and AUG prototype but who knows?---Matchgradeweapon

==RPG-7==
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100812011017/callofduty/images/9/93/RPG7BO.png

Can someone put that pic on the page in "RPG-7" section? I got this image from here: http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/RPG-7

==Time period and Guns==

There is a lot of stuff on this page so I don't know if this has been said or not, but this game takes place in different time periods so that's probably why there is such an array of anachronistic weapons. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Finally someone said it. The developers said the game takes place in the '''COLD WAR''' not just Vietnam. Everyone keeps complaining about this gun and that gun being anachronistic to 1968 but it looks like a decent amount of this game will take place after that time. I've heard talk as late as the 80's so wouldn't that then make the AUG, SPAS, and FAMAS technically time period correct? --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 17:35, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

:That point has been made before, and it becomes moot when a SPAS-12 (developed in the mid 1970s) turns up in the middle of the Tet Offensive in 1968, or likewise when an unchanged AUG A1 rifle appears in the late 1960s when it wasn't even patented until 1974. The "but black ops are so awesome they get secret prototype weapons!" argument would have made more sense if the weapons in question actually existed in the years that specific levels take place in. What the developers are doing is tantamount to giving you an AK-47 in 1943 and telling you that its presence is historically accurate because it was designed in the same era. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 19:27, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

: Even if the game would take place in 1989 ( ''And i guess it wont'' ) FAMAS FELIN will be still anachronistic.

== The Best Thing About Black Ops..... ==

.. '''None of that goddamned overpowered burst-fire weapons!!!!!!'''
Now, before you all fly off the handle at me. I just want to say a few things. 1- I am not a member of this site, but I visit it every time I want to identfy a gun used in a movie. 2- I do have real-life gun knowledge, unlike the fools who play Call of Duty and suddenly assume they're gun experts.
I do realize that many people find 3-round bursts useful in real-life. I see it as unecessary and useless. I'm also going to add that I am a Call of Duty player and I know for a fact that they intentionally make the burst-fire weapons overpowered, which is why I am so glad that it won't be featured in Black Ops.
:While I can agree with you that the kids who think that playing CoD automatically qualifies them as firearm experts are annoying (I've actually had a kid try to tell me that the AUG, the normal one, is a machine gun and not an assault rifle), and while I can also agree that I don't prefer burst fire weapons to automatic ones in real life, I have to disagree on your main point. The three shot burst weapons in Modern Warfare 2 are not overpowered. How many shots, without stopping power, does it take to kill with the M16A4 or the Famas? One burst, or three bullets, though on extremely rare occasions, it takes four bullets. How many shots does it take, again without stopping power, to kill with a SCAR-H, or a TAR-21? Again, three. So no, the burst weapons aren't over powered. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 20:49, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

: That doesn't neccessarily mean it's balanced. It also has a ''much'' higher rate of fire, even ''less'' recoil, if that's even possible, and a farther range, if I remember correctly. Now the M16A4 in MW2 was pretty balanced, but really only because it had a bit of spread with it's shots. The FAMAS, however, was the most unbalanced piece of work in gaming history. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 00:42, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::Which is really strange to me, since I was much better with the M16 then I was with the FAMAS. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 08:02, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Actually they may have the M16 be some sort of burst fire prototype, after all they got the cool stuff before it exsisted and produced so they just might.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:58, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Well in Metal Gear Solid 3, they got away with having an XM16E1 with a 4 selector capability [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:17, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

first , i had a kid tell me that the moddel 1887 is a rifel , based only on the fact that it has a lever and not a pump. i own no guns and also only pop on this site to win bets with my brother but i know that. but dose any one know if the m16 or famas have selector switches that can be changed?

Yes they do. The FAMAS can shoot on semi auto, and the M16a4 also has semi auto.[[user:Greywolverene|Greywolverene]]

== New pics ==

IGN has some new BO pics:

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054555152.html?page=mediaFull]

Theeeere's that forward grip on the AUG.

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054602839.html?page=mediaFull]

Okay, the AK mag IS a little off. And the holster looks like the holster for a Walther P38/P1. Any ideas on that shotgun (?) on his back? Or is it an M79?
:AK has a proper 545 plastic clip with little ribs on the side. But I would more like to see AKS74 in game...
::Magazine is the proper term.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:55, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
Shotgun is probably china lake laucher.
: Yes, it is. '''Russians with China Lake GL'''? Yeah, thats even more stupid, anachronistic and epic failing than Russians with SPAS.
::dude...thats the KS-23 shotgun. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
::What makes you think he's Russian? And even if he is, it could be multiplayer for all we know. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:36, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::: He has SP´s russian model. And i think its SP mission - Because all other "new" screens are from SP :)
[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054551731.html?page=mediaFull]
::::What about the Russians running around with FALs in MW2? or TAR 21s?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:00, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::::: Yeah. It was really stupid too...
Inception had the MW2 dream, so you know people are going to call this the "Inception level."

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-treyarch-project/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054558715.html]

A) This doesn't really look like a new picture, and B) it looks like he's using 20 round mags, but with 30 round ammo pouches. (Epic fail. WTF?! I'm going to cancel my preorder this instant!)

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:32, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

== I think they did it again... ==
With the fictional flattop ARs, I mean. A screenshot of Frank Woods on the Call of Duty Wiki looks like the M16 he's holding has a flattop just like the AR Carbine. Take a look for yourself [http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100730204211/callofduty/images/6/6b/M16A1.jpg]. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:53, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

It does look like the carry handle is missing. Wouldn't surprise me if this M16 is also burst fire.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:27, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
: You are wrong. It will have burst fire ( well, you are right in that ) but it will have RIS Rails all over the place. NV Scope and lasers.... sure.

I can believe it if it has the early night optics that are as large as a professional camera. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:41, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

:Eww.. Its Treyarch. Those optics will be even smaller than they are in our days.
::Oh right, they'd just take something that DID exist and turn it into something stupid for its time and say black ops can do it [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:27, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

==Galil and KS-23 confirmed at Gamescom 2010==
http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Galil & http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/KS-23 [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
: + Makarov. But get some proper screenshots first. Those from cod wiki are terrible quality.
::Couldn`t find anything better. Well see more in the upcoming days. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::I'm impressed. I don't think I've ever seen either in a game before. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:14, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
::::KS-23 maybe, but the Galil was Counter Strike. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKtnJkjxhog Crap quality! I know, but that was the only way he could smuggle the footage. Makarov pistol around 9:50, KS-23 near end. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

:Makarov! :D, Then again we are gonna get a crapload of new Makarov "experts"--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 15:12, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
::I counter them with my Hi-Power! [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::No! Then there will be Hi Power "experts"! Not my favorite handgun!--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:38, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

I wonder if they classify KS-23 as shotgun or rifle/ carbine.
:Given the capacity (four rounds) and the fact a lot of the available rounds appear to be grenades, maybe a grenade launcher, a Russian equivalent to the China Lake launcher. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:48, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
::The guys at Treyarch must have heard your rants about "Spetsnaz didn`t use the SPAS" and the put the KS in. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:KS is yet another anachronism.
:: I think at this point that's a given. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:58, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
:OMG GUYS STOP IT! If you point out any more of them we`ll be walking into a soviet base with nothing more then knives and pointy sticks, forced to do roundhouse kicks every 10 seconds to conserve ammo! Treyarch means serious biznis! [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

"Black Ops is said to be set in various locations, including Vietnam and Cuba, [3] and judging from weaponry and dates given in the trailer, it is set between 1960 and 2010."
I must paste it once again...[(BTW in CoD4 we had that Pripyat mission in 1995, so I guess Treyarch made another "American/English commandos in Russia after Cold War" mission)(Sorry for my crappy English)]
: It seems like you are trying to protect Treyarch´s weapons choice, right ? But dont forget that both already seen missions took place in 1968. And they had SPAS-12 and AUG......

I find it hard to believe when they say that this game will take place during the Cold War and now you say there will be a mission taking place in present day? How did you come across that information? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:47, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Info is from CoD wikia, but yeah, I forgot that in leaked video those guys had "CCCP" written on their backs, so the mission takes place before 1990s. Sorry for mistake.
: And what is even better. It has been confirmed that WMD mission takes place in 1968.

== AI Arctic Warfare ==

Man, That sucks! IW now decides to put in the awesome AI Arctic Warfare and now it doesn't even fit because it's very anachronistic in this game (as is the Walther WA 2000 and other weapons). Why was it not in the MW series? It would of fit perfectly in the first MW, it would of made more sense in the mission All Ghilled Up than the M14s because )1 it's British )2 it was available at that time (1995 right?). And it would have been far better than stupid Remington 700 in MP, I mean come on, the Remington 700 IS the M40A3! They just decided to make the scope wobble more and gave it the same damage as the .50 cal Barrett M82A1 WTH! MW2's main menu art even has a sniper with AI AW (and also a soldier with a SCAR-L) but it's not even in the game. Well, at least they put the CheyTac M200 Intervention in the game.

You seem to have overlooked the fact that this isn't an Infinity Ward game, it's being developed by Treyarch, who have no affiliation with IW. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:30, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well, they do share the same parent company, Activision. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:39, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
:Even so, I doubt Treyarch would have any say in what weapon IW would put into their game, or vice versa. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:48, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
::OK, Then I meant Treyarch/IW. By the way, did Treyarch make both MW games? I'm just making sure.
:::Treyarch had nothing to do with Modern Warfare, IW made both. Treyarch did COD5. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 10:23, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Alright thanks for clearing that up. I'm just saying it would have made more sense if IW had the AW in the MW games. As I said, it would have fit well both sense wise and realism wise.
::: "The Accuracy International Arctic Warfare rifle is a family of bolt-action sniper rifles designed and manufactured by the British company Accuracy International. It has proved popular as a civilian, police and military rifle since its introduction in the '''1980s'''." If you want the real date, it's actually 1982 when the L96A1 came into British Military service. Oh, and the Walther WA 2000 was desgined in the 1970s - 1980s and first produced in the same year as the L96A1 came into service, 1982. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 08:35, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Thank you. Didn't the mission All Ghilled Up take place in 1995? That's why I think the AW/L96 would have fit better in MW because your playing as British snipers, Price and the other guy (sorry, can't remember his name). As for the WA2000, what the hell is it doing in MW2?! it's not a Military rifle! (guess it's in there cus they thought in looked cool *sigh*). And in BlackOps, both the AW and WA2000 are highly anachronistic.

:Seriously, why can't Treyarch pick weapons that have NOT been in the previous game? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 13:35, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::I think they're trying to compromise, including familiar favorites like the SPAS and the FAMAS and putting in more obscure (at least by gaming standards) weapons like the Galil and the KS-23. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:31, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Who the hell is using the Israelite Galil in the this game?! I hope not the Russians.
::::They just needed to have a jew gun in the game instead of TAR.
:::::Oh course, it's that vast international Jewish video game weapon conspiracy. How could we forget? (Jew gun? What are you, a hillbilly?) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:13, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::Don't forget that most of those "Jew guns" could rip you apart, or are you forgetting the Uzi family, Desert Eagle, Jericho, and Tavors? Not to mention what they can do in the hands of Mossad. Don't make the mistake of underestimating Israel, it'll likely be the last mistake you ever make.:D -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:21, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::I don't see nothing good about those "kosher" weapons. All of them are inferior compared to western (and even russian) designs.
:::::::Great the WA2000 again, That thing is ugly, rare, and definatly not a combat rifle. IW was playing too many hitman games when they thought of that. Treyarch copying it is just really stupid.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:24, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::You gotta admit, Israels got some great weapons; this coming from a guy who loves German and Russian weapons, and also good ol' Browning's designs. :D Oh, and the big reason the WA2000 is not used in the Military is the same reason the awesome HK PSG1 is not used: it's too heavy and delicate for Military use.
:::::::::The WA2000 is a expensive and rare gun. I believe that 200 something of them were made. There are many better guns in all aspects than the WA2000. Its not just that its too delicate, its expensive, bulky, and rare. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::::::::Name a few?
Somebody needs to stop learning everything they know from movies and games. Open your eyes, or maybe you should just go back to your Klan rally. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:24, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
:My facts about guns are only based on REAL LIFE information, never games or movies. (by the guy who started the AW discussion)

::Should make an account and sign your posts, easier that way.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:39, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

You should also get me some "real life" statistics that PROVE beyond a doubt that Israeli designs are "inferior." -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 14:22, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:Are you a hater like that guy who hates the Beretta 92? Oh and thanks FIVETWOSEVEN, I will consider making a account. :)
::Not at all, I happen to love the Beretta 92, I think it's one of the best handguns ever made. I just don't like when people make biased statements like that without giving a reason to back it up. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:44, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
:::I was talking about a guy on the Beretta 92 discussion page that hates the 92 for no real reason. and what IS wrong with the Uzi, Jericho, and the Tavor? What "facts" do you have that make these weapons "inferior"? Do you hate Israel or something? (note, I am not trying to rude, a jerk, or a wise-ass) The Uzi is more or less the SMG equivalent of the AK, it is simple, reliable, and cheap like the AK, the Jericho is, from what I heard, is a very good all-steel handgun, and the Tavor is a great step forward for Israel's assault weapon technologies. If I'm wrong, please tell me and prove it with real facts.
::::Correct me if I'm wrong, but you may have misread something, cuz it seems like that post was directed at me. I agree 100% with every point you just made there. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 18:07, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::I honestly think you two have gotten confused and started arguing with each other when you both support the same position. This is why it would be much easier if everyone had an account. As to my opinion on the topic, I love Israeli made weapons. You're right about the Uzi family. It's extremely rugged, though not terribly accurate (But you can always do worse). As to the Tavor and the Jericho? I've only fired the Jericho once, but it handled great, though I still prefer the 92FS to it. And the Tavor, I love the Tavor. Honestly, if I was going into combat and I was given the choice, I'd take the TAR-21 over an M4A1 any day. I mean, the M4A1 is a great gun, but I just have a thing for bullpups. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:43, 30 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::I'm really sorry about that, my mistake, I thought you were the same guy who said "I don't see nothing good about those "kosher" weapons. All of them are inferior compared to western (and even russian) designs."

Nah, I think he ran away under our combined onslaught. xD Anywho, if it isn't signed as K, it isn't me. :) -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 14:42, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Just pitching in here but isnt the Galil what the israelis made as an improved AK-47 ? I think i heard that on the millitary channel or something (btw the price for the WA2000 these days is minimum 40 000 $ THE 2ND VERSION IS MIN 75 000 $ there was only 176 built (thank you wikipedia)--[[User:Patrickgt|℗Λ✝r][©Κ]] 04:29, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

== SKS ==
:Hopefully there will be an SKS in game because with the part of the game taking place in Vietnam, it would make sense to see it in the hands of the Viet Cong.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 21:17, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::'''It would make sense.''' This is only and biggest reason why they wont put it in.
::As much as I agree with you, I wouldn't get my hopes up. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 22:11, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Even if they include it, would anyone use it? It doesn't do anything better than any other weapon you can get in the game. As much as I like the SKS in real life, I wouldn't use one if I had an AK or an AR-15 available. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:16, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
Oh you silly people, even if they included an SKS they'd bastardize it with enough railmounts to drive a train on, and then make it have an attachable grenade launcher/katana/lasersight/ammo dispenser. :) -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:34, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well. It would be RAIL with SKS attached.
: I never really had my hopes up.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 22:06, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::If they have the correct grenade launcher on it, probably will work just like it did in WaW. Firing a round through the grenade.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:58, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:Actually, only the yugoslavian version of the SKS had the grenade launcher. Not the Russian or Chinese version that would appear in game if it is put in.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 01:56, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Oh I was wrong then, never have payed too much attention to the SKS, also doesn't help that the most common seems to be a Yugo.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:41, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
: Its Romanian WASR there. So why not yugoslavian SKS ? Oh, and i think they will put it there with M203 or GP-25 on it.
::Tats not WASR but just a retarded AK-74
::: Well, i think they just googled "AK" and modelled first gun they have seen.
::::Or some crappy airsoft gun. I can't wait till a game is made where EVERY ASPECT of firearms is 100% CORRECT and not tacticool.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:05, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::Blame the internet then, not the 3d artists or the company. It's hard enough to find a high enough resolution orthographic picture of the gun you want to model. Sometimes you have to make do with a similar model. 3d artists just can't model a gun out of thin air, you need references to use as a backdrop during modeling, and let's face it, the artist is going to use the high res sideview of an AK-74 over a low res slightly off sideview of a genuine AK-47. As for airsoft, take note that airsoft companies often provide a perfectly aligned sideview of their guns, which works great for modeling. I'd take a 1000x700 picture of an airsoft M4 over a 400x300 picture of the genuine gun. And if you were a 3d modeler, you would too.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 02:30, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
::omgz they could check this site. Or... photograph a real deal when they were recording gun sounds. And if they for some f-ing reason left off muzzle break from AK74 that would be a fail
:::Or maybe get a real gun, don't even have to guy one, just rent or borrow one from someone that owns one. That isn't so hard is it? They did that with Lord of War with about 3,000 CZ rifles.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 14:09, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Lord of War was a feature film, starring Nicholas Cage. I'm sure they had a lot more money than the average game does. Why pay extra money on something that isn't integral to the quality or enjoyment of a game? Besides, airsoft guns are relatively cheap, and a number of companies sell full metal near exact(and exact in some cases) copies of the real weapons. But ultimately, if you can't look beyond an Mp5's lack of a paddle release, you are playing games for all the wrong reasons. And really, no muzzle brake is fail? Seriously, learn to live with it. Also, most of the pictures on this site are too small for modeling accurately off of. Some are large enough, but most aren't. And not all games record real guns in person for their sounds, and some that do simply use similar models or completely different guns.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 21:00, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::You do realize that this game is gonna rake in millions. They can't rent or buy a $400 AK 47?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:08, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::This is not exclusive to this game. You said you wanted to see ''any'' game that got everything right. Also, Treyarch is based in Santa Monica, ''California''. If you knew anything about Californian gun laws, you would realize how difficult it would be for them to get their hands on a genuine Ak47. Besides, the 3d artists don't really get to decide how all the company's money is spent. And I doubt a higher up would care enough(for somewhat good reason) to waste a thousand bucks on a post-ban Kalashnikov that is not the correct model anyway.

:::::::Once again, they could either rent or borrow one. Doesn't even have to be an actual Russian AK 47. It would be fine if it was a Yugo, Bulgarian or whatever, they are similar enough to not be a problem. The point is going alittle further and not basing the model off a crappy airsoft gun or the wrong picture.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:10, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

:The always present problem with game designers is that they forget the extreme details on a gun and when they do CGI modeling, they always make mistakes and forget somethings. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:26, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
::I think you missed a word.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:11, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
== AS VAL ==
: I think it would be cool if they put the AS VAL in as a weapon of the Soviet Forces
::No.

== AKS-74U? ==

Where in Sam Hill did you guys get that from? I never saw anyone holding one in the Teaser. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:23, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

It's on that wall of guns in the insight video, and theres apparently a pic at Call of Duty Wiki with someone holding it from the teaser. If you ask me, its still not 100% confirming it --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 02:19, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

This is the image they're saying is an AKS-74U [http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:AK-74uBO.png]. Not very convincing, if you ask me, but I wouldn't put it past Treyarch as they've already failed epically by the looks of things so far. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:27, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Definatly is a short AK something.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:05, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
:Yeah, it looks like a short AK, but we can't be sure exactly what it is. Hell, it could be a full length AK at a weird camera angle. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:47, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

There are so many AK variants out there they can pull out of their asses, why another AK-74U? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:15, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Because I doubt they know any others and they don't want to confuse players.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:53, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

== New details released ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kg_8mPoloBo

This confirms a whole bunch of stuff, too much for me to list. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 02:10 2 September 2010 (UTC)

: Almighty, there's a mini-gun....a ''handheld'' minigun...
::Wow! I'm so pumped for spaying batches of n000bs with that thing WOW

:: Who cares?! An Ithica! And an L96! I'm in love. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 02:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:::I just watched the video...HOLY CRAP...A MINIGUN?!...Im in heaven! [[User:SeanWolf]]
:: [[Predator#GE_M134_Minigun_Handheld|"Payback Time!"]] [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 03:22, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:::New weapons we see are the WA2000, Makarov, Ithica, RPK (first in first person), MP5K (first person), Skorpion, HK21 (Awesome!), M14 (wood!), M134 (nicknamed Death Machine), M16 (first person, burst), AKS-74u, and also that new blue-tinted scope, maybe a new version of thermal? [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:09, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

You can THROW A TOMAHAWK?! That's awesome! Now if only you can melee with it... --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:16, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

== Over and Under shotgun, HK21 plus even moar footage ==
As seen in this video: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/team-deathmatch-call-of/703936

There's also more new MP footage up on Game Trailers and floating around YouTube. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:If you didn't notice, the handgun at the beginning was an ASP. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 07:08, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:This killicon, taken from this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToRG_z3ib-o looks like a full sized Uzi: http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/1143/uzi.png -The Unsigned

== Create A Class Video ==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAM5AZxmT_M

WAY too much to write, just take a look, and at his other BO vids while youre there. Also, awesome pistol selection :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 07:03, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:While looking at the Create-a-class 2.0 vid shown here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCzSImy-xm4, I found it rather odd for the choice that Treyarch was going with on the weapon selection for the pistols at the 0:23 mark. Wouldn't it make more sense to place the Makarov PM as the starting pistol because of it's weak 9x18mm cartridge? I'd personally would have liked to see it like this:

*Makarov PM
*ASP
*1911
*Colt Python
*CZ75

[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 10:52, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

== Full Weapon List ==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jatp6Fgs-ak
The video's not too interesting, most of this is stuff from other videos, the cool part is in the description. Note that he wrote MAC-11 instead of CZ-75.

SMG: MP5K, Skorpion, MAC-11, AKS-74u, Uzi, PM63, MPL, Spectre

Assault: Enfield, M14, FAMAS, Galil, AUG, FAL, AK-47, Commando, M16, CLASSIFIED (There's actually no M1 Garand)

Shotguns: Olympia, Ithica 37, SPAS-12

LMG: HK21, RPK, M60

Sniper Rifles: Dragunov, WA2000, L96A1

Pistols: ASP, M1911, Makarov, Python, CZ-75

Launchers: M72, RPG-7, Strela, China Lake

M202 & M134 are apparently Kill Streaks and personally I think the Classified AR is the G11

:ASP seems like an odd choice to put in a CoD game. Relative to the game, it seems like they went out of their way to put in a pistol that isn't that much different in function to a Makarov. (A small pistol with a small magazine.) Why not just a Walther P1? Or a SW M39? Looking down the sights of the guttersnipe will be interesting though. And I again applaud Treyarch for bringing in guns that have been otherwise neglected in gaming. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:58, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I don't know if these are all the weapons or if there are less in this public version, though since it is a full reveal and they make sense how they are, it's reasonable to assume these are all of them. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

EDIT: The KS-23 isn't on the list for some reason, meaning this build may not have all the weapons, or the person who made the list simply missed it as it is the only known weapon not there. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 09:55, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Someone found a screencap of the ingame M60. http://a.imageshack.us/img834/7093/m60j.jpg

::I don't think the M202 or the M134 are Killstreaks as if you look at the "Create a class" video above around the 0:36 mark it lists all the Killstreaks. As far I've seen in the trailers, the M134 is rather ironically called "Death Machine", so it might just be a high level machine gun class weapon that the user has to buy. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 13:28, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

: I think the M202 and M134 might only be in the "Wager" game modes, were everyone has a chance to earn one.

== Seriously.... ==

This is going to be worst CoD game. Minigun ? Flamethrower attachment ? Jesus . Even most stupid game from most stupid studio with most stupid gameplay will be better than this shit.

: If you say so.

Whatever you say, man, and what's wrong with a flamethrower attachment? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:48, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Its completely idiotic.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:32, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:I think it sounds fucking AWESOME. No, it won't be realistic. But it's rule of cool, brohan.-protoAuthor 11:00, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, once you get over the fact that this game is inaccurate as hell, it starts to look pretty badass [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 11:38, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Peh, I'm past the point of even expecting this to be a realistic game. I'll enjoy it for what it is, but there's no way in hell that we're getting realism out of this. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:46, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

. reality and videogames are like an amish hacker , never gonna happen . this is going to be FUCKIN EPIC . simmons 8492

== Iron sights ==

Whats with all the guns having that same back sight, i was ok with the CAR 15 and even the FAMAS having it, then i thought that it was pushing it with the AUG. Then i saw that the M60 has those sights too??!!! I hear you can customuzie your sights and i hope to god you can, cause i would be pissed if all the guns had extremely similiar iron sights --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 11:43, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

'''IS WONT BE CUSTOMIZATED !''' Its just cool to have them, you dont understand ? 7-year kids / 99% of BO players ) wont even recognize M16 and M4. SO WHATS THE PROBLEM ? Epect nuclear grenade flamethrower tactical launcher screen in nearliest days.

: ...a little excited there, bro?

From what I've heard, there will be an 'improved iron sights' attachment. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:49, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

it looks like famas had a field day and fucked everything up . the pig dosent deserve that . and for all the idiots out there reading this and thinking"whats the pig, can you use farm animals as weapona" the pig is the name for the m60 , that gun hold a special place in my heart . simmons 8492

It really looks like they just took a lot of stuff from mw2 (like those god damned iron sights) and whats the deal putting Troy industries sight on an AUG? How stupid does that even look, couldnt hit shit in real life cuz there is no spacing between the front and rear post! Come on Treyarch i tough u could do better --[[User:Patrickgt|℗Λ✝r][©Κ]] 02:45, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

== Enfield ==

Has anyone else noticed then in the create a class trailer when he goes in to primary weapons it says enfield ? anyone wanna put that up ?

:I would but it's too little info to draw a conclusion on what EXACTLY "Enfield" is. It could be the SA80 but at the same time it could be something else, it's best to hold off for now until more info shows. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 15:50, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Yeah, it is most probably a SA80 but it can also be the L1A1.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 15:55, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

::When I saw Enfield, I had assumed it would be the EM-2. When was the last time anyone referred to either SA-80 or L1A1 as an "Enfield?" I google in "enfield prototype," and a picture of the EM-2 is the first thing that comes up. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:01, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Ya id say its going to be the EM-2 because on the killfeed for a teamdeathmatch i saw there was a weapon that looked like it

If not the EM-2, it could be one of the Enfield SA80 prototypes (E60-, XL70-...etc) - Enfield did start the SA80 program in the late 60's so it could be possible for them to show up. It might also explain why Treyarch had that airsoft L85 on their wall.

It's an XL64, at least according to the create-a-class picture. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 17:06, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I think - not sure though - in the multiplayer overview video, at 6.41 to 6.49, it is possible to view the Enfield with iron sights in first person - it has the SA80 type rail, a green-ish cheek rest on the left of the reciever and a green-foreguard. I could be mistaken though. If someone could get the screen shots up for closer inspection, it might be easier to tell. [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

You mean like [http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:L85_7.png this?] [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 19:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Bingo! You can see the real SA80/British 'dovetail' 19mm optics mounting rail (under those weird iron sights...)Cheers [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

It's the XL64 for sure, saw it in the video a couple sections down ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 20:53, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Which is the same video I pulled the create-a-class image from in the first place. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:00, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Yeah... not my best moment there, lol. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 04:21, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

== Burst M16? ==

When I saw the recent multiplayer trailer, I coulda sworn that the M16 was firing in 3 round bursts. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:57, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:It was, and while idont mind it being Burstfire, i do mind that they call it the M16 Raffica.--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 17:03, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Well I do cause there's no such thing as a burst firing M16A1. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:In the Black Ops world there is. GET WITH THE TIMES EXCALIBER!!!!1--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:11, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

And why should they call it the "Raffica"? (I know it's Italian for burst, but whatever.) [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 18:17, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

On the extended trailer thing on the xbox dashboard there is a Burst M16 and its called M16 raffica

A burst M16A1 is stupid. Havent these guys seen a Vietnam era movie? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:22, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

I agree it's stupid, but I suppose it will help make up for all of those full-auto A4s that are in every single movie. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 05:41, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

First off, FIVETWOSEVEN, what does "get with the times" have to do with anything? That made no sense. In the Black Ops world, they operate outside of ordinary methods of operations and tactics. They go into extreme conditions and use the best equipments they can get their hands on but as I said before, they don't acquire guns that havent been invented yet and the military mentality of soldiers back then are different than they are now. A soldier during the Cold War would see any new technology pointless instead of an advantage because of the training and mentality, the if it isn't broken, don't fix it. Special Forces were no exception. Sure they were outside the ordinary, but they wouldn't have just say "hey, I want a gun that can do the following thing, can I have one? If it doesn't exist, I'll just get a gun smith, invent the parts and materials and make it exist." That's not how things work in real life. Yes this is a game and I've just given up on trying to convince people otherwise. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

:*WHOOSH* That was the sound of the obivious sarcasm flying over your head.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:31, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:I think he means it's now obvious Treyarch doesn't care, so why fret over it? Short of some weird plot twist that we're currently unaware of (and again, we know absolutely nothing about the plot,) Treyarch simply doesn't seem to care about historic or technical accuracy. They're selling games to kids and stoners, not history buffs and gun dorks. After seeing all the recent videos, I'm resigned to the fact that all we're going to get is a vastly enjoyable game with a lot of replay value. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:53, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Remember, it's still full-auto in Singleplayer, as it should be. It's just 3-shot burst in MP so it doesn't make pot-head COD kids heads explode. Also, where do they call it the M16 "Raffica"? In the Create a Class videos they're listed simply as M16. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:36, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh it's only burst in multiplayer? Good. In multiplayer, anything goes. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:28, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Another video ==

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G94SolEtpnc]

You get the see the M14 stock, the Enfield, and it confirms the G11 (There's a contract called "G11 Cruelty." --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Ah, that would explain that one single classified weapon. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 21:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:Looks like they're leaving a lot of old stuff in - killstreaks, perks, sentry guns, weapons.
::As opposed to a CoD game without weapons? [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:54, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

== A Question about guns ==

Do you think there are any possibilities of Daewoo K1A or K2 appearing in this game?

I think its about time some major game has put in guns made in Asia.

K2 is a really accurate rifle, it could serve as the 'ACR' of this game and K1 can be like MP5K or UMP of this game
:[[Men of Valor]] had a Type 56. Does that count? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:14, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

We've already seen all the guns that are going in game. So quite slim chances there. Also, sign your posts. [[User:The Wierd It|The
Wierd It]] 08:56, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

: I don't think we've quite seen all of them. We've seen all of the Assault Rifles and Handguns, and only some of the LMG's, SMG's, Sniper Rifles, and Shotguns. And that video a few sections up with supposedly all of the weapons in the game in it's description, is most likely incomplete. I seriously doubt there are only 3 sniper rifles. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:41, 4 September 2010 (UTC)
::Didn't people doubt only 4 sniper rifles with MW2?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:30, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

: Perhaps, but they only needed 4 to fill out the basic sniper rifles roles of COD. A bolt-action, a large caliber, a jack-of-all-trades, and a low recoil-low power. But with only 3, and moreso because of the 3 that we've seen, we should expect more, because so far we've only seen the bolt-action and two normal semi-auto sniper rifles that shouldn't be all too different from each other. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 05:33, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

==FAMAS correction==
That's not a G2 FELIN, it's a F1 FELIN prototype. The one in the screenshots is based off the F1 model (note the small triggerguard and straight magazine). The G2 FELIN platform is based off of the FAMAS G2 and is distinguishable by the sheer massive amount of stuff strapped to it.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 18:47, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

All the photos of the G2 FELIN I've seen have the small trigger guard. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:57, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7f/FAMAS_Felin_501556_fh000002.jpg [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:16, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

==Unknown Machine gun or Assault rifle?==
[[Image:Codbp_uklmg.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
Here is a picture seen in new multiplayer tralier.

:It's a HK21. Watch in HD, it says in the bottom right. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:57, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

==Unknown rocket launcher guide missile==
I seen in new multiplayer tralier.

The only thing I've seen that sounds like that is the 'Arch Angel' killstreak weapon, a missile guided by the player via a camera. (Similar to the Predator guided missile from Modern Warfare 2's killstreaks except that 'Arch Angel' appears to be a shoulder-fired system) [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

Thank for information guy.In cod wiki they call "Valkyrie Rockets".
http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Archangel
[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

== Flamethrower ==
I seen few second on enemy hand in new multiplayer tralier.

:It's an underbarrel attachment, too. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:54, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

== Grim Reaper? ==
In the wager match video, after the player gets a kill with the WA2000, you see him switch to something called the grim reaper but you never get to see what it is, any ideas?
:It's what they've dubbed the M202. It's kinda like how they called the M79 the Thumper. As I recall, the M202 is a killstreak reward. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:54, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Yeah aparently this game has several 'super weapons', but I'm not sure of the context of their use. But surely they won't be unlockable for custom classes, the "Death Machine" had a 400-somethin round belt.

::: The Death Machine (M136) and Grim Reaper (M202) are obtained from care packages now. Also, sign your posts. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:32, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

in the same video they show parts froma game called "gun game " the player swaps the M14 for the m136 . im gonna go all jessie ventura up in that bitch . simmons 8492

== Opinions on the game so far ? ==

I know everyone is going to have a different opinion but i personally think this game is gonna be the worst one yet. The weapons,the attachments,the killstreaks look so bad and the game is just gona be filled with little 10 year olds who only quickscope and camp! The next one by sledgehammer games sound better! Anyone else agre? -- GunGunGun
::I haven't seen anything about the sledgehammer installment. Is there anything out there? I just know that officially, what's left of IW is still working on MW3. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:00, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
: Call Of Duty is dead since MW2. Last good one was CoD5 ( ''But it wasnt nothing more than good'' ). So i dont expect things get better after Black Ops. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:59, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
: Considering that there's been no news at all on the Sledgehammer Games one yet, I have no idea how you could know that it will be better. Sounds like you, like some others here, are just angry that the guns and add-ons in the game make no sense for the era rather than whether or not it's fun to play. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 18:31, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
::The guns don't make sense at all, not just because of the era. I mean flamethrower attachments, handheld miniguns, the same rear sight on many guns, 20-round mags holding 30 rounds, semi-auto shotguns impossibly cycling with dragonsbreath ammo. Before MW2 the Call of Duty series was known for its accuracy and attention to how the guns really work, as well as the weapons for the time periods the games take place in. And GunGunGun has a point, it's just going to be the same chaotic multiplayer as MW2, a bunch of stoners and kids making themselves feel better by corner camping, tubing, and quickscoping. Treyarch only seems to have done things to promote those playing techniques, not discourage them like they should. -Mandaloin
::: Cry some more then? It's pretty obvious that you don't like the gameplay style. There are many, MANY gamers out there that would disagree with your tastes, and those are the ones that Treyarch is aiming to please (along with those on the fence over some of MW2s perks/killstreaks which were changed for the better). So what if it's not all realistic, the key point in a video game is if it's any fun to play or not. Last I checked, I couldn't actually survive crashing a Ferrari at 100MPh at Laguna Seca either, but it is sure as hell fun to play a game that allows me to get back up and try again without it being "game over" for me. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Meh, quit complaining, it's a video game. If you want realism go play ARMA or Operation Flashpoint. It does look better than MW2, that I will say. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 21:41, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

I just love how people can criticize a game, when yet, they haven't even played it. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 21:43, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
:I just love how people keep saying that. We don't have to play it to criticize what we've already seen of it. -Mandaloin
:: Yeah, you kinda do. If you have not actually sat down and played this game, you're only assuming it's gonna be bad by just looking at it. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Medal of Honor pwns Call of Duty in every way. ''That's'' my opinion of Black Ops. Anyone who doesn't like it can go cry a river. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:13, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

== PM-63? ==

Where did we see that? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 13:29, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

:[http://blackops.digitalwarfare247.com/weapons/sub-machine-guns/pm63].--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 16:27, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Unknown SMG ==

[[Image:MPLdual.png|thumb|none|450px|]]

: They look like MPL's to me, and those are said to be in this game so I'm betting that's what they are. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 23:33, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
::Those don't look anything like MPLs. It's probably something we haven't seen yet. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 02:35, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
:::Actually, I found this picture under Walther MPL on COD: Wiki, but I thought they looked nothing like MPLs, so I decided to put it as unknown and see if someone else knew what these were. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]]
:They kind of look like Arsenal Shipkas. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

The weapons in this game may be achronistic as hell, but at least they made them interesting, most of the weapons on the page right now are things you don't see much of in games or even movies, especially nowadays, there's even this, a gun we can't seem to identify with a clear first-person shot of both sides of the gun. I've gotten bored of knowing every gun in a game when I first get it, so, regardless of whether this game turns out to be good, which I hope it is, at least the weapon selection is nice and original, especially for a modern mainstream FPS. :D [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:51, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well I just went through the entire world.guns SMG database and the only thing that looks remotely similar to this is the Walther MPL, so if it's not a souped-up version of that than I don't know what it is. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 15:19, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
:::Nothing is in the right place. Either it's something else, or the modelers were told some other gun was an MPL and they didn't know any better. Did anyone else notice the icon on the left in the feed? Maybe it's whatever that's supposed to be. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:42, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Maybe they're just modified Skorpions? [[User:Tanaj|Tanaj]] 15:45, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

i also went through the world.guns database and figured is could be a OTs-02 Kiparis http://world.guns.ru/smg/kiparis2.jpg
:Nice find, I agree. Wow, they must've dug pretty deep. I don't see how it'd be possible for this to be a modeling mistake, as I would think it's much harder to find one of these than an MPL. The above link doesn't work, here it is again. [http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg04-e.htm] --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 11:33, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well whatdaya know, the one I missed. Good find. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:11, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

They are Skorpians in 9x18mm without the stocks. Looks awesome to me.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 00:29, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

: We've already seen what the Skorpions look like, these look alot like that OTs-02 Kiparis --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 00:41, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

== KS-23 ==

The KS-23 isn't 12 gauge, it's 6 gauge or something like that. I know that it's 23mm, which is not 12 gauge, so that should probably be changed. --[[User:ColonelTomb|ColonelTomb]] 00:58, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

According to Wikipedia it's 6.27 gauge by American standards and 4 gauge in Euros. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 08:59, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Ummm how are they going to balance that? I'm assuming that a 6.27 gauge packs a hell of a lot more lead than a 12 gauge so I'd take a guess that it would probably be pretty powerful --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 22:41, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

:I presume the KS-23 is likely to have heavy recoil, small capacity (3 rounds) and a delay between shots. Also can't the KS-23 also function as a Grenade launcher as well firing firing a variety of shells such as Tear Gass, Flash Bang and White Phosphorous? I would marry Treyarch if they finally added Slugs to this baby! [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:13, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Draco i think your my new friend. JK. i always wondered why they never put chokes or slugs as attachments for guns in video games.-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

::They have added slugs to some games. But to name few, Bad Company 2, Fallout: New Vegas and STALKER are one's that come to mind, though I don't think even the majority of game designers (save for a small collection of the minority) that know what a Choke on a shotgun even is. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 15:43, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

English version of Wikipedia erroneously indicates that the KS-23 was created in 1970. This weapon was created in mid-1980's. Rifled barrel has been borrowed from anti-aircraft weapons systems. English version of Wikipedia erroneously indicates that the KS-23 was created in 1970. This weapon was created in mid-1980's. The 23 mm rifled barrel has been borrowed from anti-aircraft weapons systems. At present it is not used Russian police, because it is too heavy and uncomfortable [[User:Slow Rider|Slow Rider]] 11:12, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

== Stoner 63? ==

Hey Guys, I believe I've identified what seems to be a Stoner 63 fitted with some sort of telescopic scope, in this video: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOAAWWjfG_g]
--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 08:14, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Looks like a AR-18 but don't we have the full assault rifle list?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:55, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

: It's not an AR-18, the recievers don't match. It looks more like the 63, although it doesn't appear to have the ventilated barrel housing. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:32, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

After actually looking at a 63, this gun looks like it.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:10, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

[[Image:Stoner63-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Stoner 63 in rifle and LMG configuration.]]
[[Image:COD7Stonerpossible.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Here's a screencap from gameplay footage of the possible Stoner 63. Compared to the stock image I'd say it is.]] . - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Reflex sights==
Just wondering about the reflex sights, were they even developed back during the periods the game is set in? Another thing I was curious about is that the M4 Spectre in the list shows it having a reflex mounted on it. While it is using a side-mount, wouldn't the stock get in the way if you try to fold/unfold it since it folds to the top of the gun?--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 14:41, 12 September 2010 (UTC)
: '''1,''' Yeah, i am almost sure reflex sight existed during cold war. There is even patent on internet, dating it into seventies.
: '''2,''' All SMG´s have apparently stocks removed for some reason. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 15:50, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

==Not exactly on topic==
Alright, I am having a pretty bad day with dealing all the crap my professors are throwing at me and then my roommate says something that is kinda pissing me off so I am gonna rant a little bit. Last night(this early morning actually, around 1), he decided not to do his homework and decided to watch a show about snipers and the amazing feats they pulled off including one about Hatchcock. It was pretty interesting until he ruined it after watching a sniper take out VietCongs using kentucky windage with his scoped (now busted) m14 after his helo was shot down by saying, "So what, I don't see how that is impressive, I can do that all the time in Modern Warfare 2." Now he wants to go buy Black Ops when it comes out because he wants to "pwn some noobs" and all the feature look really realistic just like in MW2. He goes on to say that he wants to become a Ranger because he thinks it is easy enough since he is smart since he was on a debate team, ran for state assembly, etc. and strong because he can do MMA and finishes that with he can drink a lot beer. I give him credit for having the balls to join the Rangers but at the same time, it feels like he is insulting them. Sorry for writing all this but I was having a shitty day and just had to let is all out and I figured it since he was talking of COD, that I would put it here. Alright, rant over, feeling much better now. --[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 15:43, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh boy, is actual real military service gonna shit on his cereal, lets see just how easy pwning noobs is when your actually getting shot at, oh and apparently theres this thing called recoil in reality, suprising i know. Oh and no respawns either. On an actual related note this game is gonna suck, I do love the return of the 1911 to COD i just can forgive the erronious amounts of just horrendous anacronisms, and the flamethrower undermount is so retarded --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 02:10, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Here's a fun idea, hand a CoD fanboy an AR-15 with the bolt locked back, hand them a magazine, and tell them to fire it. See how long it takes them to realize that the weapon isn't magically ready to fire just because you slap in a fresh magazine. You get five points for every ten seconds it takes before they realize what the bolt catch is. You get bonus points if they pull the charging handle.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 06:01, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Brilliant! Oh and pop that elusive saftey on too, just for good measure.--[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 09:52, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd be impressed if they would give the back stock a flat slap after loading a fresh mag and charged the gun like a real badass.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 12:46, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Even better would be actually getting through the first phase of basic to even hold a weapon.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 21:19, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd be even more surprised to find a gamer doing a proper tactical reload, instead of letting a mag drop to the ground and becoming confused as to why it doesn't magically appear back in his pouches.

first of id slap the shit out of your roommate , the second he hit basic hes gonna be crying for mommy shitting him self , and i cant wait for the m1911 to make its return .simmons 8492

==Kinda liking the weapons list==

Well, they are things you never see in other games, although the awp and famas and spas12 can go, and id love the a1 to be full auto. But, a revovler that makes sense, old school submachine guns, a pump action grenade launcher its kind of cool.

I do wish they didn't decided the nearly the same weapons from the other MW series like the AUG, SPAS-12, or the MP5K. They could have picked other pump action shotguns like the Remington 870, or another weapon aside from the MP5K. They should have stuck with the full size MP5. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:44, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
:Well, they do have the Ithaca 37. And at least the AUG is a rifle and not a LMG in this one. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:18, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I do know most of these guns really shouldn't exist but you can believe I will have a ton of fun with the under-barrel flamethrower with a smily face reflex sight on the G11(they better not mess up the G11).--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 21:15, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

At this moment, I am not bothered about weapons that don't exist at the time, but more on original choices. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:17, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

:Kinda of agree with you there, sorta disappointed though that they made the M16A1 burst fire in Multiplayer. Though it's hard to say exactly when all these guns appear, while yes we were told it was starting in Vietnam but IT could possibly star in other timezones too. From what I've gathered, you play as multiple characters so it's possible you could play as multiple characters in different time periods, 1 in Vietnam, another in Cold War and maybe a few fictional war zones in the early 2000's [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 08:10, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Well, it seems that original M16 without forward assist is in game. Anyway - As far as i know M16A1 fired in 3-round bursts, no ?
:::The A1 is full-auto. The A2 and A4 variants fire bursts. [[User:Ramell|Ramell]] 10:10, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

I dont like how they use the correct 20 round mag model but make it hold 30. Hopefully the burst/30 rounds is online only, like in cod 4 where the m16 was full auto SP but burst MP.

== CZ75 ==

JUst curious, does anyone think that the CZ-75 might be the Automatic version of the weapon. Granted Treyarch wasn't going to add Machine Pistols but since it's the last handgun in the list and it costs 750 credits would it be possible? I mean Bad Company 2 had their 93R as their last unlock which was a machine pistol [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 08:28, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well, it doesnt have to be automatic. CZ-75 is superior to all other handguns from list in real life.( maybe besides Colt Python ) - Its better than Makarov, ASP and even M1911 in all "stats" . Its probably best 9mm handgun.

::Not too sure as to how it would be better than a .45 caliber 1911. I can see it being better than the ASP or Makarov due to their small magazines of 7-8 rounds compared to the 75's 16 (9mm). Of course it does open the slight possibility that an Automatic conversion kit is available as an attachment [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:05, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
::: Its not just about calibre or mag capacity. CZ-75 is more accurate, bullet is faster and i think its lighter. Anyway - Its sure that heavier cartrigde is allways better :) But i would take CZ75 to combat instead of M1911.

:Maybe the developers just read a lot of Gunsmith Cats, and took Rally's speech to heart, but the possibility that it may be an automatic makes me sigh. I hope it isn't.-protoAuthor 16:08, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Firstly, The CZ-75 is not more accurate than a 1911
Secondly, there is no "best" 9x19 millimeter pistol, its all personal preference,
Thirdly, the .45 is a better combat round due to its lager grain bullet and more dispersion of energy on contact,
and Lastly, while caliber is not the most important factor, the .45 A.C.P is superior to the 9x19mm because the 9 is a small lightweight bullet, while the .45 is a large heavyweight bullet.
P.S. sign your posts.
~~ PunisherDave
: Well, i tested both CZ75 and 1911. I was doing better with CZ. Anyway - I would take it into combat because of for example mag size. And 9mm bullets are way much more common... --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 13:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Military 1911s almost universally sucked, with ultra loose fitting parts and 7 pound triggers, and nearly useless sights. 1911s in the civilian world, or the uber built special forces 1911, are nice. But your average GI 1911....not so. Im sure a cz75 would kick its ass in accuracy and reliability if you wanted to use more than ball ammo.
~~k9870
: Ágreed. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 13:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Those old 1911's had one thing going for them though, there was a hell of a lot of abuse you could put them through before they malfunctioned. Reliability is a factor. I'm not saying the CZ isn't reliable though, don't get me wrong. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 17:24, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

It was once said "the colt 45 will drop a charging bull dead in its tracks, but good luck hitting it.

Haha, while I do know (note how I'm just basing what I say off of research, so I am open to corrections. Hopefully one day I can fire a 1911 and CZ to really know the differences)that the old GI 1911's were often maligned for their lack of accuracy, I've also heard people say it isn't that big of a deal considering that it is a handgun. In a military capacity, the pistol is there when shit gets up close and personal and you need to defend yourself. When the guy is close enough that you can see the whites of his eyes, I'm sure you're not gonna have to be a deadeye to land shots on target. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 18:21, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
:My buddy's father was a Marine in Vietnam, and at least according to him, a lot had to do with the fact that their M1911s were just really old and worn. I would think that WWII production of M1911s would've been more enough to supply US forces for decades. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:29, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Ive heard they manuactured no new 1911s after ww2, and that they just swapped parts, keeping frame and slide. They were loose fitting, and rattled in holsters. a 7 pound single action trigger, and the sights are just awful, especially against a dark background, cheap 3 dot sights would be better. problem is when people think "1911" they think of the sweet modern ones. To be fair, military berettas are beat to hell too, and have known countless people to say the sights were misaligned, magazines had weak springs, etc.
The cz-75 though, this is the first time ive seen it in a game, its pretty cool. I cant wait to use it, im sick of the beretta being the staple 9mm.
-k9870

Misaliged sights are from them getting knocked around and is easily fixed, worn mag springs is through use and they are easily replaced.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:33, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

It is true that no new 1911's were purchased after World War 2. The same .45's that were on G.I's hips in Europe and The Pacific were being carried by U.S troops during the Gulf War in the 1990's. I've heard that the quality of the 1911's varied from gun to gun. Some were actually were in decent shape while others were just horrid. I don't believe they all suffered from the problems that K9870 is saying. Although I admit the standard sights on those guns are just awful, Most of the time I can't even make out the front post. A lot of soldiers I've read actually preferred a 1911 to the M9 and carried it when possible. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 22:37, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

I dunno about the automatic thing... I myself have only heard of the machine pistol variant of the CZ-75 until very recently, plus I don't think it has a place in media history as a well-known variant of the CZ-75 (much less the CZ-75 itself, outside of [[Gunsmith Cats]]), so I don't know how Treyarch could know about it. Most of the guns they got ideas for the game from are the airsoft guns they had in their office, and last I checked no one makes an airsoft automatic CZ-75. So I would bet my money on that this is just the game's Desert Eagle - the pistol that outshines the rest (and it's about time! The CZ-75 is very underused in the media, IMO). [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 09:23, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Actually I'm thinking that the Python is gonna be the Power Pistol of this game followed by the 1911. The CZ is probably gonna be the 9mm hi cap of the game.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 10:52, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

I hope they dont neuter it for "balance" and that it is awesome, who cares if they need to balance with the makarov and asp? When you buy better guns, they should actually be better, not just change one stat for another.

==asp==

was the asp pistol any good or even used much? It seems the grips would be slippery and the sights are weird.
-k9879
:According to a random site I found, it wasn't used much. Originally, only 100 were produced, and if they are still produced, they are produced only on a pistol-by-pistol basis by custom gunsmiths or shops or something along those lines. The grips were smooth because the original designer intended it to be the ultimate concealed carry pistol, and the smooth grips helped this keeping the chance for the hand to snag on the grips while pulling, aiming, and firing to a minimum. In addition, the sights are weird but when aimed through, due to the design of the sight which employed fluorescent panels, would point at the target when properly aligned, making it easier to shoot reflexively. -Chris Hun7er 23:42, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

It is a S&W Model 39 which was a really good pistol. It looks as though its in the game because of the size of the Makarov. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:34, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

== The Over-Under Shotgun ==

The Over-Under Shotgun AKA "Olympia", seems to be based off of a Browning Citori XT shotgun. I don't have a screenshot of the gun ingame (It was on the ground, and in HD, but the page was protected so I couldn't save it). But I am pretty sure that the Browning Citori XT is the real-life inspiration for the Olympia.

==Snubnose more accurate?==

What game designers brilliant idea was this? i could understand faster switch or something, but higher accuracy?

I think they were too stupid to make the snubnose version default and a 6" barrel an attachment. --[[User:Xarex|Xarex]]

A 4 inch python is a great service handgun, they should just have 4inch standard, the 6 inch a slower draw but more accurate, the snubby less accurate but faster draw, and unlocks like a nickle finish, different grips, pimp it out however you please.

I can't think of any reason why anyone would think that a snub makes it more accurate, this is just stupid.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:30, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

On the COD wiki it shows the stat page ffor snubnose, down one bar power, up one accuracy.
k9870
:It could be that one of the developers mixed it up by mistake, if its not a mix up..... then why bother making videogames with real guns anymore if Treyarch is just going to make up stuff. --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 08:11, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

::A snub nosed revolver has less power AND accuracy than a full size revolver.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 10:47, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

:::I mean in a video game sense (balance over realism), wouldn't a shorter barrel logically mean less accuracy? Sorry if what i said earlier sounded like i wanted Treyarch to make the game like real life. I just meant that Treyarch would be messing with logic to make a shorter barrel mean higher accuracy. --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 12:41, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

== Black Ops Zombies weapons ==

For those that are wondering, this is the "teaser" trailer for Black Op's Zombie mode www.gknova6.com

So far the weapons I can see and identify are the HK21E, Ithaca M37 Trench Gun, a sniper rifle that looks similar to the design of an Artic Warfare Super Magnum and a tricked out AK variant.

Also it seems we may have Zombies in modern arenas like Office complexes and Labs [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 06:59, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

== Makarov with target sights. ==

I just noticed that the Makarov has target sights instead of the Military sights. That definatly seems wrong for Military use.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:43, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Military sights suck, im sure special forces would replace them.

Maybe but as I recall they didn't have target sights back then, plus they are Dropped by the Russians so they would have the military sights. They aren't that bad by the way, I have personal experiance with them and they are fine.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:24, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

Saw on COD wiki "upgraded iron sights" as an attachment.

==Strela-3 Missile launcher! Latest Trailer!==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0_r4-eTmlA 1:10 "Vehicle Lock-On Only". Also whats that gun at 2:03, it makes me confus
--[[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]] 17:04, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

==Who Wants to Ice Castro?==
Apparently you can do it, and there's even an achievement for doing it in one shot!
http://www.gamesradar.com/xbox360/call-of-duty-black-ops/news/call-of-duty-black-ops-achievementstrophies-reward-you-for-murdering-monkeys-and-fidel-castro/a-20101001104021980032/g-20100430155437473001
[[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 18:35, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

tell ya what , if you can do that cuba is gonna be pissed . simmons 8492
Oh, oh, I DO!!! :D [[User:Young Gun]]

== Clues from leaked Achievements list ==

Full list here. SPOILERS! [http://planetcallofduty.gamespy.com/View.php?view=CODBOGameInfo.Detail&id=2]

:-The player gets to use TOW missiles in the game.
:: MP killstreak list is more than few days old.
:-It's DEFINITELY alternative history.
:: That was clear.
:-The Grim Reaper is in the campaign somewhere.
:: Seen already in one of first trailers.

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:41, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

== Found a PSG1 ==

[http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101001181628/callofduty/images/f/f9/Psg1better.jpg Here], to the right of the G2 --[[User:Ghostdigga|Ghostdigga]] 19:17, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

: '''Oh. My. God'''. 2000 Famas with flamethrower and M16 handguard. I beg it would sound crazy month ago. Looking forward MoH much more. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:56, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
:Sharp eye, dude. You have my respect. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:13, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

== PM-63 RAK ==

@ 2:04 in the new trailer here: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0_r4-eTmlA] Looks like a PM-63 RAK
[[Image:BO Unidentified.JPG]]--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 01:54, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

:He he, monkey.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 02:31, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

== Galil ==

Hey guys, found an ingame image of the Galil, head over to the Black Ops page to see it --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 09:14, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

== Explanation for Impossibly Inaccurate Weapons ==

It is possible that the explanation is that not all of this game is 1968. By looking at www.gknova6.com viral ad site for black ops, reading the trophy/achievemnt list, and by piecing together all the nova-6 gas based missions I believe that one of the playable characters will be killed or severely wounded in the Bay of Pigs Invasion in Cuba(due to the Sacrifice tropy found on the list at http://planetcallofduty.gamespy.com/View.php?view=CODBOGameInfo.Detail&id=2). The Gk Company or the Russian goverment then has him revived or recovered to relate what happened with his Ops in the year 1993(www.gknova6.com) or 2010(reveal) at Rebirth Island(Vozrozhdeniya Island) home to the Russian Microbioligical Warfare Unit(source wikipedia). This is not fannon look at the all the raw info of GKNOVA, the mission objectives of sevarel missions, and this GKNOVA6 Web site. Sorry for the long windedness but hopefully you will all understand.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 17:46, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

So...how does any of this new information explain the inaccurate weapons? The missions with the weapons in question like the AR-15 and the AUG really did took place in a time when they shouldn't exist. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:20, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Its confirmed this game is alternate reality/timeline so inaccurate weapons is less of a deal.
[[User:K9870|K9870]]

I was more or less talking about way off ones like the WA2000, FAMAS Felin, Artic Warfare, and Spectre M4.Trust me Im not saying thats a good excuse for F-ing up with the CAR-15 hybrid thing and the production "protoype" AUG but that might be the excuse for the G11 and all other post 1970 weapons.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 04:48, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Of course there's always the point that this is just a video game that has events based off of real life occurrences too... [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 03:02, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

== The Model 1887 is back ==
In before complaining. Seen in the newest trailer around the 00:42 second mark.
http://kotaku.com/5661296/a-look-at-black-ops-single-player-gameplay-and-story

Definitely a shout out to Terminator 2 there. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 02:54, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

It has been confirmed for single player campaign only, by trearch. Dunno about zombies --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:31, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Oh-ho, my friend, they are here. The best part is that the zombies are still of the Nazi variety. http://www.gknova6.com/agegate.php

:I mean dont know if its on zombies--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:47, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Only in one sequence within the campaign, don't think it's in zombies --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 22:26, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

What did enough people bitch about "how unfair" it is by blaming their lack of skill on "noob guns"?
:Honestly, I can understand why people complained about Akimbo 1887s. They definitely weren't balanced, since you could fire them almost constantly by staggering your shots until you had to reload. They also had almost insane range (For a video game shotgun), and very high power. I was fine with the single 1887, but I was glad that they nerfed the Akimbos. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 17:02, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

And I hope the zombies arent nazis, i want to fight commie zombies......

:Looks more like there may be a possibility of fighting not only Commie Zombies but Vietcong Zombies and regular civi zombies too, some of those screens look like their wearing office uniforms and lab coats besides military armor. In some ways I'm glad the 1887 is in singleplayer but at the same time I was kinda hoping it would also be added in multiplayer minus the silly akimbo models, they just looked wrong in my opinion. Also sign your posts with "~ ~ ~ ~" without quotations and spaces. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 17:25, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

== The Deer Hunter ==
Looks like theres a scene in the new trailer similiar to the roulette scene in The Deer Hunter, I wonder how that will work in the game. (just a cut scene or a playable moment?) --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 03:27, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

'MOW" haha that shit gets me every time . simmons 8492
:Nips? Wow, you're doubly ignorant. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:25, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

*Actually, there is no proof the Vietcong actually did anything like that, and it is widely agreed among film critics that the Russian Roulette scenes are actually allegories for the American involvement in Vietnam. We also have a few Asian members on this site, so you should keep your racism to yourself. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 01:31, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

:Well I'm not Vietnamese, so that won't offend me. Besides, sticks and stones. I'm more American than I am Asian [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:01, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

Dont want to look bad to future members, i know some is just joking but some people take everything seriously.

know what , your right . my bad guys . ill take it down. simmons8492

== Walther MPL confirmed ==

Found a video on G4 containing confirmation that the MPL SMG is in-game. For reference it's the gun painted all green http://g4tv.com/videos/49177/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops---Jungle-Multiplayer-Map-Exclusive/ [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 16:34, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

== 'Grip attachment' on Sub Machine Guns ==

I've heard that the grip attachment on SMGs in fact deploys the stock. That would explain why they all seem to be removed/folded ont the SMGs.

:This is most proven on the Skorpion, attaching a grip actually attaches the wire folding stock [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 14:24, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

==Is it just me...==

or is using the same flip up sights on every damn gun just friggin lazy?

[[User:k9870|k9870]]

It's an attachment called 'improved iron sights'. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:32, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

No, there standard in game sights. The improved adds outiline and dots to pistols, the flip up sights on guns is laz and trying to look tacticool. Even the m60 has them

And because the standard factory iron-sights for the M60 and the FAMAS, well, SUCK. I really was not a fan of the M60's irons in COD4 and the Battlefield Bad Company games. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 03:19, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
: Agreed. Kinda bugged by the repetitive sights on some guns myself, but I'm not gonna let it get me down. Most of the guns have their own, correct sights. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 08:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah, thats Treyarch development style. Put everything they want in any time etape. This game is already dead to me - actually, MoH with its 5 hour campaign is much better than MW2 and Black Ops ('' MW2 with different textures and anachronistic guns'' )
:: Wow dude, you must be from the future seeing as how you are able to form this opinion with a game that hasn't even been released yet. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 08:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
Meh, I usually play games because they are fun. MOH was pretty realisitc, (compared to Call of Duty anyway...) but it definetly wasn't fun (online). I'll just revel in the ridiculousness of it all... Akimbo HS-10 FTW
--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 05:16, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

I just finally see these old obscure guns in games and they put lameass sights on, BTW medal of honors single player was cool (ending was abrupt and anticlimactic though) but online is glitchy and feels unpolished. I want to play COD.

Not really sure about the LAME part, but I'd rather have USABLE sights even if they aren't the originals and seem LAME in other people's eyes. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:46, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Is it so hard to ask for variety, im sure the stock sights are usable for a game, i may just use an AK online since it doesnt have flip ups.

Is it so much to ask them to give us variety in the same type of gun, like stock and stockless MP5 or underfolder AK. performances, it makes no difference, but I like variety in what you pick to shoot with. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 01:19, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

== *SPOILER* Zombie Mode Characters. ==

Hey, just saw the intro video for zombie mode. It seems you play as John F Kennedy, Richard Nixon, Some CIA Bloke and Fidel Castro... Heres the link:[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnbhcHCP24g]r
::That fourth guy would appear to be Robert McNamara, JFK and LBJ's Sec of Defense. Why not just LBJ? Or Bobby Kennedy? They couldn't find two voice actors to do bad Bahston/Kennedy accents? ("Er-eh, toss me another maaahg!") --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:52, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
Awsome.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 23:59, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

: These guys are only on bonus map that you get after finishing campaign. There are some random US sosldiers fighting Nazi Zombies in normal zombie mode. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:11, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Damn, i love cigars but hate commies. [[user:k9870|k987]]

Zombies better be commies, killing nazis got old i want to shoot commie zobies.

:Is it just me, or would LBJ be better replaced by LHO? (Lee Harvey Oswald.)
::Only if he could only carry three bullets at one time. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:47, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

=="escape the past"==

Its a achievemnet listed, does this imply time travel?
-k9870

Or that something one of the characters did is going to come back to bite them in the arse. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:34, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

If it's time travel I'm tearing someone at Treyarch a new one--[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:21, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

:Don't get so defensive over a title. It could be a really cool section, forcing the player to battle his way out of his hometown. Or, maybe time travel. >.> [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 23:31, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Nah I meant it all in good humour XD --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:44, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

I highly doubt that it's actual time travel. From what we've seen and has been speculated, the majority of the campaign will take place as memories of Black Ops missions that the main characters participated in. No time travel, just photographic memories. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:51, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

==New Videos confirm various unknowns==

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrNoLz4gC60&feature=mfu_in_order&playnext=1&videos=dvWBYFCAcck]

Among a few things, this video confirms that the G11 is burst fire only, and at the exceptional rate we expect. The poster has posted about many other of the weapons, also confirming that Full Auto is a pistol attachment for the CV-75. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 20:19, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

== Golden Guns are Fugly ==

I mean take a look at this!

[[Image:Golden_PSG1.jpg‎|200px|thumb|none|Golden PSG1]]

[[Image:Golden_WA2000.jpg|200px|thumb|none|Golden WA2000]]

[[Image:Golden_Stakeout.jpg‎|200px|thumb|none|Golden Ithaca Stakeout]]

[[Image:Golden_HS-10.jpg|200px|thumb|none|Golden HS-10]]

Also, it would appear the the Ithaca M37 IS the Stakeout version and not the Trench Gun version we initially believed [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 13:39, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

:I thought golden guns were fugly before. >> [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 21:18, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

:That doesn't even look like real gold, it looks spray painted on! [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:50, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

The gold guns look terribad, probably will avoid using gold camo altogether :C --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 00:05, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:Why spend money on gun colours, when you can just buy gun attachements? :D [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 20:58, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:^ This. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:01, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Eh, still gonna make my Duke of New York class with a gold Mac-10 and a nickel (I swear I saw a nickel or 'silver' camo) Python. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:23, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:Not sure it was confirmed, I think there was rumors flying around but nothing concrete. Besides, I don't think camo patterns can be applied to secondaries, which is lame. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 09:09, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

:: Have you heard that even ACOG´s can be added on pistols ? This game is gonna suck.
:::Because the fact that you can put a scope on a high powered revolver (Something that's doable and often useful in real life) means that the game automatically sucks. Thank you for your insight. Also, sign your posts. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:54, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Only python can take an acog. And as to golden guns you only use them if you want to and it looks like you can do it for individual guns instead of the whole damn class its in.

The Python's recoil with the ACOG looks pretty balanced, I'm not too bothered about it. Besides, is pretty cool that Treyarch are doing something a bit different. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 17:51, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

:I just added pictures of all the golden guns, they are pretty gross. I would never waste any fake money to buy them.

==just watched zomie gameplay==

pentagon level, the zombies were amix of original nazi zombies and pentagon workers turned to zombies (were wearing shirt/tie)

Why cant they have communist zombies, seriously?

[[user:k9870|k9870]

:I guess they don't want to offend anyone who might be communist. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:07, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

I still hope there's some Nazi ones left. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:28, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Nazis made sense in ww2, but thats been done, we want something new, commie zombies.

From what I've seen, the WaW characters are returning to fight straight Nazi zombies, JFK and friends fight Pentagon zombies in the Pentagon, and there's another with Russian zombies in Winter camo (that's shown on that GKNOVA6 website right now). [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 04:30, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

The JFK/Nixon/Castro/McNamara level is a bonus level at the end of the game, not the actual zombies mode. The real zombies mode features some new guys in some labs (as seen on GKNOVA6) most probably russian special forces. It will include communist zombies. and the characters from W@w are in it if you buy hardened --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 11:39, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

I hope the pentagon level is 4 player co op so i can play with friends

==Interview with the military advisor==
Here is the link to the interview with the Call of Duty: Black Ops military advisor if anyone is interested in reading it. [http://www.3news.co.nz/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops-military-advisor-interview/tabid/418/articleID/185313/Default.aspx] --[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 16:13, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

:Unfortunately, that Advisor doesnt know anything about weapons. Or any kind of warfare. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 11:45, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Of course your in a position to judge him right...--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 02:56, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
:Yes, god forbid Treyarch try and make a fun game, instead of a military simulator. Fun? What's that?! [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 10:52, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
:: But game can be fun even with realistic weapons or good AI of enemies.
Unfortunately, Treyarch went in MW2 way and instead of making enemy AI better, they spawned twice as much of them.
:::No one says COD was ever a military simulator, but a M16/M203 turning up during the Bay of Pigs invasion would seem to be a "bit" out of place. Now that we know the singleplayer is set between 1961 and 1968, any arguments about the game taking place in some era that justifies the anachronisms has become irrelevant.

==Just putting this out there==
Does anyone else believe that now that the game's actually out and we can get higher quality screenshots, that the old low quality caps be removed? Or maybe the entire page be redone so it looks a little more consistent because you have a low quality shot from an online video then a high quality ingame cap from the game. I'm just saying it probably would look better. --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 01:33, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree that the low-quality screencaps should be removed ASAP. I'll try to post some as I go through the single-player campaign, but eventually, they too may need to be replaced. I'm running it on 960x600 with no AA for playability. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 02:17, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:This page also need screencaps from the Zombies mode. I was unable to get the Thundergun (a two-shot sound wave gun that resembles a modern rocket launcher) and the Ray gun due to the constant waves of zombies that may sneak up on you and kill you easily, large number of barriers (too many to defend), and the poor weapons you receive in the early rounds. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 20:29, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

I just finished single-player, and I've got tons of caps available. I'll try to upload that are relevant and in need later --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 04:18, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

== Impressions So Far? ==

What do you guys thinks of the game so far? My only dissapointment is that they have decided to remove the front sight when you use optics. Other than that, the guns look fantastic.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 05:36, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:I think it's alright, I haven't played campaign yet since the game is my roommate's so we've only been playing on Live. I think the only thing I'm not really liking so far is that they took away the slip-screen Special Ops. As for the guns, pretty much the same as yours along with the whole flame thrower thing, I just think it is rather ridiculous.--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 06:13, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

:Boring. SP is short, unoriginal ('' This wont matter as MoH had short SP too. But it was atleast fun. Atmospheric and realistic fun. While its boring, unatmospheric and completely unoriginal in BO'' ) . There isnt anything like AI. Too many boring scripts. To the guns : They are anachronistic and unrealistic. It feels strange encountering NVA with Spas-12. MP is same like in MW2 ('' Read - Crappy'' ) with tons of spammed killstreasks etc.
:This game deserves '''5/10''', nothing more. Oh, and do not think i have something against Treyarch. I hated MW2 too. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:00, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
I like it. SP was a bit of a mind fuck at times, and the AI could have been better, but 98% of the time I was having fun. MP is mostly good, better than MW2, though over the last 12 hours I started seeing some tubers. Yes it's anachronistic and ridiculous, but if I wanted an exact simulation of war I'd join the CF. Aside from some maps, I like it far more (In every way) than MW2. Galil w/ red dot & suppressor + 1911 w/ extended mags = awesomeness. --[[User:Crazycrankle|Crazycrankle]] 15:09, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The story is actually pretty decent, better than the sponataneous betrayals of MW2. The voice acting is also, suprisingly, very well done. I really don't play multiplayer alot, but it's more balanced than MW2. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 15:20, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The constant flashes on the screen is annoying as hell. Almost gave me a seizure. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:53, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The campaign was a bit hard to follow at first, but it comes together nicely in the end. Yes, the weapons are ludicrous (not even ridiculous, beyond ridiculous,) but oh well, I can live with it. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:30, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:Pretty much, I'll give this game a 9.2/10. The multiplayer and content is better and improved from Modern Warfare 2, but the campaign is a bit too short (only 15 missions :() and there's some minor complicated glitches in frame rate. Overall, the game is much better than Modern Warfare 2 and a good recommendation. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 20:24, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

To be honest guys I just ignore the ancronistic weaponry as it really doesnt matter in the long run. Lets face it, saying a game will suck because theres some AUGs in the 'nam era is just plain ludacris. If Treyarch decided to stick to realistic guns of that period, we would just end up with a bunch of bland, unoriginal guns we have all seen before, making this game both an unnecisary COD sequel and just another crappy Vietnam game that flops. Now that thats out of my system I can say with all honesty that this game is very addicting and its finnally a challenge to kill people(5-6 shots for a kill rather than 3-4 shots a kill in MW2). This game is a way more fun experince than MW2 and finally shows the potential of Teyarch development team. ---P226 21:24, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

: I agree, you people take the weapons accuracy way too seriously. What the hell did you expect from a mainstream video game? The only games that are ever 100% accurate with the guns, lets face, are awful. At least this games fun. Hate it for any other reason, that's fine I'll respect that. Hate it for innaccuracies when you really should be used to by know, and that's just ridiculous. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:38, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
:: You and P226 have both just contradicted yourselves. On the one hand you state it's ridiculous to say a game sucks because of the guns, but then go on to say games that have accurate depictions of guns suck. If the game is fun, it's going to be fun whether the guns are accurate or not. I can't believe that if Black Ops had the correct weapons in it that it suddenly wouldn't be fun anymore. Perhaps you can give an explanation of how this would be so?
::''If Treyarch decided to stick to realistic guns of that period, we would just end up with a bunch of bland, unoriginal guns we have all seen before, making this game both an unnecisary COD sequel and just another crappy Vietnam game that flops.''
::I have to totally disagree with this statement. If Treyarch had used firearms of the period, we would have ended up with weapons that, to my knowledge, have never before been used in a video game. I have mentioned in other posts how the Remington 7188, an automatic shotgun that was really used by the NAVY seals in Vietnam could have been used in Black Ops. Instead we get the SPAS-12, which didn't exist at the time, and has been used in a million other video games. Which is the "bland, unoriginal" gun here? I'm gonna have to say the SPAS-12. Of course, if Treyarch had used the period correct shotgun the game would all of a sudden not be fun anymore and would suck, right?
::''The only games that are ever 100% accurate with the guns, lets face, are awful.'' I find this statement hard to believe. Would you care to back this up with some examples?--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 04:39, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

I never said having a game with correct guns of that period is going to be bad, I was trying to make a point that if Black Ops were to have just your standard m16's,Ak47's and colt Commando's, it would be just some normal Vietnam game. Also, all the guns above have been done to death in every video game none to man (though they are nice to have to fill in weapon slots), in my opinion I find the Galil as sweet( and different) Assualt Rifle, Ancronistic or not. If your the kind of guy who can't get over the fact that your using guns lke the AK'''74'''u and the CZ'''75''' in 1968, then this isn't the game for you. ---P226 18:47, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

:I don't know if you guys remember "Men of Valor," but it was a Vietnam FPS that came out a few years ago. It was developed by the same studio that did MoH: AA, so it felt a lot like MoH: Vietnam.) All the weapons were historically accurate, nothing was out of place, but if you've never heard of it, I'm not surprised. The game isn't bad, but it's not great, and it's flawed. The weapons were correct, but there weren't that many, and many of the weapons were just variations on the same weapon. (M16 and CAR-15, M14 and M21, and AK-47 and Type 56, and you couldn't share ammo for some reason.) Thus, you can make a game like BO that has ludicrously anachronistic weapons and have the biggest media launch of all time, or a game like Men of Valor that has historically accurate (and yes, boring) weapons and have it be unknown to the general gaming public. (You should try out Men of Valor though. If you have an original Xbox, you can get it new for a penny. It's not backwards compatible though.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:36, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

: I just might have to pick that up. And when I said the games with 100% accurate weapons suck, I didn't mean they sucked because of the guns, I meant that every game I could think of that was ultra-realistic just simply wasn't fun. No contradiction. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 00:54, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
:You all seem to say the guns don't matter, but then show your disdain for having the correct weapons in the game, as if this would somehow make it boring. ''I never said having a game with correct guns of that period is going to be bad, I was trying to make a point that if Black Ops were to have just your standard m16's,Ak47's and colt Commando's, it would be just some normal Vietnam game.'' So if Black Ops had the exact same story, but the correct guns it would just be a normal Vietnam game? Why? The story makes the game, not the guns. And there's plenty of weapons that would be correct to the period that haven't been "done to death" (HK-33 w/ 40 rd mag, used by Navy SEALS, Carl Gustav m/45, Remington 7188, the list goes on) What exactly qualifies as bland,unoriginal guns, that if they were included would make the game boring? I just get the impression from you that the only interesting guns in this game are the ones that dont' belong there. My point is that they could have had period correct weapons and it wouldn't have affected the fun factor of the game at all--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 04:00, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
::I am more bothered by the guns that didn't make the cut. Why not an M76, a Carl Gustav, a Madsen M50, or an M3 Grease Gun? Sure, they could've, but they didn't, probably on purpose. That brings leads me to what can be an interesting exercise: what would've been better weapons on each level? For the first level (the Cuban one) I would've put in an M2 Carbine and a PPK instead of the M16 and ASP. Other levels? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:20, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

:::You pose an interesting question, but there are actually a lot of different choices so it's one not easily answered. I agree with you on the M-2 carbine, it would be very appropriate for the Cuban level. I feel another good choice would have been one of the Czech SA series of submachine guns. If you've ever seen photos from the Bay of Pigs Invasion, you would have noticed that SA 25 quite a common weapon in the hands of Castro's forces. The FAL is actually historically correct for that level, but it's more likely that was an accident than by design.
:::I haven't played the game yet, so I'm not familiar with all the levels, but I have some general ideas of what they should have included. For pistols a Browning Hi-Power, and if Treyarch absolutely had to have a machine pistol, they could have used the Stechkin. For SMG's, the Carl Gustav M/45 standard model or suppressed version, and if not that then the Madsen M50. The SA 23,24,25,or 26, a Beretta model 12 w/ 40 round mag instead of the Spectre, maybe the MAT-49 for the NVA/Vietcong, if not the standard version then the suppressed model that was supposedly employed by NVA counter-SOG teams. If the MP-5 is going to be included then the standard MP5A3 should have been used instead of that ugly ass prototype MP5K.
:::Of course replace the damn SPAS-12 with the Remington 7188. HK33 instead of the AUG. The correct model CAR-15 instead of the flat top Commando. How about the AMD-65 instead of an AKS-74U? I think they should have axed the RPK altogether and perhaps used 2 different Russian machine guns, maybe an older model like the RP-46, and then the PK for the Spetsnaz.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 02:53, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

::: RPK instead of "''RPK''" in first level. Also AK-47 instead of "''AK-47''" in second one. Vladimirov KPV instead of Minigun would be awesome. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:51, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Also, this game doesnt suck just because of guns. It sucks because its boring, it doesnt have AI and MP is shitty just like in MW2. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:51, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

How is the MP shitty, its definitly not, It developed to be much more balanced than MW2 in every way. Although it isnt perfect,(commando lunges...)it certainly makes modern warfare 2 look like crap as a SUBMACHINE GUN....*cough*UMP45*cough* had more power and range than most assualt rifles. As for the people listing the guns that should have been in the game, all I can say is 'sure I wish they added more time appropriate guns like the Carl Gusav and the Greese Gun, but its too late now and its going to be somthing we have to live as there is no point complaining about it on the internet(not trying to say that in harsh or disrespectful way). I feel if we can all sit down , forget all those anchronisms, and just enjoy this game for what it is, a FICTIONAL cold war/ Vietnam Game. Also on a side note, I think if Treyarh were to have focused this game on Vietnam mainly, then we would have all the correct weaponry, but since there going for a 'top secret CIA' type game,they add all these ludacris guns to accomidate the feel and presence of the cold war.---P226 20:03, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

== Pistol grips ==

Anyone noticed that there isnt gun without pistol grip ? Jeez. They put one even on Mosin. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:00, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

Mosin and ppsh dont have them, characters just hold them like they do.

: Maybe in first person. But mosin has actually pistol grip when its in hands of NPC´s.

No, they just hold their hand as if they were, when its on their backs or they die and drop it doesnt, its probably due to all other characters carrying pistol grips and they dont want too redo characte rmodeling.

I was taking a closer look at when they hold it (Mosin) and guess what, the world models are normal, but when they hold them they DO have pistol grips.... but i do agree, they probably didn't want to make new models. They probably put grips on them while their holding the weapon just so they didn't look even more awkward (floating hands). --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 22:13, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Not all the weapons have pistol grips. If you watch them carefully there are no pistol grips EXCEPT on Steiner's Mosin that is given to him my a Soviet soldier. It is actually modeled as having a pistol grip that is quite visable. Otherwise they do not have pistol grips on anything, it just looks like it. --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 16:00, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Steiners Mosin does not have a pistol grip, its a modeling error because its really a P38 in his hands along with the Rifle--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:11, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

== Gold weapon images ==

Do we really need all those pictures of the gold camo? [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:32, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah. It shows how silly and disguisting tis game is.
Disgusting? It's not THAT bad, man. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:42, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Sign your posts. But, I agree that the gold weapon pictures are rather unnecssary. If someone has the PC version of the game, taking pictures of the standard weapons in multiplayer would be greatly appreciated.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 20:31, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

== Semi Auto FAL ==

Since it is semi auto only, shouldn't it be renamed to the SLR? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:56, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

It has a metric reciever and handguards but a SLR-style flash hider... Its a Franken-gun but nowhere near as bad as MW2's FN-FAL was...--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 00:59, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

== Snub-nose ==
Could the effect of this actually reduce the visual recoil of the Python, allowing you to fire off your next shot faster, and thus make it "more accurate"? --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 16:56, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

But wouldn't it instead exacerbate recoil, without the weight of the barrel to mitigate it? If anything, a snub-nose would make the recoil more pronounced, and thus less accurate for quick follow-up shots.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 23:13, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Huh.....looks like I really suck at gun physics when it comes to recovery time and barrel lengths >_> --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 02:32, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Though it may be incorrect for real life, I'd say Hashiriya's idea is most probably how it works in game. Since all weapons in COD are perfectly accurate when aiming, the accuracy stat is there to show how easy it is for the player to accuratly shoot the weapon, not the actual weapon's accuracy as we would think of it. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:35, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

== Tunnel Rat Revolver ==
When in the tunnels, the report of the Python is fairly muted. Is the implication therefore that is it loaded with "closed circuit" shotgun ammunition as used by the experimental [http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg213-e.htm Quiet Special Purpose Revolver] as tested by Tunnel Rats in Vietnam?

When ever its fired inside a building its strangely quieter yet louder when you step outside.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:31, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Maybe it's your eardrums preemptively ('prolly didn't spell that right) exploding? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:18, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

Oh yeah, wasn't that ammunition meant for a .44 magnum? Also its just the way it sounds when its indoors.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:46, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

==Stop Complaining==

Please just stop. Who cares if the guns aren't accurate? Just sit back and enjoy the Game! If you don't like the game, don't play it! [[User:SAMBAMA|SAMBAMA]]

: 1, I dont play game, because its boring and its just ripoff of MW2. Which was crap too.
: 2, This is firearms site. Not some gaming one. So it doesnt make sense to stop complaining.
: 3, I wont be complaining if those guns would be 3 or 4 years from future. But ''30-40'' ?
--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 07:38, 4 December 2010 (UTC)
Your late to the party, we for the most part don't care anymore.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:45, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

^ Hahahahaha! [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 19:08, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

==Crossbow==
I was playing zombies the other day and got the crossbow out of the box. I do't know if anyone else has seen this but, at least I think, it bears a major resemblance to the PSE Tac 15 crossbow. Again this is just me but if that's true I'm pretty sure that would make it the most anachronistic weapon in the game seeing as it was made maybe 2 or 3 years ago? --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 16:05, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

The PSE TAC 15 uses either an AR15 lower, or is included with basically a reciever shaped the same. Looking at it, it does not appear to have an AR15 type lower reciever on it, judging from the lack of the empty magazine well in front of the trigger. Maybe the upper does a little, I would agree, but in it's entirety in my opinion I don't think it does.--[[User:Fnlover|Fnlover]] 20:44, 05 January 2010 (UTC)

==1911 in Zombies==
The 1911 in zombies is just the regular nickeled finish like in multiplayer it looks black because of the low light in the starting room. If you go outside by the 'double tap' vending machine you can see it in daylight.

In FIVE where the lighting is fine, its still a Blued finish.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:08, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Really? It looks just like the Multiplayer's nickle plated M1911, I checked just a few minutes ago. Not an expert on this, but if it was a blued finish then wouldn't that make it a lot less shiny? For all the poorly lit rooms in Nazi Zombies, it seems to reflect like a spotlight at times.

In Kino, its the Nickle plated one but in FIVE it looks blued or actually poorly done lighting. Blued is shiny by the way, I have actual guns to prove that.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:52, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

It was Five that I checked, it looks nickle plated to me, so iunno. And thanks for clearing the shine thing up, I thought blueing made the metal duller and not very reflective, I must have mixed that up with something else.

You could be thinking of Parkerizing, which results in a dull finish. --[[User:Graybass 20x6|Graybass 20x6]] 02:59, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Ohyah, parkerizing. I knew it was something with -izing in it, thanks.

== Did alittle overhauling ==

Removed the misimformation (Shiny black finish is called a Blued finish) and another things.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:11, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

==Front Cover 1911==

Is it just me or is the 1911 in the soldier's hand on the title picture (the right hand when you're looking at it) missing its hammer? I've been looking as closely as I can, but I just can't seem to find it. An error on the artists part perhaps? Strange though, the pistol marked "Sally" has its proper hammer.--[[User:august.allocco|august.allocco]] 17:32, 30 December 2010

Looks like a combination of the light and the angle making it hard to spot. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:30, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

== Silencer or Suppressor ==

I was looking at some of the images on this page and noticed that some said they were "silenced" or "with silencer", yet others used suppressor. I always thought suppressor was correct, and silencer only described the effect (although Call of Duty games are notorious for spreading this word around). I have not played black ops, so I was wondering if we would call the attachments silencers or suppresors? --Fnlover 05:42, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
:From what I've heard, both are technically correct, and when the original device was created by Maxim, he patented it as a 'silencer'. Yes, it technically doesn't make the gun silent, but that's it's official name. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 02:36, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
::They both are correct, even the BATF calls them silencers on the paperwork.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 05:23, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

== Possible Identity of Over/Under Shotgun ==

Hey everyone, long-time fan of the site, first-time contributor here. I believe I have come across the true identity of the over/under shotgun. I've tried to do as much homework as I could before submitting.

The shotgun appears to be a Beretta: the S-686. Here is the picture for your perusal: [http://armpou.com/images/BERETTA%20686%20SILVER%20PIGEON%20S.jpg Beretta S-686]. Note the identical engraving and design of the barrel pivot assembly.

I don't believe that it could be a Rottweil Olympia. The only picture I could come up with (it's pretty elusive) looked nothing like the in-game model: [http://www.guncity.co.nz/images/162403.jpg Rottweil Olympia]. It's rather plain in comparison, with a much different pivot assembly design and geometry.

What do you guys think? --[[User:Graybass_20x6|Graybass_20x6]] 1:45, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

== You know... ==

The more and more I read the discussion page, the more and more I realize you guys should develop a game. Maybe not go that far, maybe just have the developers of a game contact you guys for some info, rather than watch Predators, or Commando, or some other action movie and call it good.

:Together we would create the most weapons realistic game ever! But we don't have the funds or the people to program at least that I know of.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:43, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

::Well, since CoD4:MW, CoD series is known by its many small detail mistakes the developers did to vehicles, factions, weapons, character's clothing, etc.
::This mistakes cannot stop you from playing, but if it's really bothers you, you can use the mod tool to create a mod that accurate every aspect of the game/s, of course if you have the desire for it... I would do that to many games I could, if I had the desire too. --[[User:RaNgeR|RaNgeR]] 23:01, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

:::Sounds like the Project Reality Mod for Battlefield 2.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:19, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

Actually, my uncle does that stuff for IW maybe I should give him a few notes...

:More than a few I would say, ask him to check this site and ask for opinions. We would be happy to help!--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:34, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

I've been on board for a couple of game projects involving other people over the net, mainly as a story writer and overall ideas man. The main problem with developing games through the internet is the lack of interest over time. At the beginning of the projects I've seen, it seems there is never a lack of volunteers and collaboration. However, the projects I've undertaken (over the internet) have always seemed to lose steam after a whirlwind of work and progress, and within a month or two it's left to a bare-bones cast of a few people who eventually drop it due to lack of manpower. I'd absolutely love to have another project to do (I've had ideas for an FPS milling about in my head for ages), but I also fear that it will be all for naught within a few weeks. --[[User:Graybass 20x6|Graybass 20x6]] 02:59, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

:I completely agree. I myself, writing an idea for a game which in the meantime it's called "Lead Storm" - an FPS game based on other existing games/series like CoD, MoH, Crysis, BF, Tom Clancy's, etc. This game is also involves the accuracy of small details, from weapons to equipment to cloths and many other things. I really want this game to be exists, but it's hard to do it alone. I need people who can program, animate and generally design stuff using various programs. --[[User:RaNgeR|RaNgeR]] 14:44, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

I'm so down for that, but it does seem like something that people would lose their dedication to pretty quickly.

Talk:Call of Duty: Black Ops

2011-01-14T19:11:59Z

Gunner313: /* SOG Knife */

= Wonder Weapons and Miscellaneous Weapons =

== Ray Gun ==

The Ray Gun is available in Call of Duty: Black Ops, only in the Nazi Zombies game mode. While still being very powerful, the gun has a tendency to make crawlers on later rounds more often. Although this can be very useful, it can also create problems for the player, as the player may be caught unaware by them.

[[Image:446px-BORayGun.png|thumb|none|400px|The Ray Gun in-game.]]

== Wunderwaffe DG-2 ==

The Wunderwaffe only appears in Shi No Numa and Der Riese as part of the hardened and prestige editions. In the new maps, the weapon is replaced by its spiritual successor, the Thundergun. When Pack-a-Punched in Der Riese it becomes gold-plated. In one of the intel pieces, a group of wunderwaffe projects are referred to. One of the projects listed is the Die Glocke.

[[Image:Wunderwaffe_DG-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Wunderwaffe DG-2 in-game.]]

== Thundergun ==

This is a weapon featured in the level Kino der Toten. It pushes back zombies with such force that it kills them and should be used only to push back zombies if the player(s) are crowded and cornered considering its low ammunition it starts out with. It becomes the "Zeus Cannon" when upgraded. It also appears in as a easter egg in the Call of Duty: Black Ops campaign level Numbers. It is strongly hinted that it was created by Dr. Maxis.

[[Image:621px-Thundergun.png|thumb|none|400px|The Thundergun in-game.]]

== Winter's Howl ==

This weapon is featured in "Five" and Zombie Verruckt, but only in Call of Duty Black Ops. It is able to freeze zombies on impact, lowering their health drastically. In later rounds, it seems to make zombies health go down and takes a couple of seconds to freeze. It has a 6 round magazine and 24 shots in reserve. When pack-a-punched, it becomes Winter's Fury, and has a 9 round magazine and 36 shots in reserve. Frozen zombies have ice surrounding them. It is currently unknown who created it, but it is possible that the Americans created it because of where you find it (the Pentagon).

[[Image:WintersHowl.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Winter's Howl in-game.]]

== SOG Knife ==
The SOG Knife is a special knife used by the player (as Alex Mason) in the mission "Victor Charlie". This is the only time the SOG Knife is in use.

It is not a SOG knife it is a Randall Model #14 Attack. Gunner 313

[[Image:Shot0159.jpg|thumb|none|600px|SOG Knife in idle.]]

[[Image:Shot0167.jpg|thumb|none|600px|SOG Knife been drawn.]]

== Tomahawk ==
The Tomahawk axe is a melee weapon that replaces the throwing knife (or tactical knife) from ''[[Modern Warfare 2]]'' in mutliplayer. In single-player, it's only available on the mission "Rebirth" after obtaining it from a Russian harbor worker and killing him with it.
[[Image:Tomahawk-BO.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tomahawk in Create-a-Class.]]
[[Image:Tomahawk-BOthrow.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A Tomahawk being thrown.]]

== Ballistic Knife ==
The ballistic knife is a powerful melee weapon that available only in multiplayer and zombie modes. The knife is firing blades with a spring inside the body. In real life, this knife is used by Russian special forces units like Spetsnaz.
[[Image:BK-BO.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The ballistic knife being reloaded.]]

== Crossbow ==

The Crossbow is a new weapon that featured in ''Call of Duty: Black Ops''. It is speculated to fulfill the role of a quiet, long range weapon. The crossbow appears in the campaign mission "WMD", which is set in the Ural Mountains, 1968. Crossbows can have different types of bolts which it can fire, such as normal bolts and Explosive bolts. The crossbow is a military grade crossbow that can attach a scope, which the player can steady.

[[Image:Shot0205.jpg|thumb|none|550px|Crossbow in idle.]]

[[Image:Shot0206.jpg|thumb|none|550px|Crossbow in reloading.]]

== Flamethrower ==

A flamethrower of unknown model has been confirmed to be in Call of Duty: Black Ops as found in the "GKnova6 document" which can be found here: [http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr135/priceman14/doc10.jpg]
The document only refers to it as "Improvised Weaponry" in "Phase 1 Testing" with most of the other information redacted.

Another model appears as an underbarrel attachment.

The image used by www.codblackopsblog.com
[http://www.codblackopsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Black-Ops-Weapons-Flamethrower.jpg]

Reference image of Flamethrowers in Call of Duty: World at War, a past Treyarch game that featured flamethrowers. Image from www.gameinformer.com
[http://blog.al.com/techcetera/2008/12/Pelilucodwaw.jpg]

[[Image:PSG1pic.JPG|thumb|none|500px|Flamethrower mounted on FAMAS F2 FELIN. ''Note ankward M16 handguard'']]

== Main Knife ==

The knife returns in Call of Duty: Black Ops. It is still a one-hit kill, but unlike the previous versions, seems to cause a very large fountain of blood to appear after knifing an enemy.

[[Image:659px-KnifeBlackOpsMultiplayer.png|thumb|none|500px|The Main Knife in-game.]]

== Prison Knife ==

The Prison Knife is a melee weapon used in the mission "Vorkuta" in Call of Duty: Black Ops. It appears to be a jagged piece of scrap metal, similar to a 'shank' or 'shiv'. After Mason acquires another weapon, the prison knife is no longer equipped, and is only used by pressing the melee button. You can see blood on the blade, probably from stabbing the prison guard. Upon closer expection though, I found out it is just a piece of glass with black tape around the handle.

[[Image:624px-Prisonknife.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Prison Knife in-game.]]

== Karambit Knife ==

The Karambit Knife is a combat knife used in the Call of Duty: Black Ops mission Executive Order. It is used to kill a Russian soldier by sticking it into the soldier's spinal cord, killing him, allowing the player and Frank Woods to take their uniform and infiltrate the launch site. Though this blade is used only by US Federal Air Marshals currently, Mason and Woods could have used it instead of a normal blade to aid in the purpose of the mission. Unlike a normal blade, it is shaped like a jungle cat's claw.

[[Image:561px-Karambit_Knife.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Karambit Knife in-game.]]

== Bowie Knife ==

The Bowie Knife is a special melee weapon which can be bought for 3000 points in Der Riese, Kino der Toten and Five. It is larger and wider than the standard combat knife in Call of Duty: Black Ops (or any Call of Duty game for that matter). It increases Knife damage from 150 to 1150, making it a one-hit-kill for zombies from Round 1 to Round 11. It is a one-hit-kill to Hellhounds all the way up until the third hellround.

[[Image:BowieKnifePolkCompetition2-1024.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Bowie Knife in Real Life.]]

[[Image:Bowie.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Bowie Knife in-game.]]

=Discussion=
This game has a cold war look to it

==AK74u==

In game, it is a ak74u, not an aks74u. U=carbine S=folding stock.
The in game models are all mssing stocks, so are only an ak74u, as they are called in game. It should be noted as such, im sick of having to re change the main page and want to get this cleared up/

I don't care if there's no stock, there's no such designation as "AK-74u". Also, try unlocking the "grip" attachment for it. That adds the stock back on. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:00, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

AK74 is base model, u means shortened, s means folding stock, etc. So chopping stock off makes it a 74u

I am fully aware of what the designations mean. Find me an actual AK-74 carbine produced from the factory without the side-folder and actually labelled "AK-74u" (cannot be simply an AKS-74U with the stock detached), and I'll gladly change it back. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:16, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

It doesnt matter how it left the factory, it matters how you modify it. If you put a 4.25 inch barrel and slide on a full sized 1911 do you call it a government model or a commander? I mean its a commander model but left the factory a government.....

This isn't the Call of Duty Wiki, kid. We don't promote misinformation as fact like they do there. We refer to and classify firearms as they are in the ''real'' world, not the ''game'' world. That means referring to it by its ''actual'' name (AKS-74U, not AK-74U) and classification (carbine, not SMG). It doesn't matter what it's called in the game. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:09, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Im trying to put the corerect designation, maybe even note there is a ak74 u and a aks74u, remember that we cant say a gun has a folding stock if it has NO stock. a 7.5 inch barreled ar with a stock is a carbine, taking the stock of its an ar pistol, not a ar stockless rifle.

But "AK-74U" is ''not'' the correct designation. Look at the [[I Am Legend]] page and you'll note that even though Will Smith's AR is modified to appear as an M4A1 in the movie, we still classify it based on what it ''came out of the factory as'', a Colt Law Enforcement Carbine. Also not that the most recent AK iterations as well as the AN-94 all have side-folding stocks, yet no "S" in their designations. Your AR "pistol" comparison also has no validity in that those so-called "pistols" all fire the same full-sized .223 cal./5.56mm ammunition and as such are pistols ''in name only''. So like HashiriyaR32 said, unless you can provide proof of an actual real life AK-74 carbine ''factory-produced'' without a folding stock and bearing the in-game designation, it stays AKS-74U. You're in the domain of the "gun nerds" and real life fact takes priority over in-game fiction. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:38, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

==Accuracy of Game==
I have Black Ops and have beaten the campaign, while the missions range from 1961 to 1968 the game is LOADED with anachronisms, im not sure an alternate reality would explain for having FAMAS F1s ( ''In fact, FELIN´s'' --[[User:Werc|Werc]]) and AUG A1s in the 1960s. Also they have the M16 in Vietnam with a so-called Masterkey system on it, im not sure that they had Masterkeys in Vietnam but it looks to be an Ithaca 37 stakeout attatched to the M16, also nearly ALL of the NVA soldiers are armed with SPAS-12 which is completely wierd. Any comments from people who have played the game?
: Yeah, you are right. If this game would be atleast fun. But its boring, MP is even worse than in MW2 ( ''And MW2 had worst MP of all'' ''times'' ), SP is boring like hell. There is nothin such as AI. Storyline is boring an unoriginal. Weapons are both anachronistic and unrealistic. Nothing like kicback even on Mosin Nagant ? '''THIS GAME SUCKS, just like MW2 did''' --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:09, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
::Do you get a nickel from EA every time you rag on the game? And there are many things I can say about the story, but "unoriginal" is not one of them. I have yet to play another FPS where the player is mentally ill and one of the main characters is merely a hallucination. (Unless there's an "A Beautiful Mind" FPS I don't know about.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:50, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

well i enjoyed it , and if i tape a shotgun under the barrel of my M16 why cant i call it a masterkey . simmons 8492

I know that most of the weapons in the game are anachronistic and that's a little bit sad for a cold war game, but a lot of those firearms are never seen in video games, that's one thing that made me like it. Perhaps,I enjoyed the stroryline from the begining to the end, I love the Zombie mode and the multiplayer is great (at least when I play with my friends). --[[User:VillageFroid|VillageFroid]] 19:19, November 11 2010 (UTC)

==AKS74U a RIFLE, not a SMG!!!!==

It seems like its cool to put the 74u as a subgun these days, WTF. Its a Short carbine.
:It's an SMG.
:: '''LoL.'''
::Traditionally, a carbine is defined as a shorter variant of a full sized rifle, which the AKS-74U clearly is. The definition is a bit looser today. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:54, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:::The AKS-74U is a Carbine, meaning shortened assault rifle. The AK-74 is the main model. The "S" means its a Carbine. The "U" means it has a folding stock. --ZEER
:::: No :) "S" ( Sklopnyj - somehing like "foldable") means folding stock and "U" ( Ukrochenyj - Shortened ) means carbine :)

An SMG is a machine gun shooting pistol caliber rounds, which 5.45x39mm doesn't qualify as.

At least this time around they managed to get the name of the gun right. :/ [[Special:Contributions/124.148.203.141|124.148.203.141]] 07:41, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

A carbine is a short rifle, not a shortened assault rifle. I don't think the Mosin Nagant is a assault rifle or the M44 Carbine Mosin Nagant is a shortened assault rifle. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:38, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:From tactical point of view AKS-74U can be classified as SMG because of its size, as well as Mk 18, 9A-91, SR3 etc. But from a technical view all those are of course ultra-short assault rifles.

Just to confuse everyone a bit more, Colt marketed the CAR-15 as a Sub-machine Gun. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:02, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

::The manufacturers are actively MARKETING these ultra short full auto 'carbines' to fulfill the submachine gun role in both military and law enforcement applications (both The M16 and the AKs have been sold this way). That's why people call them SMGs. The guns makers routinely muddy the waters as to the difference between the two definitions themselves. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 14:49, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

:::Guys, IMFDB has always classified the AKS-74U as an assault rifle (see my recent page for the movie ''[[Icarus]]'', for example). It may be used in the submachine gun role, but it is a derivative of the AK-74, which is unmistakably an assault rifle. So I am going to defer to tradition here; we have to be consistent.

:::Also, bear in mind that the original AK-47 (the weapon we all think of as the classic assault rifle) was once thought of as a submachine gun in many of the armed forces that carried it (including the People's Liberation Army of China). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:53, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

::::Video Games are ruining young minds. assault rifles shoot rifle rounds, not pistol rounds. put down the Modern Warfare and Bad Company.

It's an Intermediate rifle, like the P90 or MP7A1, slightly smaller caliber but with an effective range between a rifle's range and a sub gun's range.
:No, that is an incorrect comparison. The AK-74U is just a compact rifle since it fires an assault rifle round, not an assault rifle "styled" rifle. The P90 and the MP7 are designed from the ground up to be PDWs that fired ammo that are necked down rifle rounds instead of pistol rounds designed with the same armor piercing power as the full size rifle. It's like the Colt Model 733 or the 933 or any of the other shorten assault rifle variants. A submachine gun is always compared to weapons that fire pistol caliber ammo. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:15, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

But weapons like the SAM-R use the same caliber as 933 and 733, 5.56x45, and the SAM-R is used as a DMR. i doubt the 5.45x39 could be a marksman rifle cartridge. even though its longer than the 5.7 or 4.6, its range and accuracy are not that of a true assault rifle.

==IGN reviews the Call of Duty: Black Ops trailer==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=292tCSCvFQY

I wish that IGN would actually hire people who know what the hell they're talking about, instead of a couple of conceited pricks who think that the M4 Carbine assault rifle existed thirty years before it was produced. Not to mention the fact that they also erroneously refer to it as "a machine gun" and the Steyr AUG assault rifle series as "submachine guns". [[Special:Contributions/203.59.108.117|203.59.108.117]] 11:36, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
::nerd rage
: You gotta cut people some slack when it comes to these kind of things, why would we expect the guys who analyze video game trailers to know any more about guns than what they see in video games? Although calling the AUG a sub-machine gun was pretty boneheaded...[[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:03, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well even though the M4 Carbine wasn't around at the time. This game takes place during the Cold War, Vietnam, and the rest of the time period was not yet announced. You can't be sure when the game takes place until you see it, even though they announced an era, they didn't announce a time line. I'm sure you know that the M4 was made to replace the CAR-15, but the SOG got their hands on the newest weapons before they went into service. Which means, once the M4 was made, it would be sent straight to them. And besides, like he said, its just a game.

::I love how the only defense for the anachronistic weapons is "SOG got it before everyone else". That must mean that when US Army Rangers charged up onto Omaha Beach in 1944, they must have had M4A1s and M16A4s kitted out with EOTechs, Aimpoints, ACOGs, and PEQ-16 laser/light modules, right? Or when SEALs were hunting VC in the Mekong Delta, they must have had SCARs and M249s, right? Or how about the Battle of the Alamo, where Davy Crockett was picking off Mexican soldiers with an XM29 OICW, right? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:38, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

: Yes the excuse is a bit weak, but don't you think that analogy is a bit extreme? So far the differences have only been maybe 2 or 3 years, not 20 or 30 like in your analogy. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 14:41, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

We've been having this reoccuring conversation that the AR-15 in the game should not exist at all. There might have been conceptual designs for a flat top AR-15 carbine, but it isn't like SOG could hold up a picture of an M4 that hasnt been thought up yet and tell some gunsmith to make this with flip up iron sights, which also shouldnt exist. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:51, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Now I'm actually hearing rumors is that this is an alternate history themed game, so that would just debunk weapons that shouldn't exist if it is alternate history [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:54, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

: Oh I wasn't even thinking of the wierd AR-15 when I said that, I guess you're right. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:07, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

:So what if ''Call of Duty: Black Ops'' takes place in an alternate timeline? ''Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater'' and ''Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker'' feature alternate histories and yet they still managed to retain a sense of realism when it came to firearms. Treyarch needs to take a leaf out of Kojima Productions' book. Also, while we're at it, I wonder just how much they have paid these so called SOG veterans to keep their mouths shut about the inconsistencies of this game and instead talk about how their old buddies in the unit regularly included crossbows (equipped with explosive rounds, no less) in their field arsenal while completing missions. [[Special:Contributions/203.206.7.125|203.206.7.125]] 06:03, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

==zombie mode==
Hey guys, Zombie mode on Black Ops includes 2 maps, each bringing there own unique cast of characters
-Kind Der Untoten-
-All classic Nazi Zombies Characters

-Five-
-Fidel Castro (Holding Colt Python)
-John F. Kennedy (Holding China Lake Launcher)
-Richard Nixon
-Robert McNamara
These maps i have not played that much but from what i have there are these weapons
-Kind Der Untoten-
-Olympia (Over & Under)
-Walther MPL
-PM-63
-MP-40
-Mystery Box (Any number of assorted weapons)

-Five-
-Olympia
-Walther MPL

-will they have it? It is treyarch, but i havent heard anything solid yet.
:The article that I read (and summarized below) seemed to indicate that they had something other than zombies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:22, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Hopefully not copying spec ops.....

Maybe it's aliens.

Area 51 anyone? Eh? Eh? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 22:17, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

its been confermed . for news hit up black ops 24/7 . they dont have 100 percent accurate weapons lists but its the best site out there

==What's the type of grenade under the M18 smoke grenade on the breaching artwork?==

Is it just me, or there's some type of White Phosphorus grenade under M18 smoke grenade on the breaching artwork? The guy who wields the MAC-10 has it. http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/1458/uknowngrenade.jpg

Here is the original version: http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100522160405/callofduty/images/4/4b/100355837.jpg

==add m16 to page==

It was delted since there was no in game footage, but then there is a m16 slung to the main guy's back on the cover. i say add it. I know theres no in ge screenshot yet, but look, theres no in game shots of 1911s either.

Buddy, that stuff has been added already-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

m16 has been removed, only "ar-15 carbine" is there.

==='''M16 is in.'''===

I am not sure which version is that, but i added it as A1.
:I see no forward assist and a three-prong flash hider in the screenshots, so it looks to be an original M16. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:05, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

It have been confirmed in '''Call of Duty:Black ops INSIGHT''' trailer.

Oh crap, they mentioned Sonny Puzikas, I remember that name from the spetsnaz episode of Deadliest Warrior.

==Weapons that would make sense==
M72, M60, M14, Stoner 63, M40A1, M16A1, MAC-10, Remington 1100, Smith & Wesson M76, Browning Hi-Power, Hawk MM1, Smith & Wesson 39

AK-47, AK-74, Mosin-Nagant, PM Makarov, Steckin APS, SKS, Dragnnov, PKM

-Add any other weapons that would make sense
:M3A1 "Grease Gun"/Suppressed M3A1, Carl Gustav M/45/Suppressed M/45, suppressed Uzi, CAR-15 w/CGL or M203, Ithaca 37, Remington 870, Remington 7188 Automatic Shotgun, SOG modified RPD, M-60 "Death Machine"(M-60 w/ cut down barrel and ammo pack), HK-33(Harrington and Richardson T223).
:RPD, MAT-49/suppressed MAT-49--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 13:08, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Dirty Harry's Smith & Wesson Model 29 and Tony Montana's "Little Friend"
:What the hell do you have with those movie guns ? Why should they be in ?

It would be amazing to see Sa. Vz. 58 there. It was frequently used by vietcong fighters as USSR´s help.

::The M60D, the M1928 Thompson, the PPSh-41, the StG44, the Winchester 1200, the RPG-2, the SKS, Norinco Type 54, M1 Carbine, and the Sten. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 00:14, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

:::It would be good if they could do a proper tactical reload? If you reload a gun with a round in the chamber you will have an extra round which means you should have a 31 rounds on let's say an M16A2.

''''''Some good proofs''' :'''

http://nam64-75.hill.cz/download/file.php?id=691&sid=c3ccbd4348543db02c420df186cb428c ('' '''NVA training''''' )

http://www.quansuvn.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=41.0;attach=4972;image

http://nam64-75.hill.cz/download/file.php?id=1169 ('' '''SSG Patrick Tadina with his Vz. 58''''' )

http://www.psywarrior.com/rewardforguns.gif ( '''''Vietcong fighters firearms info poster, left side, third from down''''' )

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/1164/biethaisamopal9wq.jpg ( '''''Captured Vz. 58 on left''''' )

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff164/joshuadowdle/Dad.jpg ( '''''In hands of SSG Patrick Tadina''''' )

''SSG Patrick Tadina - Legendary, five-tour Vietnam ranger. He is in rangers´s hall of fame.''
Lee Enfield SMLE/ Jungle Carbine, M1 carbine, M2 carbine, SKS, Webley, Skorpion, M1 grand, RPG-2[[User:Greywolverene|Greywolverene]]

==Should be==
There should be M72 LAWs, M60s and M14s. cause this is Vietnam baby!

Nah. They just arent cool enough for Treyarch. And if they will add those weapons - They will all have RIS rails, scopes, lasers, GL attachemnts, silencers.... --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 11:16, 15 June 2010 (UTC)No need for your cheap sarcasm here. This game doesn't seems to pursue that Nam atmosphere with rocknroll, massive chopper assaults, jungle patrols and "smell of napalm in the morning"

I'm sure you will also be able to pick up laser weapons and crap like that. [[User:SargeOverkill]]

if anything there going to have those guns , and ruinthem buy adding rails and underbarell shit.simmons8492

==E3==

Added E3 screens - .357 Python and AR15 .

== Not an AK-47 ==
Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that the mag isn't curved enough to be a 7.62x39 mag? It could be a -74 prototype, without the flash hider. Given the time frame, this may make sense.

Thanks for that, I also didn't note it before. It looks to be a WASR-2/3.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 16:19, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

:This game seems to have a lot of rendering issues when it comes to the guns [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:40, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
OMG it is damn videogame for god's sake, the guns aren't real and are nothing more than 3d drawings -of course they aren't going to be exactly like such and such gun. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 17:08, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

'''3D drawning''' ? Hell, that would be interesting. And GTFO, this is '''firearms site''' and ''YES'', we care about reality. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 17:44, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

:Thanks for pointing that out. We are a gun site and we pay attention to details. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:24, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
Well guess what, THESE ARENT GUNS!!! They aren't effing real they are nothing more than 3d models that someone threw together in 3DS MAX or whatever the hell they use so of course its not going to be up to every detail, That's why I don't do VG pages anymore--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 19:47, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

::You appear to have missed the point of this website...

::Yea. The prop guns in movies aren't real, or air-soft guns. This website is for identifying fire arms, and if you didn't know that then you obviously missed the point of the website, like he said.

AsAstra, the point that I don't think you're understanding, is that even if they're merely three dimensional renderings of the guns, and not the guns themselves, we should try to be as correct as possible. If something says that it's an Ak-74, but actually looks more like a different gun, we should call it the different gun, so as not to confuse anyone new to the site. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 15:53, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

On the topic of the AK, knowing video game developers the AK being used by the Vietcong will most likely be the same one in those snow picks. I don't think we can call it a 47 right of the bat.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

Fixed the WASR-2 messup. It's not a WASR-2. NO WASR series of rifles have the stamped steel MAGWELL DIMPLES. When looking at the screenshots the AK in game HAS those magwell dimples. That right there shows it's not a WASR.
Some people are still saying it could be WASR-2. It's not a WASR-2. WASR-2's are new production (within the past few years) rifles from Romania made ONLY for semi-automatic use and for importation into the US. There's no way on God's green earth that the rifle in game is a WASR-2.

More than likely this is just an AK-47 with an incorrectly modeled mag. They ARE modeling these things after airsoft guns ya know.

== Degtyarov ==
It just cant be DPM. Lok - It totally doesnt have ironsights - And MAG isnt on top. + Its very unlikely some guy will cary Spas12 and Degtyarev. I just think its some AK type - Or it may be some different gun, but it isnt Degtyarev.
You may keep it there, but it will be false information.

==ummmm==
This page really needs a cleanup or a deletion.
There is also too much informal talk on the page itself, infact all of it is. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 04:47, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

===Moved from main page--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 04:49, 2 May 2010 (UTC)===
== AR-10 ==

Another unknown M16 family gun. But this one seems more like [[Armalite AR-10]] A4

[[Image:AR10-4.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Armalite AR-10 A4 7.62x51mm.]]
[[Image:AR10.JPG|thumb|none|400px|M16 Family unknown gun as appeared in Black Ops teaser.]]

:The magazine seems too long to be an AR-10
::Thats looking a bit like a STANAG Magazine. The STANAG Magazines are compatible with many NATO weapons, including the SCAR-L Carbine, the M4 Carbine and the M16 Rifle. Even if it were an AR-10 its likely that it would be chambered for the standard NATO round and accept the STANAG type magazine.

Also the AR10 is a civilian gun right? So why would special forces like that guy above be holding it? I personally think its an M16(either A1 or A2) with a scope attached to its carrying handle/iron sight.

:It's a strange AR-15 Carbine with a flat top [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:20, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

AR-10 is not necessarily civilian. It is entirely possible that SOF would use one.

I think is not AR10.AR10 use .308 or 7.62x51mm round and the magazine large and short than AR15.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

: Its uselles to keep AR-10 discussion here. We all know its that ankward AR-15 or XM177 or whatever.

== Un-identified guns ==

[[Image:MP5G3.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''1''' : Possibly [[MP5]] or [[G3]].]]
[[Image:UNKNOWNLOL.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''2''' : I totally dont know.But it may be some russian one.]]
It seems to look like a [[MAC-10]] or an [[Uzi]] with the stock extended-[[User:SargeOverkill]]
[[Image:UNKNOWN THE MOST.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Un-identified gun '''4''' : Its hard to tell which gun this one is, but it looks like [[Beretta AR-70/223]] or Daewoo K2. I think that this gun could be any gun I see and AK there but it could be a siper rifle for all we know]]
As to the first unknown gun, it's too short to be a G3, so I believe it's an MP5. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:50, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

im not sure but with those ironsites id say a g36 . i hope they brink the one from COD4 back i loved it. simmons 8492

In black ops there appears also a weapon that an elicoptero is in use for throwing .. it appears in the game in the level 2 as harpoon
[[Image:Harpoon.jgp]]

== RPK ==

From the looks of it, it might be an RPK-74. Note the 45-round banana mag and the flash suppressor.

The "RPK" and the "Valmet" are the same guns - look carefully at the screenshot. Given that the 7.62mm AK-47 appears in game and the timeline, I'm gonna say that it's not an RPK-74, but a 7.62x39mm RPK or one made to look like a Valmet for some reason. Maybe Treyarch modelers are using 80's action movies as a reference for their RPK model. *shakes head*

No. Look on that "RPK" an you will see typical RPK stock. Look on "Valmet" and you will see it doesnt look like Valmet :)--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 03:53, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Look at the front of the Valmet trigger guard. Now look at that same exact place on the "Valmet" in the game picture. Different. There is no Valmet, it's an RPK.

Moved "Unknown LMG" stuff to the RPK-74 section. Whoever posted those images under there originally failed to notice the way the RPK-74 front sight is canted compared to the Valmet. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 14:18, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

==M1911==

In the title screen there is a soldier holding a 1911 i believe it also says something on the side.

It says "Sally" on the slide.

The 1911 looks more like the first and not the A1, look at the ejection port.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:17, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Here's to hoping it's 1911s will be in the arsenal in multi-player, and not the tease in MW2 --[[Special:Contributions/67.181.114.114|67.181.114.114]] 07:13, 1 June 2010 (UTC)JanG

well am i the only one who thinks WAW did a horible job of represting the stoping power of the .45 . i mean the gun does nothing in the game , but in real life its a man stoper. simmons 8492

Game balance. That's why [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:36, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

i under stand but the walther is better in that game than the 1911. at least the .45 in COD4 had some good stopingpower to it . i know its a diffrent model but still . simmons 8492

and lucky for me , the boys at trayarc made the M1911A1 the manstoper that it is .SEMPER FI!!! simmons 8492

one thing i noticed is that some times the player racks the slide and it stays back like its empty . i dont get it. simmons 8492

Its a useless flair that can be done with a real gun by pushing up on the Slide release as you pull it back and then release it after its locked. I did it on my Hi Power after seeing it.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:30, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

== good decision ==

As well as Weapon customization there will also be a character customization feature.
- That game is gonna be just awesome. Character customization ? Damn, just in R6:V style (ha-ha)

* Custom characters? hell yeah --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 00:38, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
i agree with that customization policy, i liked how in R6V2 they did that, and i can only hope they bring back CoD4s M4A1 Grenadier back, and i also completely agree with the historic battle/ war thing as compared to a (***Spoiler) nuclear warfare and a domestic terrorist plot, i would much rather see Black Hawk Down pop up in a newer game as opposed to Vietnam, but i would settle for a Operation Acid Gambit type game also.

Customizable characters in a game where... you can't actually ''see'' the character? FAIL.
* Customizable characters in game where will be 3rd person mode, and where other players can see it ? Your post '''fail'''.
:When did Black Ops become third person? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 00:42, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

It isn't. He's saying that other characters will see your 3rd person form. Also, it's noteworthy that MW2 DID have third person mode.
:So then I've gotta agree. Character customization in a game where you can't actually see your guy seems like a fail to me, too. It's not like anybody in MP is really gonna stop shooting at you to say "hey, cool guy, what kind of vest is that?" And how do I activate this third person mode in MW2? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:50, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

:: Well, i dont know. But what about trying "3RD PERSON" in "Play" screen ?

I think it's hilarious how people are whinig about the customization... Go play R6. Custom characters work in FPS games.
:Yeah, i bought R6:V2 not so long ago and its amazing. I think that game has best character customization ever. Its only pity you cant do anything with your teammates.
:R6V also has a cover system where you can actually ''see'' the guy/girl you're playing as, a third person mode cheat, and player characters who actually have voices and speak rather than being mutes with no form of personality whatsoever, none of which Black Ops has. I simply think character customization is unnecessary. That's not whining, it's called ''having an opinion". [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:09, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

How does the post fail it was an update its not like i'm wrong. its not like i said there would be some sort of Grizzly Bear cannon. it was a NEWS UPDATE!!! THINK next time a stupid comment is thought by yourself.
Also heres the ANSWER the other players can see you just like AVP. so thats how customization comes in handy. [[user:moviemaster1993|moviemaster1993]]
:First off, I never said ''your post'' failed. That was ''your'' response to ''me'', smart ass. I was commenting on a feature of the game I think is unnecessary, something I'm fully allowed to do. You aren't the lord of opinions around here. Second, comparing Rainbow Six to Call of Duty is about as much of a failure as one can accomplish. Lastly, who the hell cares if another player can see you? I wouldn't be customizing my character for other people, just like other people aren't going to be customizing their characters for me. It's not like everybody's gonna stop shooting and comment on every other player's individual character, is it? The only stupid comments on here are coming from ''you''. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:30, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

I think it's more for identification than anything. So if you're pissed at one guy, you can just look at him ans say "Hey it's that one guy, Imma kill 'em", instead of reading the little tiny red words above their head that is often jibberish anyway. Just my opinion, though. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:45, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

== MP5k ==

You think they're putting that in there to copy MW2?
:No I think they're doing it to fulfill their MP5 quota. MW2 wasn't the first game to feature the MP5K, broski.-protoAuthor 00:23, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't know about that. They also have an AUG in the game and a SPAS-12. Not a coincidence that MW2 also has these. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

- Heh. Spas and AUG were in tons of other games. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

But THIS game is directly part of the COD franchise. It's a bit repetitive to show guns that has been in previous games. Well ok WWII games don't count because they cant help having the same guns, but this is supposed to be Treyarch's turn at making a new game, but so far, none of the weapons are new. What about instead of the SPAS-12, we get an 870, or instead of the AUG, we get...any other bullpup rifle of the time. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:36, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm thinkin' maybe they showed off the MW2 guns first to get MW2 fans interested in this game. Then maybe later they'll show off some new guns. Here's to hopin'. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 22:29, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I derinitely think they're putting the MP5k in to copy MW2. They could have put in any other variant of the MP5, variants that weren't in prototype stage and would probably be more combat effective, but they went with the k variant. That said I don't think it's any coincidence the SPAS-12 and AUG is in there either.

You don't get the fans back with the same old guns. You draw interests with NEW guns that hasn't been used before. Variety and distinctions. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Well, Treyarch apparently didnt start copying first. MW2´s specops get idea fairly sure from WaW´s coop system :D
:The latest issue of the official xbox magazine says that they originally had planned on having co-op throughout the entire campaign in MW2, but cut it because it messed with the narrative. Or, it would've been way too fun. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:06, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
the AUG was stupid in the game, no1 in USSOCOM uses that gun
* Would you mind telling what do you have against bullpup designs, beside "the looks"?--[[User:WhiteSlift|WhiteSlift]] 11:58, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
* Heh. MP5k get into service 20 years after Vietnam war. There was only prototype in latest parts pf Vietnam war. MAC10 or UZI would be much more realistic in hands of US soldiers. Atleast much more than prototype gun. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:49, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
*"MP5K get into service 20 years after Vietnam war"...the MP5K isn't that new. Considering that the war ended in 1975, and the MP5K was introduced in 1976, you are way off.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 01:30, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

true why would they be carrying a Prototype in to combat

Well how much differently could essentially just a shortened MP5 with a foregrip work from the regular MP5?

Because it's a video game that doesn't care about accuracy and realism. I mean what loser actually waits until Picatinny rails to be invented? Go ahead and put them on your rifle in Nam, it's the new trend.

Why are you complaining about the AUG in particular, I mean USSOCOM doesn't use it? Yeah, well they sure as hell don't use the deagle or the AA12 or the FAMAS but I don't see you complaining

"I mean what loser actually waits until Picatinny rails to be invented?" Picatinny rails have been around since 1913, broski.
:Not in their modern version, Broseph Stalin.

You all are forgetting..this is SOG, not SOCOM. SOG could carry into battle whatever they wanted to. Could they have carried a prototype MP5K? Sure! Keep in mind..they had access to stuff that NOBODY ELSE in the military had access to at that time. Hell..one time they brought an airhorn with them and scared the crap out of an entire NVA division with it.
:Look, I can understand having access to weapons no one has ever heard of at the time, but you can't have access to weapons if it doesnt EXIST in the world yet. I mean just because they are SOG doesn't mean they have their own special gunsmith to factory make new parts and designs for weapons that haven't been thought up yet. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:21, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

== What the hell is up with this AR-15 Carbine? ==

It looks like a 733, but at the same time, not since it also has a flat top, but the scenes in the trailer that showed this rifle is assumed to be Vietnam era, so a flat top AR-15 shouldn't exist at the time much less a rail system for it. Also the same AR also has a rear iron sight on the flat top. This doesn't make sense [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

- I think its XM177, but customized way to much. Its mucb more possible that Treyarch just failed. I think they just added rail system/flat top just because MP. You know, attachments. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

::It cannot be an XM177 if it has a flattop receiver. Those did not exist when the XM177s were introduced. The flash hider is also Vortex, not the XM177-type. The game's 3D artists might have been ignorant about what AR carbines existed at the time. But that is not an XM177. Not by a long shot. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 05:23, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

I think the game's 3D rendering tech was mostly like stone because it's the 60s and 70s, but the trailer animation is horrible! I could barely tell what was going on and the weapon details are no where like MW2. Say what you want about MW2 when it comes to consistencies, but at least they can render their weapons correctly. My first upload of that funky AR-15 shows the handguard as this polygon like thing. And did flat top receivers exist during Nam? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:34, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

:::''And did flat top receivers exist during Nam?''

:::No, not at all. My recollection is that the Colt ACR (introduced in the 1980s) was the first AR-type rifle to feature a flattop receiver. Even though the ACR was a bust, flattops were subsequently carried over into future AR generations. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 05:39, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

With these seemingly anachronistic flat top recievers and flip up sights I think this game is headed towards failure. Seems like they're taking the MW2 route and making their "balanced" and cosmetically changed multiplayer weapons also appear in single player. I hope by some miracle they don't or else they don't get my money.

:And here I remember talking to my brother about how they can fuck up the M16 by either putting A2s or burst A1s, but this is WAY over there in the incorrect area. Haven't they seen any Nam movies? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:03, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

: Excalibur01 - or use five minutes just f-i-v-e f**king minutes of their time and try to google some Vietnam-era photos. Or they could hire someone with at least basic knowledge of era background and weaponery. You know, they spent money on countless other things. But I guess that Call of Duty is now like B-rated action movies. Make as many as you can and don't worry about the quality. Nobody gives a s*it about how it looks like or if it is correct as far as it would look cool and geek teen age kiddos would pay the money so they could play multiplayer on their lagging net servers. [Ragnar - 22:25, 19 May 2010]

Hopefully they at least have the M16 have full auto instead of burst, would make it more fun that way. I did read that this isn't taking place in vietnam on yahoo news which probably is incorrect but this is ridulous of the weapons they are putting in.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:48, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

:I read an IGN article that it'll take place throughout the Cold War, from the end of Nam to Cuba and also Princess Gates London [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:17, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

I researched the history of picatinny rails, turns out Treyarch may have actually done very good research. This is what I found: "The MIL-STD-1913 standard was developed out of efforts during the M16A1 Product Improvement Program which eventually resulted in the M16A2. One of the abandoned ideas was a receiver with a built-in rail. In the 1970s, Rock Island Arsenal experimented with a sniper AR-10 with a Weaver rail. In Vietnam, the Model 656 had a built-in rail." Source:http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/archive/index.php/t-18737.html
I don't know about you guys, but I'm now willing to believe the rails on this AR (Model 656?) isn't a goof at all.
:Well, its always good to know new thing :) But i think it still wasnt regular Vietnam equipment. And i also think there wont be even M16 or M16A1 ingame.--[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:35, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
::True, it wasn't regular Vietnam equipment. But these aren't regular soldiers either. These guys are top secret black ops, higher than tier one operators. They can use any weapon in the world, even ones that are in secret development. And you're probably right, I doubt there'll be an M16, simply because these experimental ARs look cooler, have a bit of mystery around them, and can accept multiple attachments. But I wouldn't be surprised if they name the rifles M16.

The model 656 looked like this:

[[Image:model 656.jpg]]

It was just an early M16 with an early style rail system. So far, I have not found images of a Carbine with these types of rails, experimental or not. Rails were not on the forefront of military minds before the 90s. The military didn't even decided to put rails on the M16 until a decade after the M4 came out. And even the Model 656 rails were not on a flat top receiver like the ones on an M4. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 13:57, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
:Aw crap, there goes my theory. Looks like it's back to just being a Treyarch fail.

I'm not one to justify inaccuracy in videogames but, the upper receiver on the 656 could easily be swapped with that of an AR-15 carbine. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 00:50, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Sure...but the one we see in the game is not the same rail receiver as the one the 656 has. It has a flat top like an M4 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:22, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

I just noticed that the front sight isn't removed when an optic attachment is present, an improvement over other COD games. Maybe Treyarch realized an AR would be bolt-action if the gas block was removed.
:Low-profile gas block is not visible from first-person perspective. And 3-d person gun models were made as low-poly as possible to minimise system loads(this was crucial because games was intended for Xbox in first place)

Who know CAR-15 with rear flip up sight use in vietnam war? I see a south vietnam flag in picture.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]
: No. Though, prototype flat-top receiver and flip-up like on your screen could be possible, but it just doesn't look authentic to the time period. I wouldn't mind if they put in something like Model 656(pictured above). But they really need to get rid of that modern-looking AR.
[[Image:CODBOAR-15b.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

It's just like the Aperature sight in W@W, but no where near as bad. I don't see why people are making such a big deal out of it, sure it's not exactly authentic, but it's far from game ruining like what a lot of people here are saying.

== Complaints ==
Hey, it's a game, not a history lesson. It's all about fun and style and so. I do like a realistic movie or game, but I don't hate a game just because the artists created something they think it's better this way. Nobody complains when a director sums up a car ride that would take 1 hour in real life in one scene in the movie, or when he puts the light where the sun can never be just to make it look good, but when someone puts a cool looking AUG in a game set before 1977, because it looks cool, or creates his own creative vision of an AR-15 everyone freaks out. All the time you hear people say "They should have done better research!" or "They don't know anything about history!", but maybe the did research, and they know history, and they discussed it and decided that they want to create something own, because they feel it fits better in their creative work than what real life history can give them.

*Yeah, you are right. Now we need M1 Abrahams tank in some Napoleonic Wars strategy. Cause that tank is just cool - right ? Or maybe M4 Carbine in WW2 shooter ?--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:28, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

::Treyarch is legally obligated to keep the timeline from going beyond Vietnam. [http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/03/04/the-activision-lawsuit-what-it-means-and-where-it-s-going.aspx] If that means they have to cheat a bit regarding the weapons, I'm willing to give them some leeway. Let's face it, we're probably the only people who truly care anyway. None of these inaccuracies are going to keep any of us from buying this game when it comes out and playing the heck out of it. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:41, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

They're not legally obligated to keep it from going beyond Vietnam. As that article says..all they need is full approval from West and Zampella. Considering those two aren't rampant assholes..it's a total possibility.
:That's a bit like saying other people can write Harry Potter novels as long as JK Rowling is okay with it, or other studios can make Star Wars movies as long as George Lucas is okay with it. Have you looked at the games IW has made? Have you noticed a pattern? (For those who don't want to look, all they make are CoD games. That is literally all they have going for them.) Sure, they COULD give away their golden goose and let someone develop else something Activision has given them exclusivity with, but I can't imagine a single scenario where they would. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 10:45, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

* Well, msot of CoD players wont even recognize M16 and M4 or HK416. So yep - We are maybe only ones who care about it :/ --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:44, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
::And mind you, Treyarch is the same developer that had Japanese troops using suppressed MP40s with reflex sights in WaW. Oh, and a RAY GUN TO SHOOT ZOMBIES. That being said, I was devastated when I found out that MW2 wouldn't have zombies, and I'll be even more devastated if BO doesn't have them. IMHO, zombies was the best part of WaW. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 17:39, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
* And IW had OMOH with FN2000´s and IMI Tavor´s - So whats the difference :D Hope zombies will be includeProxy-Connection: keep-alive
Cache-Control: max-age=0

too.

:Ok the Zombie thing in WaW was a side game. It's not part of the "story". If the zombies and the ray gun appeared in the actual missions, then we'd called bullshit but with a smile cause zombies are awesome to fight. The suppressors and red dot sights were for multiplayer to compete with COD4 at the time, so those don't count. We're talking historically accurate, period piece weapons. It's like we do a game taking place during the Civil War but we all got 1911s as handguns and M1 Garands as rifles. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:22, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
::You're telling me you wouldn't play a Civil War game where you can use an M1 Garand? ;)True, they tried that with Darkest of Days, but it was terribly done. And second, you CAN get the ray gun for one of the campaign missions, and it is awesome. (You can take down a tank with two shots.) But I know what you're getting at. I'm just saying we shouldn't let the nitty gritty get in the way of good gameplay, especially since Treyarch already has one hand legally tied behind their backs. Would they want to make a Modern Warfare-like game set in present day or the near future? Sure, but they can't, they're legally handcuffed to inflexible historical fact. Besides, no game has ever gotten its weapons exactly right. We have an entire generation of kids who believe an M1 Garand can't be reloaded without firing the entire clip, or it has less stopping power than a K98K. I won't lose any sleep if BO has AR-15s with flat top receivers, but I will if the game sucks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 06:34, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
You know if there gonna screw this game why don't the just add a bunch of laser guns or crap. I mean i could understand if the weapons in the game where off, but i have a feeling this game is going to be a cluster F***
::We're basing a lot on two trailers and some scanned images from a magazine 5.5 months from release. I'm going to reserve judgment until I actually play it or at least hear from people who have actually played it. Treyarch has little to lose here. If it's great, people will praise them, if it's not, people already think they're the Fredo Corleone to IW's Michael Corleone in the Activision family. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:40, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
:::And while we're here, we've been talking about how the angle of the AK mag is slightly off, but is anyone else annoyed that if you do a tactical reload and drop half a mag, those rounds in the discarded mag magically go back into your ammo stockpile and you don't lose them? This has been true in 99.7% of all FPS's I've ever played. Gamers have accepted the idea of the consequence-free tactical reload for over a decade now. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:40, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::::You're right it's a crying shame. Not only because it's more accurate when the game keeps track of ammo in specific mags but it also adds another challenge and element of strategy. I also enjoy the one game I've played that keeps track of the +1 round in your gun when you reload. I wish more games were like that. Sad thing is I don't see COD heading in the right direction ever again.
:::::The one time I saw them do the tactical reload correctly was... Navy SEALs Quake, a mod for Quake II. Yes, it was a mod made by amateurs over ten years ago. The big game companies aren't doing it right because they don't want to. I remember the first time I played a game that had different animations for reloading with a round in the chamber and one without. Operation Winback on the N64, also ten years ago. It was a nice touch. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:48, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::::::'''Operation Flashpoint''', '''Rainbow Six: Raven Shield''' and '''Insurgency''' all did tactical reloads properly (ammunition is a number of magazines, not bullets, and if you reload a partially-empty mag it goes back in the pool), and the latter two also simulated +1 capacity. Insurgency is a mod but the other two are retail games. --[[User:MattyDienhoff|MattyDienhoff]] 20:00, 23 July 2010 (UTC)

* But we arent complaining here about animation and bullet system, damn. We are critising look of those guns ! That stramge XM177/AR15 hybrid was seen many times in reveal trailer, so we can judge it. And it failed. Its still better when you have realistic gun without realistic ammo system than crazy-unrealistic looking gun with realistic ammo system. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:06, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::I don't think it'd be that hard to replace the skin. [[Black]] didn't give a damn about realism, but it was still enjoyable as hell. The way I see it, ultimately, it's just a game, to be played because it's fun, not as an interactive history lesson. If you want accuracy, watch the Military Channel or actually go out to the range. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:48, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
::: Well, it doesnt have to be "interactive history lesson" but atleast a bit of realism would be nice. '''''BTW''': I visit shooting range once or twice in month :)''

As pointed out, we don't want TOTAL realism. Otherwise, one bullet hit to the chest is enough to kill you. At least head shots are instant kills in the game. But we're doing a game based on a particular period and it has to be accurate. I mean, if you were watching a WWI movie and see soldiers with M16s. That's a bit jarring right? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:03, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
:: Now he will answer it isnt jarring. If the movie has cool effects and famous actors.
:::Jarring, maybe, but I don't know if it'd ruin it for me. (Is it a sci-fi film? Surrealism? A film by Uwe Boll?) It'd be one thing to have blatant mistakes, like M16s in WWI, but would it have ruined [[Saving Private Ryan]] if Sgt Horvath had a post war M1 Carbine with a bayonet lug and adjustable rear sights instead? Did the fact that the officers had Webley Mark VI's instead of Adams Mark III's ruin [[Zulu]]? Did the fake M72 LAW in [[Ronin]] take you out of the movie? If it didn't, it's because you chalked it up as a goof, moved on, and enjoyed the rest of an otherwise good movie. If it did, then I don't know what to tell you. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:52, 25 May 2010
(UTC)

Here's a hypothetical question: This game is called Black Ops, so theoretically, they can make up whatever they want, what do we know, it's a black op, and thus classified. What if all the weapons in the game were all fake, either outright, or fictional modifications of real weapons? Would we still be up in arms? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:14, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
: I hate to say it but you might be onto something. I've heard rumors that Black Ops will rewrite history and take place in an alternate past. This is probably how Treyarch can get around the legal restrictions of not being able to make post-Vietnam games and explain these BS weapons. Personally I think it's pretty weak but it explains it.
:: Well, if it does... Wait-It doesnt! I read some article with one of Treyarch members which strictly denied possibility of alternate reality. Ill repat it again : its just some Treyarch modeller fail. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:39, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
It's not rewriting history at all basically it's saying that during the Cold War what if there were some Black Ops that went down to keep the whole thing from escalating into an actual official war. Which is completely possible.
:::It doesn't have to be alternate history, just a secret history. It's implied that the JFK assassination will be in the game. Is the player the second gunman on the grassy knoll? Is he supposed to stop the second gunman on the grassy knoll? Does he successfully stop a possible third gunman? They can make up anything they want in that scenario. A mission can have the player equipped with a prototype laser rifle, but it's scripted so the rifle is damaged or lost along the way, and the technology is lost forever. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:53, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

It would be great if they do include Dirty Harry's gun and Tony Montana's "Little Friend".

The Steyr AUG (Armee Universal Gewehr - Universal Army Rifle) had been in development since the late 1960s, as a replacement for venerable but obsolete Stg.58 (FN FAL) battle rifles for Austrian army. It was developed by the Austrian Steyr-Daimler-Puch company (now the Steyr-Mannlicher AG & Co KG) in close conjunction with Austrian Army.See? It's not that wrong. Got it from http://world.guns.ru/assault/as20-e.htm
:It's still wrong. Just because the AUG was in development doesn't mean a working prototype existed. And if it's supposed to be the prototype, why does the AUG in the game look like the production version, only without the grip, and not as depicted in the prototype drawing shown on the World Guns page? I think the whole prototype explanation is a lame excuse in order to include more modern weapons in the game. I would much rather see the weapons that SOG actually used included in Black Ops, instead of an assault rifle that we've seen about 5 billion times in other shooters. I already posted below how Treyarch could have used the Remington 7188 full auto shotgun in the game. This weapon was actually used in Vietnam, and as far as i know has never been used in a video game, but instead they chose the SPAS-12, which didn't exist at the time and has been used in dozens of other shooters.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 22:50, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

== Unknown ==
The rocket launcher under unknown is an M202 FLASH rocket launcher. Ashdude01 20:20 19 May 2010

Yes there is i added it to the guns page but some moron removed it

moviemaster1993 11:58 may 2010

== Carcano M91/38? ==

The images provided doesn't shot much and it is said that it can't be a mosin Nagant because the barrel is too short. Well it could be the carbine length variant or any other short barrel bolt action rifle. I can't see anything in the picture. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:26, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

It seems like its picture of that gun. Remember that game has to do something with JFK asassination and there can be barelly seen "Lee Harvey Oswald" on paper under that gun. So i think it have to be that gun - As some reference. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 03:48, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Ever heard of the Mosin Nagant M44 carbine or the finnish retooled M38?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 11:56, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

== M16 and XM177 ==

[[Image:Colts.JPG|thumb|none|500px|]]

Looks like the guy here has either an M16 as you can tell by the barrel pointing to the left and the barrel on the right looks like an XM177 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:26, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Looks like a M16A1 to me..which makes sense..since the A2 didn't come around until the early to mid 80's.

== Embargo lifts tomarrow, the 28th ==

Ones the embargo lifts we will be flooded with info, especially about guns

What embargo? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:45, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

There was an embargo for some journalist who previewed the game(they also could have played it too)and tomarrow it ends and info will get flooded all over the web

* It ended and only few informations and no new guns appeared. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 07:24, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

== Valment m78 ==
:The M78 does have its own page here, separate from the RPK. But yeah, I don't think the designers are gun-savvy enough to have both of these guns in this game.--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:55, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

What the year of Valmet M78 build? I think is not use in vietnam war the NVA don't have a finnish weapons during the war.And i think in the picture the gun is not Valmet M78.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

: And Spas-12 was in vietnam ? It may not be Valmet, but it fairly sure isnt RPK. Or another Treyarch modeller fail ? --[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 11:40, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

Anyone notice that the picture of the unknown AK-type LMG has a front sight that upright on the front side and canted forward on the back side like the RPK-74's front sight? --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 17:11, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:The Valmet M78 was invented after the production of the M76 in 1976, which is another weapon considered anachronistic for the Vietnam War era if there's any in the game. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:45, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

== Time travel (well that would explain it) ==

[http://pc.ign.com/articles/109/1093572p1.html Another preview]
--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:22, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

The page doesn't exist [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:48, 29 May 2010 (UTC)
* Fixed that link. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 16:49, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Launching an SR-71 from an aircraft carrier? Is that even possible? O_o [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 21:04, 30 May 2010 (UTC)
:They were able to operate a U-2 from a carrier, but that wouldn't be nearly as sexy as flying an SR-71, now would it? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:32, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't think it is, You know how these game designers do ALL of their research. (Man I'm sarcastic tonight)--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:11, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
::It's pretty obvious that since MW2, the main source of research is action movies and Futureweapons reruns.

Damn straight.

[[Special:Contributions/72.189.150.170|72.189.150.170]]

Not that I have anything against the SPAS-12, AUG, or AK47s, but we need to see different types of weapons. What about an 870, or the AK-74? What about other types of Bullpup? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:41, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

: You think 12-year old child knows difference between AK-74, AK-47 and AKs-74u ? That wont make sence..... Why making more weapons when you can add only those "cool" and overused ones ? --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 15:14, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

My 11 year old brother can, just saying-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

well the ak-74 would be good , but no one would notice the difference. most kids playing this game dont know am1911a1 from a m14 . id like to see both

== Prototypes ==

Just to let you know: German games magazine ''PC Games'' had an interview with the developers. In the latest issue, they write, that the black special ops team can get any equipment they want, including non-standard weapons, brand new prototypes and even customized and special built single pieces, <quote>which no one outside the team will ever get to see</quote>. So that is the official in-game explanation for every crude weapon you can see in the hands of the player.
:That's what I figured their reasoning would be. It makes sense but it's still a pretty weak explanation if you ask me.
:So super elite 1337 black ops delta teams can even get weapons ''that don't yet exist''? WTF? Why didn't our SF and SEALs in 'Nam have M4A1s with KAC rail systems, lasers, ACOGs, EOTechs, and bullets that can home in on enemy soldiers from 50 miles away, then??? It's a conspiracy to disarm the public, I tell you! But in all seriousness, I think it's an explanation that doesn't hold water. That mentality might work in 2016 during MW2, but not in a past setting like Vietnam where small arms development has been chronicled and we know where and to what it led. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 15:29, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
::I think it does hold water. Of course these finalized weapons weren't around in the late '60s to mid '70s. But how do you know their prototypes weren't? Most of the weapons in-game will either be early prototypes or in the case of the AR custom-built weapons made by the SOG operatives.
::Ok, they could at least make it look like prototypes, not like modern weapons.
::Okay, then how about when the next WWII game comes out, they give all the troops M16s, M60s, Mark 48s, G36s, AKMs, XM29s, and XM8s because, you know, super secret black ops teams can get any piece of kit they want, even if it doesn't exist yet. All they have to do is jump in Doc Brown's time machine, travel through time and grab the latest kit, then head back. 1.21 gigawatts! [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:03, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:::I've said it once before, if it's done well, I will absolutely play it. Most people play game as a means of escape, so would it really make a difference if I shot a Nazi with an M16 or an M1 Garand? He's not REALLY dead. He's not even real, and we've contributed nothing to the winning of WWII, or any war. In fact, we've contributed nothing but to our own satisfaction. They're called video GAMES. Playing games is about having fun. I'm sure many if us here loved Nazi Zombies from WaW. Why? Because we love shooting Nazis, and we love shooting zombies, and Treyarch did us a favor by combining the two activities. And we love it even more if we can shoot them with a ray gun that comes out of a magic box. Was it historically accurate? No, but believe me, the history major in me learned to live with it. (Hell, now you've got me all worked up, because as I'm typing this, I can't wait to get the chance to catch Hitler and bin Laden in a meeting and spray the room with a minigun.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:02, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
Ok i get your point, it's a video game, and fun or not it should have realism, i mean c'mon!-[[User:sargeOverkill]]
::::BTW, they already sort of did that with the Time Splitters series. And those games were awesome. (At least 2 and Future Perfect were. I never played 1.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:30, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
:::::I quite frequently have lots and lots and lots and lots of fun playing games, especially shooters, that adhere to reality. The reason I play a Vietnam or WWII shooter is because I want to immerse myself in the environment. That includes having weapons accurate to the period. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:07, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
::::::I guess that depends if you consider these games historical or not. I just lump it in with Halo and GoW now, as CoD flew off the historical rails about two or three games ago, straight into "anything goes" territory, which was good from a story telling perspective. Even when it tried to be historical (up to CoD 2) you were still one or two men who personally killed half the German army. That's why I thought releasing WaW on Veterans Day was a backhanded tribute, because nothing honors veterans like a game that allows you to win WWII singlehandedly. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:31, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

==M14==

What with this being a Vietnam War game, I'm gonna be pretty pissed if you can't use a normal M14 rifle, without all the rails and crap.
[[Image:M14Rifle.jpg|thumb|none|500px|I want to use an M14 like this in-game]]

Well, it doesnt look cool enough. Expect it with scope, silencer, thousands of rails and plastic stock. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 18:04, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

1. They'll Probably put it in.
2. the rails are the modern demands of a soldier including the ability to easily mount optics and other accessories easily. theres nothing wrong with it.

:I'd like a regular wood stocked M14, and if you want optics, they did make a scope riser mount for M14s before rail systems. As for silencers, well that's easy, and heartbeat sensors shouldn't bother to return. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::If they want to be accurate with attachments, then they should have a sniper scope and a suppressor (suppressors were available at that time).

Randy Shughart a delta force sniper never had anything fancy on his. as stated in BlackHawk down he had a vietnam era M14, with a scope. nothing fancy there. besides in vietnam there really wasnt a need for anything fancy. silencer, hell the vietcong already knew they were there because of the helo. Lam- hadn't been invented. and a tac light is slightly useless seeing how they were in a jungle 95% of the time. [[Special:Contributions/71.194.219.9|71.194.219.9]] 01:46, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

: All of these attachments really ''WONT'' make sence. '''But its Treyarch'''.

== AUG sans grip ==

What the hell is up with the AUG without a foregrip? I don't mind the fact the AUG is anachronistic, but come on...why take off something central to firing the gun. Maybe the gun is semi-automatic in the game, because our character has to plunge his hand into a bucket of ice to stop the burning after each shot.
:Yeah, I don't understand that decision. The only possible explanation I can come up with is that they used the AUG with a grenade launcher as a model, like this one [http://www.steyr-aug.com/240.jpg], and then just deleted the grenade launcher. But this would mean that no one working on the project A) ever saw a movie with an AUG, including [[Die Hard]], which I would think every male between the ages of 21-49 in the english speaking world has seen, or B) could put two and two together and figure out that putting your hand directly on a barrel is not practical. That, or the plot involves that character severely burning his hand. If not, it's an utterly indefensible and boneheaded decision by the Treyarch staff. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:29, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
::And to be absolutely fair, the character is wearing heavy gloves while holding the barrel. But it still doesn't make sense. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:21, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

::What doesn't make sense to me is that they have a military advisor on staff. How come, at no point in the development, did this man point out that holding a gun barrel while firing is a bad idea, and has he not seen an AUG before? - Opening Poster.

::Doesn't the grip fold up?-protoAuthor
:::Yes, but you'd still be able to see it. [http://www.murdoconline.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/NEW-STEYR-AUG-right.jpg]--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:12, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:I wrote that without seeing the image. Sorry.-protoAuthor
::::I agree with the grenade launcher theory, especially since multiplayer was done first. Who knows, they might actually change the standard AUG model before the game actually comes out.

The AUG without vertical grip.I think a gun barrel is very hot.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

In third person it's just a character model fail. In first person you grip I guess what you could call the "finger guard."

I've seen pics of the Austrian Army holding their AUGs by the trigger guard like a P90 but not the barrel itself, that's stupid. Plus, who the hell in 1968 would even take a design like the AUG seriously. The M16 was just starting to be taken seriously by military brass around 1968.

......Why the hell wouldn't they take it seriously? You do know that the British had actually adopted a bullpup design in 1951 for a very short time. Search Em-2 Rifle. It even had a built in optical sight on the
carrying handle. We Yanks then bossed everybody into adopting the 7.62 and the EM-2 was abandoned because it was in the .280 round so they went with the FAL which could be much more easily changed to use the 7.62
Actually, the EM-2 would be a better choice for this game or the SA80 prototype that appeared in The Professionals. I am aware of the EM-2.
=== Bullpup guns ===

If they want bulpup gun in game why didnt they coice Em-2 ? Or Famas ? WHY THAT ANACHRONISTIC AUG, damn.
The FAMAS is even more anachronistic than the AUG. The FAMAS was adopted in the early eighties and it used a different type of 5.56 ammo than the NATO standard.

: Yeah. It get into service in eighties. But atleast there '''WERE''' first prototypes in 1968. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 06:04, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

ummm...the prototypes of both the FAMAS and AUG were developed in the seventies. A better choice might be the Stoner 63 which had a history of use by the Navy SEALs and other clandestine units

== OXM article ==

Official XBox Magazine did a feature on Black Ops (July 2010, issue 111,) and I figure I'd share some highlights:

- It was inspired by the book "SOG: The Secret Wars of America's Commandos," by Major John Plaster. [http://www.amazon.com/SOG-Secret-Americas-Commandos-Vietnam/dp/1581606761/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1275440842&sr=8-1]

- The SPAS-12 you use during the Tet Offensive uses Dragon's Breath rounds.

- At least from their description, the "WMD" level sound suspiciously like the airfield level in MW2.

The whole game looks suspiciously like MW2, just my opinion though. Hughjefender

- The M202 FLASH is confirmed.

- The M1911s with "Sally" etched on them also have tally marks on them.

- They mention a co-op feature that "appears to be a successor" to zombies, which seems to me would indicate no zombies. Bummer.

- Multiplayer was ready before the campaign, so some of the campaign levels are based on the multiplayer maps.

- Regarding anachronistic guns, "'In this world, anything was possible' for these soldiers, [Treyarch head Mark] Lamia explains. All equipment requests were granted by their superiors. Cost, apparently, was no object."

- And finally, a quote from the military advisor, Lt. Col. Hank Keirsey (ret) (and something I've been trying to point out for a while now) "The Historical Advisor fights to get every last bit of accuracy, but always has to concede to the need for excitement." Keirsey appears to be the military advisor for the whole franchise, not just this game or for Treyarch.

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:18, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

:Money is no object is one thing, but designing a different rifle system like you would design a James Bond car is a different thing. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:20, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

: So, basically they said those soldiers can have any gun. Come on, Treyarch ! Give them FN2000´s , Plasma Rifles and Gravity Guns !
No, really. Off course they can have special weapons. But only those which were designated before 1968. Not those which were designated 10 years after.--[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:30, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
::Yes, but since everything is secret, how do we know the CIA DIDN'T develop the AUG, or the SPAS-12, and cover it up by giving it to Steyr and Franchi, respectively? How can we be sure we DIDN'T capture any energy-based weapons from crashed UFOs? (Mind you, I don't work for Treyarch or owe them anything, but I have to give them credit for giving themselves such a clever out.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:51, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:::It seems like all these SOG's have custom-made pieces. And since Weaver rails did exist in Vietnam it would have been totally possible to make these weird AR's we keep seeing. Not saying I agree with this decision, but this is probably how Treyarch is getting away with it.

You guys are so wrong, My friend the NAVY SEAL told me something not to tell anyone else but I don't care. They are issued laser rifles just like the ones in Fallout 3 but have a disntegration setting meant for vaporizing. At least thats Treyarches logic. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:55, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
:Calm down. I don't think any of us know when these weapons were in their first stages of prototypes and what they looked like in the prototype stage. Prototype weapons are definitely a recurring theme in Black Ops. Since these guys are above top-secret they can have experimental weapons that are also above top-secret. In the GKnova6 files, it specifically states the AUG in-game will be a prototype version. I wouldn't be surprised if the SPAS is also experimental and the weird AR is completely custom.
:::Cool

RC planes instead of predator missiles?

== Document from viral site ==

Over at the CoD wiki I found this "document" from an viral site connected to Black Ops: [http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100601175649/callofduty/images/3/3d/Doc10.jpg]. It describes the AUG as "very early prototype weapon; not in production". It also mentions the [[G11]]

and also the delicious China Lake Launcher
-Double Agent M

:It would be better if they included more of these prototype weapons. I would love to see weapons like BRG-15, H&K CAWS, Ster ACR, Colt SCAMP,etc. Even better would be a underwater level with the H&K P11! After all the inclusion of such weapons in the game will be better than the monotonous selection of Cold War-rea weapons like M1911,M21,G3,FN FAL,AK-74,etc.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 09:37, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

:I'll shit bricks of joy if the G11 is in there. I've wanted that gun in a Call of Duty game for as far as I remember. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

G11 eh?? im guessing its going to turn into the MP40 from WaW except in speed instead of power

== M202 FLASH ==
I made a couple of changes in this section including adding of screencaps. I rechanged it back to FLASH because everything is anachronic in this came and it can't be the more rarer XM191. Plus I added a M202 FLASH image, which is actually from Far Cry Instincts Predeator, since I could not find a single good picture of it in the web.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 15:43, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
:There's not anachronism, Treyarch keeps saying that all these weapons are prototypes. I'm not sure what people aren't getting about that. I'm pretty sure every weapon we've seen in American hands so far are a prototype of some sort. I think that the FLASH is the prototype version; why can't it be?
::The reference specifically said "M202." We're not going solely by the picture, but by what was actually written by someone who either played it or watched the game be played. And since I doubt the average game journalist is an ordnance expert, he only knew because it was probably labeled "M202" in the game itself. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 23:00, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You know just as well as I do video games often mislabel their guns either by mistake or just to give the public who don't know much about guns an idea of what that gun is instead of confusing them with specifics. I don't argue that it's going to be labeled M202, but I guarantee you Treyarch is intending it to be the prototype XM191.

:: XM191 was M202 prototype, just for your information. --[[Special:Contributions/85.71.49.215|85.71.49.215]] 04:34, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
:::Yes, I'm aware of that. But given the shall we say, unique, circumstances of the game, wouldn't it make more sense to go with what the game says, rather than what's historically correct? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:10, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes XM191 is a M202 prototype.American send to test during late 1970s in vietnam.And i see a picture of XM191 in vietnam war museum. info from http://world.guns.ru/grenade/gl50-e.htm [[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]
Here is what it shoots

[[IMAGE:Treyasuckers.png]]

Wow look like a RPG7 rocket.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

==Not being able to go past vietnam?==

What is this crap I hear about treyarch LEGALLy not being able to go past vietnam in game? A comapny can do whatever the hell they want.

[[User:k9870]]

:I know, I was about to make this same post.-protoAuthor 20:25, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
::From the article posted above (emphasis mine)
::"-Activision eventually convinced West and Zampella to stay with them by offering up a Memorandum of Understanding. In addition to extending their contracts through to October 2011, this legally-binding document gave West and Zampella some major financial bonuses as well as a couple other hefty promises. Chiefly, it gave the two "creative authority over the development of any games under the Modern Warfare brand (or any Call of Duty game set in the post-Vietnam era, the near future, or the distant future) including complete control over the Infinity Ward studio." '''In other words, Activision could not publish a Modern Warfare-branded game (or a Call of Duty game set any time later than Vietnam) without West and Zampella's full approval."'''
::West and Zampella were the two heads at IW who were fired in April. Now that they're no longer with the company, this might open the door for Treyarch's next CoD game to be Modern Warfare-esque, but there's a lot of litigation right now. The firing was way too late to affect BO, so they operated under the restrictions above. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:50, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

I am still waiting for a WWI CoD with single- and multiplayer featuring France, the UK, the German Empire, the Austro-Hungarian Empire, the Ottoman Empire, Russia, Japan, Italy and the USA. Unfortunately this would be too expensive and only few people would buy it. Thus such a CoD will never be made. Sorry for half offtopic. --[[Special:Contributions/84.181.247.180|84.181.247.180]] 20:31, 9 June 2010 (UTC)Paul_Baeumer
:I would love to play a CoD WWI game. (CoD: Great War? CoD: Over the Top?) I'd like to see them change it so you can change out your melee weapon, so instead of a knife, you can equip yourself with an e-tool, brass knuckles, or a spiked club. (Sorry to continue the off-topic.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:02, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
::And to stay on topic, how would they define "distant future?" Why not a CoD game set in 2110? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:02, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

== Why did someone add possible weapons? ==

Someone added possible weapon prototypes like the G11 and the Pump 40mm? I am removing them tomarrow if no one says anything about why they should be left on. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:22, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

: This document (http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100601175649/callofduty/images/3/3d/Doc10.jpg) from the Black Ops viral site could be the reason --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 03:34, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

:There aren't possible anymore, it has been '''confirmed''' that they will be in the game, with other sites like Call of Duty wikia including them in their weapons list.

[[Image:DOC10.jpg]] 
--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 04:28, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

:Yeah, and the Call of Duty wiki is a beacon of truth... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 13:49, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

The AUG and M202 have see in game trailer.[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

== Still a little chance ==

Well, they are gonna include dedicated servers. So they apparently release modtools - So it seems like its gonna be possible change guns models, just like in CoD4. --[[Special:Contributions/88.208.103.46|88.208.103.46]] 09:09, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

== M16 on magazine cover ==
It should be removed for now, seeing as there's currently no evidence to support its inclusion in the game. IMFDB chronicles weapons appearing in movies, television, and video games, not on magazine covers. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:12, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Game mags are a great source of weapons, thats where half the screenshots we see come from, game informer and the such.
:Screenshots are one thing, but there's no evidence that the image is actually from the game, it might just be an illustration the magazine drew up. I would heap the image of the guy sitting cross-legged with the two .45s in there as well. It wouldn't be the first time that weapons on cover art don't actually appear in the game itself. ([[Medal of Honor: European Assault]] comes to mind.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:01, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
:Is it bothering you that much?
::Well, considering the site has rules against printed media, yes it does bug me. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:44, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
:90% possibility that's a box-art. Don't be nerdy.

The game sure went into a lot of detail on the 1911 not to use it, and besides, what else would they have, they cant screw up history enough to throw in deegs and berettas.......oh wait, never mind, they can....

vietcong with a spas 12, damn at this rate my dream of marching into the reichstag waist firing an aa12 may come true
:That could be multiplayer screens

== SPAS 12 Folded Stock ==

All i can say is: FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK!!!!
--[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 15:17, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Its more tacticaler and badassish to keep it folded, only noobs use a stock, not hardcore 1337 operators! (video game maker logic))
[[User:k9870]]

At least thay didn't put a goddamn XM8 in the game, if they do, i'll throw my goddamn PC outta the window, 'nuff said --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 03:04, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:'''nerd'''

At least the developers weren't stupid enough to put a rifle concept weapon into a game that takes place during the cold war. At least we can forgive them with the inaccurate AR-15s. And has any game developer ever fired a shotgun without a stock? It's a pain and you can slap yourself in the face if you don't brace yourself. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:19, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:I can only think of two possibilities, 1) you're firing Dragon's Breath rounds with the SPAS-12, and using it as small flamethrower, so you can get away with firing it from the hip, and 2)more importantly, WHEN HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A SPAS-12 FIRED FROM THE SHOULDER WITH THE STOCK EXTENDED? The only time I ever saw it was briefly in [[Jurassic Park]]. Even that famous scene in [[Miami Vice - Season 1#Franchi SPAS-12|Miami Vice]], a show that did guns pretty well, with [[Jim Zubiena]], a professional shooter would presumably knows guns pretty well, had him firing a SPAS-12 from the hip. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Q2Il86-38A] Do you think most people even realize that thing on top is a folding stock? Yes, you, me, and everyone who's ever fired a shotgun ([http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgptDs_Nncw| and now this guy]) knows it's stupid to fire a shotgun without the stock extended. But I don't think the general public knows. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:45, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
:It's not stupid. You don't really have to aim at point-blank range. I'm curious how aiming down the sights of SPAS with folded stock will work.

I'd love to know the reasoning behind including the SPAS-12 in this game. It didn't exist at the time, and I don't buy the "it's supposed to be a prototype" line. If it's a prototype, why does it look exactly like the production model?(I could make the same argument about the AUG)
Most likely this is Treyarch just being lazy, or including a weapon simply because it has been popular in video games, or both. They could have included an automatic shotgun that really was used in Vietnam, the Remington 7188. It was basically a Remington 1100 with an extended tube magazine, modified to fire full auto. It was used mostly by the Navy SEALS, but I believe SOG made some use of it as well. It's a weapon, as far as I know, that has never been used in a video game. Instead we get the anachronistic SPAS-12 that has appeared in about 5 million games. If anyone is interested in the weapons SOG really did use in Vietnam, get a copy of "SOG: A Photo History of the Secret Wars" by John Plaster. It includes a chapter that specifically covers weapons, and there are ton of great photos. It's expensive, but worth the price.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 02:01, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

:[[Image:MV-FSP-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ludovici Armstrong ([[Jim Zubiena]]) fires his SPAS-12 at two drug dealers, while posing as a chauffeur.]]

I thought it was supposed to be a homage to 80's action movies. Or at least that's why I'm accepting it, because then I'll feel like I'm in an 80's action movie whenever I play this game. And what would an 80's action movie be without the SPAS-12 or the AUG? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:22, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

a littel of topic but, that guy has one of the shitties grips that i have ever seen

== Snake ==
The guy with the AR-15 and the USMC and MACVSOG tattoo the guy looks bad ass, I'm pumped for this dude.

I'm sorry but that sounded a little gay.

i dont think he has the globe and anchor tat , but because of him im going to grow a mullet and wear a head band shhhing people. simmons8492

== .357 ==

A .357, in a tunnel? I hope the game makes it so you won't be able to hear anything for a few minutes after you fire it, so you'd have to make the choice between shooting the bad guy or just meleeing him. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:27, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

:Anyone noticed reloading animation ? He just throwed out shells ( ''STILL HOLDING FLASLIGHT IN LEFT HAND - VISIBLE'' ) And then moved .357 out of screen ('' STILL HOLDING FLASLIGHT IN LEFT HAND - VISIBLE'' ) and than returned .357 to screen. Fully loaded. So it means he reloads revolver in few seconds with one hand ? ...... I just hope BF:BC2:VIïetnam will be much better.

Hey, I'll take that over reloading ''two'' double barrel shotguns at the same time without dropping one anyday. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 04:22, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

It is a game.

youd be suprised what i can do with one hand. simmond 8492

== Grenade Launcher ==

Can anyone identify the grenade launcher used in-game? Here's the link to the video where you can find it. http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2010-call-of/101273 The game labels it "Grenade launcher." It looks like an M203 but that didn't exist in Vietnam...
Also, here's some breaching footage: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2010-call-of/101260

Yeah they did, they went into service around 1969 I think
:Can't believe I got caught without doing my research. My bad.

It's an M203. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:15, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

== SPAS-12 ==

Anyone noticed (In first gameplay video) that EVEN RUSSIANS are equipped with SPAS-12 ? Can be seen around 2:53 lying on the ground next to russian guy....
:Yeah... This is turning out to be pretty fail...

Guys who cares, achronisms don't kill a game. Does it really matter if the guns are slightly innaccurate, all that matters to me is gamplay, good and fair online and ZOMBIES!!
:Call of Duty has always been accurate in the kinds of guns they present to you in single player, with the exception of Modern Warfare 2. So I think I can speak for many fans of the franchise, it matters to us.

Again..it is a pre-release trailer...game is still 5 months from release...

At least it's European, the Russians in MW2 carried Vectors and TAR-21s. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:24, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

== "AR" Sling ==
I'm not one to complain too much about the achronisms, but I do care when things don't make funtional sense, like that the AR's sling, which for some reason is wrapped all around the gun, is stuck UNDER THE BOLT CATCH. It's not like they don't understand it's a funtional part of the gun, cause every AR varient in every COD that's had them has the empty reload where you press the catch... Also I noticed on the non-empty reloads the AR just kinda dips out of the screen and moves a bit then comes back up loaded, you don't see the mag, same goes for the .357; THAT'S lazy... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

I liked the AR-15 reload, it looked real. He pressed the mag release, he let the magazine fall to the ground, and he held it there until he put the new mag in. It's alot more realistic than the MW2 reloads, were you wave your gun around the screen while reloading either to look cool or to make it obvious that you are, in fact, reloading your weapon. Most of the time though, people don't do that when they reload in real life, unless they're an idiot. The .357 reload was kinda lazy though, but I let it slide because he actually whips the cylinder back in instead of the light tilt that's all it takes to swing the cylinder back in in MW2 and most other video games. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:35, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

I love reading these things to see how much constant griping there is..considering the game is still 5 months from release.

[sarcasm] You don't need to reload your guns if you are black ops, just lower them and they will be full again![/sarcasm] seriously thought, this game is REALLY start to be a dissapoint, and it haven't even been released yet --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 22:58, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

I have noticed weapons in game have muzzle jump. MW2 and COD4 had none the guns stayed on target and took no skill to use. In this even the ar-15s rose. I like it.
:It's just cosmetic rise up, the sights will come back right on target after each shot.

Actually WAW some guns would go off target, like an mp40 or DP machine gun. More noticeable at range. Treyarch has recoil effects, which i like.

:It could just be that modern weapons were designed with a better understanding of reducing recoil. Most modern automatic weapons have straight-line stocks, which reduces recoil, as opposed to bent stocks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 13:26, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Actually look at mw2 ak, fal, m4, whatever, no recoil. WAW, mp40s would be shooting high after half a mag. I like recoil effects means you need more skill to shoot.

== M16 ==
Unknown [[M16]] ( Seems to be A1 ) covered with some kind of cloth or tape appeared in hands of soldier on one of BO´s artworks.

[[Image:M16-SP1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M16A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[Image:BLACKOPSM16.JPG|thumb|none|500px|M16 on cover of French Xbox 360 magazine.]]

I moved it from the main page because like we discussed earlier, it's just a magazine cover with nothing to back it up. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 11:58, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah, that was nice turn. I added it on the page just because it ''HAD SOMETHING TO DO'' with game :) There arent any proofs that M16 will be featured (''unofrtunately'') --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 12:15, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
::Let's be honest fellas, it's hard to have a game that has much to do with Vietnam without having the old three pronged, triangular handguarded M16. My bet is that it will show up, armed with full auto and 20 round mags. Also, I'm pumped for the G11, that thing is gonna be epicly epic. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:Is it me or is the picture in the magazine a reverse shot? Because I see the forward assist on this A1 as well as the ejection on the right side. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:07, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

== Bad Feeling ==

After realizing all the goofs that are popping up and watching more gameplay footage, I'm getting the feeling I got before Modern Warfare 2 released. Like they're throwing what was once a pretty legitimate game out the window for the coolness effect. And with MW2 that feeling turned out to be correct. Anyone else sensing the same thing?

Yeah, I've got the same bad feeling, except a lot sooner than I got it with MW2, maybe just cause I'm not really expecting much better after the disaster that MW2 was. Oh and COD4 is still fun ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:42, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

MW2 sucked..but MW2 was IW..CoD:BO is Treyarch. Are they perfect? No..but now a days they're better than IW.

I must say i really enjoyed MW2, and, in my opinion, Infinity Ward is still better than Treyarch, oh well, games can't please everybody, can they? --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 11:49, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Hopefully multiplayer is a bit different, mw2 multiplayer was old when it started since it was just like cod 4, at least WAW had vehicles.

-k9870

With luck they'll fix the problems '''before''' the game ships this time. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 16:56, 17 June 2010 (UTC)
:I hope you're right but I doubt it. I've never seen a game change much of anything five months before release.

Everyone here talking shit about IW? You're a bunch of idiots. IW makes far better games. I don't know why you don't like MW2, but it's one of the best of the series so far. This game, on the other hand, looks like it'll be a disaster (as nearly all of Treyarch's iterations are).
:Fuckin right.--[[User:Pølaris|Pølaris]] 03:47, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

I didn't say I hated MW2. Doesn't stop it being loaded with bugs that make the game seem like it was rushed out to meet the deadline. Now, if you're done fanboying... [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 07:35, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
::I don't think it's entirely fanboyish. I'm pretty sure the general consensus of CoD fans is that IW games are better than Treyarch games. IW started the franchise, and CoD games are the only games they make. Treyarch is just along for the ride. But now that IW has lost almost a third of their employees in the last month, that dynamic may change. I have a lot of hope for BO, and I think it's silly to write it off based on a few trailers and three minutes of gameplay footage. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 12:50, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
::: My point was that MW2 was ruined by Acitvision trying to force IW to meet the due date, meaning they had to ship it with a whole range of bugs. However, some of the above poster's comments do seem to boil down to "It's gonna be shit cos it's not an IW game."[[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 07:04, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I personally think that this game looks awesome, and i dont see what the problem is

IW gets the cred since they made the modern games, which people wanted. WW2 was old that siad Treyarch couldve done just as good making mw1 and 2. They had better fire lighting, recoil effects, etc.

:Bottom line is this. IW failed to have MW2 be better than CoD: 4, and this is why they've been put on hold. Treyarch's WaW was a brilliant game, and I still love to play it to this day. Treyarch has shown more promise then IW lately, and I'm sure they won't disapoint with Black Ops, as they plan to remove and fix all the shit MW2 got wrong. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Let's replace your opinion with some fact. MW2 was better than CoD 4 based on the storyline and sales alone, without going into all the new multiplayer features. Was multiplayer a bit buggy? Yeah, for around a month. Treyarch's installments are considered, by those who have played the series, crap in comparison. WaW? That game was garbage. It was basically a recycling of levels from other games in the series that were reskinned. The game was a knockoff of CoD4 that took place in WWII.
:::I'm going to have to call BS on the better storyline in MW2. It's the first CoD game where you get to not only gun down civilians, but also kill American servicemen. That's better? Are you and your buddies playing MW2 in a cave in Kandahar? Big Red One was disappointing, but then again, it wasn't supposed to be a "real" CoD game. CoD3 did suck, I certainly won't argue that. I hated the idea of WaW at first, because WWII was so overdone, but I liked it once I actually played it. (There might be a lesson in there.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Now let's talk about Treyarch. Aside from their lameass 'cash-in' port of CoD4 for the wii (which was garbage), what did they do in the series? Call of Duty 3, Big Red One, World at War, and the current work in progress Black Ops. I don't know if you played any of those, but they were all terrible entries in the series. CoD3 was a gimmick game. 'Oooooh motion control and button mashing'. Big Red One was garbage, and WaW was a hack-job. What does that record suggest their next game will be like?

: Big Red One was awesome, shut up.-protoAuthor 18:54, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Oh, and Treyarch couldn't have made MW1 or 2. They lack originality; every game they released was a knockoff of either IW's designs and ideas or of another developer. The only reason Treyarch is getting to make more CoD's is because IW's execs left because they were being denied their contractually obligated bonuses. --[[User:Asmkillr323|Asmkillr323]] 11:33, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
::Your timeline is off. Development of BO started well before the recent upheaval at IW. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

:Also, World at War is a superb game. Sure you have the god like MP40, but that's nowhere near as bad as OMA danger close noob tubes in MW2, and to anybody who's into WWII and it's weapons it's a hell of a game. It's no CoD: 4, but thank fuck it's no MW2. Treyarch shows promise, and if IW was doing Black Ops I would hold no hope at all. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

No offense but what your saying is that WAW was great in comparison. Thats not good logic at all, CoD4 is the best out of the three. No clue on BO but I have a feeling that since they wanted to justify cool guns that are anchoristic with that they are prototypes is just half-assed which may relate to the rest of the game. Also have you seen the reload animations?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:24, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
:When WaW was first announced, I was appalled. I couldn't believe they were staying in WWII, even after CoD4 skipped ahead to modern day. Looking back though, the fact that it's a WWII game is the only flaw I can think of. (Although, yes, it's a big one.) It restricted the plot, and WWII has been done to death. It was otherwise a pretty good game. I really liked the co-op campaign missions, the vehicle missions were well done, the voice acting was superb, and Zombies takes the game to a whole new level. Aside from the setting, is CoD4 really that much better? Is it time to give Treyarch the benefit of the doubt? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:48, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

:I agree with all of your points chinaman, and you're right, CoD 4 wasn't really all that better. Besides the modern warfare setting, it lacked many of the cool features and such that WaW introduced, and while everyone including me loves it, it wasn't overly better than WaW. I always applauded Treyarch for making WaW not so noob friendly, something IW did massively with MW2. Now the guys at Arch have been watching people complain everywhere about the shit in MW2, and so they know what to do to fix it. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

== Goofs and screw-ups ==
Alright no offense but SHUT UP!!! You guys are complaining about the anachroistic guns in it but it's supposed to be that way. The freaking name is BLACK-OPS which means no one knows about it. What they are doing are saying what Cpt. Price said: History is full of lies. So, what they're saying is that this is not what they thought really happened but they are using their imagination to come with these historical ideas that fall in to the game. But like I said everything in it is supposed to TOP SECRET, so it's going to be anachroistic. But that's how it's supposed to be. It's TOP SECRET so none of us would even know about it.

and P.S. For all butt-holes who said MW2 sucks, Opinions are like butt-holes every body's got one, and nobody wants to hear the other one. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 12:14, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

: Yeah. You act like 12-years old. But we all know you are 10 years old.
::For your information I am actually 12.

Look up mw2 bad spawns on youtube and you'll see how its flawed. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:28, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

::I take it that you don't want fans of the COD series to actually question the developers for making questionable (or stupid) weapons choices for the sake of a compelling narrative. Unfortunately, that only works if we didn't have already have lots of knowledge of the 1960s-1970s era of covert operations from the military and numerous books, which only makes the anachronisms more glaring to anyone who isn't 12 years old.Just like movie watchers, people playing games set in a particular historical era have a certain set of expectations of what ought to be present and what shouldn't. To dismiss all those concerns with a "TOP SECRET" excuse is ridiculous, since Call of Duty 1-3 all managed to be interesting without adding things that didn't exist in the same timeframe. Cursing at people because they disagree doesn't make your defence of Treyarch seem anything more than juvenile. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 16:52, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

No, I just wanted everybody to shut up about saying crap about the guns. So they maybe think that a AUG without a foregrip looks stupid, I think it looks cool. The graphics look good and it looks realistic. I am 12 so I don't care about anachrosism, but I know a heck of alot about guns and Call of Duty so yeah, I was a little mad but because alot of you guys are like in your thirties they are targeting this for people in the younger phase and are not expecting people to go Hey! The AR-15 wasn't introduced then and neither was the Grenade Launcher. I don't think Treyarch are expecting a Riot of AUG foregrip lovers to burn down their studio but come on guys, seriously. Do you have to take this that seriously, your calling me juvenile while your sitting in your chair going hey that trigger guard is rounde then it can't be a M9 so it has be a 92SB therefore they lied! I'm going to kill them! etc. etc. so hey try to be a little compassionate and maybe think about going outside your mom's basement. Ha Ha just joking. (not sarcasm) So what i'm saying is can you not be so depndive on every little detail. Would you like to make a Call of Duty game. Just please voice your honest opinions and not go on about gun mixups because it's really not about the guns it's more about the plot and story. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 18:08, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I think that you people are taking these things too seriously. Since cod 4, these games are like action movies, rather than historical war role-playing type shit. Yes the anachronisms are disappointing, but I'm not really bothered by it and they were done for the sake of making the game cooler (and in my opinion any game set in Vietnam AND including a spas-12 is badass). If you want realism, than check out the new Medal of Honor. If you want Hollywood type action, buy cod games, because thats the direction the franchise is going in, which isnt a bad thing.

:Alright kiddies, let's sit down and have a nice list of what's wrong with Modern Warfare 2.
-One Man Army
-Danger Close M203s
-Commando
-The Spawn system
-Deathstreaks (especially Painkiller)
-Overpowered and unbalanced guns (ACR, FAMAS, UMP)
-Overpriced map packs
-non-dedicated servers, which leads to lag and host migration up you yin yang
-the OMA/Danger Close noob tube combo
-boosters galore
-10 Prestige hack lobbies
-The F2000 is a pile of garbage

So all said and done, that's a pretty big list of whats wrong with the game. You're free to disagree, but let it be known anyone claiming noob tubes are legit will be lynched. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The new Metal of Honor is just trying to cash in on the whole Modern Warfare craze we got going. Modern Warfare is the new WWII game of this generation. And because this IS a site that points out specific weapons, whether or not it should exist in the time period is our jobs on this site. Those of us who do take this site serious has an obligation to point out the holes and inconsistencies. That's what we do here. Call it bitching or whining, but that's what this site is solely for, nitpicking, pointing out obvious holes when we see guns in a movie, game, etc. We're looked up all sorts of history involving the AR-15 and just saying it's "Black ops" doesn't mean they defy the laws of historical consistency. In some of the Indiana Jones movies that takes place before WWII, we do point out MP40s and 98Ks should not exist as a fact. Even black ops of today would use the latest technology, not weapons that haven't been field tested or even made yet. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:12, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

: You, Excalibur, look like one of those very few inteligent people in this discussion. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:42, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. Also, I've seen Beta footage and Medal of Honor just looks a lot like Bad Company 2. And to be honest, I could care less if the AUG or AR-15 or what have you is an anachronism in this game, as long as we're not talking lasers I'm fine. We're here to point out weapons in film, give pictures and descriptions of them, and talk about them, not bitch that a gun being in a game set 2 days before it was produced makes it a failure [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Those guns arent 2 days befor prouction. Its ''8 years''. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:42, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Pointing out achronistic guns is part of what we do here, that said, for me it won't kill the game, unless there's a Modern Warfare 2-like pile of other stuff wrong with it too. Oh and yes the Russians & Vietnamese wouldn't use SPAS-12s but you're forgetting the only guns they've REALLY intended to show off so far are the AUG, SPAS-12, AK-47, M202, Python, and Crossbow, that's only what, six? I think they only picked these few guns to go in the trailers, and then reveal more later, so maybe the guns will be more where they should in the final version... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 21:42, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, God forbid we talk about firearm mistakes in TV/Movies/Video Games on a website DEDICATED TO DISCUSSING FIREARMS IN TV/MOVIES/VIDEOGAMES! I will continue to make comments on what, in my opinion, are idiotic firearm choices for this game. If anyone disagrees, feel free to reply, but don't tell me to shut up. Some of the comments above just prove my theory that weapons, such as the SPAS-12, were simply included because they are popular in video games, with Treyarch using the whole "prototype" B.S. as justification for their presence.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 05:08, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
:Yes, how DARE they try to give players what they want?! You'd think they were in this to make money or something. What a bunch of whores! --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:27, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
::Really? So the only way for this game to make money is to include a SPAS-12? Is there that much demand for a SPAS-12 it has to be inluded to make gamers happy? Would the game be a financial failure if it wasn't there, and weapons more appropriate to the time period were included instead?--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 06:12, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You said it yourself, it's what players want. And like you also said, it's minor. Games are made for the general public, not gun dorks like us. As a gun dork, I'm a bit bothered, but as a gamer, I'm thrilled that I can light people on fire with a shotgun. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 09:43, 20 June 2010 (UTC) (gun dork and gamer)
^Hell yeah! [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:44, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

:::: Does the success of the game depend that much on specific weapons that appear in it? You said yourself that as long as a game is fun, accurate/inaccurate depictions of weapons doesn't matter that much. If that's the case, weapons more correct to the time period can be included, and the game will still be a success ''as long as it's fun''. And I highly doubt Treyarch polled gamers and asked them what weapons they wanted to see in Black Ops. I think they were just acting on their ''perception'' of what weapons are popular in video games. So I don't know if I can say this is a case of "what players want", more a case of Treyarch saying "we think we know what players want". This is just a theory I came up with as to why certain weapons were included, I don't have any idea if it's true(although some comments from other posts seem to confirm it). For all I know, Treyarch is just being lazy and it's easier for them to include the well known weapons rather than do real research. At any rate, I can't see the inclusion/exclusion of specific weapons making or breaking a game.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 01:17, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
:::::"At any rate, I can't see the inclusion/exclusion of specific weapons making or breaking a game." My thoughts exactly. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:53, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

You know, those that find it stupid that we are pointing out the anachronisms in this game should really just go to the treyarch forums, not post on a website dedicated to firearm identification. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:32, 21 June 2010 (UTC)
:Ok, if those anachronistic weapons supposed to be '''early''' prototypes then they at least could make it look '''different''' from production models! That would be much more believable. Tryesuckarch is just being f-ing lazy. I don't mind flat-top AR, but they could make it not look like a modern one. And also if there is no simple M16A1 then it's a total fck-up in the Vietnam themed game.
::If they made it look different5 from the final gun, you guys would be even more pissed! You'd be like "How can they call that a M16A1! Look at it it looks nothing like the original!" Plus. how could Treynot-suckarch know what they would like? You guys wouldn't be pissed if this was a modern warfare game. In fact I bet that Treyarch probably wanted to do that but they couldn't(breathes deeply)you know what this is my last comment. I'm done arguing with all the stupid people on this site. If you have anything else to say you can take it up with me on my talk page. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 13:44, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
:::You don't know what you're talking about. Photos or drawings of the prototypes can easily be found on the internet. A drawing of the AUG prototype is on the World Guns page, and the prototype SPAS-12(along with a photo of the SPAS-11) is shown on the SPAS-12 webpage: [http://spas12.com/spas12not.htm] And if Treyarch clearly states a weapon is supposed to represent a prototype and it actually looks like the prototype, no one is going to complain.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 00:09, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

:Are these mistakes any worse than some of MW2s fuck ups? Like the L86 with a made up drum magazine and iron sights that wouldn't be usable as it has a straight stock, the AUG cosmetically having a 30 round mag when it says 42? The MP5K having a rail system only seen on an airsoft gun in real life and so on. Let's remember Black Ops isn't set only in 1968, and so they have a bit of play when it comes to weapons. The M16 is confirmed (I have a friend doing beta testing) and is Vietnam styled. Now if anyone wants to instantly write off the game because it has a few anachronisms and shit in it, then your missing the point. So what if your using an AUG in 1968? It's not like lasers in WWI, and it's still fun to do. Don't focus on the hate, try and just enjoy it for what it is, a video game. If you want reality, go join the army and head off to Iraq or something, cause in video game land, reality will be broken. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]
:So you're trying to justify Treyarch fuckups comparing it to MW2? Fuckup is fuckup

One, I tottaly agree. Two, did your friend say if there is an M14?

:Yes, the M14 should be in there. Also, I hardly see mild anachronisms as "fuck ups" in a game that pretty much goes on alternate reality anyways. Treyarch has created a game all about the operations we don't know about, the cover ups, and the spec ops weaponry we don't see for years, so having an AUG earlier then it's commercial release can be forgiven. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]\

::Treyarch has the right to depict an alternate Cold War for all they desire, but as long as they try to play it off as the historical "truth" that no one knows about while maintaining all sorts of obvious (and IMO not minor at all) anachronisms, they are only leaving themselves open to criticism. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 23:41, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

:They aren't trying to play it off as historical truth, they're trying to go with an alternate truth, which makes perfect sense. Also, if I hear another person commenting on how rails are anachronistic, I'm going to snap. It's fucking rails on a gun in a video game, get over it. Black Ops will be an awesome game, and despite these possible anachronisms, I'll be gladly killing Russians in 1968 with my AUG thank you [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I don't think I'm going to get this game. I'm getting a vibe that it's filled with silly crap much like Modern Warfail 2. I'll be playing the next Medal of Honor instead. -Frank T

:Medal of Honor looks like Bad Company 2 with Taliban, so that's the game I won't be getting. Treyarch impressed me with World at War, and they're aiming to please this time, removing and modifying all the bullshit Modern Warfare 2 bestowed on us. From deathstreaks to Commando, they're out to fix it all! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I never really got that mindset "It's BFBC2 but slightly different so I'm not getting it". Well, if you don't like Bad Company 2 to begin with that's fine, but there's more of a difference between Bad Company 2 and Medal Of Honor than between COD4 and World At War, most of the difference was the setting so it seemed like a bigger difference, but the core gameplay was very close, and they were made by two DIFFERENT companys while BFBC2 and MOH are made by the SAME ONE. I'm not saying anything bad about them, I like the first three and the MOH Beta. And yes, Modern Warfare 2 failed in two ways: First, it was WAY too noob-friendly, like, before it came out I would've never thought it possible for a game to be that noob-friendly, and second, it traded realism for coolness in pretty much every way, while COD4, the game they'd JUST MADE, had a believable story, weapons that were almost perfect in terms of appearance and who used them, and the only real nooby stratagy was the M16 Red Dot, but oh well, there was almost only that one. I know Treyarch has said they're trying to get rid of the cheap MW2 stuff, and that's good, but I'm really not liking the direction this is going, picking the guns because they're cool and not because they make sense, even a little bit, the exploding crossbow bolts, how almost every weapon we've identified so far is either achronistic or has something wrong with it (go look), the Hind A with tandam seating, and when you get in you go through the long cool animation of getting in and starting up, but then it takes off in 2 seconds flat, and the lazy, lazy reloads... I'm not saying it's going to suck, I'm saying my hopes aren't high, sure it'll be better than MW2, but that's not saying much. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 23:36, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

:Arguably Black Ops has issues, but don't forget that E3 footage comes months before the final product. So what if the Hind has tandem seating, does that make it any less cool to blast VC with it? So what if the reload isn't uber detailed, does that detract from you shooting people? So what if there's minor anachronisms, isn't this both a video game and an alternate reality? I'll agree the crossbow is kind of odd, but this game should be nowhere near as noob friendly as the god awful MW2. Modern Warfare 2 was built on the idea of helping bad players, but it only resulted in much rage for good players such as myself. Call of Duty 4 was made to break the mold on FPs games of the time, and it did and still does kick ass. MW2 was built to top it, and instead of that, they gave us an over dramatic, noob friendly game that overall makes me just want to buy a copy of CoD 4 again. And on MOH, I've seen some footage, and now I actually like it, sure it looks BC2 like, but thats no biggy, and overall that looks ready to rock too! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Okay, sorry, that came off as too bad against Black Ops, I know it's months away from coming out and no, the Hind's seating isn't really a problem, I was just pointing out that it was wrong, same with a lot of the stuff we've seen so far. My point was there's a lot of incorrect things in the game, not neccecarily game-breaking, just pointing out that COD4 and WAW were better in that regard, though so far the game overall looks pretty good :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 05:29, 29 June 2010 (UTC)

:To be really honest, it won't matter if there's minor issues and anachronisms, cause as long as Black Ops isn't as noob friendly and shitty as MW2, I'll be fine and dandy [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Exactly, but we still do need to point them out though. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

I dont see MW2 as "noob friendly", just as balanced. It tried too hard to make no gun any better than another. It also felt like cod4, like the core gameplay mechanics were all old when you started playing.

-k9870

:Face it dude, MW2 basically reeks of noob friendliness. You have deathstreaks, solely designed to help shitty players, noob tubes which when coupled with OMA and danger close are the noobs cannon of choice. You have the ACR and FAMAS, both of which are overpowered, then you get stuff like the UMP which at close range does more damage then an M4 Carbine. Not to mentionthe marathon lightweight commando set up used by knife fags so they can knife you from 12 feet away. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

And the overpowered Harriers, that killed everyone all the time and you could have 2 up at once, and they always beat the helos in fights, and Chopper Gunner, and Tactical Insertions, allowing people to boost really easily for the Nuke, that ended the game, and Slight Of Hand Pro that let everyone quickscope, yeah the list keeps going... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 19:49, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

I always find a stinger to be good against harriers and because you can have 2 on you, most of the time, you can take even 2 of them out. Not Gunner choppers are a pain to take down [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

:Chopper gunners are a pain, AC-130s are worse. Not only can they not be hit by bullets or tubes or anything of that sort, but they have TWO sets of flares that can deploy without any delay. Tact inserts mixed with cold blooded and good old FFA is great for boosting, luckily now Sandy Ravage deals some booster justice (hell, even I serve justice to them now). Either way though, MW2 was clearly IW's attempt to top CoD: 4, which was a game built to revolutionize FPS games. MW2 was built to be playable by even the noobiest kids, over the top, reference movies every two seconds, and overall be a fairly shitty game. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The problem with the Harriers is they're way too good... unless you just pull out a stinger and then they're dead, which is a little too extreme both ways. The reason the helicopter was so much better in COD4 was because there were no guided rockets, you couldn't shoot the rotor (so you couldn't just hipfire the thing to death), and UAV Jammer didn't help you against it, it killed you anyway, not to mention it never seems to manage to hit you in MW2. What I hate is hearing "Helicopter Inbound", then seeing it shot down in literally 5 seconds... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 17:05, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Death streaks were only like 10 seconds long and didnt bother me, no guns were eoverpowered, there all balanced, too much if you ask me. C130s were easy to hide from and rare to see and i downed tons of harries with stingers. The noob tube didnt bother me, i used a m16 with m203 and iron sights as my primary weapon. Knife noobs are easy to shoot The problem was cheap tactics, like camping spawn points and getting your friends to camp with you in free for all so you could stab them and boost your way to a nuke.

-k9870

The only streak thats ten seconds long is painkiller, and it still sucks. The ACR has no recoil and can outshoot sniper rifles, so can the FAMAS. AC-130s are easy to hide from on SOME maps, but if you get spawn trapped outside, your screwed. The fact you use a noob tube on your primary gun choice sickens me, because ANYONE who uses them, unless to get the shotgun unlocked or in a tactical, non spam way is a complete noob and should be banned for using such a cheap weapon. Knife noobs are easy to shoot at times, but if they get within ten feet, commando is your demise. MW2 is a shit game, end of story, Black Ops is doing everything to solve the problems it caused, amen. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The m203 is useful to launch through windows and take out campers, and i use iron sights so might as well have an attachment. I dont use the m203 as my primary, but have it on my primary. And the ACR has low power at range taking on snipers. I countersniper with my m16 though, love irons, they have no sway like a scope. I hate snipers the most, there like socially acceptable campers. Its funny to lay out some noob who tries to quickscope though. It seems like no matter what you get called a noob though, m4 noob, noob tuber, shotgun noob, dual wield noob, knife noob....it seems everyoned thinks if yo dont use whaty they do your a noob, and c-130s dont bother me, there rare, people need 13 kills to get them. I hated when i tried to play free for all with some friends in a party and people are just boosting to nukes each round and cheating there asses off

[[user:k9870]]

agreed. it is always considered noobing. Snipers are annoying. it takes no skill at all to snipe. however there are worse things in MW2 then Snipers. for example- the people who camp in buildings like Wasteland or Scrapyard. "noob tubers" really arent annoying at all anyway. aggravating maybe, but if someone hits you with a M203 its your fault anyway. you should have been more alert. [[Special:Contributions/71.194.219.9|71.194.219.9]] 22:48, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

People always camped hallways and alleys and just shot anyone coming around the corner. Easy to just poke in and launch 40 mil at them. Besides, the thing has an aring distance, you need to arc it at range and reload was slow. Balanced.\

-k9870

:Face it, the M203 is a noob piece of shit. the combo of an M203 with Danger Close and OMA makes you a mini artillery battery. Also, how are you supposed to dodge a tube when people are shooting them cross map to your spawn? Nothing says pro like getting hit by a 40mm grenade shot hundreds of feet over buildings into your face. The M203 has no place in MW2, and I'd be one to have it removed. If retards can't use guns well, don't give them bullshit to help them, let them suck and they'll quit the game. When I pull my FAL out, I feel like a pro, knowing everyone else has the overpowered ACR and FAMAS and the tubes out, all ready to be scrubs, while I'm using something that's balanced and yet awesome. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Well said, though I wish the G3 was still in, and the fact that the ACR does a little less damage, like 1 bullet, maybe two different, makes no difference when there's absolutly no recoil, they still can't do anything by the time you kill them across the map from one huge sustained burst... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:37, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

Are you all playing hardcore or something? And i have no people launching 203s around problem, you only get 2. And i could care less about harriers and 130s, you need a lot of kills to get them. There is a call of duty cultuure to nae some guns as oaky and some as cheap. I dont give a shit personally though. i just play. No matter what somebody will bitch about your gear.

I remember back when everyone hated p90s, that thing had no range or power and overall sucked.

You only get two M203s if your not using scavenger or the more common One Man Army. I literally see two or three people on my team per game using that stupid backpack, it's complete bullshit. The ACR may not do high damage, but it's high rate of fire and zero recoil means you can full auto the damn thing at any range. I think retards who dare to say the noob tube is a legit way to play should be banned from PSN or XBL and never allowed on any Call of Duty again. It's called a first person shooter, not first person grenade launchers. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:I wasn't aware that we can't SHOOT grenade launchers. I better go tell the guys at Activision/IW/Treyarch. -Chris_Hun7er 02:05, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

The problem is more that games are good and balenced when everything has a place, if people start using snipers at close range and beating shotguns (that's more of a Halo thing, but the snipers quickscope and the shotguns are rather terrible), or shooting 40mm rounds at any range for any reason, it's dumb. The launchers in BFBC2 are well balenced, because they have a purpose and they fill it, and nothing else. The assault rifles in MW2 have a purpose, fill it, and then beat SMGs and shotguns at close range, and half the time snipers at long range. And the Javelin, not that I see it too much, is good against tanks, except, there aren't any, there's infantry and helicopters. A game works when things have a purpose and fill that purpose, but not anything else's purpose, and that's half of what's screwed up in MW2. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:36, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

:Excactly Alex. Bad company 2 had 40mms that had to virtually land on the person to kill them, but with Danger Close an MW2 noob tube will kill people even if they're up to fifteen feet away from the landing. To be honest, I think noob tubes should just be plain removed from Black Ops, and the tube fanboys can suck it while us normal players use our guns. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:Reality is fanboy the US 40mm rounds have a 5 meter kill radius. meaning that if you are 15 feet away from the blast you are dead as a doornail. the 40mm grenades in bad company are more useful as doorway makers and cover destroyers than as proper suport weapons. what is pissing off alot of us who care about little things called historic accuracy is the fact that even though they say that everyone had to read about MACV:SOG they have gotten few details right. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 18:44, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

It's true that the 40mm is not terribly powerful in BC2, but explosives need to be less powerful in games than they would in real life, imagine Claymores with realistic spread, damage, and range, without those stupid little lasers, and without bomb squad. Or frag grenades, they're overspammed as it is. Doing something like that is less realistic, but needed for the game to work. Having something like and AUG in 1968, or a SPAS-12 used by Vietcong around the same time... not so much. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

:I agree Alex, because Claymores are really designed to take out a huge radius of enemies, it could easily wipe out an eight man squad. and a frag in a 10 by 10 room would really kill everything inside. If they went for realism, all the 5.56 assault rifles in MW2 would have the same damage and virtually the same recoil, but for balance the TAR is portrayed as extremely powerful, and the ACR weak. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Yeah, it just bothered me that they were THAT different, they could have chosen different weapons if they wanted to balence them like that or something, the part that bugs me the most is that COD4 was better balenced AND made more sense, it's just such a step back... [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 22:05, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

All you people whining and crying about grenade launchers and snipers need to quit bitching and cowboy up. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:38, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Grenade launchers are balanced, mininum detonation range, slow reload, not very accurate (need to arc) only 2 rounds, and besides, use it to take down campers.

== Linked to World at War ==

It has been conformed that Reznov from World at War will appear in this game and even make comments about Dimitri Petrenko. This was seen on the Call of Duty Wiki

:Yes, as Reznov is more or less confirmed to be the bearded man you meet and then split from in the tunnel rat scene at E3. I'm happy to see him back, as he made World at War even better for me, maybe now he'll continuously yell "Fire the Javelin!" [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::"now he'll continuously yell "Fire the Javelin!"" What's a Javelin doing in the cold war? Oh wait I forgot, it must be a secret prototype no one knew about.

:Alright, I was thinking in an MW2 state of mind, lemme see. I know, how about him always yelling "FIRE THE LAW" in your ear every two seconds when something as small as a jeep shows up
[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Any links to zombies?

Yes. Confermed on callofduty.com

as lon as he goes all predator on some one like in wold at war , im fine with in, and being as that hes a soviet why is he with the us? defector or what? simmons 8492

== Has it occured to anyone that the AR-15 variant is probably custom made? ==

Treyarch has said that these guys could have guns custom built just for them, which I feel explains things much more adequately than just saying that they're prototypes of future (to them) guns. My theory is that he had a CAR-15 custom made with a flat-top reciever for tactical reasons. Maybe this caught on with the rest of the team, and whatever manufacturer they got to make these guns for them sold the idea later on. Of course this is just an excuse for the guns having the rails just to free it up for attacthments in Multiplayer, but at least there is some kind of excuse. Unfortunately this theory doesn't cover the anachronistic appearances of the SPAS-12 and the AUG, but hey, no game ever get's all of it's guns 100% correct. 

Edit: Actually it just might explain the AUG, because all it really is is a combination of ideas taken from the Enfield EM-2, 
Korobov TKB-022, and several other abandoned designs from before or shortly after World War 2. The only thing it doesn't explain is why it has the production-style built in telescopic sight, instead of the original prototypes open sights:
[[http://world.guns.ru/assault/aug_pr1.gif]]

:I can deal with the CAR-15 because it's at least ''plausible'', but the "SOG got it first" excuse doesn't work with the guns that didn't yet exist. The AUG isn't just a customized version of another gun, it's a standalone design on its own. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:48, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

== For those of you who may be confused about the supposed MP5/UMP hybrid ==

This is what I'm talkin about: 

[[Image:CODBO-SMG.jpg]] 

As you can see, it appears that it has the reciever and magazine housing of an MP5 or MP5K, while the barrel housing (correct me if I'm incorrect in calling it that) looks like that of a somewhat shortened UMP. If you look closely, you will note that it has the MP5Ks finger guard (I'm guessing that's what that is) directly below the muzzle that looks like a cut down version of the full handguard found in this picture: 

[[Image:MP5Kprototype.JPG]] 

My point is I don't think it's a hybrid at all, merely an MP5K missing it's forward vertical grip, for some reason or another. And seeing as every other aspect of the gun is that of an MP5Ks, I think it's safe to say that's what it is, so I'm gonna change it to that on the front page. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:38, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

It ain't a hybrid, it is a real gun altogether. After doing some research I think I've found the gun or rather guns that it could potentially be. My first guess is:
*The H&K SMGI & II
http://www.hkpro.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=103:smg-i-a-ii&catid=11:rare-prototypes&Itemid=5
*And second guess being the MP5 PIP
http://www.hkpro.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=102:mp5-pip&catid=11:rare-prototypes&Itemid=5
[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 19:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

== G11 ==

Anyone else as excited as I am for the inclusion of the G11? [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:16, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
:Just another anachronistic gun. Thats all. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 04:49, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

I sure as heck am. --[[User:AK-74Fan|AK-74Fanc]] 23:18, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

Eh the gun itself isn't that big of a deal to me, but I definitely am excited to see something that to my knowledge hasn't been in an FPS before. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 23:29, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
: Well, it have appeared already in few other FPS games. For example [[Delta Force: Land Warrior]], [[Global Operations]], [[IGI 2: Covert Strike]] or Code of Honor: The French Foreign Legion --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 04:58, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
::Those games are not up to the modern standard, though. ;) [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 12:11, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

:Really, you could say this is the G11s first appearance in a well known game, and will finally show it off to the masses. I love the weapon itself, and to see it finally make a big appearance like this makes me quite happy.[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

The G11 was in Syphon Filter 2 [[Special:Contributions/98.237.107.108|98.237.107.108]] 02:25, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Can someone link me the video of the G11 being used? I don't want to search through all the reposts and copies of other videos.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 13:23, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== XM214 Microgun ==

Since it's going to cover the Vietnam era, and the way these types of games like to go over the top, do you think there's a chance that the XM214 Microgun is going to make an appearance? I know it was only a prototype, and was it was made in the 70's, but I thought I read somewhere that the SF guys tried it out only to find that it was not feasable having a gun fire at 4,000 rpm.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 03:14, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

:I think putting a Minigun in the game would be kind of stupid. I mean sure they could make it heavy and awkward to carry, but that thing would simply decimate anyone in it's path, whether they're behind light cover, in a vehicle or just in the open. I'd love one, but methinks not. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Not to mention it's impossible to actually fire one with live rounds. -Mandaloin

== A more plausable fictional AR-15 ==

I can understand a frankengun, like some special forces guy back then would take several kinds of AR-15 designs and mash them together until he gets an awesome gun that works. And being special forces, they can get whatever they want to suit their mission, so it would make sense for whatever they take to not be standard issue or that it is known, but I don't like the flip up iron sights since I don't know when flip up irons came about or the flat top receiver. It's like they just took a Colt Model 933 and replaced the stock with an old style stock from the CAR-15. I mean, put a telescoptic stock on an M16A1 rifle, or A2 upper reliever on the Car-15 and swap out the pistol grip or something. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:16, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

:That would make sense considering the special forces style of the game. Also, Sonny (from Deadliest warrior and such) was on as an advisor for Spetsnaz and tactics, so look for both some epic Spetsnaz moves and even a character of him in game! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Do we even officially know yet what model AR-15 it is, aside of course from the flattop reciever and flip-up sights? [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 02:31, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

It pretty much is a Colt Model 933 without a brass deflector or forward assist, which actual does not exist. I have not seen a flat top reciever without the forward assist and the brass deflector. I don't even think flip up irons were invented back then. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:58, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

I mean if they threw in a CAR-15 tricked out like the ones seen in Black Hawk Down, I'd have no complaints [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:04, 22 July 2010 (UTC)
:+1. but they though it would look too bulky from first person perspective.

agreed. that movie was amazing. i wouldnt even care if you couldnt use the tac-lights but still the CAR-15s they had in that movie were amazing. does anyone no what the difference between CAR-15 and Colt Commando models are??? [[Special:Contributions/24.15.103.231|24.15.103.231]] 23:55, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
:I associate the CAR-15 with the XM177 style flash hider and the Commando to me is the M733 for it's short barrel [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:55, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

== New weapons! ==

Here's [[http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:GunWall.png]] a pic of a bunch of airsoft guns Treyarch has on a wall in their studio which pretty much confirms that they'll be in the game. 
From left to right, starting at the top: 
-M16A2 (?) 
-MAC-10 w/ supressor 
-AUG 
-Mini-Uzi 
-L85 
-Scorpion SA Vz 61 
-AKs-74u 
-Another Skorpion 
-SPAS-12 
-MP5 (?) 

Not sure exactly what the MP5 is doing as there already is the K variant prototype, and no idea what the HELL the M16A2 is doing there as there's already an M16A1 AND a CAR-15. What do you all think?
Sorry it's a bit blurry.

It could be a very blurry M16A1 or maybe because they somehow can bullshit their way into saying they got a prototype M16A2. And I prefer us to use the full size MP5 again. Looks like they got an L85 here. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:59, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

: That pic is here too :) Check out "extras" section in article :D

:The L85 got my gun-boner up, been wanting that since the MW2 L86 LSDisapointment. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Dude, put that away. :P [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 12:23, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

We might also see the Browning HP because of the rumored "Iranian Hostage Situation" level. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

:I wouldn't be surprised, but if I see another Desert Eagle, then I'll have to wtf. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
::Deagle prototype and AA12 prototype + level is moved to Buckingham Pallace to add more drama to the game. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::Sorry, Buck Palace? Explain this? I assume this is a rumour, since so far Operation Nimrod has yet to be confirmed aswell. Sounds interesting though (if a little rediculous and implausible)
::::just kidding. I just jumped on the Black Ops bandwagon [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

Im guessing the a2 is used since its more availible and when they do motion capture it would look the same. showing how someone moves with a m16 s what they're looking for,

:Also, the footage showing the Spetsnaz game models doing rolls shows the player holding and firing a clearly Vietnam era M16A1, so that's there for sure. Also, I do believe the Iranian Embassy raid will be tacked on much like Mile high Club in CoD 4, simple as a fun epilogue style bonus mission. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

"Black Ops is said to be set in various locations, including Vietnam and Cuba, [3] and judging from weaponry and dates given in the trailer, it is set between 1960 and 2010."
a quote from here: http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops

I really hope there's a Browning HP, cause it's cool and cause I'm Canadian lol. It might be in to be honest because in COD4 the Overkill and Last Stand pics had a Glock and then it was added in MW2, and the Overkill pic in WAW was a Browning HP :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 21:56, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I hope its just "iranian embassy raid inspired", not the real thing, i want more than 6 guys to shoot.

:This is Call of Duty, so you'll always have plenty of enemies to shoot. And yeah Alex, as a fellow Canadian, a Hi-Power would be a nice handgun to have in the game, and period correct. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

As much as I love the Hi Power and actually owning one, I don't want to see one in a game such as call of duty just because of the attention it will recieve from nerds spamming videos on youtube "HEY THIS GUN IS IN CALL OF DUTY!!!!1" It gets really annoying and that kind of attention seems negative to those that actually collect guns. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:29, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

:Partially agree with you there. I hate the attention guns get from these games (and suddenly every 12 year old becoming a firearms expert [yes, obviously the M16 is better than the AUG just because CoD says so]) but, I enjoy being able to play with them. Win some, loose some. Well, one or two firearms forums have noticed a HUGE increase in the number of people looking for the 'ACR'. As have a few rifle stores in the 'States that I know of have been plagued by idiot teens looking for hi-tech military grade gear...

I hope there is a HP, they need a 9mm gun for MP (more ammo, less recoil, but less damage) and Id rather see a cool gun then a lame generic beretta coming in.

I wouldn't mind seeing a Browning HP, (heck Indiana Jones used one, who wouldn't?) But then again it may look just a little bit too similar to the M1911 that's already confirmed for this game, so it's addition might be just a little visually redundant. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 05:04, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

:Hi-power and m1911...look similar? It sounds like "Elephant&Rhino look alike" or "M16 looks like AK 47".

I said they look similar. Not exactly alike. Besides, when it comes to COD, all of the guns are supposed to be easily distinguishable on the fly. If they gave one a different finish it'd be perfectly fine.

:Maybe so, maybe not, but all I'd like to hope is that the bloody ACR doesn't return, or else I'm burning down Treyarch studios. Honestly, MW2 just had cool and shiny guns that everyone would like, as opposed to realistic and proper guns used by militaries and militias. Of course the AK needs rails and a retractable stock, that makes it cooler! And of course we have the Barret, because it's big and makes a loud boom! And of course we have a Glock 18, because it's a Glock! I swear, it's like the IW developers had no idea what real special forces, Rangers, Spetsnaz and Militia would be equipped with, and instead went solely with cool, popular and impractical guns. Black Ops sounds like it's trying to be period correct, or at least have some different guns that other games. Sure there's an anachronistic AUG, but atleast it's not an ACR or Intervention in 1968! Rant complete! Also, I've heard lots of rumours of the Beta being released August 1st, anyone got any info on that? [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

I've heard that rumor too, but as far as I know it has no information to back it up

some guy was selling beta codes on ebay (£12 for a demo!!!) but they have been pulled. unluckey for the 10 people that bought them as the guy was new and had (0)--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 22:04, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

They don't really need a high cap 9mm, while it wouldn't be realistic but they could do it like they did in WaW. I remember reading something about a old guy that was killed in his home and over 30 guns stolen and he had a Uzi and a FAL. The guy was in his 70s as I recall and someone said "a uzi and a fal? LOL someone plays to much MW2!" even though the guy most likely never heard of MW2. The FAL used to be fun to look up on Youtube, I discovered it through sportsman guide as a parts kit so I looked it up on youtube and it was just educated comments about the gun. Same video a few months later after MW2 came out it was just gaming nerds that thought they knew guns commenting. I don't want to see this happen to the gun thats in my shoulder holster. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:49, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

:COD nerds. Sooner or later they`ll grow out of it(like i did with Counter Strike) [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

Or not.

Who gives a damn if they do, what are you gonna do, buy a brand new gun, buy the most obscure handgun you can think of? Every profession, field of study, or interest gets its day in the limelight(save for the really boring ones), and videogames are doing this for guns. Do you think that symbologists enjoyed when the Da'Vinci code came out? They were probably just as annoyed as you for all the dilettantes who thought they suddenly knew something about symbology. What the hell are you gonna do? Nothing, I say. --[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 05:32, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

:I plan on owning guns when I grow up, have already handled and shot many guns, and yet I still plan to play CoD as an adult. You know why? Because I enjoy online gaming, and because oddly IRL you can't shoot people and get away with it (outside of airsoft, which I also play) [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Jigsaw, it appears as though you misread my post, I don't want them to include it because I hate the negative and dumbass attention guns online already attract. I feel as though my sport is tainted because of all these idiots. I'm fine with other games including it that aren't as mainstream but CoD is idiot infested. The 1887 Winchester is a perfect example, I learned about it from terminator 2 and thought it was cool and all and comments on those videos were either people that found out about it the same way and shooters. Now they are filled with nerds talking about it in MW2. Its seriously annoying. Seeing how you people come from video games and not shooting you won't be able to understand. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:43, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

Well you never addressed the negative attention bit in your original post, but still, how are you going to stop them? Sure it's annoying but it's nothing to stew over. And I like how you assume that we're 'from' gaming and not a shooting history so we obiously can't know how you feel. Also, your page says you're seventeen, I didn't realize that minors could get CCWs, or was that shoulder holster talk figurative, or do you live on a ranch or something?

It was in my own home and it was for real. Don't need a CCW to carry anyway. I never said I'm gonna stop them or make a petition or anything, I was just expressing my point. Yes I did address the negative attention. Alot of you on here in the video game section have more experiance with video games than actual firearms. I know someone that has made it so you he has to approve comments because of the videos of his Beretta M93r.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:18, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

:I'm also extremely proud that even at 16, I came from liking and learning about guns from sources outside of video games. Hell, even if I first see a gun in a game, I'll research it to learn some proper information, not the awesome CoD-Knowledge so many kids think they have nowadays. Literally, I had a kid telling me the ACR was better then the AK-47 the other day because "It's better in MW2, which is really close to real life". I laughed at him for a minute, then went on to own him with a five minute talk on the AK-47, which he promptly retorted to by leaving the game. Cod kids 0, Me 1 [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Eh I shoot when I can, but I mostly just read up on just about everything I can learn about a certain gun once I see it in a movie/game/real life. I wish I had more time to shoot. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 04:50, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

i hate it when people talk about the intervention sniper as being amazing. ok in real life its very powerful, and i first learnt about it from a film and i thought it looked ugly. i also hate the annoying 10 year olds with the duel shotguns, modern warfare 1 was a great game and tactical, MW2 was more tacticool. especially when you get kids, that shouldnt own the game but are spoilt enbough to get there parents buy it, they lecture you on guns like they have them in their living room and use them constantly. i like the ACR it looks cool, i know it as the 'magpul masdasa' but no one on COD as ever hear of the name. i would like to see pistols as secondary, they balance out the game and dont make it unfair. i would like them to make pistols louder to make them feel powerful rather than a crappy sound that seems quieter than a hole puncher--[[user:smish34|smish34]] 13:44, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

: Well, i always though that ACR looks terrible. First seen it in Future Weapons and only thing that i liked was fact that i can fire both 5.56 and 7.62. Intervention ? This is one of first guns that i heard about first in MW2. I imediattly googled some real life info about it :)

So did I. By the way, is it even called the Masada anymore? I thought Remington bought the rights and renamed it 'Remington ACR'. Oh well, either way I'm still gonna call it the Masada, it sounds better, and MW2 kiddies won't know what I'm talking about. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:10, 31 July 2010 (UTC)
:I always thought it was a silly name for a weapon. You ARE aware of what happened to Masada, correct? Yes, it's a great example of defiance in the face of incredible odds, but the fact remains, everyone eventually killed themselves. (Or each other, but you know what I mean.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:38, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

It was designed by Magpul under the Masada name and then Bushmaster started building them. Then came Freedom group that bought Remington and they decided to buy bushmaster. So now the bushmaster ACR has the remington name on it even though they have nothing to do with design or manufacturing.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 16:42, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Ah, I see. And I had no idea that happened to Masada, I'll have to look into that. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 17:49, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

:Well, from what I've heard as a heavy rumor from many places, tomorrow could be the release of the Black Ops Public Beta. It seems logical, as it gives roughly two and a bit months of Beta before it's closed so Treyarch can finish the game off for the November release, but then again maybe not. All I can say is, fingers crossed, because tomorrow we could be going deep and going hard men![[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:: Tommorrow? Now I seriously doubt that. I don't think they can just drop a public beta on us like that without an official announcement. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:27, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

:::It's happened before, and if not released tomorrow, maybe they announce it tomorrow then release for Monday. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

well they havent confirmed nor denied the beta but some hackers found the codes a few months ago, they also found the halo reach beta codes months before it was announced. but i think they would give some indication on wether or not they are, also there was this guy selling codes on ebay a few days ago, definatly fake, and they have been pulled [[user:smish34|smish34]]

While i'm not fully aware of the differences between the ACR and the Masada, but the most notable is the location of the charging handle. The Masada has it over the ejection port while the ACR has it over the forend. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:16, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Correct me if i'm wrong, but I heard on youtube I heard that it was originaly call the magpul masada, but they changed the name because they didn't want the name masada on there gun so they changed it to the name acr. Liek I said if I'm way of correct me.

==Anyone Take Notice?==

During one of the gameplay videos, did anyone take notice to the AK-47 icon (where it said "Hold X For AK-47)? It looks a bit colored instead of grey (meaning i noticed some orange in it as well) [[SeanWolf]]

Those Icons are only grey, no color. It had to be behind it giving it the appearance of orange.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:27, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Well...i was looking at this image and it LOOKS colored (the stock)[[User:SeanWolf]]:

[[Image:CODBO-AK47blip.jpg]]

: That looks coloured to me too. Hmm, that's interesting. And it's not like it's all one color, like something could be behind it giving it the illusion of colour, the reciever seems to be some kind of a metallic blue while the wooden handguard and stock seem to be orange-ish. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:12, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah it is, Thats what I get for not looking at it. Thought it would have been the same as before. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:17, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

== New Trailer ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_fsM6LBi54

Straight off the bat, there's a FAMAS, Ballistic Knife, and what some people on the CoD wiki have claimed to to be an Arctic Warfare type sniper rifle. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:55, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:...and an exploding RC car. Interesting...--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:12, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
::''Holy hell...they've stopped trying. Depending on how any demo and reviews are, I might just buy it for the single player, but the multiplayer is completely out of the question. They took Modern Warfare 2 - which wasn't the best of bases to start with - and made it worse. Just like Treyarch, I suppose.'' --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 18:14, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

: It looked a lot better than MW2 to me. A lot of the minor details looked the same, like the kill medals at the top of the screen, but other than that not much looked the same. And I do believe that was an Arctic Warfare, but I'll have to look a little closer before I'm sure. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 18:30, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

: Watched it again: Yes, that is an Arctic Warfare. And another thing to note, the FAMAS was missing it's carry handle! Again, Treyarch? Really? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 19:14, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

:There IS a FAMAS without the carrying handle, but it's a DMR and the carrying handle is removed solely to mount a scope on it [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:39, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::kind of like this.--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 19:58, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
[[image:Famascoddmr.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

:The one in the game is EXACTLY like this thing. Even though it's a FAMAS again, it does look kinda cool despite the fact that this gun never existed during the Cold War...this is stupid. They got an AR-15 that shouldn't exist, an Accuracy International Arctic Warfare that shouldn't be in the game, the AUG, which might not exist in the game either, and now a FAMAS that shouldn't exist. They going to pull anything else out of their asses? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:02, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::Unless they've gone down the "we don't care that it's not historically accurate, we're trying to make it fun" route. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 20:27, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Mind you, all of this is from multiplayer. It's multiplayer, there's no story, no setting. Why can't they use anything they want? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:31, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

:::: You do know this places THROUGH OUT the cold war. This is also a MULTIPLAYER trailer, so a number of weapons that appear through out the game can appear. Now, I'm not defending this game, I don't even play CoD anymore. But I'm just saying the fact's about the game. I mean...Yes, if the Accuracy International Arcticle Warfare appeared in single player in a Vietnam mission, then yes, "What the hell..." But this is a multiplayer teaser. (Just to say the Accuracy International Article Warfare started producing in 1982 which the Cold War was still up and running) Please don't rant at me, as I'm just giving the fact's about the game. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 20:34, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

::::::Ok, if a gun appears in the MILTIPLAYER, then it most likely will appear in the game. I have yet to see a shooter game that has guns that appear in the multiplayer mode NOT appear in single player. I've seen the reverse, like in MW2, the SVD appears in singleplayer, but not multi. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:36, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

And to ADD to that, yes we know this game takes place THROUGHOUT the cold war, which was official between the end of WWII and 1989 ish. The FAMAS wasn't even in production until 1995. The AUG might be excused but the year the mission took place when it made an appearances is 68 and the weapon wasn't even patented until 77. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:40, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Could someone edit the Famas section?It says that it appeared in multiplayer foor

The creators said that the guns that they have are prototypes so some of them will be used when not in service.
:Well the creators are bullshitters. You're telling me the French created the FAMAS carrying handleLESS prototype almost 20 YEARS before it was put into service? And the G2 rail version even which was made in 2001? I might forgive the AUG somewhat, but there is so much bullshit I can take here. There are so many other weapons Treyarch could use, but they had to try to somehow bullshit the weapons from MW2 into this game instead of being original. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:47, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah I agree that Treyarch could have picked another gun, but if you think about it all the recent call of duty game (Modern Warfare, Modern Warfare 2) not all the guns that are used in the game would be used at that time, but they are little thing like the w1200 wouldn't be used in 2011 and the wa2000 in 2016 so maybe the famas and the ar 15 are the acceptions.

MW2 is a different kind of weapon selection. It takes place in an unspecified "near future" kind of storyline or present day. All the weapons in the game exist in the current timeframe. MW2 isn't a period piece game, COD from 1 to 3 were all WWII games and Modern Wafare is well, as the title goes, "Modern Warfare." Black Ops takes place within the Cold War, a time before 1989, so any guns before than is acceptable. Sure, seeing a gun that won't be out in the open market for another 2-3 years, yeah I can accept that. A lot of prototype weapons are like that, but the FAMAS is in a game that is more than a decade before the concept inception of said weapon. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

It's a bit more than a decade. The game's set in 1967/68, so a good thirty-odd years before it was conceived. The problem is, they could have inserted the real FAMAS prototype, no problem (1971, compared with 1974 for the AUG). [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 23:13, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

I heard that treyarch isn't going past the 1980 mark.

Ok I agree with maybe Treyarch just abused the prototype thing, but they can always take the famas out, they look at the forums.
:I don't think they do [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:24, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

On the new multiplayer video did anyone see the guy roll out the way around the :36 mark? - the marksman.
:Looks like he jumped and slide away from the gunfire. I hope we get to do that. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:55, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

: We can. If everything else from that old Multiplayer rumor is also true, which is a very real possibillity as a lot of it was confirmed or all but confirmed in that trailer, it will be a standard mechanic and won't need any kind of a perk or anything. Also, I've just gone ahead and decided to completly disregard this game realism. It's obviously trying to be some sort of "Modern Warfare back in time" deal, so at this point I'm just hoping it's fun. And that's all that will really matter in the end, right? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:39, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
::No, I can't accept that! Call of Duty originated as a game that takes place in a set time frame and immerses you in it with historical accuracies. Every game except for MW2 has been very accurate, especially when compared to other video games. If they wanted all these modern guns, then why make the time frame set in Vietnam/the Cold War? Why all of a sudden do they only care about making it look cool instead of providing us with realism like they always have? With the FAMAS G2 FELIN and the Accuracy International Rifle, they are officially bullshitting about the fact that these are prototypes in the Vietnam War. There can be no more arguments against that fact. But why do they have to do that to what was once such a legitimate series?
:::Look around on this page, and we go into why they chose the time period they did. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:11, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

: Money. Most consumers don't care or even know that most of these guns weren't around in the game's time period, they don't even really care about the Singleplayer, they just want cool guns in their Multiplayer. Of course I don't agree with this at all. 02:50, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::That still doesn't make sense to me. Call of Duty got its very successful start making realistic games. When it came out Call of Duty 4 was one of the best selling games ever and it's one of the most legitimate modern war games I've ever seen. Based on that you would think that people like seeing an accurate game.
:::First off, a game where you can single-handed kill half the German army is not that realistic. In fact, I personally think it's a bit insulting to the real veterans who only had one life and no continues to play with. Second, MW2 wasn't realistic and it still sold a bajillion copies. Yes, it's about the money. Don't like it? Then don't spend your gaming dollar on it. Our wallets are our votes. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:00, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Obviously being able to kill a million people isn't realistic. Perhaps a better word would be accurate. You can tell in the first 5 Call of Dutys they made a good effort to get their shit right. Now they don't even try. I don't understand why they stopped trying with MW2 and now why Treyarch is following suit. I wouldn't buy any of these games but there's no more realistic or accurate games coming out anymore and I can only play the old Rainbow Six and Ghost Recon games so much before I get tired of them.

I'd like to make a small correction, the FAMAS was designed from 1967-1971 and the first generation FAMAS's entered service in 1978. Dose this mean you'd see a G2 in the Vietnam war, no but a prototype without a carry handle could hypothetically have exited in the time of the game.

=== I think this is actual FAMAS Prototype ===

Isn it ? Whatever. It will be awesome if actual prototypes of guns will get in.
[[image:FAMAS_PROTOTYPE.JPG|thumb|none|400px]]

If it is than they won't put it in, doesn't look as cool you know, thats what counts.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:34, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Pepole please acquant yourself with the FAMAS's history here. Thank you. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FAMAS]

== The COD wiki ==

I just looked over at the COD wiki and it is a nightmare over there on their format and what little info they put on their pages and disregard the "gun nerds" on any contributions. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:46, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

That's because there's a policy against adding IRL info to the weapon articles. Although I've just been having an argument with someone who was convinced the FAMAS here was an F1. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:52, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Have they ever seen the F1 FAMAS, it has the carrying handle. Only the FAMAS G2 had the option of getting no carrying handle. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:53, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

His initial argument was that it couldn't be a G2 because it had a small trigger guard and was using the proprietary magazine, rather than the large hand-guard and a STANAG magazine (despite the G2 being able to fit+feed both). [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:57, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
:Then this FAMAS don't exist either in the real world like the Ar-15. The developers are also looking at "Black Ops" history wrong. The concept of today's special forces were really different back then during the Cold War. It's not the same kind of people or style as it hasn't been refined like today Spec Ops. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:12, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm over at Cod wiki right now.

==Those are definitely explosive tips==

The attachment on this picture:
http://www.imfdb.org/images/7/77/Codblackopsunkownattachment.jpg
is definitely explosive tip for crossbow.
just watch the trailer and stop at 0:30 and look in the killfeed.
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/804/callofdutyblackopsmulti.png

==A nice detail==
Look at 0:09 in the new trailer, there is clan tag written on the AR-15 charging handle.

Yeah, I noticed that. I like that little touch. But I hope it doesn't just copy his clan tag from next to his name and paste it on the charging handle, I hope I can have something written on my gun without having to have a clan tag. I don't particularly like clan tags, mostly because I hate clans. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:55, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

==Ballistic knife==
would the Ballistic knife be listed as a firearm or not?

Maybe it does shoot a projectile even thought it is not a firearm.

No because its not a firearm.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:43, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

To be fair though, the crossbow isn't a fire arm, but it is a ballistic weapon. And isn't the Punisher's compound bow up even though THAT isn't a firearm? Just put up the ballistic knife.--[[User:True Night]]

I have a better idea: Since they aren't firearms, let's remove the crossbow from this page and the compound bow from the ''Punisher'' page. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:44, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

just for that tom jane is going to kill you with a bow and arrow. good job . and the balistic knive uses high tention (missspeled) springs, so id call it a projectial if anything. not to mension that , if you look at the rock on this site , it has the little dart shot gun that nick cage uses in the begining. simmons 8492

== Snub Nose ==

I went over to cod wiki and there is a page about a snub nose attachment for the colt python
Confirm?

I swear I saw snub nose in the new Multi-player trailer. Maybe faster draw?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Went back to the video and I saw it, the guy is switching to it. http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/319/snubnose.png[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:20, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Hmm...Snubnosed=less accuracy+shorter range= more XP per kill? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:51, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Probably the same logic that it somehow gets more damage with a shorter barrel like the double barrel shotgun in WaW. I'm leaning more towards a faster draw.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:36, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Apparently, it leads to more accuracy and less damage. Hmm [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 02:15, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Anachronisms ==

Can we please not say that the guns are anachroistic on the actual page? Because Me, along with alot of other people, agree that we really don't care about anachrosisms so please can we just limit comment about anarchistic guns to th talk page please? Thank you. [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 20:54, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

:Then what's the point of a discussion page if we can't DISCUSS about shit? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:34, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Also, since this ISN'T the Call of Duty Wiki, where it is full of people who can't accept REAL facts, I am undoing all the erasing of pointing out that the guns are anachronistic. Cause that's how I roll [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:45, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
:I'm one of those people who don't think it'll affect the quality of the game, but I do believe it should be pointed out. I also believe we'll be able to make a better judgement call on whether or not these are truly anachronistic or just victims of an alternative timeline once the game actually comes out. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:59, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

:Drjuki, the whole point of this whole site is the guns and this page is to discuss the ones in the game. And like Excalibur said, this isn't the Call of Duty Wiki where factual real world information about said guns is against the rules. So, yes, we ''are'' going to point out anachronisms. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:13, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

:: Although I do think it should be noted on the page when a certain firearm is anachronistic, I also think it should be simply noted, not ridiculed. Not sure if there really is any on this page, actually haven't looked at it in a while, but it's been a problem on other pages, with commments such as "Aparently they did no research" and such. Our job here is to jot down the facts, not intermingle them with our own thoughts. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:04, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Well that's just it, we don't have the facts. We have images, and no context. Why not just wait until the game actually comes out? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:11, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
The context of the trailers and images is that the game takes place during the Cold War period and we have a gun like that AR-15 carbine. No forward assist or brass deflector and the weird magazine. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:24, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:The context of a three minute trailer, or multiple three minute trailers that tell us nothing? I'm fairly certain I've seen all the trailers, and yet I can't tell you what the overall goal of the campaign is. What are we fighting for? To prevent nuclear war? Assassinate rogue agents? Who's the villain? Is there one? It can all be a dream, or a fevered hallucination for all we know. And it wouldn't surprise me at all if the plot was paper thin. It's MP that sells the game. The only reason why there's a campaign at all is because they can't sell the game for full price if it's only MP. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:03, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
::We can ridicule anachronisms if we want, it's a discussion page where we can say what we want. And yeah they didn't do their research or worse straight up ignored the fact these guns didn't exist back then. I think more of us would agree that Treyarch failed on the firearms.
::: Seriously. Only firearms ?
I wasn't talking about the discussion page, I was talking about the main page. Say whatever you want here. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 15:24, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:No one was really talking in the main page. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:25, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

::Well good, let's keep it that way. It's been a problem on other pages, with ''much'' less incorrect details than this game, so I was just trying to keep it clean here. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 15:35, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

--[[User:Jackie.45Cal|Jackie.45Cal]] 12:18, 12 August 2010 (UTC)Im sorry but if you are going to put a gun that wasn't even in development until 2001 in a game set pre 1989 then you may asweel put an ipod in too. It's just silly, those guns were made with materials and machinery that didn't even exsist. I'm personally hoping that there is a surprise mission that takes place in a more modern setting.--[[User:Jackie.45Cal|Jackie.45Cal]] 12:18, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

== Watch the ending of the Campaign reveal that.... ==

The SOG soldiers are back in time to prevent a nuclear war, and they brought all their guns and equipment from the future with them. That would just make my day, would be so awful it's hilarious. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:26, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
:Honestly, I'll cry if that happens. In the metaphorical sense, of course. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 22:46, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

== Dragunov? ==

In the new Prestige Trailer [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4HreDGcQus]], people have speculated that the rifle the sniper is carrying at the end is a Dragonuv. Anyone concur?

watch ust before he blows up, the stock and the positioning are from the draganuv --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:02, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Its a dragonuv. Also I noticed the Dragonuv style scope in the very begining. Do we finally get different redicles for the different rifles?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:17, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

I think the action diver had one, too

== R/C car ==

For Modern warfare 2 it was the nvgs and now we have a R/C car with a camera and a microphone. what are your thoughts on this?

Dumb crap makes my wallet giggle... --[[Special:Contributions/99.65.211.227|99.65.211.227]] 09:51, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Retarded gimmick is retarded.

== Some prototypes photos ==

So... When Treyarch decides to put prototype guns, why not choose actual prototypes ?

For exmaple '''prototype Famas'''.[http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Talk:Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops#I_think_this_is_actual_FAMAS_Prototype]

Post more prototype photos. I wish to see ''AUG, SPAS'' or ''AWM'' prototype.

And i have one question - May be Stg. RH-70 some kind of AUG Prototype ?
[[image:2757881.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

I just looked it up, its not a AUG Prototype, its a gun that was meant to be a 5.56 x 45 rifle to replace the G3 as the service arm but its not a AUG prototype.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:02, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

The way things are nowadays if it doesn't look cool its not gonna be in the game. Wouldn't surprise me if the G11 is covered by rails.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:42, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:Probably. It also bothers me that in WaW and CoD4 they actually tested and recorded most of the weapons. We all know there is no way they got their hands on a G11 to test it or record sounds from it.

Probably gonna take sounds from another gun. IMO though that gun is UGLY! --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:03, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:Who would know what a G11 sounds like? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 19:22, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

There is a youtube video which i'll post here for you guys of it, probably already infested with CoD nerds posting dumbass things and arguing about MW2.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:45, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6JWCEmCgD8--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Huh, so that's what caseless ammo looks like. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:11, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

The SPAS 12 prototype: (note the shorter barrel and different folding stock): [http://spas12.com/spas/franchimod12a.jpg]
The AUG prototype (with many differences from the final product): [http://world.guns.ru/assault/aug_pr1.gif]----[[User:Markit|Markit]] 03:13, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Looks just like the shorter model, combat model I think. I forgot.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:56, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Never mind that gun is pretty much the AUG prototype. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:04, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

If the AUG in the game looks like the prototype, I can ignore it, but it looks like the modern variant [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:14, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

==RPG-7==
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100812011017/callofduty/images/9/93/RPG7BO.png

Can someone put that pic on the page in "RPG-7" section? I got this image from here: http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/RPG-7

==Time period and Guns==

There is a lot of stuff on this page so I don't know if this has been said or not, but this game takes place in different time periods so that's probably why there is such an array of anachronistic weapons. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Finally someone said it. The developers said the game takes place in the '''COLD WAR''' not just Vietnam. Everyone keeps complaining about this gun and that gun being anachronistic to 1968 but it looks like a decent amount of this game will take place after that time. I've heard talk as late as the 80's so wouldn't that then make the AUG, SPAS, and FAMAS technically time period correct? --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 17:35, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

:That point has been made before, and it becomes moot when a SPAS-12 (developed in the mid 1970s) turns up in the middle of the Tet Offensive in 1968, or likewise when an unchanged AUG A1 rifle appears in the late 1960s when it wasn't even patented until 1974. The "but black ops are so awesome they get secret prototype weapons!" argument would have made more sense if the weapons in question actually existed in the years that specific levels take place in. What the developers are doing is tantamount to giving you an AK-47 in 1943 and telling you that its presence is historically accurate because it was designed in the same era. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 19:27, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

: Even if the game would take place in 1989 ( ''And i guess it wont'' ) FAMAS FELIN will be still anachronistic.

== The Best Thing About Black Ops..... ==

.. '''None of that goddamned overpowered burst-fire weapons!!!!!!'''
Now, before you all fly off the handle at me. I just want to say a few things. 1- I am not a member of this site, but I visit it every time I want to identfy a gun used in a movie. 2- I do have real-life gun knowledge, unlike the fools who play Call of Duty and suddenly assume they're gun experts.
I do realize that many people find 3-round bursts useful in real-life. I see it as unecessary and useless. I'm also going to add that I am a Call of Duty player and I know for a fact that they intentionally make the burst-fire weapons overpowered, which is why I am so glad that it won't be featured in Black Ops.
:While I can agree with you that the kids who think that playing CoD automatically qualifies them as firearm experts are annoying (I've actually had a kid try to tell me that the AUG, the normal one, is a machine gun and not an assault rifle), and while I can also agree that I don't prefer burst fire weapons to automatic ones in real life, I have to disagree on your main point. The three shot burst weapons in Modern Warfare 2 are not overpowered. How many shots, without stopping power, does it take to kill with the M16A4 or the Famas? One burst, or three bullets, though on extremely rare occasions, it takes four bullets. How many shots does it take, again without stopping power, to kill with a SCAR-H, or a TAR-21? Again, three. So no, the burst weapons aren't over powered. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 20:49, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

: That doesn't neccessarily mean it's balanced. It also has a ''much'' higher rate of fire, even ''less'' recoil, if that's even possible, and a farther range, if I remember correctly. Now the M16A4 in MW2 was pretty balanced, but really only because it had a bit of spread with it's shots. The FAMAS, however, was the most unbalanced piece of work in gaming history. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 00:42, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::Which is really strange to me, since I was much better with the M16 then I was with the FAMAS. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 08:02, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Actually they may have the M16 be some sort of burst fire prototype, after all they got the cool stuff before it exsisted and produced so they just might.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:58, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Well in Metal Gear Solid 3, they got away with having an XM16E1 with a 4 selector capability [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:17, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

first , i had a kid tell me that the moddel 1887 is a rifel , based only on the fact that it has a lever and not a pump. i own no guns and also only pop on this site to win bets with my brother but i know that. but dose any one know if the m16 or famas have selector switches that can be changed?

Yes they do. The FAMAS can shoot on semi auto, and the M16a4 also has semi auto.[[user:Greywolverene|Greywolverene]]

== New pics ==

IGN has some new BO pics:

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054555152.html?page=mediaFull]

Theeeere's that forward grip on the AUG.

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054602839.html?page=mediaFull]

Okay, the AK mag IS a little off. And the holster looks like the holster for a Walther P38/P1. Any ideas on that shotgun (?) on his back? Or is it an M79?
:AK has a proper 545 plastic clip with little ribs on the side. But I would more like to see AKS74 in game...
::Magazine is the proper term.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:55, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
Shotgun is probably china lake laucher.
: Yes, it is. '''Russians with China Lake GL'''? Yeah, thats even more stupid, anachronistic and epic failing than Russians with SPAS.
::dude...thats the KS-23 shotgun. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
::What makes you think he's Russian? And even if he is, it could be multiplayer for all we know. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 05:36, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::: He has SP´s russian model. And i think its SP mission - Because all other "new" screens are from SP :)
[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-black-ops/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054551731.html?page=mediaFull]
::::What about the Russians running around with FALs in MW2? or TAR 21s?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:00, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
::::: Yeah. It was really stupid too...
Inception had the MW2 dream, so you know people are going to call this the "Inception level."

[http://xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14349501/call-of-duty-treyarch-project/images/call-of-duty-black-ops-20100818054558715.html]

A) This doesn't really look like a new picture, and B) it looks like he's using 20 round mags, but with 30 round ammo pouches. (Epic fail. WTF?! I'm going to cancel my preorder this instant!)

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:32, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

== I think they did it again... ==
With the fictional flattop ARs, I mean. A screenshot of Frank Woods on the Call of Duty Wiki looks like the M16 he's holding has a flattop just like the AR Carbine. Take a look for yourself [http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100730204211/callofduty/images/6/6b/M16A1.jpg]. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:53, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

It does look like the carry handle is missing. Wouldn't surprise me if this M16 is also burst fire.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:27, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
: You are wrong. It will have burst fire ( well, you are right in that ) but it will have RIS Rails all over the place. NV Scope and lasers.... sure.

I can believe it if it has the early night optics that are as large as a professional camera. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:41, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

:Eww.. Its Treyarch. Those optics will be even smaller than they are in our days.
::Oh right, they'd just take something that DID exist and turn it into something stupid for its time and say black ops can do it [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:27, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

==Galil and KS-23 confirmed at Gamescom 2010==
http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Galil & http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/KS-23 [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
: + Makarov. But get some proper screenshots first. Those from cod wiki are terrible quality.
::Couldn`t find anything better. Well see more in the upcoming days. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::I'm impressed. I don't think I've ever seen either in a game before. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:14, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
::::KS-23 maybe, but the Galil was Counter Strike. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKtnJkjxhog Crap quality! I know, but that was the only way he could smuggle the footage. Makarov pistol around 9:50, KS-23 near end. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

:Makarov! :D, Then again we are gonna get a crapload of new Makarov "experts"--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 15:12, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
::I counter them with my Hi-Power! [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:::No! Then there will be Hi Power "experts"! Not my favorite handgun!--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:38, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

I wonder if they classify KS-23 as shotgun or rifle/ carbine.
:Given the capacity (four rounds) and the fact a lot of the available rounds appear to be grenades, maybe a grenade launcher, a Russian equivalent to the China Lake launcher. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:48, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
::The guys at Treyarch must have heard your rants about "Spetsnaz didn`t use the SPAS" and the put the KS in. [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]
:KS is yet another anachronism.
:: I think at this point that's a given. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 16:58, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
:OMG GUYS STOP IT! If you point out any more of them we`ll be walking into a soviet base with nothing more then knives and pointy sticks, forced to do roundhouse kicks every 10 seconds to conserve ammo! Treyarch means serious biznis! [[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]]

"Black Ops is said to be set in various locations, including Vietnam and Cuba, [3] and judging from weaponry and dates given in the trailer, it is set between 1960 and 2010."
I must paste it once again...[(BTW in CoD4 we had that Pripyat mission in 1995, so I guess Treyarch made another "American/English commandos in Russia after Cold War" mission)(Sorry for my crappy English)]
: It seems like you are trying to protect Treyarch´s weapons choice, right ? But dont forget that both already seen missions took place in 1968. And they had SPAS-12 and AUG......

I find it hard to believe when they say that this game will take place during the Cold War and now you say there will be a mission taking place in present day? How did you come across that information? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:47, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Info is from CoD wikia, but yeah, I forgot that in leaked video those guys had "CCCP" written on their backs, so the mission takes place before 1990s. Sorry for mistake.
: And what is even better. It has been confirmed that WMD mission takes place in 1968.

== AI Arctic Warfare ==

Man, That sucks! IW now decides to put in the awesome AI Arctic Warfare and now it doesn't even fit because it's very anachronistic in this game (as is the Walther WA 2000 and other weapons). Why was it not in the MW series? It would of fit perfectly in the first MW, it would of made more sense in the mission All Ghilled Up than the M14s because )1 it's British )2 it was available at that time (1995 right?). And it would have been far better than stupid Remington 700 in MP, I mean come on, the Remington 700 IS the M40A3! They just decided to make the scope wobble more and gave it the same damage as the .50 cal Barrett M82A1 WTH! MW2's main menu art even has a sniper with AI AW (and also a soldier with a SCAR-L) but it's not even in the game. Well, at least they put the CheyTac M200 Intervention in the game.

You seem to have overlooked the fact that this isn't an Infinity Ward game, it's being developed by Treyarch, who have no affiliation with IW. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:30, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well, they do share the same parent company, Activision. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:39, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
:Even so, I doubt Treyarch would have any say in what weapon IW would put into their game, or vice versa. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:48, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
::OK, Then I meant Treyarch/IW. By the way, did Treyarch make both MW games? I'm just making sure.
:::Treyarch had nothing to do with Modern Warfare, IW made both. Treyarch did COD5. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 10:23, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Alright thanks for clearing that up. I'm just saying it would have made more sense if IW had the AW in the MW games. As I said, it would have fit well both sense wise and realism wise.
::: "The Accuracy International Arctic Warfare rifle is a family of bolt-action sniper rifles designed and manufactured by the British company Accuracy International. It has proved popular as a civilian, police and military rifle since its introduction in the '''1980s'''." If you want the real date, it's actually 1982 when the L96A1 came into British Military service. Oh, and the Walther WA 2000 was desgined in the 1970s - 1980s and first produced in the same year as the L96A1 came into service, 1982. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 08:35, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Thank you. Didn't the mission All Ghilled Up take place in 1995? That's why I think the AW/L96 would have fit better in MW because your playing as British snipers, Price and the other guy (sorry, can't remember his name). As for the WA2000, what the hell is it doing in MW2?! it's not a Military rifle! (guess it's in there cus they thought in looked cool *sigh*). And in BlackOps, both the AW and WA2000 are highly anachronistic.

:Seriously, why can't Treyarch pick weapons that have NOT been in the previous game? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 13:35, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::I think they're trying to compromise, including familiar favorites like the SPAS and the FAMAS and putting in more obscure (at least by gaming standards) weapons like the Galil and the KS-23. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 14:31, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Who the hell is using the Israelite Galil in the this game?! I hope not the Russians.
::::They just needed to have a jew gun in the game instead of TAR.
:::::Oh course, it's that vast international Jewish video game weapon conspiracy. How could we forget? (Jew gun? What are you, a hillbilly?) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:13, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::Don't forget that most of those "Jew guns" could rip you apart, or are you forgetting the Uzi family, Desert Eagle, Jericho, and Tavors? Not to mention what they can do in the hands of Mossad. Don't make the mistake of underestimating Israel, it'll likely be the last mistake you ever make.:D -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:21, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::I don't see nothing good about those "kosher" weapons. All of them are inferior compared to western (and even russian) designs.
:::::::Great the WA2000 again, That thing is ugly, rare, and definatly not a combat rifle. IW was playing too many hitman games when they thought of that. Treyarch copying it is just really stupid.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:24, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::You gotta admit, Israels got some great weapons; this coming from a guy who loves German and Russian weapons, and also good ol' Browning's designs. :D Oh, and the big reason the WA2000 is not used in the Military is the same reason the awesome HK PSG1 is not used: it's too heavy and delicate for Military use.
:::::::::The WA2000 is a expensive and rare gun. I believe that 200 something of them were made. There are many better guns in all aspects than the WA2000. Its not just that its too delicate, its expensive, bulky, and rare. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::::::::::Name a few?
Somebody needs to stop learning everything they know from movies and games. Open your eyes, or maybe you should just go back to your Klan rally. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 20:24, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
:My facts about guns are only based on REAL LIFE information, never games or movies. (by the guy who started the AW discussion)

::Should make an account and sign your posts, easier that way.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:39, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

You should also get me some "real life" statistics that PROVE beyond a doubt that Israeli designs are "inferior." -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 14:22, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:Are you a hater like that guy who hates the Beretta 92? Oh and thanks FIVETWOSEVEN, I will consider making a account. :)
::Not at all, I happen to love the Beretta 92, I think it's one of the best handguns ever made. I just don't like when people make biased statements like that without giving a reason to back it up. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:44, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
:::I was talking about a guy on the Beretta 92 discussion page that hates the 92 for no real reason. and what IS wrong with the Uzi, Jericho, and the Tavor? What "facts" do you have that make these weapons "inferior"? Do you hate Israel or something? (note, I am not trying to rude, a jerk, or a wise-ass) The Uzi is more or less the SMG equivalent of the AK, it is simple, reliable, and cheap like the AK, the Jericho is, from what I heard, is a very good all-steel handgun, and the Tavor is a great step forward for Israel's assault weapon technologies. If I'm wrong, please tell me and prove it with real facts.
::::Correct me if I'm wrong, but you may have misread something, cuz it seems like that post was directed at me. I agree 100% with every point you just made there. -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 18:07, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::I honestly think you two have gotten confused and started arguing with each other when you both support the same position. This is why it would be much easier if everyone had an account. As to my opinion on the topic, I love Israeli made weapons. You're right about the Uzi family. It's extremely rugged, though not terribly accurate (But you can always do worse). As to the Tavor and the Jericho? I've only fired the Jericho once, but it handled great, though I still prefer the 92FS to it. And the Tavor, I love the Tavor. Honestly, if I was going into combat and I was given the choice, I'd take the TAR-21 over an M4A1 any day. I mean, the M4A1 is a great gun, but I just have a thing for bullpups. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:43, 30 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::I'm really sorry about that, my mistake, I thought you were the same guy who said "I don't see nothing good about those "kosher" weapons. All of them are inferior compared to western (and even russian) designs."

Nah, I think he ran away under our combined onslaught. xD Anywho, if it isn't signed as K, it isn't me. :) -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 14:42, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Just pitching in here but isnt the Galil what the israelis made as an improved AK-47 ? I think i heard that on the millitary channel or something (btw the price for the WA2000 these days is minimum 40 000 $ THE 2ND VERSION IS MIN 75 000 $ there was only 176 built (thank you wikipedia)--[[User:Patrickgt|℗Λ✝r][©Κ]] 04:29, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

== SKS ==
:Hopefully there will be an SKS in game because with the part of the game taking place in Vietnam, it would make sense to see it in the hands of the Viet Cong.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 21:17, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
::'''It would make sense.''' This is only and biggest reason why they wont put it in.
::As much as I agree with you, I wouldn't get my hopes up. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 22:11, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
:::Even if they include it, would anyone use it? It doesn't do anything better than any other weapon you can get in the game. As much as I like the SKS in real life, I wouldn't use one if I had an AK or an AR-15 available. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 22:16, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
Oh you silly people, even if they included an SKS they'd bastardize it with enough railmounts to drive a train on, and then make it have an attachable grenade launcher/katana/lasersight/ammo dispenser. :) -- K [[Special:Contributions/98.118.59.151|98.118.59.151]] 00:34, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
:Well. It would be RAIL with SKS attached.
: I never really had my hopes up.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 22:06, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
::If they have the correct grenade launcher on it, probably will work just like it did in WaW. Firing a round through the grenade.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:58, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:Actually, only the yugoslavian version of the SKS had the grenade launcher. Not the Russian or Chinese version that would appear in game if it is put in.--[[User:Mpe2010|Mpe2010]] 01:56, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Oh I was wrong then, never have payed too much attention to the SKS, also doesn't help that the most common seems to be a Yugo.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:41, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
: Its Romanian WASR there. So why not yugoslavian SKS ? Oh, and i think they will put it there with M203 or GP-25 on it.
::Tats not WASR but just a retarded AK-74
::: Well, i think they just googled "AK" and modelled first gun they have seen.
::::Or some crappy airsoft gun. I can't wait till a game is made where EVERY ASPECT of firearms is 100% CORRECT and not tacticool.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 19:05, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::Blame the internet then, not the 3d artists or the company. It's hard enough to find a high enough resolution orthographic picture of the gun you want to model. Sometimes you have to make do with a similar model. 3d artists just can't model a gun out of thin air, you need references to use as a backdrop during modeling, and let's face it, the artist is going to use the high res sideview of an AK-74 over a low res slightly off sideview of a genuine AK-47. As for airsoft, take note that airsoft companies often provide a perfectly aligned sideview of their guns, which works great for modeling. I'd take a 1000x700 picture of an airsoft M4 over a 400x300 picture of the genuine gun. And if you were a 3d modeler, you would too.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 02:30, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
::omgz they could check this site. Or... photograph a real deal when they were recording gun sounds. And if they for some f-ing reason left off muzzle break from AK74 that would be a fail
:::Or maybe get a real gun, don't even have to guy one, just rent or borrow one from someone that owns one. That isn't so hard is it? They did that with Lord of War with about 3,000 CZ rifles.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 14:09, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
::::Lord of War was a feature film, starring Nicholas Cage. I'm sure they had a lot more money than the average game does. Why pay extra money on something that isn't integral to the quality or enjoyment of a game? Besides, airsoft guns are relatively cheap, and a number of companies sell full metal near exact(and exact in some cases) copies of the real weapons. But ultimately, if you can't look beyond an Mp5's lack of a paddle release, you are playing games for all the wrong reasons. And really, no muzzle brake is fail? Seriously, learn to live with it. Also, most of the pictures on this site are too small for modeling accurately off of. Some are large enough, but most aren't. And not all games record real guns in person for their sounds, and some that do simply use similar models or completely different guns.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 21:00, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
:::::You do realize that this game is gonna rake in millions. They can't rent or buy a $400 AK 47?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:08, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
::::::This is not exclusive to this game. You said you wanted to see ''any'' game that got everything right. Also, Treyarch is based in Santa Monica, ''California''. If you knew anything about Californian gun laws, you would realize how difficult it would be for them to get their hands on a genuine Ak47. Besides, the 3d artists don't really get to decide how all the company's money is spent. And I doubt a higher up would care enough(for somewhat good reason) to waste a thousand bucks on a post-ban Kalashnikov that is not the correct model anyway.

:::::::Once again, they could either rent or borrow one. Doesn't even have to be an actual Russian AK 47. It would be fine if it was a Yugo, Bulgarian or whatever, they are similar enough to not be a problem. The point is going alittle further and not basing the model off a crappy airsoft gun or the wrong picture.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:10, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

:The always present problem with game designers is that they forget the extreme details on a gun and when they do CGI modeling, they always make mistakes and forget somethings. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:26, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
::I think you missed a word.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 17:11, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
== AS VAL ==
: I think it would be cool if they put the AS VAL in as a weapon of the Soviet Forces
::No.

== AKS-74U? ==

Where in Sam Hill did you guys get that from? I never saw anyone holding one in the Teaser. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:23, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

It's on that wall of guns in the insight video, and theres apparently a pic at Call of Duty Wiki with someone holding it from the teaser. If you ask me, its still not 100% confirming it --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 02:19, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

This is the image they're saying is an AKS-74U [http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:AK-74uBO.png]. Not very convincing, if you ask me, but I wouldn't put it past Treyarch as they've already failed epically by the looks of things so far. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:27, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Definatly is a short AK something.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:05, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
:Yeah, it looks like a short AK, but we can't be sure exactly what it is. Hell, it could be a full length AK at a weird camera angle. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 01:47, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

There are so many AK variants out there they can pull out of their asses, why another AK-74U? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:15, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Because I doubt they know any others and they don't want to confuse players.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:53, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

== New details released ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kg_8mPoloBo

This confirms a whole bunch of stuff, too much for me to list. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 02:10 2 September 2010 (UTC)

: Almighty, there's a mini-gun....a ''handheld'' minigun...
::Wow! I'm so pumped for spaying batches of n000bs with that thing WOW

:: Who cares?! An Ithica! And an L96! I'm in love. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 02:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:::I just watched the video...HOLY CRAP...A MINIGUN?!...Im in heaven! [[User:SeanWolf]]
:: [[Predator#GE_M134_Minigun_Handheld|"Payback Time!"]] [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 03:22, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:::New weapons we see are the WA2000, Makarov, Ithica, RPK (first in first person), MP5K (first person), Skorpion, HK21 (Awesome!), M14 (wood!), M134 (nicknamed Death Machine), M16 (first person, burst), AKS-74u, and also that new blue-tinted scope, maybe a new version of thermal? [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:09, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

You can THROW A TOMAHAWK?! That's awesome! Now if only you can melee with it... --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:16, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

== Over and Under shotgun, HK21 plus even moar footage ==
As seen in this video: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/team-deathmatch-call-of/703936

There's also more new MP footage up on Game Trailers and floating around YouTube. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:If you didn't notice, the handgun at the beginning was an ASP. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 07:08, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:This killicon, taken from this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToRG_z3ib-o looks like a full sized Uzi: http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/1143/uzi.png -The Unsigned

== Create A Class Video ==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAM5AZxmT_M

WAY too much to write, just take a look, and at his other BO vids while youre there. Also, awesome pistol selection :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 07:03, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:While looking at the Create-a-class 2.0 vid shown here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCzSImy-xm4, I found it rather odd for the choice that Treyarch was going with on the weapon selection for the pistols at the 0:23 mark. Wouldn't it make more sense to place the Makarov PM as the starting pistol because of it's weak 9x18mm cartridge? I'd personally would have liked to see it like this:

*Makarov PM
*ASP
*1911
*Colt Python
*CZ75

[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 10:52, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

== Full Weapon List ==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jatp6Fgs-ak
The video's not too interesting, most of this is stuff from other videos, the cool part is in the description. Note that he wrote MAC-11 instead of CZ-75.

SMG: MP5K, Skorpion, MAC-11, AKS-74u, Uzi, PM63, MPL, Spectre

Assault: Enfield, M14, FAMAS, Galil, AUG, FAL, AK-47, Commando, M16, CLASSIFIED (There's actually no M1 Garand)

Shotguns: Olympia, Ithica 37, SPAS-12

LMG: HK21, RPK, M60

Sniper Rifles: Dragunov, WA2000, L96A1

Pistols: ASP, M1911, Makarov, Python, CZ-75

Launchers: M72, RPG-7, Strela, China Lake

M202 & M134 are apparently Kill Streaks and personally I think the Classified AR is the G11

:ASP seems like an odd choice to put in a CoD game. Relative to the game, it seems like they went out of their way to put in a pistol that isn't that much different in function to a Makarov. (A small pistol with a small magazine.) Why not just a Walther P1? Or a SW M39? Looking down the sights of the guttersnipe will be interesting though. And I again applaud Treyarch for bringing in guns that have been otherwise neglected in gaming. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:58, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I don't know if these are all the weapons or if there are less in this public version, though since it is a full reveal and they make sense how they are, it's reasonable to assume these are all of them. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

EDIT: The KS-23 isn't on the list for some reason, meaning this build may not have all the weapons, or the person who made the list simply missed it as it is the only known weapon not there. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 09:55, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Someone found a screencap of the ingame M60. http://a.imageshack.us/img834/7093/m60j.jpg

::I don't think the M202 or the M134 are Killstreaks as if you look at the "Create a class" video above around the 0:36 mark it lists all the Killstreaks. As far I've seen in the trailers, the M134 is rather ironically called "Death Machine", so it might just be a high level machine gun class weapon that the user has to buy. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 13:28, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

: I think the M202 and M134 might only be in the "Wager" game modes, were everyone has a chance to earn one.

== Seriously.... ==

This is going to be worst CoD game. Minigun ? Flamethrower attachment ? Jesus . Even most stupid game from most stupid studio with most stupid gameplay will be better than this shit.

: If you say so.

Whatever you say, man, and what's wrong with a flamethrower attachment? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:48, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Its completely idiotic.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:32, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:I think it sounds fucking AWESOME. No, it won't be realistic. But it's rule of cool, brohan.-protoAuthor 11:00, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, once you get over the fact that this game is inaccurate as hell, it starts to look pretty badass [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 11:38, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Peh, I'm past the point of even expecting this to be a realistic game. I'll enjoy it for what it is, but there's no way in hell that we're getting realism out of this. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:46, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

. reality and videogames are like an amish hacker , never gonna happen . this is going to be FUCKIN EPIC . simmons 8492

== Iron sights ==

Whats with all the guns having that same back sight, i was ok with the CAR 15 and even the FAMAS having it, then i thought that it was pushing it with the AUG. Then i saw that the M60 has those sights too??!!! I hear you can customuzie your sights and i hope to god you can, cause i would be pissed if all the guns had extremely similiar iron sights --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 11:43, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

'''IS WONT BE CUSTOMIZATED !''' Its just cool to have them, you dont understand ? 7-year kids / 99% of BO players ) wont even recognize M16 and M4. SO WHATS THE PROBLEM ? Epect nuclear grenade flamethrower tactical launcher screen in nearliest days.

: ...a little excited there, bro?

From what I've heard, there will be an 'improved iron sights' attachment. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:49, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

it looks like famas had a field day and fucked everything up . the pig dosent deserve that . and for all the idiots out there reading this and thinking"whats the pig, can you use farm animals as weapona" the pig is the name for the m60 , that gun hold a special place in my heart . simmons 8492

It really looks like they just took a lot of stuff from mw2 (like those god damned iron sights) and whats the deal putting Troy industries sight on an AUG? How stupid does that even look, couldnt hit shit in real life cuz there is no spacing between the front and rear post! Come on Treyarch i tough u could do better --[[User:Patrickgt|℗Λ✝r][©Κ]] 02:45, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

== Enfield ==

Has anyone else noticed then in the create a class trailer when he goes in to primary weapons it says enfield ? anyone wanna put that up ?

:I would but it's too little info to draw a conclusion on what EXACTLY "Enfield" is. It could be the SA80 but at the same time it could be something else, it's best to hold off for now until more info shows. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 15:50, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Yeah, it is most probably a SA80 but it can also be the L1A1.--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 15:55, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

::When I saw Enfield, I had assumed it would be the EM-2. When was the last time anyone referred to either SA-80 or L1A1 as an "Enfield?" I google in "enfield prototype," and a picture of the EM-2 is the first thing that comes up. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:01, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Ya id say its going to be the EM-2 because on the killfeed for a teamdeathmatch i saw there was a weapon that looked like it

If not the EM-2, it could be one of the Enfield SA80 prototypes (E60-, XL70-...etc) - Enfield did start the SA80 program in the late 60's so it could be possible for them to show up. It might also explain why Treyarch had that airsoft L85 on their wall.

It's an XL64, at least according to the create-a-class picture. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 17:06, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I think - not sure though - in the multiplayer overview video, at 6.41 to 6.49, it is possible to view the Enfield with iron sights in first person - it has the SA80 type rail, a green-ish cheek rest on the left of the reciever and a green-foreguard. I could be mistaken though. If someone could get the screen shots up for closer inspection, it might be easier to tell. [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

You mean like [http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/File:L85_7.png this?] [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 19:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Bingo! You can see the real SA80/British 'dovetail' 19mm optics mounting rail (under those weird iron sights...)Cheers [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

It's the XL64 for sure, saw it in the video a couple sections down ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 20:53, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Which is the same video I pulled the create-a-class image from in the first place. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:00, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Yeah... not my best moment there, lol. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 04:21, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

== Burst M16? ==

When I saw the recent multiplayer trailer, I coulda sworn that the M16 was firing in 3 round bursts. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:57, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:It was, and while idont mind it being Burstfire, i do mind that they call it the M16 Raffica.--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 17:03, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Well I do cause there's no such thing as a burst firing M16A1. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:In the Black Ops world there is. GET WITH THE TIMES EXCALIBER!!!!1--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:11, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

And why should they call it the "Raffica"? (I know it's Italian for burst, but whatever.) [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 18:17, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

On the extended trailer thing on the xbox dashboard there is a Burst M16 and its called M16 raffica

A burst M16A1 is stupid. Havent these guys seen a Vietnam era movie? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:22, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

I agree it's stupid, but I suppose it will help make up for all of those full-auto A4s that are in every single movie. ;) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 05:41, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

First off, FIVETWOSEVEN, what does "get with the times" have to do with anything? That made no sense. In the Black Ops world, they operate outside of ordinary methods of operations and tactics. They go into extreme conditions and use the best equipments they can get their hands on but as I said before, they don't acquire guns that havent been invented yet and the military mentality of soldiers back then are different than they are now. A soldier during the Cold War would see any new technology pointless instead of an advantage because of the training and mentality, the if it isn't broken, don't fix it. Special Forces were no exception. Sure they were outside the ordinary, but they wouldn't have just say "hey, I want a gun that can do the following thing, can I have one? If it doesn't exist, I'll just get a gun smith, invent the parts and materials and make it exist." That's not how things work in real life. Yes this is a game and I've just given up on trying to convince people otherwise. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

:*WHOOSH* That was the sound of the obivious sarcasm flying over your head.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:31, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:I think he means it's now obvious Treyarch doesn't care, so why fret over it? Short of some weird plot twist that we're currently unaware of (and again, we know absolutely nothing about the plot,) Treyarch simply doesn't seem to care about historic or technical accuracy. They're selling games to kids and stoners, not history buffs and gun dorks. After seeing all the recent videos, I'm resigned to the fact that all we're going to get is a vastly enjoyable game with a lot of replay value. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 00:53, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Remember, it's still full-auto in Singleplayer, as it should be. It's just 3-shot burst in MP so it doesn't make pot-head COD kids heads explode. Also, where do they call it the M16 "Raffica"? In the Create a Class videos they're listed simply as M16. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:36, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh it's only burst in multiplayer? Good. In multiplayer, anything goes. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:28, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Another video ==

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G94SolEtpnc]

You get the see the M14 stock, the Enfield, and it confirms the G11 (There's a contract called "G11 Cruelty." --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:13, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

:Ah, that would explain that one single classified weapon. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 21:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
:Looks like they're leaving a lot of old stuff in - killstreaks, perks, sentry guns, weapons.
::As opposed to a CoD game without weapons? [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:54, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

== A Question about guns ==

Do you think there are any possibilities of Daewoo K1A or K2 appearing in this game?

I think its about time some major game has put in guns made in Asia.

K2 is a really accurate rifle, it could serve as the 'ACR' of this game and K1 can be like MP5K or UMP of this game
:[[Men of Valor]] had a Type 56. Does that count? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 20:14, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

We've already seen all the guns that are going in game. So quite slim chances there. Also, sign your posts. [[User:The Wierd It|The
Wierd It]] 08:56, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

: I don't think we've quite seen all of them. We've seen all of the Assault Rifles and Handguns, and only some of the LMG's, SMG's, Sniper Rifles, and Shotguns. And that video a few sections up with supposedly all of the weapons in the game in it's description, is most likely incomplete. I seriously doubt there are only 3 sniper rifles. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:41, 4 September 2010 (UTC)
::Didn't people doubt only 4 sniper rifles with MW2?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 04:30, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

: Perhaps, but they only needed 4 to fill out the basic sniper rifles roles of COD. A bolt-action, a large caliber, a jack-of-all-trades, and a low recoil-low power. But with only 3, and moreso because of the 3 that we've seen, we should expect more, because so far we've only seen the bolt-action and two normal semi-auto sniper rifles that shouldn't be all too different from each other. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 05:33, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

==FAMAS correction==
That's not a G2 FELIN, it's a F1 FELIN prototype. The one in the screenshots is based off the F1 model (note the small triggerguard and straight magazine). The G2 FELIN platform is based off of the FAMAS G2 and is distinguishable by the sheer massive amount of stuff strapped to it.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 18:47, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

All the photos of the G2 FELIN I've seen have the small trigger guard. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:57, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7f/FAMAS_Felin_501556_fh000002.jpg [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:16, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

==Unknown Machine gun or Assault rifle?==
[[Image:Codbp_uklmg.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
Here is a picture seen in new multiplayer tralier.

:It's a HK21. Watch in HD, it says in the bottom right. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:57, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

==Unknown rocket launcher guide missile==
I seen in new multiplayer tralier.

The only thing I've seen that sounds like that is the 'Arch Angel' killstreak weapon, a missile guided by the player via a camera. (Similar to the Predator guided missile from Modern Warfare 2's killstreaks except that 'Arch Angel' appears to be a shoulder-fired system) [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

Thank for information guy.In cod wiki they call "Valkyrie Rockets".
http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Archangel
[[User:Tanarmy|Tanarmy]]

== Flamethrower ==
I seen few second on enemy hand in new multiplayer tralier.

:It's an underbarrel attachment, too. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:54, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

== Grim Reaper? ==
In the wager match video, after the player gets a kill with the WA2000, you see him switch to something called the grim reaper but you never get to see what it is, any ideas?
:It's what they've dubbed the M202. It's kinda like how they called the M79 the Thumper. As I recall, the M202 is a killstreak reward. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:54, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Yeah aparently this game has several 'super weapons', but I'm not sure of the context of their use. But surely they won't be unlockable for custom classes, the "Death Machine" had a 400-somethin round belt.

::: The Death Machine (M136) and Grim Reaper (M202) are obtained from care packages now. Also, sign your posts. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:32, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

in the same video they show parts froma game called "gun game " the player swaps the M14 for the m136 . im gonna go all jessie ventura up in that bitch . simmons 8492

== Opinions on the game so far ? ==

I know everyone is going to have a different opinion but i personally think this game is gonna be the worst one yet. The weapons,the attachments,the killstreaks look so bad and the game is just gona be filled with little 10 year olds who only quickscope and camp! The next one by sledgehammer games sound better! Anyone else agre? -- GunGunGun
::I haven't seen anything about the sledgehammer installment. Is there anything out there? I just know that officially, what's left of IW is still working on MW3. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:00, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
: Call Of Duty is dead since MW2. Last good one was CoD5 ( ''But it wasnt nothing more than good'' ). So i dont expect things get better after Black Ops. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 09:59, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
: Considering that there's been no news at all on the Sledgehammer Games one yet, I have no idea how you could know that it will be better. Sounds like you, like some others here, are just angry that the guns and add-ons in the game make no sense for the era rather than whether or not it's fun to play. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 18:31, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
::The guns don't make sense at all, not just because of the era. I mean flamethrower attachments, handheld miniguns, the same rear sight on many guns, 20-round mags holding 30 rounds, semi-auto shotguns impossibly cycling with dragonsbreath ammo. Before MW2 the Call of Duty series was known for its accuracy and attention to how the guns really work, as well as the weapons for the time periods the games take place in. And GunGunGun has a point, it's just going to be the same chaotic multiplayer as MW2, a bunch of stoners and kids making themselves feel better by corner camping, tubing, and quickscoping. Treyarch only seems to have done things to promote those playing techniques, not discourage them like they should. -Mandaloin
::: Cry some more then? It's pretty obvious that you don't like the gameplay style. There are many, MANY gamers out there that would disagree with your tastes, and those are the ones that Treyarch is aiming to please (along with those on the fence over some of MW2s perks/killstreaks which were changed for the better). So what if it's not all realistic, the key point in a video game is if it's any fun to play or not. Last I checked, I couldn't actually survive crashing a Ferrari at 100MPh at Laguna Seca either, but it is sure as hell fun to play a game that allows me to get back up and try again without it being "game over" for me. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Meh, quit complaining, it's a video game. If you want realism go play ARMA or Operation Flashpoint. It does look better than MW2, that I will say. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 21:41, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

I just love how people can criticize a game, when yet, they haven't even played it. [[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]] 21:43, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
:I just love how people keep saying that. We don't have to play it to criticize what we've already seen of it. -Mandaloin
:: Yeah, you kinda do. If you have not actually sat down and played this game, you're only assuming it's gonna be bad by just looking at it. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 06:46, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Medal of Honor pwns Call of Duty in every way. ''That's'' my opinion of Black Ops. Anyone who doesn't like it can go cry a river. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:13, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

== PM-63? ==

Where did we see that? [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 13:29, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

:[http://blackops.digitalwarfare247.com/weapons/sub-machine-guns/pm63].--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 16:27, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== Unknown SMG ==

[[Image:MPLdual.png|thumb|none|450px|]]

: They look like MPL's to me, and those are said to be in this game so I'm betting that's what they are. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 23:33, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
::Those don't look anything like MPLs. It's probably something we haven't seen yet. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 02:35, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
:::Actually, I found this picture under Walther MPL on COD: Wiki, but I thought they looked nothing like MPLs, so I decided to put it as unknown and see if someone else knew what these were. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]]
:They kind of look like Arsenal Shipkas. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

The weapons in this game may be achronistic as hell, but at least they made them interesting, most of the weapons on the page right now are things you don't see much of in games or even movies, especially nowadays, there's even this, a gun we can't seem to identify with a clear first-person shot of both sides of the gun. I've gotten bored of knowing every gun in a game when I first get it, so, regardless of whether this game turns out to be good, which I hope it is, at least the weapon selection is nice and original, especially for a modern mainstream FPS. :D [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:51, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well I just went through the entire world.guns SMG database and the only thing that looks remotely similar to this is the Walther MPL, so if it's not a souped-up version of that than I don't know what it is. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 15:19, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
:::Nothing is in the right place. Either it's something else, or the modelers were told some other gun was an MPL and they didn't know any better. Did anyone else notice the icon on the left in the feed? Maybe it's whatever that's supposed to be. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:42, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Maybe they're just modified Skorpions? [[User:Tanaj|Tanaj]] 15:45, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

i also went through the world.guns database and figured is could be a OTs-02 Kiparis http://world.guns.ru/smg/kiparis2.jpg
:Nice find, I agree. Wow, they must've dug pretty deep. I don't see how it'd be possible for this to be a modeling mistake, as I would think it's much harder to find one of these than an MPL. The above link doesn't work, here it is again. [http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg04-e.htm] --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 11:33, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well whatdaya know, the one I missed. Good find. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:11, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

They are Skorpians in 9x18mm without the stocks. Looks awesome to me.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 00:29, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

: We've already seen what the Skorpions look like, these look alot like that OTs-02 Kiparis --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 00:41, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

== KS-23 ==

The KS-23 isn't 12 gauge, it's 6 gauge or something like that. I know that it's 23mm, which is not 12 gauge, so that should probably be changed. --[[User:ColonelTomb|ColonelTomb]] 00:58, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

According to Wikipedia it's 6.27 gauge by American standards and 4 gauge in Euros. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 08:59, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Ummm how are they going to balance that? I'm assuming that a 6.27 gauge packs a hell of a lot more lead than a 12 gauge so I'd take a guess that it would probably be pretty powerful --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 22:41, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

:I presume the KS-23 is likely to have heavy recoil, small capacity (3 rounds) and a delay between shots. Also can't the KS-23 also function as a Grenade launcher as well firing firing a variety of shells such as Tear Gass, Flash Bang and White Phosphorous? I would marry Treyarch if they finally added Slugs to this baby! [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:13, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Draco i think your my new friend. JK. i always wondered why they never put chokes or slugs as attachments for guns in video games.-[[User:SargeOverkill]]

::They have added slugs to some games. But to name few, Bad Company 2, Fallout: New Vegas and STALKER are one's that come to mind, though I don't think even the majority of game designers (save for a small collection of the minority) that know what a Choke on a shotgun even is. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 15:43, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

== Stoner 63? ==

Hey Guys, I believe I've identified what seems to be a Stoner 63 fitted with some sort of telescopic scope, in this video: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOAAWWjfG_g]
--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 08:14, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Looks like a AR-18 but don't we have the full assault rifle list?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:55, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

: It's not an AR-18, the recievers don't match. It looks more like the 63, although it doesn't appear to have the ventilated barrel housing. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:32, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

After actually looking at a 63, this gun looks like it.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 02:10, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

[[Image:Stoner63-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Stoner 63 in rifle and LMG configuration.]]
[[Image:COD7Stonerpossible.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Here's a screencap from gameplay footage of the possible Stoner 63. Compared to the stock image I'd say it is.]] . - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Reflex sights==
Just wondering about the reflex sights, were they even developed back during the periods the game is set in? Another thing I was curious about is that the M4 Spectre in the list shows it having a reflex mounted on it. While it is using a side-mount, wouldn't the stock get in the way if you try to fold/unfold it since it folds to the top of the gun?--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 14:41, 12 September 2010 (UTC)
: '''1,''' Yeah, i am almost sure reflex sight existed during cold war. There is even patent on internet, dating it into seventies.
: '''2,''' All SMG´s have apparently stocks removed for some reason. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 15:50, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

==Not exactly on topic==
Alright, I am having a pretty bad day with dealing all the crap my professors are throwing at me and then my roommate says something that is kinda pissing me off so I am gonna rant a little bit. Last night(this early morning actually, around 1), he decided not to do his homework and decided to watch a show about snipers and the amazing feats they pulled off including one about Hatchcock. It was pretty interesting until he ruined it after watching a sniper take out VietCongs using kentucky windage with his scoped (now busted) m14 after his helo was shot down by saying, "So what, I don't see how that is impressive, I can do that all the time in Modern Warfare 2." Now he wants to go buy Black Ops when it comes out because he wants to "pwn some noobs" and all the feature look really realistic just like in MW2. He goes on to say that he wants to become a Ranger because he thinks it is easy enough since he is smart since he was on a debate team, ran for state assembly, etc. and strong because he can do MMA and finishes that with he can drink a lot beer. I give him credit for having the balls to join the Rangers but at the same time, it feels like he is insulting them. Sorry for writing all this but I was having a shitty day and just had to let is all out and I figured it since he was talking of COD, that I would put it here. Alright, rant over, feeling much better now. --[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 15:43, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh boy, is actual real military service gonna shit on his cereal, lets see just how easy pwning noobs is when your actually getting shot at, oh and apparently theres this thing called recoil in reality, suprising i know. Oh and no respawns either. On an actual related note this game is gonna suck, I do love the return of the 1911 to COD i just can forgive the erronious amounts of just horrendous anacronisms, and the flamethrower undermount is so retarded --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 02:10, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Here's a fun idea, hand a CoD fanboy an AR-15 with the bolt locked back, hand them a magazine, and tell them to fire it. See how long it takes them to realize that the weapon isn't magically ready to fire just because you slap in a fresh magazine. You get five points for every ten seconds it takes before they realize what the bolt catch is. You get bonus points if they pull the charging handle.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 06:01, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Brilliant! Oh and pop that elusive saftey on too, just for good measure.--[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 09:52, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd be impressed if they would give the back stock a flat slap after loading a fresh mag and charged the gun like a real badass.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 12:46, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Even better would be actually getting through the first phase of basic to even hold a weapon.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 21:19, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd be even more surprised to find a gamer doing a proper tactical reload, instead of letting a mag drop to the ground and becoming confused as to why it doesn't magically appear back in his pouches.

first of id slap the shit out of your roommate , the second he hit basic hes gonna be crying for mommy shitting him self , and i cant wait for the m1911 to make its return .simmons 8492

==Kinda liking the weapons list==

Well, they are things you never see in other games, although the awp and famas and spas12 can go, and id love the a1 to be full auto. But, a revovler that makes sense, old school submachine guns, a pump action grenade launcher its kind of cool.

I do wish they didn't decided the nearly the same weapons from the other MW series like the AUG, SPAS-12, or the MP5K. They could have picked other pump action shotguns like the Remington 870, or another weapon aside from the MP5K. They should have stuck with the full size MP5. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:44, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
:Well, they do have the Ithaca 37. And at least the AUG is a rifle and not a LMG in this one. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 15:18, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I do know most of these guns really shouldn't exist but you can believe I will have a ton of fun with the under-barrel flamethrower with a smily face reflex sight on the G11(they better not mess up the G11).--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 21:15, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

At this moment, I am not bothered about weapons that don't exist at the time, but more on original choices. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:17, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

:Kinda of agree with you there, sorta disappointed though that they made the M16A1 burst fire in Multiplayer. Though it's hard to say exactly when all these guns appear, while yes we were told it was starting in Vietnam but IT could possibly star in other timezones too. From what I've gathered, you play as multiple characters so it's possible you could play as multiple characters in different time periods, 1 in Vietnam, another in Cold War and maybe a few fictional war zones in the early 2000's [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 08:10, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

:: Well, it seems that original M16 without forward assist is in game. Anyway - As far as i know M16A1 fired in 3-round bursts, no ?
:::The A1 is full-auto. The A2 and A4 variants fire bursts. [[User:Ramell|Ramell]] 10:10, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

I dont like how they use the correct 20 round mag model but make it hold 30. Hopefully the burst/30 rounds is online only, like in cod 4 where the m16 was full auto SP but burst MP.

== CZ75 ==

JUst curious, does anyone think that the CZ-75 might be the Automatic version of the weapon. Granted Treyarch wasn't going to add Machine Pistols but since it's the last handgun in the list and it costs 750 credits would it be possible? I mean Bad Company 2 had their 93R as their last unlock which was a machine pistol [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 08:28, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

: Well, it doesnt have to be automatic. CZ-75 is superior to all other handguns from list in real life.( maybe besides Colt Python ) - Its better than Makarov, ASP and even M1911 in all "stats" . Its probably best 9mm handgun.

::Not too sure as to how it would be better than a .45 caliber 1911. I can see it being better than the ASP or Makarov due to their small magazines of 7-8 rounds compared to the 75's 16 (9mm). Of course it does open the slight possibility that an Automatic conversion kit is available as an attachment [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:05, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
::: Its not just about calibre or mag capacity. CZ-75 is more accurate, bullet is faster and i think its lighter. Anyway - Its sure that heavier cartrigde is allways better :) But i would take CZ75 to combat instead of M1911.

:Maybe the developers just read a lot of Gunsmith Cats, and took Rally's speech to heart, but the possibility that it may be an automatic makes me sigh. I hope it isn't.-protoAuthor 16:08, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Firstly, The CZ-75 is not more accurate than a 1911
Secondly, there is no "best" 9x19 millimeter pistol, its all personal preference,
Thirdly, the .45 is a better combat round due to its lager grain bullet and more dispersion of energy on contact,
and Lastly, while caliber is not the most important factor, the .45 A.C.P is superior to the 9x19mm because the 9 is a small lightweight bullet, while the .45 is a large heavyweight bullet.
P.S. sign your posts.
~~ PunisherDave
: Well, i tested both CZ75 and 1911. I was doing better with CZ. Anyway - I would take it into combat because of for example mag size. And 9mm bullets are way much more common... --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 13:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Military 1911s almost universally sucked, with ultra loose fitting parts and 7 pound triggers, and nearly useless sights. 1911s in the civilian world, or the uber built special forces 1911, are nice. But your average GI 1911....not so. Im sure a cz75 would kick its ass in accuracy and reliability if you wanted to use more than ball ammo.
~~k9870
: Ágreed. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 13:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Those old 1911's had one thing going for them though, there was a hell of a lot of abuse you could put them through before they malfunctioned. Reliability is a factor. I'm not saying the CZ isn't reliable though, don't get me wrong. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 17:24, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

It was once said "the colt 45 will drop a charging bull dead in its tracks, but good luck hitting it.

Haha, while I do know (note how I'm just basing what I say off of research, so I am open to corrections. Hopefully one day I can fire a 1911 and CZ to really know the differences)that the old GI 1911's were often maligned for their lack of accuracy, I've also heard people say it isn't that big of a deal considering that it is a handgun. In a military capacity, the pistol is there when shit gets up close and personal and you need to defend yourself. When the guy is close enough that you can see the whites of his eyes, I'm sure you're not gonna have to be a deadeye to land shots on target. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 18:21, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
:My buddy's father was a Marine in Vietnam, and at least according to him, a lot had to do with the fact that their M1911s were just really old and worn. I would think that WWII production of M1911s would've been more enough to supply US forces for decades. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:29, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Ive heard they manuactured no new 1911s after ww2, and that they just swapped parts, keeping frame and slide. They were loose fitting, and rattled in holsters. a 7 pound single action trigger, and the sights are just awful, especially against a dark background, cheap 3 dot sights would be better. problem is when people think "1911" they think of the sweet modern ones. To be fair, military berettas are beat to hell too, and have known countless people to say the sights were misaligned, magazines had weak springs, etc.
The cz-75 though, this is the first time ive seen it in a game, its pretty cool. I cant wait to use it, im sick of the beretta being the staple 9mm.
-k9870

Misaliged sights are from them getting knocked around and is easily fixed, worn mag springs is through use and they are easily replaced.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:33, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

It is true that no new 1911's were purchased after World War 2. The same .45's that were on G.I's hips in Europe and The Pacific were being carried by U.S troops during the Gulf War in the 1990's. I've heard that the quality of the 1911's varied from gun to gun. Some were actually were in decent shape while others were just horrid. I don't believe they all suffered from the problems that K9870 is saying. Although I admit the standard sights on those guns are just awful, Most of the time I can't even make out the front post. A lot of soldiers I've read actually preferred a 1911 to the M9 and carried it when possible. [[User:ShootingLiberal|ShootingLiberal]] 22:37, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

I dunno about the automatic thing... I myself have only heard of the machine pistol variant of the CZ-75 until very recently, plus I don't think it has a place in media history as a well-known variant of the CZ-75 (much less the CZ-75 itself, outside of [[Gunsmith Cats]]), so I don't know how Treyarch could know about it. Most of the guns they got ideas for the game from are the airsoft guns they had in their office, and last I checked no one makes an airsoft automatic CZ-75. So I would bet my money on that this is just the game's Desert Eagle - the pistol that outshines the rest (and it's about time! The CZ-75 is very underused in the media, IMO). [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 09:23, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Actually I'm thinking that the Python is gonna be the Power Pistol of this game followed by the 1911. The CZ is probably gonna be the 9mm hi cap of the game.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 10:52, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

I hope they dont neuter it for "balance" and that it is awesome, who cares if they need to balance with the makarov and asp? When you buy better guns, they should actually be better, not just change one stat for another.

==asp==

was the asp pistol any good or even used much? It seems the grips would be slippery and the sights are weird.
-k9879
:According to a random site I found, it wasn't used much. Originally, only 100 were produced, and if they are still produced, they are produced only on a pistol-by-pistol basis by custom gunsmiths or shops or something along those lines. The grips were smooth because the original designer intended it to be the ultimate concealed carry pistol, and the smooth grips helped this keeping the chance for the hand to snag on the grips while pulling, aiming, and firing to a minimum. In addition, the sights are weird but when aimed through, due to the design of the sight which employed fluorescent panels, would point at the target when properly aligned, making it easier to shoot reflexively. -Chris Hun7er 23:42, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

It is a S&W Model 39 which was a really good pistol. It looks as though its in the game because of the size of the Makarov. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:34, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

== The Over-Under Shotgun ==

The Over-Under Shotgun AKA "Olympia", seems to be based off of a Browning Citori XT shotgun. I don't have a screenshot of the gun ingame (It was on the ground, and in HD, but the page was protected so I couldn't save it). But I am pretty sure that the Browning Citori XT is the real-life inspiration for the Olympia.

==Snubnose more accurate?==

What game designers brilliant idea was this? i could understand faster switch or something, but higher accuracy?

I think they were too stupid to make the snubnose version default and a 6" barrel an attachment. --[[User:Xarex|Xarex]]

A 4 inch python is a great service handgun, they should just have 4inch standard, the 6 inch a slower draw but more accurate, the snubby less accurate but faster draw, and unlocks like a nickle finish, different grips, pimp it out however you please.

I can't think of any reason why anyone would think that a snub makes it more accurate, this is just stupid.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:30, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

On the COD wiki it shows the stat page ffor snubnose, down one bar power, up one accuracy.
k9870
:It could be that one of the developers mixed it up by mistake, if its not a mix up..... then why bother making videogames with real guns anymore if Treyarch is just going to make up stuff. --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 08:11, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

::A snub nosed revolver has less power AND accuracy than a full size revolver.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 10:47, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

:::I mean in a video game sense (balance over realism), wouldn't a shorter barrel logically mean less accuracy? Sorry if what i said earlier sounded like i wanted Treyarch to make the game like real life. I just meant that Treyarch would be messing with logic to make a shorter barrel mean higher accuracy. --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 12:41, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

== Black Ops Zombies weapons ==

For those that are wondering, this is the "teaser" trailer for Black Op's Zombie mode www.gknova6.com

So far the weapons I can see and identify are the HK21E, Ithaca M37 Trench Gun, a sniper rifle that looks similar to the design of an Artic Warfare Super Magnum and a tricked out AK variant.

Also it seems we may have Zombies in modern arenas like Office complexes and Labs [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 06:59, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

== Makarov with target sights. ==

I just noticed that the Makarov has target sights instead of the Military sights. That definatly seems wrong for Military use.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:43, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Military sights suck, im sure special forces would replace them.

Maybe but as I recall they didn't have target sights back then, plus they are Dropped by the Russians so they would have the military sights. They aren't that bad by the way, I have personal experiance with them and they are fine.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 00:24, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

Saw on COD wiki "upgraded iron sights" as an attachment.

==Strela-3 Missile launcher! Latest Trailer!==
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0_r4-eTmlA 1:10 "Vehicle Lock-On Only". Also whats that gun at 2:03, it makes me confus
--[[User:Orita Md.41|Orita Md.41]] 17:04, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

==Who Wants to Ice Castro?==
Apparently you can do it, and there's even an achievement for doing it in one shot!
http://www.gamesradar.com/xbox360/call-of-duty-black-ops/news/call-of-duty-black-ops-achievementstrophies-reward-you-for-murdering-monkeys-and-fidel-castro/a-20101001104021980032/g-20100430155437473001
[[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 18:35, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

tell ya what , if you can do that cuba is gonna be pissed . simmons 8492
Oh, oh, I DO!!! :D [[User:Young Gun]]

== Clues from leaked Achievements list ==

Full list here. SPOILERS! [http://planetcallofduty.gamespy.com/View.php?view=CODBOGameInfo.Detail&id=2]

:-The player gets to use TOW missiles in the game.
:: MP killstreak list is more than few days old.
:-It's DEFINITELY alternative history.
:: That was clear.
:-The Grim Reaper is in the campaign somewhere.
:: Seen already in one of first trailers.

--[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:41, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

== Found a PSG1 ==

[http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101001181628/callofduty/images/f/f9/Psg1better.jpg Here], to the right of the G2 --[[User:Ghostdigga|Ghostdigga]] 19:17, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

: '''Oh. My. God'''. 2000 Famas with flamethrower and M16 handguard. I beg it would sound crazy month ago. Looking forward MoH much more. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:56, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
:Sharp eye, dude. You have my respect. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 19:13, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

== PM-63 RAK ==

@ 2:04 in the new trailer here: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0_r4-eTmlA] Looks like a PM-63 RAK
[[Image:BO Unidentified.JPG]]--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 01:54, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

:He he, monkey.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 02:31, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

== Galil ==

Hey guys, found an ingame image of the Galil, head over to the Black Ops page to see it --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 09:14, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

== Explanation for Impossibly Inaccurate Weapons ==

It is possible that the explanation is that not all of this game is 1968. By looking at www.gknova6.com viral ad site for black ops, reading the trophy/achievemnt list, and by piecing together all the nova-6 gas based missions I believe that one of the playable characters will be killed or severely wounded in the Bay of Pigs Invasion in Cuba(due to the Sacrifice tropy found on the list at http://planetcallofduty.gamespy.com/View.php?view=CODBOGameInfo.Detail&id=2). The Gk Company or the Russian goverment then has him revived or recovered to relate what happened with his Ops in the year 1993(www.gknova6.com) or 2010(reveal) at Rebirth Island(Vozrozhdeniya Island) home to the Russian Microbioligical Warfare Unit(source wikipedia). This is not fannon look at the all the raw info of GKNOVA, the mission objectives of sevarel missions, and this GKNOVA6 Web site. Sorry for the long windedness but hopefully you will all understand.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 17:46, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

So...how does any of this new information explain the inaccurate weapons? The missions with the weapons in question like the AR-15 and the AUG really did took place in a time when they shouldn't exist. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:20, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Its confirmed this game is alternate reality/timeline so inaccurate weapons is less of a deal.
[[User:K9870|K9870]]

I was more or less talking about way off ones like the WA2000, FAMAS Felin, Artic Warfare, and Spectre M4.Trust me Im not saying thats a good excuse for F-ing up with the CAR-15 hybrid thing and the production "protoype" AUG but that might be the excuse for the G11 and all other post 1970 weapons.--[[User:N-10 Aden|N-10 Aden]] 04:48, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Of course there's always the point that this is just a video game that has events based off of real life occurrences too... [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 03:02, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

== The Model 1887 is back ==
In before complaining. Seen in the newest trailer around the 00:42 second mark.
http://kotaku.com/5661296/a-look-at-black-ops-single-player-gameplay-and-story

Definitely a shout out to Terminator 2 there. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 02:54, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

It has been confirmed for single player campaign only, by trearch. Dunno about zombies --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:31, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Oh-ho, my friend, they are here. The best part is that the zombies are still of the Nazi variety. http://www.gknova6.com/agegate.php

:I mean dont know if its on zombies--[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 20:47, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Only in one sequence within the campaign, don't think it's in zombies --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 22:26, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

What did enough people bitch about "how unfair" it is by blaming their lack of skill on "noob guns"?
:Honestly, I can understand why people complained about Akimbo 1887s. They definitely weren't balanced, since you could fire them almost constantly by staggering your shots until you had to reload. They also had almost insane range (For a video game shotgun), and very high power. I was fine with the single 1887, but I was glad that they nerfed the Akimbos. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 17:02, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

And I hope the zombies arent nazis, i want to fight commie zombies......

:Looks more like there may be a possibility of fighting not only Commie Zombies but Vietcong Zombies and regular civi zombies too, some of those screens look like their wearing office uniforms and lab coats besides military armor. In some ways I'm glad the 1887 is in singleplayer but at the same time I was kinda hoping it would also be added in multiplayer minus the silly akimbo models, they just looked wrong in my opinion. Also sign your posts with "~ ~ ~ ~" without quotations and spaces. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 17:25, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

== The Deer Hunter ==
Looks like theres a scene in the new trailer similiar to the roulette scene in The Deer Hunter, I wonder how that will work in the game. (just a cut scene or a playable moment?) --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 03:27, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

'MOW" haha that shit gets me every time . simmons 8492
:Nips? Wow, you're doubly ignorant. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 03:25, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

*Actually, there is no proof the Vietcong actually did anything like that, and it is widely agreed among film critics that the Russian Roulette scenes are actually allegories for the American involvement in Vietnam. We also have a few Asian members on this site, so you should keep your racism to yourself. --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 01:31, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

:Well I'm not Vietnamese, so that won't offend me. Besides, sticks and stones. I'm more American than I am Asian [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:01, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

Dont want to look bad to future members, i know some is just joking but some people take everything seriously.

know what , your right . my bad guys . ill take it down. simmons8492

== Walther MPL confirmed ==

Found a video on G4 containing confirmation that the MPL SMG is in-game. For reference it's the gun painted all green http://g4tv.com/videos/49177/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops---Jungle-Multiplayer-Map-Exclusive/ [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 16:34, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

== 'Grip attachment' on Sub Machine Guns ==

I've heard that the grip attachment on SMGs in fact deploys the stock. That would explain why they all seem to be removed/folded ont the SMGs.

:This is most proven on the Skorpion, attaching a grip actually attaches the wire folding stock [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 14:24, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

==Is it just me...==

or is using the same flip up sights on every damn gun just friggin lazy?

[[User:k9870|k9870]]

It's an attachment called 'improved iron sights'. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:32, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

No, there standard in game sights. The improved adds outiline and dots to pistols, the flip up sights on guns is laz and trying to look tacticool. Even the m60 has them

And because the standard factory iron-sights for the M60 and the FAMAS, well, SUCK. I really was not a fan of the M60's irons in COD4 and the Battlefield Bad Company games. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 03:19, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
: Agreed. Kinda bugged by the repetitive sights on some guns myself, but I'm not gonna let it get me down. Most of the guns have their own, correct sights. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 08:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah, thats Treyarch development style. Put everything they want in any time etape. This game is already dead to me - actually, MoH with its 5 hour campaign is much better than MW2 and Black Ops ('' MW2 with different textures and anachronistic guns'' )
:: Wow dude, you must be from the future seeing as how you are able to form this opinion with a game that hasn't even been released yet. [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 08:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
Meh, I usually play games because they are fun. MOH was pretty realisitc, (compared to Call of Duty anyway...) but it definetly wasn't fun (online). I'll just revel in the ridiculousness of it all... Akimbo HS-10 FTW
--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 05:16, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

I just finally see these old obscure guns in games and they put lameass sights on, BTW medal of honors single player was cool (ending was abrupt and anticlimactic though) but online is glitchy and feels unpolished. I want to play COD.

Not really sure about the LAME part, but I'd rather have USABLE sights even if they aren't the originals and seem LAME in other people's eyes. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 20:46, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Is it so hard to ask for variety, im sure the stock sights are usable for a game, i may just use an AK online since it doesnt have flip ups.

Is it so much to ask them to give us variety in the same type of gun, like stock and stockless MP5 or underfolder AK. performances, it makes no difference, but I like variety in what you pick to shoot with. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 01:19, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

== *SPOILER* Zombie Mode Characters. ==

Hey, just saw the intro video for zombie mode. It seems you play as John F Kennedy, Richard Nixon, Some CIA Bloke and Fidel Castro... Heres the link:[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnbhcHCP24g]r
::That fourth guy would appear to be Robert McNamara, JFK and LBJ's Sec of Defense. Why not just LBJ? Or Bobby Kennedy? They couldn't find two voice actors to do bad Bahston/Kennedy accents? ("Er-eh, toss me another maaahg!") --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 18:52, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
Awsome.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 23:59, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

: These guys are only on bonus map that you get after finishing campaign. There are some random US sosldiers fighting Nazi Zombies in normal zombie mode. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 05:11, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Damn, i love cigars but hate commies. [[user:k9870|k987]]

Zombies better be commies, killing nazis got old i want to shoot commie zobies.

:Is it just me, or would LBJ be better replaced by LHO? (Lee Harvey Oswald.)
::Only if he could only carry three bullets at one time. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:47, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

=="escape the past"==

Its a achievemnet listed, does this imply time travel?
-k9870

Or that something one of the characters did is going to come back to bite them in the arse. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:34, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

If it's time travel I'm tearing someone at Treyarch a new one--[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:21, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

:Don't get so defensive over a title. It could be a really cool section, forcing the player to battle his way out of his hometown. Or, maybe time travel. >.> [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 23:31, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Nah I meant it all in good humour XD --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:44, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

I highly doubt that it's actual time travel. From what we've seen and has been speculated, the majority of the campaign will take place as memories of Black Ops missions that the main characters participated in. No time travel, just photographic memories. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:51, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

==New Videos confirm various unknowns==

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrNoLz4gC60&feature=mfu_in_order&playnext=1&videos=dvWBYFCAcck]

Among a few things, this video confirms that the G11 is burst fire only, and at the exceptional rate we expect. The poster has posted about many other of the weapons, also confirming that Full Auto is a pistol attachment for the CV-75. [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 20:19, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

== Golden Guns are Fugly ==

I mean take a look at this!

[[Image:Golden_PSG1.jpg‎|200px|thumb|none|Golden PSG1]]

[[Image:Golden_WA2000.jpg|200px|thumb|none|Golden WA2000]]

[[Image:Golden_Stakeout.jpg‎|200px|thumb|none|Golden Ithaca Stakeout]]

[[Image:Golden_HS-10.jpg|200px|thumb|none|Golden HS-10]]

Also, it would appear the the Ithaca M37 IS the Stakeout version and not the Trench Gun version we initially believed [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 13:39, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

:I thought golden guns were fugly before. >> [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 21:18, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

:That doesn't even look like real gold, it looks spray painted on! [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:50, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

The gold guns look terribad, probably will avoid using gold camo altogether :C --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 00:05, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:Why spend money on gun colours, when you can just buy gun attachements? :D [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 20:58, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:^ This. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:01, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Eh, still gonna make my Duke of New York class with a gold Mac-10 and a nickel (I swear I saw a nickel or 'silver' camo) Python. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:23, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:Not sure it was confirmed, I think there was rumors flying around but nothing concrete. Besides, I don't think camo patterns can be applied to secondaries, which is lame. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 09:09, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

:: Have you heard that even ACOG´s can be added on pistols ? This game is gonna suck.
:::Because the fact that you can put a scope on a high powered revolver (Something that's doable and often useful in real life) means that the game automatically sucks. Thank you for your insight. Also, sign your posts. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 16:54, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Only python can take an acog. And as to golden guns you only use them if you want to and it looks like you can do it for individual guns instead of the whole damn class its in.

The Python's recoil with the ACOG looks pretty balanced, I'm not too bothered about it. Besides, is pretty cool that Treyarch are doing something a bit different. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 17:51, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

:I just added pictures of all the golden guns, they are pretty gross. I would never waste any fake money to buy them.

==just watched zomie gameplay==

pentagon level, the zombies were amix of original nazi zombies and pentagon workers turned to zombies (were wearing shirt/tie)

Why cant they have communist zombies, seriously?

[[user:k9870|k9870]

:I guess they don't want to offend anyone who might be communist. --[[User:Chrausis|Chrausis]] 23:07, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

I still hope there's some Nazi ones left. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 23:28, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Nazis made sense in ww2, but thats been done, we want something new, commie zombies.

From what I've seen, the WaW characters are returning to fight straight Nazi zombies, JFK and friends fight Pentagon zombies in the Pentagon, and there's another with Russian zombies in Winter camo (that's shown on that GKNOVA6 website right now). [[User:Swamples|Swamples]] 04:30, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

The JFK/Nixon/Castro/McNamara level is a bonus level at the end of the game, not the actual zombies mode. The real zombies mode features some new guys in some labs (as seen on GKNOVA6) most probably russian special forces. It will include communist zombies. and the characters from W@w are in it if you buy hardened --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 11:39, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

I hope the pentagon level is 4 player co op so i can play with friends

==Interview with the military advisor==
Here is the link to the interview with the Call of Duty: Black Ops military advisor if anyone is interested in reading it. [http://www.3news.co.nz/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops-military-advisor-interview/tabid/418/articleID/185313/Default.aspx] --[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 16:13, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

:Unfortunately, that Advisor doesnt know anything about weapons. Or any kind of warfare. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 11:45, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Of course your in a position to judge him right...--[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 02:56, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
:Yes, god forbid Treyarch try and make a fun game, instead of a military simulator. Fun? What's that?! [[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 10:52, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
:: But game can be fun even with realistic weapons or good AI of enemies.
Unfortunately, Treyarch went in MW2 way and instead of making enemy AI better, they spawned twice as much of them.
:::No one says COD was ever a military simulator, but a M16/M203 turning up during the Bay of Pigs invasion would seem to be a "bit" out of place. Now that we know the singleplayer is set between 1961 and 1968, any arguments about the game taking place in some era that justifies the anachronisms has become irrelevant.

==Just putting this out there==
Does anyone else believe that now that the game's actually out and we can get higher quality screenshots, that the old low quality caps be removed? Or maybe the entire page be redone so it looks a little more consistent because you have a low quality shot from an online video then a high quality ingame cap from the game. I'm just saying it probably would look better. --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 01:33, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree that the low-quality screencaps should be removed ASAP. I'll try to post some as I go through the single-player campaign, but eventually, they too may need to be replaced. I'm running it on 960x600 with no AA for playability. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 02:17, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:This page also need screencaps from the Zombies mode. I was unable to get the Thundergun (a two-shot sound wave gun that resembles a modern rocket launcher) and the Ray gun due to the constant waves of zombies that may sneak up on you and kill you easily, large number of barriers (too many to defend), and the poor weapons you receive in the early rounds. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 20:29, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

I just finished single-player, and I've got tons of caps available. I'll try to upload that are relevant and in need later --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 04:18, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

== Impressions So Far? ==

What do you guys thinks of the game so far? My only dissapointment is that they have decided to remove the front sight when you use optics. Other than that, the guns look fantastic.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 05:36, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:I think it's alright, I haven't played campaign yet since the game is my roommate's so we've only been playing on Live. I think the only thing I'm not really liking so far is that they took away the slip-screen Special Ops. As for the guns, pretty much the same as yours along with the whole flame thrower thing, I just think it is rather ridiculous.--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 06:13, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

:Boring. SP is short, unoriginal ('' This wont matter as MoH had short SP too. But it was atleast fun. Atmospheric and realistic fun. While its boring, unatmospheric and completely unoriginal in BO'' ) . There isnt anything like AI. Too many boring scripts. To the guns : They are anachronistic and unrealistic. It feels strange encountering NVA with Spas-12. MP is same like in MW2 ('' Read - Crappy'' ) with tons of spammed killstreasks etc.
:This game deserves '''5/10''', nothing more. Oh, and do not think i have something against Treyarch. I hated MW2 too. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:00, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
I like it. SP was a bit of a mind fuck at times, and the AI could have been better, but 98% of the time I was having fun. MP is mostly good, better than MW2, though over the last 12 hours I started seeing some tubers. Yes it's anachronistic and ridiculous, but if I wanted an exact simulation of war I'd join the CF. Aside from some maps, I like it far more (In every way) than MW2. Galil w/ red dot & suppressor + 1911 w/ extended mags = awesomeness. --[[User:Crazycrankle|Crazycrankle]] 15:09, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The story is actually pretty decent, better than the sponataneous betrayals of MW2. The voice acting is also, suprisingly, very well done. I really don't play multiplayer alot, but it's more balanced than MW2. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 15:20, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The constant flashes on the screen is annoying as hell. Almost gave me a seizure. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:53, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

The campaign was a bit hard to follow at first, but it comes together nicely in the end. Yes, the weapons are ludicrous (not even ridiculous, beyond ridiculous,) but oh well, I can live with it. --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 16:30, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
:Pretty much, I'll give this game a 9.2/10. The multiplayer and content is better and improved from Modern Warfare 2, but the campaign is a bit too short (only 15 missions :() and there's some minor complicated glitches in frame rate. Overall, the game is much better than Modern Warfare 2 and a good recommendation. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 20:24, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

To be honest guys I just ignore the ancronistic weaponry as it really doesnt matter in the long run. Lets face it, saying a game will suck because theres some AUGs in the 'nam era is just plain ludacris. If Treyarch decided to stick to realistic guns of that period, we would just end up with a bunch of bland, unoriginal guns we have all seen before, making this game both an unnecisary COD sequel and just another crappy Vietnam game that flops. Now that thats out of my system I can say with all honesty that this game is very addicting and its finnally a challenge to kill people(5-6 shots for a kill rather than 3-4 shots a kill in MW2). This game is a way more fun experince than MW2 and finally shows the potential of Teyarch development team. ---P226 21:24, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

: I agree, you people take the weapons accuracy way too seriously. What the hell did you expect from a mainstream video game? The only games that are ever 100% accurate with the guns, lets face, are awful. At least this games fun. Hate it for any other reason, that's fine I'll respect that. Hate it for innaccuracies when you really should be used to by know, and that's just ridiculous. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 02:38, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
:: You and P226 have both just contradicted yourselves. On the one hand you state it's ridiculous to say a game sucks because of the guns, but then go on to say games that have accurate depictions of guns suck. If the game is fun, it's going to be fun whether the guns are accurate or not. I can't believe that if Black Ops had the correct weapons in it that it suddenly wouldn't be fun anymore. Perhaps you can give an explanation of how this would be so?
::''If Treyarch decided to stick to realistic guns of that period, we would just end up with a bunch of bland, unoriginal guns we have all seen before, making this game both an unnecisary COD sequel and just another crappy Vietnam game that flops.''
::I have to totally disagree with this statement. If Treyarch had used firearms of the period, we would have ended up with weapons that, to my knowledge, have never before been used in a video game. I have mentioned in other posts how the Remington 7188, an automatic shotgun that was really used by the NAVY seals in Vietnam could have been used in Black Ops. Instead we get the SPAS-12, which didn't exist at the time, and has been used in a million other video games. Which is the "bland, unoriginal" gun here? I'm gonna have to say the SPAS-12. Of course, if Treyarch had used the period correct shotgun the game would all of a sudden not be fun anymore and would suck, right?
::''The only games that are ever 100% accurate with the guns, lets face, are awful.'' I find this statement hard to believe. Would you care to back this up with some examples?--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 04:39, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

I never said having a game with correct guns of that period is going to be bad, I was trying to make a point that if Black Ops were to have just your standard m16's,Ak47's and colt Commando's, it would be just some normal Vietnam game. Also, all the guns above have been done to death in every video game none to man (though they are nice to have to fill in weapon slots), in my opinion I find the Galil as sweet( and different) Assualt Rifle, Ancronistic or not. If your the kind of guy who can't get over the fact that your using guns lke the AK'''74'''u and the CZ'''75''' in 1968, then this isn't the game for you. ---P226 18:47, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

:I don't know if you guys remember "Men of Valor," but it was a Vietnam FPS that came out a few years ago. It was developed by the same studio that did MoH: AA, so it felt a lot like MoH: Vietnam.) All the weapons were historically accurate, nothing was out of place, but if you've never heard of it, I'm not surprised. The game isn't bad, but it's not great, and it's flawed. The weapons were correct, but there weren't that many, and many of the weapons were just variations on the same weapon. (M16 and CAR-15, M14 and M21, and AK-47 and Type 56, and you couldn't share ammo for some reason.) Thus, you can make a game like BO that has ludicrously anachronistic weapons and have the biggest media launch of all time, or a game like Men of Valor that has historically accurate (and yes, boring) weapons and have it be unknown to the general gaming public. (You should try out Men of Valor though. If you have an original Xbox, you can get it new for a penny. It's not backwards compatible though.) --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 21:36, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

: I just might have to pick that up. And when I said the games with 100% accurate weapons suck, I didn't mean they sucked because of the guns, I meant that every game I could think of that was ultra-realistic just simply wasn't fun. No contradiction. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 00:54, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
:You all seem to say the guns don't matter, but then show your disdain for having the correct weapons in the game, as if this would somehow make it boring. ''I never said having a game with correct guns of that period is going to be bad, I was trying to make a point that if Black Ops were to have just your standard m16's,Ak47's and colt Commando's, it would be just some normal Vietnam game.'' So if Black Ops had the exact same story, but the correct guns it would just be a normal Vietnam game? Why? The story makes the game, not the guns. And there's plenty of weapons that would be correct to the period that haven't been "done to death" (HK-33 w/ 40 rd mag, used by Navy SEALS, Carl Gustav m/45, Remington 7188, the list goes on) What exactly qualifies as bland,unoriginal guns, that if they were included would make the game boring? I just get the impression from you that the only interesting guns in this game are the ones that dont' belong there. My point is that they could have had period correct weapons and it wouldn't have affected the fun factor of the game at all--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 04:00, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
::I am more bothered by the guns that didn't make the cut. Why not an M76, a Carl Gustav, a Madsen M50, or an M3 Grease Gun? Sure, they could've, but they didn't, probably on purpose. That brings leads me to what can be an interesting exercise: what would've been better weapons on each level? For the first level (the Cuban one) I would've put in an M2 Carbine and a PPK instead of the M16 and ASP. Other levels? --[[User:Funkychinaman|funkychinaman]] 04:20, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

:::You pose an interesting question, but there are actually a lot of different choices so it's one not easily answered. I agree with you on the M-2 carbine, it would be very appropriate for the Cuban level. I feel another good choice would have been one of the Czech SA series of submachine guns. If you've ever seen photos from the Bay of Pigs Invasion, you would have noticed that SA 25 quite a common weapon in the hands of Castro's forces. The FAL is actually historically correct for that level, but it's more likely that was an accident than by design.
:::I haven't played the game yet, so I'm not familiar with all the levels, but I have some general ideas of what they should have included. For pistols a Browning Hi-Power, and if Treyarch absolutely had to have a machine pistol, they could have used the Stechkin. For SMG's, the Carl Gustav M/45 standard model or suppressed version, and if not that then the Madsen M50. The SA 23,24,25,or 26, a Beretta model 12 w/ 40 round mag instead of the Spectre, maybe the MAT-49 for the NVA/Vietcong, if not the standard version then the suppressed model that was supposedly employed by NVA counter-SOG teams. If the MP-5 is going to be included then the standard MP5A3 should have been used instead of that ugly ass prototype MP5K.
:::Of course replace the damn SPAS-12 with the Remington 7188. HK33 instead of the AUG. The correct model CAR-15 instead of the flat top Commando. How about the AMD-65 instead of an AKS-74U? I think they should have axed the RPK altogether and perhaps used 2 different Russian machine guns, maybe an older model like the RP-46, and then the PK for the Spetsnaz.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 02:53, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

::: RPK instead of "''RPK''" in first level. Also AK-47 instead of "''AK-47''" in second one. Vladimirov KPV instead of Minigun would be awesome. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:51, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Also, this game doesnt suck just because of guns. It sucks because its boring, it doesnt have AI and MP is shitty just like in MW2. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:51, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

How is the MP shitty, its definitly not, It developed to be much more balanced than MW2 in every way. Although it isnt perfect,(commando lunges...)it certainly makes modern warfare 2 look like crap as a SUBMACHINE GUN....*cough*UMP45*cough* had more power and range than most assualt rifles. As for the people listing the guns that should have been in the game, all I can say is 'sure I wish they added more time appropriate guns like the Carl Gusav and the Greese Gun, but its too late now and its going to be somthing we have to live as there is no point complaining about it on the internet(not trying to say that in harsh or disrespectful way). I feel if we can all sit down , forget all those anchronisms, and just enjoy this game for what it is, a FICTIONAL cold war/ Vietnam Game. Also on a side note, I think if Treyarh were to have focused this game on Vietnam mainly, then we would have all the correct weaponry, but since there going for a 'top secret CIA' type game,they add all these ludacris guns to accomidate the feel and presence of the cold war.---P226 20:03, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

== Pistol grips ==

Anyone noticed that there isnt gun without pistol grip ? Jeez. They put one even on Mosin. --[[User:Werc|Werc]] 14:00, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

Mosin and ppsh dont have them, characters just hold them like they do.

: Maybe in first person. But mosin has actually pistol grip when its in hands of NPC´s.

No, they just hold their hand as if they were, when its on their backs or they die and drop it doesnt, its probably due to all other characters carrying pistol grips and they dont want too redo characte rmodeling.

I was taking a closer look at when they hold it (Mosin) and guess what, the world models are normal, but when they hold them they DO have pistol grips.... but i do agree, they probably didn't want to make new models. They probably put grips on them while their holding the weapon just so they didn't look even more awkward (floating hands). --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 22:13, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Not all the weapons have pistol grips. If you watch them carefully there are no pistol grips EXCEPT on Steiner's Mosin that is given to him my a Soviet soldier. It is actually modeled as having a pistol grip that is quite visable. Otherwise they do not have pistol grips on anything, it just looks like it. --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 16:00, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

== Gold weapon images ==

Do we really need all those pictures of the gold camo? [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:32, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
: Yeah. It shows how silly and disguisting tis game is.
Disgusting? It's not THAT bad, man. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 01:42, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Sign your posts. But, I agree that the gold weapon pictures are rather unnecssary. If someone has the PC version of the game, taking pictures of the standard weapons in multiplayer would be greatly appreciated.--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 20:31, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

== Semi Auto FAL ==

Since it is semi auto only, shouldn't it be renamed to the SLR? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:56, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

It has a metric reciever and handguards but a SLR-style flash hider... Its a Franken-gun but nowhere near as bad as MW2's FN-FAL was...--[[User:Mattatack92|Mattatack92]] 00:59, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

== Snub-nose ==
Could the effect of this actually reduce the visual recoil of the Python, allowing you to fire off your next shot faster, and thus make it "more accurate"? --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 16:56, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

But wouldn't it instead exacerbate recoil, without the weight of the barrel to mitigate it? If anything, a snub-nose would make the recoil more pronounced, and thus less accurate for quick follow-up shots.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 23:13, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Huh.....looks like I really suck at gun physics when it comes to recovery time and barrel lengths >_> --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 02:32, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Though it may be incorrect for real life, I'd say Hashiriya's idea is most probably how it works in game. Since all weapons in COD are perfectly accurate when aiming, the accuracy stat is there to show how easy it is for the player to accuratly shoot the weapon, not the actual weapon's accuracy as we would think of it. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 06:35, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

== Tunnel Rat Revolver ==
When in the tunnels, the report of the Python is fairly muted. Is the implication therefore that is it loaded with "closed circuit" shotgun ammunition as used by the experimental [http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg213-e.htm Quiet Special Purpose Revolver] as tested by Tunnel Rats in Vietnam?

When ever its fired inside a building its strangely quieter yet louder when you step outside.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:31, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Maybe it's your eardrums preemptively ('prolly didn't spell that right) exploding? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 00:18, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

Oh yeah, wasn't that ammunition meant for a .44 magnum? Also its just the way it sounds when its indoors.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:46, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

==Stop Complaining==

Please just stop. Who cares if the guns aren't accurate? Just sit back and enjoy the Game! If you don't like the game, don't play it! [[User:SAMBAMA|SAMBAMA]]

: 1, I dont play game, because its boring and its just ripoff of MW2. Which was crap too.
: 2, This is firearms site. Not some gaming one. So it doesnt make sense to stop complaining.
: 3, I wont be complaining if those guns would be 3 or 4 years from future. But ''30-40'' ?
--[[User:Werc|Werc]] 07:38, 4 December 2010 (UTC)
Your late to the party, we for the most part don't care anymore.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:45, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

^ Hahahahaha! [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 19:08, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

==Crossbow==
I was playing zombies the other day and got the crossbow out of the box. I do't know if anyone else has seen this but, at least I think, it bears a major resemblance to the PSE Tac 15 crossbow. Again this is just me but if that's true I'm pretty sure that would make it the most anachronistic weapon in the game seeing as it was made maybe 2 or 3 years ago? --[[User:Subiefan98|Subiefan98]] 16:05, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

The PSE TAC 15 uses either an AR15 lower, or is included with basically a reciever shaped the same. Looking at it, it does not appear to have an AR15 type lower reciever on it, judging from the lack of the empty magazine well in front of the trigger. Maybe the upper does a little, I would agree, but in it's entirety in my opinion I don't think it does.--[[User:Fnlover|Fnlover]] 20:44, 05 January 2010 (UTC)

==1911 in Zombies==
The 1911 in zombies is just the regular nickeled finish like in multiplayer it looks black because of the low light in the starting room. If you go outside by the 'double tap' vending machine you can see it in daylight.

In FIVE where the lighting is fine, its still a Blued finish.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:08, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

== Did alittle overhauling ==

Removed the misimformation (Shiny black finish is called a Blued finish) and another things.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:11, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

==Front Cover 1911==

Is it just me or is the 1911 in the soldier's hand on the title picture (the right hand when you're looking at it) missing its hammer? I've been looking as closely as I can, but I just can't seem to find it. An error on the artists part perhaps? Strange though, the pistol marked "Sally" has its proper hammer.--[[User:august.allocco|august.allocco]] 17:32, 30 December 2010

Looks like a combination of the light and the angle making it hard to spot. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 22:30, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

== Silencer or Suppressor ==

I was looking at some of the images on this page and noticed that some said they were "silenced" or "with silencer", yet others used suppressor. I always thought suppressor was correct, and silencer only described the effect (although Call of Duty games are notorious for spreading this word around). I have not played black ops, so I was wondering if we would call the attachments silencers or suppresors? --Fnlover 05:42, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Talk:Live Free or Die Hard

2010-02-11T16:10:59Z

Gunner313:

==Goofs?==

Anyone else notice that he fired off, what, how many magazines in Farrells house before running out of ammo, like ten, or what?
:I believe it was four mags, instead of 3 since he would have two in the pouch and one in the gun, so that was a mistake. What is more notable is how he fires close to 20 shots from each mag despite them only holding 7 shots each. Anyone notice how in the first film he managed to keep his Beretta loaded all the way to the end and here he wastes all his ammo in one firefight? If he had carried a "friend in need", a backup gun, he likely wouldn't have been left defenseless in the apartment once his SIG ran dry. Last thing, in the theatrical edition he tells Farrell he destroyed the helicopter with the car because he was out of bullets but he tells Matt he has mags in the glove compartment when they leave his apartment. In the unrated version, they changed what he said and this error went away.
*** It could of been the 9mm p226 which holds 20 rounds per magazine.***
:A P226 holds 15 shots, not 20. And it has been confirmed as a P220 by the armorer of the film.

Can't a person get a 20 round mag for a 226? Also, wouldn't a 220 have to be his off duty weapon? The NYPD only allows 9mm and 38's.

:''I'd imagine they could, if one made such a magazine for that gun. And as for what the NYPD allows, real life =/= this movie. The gun's been long confirmed to be a P220R. So, in the Die Hard universe, that's what he was issued or allowed to carry.'' --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 20:19, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
::Also, in regards to what is permitted by NYPD, McClane as a senior detective (he has been on the force for decades) probably has more freedome in what he can carry than an average patrol officer.
:::Mauser currently made a 20 round magazine for the SIG P226 using super-new spring technology, but that's in 9mm. You can't fit 20 rounds of .45 ACP into a standard magazine and not have it extend way past the grip. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::Regarding the "I was out of bullets" remark, I'm guessing that probably had nothing to do with how much ammo he fired. That was probably just for humor. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 23:24, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

==Who did it first - ''Die Hard'' or ''Lethal Weapon''?==

Not to say that you're wrong, but wouldn't the ''Lethal Weapon'' movies be just as much of an influence on the guns popularity in the US? I mean, ''Lethal Weapon'' came out a year before ''Die Hard'' and Mel Gibson and Danny Glover talk specifically about the the Beretta in the beginning. "9mm Beretta, 16 in the mag, one in the pipe,..."Danny Glover.

I think both movies were equally influential in increasing the popularity of the 92FS. But, from my experience at least, Die Hard was the movie that made me want a 92FS from the age of 8 until I got one at 26.
::Hmmmmm. I already had several 92F pistols when I saw Die Hard in the theaters....[[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 09:54, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

''OK, have at it.'' --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 05:25, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

:::Then there's the fact that by the time ''[[Lethal Weapon]]'' came out, two ''[[A Better Tomorrow]]'' movies had already been released, both featuring the Beretta 92F prominently. BTW, interesting story I heard...has anyone ever noticed that there aren't too many Berettas in movies made in the U.K. during the 1980s (such as the James Bond movies of the time)? Apparently, this is because Bapty & Co.'s Beretta 92Fs and Taurus PT92s were rented out to so many Hong Kong productions in the '80s that they were never in inventory for use by domestic productions. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:42, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

== F-35 ==

The STOVL version actually ''doesn't'' have an internal gun, it mounts it in a ventral pod like the Harrier. I still don't think it has two like the Harrier does, so the page is right about it being inaccurate on that front. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 19:44, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
::I actually know nothing about jets so I used all the information I could find on Wikipedia and IMDB. Hopefully I did a good job. :) - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
:::You did pretty good. Got some things wrong though but who i am to judge? I don't know nothing about jets either. I'm more of a Army and Marines guy.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:16, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

==Sad to see it Go==
Anyone else saddened by the loss of Mclanes old Beretta for this new film? I'm not knocking the SIG P226, but the Beretta is Mclanes iconic pistol, and it deserved more then just a we cameo. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:He actually uses a SIG P220, not a P226. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 01:01, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
:I would much rather see him use a P220 than his old, rattletrap Beretta-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 01:24, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
::I think everyone knows you hate Beretta's, S&Wshooter. No need to keep going on and on about it. McClane started with a Beretta 92 he should have finished the series with one. It's basically like Dirty Harry not using a S&W Model 29. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 02:17, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
: I think it would have been cool to see Mclane use a Beretta Px4 Storm-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 02:30, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

::Um..................he does. Have you seen the page??? -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 02:39, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

:''I think it would have been cool to see Mclane use a Beretta Px4 Storm''

:Is that a joke?

:[[Image:LFDH-BerettaPx4-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:Also, your profile says you hate SIGs, too. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:59, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

:Oh I totally forgot about that part. I don't hate SIGs as a whole, just how all the weight is at the top of the slide and that they are really fucking expensive (I'm '''BROKE''' and if I spend the amount that a SIG goes for, it'll be for a nice Smith and Wesson revolver-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 04:01, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

::"Part"? He uses the PX4 Storm for half the damn movie! How can you be an IMFDB member if you don't read the page? Ugh...

::Anyway, as for SIGs, the weight on the slide is a consequence of SIG stupidly switching to those cheaply and crudely CNC-milled slides on all their guns since 1996. Earlier SIGs, like my West German stamped-slide P226, are much less top-heavy. So, stick with the P228s and the older-model P220s and P226s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:28, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

:For whoever is pissed about me forgetting a part of a movie that I only saw once, shut up. As for the SIG discussion, I find that the P239 is a pretty nice gun, even though I haven't fired it, and their Hammerli pistol is an excellent target pistol-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 04:38, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

::OMG, so you only saw the movie once; haven't you looked at this page? We've got 7 pics of the Beretta!! BTW, thanks for the info on the SIGs, MT2008. :) -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 00:14, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

:::I'm not "pissed", sorry if I came across that way. But I just think it's hilarious that you're on a site which identifies guns in movies, and you constantly complain about guns you hate on this site, and yet you take NO time to actually read the site that you post on. You gotta admit it's hilarious. But whatever. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:14, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

:It's not that I didn't read the article, it's that I haven't read it in a month or so. I read every article that I see, so you are wrong- I do read the site I post on. I'm not going to hold your assumption against you, however, because you had no way of knowing that this is the third site I check whenever I go online-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 02:27, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

==Watch used==

I was looking at another site and discovered the brand of the watch, worn by Emerson. It is handmade in Switzerland and sells from $15,000.00 to $70,000.00, depending on options. That is quite a watch for a thug to have.

[[Image:LFDH-MP7A1-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Emerson points his Heckler & Koch MP7A1 at McClane.]]

Talk:Edge of Darkness

2010-01-29T17:22:59Z

Gunner313:

It seems like its been a while since Mel Gibson has done anything. I don't think I have seen him in any new film since ''[[Signs]]''. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
:Yeah no kidding, has anyone noticed the way he holds his Glock by holding his firing hand by the wrist with his other? I never really understood the concept of this shooting style/technique.--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 18:10, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
::In a recent trailer you can see he holds his gun in a nice weaver grip at times. I never understood it either, it doesn't provide any real support.--[[User:Pølaris|Pølaris]] 00:44, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
:::It's all about what works for him. Any grip that enables one to shoot acurately and control the weapon is a proper grip. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

Removed a comment that had nothing to do with this site. Gunner313

==The Glock==

Are we sure that Mel Gibson's Glock is a G19? In the first image, the grip looks a bit too long to be a G19. More like a -17. And yes, I know that the G19 is what the NYPD uses in real life, but this is a movie. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:54, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Edge of Darkness

2010-01-29T17:22:31Z

Gunner313:

It seems like its been a while since Mel Gibson has done anything. I don't think I have seen him in any new film since ''[[Signs]]''. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
:Yeah no kidding, has anyone noticed the way he holds his Glock by holding his firing hand by the wrist with his other? I never really understood the concept of this shooting style/technique.--[[User:ThePotShot|ThePotShot]] 18:10, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
::In a recent trailer you can see he holds his gun in a nice weaver grip at times. I never understood it either, it doesn't provide any real support.--[[User:Pølaris|Pølaris]] 00:44, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
:::It's all about what works for him. Any grip that enables one to shoot acurately and control the weapon is a proper grip. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

Removed a comment that had nothing to do with this site.

==The Glock==

Are we sure that Mel Gibson's Glock is a G19? In the first image, the grip looks a bit too long to be a G19. More like a -17. And yes, I know that the G19 is what the NYPD uses in real life, but this is a movie. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:54, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Talk:24: Redemption

2010-01-21T19:22:22Z

Gunner313:

the other gunin the box was a cz52 not a p229, i have screencaps if you want them, I just don't feel like logging in and uploading them right now [[Special:Contributions/69.23.137.224|69.23.137.224]] 00:43, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
:Dammit, I just bought this to screencap and found it done already. Oh well, at least you did it MT. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::Oops, sorry, I completely missed out on the fact that it was on your Dibbs list. Normally, I try to respect your list, but I guess I got sloppy and my eye slipped. I received this movie on DVD as a Christmas present from my Dad, and even though I'm not at all into ''[[24]]'', I figured I'd watch it and screencap it. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:09, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
:That's alright. Your better with AKs than I am by a LOT. Still a good movie to watch though. I'm working on some extra shots for Collateral right now and then I'm going to add some shots for Commando.

I got this DVD and went into special Features and it showed a 16:00 minute sneak peak of 24 Season 7 I could see a AA12, and a SG 552 in this DVD.

:Well and done, but since those don't appear in the movie itself, no need to document them, if that's what you're implying we should do. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 05:00, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

== FBP SMG ==

The SMG the child soldier is holding isn't an M-3, although it's based on that design. Pretty sure it's a Portuguese FBP, which is listed on this very site [[http://www.imfdb.org/index.php?title=FBP_Submachine_Gun]]. Take a closer look at the screenshot and you'll see the bolt handle on the side of the gun..definitely not a feature of the M-3.--[[User:Phillb36|Phillb36]] 03:55, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

:Yep, agreed. I had a feeling I was wrong, but it was only seen for a second and I had trouble being sure. Thank you so much for correcting me on this. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:05, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

Were you able to find out what guns The Dubaku brothers used in this movie? I think Ike Dubaku used a revolver, aqnd his brother a pistol? -[[User:Btracy1994|Btracy1994]] 05:36, 18 Febuary 2009 (UTC)

== re listing ==

Shouldn't this be relisted in the TV section.

Talk:Casino Royale (2006)

2010-01-07T07:42:52Z

Gunner313:

Could someone identify the automatic weapons used in the final shootout in the sinking building.

JNA

Response from Anonymous: Two of Gettler's thugs are using H&K UMP.45s with laser scopes and silencers. They are clearly UMP.45s due to their forward handgrip and straightened clip.

:Tsk, Tsk, Magazine. A clip loads a magazine. A bolt action rifle like a Mauser 98 has an internal magazine which you load with a clip, or stripper clip in this manner. Now, if you refer to a magazine as a "clip", that would mean you would be loading a clip with a clip. ?? Now you can't load a clip with a clip because then you'd be smacking to en-blocs or stripper clips together like an idiot. And you can't load a magazine with a magazine, that also proves to be a problem. But you can load a magazine with a clip. See the confusion in using improper designation? -GM

::Also, I really get sick of editing pages to replace the word "silencer" with "suppressor". -MT2008

To be fair several suppressor/sliencer manufactuters use the term "silencer" to describe there product, such as YHM, AAC, AWC, Gemtech, KAC and HTG. Also while speakaing with various employees of the said companies at the SHOT Shows, they often use the term "silencer". Gunner313

:I think the point is you can never really fully silence a gun, but you can suppress it. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 05:22, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

::To silence a gun 100% I would think is nearly impossible, but to lower the noise of the shot to below human hearing is probably feasible, but not practical. The "silencer" would be so large that the gun would be extremely barrel heavy, and the bullet would have to be subsonic prior to exiting said silencer. All these limit the gun's effectiveness, and lets face it, the point of a suppressor is to attract less attention to yourself when firing. At the range you'd be limited to, you might as well be holding a sign above your head saying, "I have a silenced gun!" At least that's what I think. Anyone care to comment? -Tal379

I wasn't talking about the definition of "silencer". But on the note of a " silencer". Example; on a two stroke motocross bike the rear portion of the exhuast is called the silencer and the front part the expansion chamber. No the silencer doesn't completey muffle the sound, it just reduces it. Yes it would make sense to only call it a muffler, but many words used to describe a product do not describe what it actually does. One last example off the top of my head refering to what an item does; ram air induction on a production vehicle doesn't ram air into the engine, it simple allows an easier path and an adaquate amount of air to reach the air/fuel mixture area. But it is still called ram air. You can't take the word "silencer" or any other name of a product and expect it to be an accurate representation of what the product does, it is just a name. Gunner313

Talk:Casino Royale (2006)

2010-01-07T05:17:50Z

Gunner313:

Talk:Tears of the Sun

2010-01-07T04:38:05Z

Gunner313: /* The Knives */

Well, I'm done. How does it look? -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]

:Great! Except that the weapon you IDed as an "AKS-47" is actually a Chinese Type 56-1. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]
::It needs a small rewrite though.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:09, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

I added caps from the alternate opening of the director's cut of the film. They have the triangular handguards of the 'Nam-era M16s, but I couldn't get any clear shots of the receivers for further ID. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]
:Please put captions on the screencaps. Please?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 13:56, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

::Didn't really know what exactly to put, but I hope those captions suffice. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]
:::Thank you Spartan! Great Job! Those captions suffice. Even if they are generic they suffice.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 14:03, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

::::I'm sure you've noticed, but you also need the gun picture and the page links. Remember, if you're going to make additions, it's totally welcome, but please follow format. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]
::I don't think gun pictures are needed in this case since Spartan doesn't know what kind of M16s they are.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 15:04, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

:::You can always guess. And that only addresses half my request. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== Not an M1A ==

If you enlarge the second picture and look at the stock near the rear of the reciever, you'll see that it is cut for the selector switch. No M1A stock is like this, but all wood stocked M21 are since they're just rebarreled M14s with the selector removed and a scope attached. --[[User:Zurak 47|Zurak 47]] 14:51, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

== Shotgun muzzle device... ==

...is a "duckbill choke" intended to spread the shot pattern horizontally vs. vertically. They were also used by Vietnam era SEALS, primarily on pump shotguns. The intent is to have an effective, short ranges anti-ambush weapon for the point man. By aiming in the general direction of an identified ambusher and maintaining a horizontal hold, the shotgun can be effective against that ambusher as well as having a chance to hit/distract others close around him. In jungle and forest terrain with limited visibility and engagement ranges, ambushers would have to bunch up in order to maximize firepower on a patrol, especially along a trail.

== The new layout ==
Whoever changed the pages layout to the guns being organized by gun type. yea, dont do that again as i dont like it nor do i think the page that '''I''' made and put a lot of effort into. If you want to do that to your page, knock yourself out, but do '''not''' do this to any of my pages again. Thank you. -[[User:The_Winchester|Winchester]]

Chill the hell out! Christ!

== The Knives ==

And Knives ???

Where are you??

:IM'''F'''DB. Firearms unless a cultural reference i.e. Rambo's knives. -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]

Here are the main knives used; Emerson Police Utility Knife, Sog X-42 Recondo and Emerson Kandahar. Gunner313

Mission: Impossible II

2010-01-03T03:45:58Z

Gunner313: /* Heckler & Koch FABARM FP6 */

[[Image:Mission Impossible 2-Poster.jpg‎|thumb|300px|''Mission: Impossible II'' (2000)]]
'''''Mission: Impossible II''''' is the second installment in the [[Mission: Impossible]] franchise. The 2000 action sequel was directed by John Woo ([[Face/Off]]) and once again stars [[Tom Cruise]] as IMF Agent Ethan Hunt, who this time travels to Australia to locate a deadly bioweapon before it's sold off by a rogue IMF agent.

'''The following guns were used in the movie ''Mission:Impossible II'':'''

==Beretta 92FS Brigadier==
One of the main firearms used by IMF Agent Ethan Hunt ([[Tom Cruise]]) in the film is a [[Beretta 92 pistol series#Beretta 92FS Brigadier|Beretta 92FS Brigadier]]. He uses it along with a Beretta Centurion, often together at once. Hunt carries the Brigadier in a shoulder holster. Throughout the final chase, Hunt does several clean magazine releases during his handling of these pistols, one while moving without looking down or fumbling.
[[Image:44 elenco.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Beretta 92FS Brigadier 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3016.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Hunt does a clean mag change with his Beretta.]]
[[Image:MI2b.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Ethan fires both Berettas in classic John Woo fashion.]]

==Beretta 92FS Centurion==
Along with the Brigadier, Hunt also carries a [[Beretta 92 pistol series#Beretta 92FS Centurion|Beretta 92FS Centurion]]. He carries this handgun in a 7 o'clock position holster (either belt or IWB) allowing for a weak-side draw (permitting for a drawn pistol in each hand).
[[Image:Beretta92Centurion.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Beretta 92FS Centurion - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MI2A.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Ethan fires his Beretta Centurion from his motorcycle.]]
[[Image:MI2 3061.jpg|600px|none|thumb|Ethan uses the motorcycle's side-view mirror to fire his Beretta Centurion at Ambrose's motorcycle.]]

==Beretta 92FS Inox==
Luther ([[Ving Rhames]]) is seen with a [[Beretta 92 pistol series#Beretta 92FS Inox|Beretta 92FS Inox]] after the surveillance van is blown up by an explosive device.
[[Image:Beretta-Inox.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Beretta 92FS INOX - 9x19mm. This pistol was the screen used gun in the film [[Fair Game]].]]
[[Image:MI2 3014.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Luther (Ving Rhames) with his Beretta Inox.]]

==Heckler & Koch USP Compact==
A [[Heckler & Koch USP#Heckler & Koch USP Compact|USP Compact]] is seen dropped in the sand when Ethan and Ambrose jump from their motorcycles to engage in hand to hand combat.
[[Image:USPCompact9.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Heckler & Koch USP Compact - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3042.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Hunt kicks up the USP from the sand.]]
[[Image:MI2 3044.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Hunt fires the USP.]]

==Vektor CP1==
Hugh Stamp ([[Richard Roxburgh]]) draws and runs with a [[Vektor CP1]] pistol before his final fight. The Vector is an interesting choice for Stamp, since the character appears to have a South African security background, and Vektor as a company is apparently a small-arms division of DENEL Corporation, a group with ties to the South African military and security apparatus. These pistols are apparently unsafe due to a design flaw, and should never be loaded due to the risk of accidental discharge.
[[Image:VektorCP1Black.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Vektor CP1 9mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3010.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Vektor CP1 9mm|Stamp holds his Vecktor CP1 on Hunt.]]

==Sphinx AT 2000==
Sean Ambrose ([[Dougray Scott]]) carries a [[Sphinx AT 2000]] pistol in "duotone" finish as his main sidearm. This weapon is chambered for 9x19mm (as are many of the pistols in the movie).
[[Image:Sphinx AT 2000.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Sphinx AT 2000 - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3009.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Sean Ambrose (Dougray Scott) with his Sphinx AT 2000.]]
[[Image:000MIT Dougray Scott 033.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ambrose points his Sphinx AT 2000.]]
[[Image:000MIT Dougray Scott 022.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

==Steyr GB==
One of Ambrose's men fires a [[Steyr GB]] at Hunt during the final chase.
[[Image:SteyrGB.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Steyr GB 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3060.jpg|thumb|600px|none|One of Ambrose's men fires a Steyr GB from the passenger's side (they're in Australia).]]

==Glock 17==
Another of Ambrose's men fires a [[Glock#Glock 17|Glock 17]] at the helicopter carrying Luther ([[Ving Rhames]]).
[[Image:Glock17EarlyModel.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Glock 17 2nd Generation - 9x19mm.]]
[[Image:MI2 3025.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Ambrose's men fires a Glock 17 at Luther's chopper.]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5A2==
Many of the BioCyte Security guards and some of Sean Ambrose's ([[Dougray Scott]]) men, are armed with [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5A2|Heckler & Koch MP5A2's]].
[[Image:H&KMP5A2WideForearm.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch MP5A2 w/"tropical" Wide forearm - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3001.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A BioCyte guard fires his MP5A2.]]
[[Image:facilityguard.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A guard patrols the facility armed with a MP5A2.]]
[[Image:guardhit.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A guard fires his MP5A2 before he gets shot.]]
[[Image:carchase.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Ambrose's men armed with MP5A2s during the car chase.]]

==Heckler & Koch FABARM FP6==
During the shootout at BioCyte facility, one of Ambrose's men is armed with a [[Heckler & Koch FABARM FP6]] shotgun.
[[Image:Fabarm_Sdass_tactical_-1-.jpg‎|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch FABARM SDASS Tactical - 12 Gauge.]]
[[Image:mi2guard2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The guard leaping in the air is armed with a H&K FABARM FP6 Shotgun.]]
[[Image:MI2 3007.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The BioCyte guard fires his H&K FABARM FP6 Shotgun.]]

Looks more like a Mossberg to me.

==SA Vz.61 Skorpion==
One of Ambrose's men fires a [[SA Vz.61 Skorpion]] at Hunt during the final chase.
[[Image:Skorpion-SA-VZ-61.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Skorpion SA Vz 61 - .32 ACP]]
[[Image:MI2 3028.jpg|thumb|600px|none|One of Ambrose's men fires a Skorpion SA Vz 61 from his car.]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5K-PDW==
During the final chase, one of the Ambrose's men uses an [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5K|MP5K-PDW]].
[[Image:MP5K-PDW.jpg|thumb|none|300px|MP5K-PDW w/extended barrel (w/3 lugs & folding stock) - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:carattack.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Ambrose's men fires his MP5K at Luther from the passenger's side window.]]
[[Image:MI2 3035.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The thug with his MP5K as his car is hit by Luther's grenade. Note the extended barrel.]]

==Colt 9mm Submachine Gun==
Luther ([[Ving Rhames]]) fires a [[M16 rifle series#M4A1 Carbine|Colt 9mm Submachine Gun]] fitted with a C-More sight mounted in front of the carrying handle and a M16/AR15 brass catcher from the helicopter during the final chase.
[[Image:Colt-9mm--SMG.jpg‎ |thumb|none|400px|Colt 9mm SMG aka (''Colt Model R0635'') - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3024.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Luther([[Ving Rhames]]) fires a Colt 9mm Submachine Gun.]]

==Defense Technologies 37mm Gas Gun==
After he's shot at, Luther puts down his Colt and picks up a [[Smith & Wesson Model 276 Gas Gun|Defense Technologies 37mm Gas Gun]] to use against Ambrose's men. It appears that the gas gun has an M16 shell built around it and is fitted with a C-More sight and is apparently able to fire 40mm grenades.
[[Image:DefTech1316.jpg|thumb|none|400px|DefTech 1316 - 37mm]]
[[Image:MI2 3021.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Luther([[Ving Rhames]]) prepares to fire the Gas Gun.]]

==M26 hand grenade==
In his fight with Stamp, Ethan Hunt ([[Tom Cruise]]) tosses an [[M26 hand grenade]] through Stamps's legs, distracting him and allowing Ethan to defeat him until the grenade's explosion knocked out Stamp.
[[Image:200px-M-67handgrenade.jpg|thumb|none|300px|M26 HE Frag hand grenade]]
[[Image:MI2 3018.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A closeup of M26 grenade thrown by Hunt.]]

[[Category:Movie]]
[[Category:Espionage]]
[[Category:John Woo]]

Talk:Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2

2009-12-22T13:32:17Z

Gunner313: /* Combat Knife */

Note: This talk page is for discussion related to the '''article'''. Do not use it to argue about how H&K pwnz Colt, it is safe to say nobody cares.

__TOC__

==Weapon on newspaper==
Hey for anyone who has played the game,do you think the rifle from the newspaper they showed when talking about Makarov should be included?

:I personally wouldn't have any issue with it. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:08, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

==Suggestions==
I think the page needs the F2000 and TAR-21 with their special sights. Also, if anyone is looking for a screen of the M14 EBR with nothing attached, there's one in the spec ops mission where you breach the gulag wall. Oh, and we need the GP-25 included. --[[Special:Contributions/24.63.181.248|24.63.181.248]] 19:40, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

:The TAR-21 on the page ''already'' has a MARS sight on it. And the F2000 on the page is the same version used in the game. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:11, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

::There are no in-game screens of the MARS sight and the F2000's standard scope is in the game as the RDS in multiplayer, or "scoped" in singleplayer.

==winchester 1887 loading animation==

Is it supposed to load through reciever like that?
\
:Yes -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]

::Sort of. The animation shows the rounds being placed in the upper tube (the barrel) rather than the lower tube (the magazine). [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 15:51, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

It is wierd, but 1887's do load that way.
When you pull the cocking lever down the top of the breech kind of rolls back and opens.
The shells slip into the breech, past the chamber and down into the tube magazine below the barrel.
They're slow and a little clumsy to reload IRL. You have to push the shell down into the magazine tube past the stop with your thumb.
You can get a close look here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZE9WD9Fihks

:::This one looks like the cowboy action shooter style thats made to quickly load 2 shots, usually custom jobs but I believe Legacy Arms -> Puma Arms is currently selling one. Since in cowboy action shooting you can only have a maximum of 2 rounds in a shotgun. [[Special:Contributions/24.177.167.87|24.177.167.87]]Pawnstar

== Price's 1911 ==
Actually its in the game it can be picked up and used in the museum, don't know about MP though.

*It's not featured in MP, it's exclusive to the single player level Museum, though I have heard you can find it during an early mission, much in the same way as to how the desert eagle in MW was found on Crew Expendable (the only one in the entire SP campaign btw). Apparently on one of the loading screens, it details the weapon as a GI 1911 (unsure of the manufactuer) compared to what it was in Modern Warfare, a Springfield Armoury 1911 Professional model. [[Draco122|Draco122]]

On one of the loading scenes I think it said it was a colt.

The one used by price is a springer pro, colt's just a more recognizable name to put in loading screens.

Yeah, most definitely NOT a Colt. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:29, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

== M93R ==
There is a confirmation of the M93R machine pistol to be unlocked in MW2 online as confirmed in this video at the bottom of this page

http://modernwarfare247.com/news/multiplayer-unlocks - Madax XX

CAN ANYONE TELL ME HOW TO ADD PICTURES ONTO A PAGE ?????????????

== Who saw this video, 92, FS or SB? ==
The video with the Beretta M9, Ive not seen, Is it a 92 FS or SB?, i mean this isn't my site but still putting M9 just make's it as noobs are running the place, lol sorry, so who has the link to the video?
*It is impossible to understand it from video. The only place this pistol appears is shown on the screenshot, the trigger guard is not seen, so i decided to discribe it as military modification, M9. I don't think, that it is a big problem for you to write what is this pistol realy is, whan we will have a better view.

Didn't mean to offended you, it's just most people come to this site to get correct info on weapons, but i suppose putting M9 isn't that bad considering that its the correct name, i just feel its lack of info.

Its the 92SB again, you can tell on its Create-A-Class picture

== Airsoft ==
I like airsoft as much as the next guy, but we already have pictures of ''real'' M4A1s and MP5Ks on the site, so no need to replace them with pics of airsoft replicas. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 11:51, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
:Yeah, but the "real" M4A1s and MP5Ks in the game don't look like those pictures; for the sake of identification, wouldn't it just be simpler to use images that at least look like the weapons from the game, whether they're real or not? Besides, there are plenty of other pages that use airsoft images, so why should this one be an exception?
:Biggest part of airsoft pictures used on this site are of guns we don't have pictures of. As you can see on the [[M16 rifle series|M16]] and [[Heckler & Koch MP5|MP5]] pages, we have plenty of pictures of the real things, so no need to add airsoft replicas to the page instead. Whether or not they're equipped with a specific rail system or not is moot, since the rail systems in question are pictured beneath the weapons and the addition of them ''on'' the weapons doesn't change anything. An M4 is still an M4 and an MP5K is still an MP5K. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 21:27, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
:There has always been guns we see in movies that have been customized and don't look like the stock photos of the gun unmodded. It's best to have a picture of the real thing than a fake that LOOKS like the one used in the movie. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:58, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
:Then shouldn't all the other airsoft pictures (such as the Custom 1911 seen on the MGS4 page and the Cutlass on the Black Lagoon page, and even the Springfield Armory M1911 on CoD4's and MW2's page) be replaced with stock pictures? If you're gonna insist on this, you might as well go all the way.
::As I've already pointed out, '''biggest part of airsoft pictures used on this site are of guns we don't have pictures of'''. So those images are there '''because we don't have pics of the real things'''. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 23:42, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

For the record, I'm in favor of pictures of the weapons modded or detailed as they are seen in the movie or game. Chances are the link takes you to the base page for them anyway, so you can see a picture of the real deal. Someone might be looking for a picture of the gun that is identical to how it is in the film or game. Whether it's airsoft or not to me seems moot as long as it is the weapon in question. Of course, no orange tips, please. -- ZG
:The problem I have with all Airsoft guns is that they all scream "FAKE!" to those of us who spend alot of time around the real thing. Now as placeholders until we get a real weapon image I don't mind as it's a placeholder. Useing an airsoft gun insted of a real firearm that we have an image of that I just don't like. We do get the occational screem used weapon here and even when those have been beat to hell they are much better than the most realistic airsoft gun.--[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 16:48, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Replaced the airsoft M4A1 with the pic of a real one yet again. It doesn't matter whether it looks exactly like it does in-game or not. An M4A1 is an M4A1, regardless of what it looks like. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 17:36, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

But if you could find a picture of what it looks like exactly in the game, wouldn't you use it? -- ZG

:The inclusion of a few tacticool accessories is not enough of a reason to waste server space on even more photos of a weapon we already have a number of photos of. For the third time, an M4A1 is an M4A1 regardless of what kind of rail system and whatnot is on it. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:46, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

I (not that it matters) am perfectly fine with pictures of the real deal and I love the effort that's gone into posting such great screenshots. I just hope the trend keeps with noting what particular accessories are present. I'm one of those douchebags that sees guns in the movies and thinks "Golly! I want mine to look just like that!" In any case, I love the site and it hasn't let me down yet. -- ZG

:Nothing at all wrong with noting what kind of accessories are used and by no means does it make you (or anyone else) a douchebag. I mean, flashlights, IR and visible lasers, optics... all that stuff is awesome. I just think it's unnecessary (as well as a waste of server space) to have multiple pics of one weapon customized in multiple different ways each for a few specific pages when one pic of the weapon in its standard configuration can be used on all pages, with minor differences noted in the descriptory paragraph. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:43, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree. I'm all for the efficient use of resources and I come here for info and screenshots anyway. I wasn't necessarily against airsoft pictures but I do see it a different way now. In the spirit of full disclosure, however, I really am quite a douchebag. -- ZG

:Lol XD Well, they ''do'' say honesty is golden... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 09:53, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

==Planned Weapons==
Where did the informatio for most of these planned weapons come from??
:No idea, and no one has posted any sources, and there's no way to edit it now. Maybe if another multiplayer video shows up, someone with some authority will notice them and can remove them. I mean, really, the XM8? COD4 never had it and that came out when it was still showing up in every "realistic" FPS.--[[Special:Contributions/24.63.181.248|24.63.181.248]] 22:07, 5 October 2009 (UTC)
::IMHO, the XM8 is way overused in video games today. I'm glad IW shied away from it in favor of weapons like the ACR/Masada, that actually got beyond ''prototype'' stage. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 12:06, 11 October 2009 (UTC)
the acr isnt past prototype stage
:::No, it just isn't widely available yet, but it ''is'' beyond prototype stage. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 07:53, 14 October 2009 (UTC)
:The ACR is actually being produced by both Bushmaster and Remington. It's already being marketed and available to purchase [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:38, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

==Winchester 1887==
Is the Winchester 1887 actually confirmed for the game? If it is, you can pretty much create a T2 class with that shotgun, the thumper, juggernaut, stopping power and something else that suits Arnie:P - Madax XXI 12:28

:Yup, it's in there. I'm totally gonna have a Terminator 2 online kit. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:16, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

::It's definetely confirmed now, and with the big cocking loop and sawnoff stock and barrel too, only a hint of Terminator 2 fanboyism from IW there.... Can't wait to try it though. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 18:14, 5 November 2009 (UTC)

:I found it in campaign a minute ago and it really sucks-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 01:41, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

^^^I think it's pretty good, I'm stoked to get it online.

::Same here, I heard it has fairly good range and damaged when stacked up to the other shotguns, it just has a slower ROF, due to the lever action. you can dual wield them though, which says something. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:It's one of the only shotguns with the furthest range out of the lot in MP, this and steady aim and it's a monster in it's own. Like you said M14, it has a low ROF and the second smallest capacity next to the ranger [[Draco122|Draco122]] 21:06, 26 November 2009

::Actually it doesn't. I picked an 1887 up off a dead guy today, and was amazed. first thing is, that it has stunning range. Easily the best, can hit damn close to 50 feet. It holds 7 shots in MP as well, and you can dual wield them, cocking them T2 style. It's a beast of a shotgun, and I can't wait to unlock it for myself. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:::Isn't this weapon the Winchester 1897 shotgun, originally designed for trench warfare and used by the US military thru Vietnam (and plenty are still in use by civilians in the US). In playing COD 5: World at War, I haven't found the shotguns to be particularly effective. The Japanese NPCs are often so quick (esp in the higher difficulty level) that they are on you before you can chamber another round (esp in the section of the game where you have to destroy a howitzer with a 3 barreled 25mm AA gun and quickly take up a covered position to eliminate the Japanese counter-attack using a scoped Springfield). Two Japanese soldiers immediately attack you. I was killed more often using the shotgun than using the Type 100 or the .30 belt-fed machine gun--whose name just eluded me.

:::As for COD6:MW2, I have yet to run into the 1897. With so many high tech weapons (and the bewildering array of Russian weapons in the Sgt Roach and Pvt Ramirez sections), why bother with such an obsolete weapon given the effectiveness of the ASC45 (?) that's standard issue for Rangers & Special Forces, esp when there are smg/shotgun combos available. Or the incredible arsenal in Makarov's safe house?

:::[[User:Newsjunkie356|Newsjunkie356]] 23:58, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

:::: It's not an 1897, it's an 1887, being lever-action not pump-action. That and it's styled after the Terminator 2 shotgun anyway.[[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 09:03, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

==M1014 Removal?==
Should we remove the section on the M1014 in this game? There hasnt been any confirmation of it appearing in game, aside from the misplaced icon.

No, it has been confirmed now
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKwaOg7RYPo

== Any Ideas On The .44 Magnum ==
I think its either a Raging bull or a colt anaconda. both look quite simmlar but im thinkin it more a colt anaconda than a raging bull reason being that the the magnum in game look as if it has smaller vents were as the raging bull as quite thick vents. --[[User:Final Tsurugi|Final Tsurugi]] 22:12, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

On the Call of Duty wikipedia website it said it was a colt anaconda

Link plz? --[[User:Final Tsurugi|Final Tsurugi]] 22:12, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

Found a video on youtube where they switch classes revealing a .44 magnum on 0:16 [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Xv37FiiOAk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Xv37FiiOAk]

==Clean Up Page==
I cleaned up the main page, but i can change it back if any one want's. --[[User:Final Tsurugi|Final Tsurugi]] 21:50, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

I noticed that FourZeroTwo has a gun on his back before getting knifed, that you missed. It appears to be a PP-2000, please correct me if I'm wrong

http://www.modernwarfare247.com/weapons/sub-machine-guns/pp-2000

You could be right, but Ive got a hunch it could be a MP7, which seems more likely. But from what we can see its hard to tell. (thx also :)

No problem, I just love MW and MW2 and had to point that out, but I didnt know who to talk to about it. Great site, too:) I learned loads about guns, like the difference between a Beretta and a Taurus:) - Terry 00:06

I was right about the PP-2000!:) - Terry 23:30

I was like "Sure" when i saw your above post, then i look at the pic of the PP-2000 akimbo, and was like "FUCK" cool any way m8 :)

== Bullet Types ==
What is this about the Tavor being loaded with FMJ's? Is this supposed to mean that along with choosing weapon attachments, we also get to choose bullet types? - [[User:Mythekal|Mythekal]]

A bit too confusing now lol, I'm thinking it will just be a perk, because if im right fmj's give higher velocities, but i couldn't see how this would affect the game, in cod 4 all bullets moved at the same speeds?

Where do you get the info that FMJ give higher velocities? just curious?

What i understand is that FMJ are solid bullets and the only bullets "allowed" in warfare from the Hague Conventions.

True, but but a "Black" operation such as this would hardly be concerned with the rules of "conventional warfare." =P

The Theory behind JHP (Jacketed Hollow Points) is that upon impact of the target the nose of the bullet mushrooms to a much larger size the then original diameter(caliber) of the bullet causing a larger wound channel and more "stopping power"

The downside to this is that since JHP expand during impact the force of the bullet is dispersed over a larger area on the target making these bullets less likely to pierce body armor, also some HP bullets give certain firearms trouble when cycling this ammo. my 1911 for instance... =)

Your 1911's feeding of hollow point has to do with the type of 1911 usually. Different kinds of feeding ramps I'm told. My series 70 Gold cup has the same problem but my Springfield TRP feeds just fine.
FMJ's moving at Higher velocities has to do with air drag, hollow points would create more of it. As others have said hope this helps, and by all means correct me if I'm wrong.

But basically all bullets work well for their intended applications. its just that in this day and age there are so many options for a person to use its just matching the bullet to the task. Hunting, Target, Match, Self-defense, Low recoil or "Cowboy" Loads, Plinking. Its endless. -Furious Oyster (feel free to expand or remove if incorrect or unnecessary, just trying to help)

well... I didn't exactly want a bullet discussion, i was just wondering how this would affect the game, like if infinity ward would make it horrible and make stuff like hollow points do something like 4 times damage but only go as far as a "Call of Duty Shotgun". - [[User:Mythekal|Mythekal]]

"Where do you get the info that FMJ give higher velocities? just curious?"- I just read alot on firearms :P but i remember coming across it?

As far as i know there is an international convention that bans the use of hollow point bullets and other expanding bullets for millitary purposes.

:That would be the Hague Convention. But from what I understand, it bans their use against ''state-employed combatants'' only, leaving them fair game for counter-terrorism ops and the like. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:47, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

FMJs could be like the perk "Deep Impact"?

They are an attachment for the guns that gives them a little extra damage and better penetration through walls too.

== Extended Magazines Attachments ==
Thought it was pretty cool, but will it be like a drum mag or something like bandolier, what ever it is i hope it applies to assault rifles.

[[Image:Ump45em.jpg|400px]]

:Could be a dual mag clip, so you can reload faster. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 00:35, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
:: Magazine dammit!-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:11, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
He said a clip that holds two magazines together for a speedier reload - Mythekal
:::Huh. i never heard of that before. Good point, Mythekal.

Lol its still a mag Mythekal!

its usually just a metal or plastic part that latches to both mags allowing you to just pull out the used one move it to the left and reinsert the fresh mag... Some times its just a piece of tape. Google AR-15 mag couplers or something. -Furious Oyster (Sorry miss read it)

I knew what a dual mag clip is, i was merely trying to explain it to who ever thought that M14Fan said "Clip" instead of Magazine. And here is a picture to avoid further confusion. -[[User:Mythekal|Mythekal]]

[[Image:Dual_Mag_clamp.jpg‎|200px]]

There better be an attachment like this for the AA-12, cause its gonna get really annoying reloading that lousy 8-shot magazine every five seconds after unloading on someone lol-ArmoredMason619

Apparently the extended mags are exactly what you think. They take the standard magazines of any gun and just add like 10 more rounds to it. I don't know about the reload animation, but most likely it's the same. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:39, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

the extended mags look exactly the same and reload the same they've just got more rounds- red raindog

==Barret .50==

At the end of the Flag Runner video FourZeroTwo has a Barret M82. May not be, but it looks like one and sounds like one, it's a little blurry so i wasn't sure? -Final Tsurugi

It looks like a Barrett XM500 - Mythekal

How did i not notice that, actually might be a Barrett M99? - Final Tsurugi

:Or it could be the M107, the updated M82. ][[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy] 01:52, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

It wasnt the M99 because it was firing semi-automatically, and from the angle, the magazine was not visible, so i assume it was a bullpup - Mythekal

It is a Barret M82/M107, if you pause the video at the right moment you can see the magazine in front of the grip, i actually got excited to think we might have a bull-pup sniper in Modern Warfare 2 :P -Final Tsurugi

Nope. Youre all wrong, I mean you got the .50BMG part right, but its actually an Accuracy International AS50. Come on guys I cant be the only one who noticed that-Kellers357
I'm almost positive that it is not an AI. It is just a M107 [[User:mythekal|mythekal]]

Most definitely a Barret 82/M107. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:49, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

== Brazillian Militia? ==

They better make the main character waste the militia alongside the Brazilian Army or the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BOPE/ BOPE] or i am not buying it.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 19:07, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

:I actually like that causal outfit the militia wear :)
::Me too. I never seen a brazilian wear a 1980s Miami Vice style flower shirt, but i do like how they have militia wearing Brazilian football team shirts. Makes it more realistic. I like the flower shirts though. They are cheesy as hell. It fits the game. Also, Please sign your posts.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:14, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

Yeah Miami vice ftw :) --[[User:Final Tsurugi|Final Tsurugi]] 21:50, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

==Guns from the new teaser==
This SMG looks like a [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Special Weapons MP-10 and SP-10|Heckler & Koch MP-10]].
[[Image:Mp10catch1.JPG|thumb|none|300px|[[Heckler & Koch MP5#Special Weapons MP-10 and SP-10|Heckler & Koch MP-10]]]]
[[Image:MW2teastrail1.png|thumb|none|400px|I thought it was a MP5K but if we look closer, it doesn't seem to be one.]]
:It could be a K with the forward grip removed? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]

no, its an MP5K equipped with some sort of an RIS handguard to me-Kellers357

looks like an MP5 with a tactical end-cap, kinda like the end cap on the MP5K. no idea why there's a 15 round magazine though
[[Image:MW2teastrail2.png|thumb|none|400px|And this one looks like a UMP but the the silhouette isn't exactly the same (maybe the model of the game was not loaded enough).]]
--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 08:27, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

:It definitely resembles a UMP, it probably has rails on the handguard, as well as the front sight removed, as they did in the last game ~[[user:Revolver|Revolver]]
its a UMP with the foresight removed for the red dot-Kellers357

The one in the first picture is I think a Special Weapons MP-10. Check it out at the bottom of the mp5 page.
::The forearm doesn't look as large as the MP-10 though... everything else looks like a MP-10 indeed.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 11:10, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
The two guns look similar minus the stock and clip. I could be wrong but I'm sure that if it isn't a special weapons mp-10 then it is an UMP.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]
:Magazine goddamit![[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 23:30, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
What's wrong with saying clip? It means the same thing.
:.. Uh, no. It's not. A 'clip' is the device that loads a magazine. You either use it to load your detachable magazines, or you carry the clips to load the fixed magazine in your rifle (on old rifles). You don't carry 'clips' around any more. They're two different things. It's like saying rim and tyre mean the same thing. --[[User:Joffeloff|Joffeloff]] 12:44, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
I've never heard that before. I can see where clip comes from stripper clip that they used in rifles. Everyone around me says clip and mag is interchangeable but people use mag more often. If it really bothers you that much then I'll just say mag then.
[[Image:Mp10catch1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Special Weapons MP-10 9x19mm]]
The second one looks like an UMP. I'm pretty sure we're dealing with two guns here.
::Yeah but there is no rear sight on the one in the screenshot, and it's disturbing me... maybe they took it away because of the Red Dot on it.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 11:10, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
Actually if you look closely that kinda square shape towards the back of the gun is the iron sight so it's pretty much an UMP with what looks like an ACOG. If you're talking about the front sight for the UMP which does appear to be missing, remember that they removed the front sights from the M4/M16 when you attach a sight even though that's not standard.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]
[[Image:UMP 45.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch UMP .45 ACP]]
[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

I've got a clearer shot of the weapon thanks to a friend :)
[[Image:MW2MP.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 17:05, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

Ok I guess it's not an MP-10 but a dressed up MP-5. They did it to the AK I suppose they are going to do it to the MP-5?[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

Guys on CoD Wikia found an interesting thing about this gun and I pretty agree: http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Modern_Warfare_2#Sub_Machine_Guns They say it's a MP5K with a R.I.S system. Since they've put one for the M4, I guess that's possible.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 16:58, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

It has to be a MP5k with a rail. The short magazine,no stock, and small flashider make it the only possible variant.

==what AK is this?==
http://www.gamegrep.com/showimage.php?pos=2&newsid=20387
http://www.gamegrep.com/showimage.php?pos=4&newsid=20387
http://www.gamegrep.com/showimage.php?pos=5&newsid=20387

In the first image I can see that it has a waffle magazine. In the second image I can see that a muzzle brake is present, and in the last image I can see what appears to be a Tapco Intrafuse AK-47 Handguard. So what is it? Oh and it appears to have a synthetic stock. [[Special:Contributions/72.133.253.21|72.133.253.21]] 21:10, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

== Guns from the trailer ==
[[Image:MW2brazil.png|thumb|none|400px|FN FAL or Imbel MD-3 (brazilian variant of the FAL)?]]
I hope it's an FAL. You barely ever see them in video games-S&Wshooter
:Could be a variant of the KTR-03S - an AK custom build [http://www.krebscustom.com/RawPhotos/6-28-04/KTR-03SFinal.jpg]. - MCain (UTC)
:Me too. I love fals. And the gun above looks like a IMBEL MD2. Heres the wikipedia article: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMBEL_MD2]. Note how it has a STANAG Magazine like the MD2.I also love how ridiculous looking the Brazilian gang members are.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:39, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
::rather MD-3 isn't it? Since it hasn't a foldable stock.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 18:51, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
:::Yeah without the folding stock it is a MD3.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:38, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
::::However, the gun's long barrel looks more like a FAL... ahh sh*t! This fuc*ing game is driving me mad, every guns don't look exactly the same as their originals^^--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 21:11, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
:I think there are Imbel MD2s or MD3s with the regular barrel.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:14, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
:Ok, there are no Imbel MD3s with regular barrels. It's most likely a design error by the developters.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:59, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
(comment: It better be a FAL. I'm getting tired of M4's, M16's, AK's and G36's. I want to be able to use a gun ingame that in't too small for me in real life.-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]])
:I agree. the game better have G3s and IMI galils. I also love the fact that is a Brazilian made Fal. You don't see those in movies.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 23:45, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
:I also want a MG3 or some kind of big, dumb machine gun chambered to 7.62x51mm NATO. Machine guns chambered to 7.62 tear shit up.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 00:04, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
: Hell yeah man! Thats exactly what I'm saying. I would also like to see some more bolt action jobs that aren't crappy( DSR-1, Enfield Enforcer, Steyr SSG) in video games- [[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 00:22, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
::''This would probably be the IMBEL MD-2 (folding stock) or MD-3 (fixed stock) which is manufactured locally in Brazil. The weapons are based, pretty much, on the FAL with the exception that they fire a 5.56 round'' [[User:Charon68|Charon68]]
:::And are fed from STANAG Magazines and have different handguards.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:31, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
:I'm tired of .223 guns. I would like to see a FAL, M14 or G3 that isn't emasculated (made innacurate, weak or make ammo for it scarce)-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]]
::I want a M14 that is not tricked out with rails like the one in Call of Duty 4. I want a M14 like the one below:
[[Image:M14Rifle.jpg|thumb|none|500px|A real M14.]]
I do like the Mk 14 Mod 0 EBR rifle though. I also want A M16A4 that doesn't fire on Full Auto and a AK-74. AK-74s don't get enough love.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 18:02, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
:::::CoD 7 will be about Vietnam War according to rumours, maybe they'll put in one.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 19:33, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
::And smaller conflicts in africa. I hope they also put atleast one level that takes place in the portuguese colonial war.
[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 01:29, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
:::Now i think the FAL above may be a FN FAL with rails on the handguards and a 30 round magazine but i think it's too curved and big to be 7.62x51mm NATO.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:06, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

im taking a guess that the FAL looking rifle is a DSA SA58 OSW. im probably wrong, but thats my two cents
:Way too big to be an SA58. The SA58 is a Carbine. The one in the upper picture is an Assault Rifle. Also, sign your posts by putting four ~ at the end of every message.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:02, 11 July 2009 (UTC)
[[Image:MW2smg.png|thumb|none|400px|]]
[[Image:MW2Brazilpistol2.png|thumb|none|400px|]]
[[Image:MW2Brazilpistol.png|thumb|none|400px|]]
--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 16:54, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

*A Kriss Super V?
Does anyone know who the guy with the KRISS is? Im calling him Brazilian Secret Service but I'm sure Im wrong. Help?-Kellers357
Cool. The pistol is a Desert Eagle, by the way.-protoAuthor
:I think the pistol is a Jericho 941 since it's too small to be a desert eagle.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 18:38, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
::No, it's an Eagle. Check out the ejection port.
:::''I concur. It's not terribly visible, but there's that familiar slide mounted safety in both shots. It appears to be a totally game-created custom finish though - the barrel and the underlying section of the frame (where the gas pistons are housed) look to be blued and the grips and the rest of the frame looks silver. On a couple of related notes, wow at the graphics - I took these for pictures of the developers testing out their guns at first - and wow at the handling of the Desert Eagle by this guy. Usually in these games, you see handguns being handled only somewhat compentently at best. This guy looks like he sleeps with the damn thing.'' ---[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 02:09, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
::::Also, take note of the sound it makes when it fires. Exact same sound as the Desert Eagle in CoD4.
:::::Besides, the game is still going through production and the weapon models will be touched up. --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 02:53, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

== The machine gun ==
I think the machine gun that the russian terrorists are using is a M240.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:42, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
::I think it's a M249 SAW, the M240 (GP Machine gun) is bigger.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 18:00, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
:::Could it possibly be a Mk. 46?
:Makes sense since most of the guns are special forces guns.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:52, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
:Well the M240B has been added just look at the new multiplayer trailer. IGN rewind theater confirms it too. could someone add it on the main article? -Mandaloin

==New AK==
[[Image:AKMW2.png|thumb|none|400px|]]
I think its just an amped up AK-47. It has an AR-15 stock, waffle magazine, and has a synthetic handguard.
Found a similar image:
[[Image:Ak-47-weapon-accessories-desert-colourb.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
[[User:Rock and Metal|Rock and Metal]] 22:22, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
:Good god, look what they did to that AK! That's just horrible. I hope the AK in the game isn't like that.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:37, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
::I watched the trailer again. I am sure that i saw a AK with a AK-74 style flash hider.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:55, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
:::Maybe a AK-101 since NATO forces use 5.56mm.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 11:05, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
::I think it could be a AK-74M or just a AK-74 since the russian army might make a apparence and they need to arm the russian soldiers.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 18:38, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
:::I said "NATO forces"--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 22:42, 26 May 2009 (UTC) because the one having it in the screenshot is Soap... well, maybe or surely, he captured because he had a M14 at the beginning.
::Well...the game's plot is a about a Uber badass special forces unit that works alone and is headed by our buddy Soap up there. So, i guess the badass special forces unit is not part of NATO.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 23:35, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
:::Neither AK-101 or AK-74, the magazine in the image holds 7.62x39mm. [[User:Rock and Metal|Rock and Metal]] 00:16, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
::::Maybe theres the tricked out AK up there and the AK-74 style AK.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:26, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
:::::Well, seems like we won't know until we'll have a level walkthrough with the name of the weapon in it...--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 15:45, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
::I saw the Gameplay videos and i saw two different AKs. One with a AKM style muzzle brake and another one with a AK-74 style flash hider. Maybe we can build guns from the ground up? like, you can have a AK-47 with a kobra sight, snow camo, fires 7.62x39mm and has a AK-74 flash hider?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:39, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
*It's gotta be an AKM.
::Why the it would be an AKM? It looks like an AK-74M or one of the AK-100 series.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 15:38, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
:::Well it has ribbing on the top of the reciever, like the AKM, but the indentation I cannot clearly see. It could be like in Farcry 2, where it has the Ak-47 receiver with some AKM parts, and I used AKM because the 100 series are developments on the AKM, understand? So AK-47 is incorrect.
::::But the AK-10X series were developments on the AK-74M. Also, sign you posts.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:36, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
:::::Well technically the modernizations start with the AKM, I see it as the break off point of the AK series. Ak-74 was designed from the AKM, and so on and so on, but that doesn't matter, yeah it could be the 100 series, but my point is its not an AK-47. Also lacks the flash hiders of the 74 and 100s. But I think it's a frankenAK-[[User:RedJedRevolver|RedJedRevolver]]
::I think the AK-74 flashider can be seen when in first person. Like how in the first Modern Warfare, The first person model of the M4 had an grip on the handguard but the world model didn't have a grip. I also think it's an frankengun or it may be an AK that the player can build. Like in hitman: Blood Money.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 14:41, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
:::I don't think so on the 74, but I think we can agree in the meantime it is not an AK-47 so we should change the heading accordingly, evidence shows it is a modernized variant so we could say a Kalashnikov in the heading and have notations that it is a modernized variant.-[[User:RedJedRevolver|RedJedRevolver]]

It looks like it has the AK-47 variant front sight on it.

Guys, I guess it's new railed AK-103 from Izhmash with M4ish buttstock and waffled mags. Check the link below for pics, note the same muzzle brake etc as in the game.
[http://depositfiles.com/files/xgycdj189 new AK-103]

:That link goes to a pay-to-download site. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 09:20, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

== Unrealeted ==
Ok, i know this has nothing to do with the game or releted to guns but, i was reading the Modern Warfare 2 thread on the Something Awful forums and they were calling the Brazilian gangters africans. What the ? and they seen to think the scenes in Rio De Janeiro are set in Africa. What the mother ? it offends me that people are dumb enough to ignore the line "he's got a contact in rio" and Christ the Redeemer and the huge mountains with favelas full of illiterate drug dealers and the Brazilian made Imbel MD-3.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 23:43, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
:What do you expect? It's Something Awful!

To be fair all the favela gangsters that are seen so far are Afro-Brazilians, even if there are plenty of gang members of all races in real life. With so many games having levels in destroyed urban areas in Africa it's not surprising that some people would get a Black Hawk Down style vibe from the pictures.

Personally I hate something Awful as they break their own rules on posting. One member has a post on there with my first and last names and it's a bloody poison pen hitpeice. I asked the frigging syop to remove the shit and he laughed at me. Personally I find the site the home of a bunch of elitist idiots who have at least one member dumb enough to set the fuel line for a weilding torch on fire.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 19:17, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
:Hey, i like something awful but you have to be really dumb not to see the Christ the redeemer.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:26, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

==Hopes For New Game==

Want a little realism and some weapons like standard battle rifles not all trick out with rails. Hoping russians have ak-74s and makarovs or that new 9x19 pistol they developed, not ak47s. Militias and gangs should have a mix of guns, not all berettas and 1911s. A makarov, cz-75, hk or two, glock, model 19 smiths.....just variety.

What the fick is an "akarov"? Lol-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 03:08, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Makarov, a 9x18mm pistol that has been issued in several variants to the russian military. Come on, seriously, sticky keys some things are mspelled.

I knew that. I was just kidding-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 03:35, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

I think the brazilians should use taurus and stoeger guns too, that would be realistic. And the militia should have some sxs coach guns and taurus revolvers, you know, the non tatcticla stuff. And psitols should be portrayed as hard to shoot, not coming back exactly on target after each round and it should wobble a bit while aiming.
:The Brazilian gangsters are using tricked out guns with rails. At least the IMBEL MD-3 up there has a Eotech reflex sight and what looks like rails on the handguards but they could be the regular MD-3 hand guard. We know the AKs are going to be tricked out as like the image above but i think i saw a AK-74 that was not tricked out. I hope they have a AK-74.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:26, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

My major hope for the game is a surpressed sniper rifle available on multiplayer not single. The first Modern Warfare was a great stealth game with all the "Surpressors", and "Ghillie Suits" but really was a "Greek Tragedy" on multiplayer. I could understand that your average military trained sniper has a spotter and a shooter and are trained to be the world's top 10 patient people in the world but can't put the patience into a live game with real people in a seven minute match. Aside from history why couldn't the writers just put a M21 with a surpressor on in multiplayer like in the missions "Blackout" and "All Ghillied Up"? For the new guys to COD4 on the M21 attachments there are only two attachments "No Attachment" has a standard scope, the ACOG attachment has a ACOG scope and is missing a surpressor as a third attachment. If you understand how to customize your attachments you wouldn't be so confused but since the "No Attachment" feature has a standard scope why not have the surpressor and scope. It just doesn't make sense why you would have the same setup in the campaign but not in multiplayer. We can all understand why you can't have more than one attachment on any other weapons but why not add a surpressor on a sniper that has "No Attachment" for it's standard scope? I am probably to late to send this message to Infinity Awards but I spent 20 minutes on it so I might get lucky if they read it and a miracle if they change it. I'm just sharing my hopes so try not to delete it.

I hope they get more shotguns in and make them a tiny bit better.m3,870,m1300,m950,etc. Two shotguns that go 5 feet suck, especially when pistols can go as far as sniper rifles.

* If they added compensators to the attachments for handguns would be cool. It sucks that there's only one attachment for pistols in MW1, and the D-Eagle hasnt got anything that can be put on it, and that sucks even more. Maybe different calibers for the D-Eagles could be used too, but that might be going too far. And I hope theres an SG552 in there aswell, I love that gun so much. And if they added firing selection to the game, you could switch the SPAS from pump to semi auto, which would also be cool, and a touch more realistic.

:More Desert Eagle is the ''last'' thing this game needs. Seriously, why not a SIG 226 or HK45 instead (i.e., an actual ''combat pistol'')? One thing I want for sure is a freaking fire selector for assault rifles and carbines. Like has been said on the CoD4 page, full auto or bust sucks. I prefer quick double tapping on semi-auto. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 11:54, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

My hopes for this game? An automatic FAMAS; leave the 3-round burst to the M16. Also, a true M14. As for everything else, well, the only thing I was worried about from the onset was the RPD, but since it's been confirmed, I'm ecstatic. And I like how they're doing the secondary weapon thing. Having a shotgun as your primary could be pretty useless sometimes...[[User:Run its a T-55|Run its a T-55]] 21:34, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
-you no what, they need to make a real "modern warfare" game, like with acts going from Vietnam, Grenada, Panama, and hell Somalia, who wouldnt want to play a blackhawk down game with kick ass graphics AND guns, that is what cod7 should be and obviously with the real weaponry they had, ex- no Magpul Masada in vietnam, Sad but true, any agree with this?- Griz

==Winchester 1200==

We all know the 1200 is old and not used since vietnam. The 1300 is used. Would it be safe to say these are mis-named winchester 1300s? Or is it more video game nonsense?
:The 1200 in this game is the same 1200 from Modern Warfare 1 so it's safe to say that the Winchester is a 1200 even though is pretty retarded to militarys still be using the 1200 today.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 18:52, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

I seriously doubt the 1200 was ever made in this configuration.
:Me too but it is a video game and video game developters are pretty retarded when it comes to guns. Still, this and COD4 have the best Gun in video game history atleast by now.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:11, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

:Watching over the video again on youtube and moderwarfare2.com, the weapon does look like a Winchester 1200 at first glance, yet I'm also convinced it may be a Remington 870 MCS, either in the Entry configuration or the Patrol Configuration due to the length of the barrel or it maybe the combination of the two, due to the length of the barrel with an added entry front sight. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 22:15, 11 August 2009

[[Image:Rem870mcs_14.jpg‎|thumb|none|400px|]]

== Alright ==
Alright you son-of-a-bitches there's a gameplay video in gametrailers. It's pretty low quality but some new guns were seen, including the gun with the heartbeat sensor and some others. Now, i don't know how to screencap trailers so someone else will have to do it.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:58, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

Here they come:
[[Image:MW2AR1.png|thumb|none|400px|]]
[[Image:MW2AR2.png|thumb|none|400px|]]
--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 21:15, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
YOU FOOL! It's "sons-of-bitches". That's a pretty awesome-looking cap, though.-protoAuthor
:Thanks for the correction. I am sure Soap and Roach we using AKs with AK-74 flash hiders. Anyone have any idea what kind of AKs were those?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:20, 3 June 2009 (UTC)
::Oliveira, do you think you could post a link of the trailer for me, please? Thanks so much. --[[User:Blemo|Blemo]] 04:43, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Which trailer?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 12:11, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

== gameplay demo ==

did anyone see the new gameplay demo for Modern Warfare 2
it showed "Roach"(main protagonist) with a IMBEL MD-3 with a dot sight and a...radar
im not good with gun attachments but is there really a radar attatchment?
:It's a heartbeat sensor and the gun wasn't a MD-3. it looked like a fictional gun of some sort.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:52, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
::some says it's a SCAR--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 21:16, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Makes sense since the charging handle is on the right side. But i think the SCAR charging handle is on the left side.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:46, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
-It looks like a Sig 556 variant to me - Mythekal

Yeah looks like the sig556 itself thogh, not the military versions? Also, would it be safe to say the glock is a glock 18, no idea how anyone would mistake a full auto as a g22/.

It could just be a fully automatic Glock 22. Gun rules dont necessarily matter to video games - Mythekal
:Mythekal is right. Hell, Modern Warfare 1 had a M16A4 that fired on full auto.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:30, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

All that matters is the real weapon that the in-game version is modeled from. Call of Duty 4 had an Aks-74u modeled from an Airsoft gun - Mythekal

I'm starting to think that this rifle could be a Bushmaster ACR, as it shares similar traits, except for the placement of the charging handle - Mythekal

:My thoughts too. The charging handle is consistent to the ACR, but the SCAR has the same kind of charging handle. We can't see the stock and both could accept a thermold mag. So it could be either. I really doubt they make up an entire fiction rifle for the sake of it. Modern Warfare was always all about guns that are real. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:34, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

::Though the weird part is, the ACR has a slide release right next to the trigger, similiar to the XM8. You reload and just press forward with your trigger finger, no need to slap or pull the charging handle. The SCAR has the slide release like the AR-15 rifles, you can just slap it to release, but yet in the gameplay, you don't slap a slide release or push a slide release, you pull the charging handle back. Strange [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:36, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

It could be a Magpul Masada. It is very similar to the weapon in the videos, and has a charging handle on the right side of the receiver. In the video, the stock has a hinge, indicating a folding stock, which looks almost identical to the Masada. - Mythekal

The rifle also has ambidexterous charging handles - Mythekal

:That sumbitch is most certainly a Masada.

new gameplay vid says it's a silenced ACR with heartbeat sensor.

I think it is a Magpul Masada [[User:Choi117|Choi117]]
:I watched the Gameplay and i'm sure that the gun is a ACR.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:32, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

ACR is the masada. Same gun, switched manufacturer.
:Sorry, i didn't know that.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 00:07, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

But the stock is that of the Masada - Mythekal

::ACR man, I know the Masada sounds cooler, but it isn't call that anymore. It's like people still calling the REC 7 a Barret M468 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:42, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Or any of the M16 series of weapons a AR-15.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:20, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
:Well if it's called AR15, you would be referring to the civilian M16 rifles. M16 is a military weapon and an AR-15 isn't. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:11, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

I think the pistol is a [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18C]]
:Most likely since it was firing on Full auto.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 18:13, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
::It was pointed out that the firing rate wasn't the same speed as a real [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]], but it could be that the developers couldn't quite get the slide and sound speed for a [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]]. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:31, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Or it could be a [[Glock]] firing on semi-automatic. [[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:16, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
::::That little er fires fast if its semi auto (pardon my language)
:::::Who ever put the screenshot on the page forgot to remind that the frame color is (tan) "Olive Drab". [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18's]] did not have this color available. [[Glock#Glock 22|Glock 22's]] just came out with this color somewhere in 2008. Of course I still wouldn't rule out it could be a [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] with a replaced frame. But the writers probably wanted to put a new FBI (.40S&W) caliber into their Video Game arsenal.

==Weapons-trailers==

Been seeing trailers online annoncing weapons and perks. How much cred do they have? Theres no footage to back it up, bt several announced weapons are in the screenshots. They also list the 110 SASR, L85, L85 mg version, etc.
:Weapon trailers? Where the hell can i find those? They could be really useful for the article.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 00:07, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

Youtube, theres a "weapons" one that just lists guns, and a weapons and perks thing, the perks it actually ahs proof from the original teaser.

:I wouldn't trust any of those youtube bull. One said there might be an XM8 in the game. I hope it does not. That's one more step towards having all the guns Rainbow Six have. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:55, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
::Those videos are pure speculation. I'm sure those are all . We will only document weapons that are confirmed by the developters and seen in gameplay.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:20, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

== Hbar? ==
I don't want to offend anyone but, what the mother is a Hbar?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:19, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

Its the Heavy barreled variant of the Aug meant to be a squad based machine gun - Mythekal

:Hbar could also be refering to anything really. Heavy barrel anything. I've seen plenty of AR-15 variants in movies with Hbars. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:01, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
::[http://e3.gamespot.com/video/6211390/?hd=1&tag=live-schedule] Sometime when the player passes over ennemies' corpses, he can take their weapons. One of them (the other is often a FA-MAS) is a AUG. There is four letter after it, a H at the beginning and I don't see well the other 3. But there is only one variant of the AUG with a "H" in its name, and that's the HBar.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 08:24, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Could someone upload a image of the icon in the above video? The link isn't working for me.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:43, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

I just watched the E3 gameplay again. The AUG HBAR pick up symbol looks amazingly like the SA80 British service rifle. Might be a place holder or something.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

:I made a note of it in the actual page. It DOES look like an SA80 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:27, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

::My money's on a mislabel. We know the standard AUG is confirmed (all those screenshots) so why not the HBAR too?--[[Special:Contributions/142.162.149.33|142.162.149.33]] 17:12, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

::If you pause it right before you kill the guy who carried it it's an AUG. So therefore its a mislabel. (I wish I can upload the screenshot but dun know how.)
:::Sign you posts for christ's sake.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 15:55, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
== Correct Name ==
I think we should call this game Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 instead of just [[Modern Warfare 2]] because we have a entire alphabetized series of Call Of Duty in the Video Games Category and just putting this in the "M" section does not look we even have this page. If somebody knows how to put this in the "C" section with out changing the name that will be organized.

:Well that's the problem. Originally it WAS called Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 and some still do, but officially, the publishers decided to shorten the title for some reason. We COULD for alphabetize sake, put Call of Duty in front so it fits with the others. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:08, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

:And I've successfully changed the name [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:10, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

::Wait, I thought the reason that this was called Modern Warfare 2 was because Infinity Ward no longer wanted to make any more WWII related games and as such gave the "Call of Duty" moniker to Treyarch. Modern Warfare is supposedly now a separate series from Call of Duty. [[User:Markit|Markit]]
:Modern Warfare is its own series now and isn't a CoD game anymore.-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 04:39, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
::Or we could make a new "Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2" page which bring it here.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 08:12, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
::[[Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2]]--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 08:19, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

:Actually, this game is still being published by Activision that published the previous game. It is STILL apart of the Call of Duty franchise, they just chose to officially call this game just Modern Warefare 2. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 08:33, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Keep it modern warfare 2, but link them together, like GM did linking all the dirty harry movies together.

I just saw a new official cover art for the game. It says
CALL OF DUTY
MODERN WARFARE 2
so i think we should call it call of duty modern warfare 2 -Mandaloin

Thats just the boxart. Officially by the gamedevs its only called Modern warefare 2. They just slapped "call of duty" on there because a lot of people are stupid enough not to realise this IS a sequel to Call of Duty 4: modern warefare [[User:5t3v0|5t3v0]]

== Taskforce 141 = Rainbow Six ==

A multinational commando unit? The moment I read that, I immediately thought Rainbow and well we really can't complain what kinds of weapons these guys uses since they are a fictional unit like Rainbow so they can use whatever they want. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:18, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
:I was expecting the task forece to be from the UN. That would be cool.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:35, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
::But if they say they are are UN taskforce makes the team sound kinda...pointless Like the UN does anything. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:39, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
:::I though Rainbow Six was a UN Task Force? Anyway, a movie or televison series about a UN Uber badass task force that were formed to catch international criminals would be really cool. The problem with the UN is that they try to be neutral and being neutral doesn't do anything. The UN should be reformed to be more of a International police that works against international criminals and make international laws.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:50, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
I like the UN the way it is. What you're talking about sounds like the first step to a totalitarian society.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]
:What i'm talking about is stuff like Resolution 84. I also like the UN the way it is but, they fail at quick responses to genocide such as the Rwandan Genocide in 1994.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:00, 10 June 2009 (UTC)
In general they fail at mostly any response. They just don't have the power to back up their enforcement of peace. Any peace keeping force with too much power can be oppressive. Who will keep the peace keepers in check when they're suppose to keep us in check? Quite the dilemma. I just don't think the idea of the U.N. or anything similar can work.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

:The United States shall keep the UN in check, without US, there is no UN. They need us more than we need them. It might seem like typical arrogant American mentality, but from how things are, the US has more indirect influence and handle over the entire world. We are the world's insurance policy, the self proclaimed enforcer, guardian, peacekeeping super power despite all our internal problems with crime, money and other things, but because of our population and how relatively young our nation is, the intense diversity in culture and believes keeps us in check. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:07, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
::The Problem is when someone like Bush Jr. comes up and s everything up. Could you imagine having someone like him being President of The United States during the Cold War? Anyway, The UN did have a really good quick response to the North Korean invasion of South Korea. We almost had North Korea. If weren't for the goddamm chinese.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 15:19, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
: Yeah if it weren't for them all this Kim Jong Il shit wouldn't be happening and we wouldn't be about to go to war in Korea-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 18:57, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
::Hey Smith, if someone is at fault for not winning the Korean War and not having only one Korea, is Mao. Truman also kinda ed up by telling the 7th Fleet to enter the Taiwan Straits.
:::Um, Task Force 141 is a play on Task Force 121, which in real life is a (dare I say) black ops verison of JSOC. -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]

I think the Task Force 141 is referring to Task Force 145 in reality. Task Force 145 is a joint force combining US and UK special forces

Task Force 121 was in no way a Black Ops Unit. It was, as 145 is, a multinational military unit assigned dircetly to counter-terrorism. Task Force 121 no longer exists it is now known as 145, which is what Task Force 141 in the game is based off of.

team rainbow was made to combat terrorism the old commander of ranbow is was a navy seal and a cia agent. he is the guy in clear and present danger is his name mr. clark.

Yeah that's from the original book, Rainbow Six. The games are all based around it. He was and Ex-SEAL who was recruited by the CIA and became an Operator[a Spy, if you wanna be movie technical.]. His name was John Clark.

:My Rainbow Six history isn't what it used to be, but I'm pretty sure John Clark was just the director of Rainbow and didn't do much field work (most of which was left to Ding Chavez, at least until the Vegas games when he was promoted to Six and Logan and Bishop were brought into the picture). [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 09:34, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

True, he didn't do much feild. About all he did in the basis of feild work was at the end of the novel where they hunt down the Bio-terrorist's and chase them to their secondary base in Brazil. He run's the show basically as Feild Commander.

Task Force 141 in-game is made-up of an unknown amount of countries military. The three that you can definately tell are, U.S. Military, British S.A.S., and Australian S.A.S.

== More weapons comfirmed ==

It seems that p90 is making a return and spas 12 will also be ingame
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFKBEQoSpu8
:That guy got a lot of the guns wrong and that AUG Hbar looked more like a SA80 to me. And what the hell is up the people thinking that the FAL in the trailer is a AK? It looks nothing like it!-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 13:00, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

:Well, most people are unaware of all the different kinds of firearms. I'm surprise this guy in the vid ID as much as there was. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:32, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

== CPT. Price ==
I hope we get to find out if CPT. Price from CoD4 survived or not. That's been bugging me... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:47, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
:I think it would cheapen the ending of Modern Warfare 1 if he survived.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:51, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

How would that cheapen the ending of the first game? It was never clear if any of the team's survived. What about the Mile High Club mission where you hear Price and Gaz talk? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:33, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
:Gaz got shot in the face with a Desert Eagle, he's dead.-protoAuthor

Captain Price leads the Task Force in this game!

No, Soap leads the Task Force

Soap does sound kind of similar to Cpt. Price. I guess Price rubbed off on him a little or something.

*Price managed to last for sixty years without ageing, dying or trimming his moustache, so I can't see a little thing like being shot dead getting to him. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 10:16, 10 June 2009 (UTC)
:Well...I would like if he came back right at the end and save Soap and Roach. But, he better have a even glourious moustache.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:00, 10 June 2009 (UTC)
::Actually, recalling CoD1 a little more, Price has ''already'' died once in the series. He was shot dead on board the ''Tirpitz'' and you just left him there, only for him to turn up again in CoD2 apparently none the worse for it. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 08:26, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Didn't COD2 take place before COD1?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 11:25, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
::::Can't remember, to be honest, I didn't play it that much; I was busy being an Annoyed PC Gamer because they took away my quicksaves, fire modes and health packs and replaced them with Not Being Killed Grenades [throw one to not be killed by that machinegun!]. Still, this is his second death in the series, so I wouldn't expect it to cramp his style much. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 12:22, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
:Gaz and Griggs got wasted though.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 13:03, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

The Cpt. Price in CoD 1 and 2 is a diffrent Price, most probably grandfather. And it is unsure if Price died or if he got promoted and got a higher position...

*Oh come on, it's either a clone or the same guy, they just came up with that when people started seriously questioning an extremely silly off-hand reference. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 07:09, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

Don't talk about something you don't know sh¤t about... [http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Price_(Call_of_Duty_4)] the two Cpt. Price are two diffrent guys

*Two different, totally identical guys. It's an elaborate cover story to hide that Price is invincible and immortal. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 11:48, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
:Captain Price is a symbol representing the glourious British Military. Ok, he is just a tradition for the Guys at Infinity Ward but it would be really cool if he was a symbol.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:11, 18 June 2009 (UTC)
:Hes dead a russian medic was seen trying to revive him but failed an started bashing his chest

Gaz... gone, .50 AE round to the face and you're done. Price... I doubt he'd be returning because let's face it he did die in COD4 and the Russian medic wouldn't have pounded his chest if he didn't die. As far as previous games go, Price was able to return because they didn't really have a tight storyline to them. But this Modern Warfare series does. So if Price returns, I think it'll be a bit ridiculous.
:I like that they Replaced Price with Soap but there is one thing i don't like about it.

No Glourious Mustache.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 01:07, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
::Yes, but apparently Soap has a glorious Mohawk. And Price could be a good Zombie.

Even if Price lived through the end of COD4, do you really think he'd still fight?
:What reason would there be for him ''not'' to? Guys get wounded and go back to active duty all the time. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 12:00, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

The Voice Actor, Billy Murray, has been confirmed as having worked on the project, if that's worth anything.
:: Unfortunatly that could just end up being part of a flashback mission like in CoD 4. Here's hoping it's for a part of the main game.[[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 12:27, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

-Hes in the new trailer. Seriously, end of debate- k9870
::If you're on about the guy on the assault boat, all we see is a guy in a boonie from behind. I'm going to withhold judgement until the game actually comes out.[[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 12:35, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

At beginning of the Takedown level, Royce addresses "Bravo Six," Price's call sign from CoD4. Keep in mind that Captain Macmillan was Alpha Six, and that Soap's call sign is ''rumored'' to be Papa Six.
:: Except Bravo six was also Lt Vasquez's callsign. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:55, 23 October 2009 (UTC)
:: Except that Vasquez died in a nuclear explosion. Price's odds of survival are much better that someone who was nuked, crashed in a helicopter, and then exposed to radiation.
::: Hence my point, which is that the callsign is non-indicative. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 13:00, 5 November 2009 (UTC)

I think everyone here just needs to except that Cpt. Price has returned and is immortal like many other great men with Facial hair (I.E Gordan Freeman, Solid Snake, Chewbacca)
:Actually chewbacca dies. Gets a moon crashing into him.-protoAuthor 05:22, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

it has been rumored that captain price (billy murray) will return as the commander of the 22 reg along with SSGT griggs (somehow) due to the fact we have been told (through the twitter page) that the voice actors have been paid record their voices but even then thiers nothing from stoping them from making another flashback mission with them

:Hence my original point. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 11:53, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

sorry ment to update that earlier CPT price is confirmed as retuning as the unit leader again after soap and roach break him out of a Russian prison (at that point price trys to kill roach but stops when he sees soap) the M1911 that you see on soap is the same as whats from MW1 which is returned to price then you can figure the rest out. end of story. regards scarec

The voice actor of SSGT. Griggs from the first MW, came back as the narrator of the SEALs in multiplayer. Same as Craig Fairbrass does as Ghost for all the Special Ops missions and for Task Force 141 on multiplayer.

:SEALs? Don't you mean Rangers? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 09:35, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

In Multiplayer, you have a different voice that announces the game for the Rangers. You would hear an american voice say "insert type of game", then he would say "Rangers lead the way". The voice of Griggs would say "insert type of game" then "let's do this", in mulitplayer, you can play middle easterns, Brazillians, russians, british, and Rangers. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:50, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

==General Observations==
Though I freely admit I got wood watching this trailer one thing I noticed is that the guys from ''Infinity Ward'' seemed to have recycled some scenery. When they showed the guys running through the alleyways of Rio I swear it reminded me of the alleyways of the Arab capital the Marines run through in [[Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare]].

:Not really. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:38, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

== The New pictures ==
Could someone tell me where did that picture of the american soldier with the M4 came from?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:10, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
:http://www.modernwarfare247.com/news/special-ops-characters --[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 17:30, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
::Jesus Christ, is the weapons section of that website all kinds of ed up. Thet called an FN-FAL a G3 and they called an AK-74 a AK-47. What the mother ? At least that means that we, IMFDB members, have the best website documenting weapons in Modern Warfare 2. But still, what the mother ?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:38, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Is all the cussing necessary but yes I do agree that this website is the most reliable.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

Wow... that site has the MP5 listed as being 40. S&W [[User:5t3v0|5t3v0]]

LoL that site is horrible... if you think that page is bad just jump into the forums... all kinds of gems in there... read the one about the Taurus Raging Bull. the guy says "goodluck reloading its four barrels" <- That had me laughing with the stupidity of that statement. - Furious Oyster

== TAR-21 or F2000? ==
[[Image:MW2TR6.jpg‎|thumb|none|400px|A Brazilian Militia firing the unknown rifle, presumably a[[FN F2000#FN F2000 Tactical|FN F2000 Tactical]]]]
Isn't it a TAR-21 rather than a F2000?--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 08:44, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
:It's way too big to be a Tavor. Most likely an F2000.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:40, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
::Yeah... the form is rather an F2000 too...--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 08:44, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
:My question is where the is the scope?-[[Special:Contributions/76.31.5.208|76.31.5.208]] 15:25, 25 June 2009 (UTC) (S&Wshooter)
::There is an version of the FN2000 that has the scope replaced with rails. I guess that's the one in the picture above.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:18, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Whats that under the F2000? Its too skinny to be an M203, I think its a shotugn--[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 03:59, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
::::Looks like an Remington 870.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 13:49, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
How the hell would they fit a shotgun/Masterkey on the three inches of forward rails that the F2000 has? More like a shotgun with an F2000 attachment, rather than the other way around.--[[User:Halorocka888|Halorocka888]] 18:33, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
:::::Well it definetly looks to be a shotgun, however it's mounted on there.--[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 16:23, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

:I see it now. It is an F2000 with the shotgun attachment and the way the shotgun is attached makes the gun look retarded. They didn't make the SCAR's own grenade launcher attachment, so obviously they didn't do the F2000's attachment and worse, they didn't take off the removeable handguard and just put the M203 directly under the barrel, they had to slap it at the bottom of the damn thing. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:46, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

::I have heard however that the F2000s red dot sight in multiplayer is the standard F2000 optical sight, much like the TAR-21 uses the MARS sight in multiplayer as well, and the L86 uses the SUSAT in place of the ACOG. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:::I've used F2000s with the standard scope in Special Ops and the L86 does indeed have a SUSAT (that thing is horrible, BTW) in place of the ACOG. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 09:37, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

== MP7? Are you sure? ==

Where do you exactly see MP7?

I only see custom MP5 (or MP5k without foregrip) on the right and two copies of another unidentified weapons on the left.
They have curved magazines where MP7 has foregrip and their casing is completly different.
MP7 doesn't match...
[[User:Morihaus|Morihaus]] 17:51, 25 June 2009 (UTC)Morihaus

I saw a picture of it yesterday and i cant remember where. and i think it was a russian behind a shield, but im not sure if i remember that correctly. but the MP7 is definitely here -Mandaloin

The MP7A1 is seen in the Reveal trailer in the hands of the Brazilian Secret Service agents fighting off an insurgent force from a crashed C-130-Kellers357

== FAL Please ==

I know one of the screenshots show's what appears to be an MD-2, but I still wanan see a FAL in MW2. I'm getting annoyed by G36Cs and M16s and G3KA4s in all these games. The FAL was a true combat rifle, and I do has want (sorry for net speak)--[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 20:57, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
: I absolutely agree with the above statement-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 21:02, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
::Me too but, the MD-2 is good enough for me. And it is Brazilian! That makes me proud of being Brazilian.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:28, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
: I like the Imbel also, its a pretty solid gun-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 21:57, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
::Which Imbel? Imbel is the manufacturer.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 21:58, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
:Their FAL copy with the fixed stock (it's the only one I've held)-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 22:11, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
::Those are just called FN FALs.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:16, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
:::The Imbel is great and all, but the FAL is a solid 7.62 rifle. Also, I noticed they're using the AUG A1, not A3 for MW2. I'm pleased with that as the original AUG model was always my favorite.--[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 22:08, 26 June
2009 (UTC)

== TDI "Kriss" ==
I know the Kriss is going to be hyped in MW2, as its a powerful .45 ACP SMG that has virtually no recoil and great accuracy. But the guys at IW won't let such a perfect gun into multiplayer, because it'll turn into a noob weapon fast. My bet's on that they purposely change one of it's stats to make it more balanced. Any guesses on what they'll take away from it? My bet is make it less powerful.--[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 16:17, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
:There IS recoil in the Kriss. Every gun has recoil.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:20, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
::True, but it varies what the recoil force actually ''does'' and how much of it the user feels; the recoil has to go somewhere, but it can be towards things like fighting the gun's own muzzle climb by shoving a weight downwards [as with the Kriss], stopping a barrel that's moving forwards [as with the XM307 / XM312], or quite a number of other things. The general idea is that the Kriss has very light felt recoil for its weight [less than half the weight of a Thompson] because of the novel operating system. And I imagine they'll either limit the magazine, turn it into a peashooter or make it horribly inaccurate. [[User:Tim|Tim]] 02:04, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:::Or Infinity Ward could make the Kriss a Kicking Rad gun that you will get when you reach the highest level. An all around gun.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 02:16, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
::::What about the Rate of Fire? i don't remember if the Kriss had a high R.O.F. or not
:::::From the Future Weapons video I watched on the Kriss, it seems to have an average MP5 like rate of fire. But if IW does let the Kriss go all out, it'll be revenge of the pwned when people get a hold of it. Take that noob tubers! Have some .45 slugs in the face!--[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 16:27, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
::Hey man, the noob tube is awesome.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:36, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

::People who hates tubers are just gamers. Sure I get off when I get hit in the face by an M203, but hell, I use one too. It's a very good field weapon. In combat, there is no such thing as cheap shot. There's hit and miss. Even in games, if you killed a guy, it's a kill, doesn't matter how you did it, unless you used cheats, but I use the M203 all the time, and 2 shells is what you get in multiplayer, so quit complaining, those on the recieving end of my tube. Now the P90 was a widely used gun for noobs cause of it's high ROF and mag capacity and with the slight of hand perk, you can reload the faster than you could in real life[[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:04, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
:::People who complain about tubes in modern games don't remember the days of real noob-tubes, back when the 203 was your alt fire, had realistically-sized splash and had a zero arming distance, and a newbie could easily end a game with a positive score just by firing it point-blank whenever they had more than one person in front of them. [[User:Vangelis|Vangelis]] 07:23, 7 July 2009 (UTC)
I agree i just hate the loss of a perk its better than juggernaut.--[[User:Panther61DC08|Panther61DC08]] 20:02, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

::ANYTHING is better then juggernaut man. And yeah, I use the M203 from time to time, but people who use it constantly should really just go sit down.--[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 18:13, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

Most online gamers are idiots who most likely don't know the difference between a bullet and a bolt carrier, so they're going to label anyone who kills them a [insert gun name here] noob. If you kill them with an M4, you're an M4 noob. If you kill them with a P90, you're a P90 noob. If you kill them with a shotgun, you're a shotgun noob. It never ends. The point of playing a game is to have fun, so I'm gonna use what I like to use (including the 203) regardless of what everyone else thinks about it. If I nail some tit in the face with a 40 mike-mike, they can whine and cry "noob tuber" all f'n day, it isn't going to change that I put a 40 mike-mike into their face. Only thing about me is that I can do it from a block away (an in-game block, I mean), rather than at point blank. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]
:I have a Class that it's specialty is to piss people off. Yes, i am a asshole. BUT, i am a professional asshole.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 23:01, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

:As far as the Kriss goes they sure as hell have never fired it (which disappoints me that they put all these exotic weapons in that they really havent touched... in COD4 they actually fired most of the weapons and that gave it a level of authenticity) so i dont think they'll pay attention to the fact that it takes most of the recoil for you. when you fire it youll probably be shooting all over the place with heavy recoil -Mandaloin

::Well looky here, an icon for picking up a "FAL Red Dot sight" In the Multiplayer trailer. There is a god, because the FN FAL has finally made it into an awesome game![[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 05:36, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

The Kriss does seem to have a comparably short barrel to the UMP. IW could lower the damage due to the lower velocity? not sure what barrel length is ideal for .45ACP but I just thought that could be used as a reason to balance? that and the Kriss only uses the .45 Glock pistol mags correct? so maybe your attachment is an extended mag to help compete? -FuriousOyster

:From what we've seen, the Kriss in MW2 is already being used with the experimental 26 round magazine currently being developed for the gun. As for barrel length, it's on par with the UMP, plus its shorter overall. Who knows, maybe IW will just make the Kriss what it is in real life, a hard and precise hitting sub machine gun. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 01:51, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Apparently IW got the Kriss right on how controllable it is when firing on full auto. It doesn't go all over the place. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:50, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

:The Vector is stunningly good. A bit down on power, but accurate and it can handle it's high ROF. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:Been unlocking the attachments for the Vector and it is kind of nerf on the power. It's really not the strong, but has a high rate of fire and accuracy [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:52, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

== HK416? ==

Possible HK416-

The SAS guy with the Mohawk & Glock @ 0:30 of the reveal trailer seems to carry something resembling an HK416 (Notice the rear H&K hallmark diopter sights...).
--[[User:Wikinerd|Wikinerd]] 15:43, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
:Thats actually Soap. -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]

that is either the M4 or M468(most likely an M4)

Why would they add the HK 416? Internally it's far superior to the M4, but as far as video games go they're virtually the same.

I hope they don't. It's not that I necessarily hate the HK416 (well, okay, maybe I do ''a little bit''), but let's give LWRC's or Colt's gas pistons some love. The 416 and XM8 are way overused in shooters today. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]
:And the rear sight on Soap's M4 looks more like an ARMS #40L to me. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]

:Again, why do people think that when they see a cool looking AR15 in a game or a movie shot they RIGHT AWAY say, HK416 or M468 AKA REC7 as it is called now.? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]
::Because a lot of people are so fracking biased against DI guns that it's crazy. They're quick to tout the AK's widespread use as an example of its so-called "superiority", but that same argument means "absolutely nothing" to the same people when it's applied to the M4 and variants ''chosen'' by elite forces all over the planet. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:34, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

yeah, i agree, it is ridiculous, especially since you can upgrade an m4 to perform exactly like any of the other new weapons and do it for a $1,000 cheaper. it makes you wonder why were even replacing the m4?
:Same reason the army bought a new grenade launcher: It's shiny and new. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 04:34, 25 October 2009 (UTC)
Well you have to think about the old saying. If it isn't broken, don't fix it. But with weapon systems, they do get out dated and don't last forever. Eventually it's naturally to want to replace what you have now even though it's an effective piece of equipment that's served you for many years. Think back when the M16 was first introduced. It got so much crap from the old timers in the military that it took almost a decade to get it fielded. And now the M16 is a beloved icon of American power and loved by millions. Times change and so would weapons. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:55, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

==FN P90==
Why haven't anyone added the P90? It has been confirmed and in the E3 trailer there was a pickup icon for the P90 and it said "Press # to ick up P90"
:Did you miss [http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Modern_Warfare_2#FN_P90TR this?]-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 16:32, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

== Re-added ==
Hey evryone Activision has decided to re-add the Call of Duty prefix back to the Modern Warfare 2 title making the game now being called: Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2, instead of just Modern Warfare 2? Actvision added the Call of Duty prefix because of the lowered awareness of the Call of Duty series [[User:Drjuki|Drjuki]] 17:16, 13 July 2009 (UTC)
:So we're changing the name again on this site? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:42, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
::The changing is not official yet. They're still calling the game "''Modern Warfare 2''" (source: [http://kotaku.com/5315981/infinity-ward-talks-modern-warfare-2-43-stories-up]). In fact, nobody at Activision or Infinty Ward ever called the game "''Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2''", search any quotes you want. Also, the hardened and prestiges editions (collector versions) don't have "''Call of Duty''" on their boxes.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 14:40, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

i luv p-90 its awesome. i'v been playing modern warefare for one week now and what i did was i got bling pro(allows you to chose 2 perks) and i took a p-90 and put akimbo and rapid fire. its CRAZY. whenever your in close quarters with that combo, your invincibal.

-evilmidget25

ps il be online soon, its been three months and ill be back on chrismas

== Walther WA2000 ==
Does someone has an ingame picture of this game, because I doubt its presence in the game. And there is no use for a weapon to be listed if there is no proof.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 17:18, 18 July 2009 (UTC)
:I strongly concur with Phantom. --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 17:16, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

== Behold, a really, really silly bundle: ==

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=219720

I can understand doing that for something like a ''Splinter Cell'' bundle (sorta), but... [[User:Vangelis|Vangelis]] 08:42, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

:I'm so getting that... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]

NVG's that max out to 50 feet, failll

:*facedesk* Behold, NVGs for less then 200 with a $70 game and art book, Who wants to bet those are made by a company who's name you can't pronounce and is based in a country that rhymes with Dina? Anyhow, I already pre-ordered the standard game, I don't need fancy art books and hard cases and crappy NVGs, I just want what may be the best FPS ever created, period. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 01:48, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
::I'm don't want the nod to use, I just want them as a bad-@$$ display for the living room. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]

== Cover Restoration ==
Does anyone have any unique or expensive software to put this image on the front page?

[[Image:Modern Warfare 2 Cover.jpg|thumb|left|200px|Original]]
[[Image:Modern Warfare 2 Final.jpg|thumb|none|350px|The best I could do.]]

It's not the standard edition box.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 15:06, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

== SPAS-12? ==
Do you think this shotgun is a SPAS-12? Since we were shown that there is one in this level during a gameplay demo, it could be possible.
[[Image:MW2shotgunspa.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

its a FAMAS- the folded bipod

:Nope, it's a WA2000

::The Walther WA2000 has a "skeletal" look to it and is a bolt-action sniper rifle. This image shows the weapon having a pump gauge at the bottom, meaning that it must be some sort of shotgun, as opposed to the WA2000's bolt-action. <s>Besides, I may be mistaken since I don't pay much attention to the FAMAS, but the last time I checked, the FAMAS didn't have a folding stock.</s> --[[User:Blemo|Blemo]] 04:44, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
:::Sorry, I didn't see that you meant "bipod", not "stock". I don't see the point in the FAMAS having one of those, either. --[[User:Blemo|Blemo]] 04:45, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

It's not a shotgun, the "handgrip" is too long to be a pump like you were saying, i agree with the fact that it is a WA2000, it has the same front end and flash hider as the walther. By the way, the walther can be either semi or bolt action.

yeah i think its a Wa200 too, you can even see a fat ol' scope and a bipod on it. look real close for the scope.

Now that I think about it, it looks more of a WA200, if not a SPAS-12, and it is definitely not a FAMAS. And please, fellas, sign your edits. --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 17:19, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

== Confirmed Weapons ==
Could someone tell me where those weapons were confirmed?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:41, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
:Which one?--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 18:35, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
::All of them. But if you can only confirm only one, then confirm the MD3.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 18:41, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
:::For the Imbel, I think it's almost sure. It has the look, it's Brazil... But it can still be a FAL... For the others like G36, Walter WA2000 or HK416, I will delete them until they provide us screenshots or other proofs that these weapons will be in the game. They think because modernwarfare247.com has listed them, it will be in the game but it's just a fansite, not an official one, and they don't have ingame screens to prove like us.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 20:14, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
:Yeah, the Imbel Makes sense to be in the game.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:33, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
::The forearm looks more like an Imbel than a FAL too.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 11:23, 22 July 2009 (UTC)

Does this help on the FAL?
http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Image:Fal_online_vid.png
[[User:Hoot471|Hoot471]]
:HELL YES. Thank god there is a FAL in this. And, yes that helps on the FN FAL.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:53, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
::So, it's almost sure that the weapons carried by the brazilians are FAL? I don't think they will include two weapons pretty identical... Unless they changed the rate of fire on each weapon much like the M4/M16 AR.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 22:02, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
:It's the Imbel but Infinity Ward named it FN FAL. Like the AKMSU/AK-74S fuck up in Modern Warfare 1.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 23:50, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

I think its the fal, it looks like it uses a bigger magazine therefore a bigger round, the MD 3 uses 223, the fal uses 308
::I noticed that too. It looks like a FN FAL with an 30 round magazine. But look at the Forearm. It looks like an MD-3 forearm to me.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 13:47, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
:::But it could be based on the DSA SA-58, which has a shorter fore end, and curved .308 mags do exist. Either way though, a FAL in Mw2 is win in my books. Infact, here's a nice picture that may help that theory, [url]http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Image:DSA-SA-58-OSW.jpg[/url] [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 01:45, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Terribly disappointed that the 1911 is not used in multiplayer - JanG

:Not just disappointing, it's a crime. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:54, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

==M4==

The M4 used in the game had been confirmed as a Bushmaster M4. According to one of the guys working on MW2 he has told in the Call of Duty wikia that the M4 is a Bushmaster M4.... Could someone add that??

:wheres the proof?

::As of now, nothing can be added to the main article since there are no sources or evidence that provide the actual facts. Do you happen to have a link of the official statement? I think what he means is that the M4 (when mounted with sights or scopes) looks like a Bushmaster ORC (Optics-Ready Carbine), since it's rear and front sights are already removed. But just because it looks like it doesn't mean it has to be a Bushmaster. And again, guys, please sign your edits. Cheers, --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 21:51, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

The M4 IS a Bushmaster! And proof is right here on IMFDB! I took this from the pic of Soap and enlarged it.

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm97/SpartanWarrior198/Soap_Bushmaster_M4.jpg

Snake logo on the mag well is Bushmaster's. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 12:48, 8 September 2009 (UTC)
:And I just noticed Soap is wearing US Army UCP, as well... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]

:So what? In this fictional universe, Bushmaster makes all the M4s? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:28, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

::Well, true, but this is a video game set in the near future. It could very well be possible that Bushmaster took over M4 production from Colt (since their exclusivity agreement expired back in June) in the Modern Warfare world.[[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 12:07, 14 September 2009 (UTC)
::And I doubt IW would put two or more different identical "M4s" in the game. I can see an M4 and HK416 or REC7 put side-by-side in the game because there are some slight external differences (and caliber increase in the case of the REC7), but there'd be no point in having separate Colt and Bushmaster M4s, both virtually identical externally, at the same time. But then again the still above could very well be just promotional with a Bushmaster put in because it's all they had available to model. But we'll find out for sure Nov. 10th... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:45, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
:::Hmm... Bushmaster may have used the Call of Duty franchise to advertise for their weapons, as seen on the lower receiver of the M4. Maybe likely, maybe not; but it is a possibility. Cheers, --{{User:Blemo/Sig}}
::::HK did it with R6, so why can't Bushmaster do it with MW2? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 04:37, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

==Winchester 1887==

No way this is a winchester 1887, you have to out of your mind to think that.
http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Image:MW2Winch1887.jpg
http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Image:Winchester1887shotgun.jpg

yeah dude there's one in there, it must be like a cheat code to get it but there is a picture.

I dought you need a cheat code to get it as the enemy you can kill and take their weapons have it.
Also it could be the Chinese copy.
--[[User:Jake zergling|Jake zergling]] 23:40, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

There was a ''Public Ennemies'' version of the weapon which was closer to the one in the screenshot, but it has been deleted.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 22:16, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

:I think it would be peculiar to have the old lever shotgun in MW2, but definitely a cool choice of gun. It may not be the fastest or most powerful, but it has nostalgia and cool to it. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 18:13, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

It could be like the Stg-44 from COD4, a retro weapon.
It was called MP44 in Cod4 not Stg-44 that was in W@W just trying to help. -FuriousOyste
: The MP44/StG-44 was only in CoD4 as a nod to the other games in the franchise which are all set during WW2. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:41, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Maybe you can unlock Price's mustache as a nod to his awesomely awesome mustache from MW1? =D -FuriousOyster

Since IW seem to be going along the "fun" route while still sticking to a semi-realism point of view, it's probably safe to assume this was added as a "fun gun". It's likely with the recent videos of the "Flag Runner" and the addition of throwing knives there adding weapons that no serious soldier would use in direct combat but would be awesome to use a video game multiplayer match. It's possible they added it as a reference to Terminator 2, I wonder if they'll add the M79 and a portable minigun... [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 14:11, 02 September 2009 (UTC)
:There should be two reload animations. The first one you reload normally but in the second one you reload like the T-600, With one goddamm hand.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 17:05, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

::That was only chambering fresh rounds, not reloading it, but I see your poit. Either way though, having an old school lever action shotty will surely make things, uh, interesting? And throwing knives will just attract goddamn ninjas. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 01:46, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

:::Ninjas that I'll gladly lay waste to in MP. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 12:02, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

::::Amen to that man, they can throw all the knives they want, but that won't stop them from taking a burst of FAL rounds in the chest. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 23:55, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

:"Those who live by the sword get shot by the ones who don't". Ninja's were cowards anyways. They retreated rather than fought most of the time-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 00:05, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

::Not to mention that was against bows and arrows, not automatic rifles. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 18:14, 5 November 2009 (UTC)

for the reload animations I think the shells are being loaded in to the barrel!!

:No my friend, thats just how you load a lever shotgun. The tube you load the shells in to is the magazine, and the tube below it is where they eject from when you cock the gun after a shot. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

== Don't debate on the articles ==

Stop debating on the page do it in here that's what it is for.
--[[User:Jake zergling|Jake zergling]] 23:40, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

:I am confused you say not to debate here but then you say to debate here. I am new to this.
::Jake, can you speak english?-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 00:25, 30 July 2009 (UTC)
:::I mean don't debate on the main page with the articles it clutters it.--[[User:Jake zergling|Jake zergling]] 05:33, 30 July 2009 (UTC)
::::What Jake means, is that to hold all disputes, comments, and debates on the discussion (talk) page, instead of the article itself. The page you are looking at is the talk page and you should type any comments on this page. If you look at the top, there are seven tabs (varies on your status and monobook of the wiki), but for more users, it says, "page, discussion, edit, +, history, move, & watch". Make sure the "discussion" tab is pressed before you make your edit. Typing in the tab that says "page" makes the article look unprofessional and a hassle to read. Cheers, --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 21:49, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
:::::I'll move all the discussion here...--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 13:50, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

== Glock ==
The GameTrailers Analysis states that it is a [[Glock#Glock 22|Glock 22]], but this is unconfirmed. It could be a [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] since in the video demo shown at the E3 conference, it fires fully automatically.
[[Image:Glock18c_01-1-.jpg|thumb|none|400px|[[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] - 9x19mm. This model has compensator cuts on the slide and barrel to reduce muzzle climb while firing]]
[[Image:MW2Glock.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A [[Glock]] fired by "Roach" on a snowmobile in Mission "Cliffhangar". Note olive-drab frame.]]
[[Image:MW2SpOpGlock.jpg|thumb|none|300px|This US special ops has a olive-drab framed Glock in his thigh holster (barely off-shot).]]

*An interesting note is that the Glock fires dramatically slower than a Glock 18 or other converted Glocks. The Glock from the video's rate of fire is only around 600-700 RPM, where as a real Automatic Glock fires around 1100+ RPM -- Mythekal

:The guy COULD just be firing in semi VERY fast so that it seems like it's full auto. A lot of the handguns in COD4 if you tap the trigger in quick successions, it seems almost full auto [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:45, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

::Who ever put the screenshot on the page forgot to remind that the frame color is (tan) "Olive Drab". Glock 18's did not have this color available. Glock 22's just came out with this color somewhere in 2008. Of course I still wouldn't rule out it could be a Glock 18 with a replaced frame. But the writers probably wanted to put a new FBI (.40S&W) caliber into their Video Game arsenal.

:::Not to disagree with you, I mean, you strike a really good point, but I've seen video game companies butcher their weapons into having colors or functions that they don't even have in the first place. Perhaps this is the case, although highly unlikely. --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 17:08, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Not sure if anybody noticed, but the G18s in game does not have a selector switch - JanG

== H&K USP .45 ==
Shown in a stage demo for GameSpot, Roach wields it with a knife at the same time. There is a similar technique where you do this with a flashlight. If someone would care to name it please do as I forgot for the moment.

*Take your pick from CQC, CQB, Combatives or Defendu. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 11:27, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
** The particular technique shown below with the support arm under the wrist of the main arm indexing the flashlight along the axis of the barrel is called the Harris Method. In this case it's being done with a knife presumably because it looks cool.
*** It's actually done for CQC and not just cause it looks cool. A similar method to this is what Snake does on MGS.But he holds the Knife with the gun by the grips.Perhaps the Harries method is more comfortable than Snake's CQC method,so they made it that way.
****
[[Image:HK-USP.jpg‎|thumb|none|300px|Heckler & Koch USP .45 ACP. Note the slightly longer barrel/slide and grip compared to the 9mm and .40 S&W models above.]]
[[Image:USP_with_knife.JPG|thumb|none|400px|]]

== Akimbo ==

*Need some confirmation on this as I cant find any videos or images of this, supposedly the player is now able to Dual wield or go Akimbo with Pistols, particularly twin desert eagles were seen in a demonstration during a show off session to fans.

This is one of the websites with this article:
http://www.bit-tech.net/news/gaming/2009/08/27/modern-warfare-2-has-guns-akimbo/1

[[User:Draco122|Draco122]]

:There was a screenshot of the Desert Eagle being held akimbo during a gameshow in Vegas (the name of which I forgot...) I'm not sure if it was already added to the article, but I'll take a look. --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 04:10, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

:Now Akimbo? I'm having less and less faith in this new game with most of these cliche shit added on. We got too many kinds of new guns enough to put Rainbow Six to shame, odd matches for people and prototype guns in wide use. This game went from pretty cool to up down cliche generic shooter. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 19:52, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

== Leaked Video ==

Found this video while searching the net on youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FuwFT4p5hA

At 1:28 there appears to be a new weapon, it looks like it says "Shotgun" but the video is low qaulity and I'm having a hard time finding out what it is? The icon image looks similar to that of a Saiga shotgun but I'm not sure. From the looks of it, the IMI Mini Uzi will be making a return.

[[User:Draco122|Draco122]]

[[Image:Mw2brazilshotgun.png]] I think it says (litterally) "FAL w/ Shotgun"... Shotgun attachment?!--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 18:23, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

MASTERKEY! that would be awesome! on the other hand... COD4 shotguns were pretty pointless. so I doubt an even shorter barreled one would be worth it.

:Yeah, there have been rumors of an under-slung shotgun attachment. --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 04:30, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

::That does surely say FAL with Shotgun, as it matches the shape of the other FAL seen in a trailer, sweet! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 22:19, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

also confirmed in game masterkey is avalible -scarecrow

== Continuity Error(??) ==

Perhaps, in the E3 Gameplay video, the Infinity Ward boyz made a continuity error. If you will, note that Roach is first seen using a USP .45, but later, on the snowmobile, he switches to a Glock 18/22/whatever. Just a thought.

:Doubt it. games arn't that sloppy. Its probably given to you when you board the snowmobile because firing a semiautomatic weapon while you are going pretty fast wouldn't help much unless you have a very steady hand. better to have a wide spread than accuracy when you cant predict the enemy that well. [[user:5t3v0|5t3v0]]

::Well apparently you are able to equip 3 weapons?, but that still wouldn't explain how he got that glock.

:::What 5t3v0 says is true. Video game developers aren't that sloppy and I think that the publishers purposefully made this so-called "continuity error". I think that the Glock is for use only for the snowmobile portion of the mission, since its high rate of fire (compared to the HK USP .45) is more ideal for tracking and shooting fast-moving vehicles. Many other video games during their vehicle missions use the same logic (i.e. a mounted machine gun on the snowmobile in [[007: Nightfire]]). --''[[User:Blemo|'''B''''''le''''''mo''']] [[Image:Progress Wheel.gif]] [[user talk:Blemo|'''TALK''']] • [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|'''CONTRIBUTIONS''']] • [[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|'''EMAIL''']] • '''MESSAGE''''' 04:11, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

::::There's one on each of the snowmobiles, There's a holster somewhere.

Okay first of all, i know you know its just a game, so thats my first statement, and my second is, who says you cant have another holster on you, one on your thigh, one on your rig, or two on both your thighs? and then you either have access to it in the game or you dont, and we can all pretend like roach just doesnt want to use it until the snowmobile thing or something like that.

== New mw video ==

Gentlemen. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4PMRFkx07g

Damn, the MP5K Looks SWEET! And throwing knives? kick-ass!!! man as soon as this is released im disowning my copy of COD4.

== Double Barrel Shotty ==

According to the guys over at the COD Wiki, the Double barrel shotgun will make a return(from COD5), has anyone else seen this?

* It's possible with the inclusion of other "fun" weapons like the Winchester M1887 and Throwing knives, but I'm not going to get my hopes up about it... [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 14:18, 02 September 2009 (UTC)

:Try not to include wiki as a source unless there's pics of the actual shotgun ingame. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 13:41, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

::The OXM stated that (Official Xbox Magazine). The DB shotgun will have separate trigger for each barrel.--[[User:PhantomT1412|PhantomT1412]] 20:44, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

:::You said it will make a return, it never was in cod4, or are you referring to cod5? --[[User:Final Tsurugi|Final Tsurugi]] 15:50, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

::::Sorry, shouldve been a little clearer, i was referring to cod5

== Mk14 Rifle ==

The Mk14 on the screenshot is not a Mk14 Mod0 battle rifle but a Mk14 Mod1 ([http://www.imageseek.com/m1a/gallery/albums/closeup/Mk_14_Mod_1.jpg]), the second modification. Still based on the M14/M1A battle rifle/semi-auto rifle, but using M4 grip and stock with the EBR chassis. The version used by soaped also seems to sport a Magpul MOE stock with cheek rest.

Now that I see that new picture on the page with the mk14 in it I think that it is also a mod 1. Who else is thinks so?[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

== Highrise Gameplay videos (Cam) ==

http://www.gametrailers.com/game/modern-warfare-2/11043

Just saw this today, the "trailer" section also has a trailer cam of a predator missile and a supply drop, it also shows off the UMP45.

The newer highrise videos show a few weapons in the game that would now be deemed confirmed to a degree. It's labelled 1 through 5 in parts. They all feature different guns, I remember seeing two icons, one which was thought to be a place holder, the L85 was displayed as the L86 LSW (maybe an attachment for the L85?) including a PP-2000 Akimbo. Other's include various MG's which I can't identify, a SPAS-12 shotgun in full view (with appropriate icon) and the FAMAS and UMP.

[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 13:51, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

:The videos from Gametrailers also seem to show a silenced SPAS 12, which should be fun.

[[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 15:14, 16 September 2009

== New video confirms a few weapons==

A few weapons are probably confirmed by this video from Screwattack, PP-2000 amongst them.
http://www.screwattack.com/Events/MW2HandsOn
[[User:DAnnysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 14:39, 16 September 2009

:Just from watching, I saw the FAMAS, RPD, M4, SCAR, PP2000, AT4 (now a weapon not a perk, and more.[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
00:48, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

everything in the game is now content locked. that means any weapon seen will be in the final game

happy hunting

==Zombie Mode==

Any idea if theyll have one?

No they wont. Instead they have a spec-ops mode. Besides, its not cool of Infinity ward to copy treyarchs thing. [[User:5t3v0|5t3v0]

Yeah, especially when Treyarch has made an entire career out of copying Infinity Ward

== Create A Class Menu ==

Several weapons,perks, and attachments have now been confirmed in a new video's on youtube including [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]], [[PP-2000]], [[M79 grenade launcher]], [[Cheyenne Tactical M-200 Intervention]], [[RPD light machine gun]], [[Franchi SPAS-12]] and much more.

Source: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K51MZPJ-Rd0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K51MZPJ-Rd0], [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xNCCkvV77s http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xNCCkvV77s]

[[Image:CreateAClass.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Create a Class Menu.]]

== Infamy (New Trailer) ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8toHfZm6jNE

The Guy in the Airport wearing a black suit (presumably this Makarov character) looks like he was carrying a SCAR-L but then I noticed the RIS rails to which it was just a regular M4. It was weird how they made look very similar to the SCAR-L, yet at 1:31 in the Infamy trailer there's a guy with outline of the SCAR-L. It looks like the "Mini-Uzi" is now confirmed to be apart of the machine pistol lineup of weapons. Also does anyone think the AK at 0:57 looks odd? Kinda looks to me like a AN-94. - [[Draco122|Draco122]] 07:07 05 October 2009

*The weapon Makarov was holding looked like an M4 to me, but I think your right about the Mini-Uzi being a machine pistol now. And as for the AK it looked like the rest of the AKs I've seen from ingame pictures and footage. [[User:Rock and Metal|Rock and Metal]] 20:53, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

:The guy is holding an M4. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:40, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

The Russian tactical team that responded to the airport attack were referred by Makarov as FSBs. Even though they did deploy from SWAT vans marked as FSB, the Russian soldiers actually wear MVD uniforms, meaning that they were actually interior troops.--[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] 18:52, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

== Wall of guns ==

Just got this off of Gametrailers TV. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:40, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

[[Image:MW2wallofguns.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
*Too late, man.)

== Sentry Gun ==

On Gamesrader.com, an article on the impressions of MW2, mentions a Sentry Gun in the Kill Streak list. After doing some research, I've found a supposed concept of the Sentry Gun on Modernwarfare247.com. Apparently it seems to be the XM312 .50Cal fitted with a Camera. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] 09:59, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

[[Image:Leaked-mw2-art-book-12.jpg|300px|thumb|none|XM312]]

maybe its a .50BMG on a CROWS-type system

:The Sentry Gun in the game is an M134 on a tripod, as I've used some in MP. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

==Screenshot==

The first two are Scars, the second has a Masterkey, the third with an ACOG doesnt quite look right, and I cant tell what the digital one is, any help?

[[Image:Mw2scars.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

The two on the right might be ACR's--[[Special:Contributions/24.63.181.248|24.63.181.248]] 03:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

The digital one is the bushmaster ACR. It looks a little funny but that is it.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

== W2000 ==

I'm not 100% certain on this, but isn't the W2000 a collector's sniper rifle? I mean this is a rather expensive sniper rifle made as a colector's rifle. So why would the military be using it in whatever war this game takes place in?

And we're supposed to know the thought process behind Infinity Ward's weapon decisions how?

Remember the game black where w2000s were just laying all over eastern europe?

:Yeah, ever since Black came out, WA2000s have been known to be laying all across Europe, ripe for the picking! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]] 23:57, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Haha Agent 47 spends thousands of dollars just to maintain one yet European armies can buy millions of them just to lay around randomly :P

From my play through, I can only find one. The one you see on the wall of guns picture.

I've seen them in several missions. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:57, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

== Unfocused ==

This game is looking more and more gimmicky by the day. It's as if they're going all out to jam as much modern technology into the game as possible, whether it makes sense or not. Brazilian militia with FN F2000 assault rifles? Russian terrorists with the TDI Vector? ''Really''? --[[User:MattyDienhoff|MattyDienhoff]] 08:56, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

It's true that I feel the game is adding so much new stuff it won't be anything like CoD4. It bothers me that Infinity Ward is going over the top just because of its huge fanbase.
[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

For those of you who have seen "Lord of War", remember Nicolas Cage's quote: "Where there's a will, there's a weapon." I'm sure that their theory for the MW2 universe is that some FN or TDI salesmen forgot who they were working for, and sold their latest & greatest weapons to the bad guys, and got paid more in a day or two than they would earn working for a decade. I believe that money is the most corrupting force on Earth. Also, I do recall a story about some F2000s winding up in the hands of a militia in East Timor a few years ago, and I'm not sure whether or not FN figured out how they got there.
-KLR
:I've heard of this happening with a custom M14 maker. One of their people was rebuilding some MK14Mod0 on the side and smuggling them to the phillipines if i rememger correctly. The man was caught and is spending a long vacation is club fed. --[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 17:05, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

As much as I agree that the weapons are going a little crazy (how the hell do Brazilians in the slums of Rio get their hands on such powerful NATO weaponry?), remember this game isn't set in the present day, its sometime in 2016 I think. So who knows, in that year the rarer weapons of today may be more widely available. Unlikely I know, but possible. [[Special:Contributions/90.213.208.208|90.213.208.208]] 10:45, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
:And besides, the game would be very boring if everyone had AK's. --[[Special:Contributions/24.63.181.248|24.63.181.248]] 22:05, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Not exactly. Im not liking the whole high end weapons idea for militia. I would have been fine seeing militia using ak variants and other common battle rifles. --[[User:mythekal|mythekal]]

You must remember that all gangs in Rio get majority of there weapons from buying over seas and from corrupt military and police units, who themselves have stockpiles of powerful NATO weapons (M4s, AKs, FNs,etc.). And the Brazilian militia's leader is an Arms Dealer who has ties with the Ultranationalists, any Arms dealer that big can afford to give his men some much more flashier weapons! Also this is just a game too!--[[User:Choi117|Choi117]]

In the first game the russians had g36cs, ak-47s, m9s and 1911s, not like, ak-74s and makarovs. In this they seem to have gone to just having tacticool bullpups and high-end everything.....I laugh if you pick p an m9 in brazil even though your infinitely more likely to get a taurus pt92.

One aspect of Modern Warfare 2 is notably the fact, that although not identified by developers, is the way in which the worlds runs, MONEY!, believe it or not but the American government has been dealing arms for years, all to up there pay check, the result is quite devastating, its give there own troops a disadvantage but what do they care money's, money, they would give nuclear weapons to iraq if there was enough money.

:Actually, the American government deals arms mainly to friendly nations and used to deal arms to CIA backed insurgencies. So, you know, they wouldn't be selling things like NUKES you moron. As far as the purchase of these weapons, just consider Mexico today: You have a 'military' (if you can really call the Mexican Army a military) where 250,000 soldiers have left to work for a drug cartel or just left the country, leaving their rifles with the cartels. Then you have those same cartels buying firearms from third world SA countries that were provided firearms by the US for insurgencies. Then you have cartels buying firearms from people very similar to Cage's character in Lord of War. In 2016, it's more than believable taht those dealers could be selling ill-gotten FN2000's to wherever they damn well please.

I think that they are adding all of these guns because after Zakheav died the ultranationalists kinda fell apart and now they use anything they get their hands on so some of their guys probably decided too buy their own guns and thought they might as weel go big.

- If you think this game is unfocused you haven't seen the 25 kill streak perk yet! A Freaking Tactical Nuke, I'm not joking: http://www.gametrailers.com/user-movie/modern-warfare-2-25th-killstreak/333858[[User:Draco122|Draco122]]

That idea makes the game sound more ridiculous than it already is. This is way over the top now.[[User:ShaDow XPS|ShaDow XPS]]

Can someone explain what "in egoview" means? pictures have the caption something like "the SPAS-12 in egoview " somethign like that. Is it suposed to mean first-person view, only written by someone with poor english?
: Presumably it refers to First-Person view. If you look, all the HUD text in those shots is in German. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 16:19, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

== M21 EBR ==

Just to make sure no one changes it back. Even though it doesn't technically exist, that is what its called in game. The logic behind the name is: M21 (Sniperized M14) + M14 EBR (Modernized M14) = Modernized Sniperized M14 = M21 EBR

Alright, to be blunt, I LOVE the M14. Whenever I used one in Call of Duty 4, it was like the second coming of Jesus Christ. I just got done reading that the M14 used in this game is, as said above, a M21 EBR, and is classified as a sniper rifle. When I found that out I was extremely pissed. What I don't get though, is that in the Breach and Clear video that is out there, there is clearly a Mk. 14, with open iron sights. Based on all of this bullcrap, it appears that you will not be able to use the M14/Mk.14 EBR/M21 EBR/or-whatever-the-heck-we-are-calling-it without a scope. I am aware that MW2 is somehow sneaking out into people's Xbox's already, and I would greatly appreciate if someone could elaborate on this?[[User:Run its a T-55|Run its a T-55]] 00:37, 5 November 2009 (UTC)

:Putting a scope on a Mark 14 doesn't change its designation. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 19:52, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
Been checking with various sources on M14's and this M21 EBR is just an M14 fitted into a Sage Stock. it's nothing more than the numerous M14's I've seen used as a DMR.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 17:35, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
:I say we just stick with calling it Mark 14 Mod 1 and note in the description that its in-game name is M21 EBR. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:04, 10 November 2009 (UTC)
:And, while I've not yet played MP, every instance of Mark 14 use in SP refers to it as "M14 EBR". [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 00:03, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

::It's officially called the M21 EBR in MP. However a friend of mine tells me when fitted with an ACOG it makes for an alright assault type rifle. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:::Still a Mark 14 as far as this site is concerned. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:57, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

::::And what pisses me off the most is that besides the scope and smaller magazine. it's a Mark 14 EBR. Why IW decided to turn it into a sniper is beyond me. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:::::I'd imagine they did it for balance, can't have a sniper rifle with a 20 shot magazine. Unless you get extended mags then maybe it might be better I dont know [[Draco122|Draco122]]

::::::I don't see how that's supposed to balance anything. 20 round magazine or not, a sniper rifle is still a sniper rifle. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:10, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

:::::::How much of a bump does extended mags do for the EBR anyhow? [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

::::::::I haven't gotten them yet myself, but I'll let you know when I do. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:06, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

== Two new videos ==
This is the level you get for beating the game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lhjh8KxFPkg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czJEO8skB64

Damn good videos, I'll have a lot of fun with that museum :D Does this mean theres not going to be any semi-auto assualt rifles? Everything seems to be full auto in those videos...:( [[Special:Contributions/90.213.208.208|90.213.208.208]] 19:38, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

in the video description it says that the person playing was using rapid fire.

They likely removed the use of the G3 and M14 from Multiplayer due to people using the modified controllers to enable rapid firing, though I remember seeing that "Rapid Fire" was being made as an Attachment for weapons, not something I'd imagine seeing in singleplayer [[Draco122|Draco122]]

:An added note about the "Museum" level is a button on the front desk. Press it and all the soldiers in the exhibits come alive and try to kill you! Good fun if you stock up from the weapons cases first. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

==Wow, Dual wielding all subguns?==

watched video of dual mp5ks and p90s........wtf is wrong here?

Where is this video?

:Even worse, I heard it was possible to dual wield shotguns. [citation needed] Yeah, ordinarily I wouldn't just put that out there without a source, but given all the other stupid decisions IW have been making lately, I can believe it. --[[User:MattyDienhoff|MattyDienhoff]] 01:49, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

you dual wield sawn off doubles, its showed in museum gameplay.

:Wouldn't firing a sawed off one handed dislocate your shoulder?-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 03:00, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Not necessarily, but that doesn’t mean it is the smartest way to shoot a firearm. --[[User:Mauser|Mauser]] 05:14, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

You know what this means, every noob on the planet will be duel wielding in MW2 like it's Halo 3 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:23, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

Meh, who cares? Yeah, I think dual wielding is an action movie cliche, too, but I'll just play the game the way I want and everyone else will do the same. It most likely won't be long until people are whining and crying about "dual wield noobs" like they do about so-called "noob-tubers". [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 19:56, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, i use a noob tube on one of my classes myself, it may piss people off, but snipers piss me off. Besides, its not like the noob toob is good in close quarters, it only holds two rounds and has slow ass reloads. I use mine to countersnipe when they try and hide behind cover.

:I only use noob tube when coming up against a map with lots of trenches or caves or buildings, the better to lob nades into. I prefer the ACOG in MW2, as now it doesn't suck like in CoD: 4 [[Special:Contributions/142.166.195.174|142.166.195.174]] 18:08, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Anyone who cries about what weapons, perks, or attachments another player is using needs to either learn how to adapt to the environment and opposition or quite playing multi-player altogether. "ZOMG! He killed me with a grenade launcher! Not fair! Waaah waaah waaah!" Some people just need to grow the feck up and stop being pansies. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 06:49, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree. the M203 is a useful tool. so are shotguns, i was sick of hearing "SHOTGUN NOOB!" after the first time i heard it. now this is just an opinion but when indoors and within the effective range, i dont think theres a better weapon. they provide a large spread pattern that can be useful in high stress situations. im not saying you dont have to aim a shotgun at close range, but neutralizing a threat can be easier with with buckshot (defense loads) than with a single slug from a pistol or rifle. in my opinion there is no "noob" weapon. when they are all used properly, each individual weapon serves a specific purpose. cheap tactics is what makes a bad player in my eyes. someone who uses a high capacity weapon (P90, Light Machine Gun) while sitting in one spot picking off players who are trying to have fun and play "right" just ruins the expirience for everyone else. and in my expirience these "campers" are the ones who cry like babies when THEY get dead at the hands of a P90 or shotgun. but thats just my opinion.--[[User:GLOCK10mm|GLOCK10mm]] 17:57, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

I don't particularly think ''any'' tactic is cheap (nor any weapon a "noob" weapon), no matter how "unfair" an advantage one thinks it gives. Some tactics are just simply more successful than others. The fact is that MW2 is a '''war''' game, and so goes the old saying ''all's fair in love and war''. If a machine gun camper kills me, so what? I'll just respawn and continue with the game. But that's the point, it's a ''game''. Some people take games way too seriously. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:14, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

:For me, my response to ppl calling others and me campers or sniper whore, noob tuber. I just reply "It's a legitimate strategy". Don't get mad, get EVEN. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:50, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

::Totally agree. I mean, I could possibly be wrong, but isn't "camping" essentially what snipers and machine gunners ''actually do'' in real life? I know it was last time I checked... And I sure as heck wouldn't want an M40A5 to clear a room with. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:07, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

== RIOT SHIELD ==

Just played the game and i have to admit the riot shield is the most fun weapon to use in multi-player. Bashing enemies to death is extremely gratifying. - JanG

i love when people use it, theyre easier to kill. Especially with the knife. If you are anywhere but directly in front of them they cant block it.

-k9870

That, sticky grenades, and powerful caliber fmj weapons are the only thing that can break through the shield - JanG

:A WELL AIMED grenade from an M203 would take a guy with a shield out[[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:48, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

::Unless the guy has a Blast Shield (explosive resistant face mask) equipped, he won't die unless it's a direct impact from a 40mm. He'll even survive sticky grenades on his shield. I've survived plenty with a Blast Shield on when I've got a Riot Shield. Half the time though, after a hit with a 40mm I'm near death anyway even with a Blast Shield on and usually the guy still has a second shot [[Draco122|Draco122]] 17:18, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

:::Hitting the shield with a 40mm won't kill the guy, the trick is to hit just behind or under him, launching his ass into the air. also FMJs work well, as do Semtex grenades. I myself use Marathon, Lightweight and Commando with my Riot Shield, as well as blast shield and an AA-12 for sticky situations. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

==Semi Auto only FAL==
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 21:39, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

:The only Thing I could think to defend it is in The Falklands War both the UK and Argentina used the FAL. Which the UK used their L1A1 in single fire only, the Argentinian Army had theirs on Automatic, which Military experts have said that after the third shot makes in an Anti-Aircraft gun. I've never fired one, but in the game I like the controlled fire of the FAL, of it would just fire like another AK.-Km314
:But it shoots way too slowly ingame to be of much use. They should have made it shoot in bursts of 2-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 04:40, 13 November 2009 (UTC)
::From what I experienced in Multiplayer, it's powerful, it would be way to powerful if it was full auto, I think Infinity ward was going for a thing like they did in CoD4 with the G3. 1:21, 13 November 2009

I think they purposely brought down single fire rate to keep people from using modded controllers too. The g3 would fire as fast as you pulled the trigger, and anyone with a modded controller had an unfair advantage. The FAL is a true single shot, mods or not. I like it.

To whoever said "military experts have said that after the third shot makes in an Anti-Aircraft gun", I believe one person on the Military Channel does not count as "military expert'''S'''
Just look at this guy: he's not shooting down any planes. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z1q8GiSIdc

If anything, the FAL with an ACOG makes a great DMR. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 00:54, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

:I dunno whats with all the fuss, I love the FAL in MW2. Sure auto would have been fun, but it's hugely accurate and powerful, not to mention long ranged. A Holo sight makes it a perfect AR, and an ACOG pretty much makes it competition for the EBR. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

But I think I wish it's like in Rainbow Six where you can switch firing modes. The first 2 Call of Duty games did that. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

:Yeah, and I sort of expected firing mode switches in MW2, but I guess not. But really, the FAL would be ridiculous on full-auto man. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

== Tacticool-ness ==
Well, this game is awesome and all, but i hate the fact that they made it to be a HALO knock-off. Dual wielding? Glock 18s? God, this there ever going to be a game that gets Special Ops right? -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]

:No, because the average person doesn't know dick about guns or the military-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 02:25, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
::I really thought that it would be a badass fucking game, which it is, but they made it just too fucking...tacticool. -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]

Its what happens when they cater to mall ninjas, dual g18s, dual deegs, dual sawn offs.... and the plot made no sense. Price launching a nuke, sheperd going bad, i love how the start of the game has sheperd just standing there without body armor in a war zone where the loliest terrorist could pick him off.... k9870[[User:K9870|K9870]]

: Wouldn't you find a guy who uses .44 magnum in a modern war to be very cocky and arrogant? -[[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]]
::True, but some Generals do carry Colt 1911A1s and the such. -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]
:No, anyone who can get a M1911 Authorized carries one-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 20:35, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

But most generals of today, especially a Lieutenant General would NOT be standing out on the front lines or strongly recommended not to. What is a Lt. General doing in Afghanistan anyway? The game also took out a lot of the old guns in the previous MW game [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:38, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

:Not to mention they chose what's essentially a wallhanger sniper rifle (WA2000) over a number of battle-proven designs (M24, M110, even the L96A1 that Counter-Strike players seem to be so in love with). [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:15, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

:I would rather use my Winchester 88, shooting Hornady Custom .308's, over any of those rifles-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 04:46, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

::I agree that the WA2000 was a Stupid choice. That rifles has custom wood stocks and high quality handbuilt precision, and isn't meant for combat use. The only non magnum or anti-material sniper is the M21 EBR, which has a wrongly animated 20-round mag that only holds ten rounds. They dropped the M40, R700 and Dragunov, and gave beginners the Barrett .50 cal. I'm not the best sniper, but I wouldn't have minded a nice bolt action rifle thats not chambered in a massive round. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:::No, Dragunov is still in the game. As far as dropping the M40, it would seem logical to do so considering there are no US Marines in MW2. And having the R700 as a separate weapon than the M40 was just pointless, IMO. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:23, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

::::The Dragunov being in single player doesn't count. Why build it into the game and not add it to multiplayer? [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:::::Probably the same reason the M40A3 in CoD4 was restricted to MP. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:13, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

== Glock 18 with red dot ==
Hey if anybody plans to use a G18 with a red dot sight without a silencer I just wanted to tell you that using a G18 in this configuration is a bad idea, the muzzle flash of the gun on full-auto is so large that it actually blocks the view of the dot so much that you can barely see the dot
:Glock 18s were already a bad move. and put three ~ at the end of your text to show your name. like so: -[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]]
::I have to agree, without the silencer used the G18s muzzle flash ruins your sight picture, not to mention it has zero range and horrid accuracy.[[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
Ok thanks for telling me how to put my name on a page, and the G18 is an ok gun, I mean the gun tisn't that accurate when you do a full clip 33 round burst, but it is a good close quarters gun because you can hose down an enemy in about two seconds, and I sometimes use it to pin down other players because they think that I am using an MG and when the gun runs out of ammo and they jump out of cover I spray them with a real MG. [[User:Korean war marine]]

I use it for close quarters only, with usually a UMP or Vector to back it up in case I need some accuracy [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

Glock 18s don't use clips, they use magazines. And I agree with Winchester and M14fanboy, Glock 18 (along with Desert Eagle and Magnum revolver) was a bad choice. Heck, I'd take a Mark 23 over any of them in a combat op any day. They should put in actual ''combat pistols'', not mall ninja favorites. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:21, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

:They also removed the 1911 from multiplayer. That is just bull shit. I was hoping for a P226 or something from SIG since we got so many British characters or Browning Hi-powers. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:30, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

::I had Hi-Power hopes as well, or possible the 226. But a Colt Anaconda and Desert Eagle, I thought this was military, not ghetto. The only good handguns really are the USP and the M93R, which is like a mini-M16. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

:::I've said this before and I'll say it again that this is a ''war'' game, so they should have dropped the Desert Eagle, Anaconda, and Glock 18 for actual ''combat pistols'' like the aforementioned Hi-Power, 226, and 1911. Heck, I even had hopes that that new Russian service pistol (MR-446 Grach, I think it's called) would make an appearance, but my hopes were all for naught. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:27, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

::::I know man, it's dperessing to see a WAR game with nothing but stupid magnum handguns firing ridicilously large rounds. Theres a total of two legit combat pistols, the USP and M9, and while I haven't used the USP I can say the M9 is shite. DLC pistols pl0x! [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

== Is it just me ==

or does infinity ward think all firearms in the near future will have a bunch of Picatinny rails on them?

:They just watch too many movies. But then again a lot of issued guns now do have rails. That's how the Marines Corp get their M4s and M16A4s now [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:46, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

::All firearms in the near future (aside from oddballs like the XM8) ''will'' have Picatinny rails. Modularity is the wave of the future. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:23, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Actually if you look the extra rails are for the heartbeat sensor attatchment, which goes midway along the left side of all the guns its on. The UMP and P90 have them even though SMGs can't have that attachment, so obviously they were going to at some point in development.

== ACOG "off" after EMP among other things. ==

Ok, I get the fact that all electronics that were turned on would have been knocked out after the EMP struck, but...when I picked up a rifle with an ACOG, the lights were out, leaving only a black reticule, which is bullshit because ACOGs don't work like that. They are not battery powered and as such would not be affected by the EMP. I also find it hard to believe that none of the soldiers had flashlights that were most likely turned off during EMP. Another nit-pick is that your weapon after the EMP was an M4 with an EOtech mounted on it. Why couldn't the creators have your character just flip up the iron sights? You had to pick up an entirely different M4, also coincidentally like yours with an M203, with iron sights up for that kinda of thing.

This is one of the many minor lazy details they could have done. Like for the ACR. I know for a FACT that the ACR's bolt release switch is in front of the trigger. It was designed so when you insert a fresh mag, all you have to do is press forward on the release right in front of the trigger! But instead, if you are empty, you insert new mag and then with your FIRING HAND, take it off the pistol grip and pull the charging handle back! One, no soldier would is RIGHT handed would taken their trigger hand off the grip unless they need it to fix a malfunction. They would use their NON firing hand to pull the charging handle since the charging handle and in fact the entire RIFLE was built for both hands to operate. But no, IW wanted us to waste precious seconds to see the wrong hand pull the charging handle. I got shot so many times using the ACR when I am empty completely because I can't just press the bolt catch with my trigger finger as the gun was DESIGNED to! [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:46, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

To add more fuel to the rant fire, the Glock 18 is an ok gun, I'll admit that in small bursts. But when you reload, you don't press the slide release, which would make getting back into action faster, but instead you're treated to your character pulling the slide back! This is only good for range shooting a Glock, since the slide release is pretty weak, factory wise, but in combat, pulling back the slide takes too much time, in fact, there's a couple seconds delay when reloading an empty Glock. That's why I try to not reload empty weapons. Always mid magazine change. It'll save fustraions for you watching your character take his damn time reloading and doing unneeded things like pulling the slide back or in the ACR's case, use right hand instead of left hand instead of pressing trigger finger forward. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:54, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

And even MORE nitpicking. Look at how they attached the M203 on a Tavor in the game! I've seen what an M203 with a Tavor looks like in real life and it works ergonomicially but the way IW did it in this game makes it look stupid. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 07:30, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

its a game and just about every gamer you come across wont know about weapons like i have been telling people about the screw ups and they said if they did not give it a name they would have just called the m93r a machine pistol and most people i know call assault rifles machine guns. -scarecrow

yeah I too noticed on the ACR how they made the unnecessary action of charging it and all that when, like they did with the SCAR and M4, they could just push bolt release, which would probably decrease reload time in the game. but hey, maybe the did it cause it would "look cool" - Whatsagun

:Well at least for the M4 and SCAR, they are slapping the bolt release on the side of the gun. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:05, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

:Seriously, no one else noticed how the M4 was modeled on Semi?-protoAuthor 03:25, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

The M203 in this game is based on an RIS-mounted airsoft replica. [http://arniesairsoft.co.uk/news2/wp-content/uploads/2007/NewshotsofCASCARM203fromVisele_1022A/DSC021252.jpg] [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:31, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Back to the mocked up Glock 18, I think all videos on youtube never show full auto Glock's reloading. Just one magazine and "The End". But there was this one video on youtube called 298 rounds in full auto and it showed this guy with a mocked up Glock 18 not using the slide release lever, just pulling back the slide. With this video close to 5,000,000 views it's quite obvious IW got there ideas from that video.
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBjUDCyDCuI Glock 298 rounds in full auto]

:In response to that, I keep saying that most people target shooting with a lot of their guns would pull back the slide instead of pressing the slide release because every time they press down on it, it degrades it more and more. In a combat situation, you shouldn't be thinking about that if you are rushing to reload. If you are on the range, pissing bullets, then you do the pull slide back. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:35, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

I wanna nitpick on the gun selection in this game. I'm sure they did this to expand the number of guns used, but some of their choices just kinda irk me. For instance, why does the Russian military use FAMAS, Tavor TAR-21, MG4, UMP, TDI Vectors, PP2000, AUG, AK's and RPD's? Seriously, TAR-21's? Israel doesn't even really like Russia right now, considering that they're selling weapons to people who want to destroy them.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 09:49, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

:Well the AKs, RPD and PP2000 are obviously Russian weapons, but I hate that they didn't give them AK-74 type weapons, but all 47s instead. The Russian military doesn't use AK-47s anymore. They've switched to the smaller rounds. They also had the Russians during the Wolverine mission with FALs. IW obviously didn't know a thing about Russian military of today and didn't want to just give them all AKs, so they slapped them with a bunch of other guns. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:35, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
::Wait a minute, aren't russians in the Wolverines mission ultranationalists? Because if they are the terrorist ones then they can have any gun they want.--[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 18:28, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
:No they're the russian army. I'm guessing that you haven't played the game (spoiler) as it is the russian army paratroopers invading the east coast of the U.S. --[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 02:12, 23 November 2009 (UTC))

I think the Ultra nationalist won the civil war in Russia. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:33, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I have to agree that it seems that IW knows jack-shit about firearms, just like most everyone else in the world, unfortunately. An FN rifle with a reciprocating charging handle? Come on. [[Special:Contributions/70.196.44.211|70.196.44.211]] 01:03, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

:At least they didn't make the single player M16A4 a full auto weapon and made it burst. That one's ok. And seriously, if they were modeling their guns off of airsofts, or even real ones, how can they fuck up with the SCAR's rear flip up sight? It's very hard to miss where it folds. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

== TMP or MP9? ==

Hi. Just wondering about the labeling on the MW2 page. The game calls it a "TMP", but on the MW2 page it's labeled as an MP9. Since they look the same, why bother calling it the MP9 when it is in fact the TMP? -KLR

:Because the MP9 is the newer version of the TMP. I do believe Bruger and Thomet took over production from Steyr, who no longer makes it. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

::Isn't the side-folding stock unique to the MP9? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:32, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

:::Yeah, I think that was a part of the update too. Either way, unless those are old TMPs, the MP9 is the logical choice for the game. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

::::Update? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:17, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

:::::The update Bruger and Thomet made when they took over building TMPs. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

==Walther WA 2000 screenshot==
Did someone have fun or is this an unedited screenshot from the game? If you look at the scope you can see an unhappy sick face painted on the scope cover. I have yet to use this gun, so I don't know. My money is on someone having fun. --[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 09:39, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

No, it's really like that in the game, the only people having fun there was Infinity Ward :D [[Special:Contributions/90.213.208.208|90.213.208.208]]

:Thats the emblem used for a certain class of accolades, and a comedic effect as well. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]

stop lieing to the guy. yes it does have a sick face painted on the cover its more noticeable on the WA2000 theres one on the barrett M102(idk the spelling or the number) aswell but its hard to see. theres none on the intervention or the M21 EBR. - Scarecrow

==L86A1 LSW drum magazine==

It is impossible in real life to fire and handle an L85A1 LSW with a 100 round drum magazine? --[[User:Dangerman 1973|Dangerman 1973]] 15:51, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

:Impossible? No. Incredibly uncomfortable, awkward, and impractical? Yes.--[[Special:Contributions/141.165.142.102|141.165.142.102]] 16:16, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

::Unless you're left-handed or have ''really long arms''... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 03:29, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

::Also the drum in the game model doesn't make sense. That's surely not big enough tohold 100 rounds, looks more like 50 to me. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:If you shot it left handed, the charging handle would break your jaw-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 21:28, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
::I didn't know the L85/86 had a reciprocating charging handle. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 09:46, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
::: Either way you'd still get a face full of hot brass firing left handed. Which may probve to be a problem if I decide to enlist... [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 12:24, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

== PC or console? ==

So who has the PC and who has the Console version? Fact is that there is absolutely no difference between the two. In fact the PC is pretty much a direct port from the console version. I don't have any consoles, so I go for PC. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:48, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

this has nothing to do with the firearms of the game. please leave until you can think of something relevant.

== SCAR H is really a SCAR L ==

I think that the SCAR that is in the game is actually chambered in 5.56. I say this because it holds 30 rounds and after the helicopter is shot down in DC you are given a mag for an M4 from Sgt. Foley who has a SCAR. I think they had the SCAR replacing the M16 as the main battle rifle of the U.S. Military with the M16A4 being used for the reserve troops. They probably used the SCAR H model to make it look cooler. --[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 21:20, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
:The SCAR in the game isn't chambered in anything because it is a video game. Also if I am not mistaken IMFDB policy in regards to videogames is to identify guns purely by looks, not by any specifications. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 00:28, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
No its the Mk. 17 as evidenced by the larger flash suppressor. Infinity Ward probably created a 30 round mag to keep it more like an assault rifle than the battle rifle it is. Also the soldier who gives you the M4 dies and the clip could be from him.
Here's a picture of the flash suppressor to show it's an Mk.17--[[User:Km314|Km314]] 06:51, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
[[http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/callofduty/images/c/c0/SCAR-H_Lv8_II.png]]
:''Magazine'', not clip. And I thought there had been a 30 round magazine introduced for use with the M14 rifle a few years ago? Last I heard, the Mark 17 still used M14 mags. And, while this may not be the best of arguments here, the Mark 17 in-game has heavier recoil than either the M16 or M4 and generally seems more effective at longer ranges than the M4. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 09:50, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

It only has the 30 round magazine in single player, incorrectly, but in multiplayer, it has the 20 round. A lot of the weapons in multiplayer is correct but still, IW did miss a few things, like the rear iron sight for the SCAR is supposed to fold down towards the user, not away. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 16:46, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
:Regarding the rear sight... someone on IW's forum actually pointed that out to them sometime prior to the game's release, but they didn't do anything. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:42, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

== Is it an M9, 92FS or 92SB? ==

I'm confused. We have the title of the handgun called an SB, then a photo of a 92FS and then in the description, it's called an M9. Which one is it? Isn't the game trying to portray an M9 since it's military use? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

it should be cleened up. well im guessing a 92FS is the civil version of the M9 (what its suposed to be)
but its a 92SB because of the rounded trigger guard. -scarecrow

== Combat Knife ==

Can anyone identify the combat knife used in the final level? I know I've seen it before, I just don't know where. --[[User:Asmkillr323|Asmkillr323]] 20:05, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

-If it's the same one that shows up in the sneak type missions I believe its a Blackhawk Tatang or SZABO FELONY STOP. --Pawnstar

:Looks like it's the Tatang. It is DEFINITELY NOT the Szabo Felony Stop. Thanks for the help, chief. --[[User:Asmkillr323|Asmkillr323]] 20:36, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

just played that level again and i dont think its a tatang -scarecrow

Is that the same blade that appears when you melee? Gunner313

Talk:Glock pistol series

2009-12-12T07:17:29Z

Gunner313:

2 Glocks (.45?) play prominet roles in the movie "Fracture" starring Anthony Hopkins. Don't know the model so I didn't edit the main page ([[Special:Contributions/80.121.38.199|80.121.38.199]] 18:10, 20 March 2008 (UTC))

== The "Glock invisible"-nonsense ==

Here's what Hugh Laurie (yes, the "House M. D."-guy) had to say about that in his novel "The gun seller":
"You may have read, at one time or another, some of the nonsense that’s been written about the Glock. The fact that its body is made from a fancy polymer material got one or two journalists very excited a while back about the possibility that the gun might not register on airport X-ray machines - which happens to be so much hooey. The slide, barrel, and a fair portion of its innards are metal, and if that weren’t enough, seventeen rounds of Parabellum ammunition are pretty hard to pass off as lipstick refills. What it does have is a high magazine capacity for a low weight, great accuracy, and virtually unequalled reliability. All of which have made the Glock 17 the choice of housewives everywhere."
Dr. House, I couldn't agree more.
--[[User:Lastgunslinger|Lastgunslinger]] 22:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

I have to admit that my whole perspective of Glock changed when they sued Smith & Wesson over the Sigma. I mean, they make more money from their handguns than any other company in the world and then they go and sue someone. The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all. I see the similarities but they are easily telled apart. Not a cool thing to do Glock, I wish you hadn't stooped down like that.

== ==

"The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all."

It only resembles every handgun, because almost every brand has a Glock copy now. There wasn't anything like it back in 1982 when it was released. Back then its main competitors were the 1911, S&W 39, Berreta 92 and various wheel guns. Gunner313

Talk:Glock pistol series

2009-12-12T07:16:19Z

Gunner313:

2 Glocks (.45?) play prominet roles in the movie "Fracture" starring Anthony Hopkins. Don't know the model so I didn't edit the main page ([[Special:Contributions/80.121.38.199|80.121.38.199]] 18:10, 20 March 2008 (UTC))

== The "Glock invisible"-nonsense ==

Here's what Hugh Laurie (yes, the "House M. D."-guy) had to say about that in his novel "The gun seller":
"You may have read, at one time or another, some of the nonsense that’s been written about the Glock. The fact that its body is made from a fancy polymer material got one or two journalists very excited a while back about the possibility that the gun might not register on airport X-ray machines - which happens to be so much hooey. The slide, barrel, and a fair portion of its innards are metal, and if that weren’t enough, seventeen rounds of Parabellum ammunition are pretty hard to pass off as lipstick refills. What it does have is a high magazine capacity for a low weight, great accuracy, and virtually unequalled reliability. All of which have made the Glock 17 the choice of housewives everywhere."
Dr. House, I couldn't agree more.
--[[User:Lastgunslinger|Lastgunslinger]] 22:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

I have to admit that my whole perspective of Glock changed when they sued Smith & Wesson over the Sigma. I mean, they make more money from their handguns than any other company in the world and then they go and sue someone. The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all. I see the similarities but they are easily telled apart. Not a cool thing to do Glock, I wish you hadn't stooped down like that.

"The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all."

It only resembles every handgun, because almost every brand has a Glock copy now. There wasn't anything like it back in 1982 when it was released. Back then its main competitors were the 1911, S&W 39, Berreta 92 and various wheel guns. Gunner313

Talk:The Punisher (2004)

2009-12-12T04:55:53Z

Gunner313: /* Cold Steel Warhead */

Talk:Bad Boys

2009-10-14T04:49:56Z

Gunner313: /* Re: Style choices */

* Not sure it's worth mentioning but the gun on the left in this photo: http://www.imfdb.org/images/9/9a/Bad_boys_bug17_image1-1-.jpg is actually a Wildey of some sort. Not sure which one. [[User:Brandtbl|Brandtbl]] 06:14, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

== LAR Grizzly Win Mag? ==

I'm beginning to think that isn't a real LAR Grizzly Win Mag, as I just saw another movie screenshot of the weapon, and it doesn't have the squared trigger guard, instead, it has a round one. Here is the link to that site where someone has noticed this. [[http://fateoflegions.blogspot.com/2008/09/movie-guns-xxii.html]]

==Style choices==

This was mentioned briefly in the article but I was hoping to elaborate on it. Why is it that virtually every weapon in this film has a stainless, chrome, or nickle finish? I like these types of finishes as much as the next guy (especially on the second and third generation Smith & Wesson Auto pistols) but this seems like overkill to me. If anyone agrees or disagrees with my assessment I would like to hear.
:-Anonymous
::This is a Retarded action movie and it's directed by Michael Bay. There is nothing wrong with that though.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 12:21, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

==Re: Style choices==

Those finishes are commonly seen used buy police departments that are located in coastal cities and of course the bad guys have to have bling, bling guns. Gunner313

Talk:Bad Boys

2009-10-14T04:49:20Z

Gunner313:

Face/Off

2009-02-05T23:54:45Z

Gunner313: /* Smith & Wesson 5906 */

'''The following weapons are used in the movie Face/Off:'''
[[Image:Face Off Poster.jpg‎|thumb|right|300px]]

== Beretta M92FS ==
During the final firefight Sean Archer/Castor Troy ([[Nicolas Cage]]) has a pair of [[Beretta M92F#Beretta 92 FS|Beretta M92FS]]s. Jamie (Dominique Swain) picks one of these up as Archer/Troy and Troy/Archer ([[John Travolta]]) struggle in the church's courtyard, only to be misled into shooting her father. Finally, during the boat chase, Troy/Archer pulls a stainless steel INOX version of the weapon, only to lose it when Archer/Troy jumps aboard his boat and knocks it from his grip.
[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Beretta M92FS 9mm]]
[[Image:Face_Off-1-.jpg‎|thumb|300px|none|Sean Archer/Castor Troy with his Beretta M92FS.]]
[[Image:FaceOff_05-1-.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Jamie picks up a Beretta M92FS and aims it at Castor Troy during the final firefight.]]

== Custom Springfield 1911s ==
Castor Troy's (Nicolas Cage) favorite weapons are two gold plated [[M1911 pistol series|Springfield Armory M1911A1s]] fitted with custom grips. He uses these akimbo during the first major gunfight of the movie, putting a hole in the windshield of Sean Archer's ([[John Travolta]]) chopper and later gunning down several agents. Later in the movie, when Archer has assumed Troy's identity and face, he is given these weapons by Dietrich ([[Nick Cassavettes]]). He then uses one or both of them in the following raid/gunfight.
[[Image:Faceoffcap_23-1-.jpg|thumb|left|500px|Castor Troy's .45s in his box of goodies.]]
[[Image:Face_off_cap_25-1-.jpg|thumb|none|345px|Sean Archer/Castor Troy holding his 45s.]]
[[Image:Face_off_cap_3-1-.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Castor Troy at the airport with his custom holsters and 45s.]]

I don't think that the pistols are gold plated, too flat. I believe that it is a titanium gold finish.

== SIG-Sauer P226 ==
Sean Archer (John Travolta) uses a [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P226|SIG-Sauer P226]] with a nickel-plated slide during the movie's first gunfight. When he and Castor Troy (Nicolas Cage) switch faces and identities, Troy/Archer begins using the weapon, killing Dietrich (Nick Cassevettes) and another FBI agent with it before he loses it during the church's Mexican Standoff.

[[Image:SigP226TwoTone03.jpg|thumb|none|250px|Two-tone SIG-Sauer P226 9mm.]]
[[Image:Faceoff-1-.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Castor Troy/Sean Archer with his two-tone SIG P226.]]
[[Image:Facoff226.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A rather Clearer shot of the same scene above.]]

== Stechkin APS ==
A Stechkin APS automatic pistol is used briefly by Castor Troy/Sean Archer ([[John Travolta]]) during the church shootout, in the courtyard. At the conclusion of the fight, Sean Archer/Castor Troy ([[Nicolas Cage]]) picks the gun up and fires a long burst at Troy/Archer after he unsuccessfully tries to kill his daughter.
[[Image:Aps-1-1-.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Stechkin APS 9mm Makarov.]]
[[Image:118576-1-.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Sean Archer/Castor Troy firing the Stechkin at the final firefight.]]

== Skorpion SA Vz 61 ==
Used in the shootout at the airport by Castor Troy's brother Pollux.
[[Image:Skorpion-Sa.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Skorpion SA Vz 61 .32 ACP]]
[[Image:Pollox_Skorpion.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Pollux Troy (Alessandro Nivola) shooting a Skorpion machine pistol during the airport shootout]]

== Ruger Mini-14/AC556 ==

The prison guards on the oil drill platform are armed with [[Ruger Mini-14]]s or their full auto counterparts, the Ruger AC556.

[[Image:RugerAC556.jpg|thumb|500px|none|Ruger AC556 (the full auto version of the Mini-14) - 5.56mm]]

[[Image:Guard_Ruger_Mini-14.jpg‎|thumb|500px|none|Prison guard on the oil platform prison firing a Ruger AC556 rifle]]

During the prison break scene, Ivan Dubov (Chris Bauer), the inmate that helps Archer/Troy (Nicolas Cage) escape from the electro-shock chamber, picks up an AC556 rifle from one of the dead guards and kills several guards before Archer/Troy stops him.

[[Image:Dubov_Ruger_Mini-14.jpg‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Inmate Ivan Dubov (Chris Bauer) wielding a Ruger AC556 rifle that he took from a dead prison guard]]

[[Image:Dubov_Ruger_Mini-14_2.jpg‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Ivan Dubov (Chris Bauer) shooting a prison guard with a Ruger AC556 rifle during the prison break]]

== Milkor BXP ==
During the final firefight Castor Troy/Sean Archer (John Travolta) picks up a [[BXP]] as he flees from Sean Archer/Castor Troy (Nicolas Cage) who is firing at him.

[[Image:Fo_travol1-1-.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Castor Troy/Sean Archer firing the BXP.]]

== Smith & Wesson 5906 ==
During the final firefight stand off Castor Troy's girlfriend, Sasha Hassler ([[Gina Gershon]]) is armed with a [[Smith & Wesson 5906]].

[[Image:S&W5906EarlyModel.jpg‎‎|thumb|none|350px|Smith & Wesson 5906 - 9mm]]
[[Image:FaceOff_04-1-.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Sasha aims her Smith & Wesson at Sean Archer.]]

The thing is way too short to be a 59 series, so it's probably a 69 series.

== Walther PPK ==
On the plane the undercover FBI Agent pulls a [[Walther PPK]] on Castor Troy.
[[Image:Walther-PPK.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Walther PPK .380 ACP]]
[[Image:FaceOff_02-1-.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Agent Winters ([[Lauren Sinclair]]) pulls a Walther PPK .380 ACP]]

== Colt 9mm Submachine Gun ==
During the shootout in Dietrich's apartment, some of the FBI SWAT team members can be seen with [[Colt 9mm SMG]] rifles with reflex scopes. Used by Dietrich's sister Sasha during the shootout as well.

[[Image:Colt-9mm--SMG.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Colt 9mm SMG]]

[[Image:Sasha_Colt_SMG.jpg‎|thumb|500px|none|Sasha Hassler (Gina Gershon) with a Colt 9mm submachine gun and Archer/Troy (Nicolas Cage)]]

== Unknown Revolver ==
During the first major gunfight in the movie. Sean Archer briefly uses a backup revolver with his Sig P226 akimbo-style. Possibly a .38 special.

==Heckler & Koch MP5 submachine gun==

The Heckler & Koch MP5 series of submachine guns were extensively used by FBI on numerous occasions. During the FBI's assault on Dietrich's apartment, the assault team were armed with the MP5A2, the MP5A3 and the MP5SD3 series submachine guns.
[[Image:H&KMP5A2WideForearm.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch MP5A2 9mm with "tropical" Wide forearm]]
[[Image:MP5A3 StockCollapsed.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch MP5A3 9mm]]
[[Image:MP5SD3.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch MP5SD3 9mm with Stock Extended.]]

[[Image:FBI_MP5.jpg‎|thumb|none|500px|FBI agents carrying MP5 & MP5SD submachine guns preparing to raid Dietrich's apartment]]

[[Image:Sasha_MP5.jpg‎‎|thumb|none|500px|Sasha Hassler (Gina Gershon) firing an MP5A3 submachine gun at raiding FBI agents]]

==Remington 870 shotgun==

A sawn-off Remington Model 870 was used by Dietrich to fend off the FBI assault team attacking his apartment.

[[Image:Dietrich Remington 870.jpg‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Dietrich Hassler (Nick Cassavetes) defending his apartment from raiding FBI agents with a Remington 870 shotgun]]

==M60 Machine Gun==

During the oil platform prison escape, a helicopter with a mounted [[M60 machine gun]] chases down Sean Archer/Castor Troy ([[Nicolas Cage]]) just before he jumps off the platform.
[[Image:Helicopter_M60.jpg‎‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Prison guard on a helicopter with an M60 machine gun chasing down Sean Archer / Caster Troy (Nicolas Cage) as he escapes from the oil platform prison]]

==Mini Uzi==

[[Category:Movie]]

Face/Off

2009-02-05T23:46:53Z

Gunner313: /* BXP submachine gun */

'''The following weapons are used in the movie Face/Off:'''
[[Image:Face Off Poster.jpg‎|thumb|right|300px]]

== Beretta M92FS ==
During the final firefight Sean Archer/Castor Troy ([[Nicolas Cage]]) has a pair of [[Beretta M92F#Beretta 92 FS|Beretta M92FS]]s. Jamie (Dominique Swain) picks one of these up as Archer/Troy and Troy/Archer ([[John Travolta]]) struggle in the church's courtyard, only to be misled into shooting her father. Finally, during the boat chase, Troy/Archer pulls a stainless steel INOX version of the weapon, only to lose it when Archer/Troy jumps aboard his boat and knocks it from his grip.
[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|250px|none|Beretta M92FS 9mm]]
[[Image:Face_Off-1-.jpg‎|thumb|300px|none|Sean Archer/Castor Troy with his Beretta M92FS.]]
[[Image:FaceOff_05-1-.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Jamie picks up a Beretta M92FS and aims it at Castor Troy during the final firefight.]]

== Custom Springfield 1911s ==
Castor Troy's (Nicolas Cage) favorite weapons are two gold plated [[M1911 pistol series|Springfield Armory M1911A1s]] fitted with custom grips. He uses these akimbo during the first major gunfight of the movie, putting a hole in the windshield of Sean Archer's ([[John Travolta]]) chopper and later gunning down several agents. Later in the movie, when Archer has assumed Troy's identity and face, he is given these weapons by Dietrich ([[Nick Cassavettes]]). He then uses one or both of them in the following raid/gunfight.
[[Image:Faceoffcap_23-1-.jpg|thumb|left|500px|Castor Troy's .45s in his box of goodies.]]
[[Image:Face_off_cap_25-1-.jpg|thumb|none|345px|Sean Archer/Castor Troy holding his 45s.]]
[[Image:Face_off_cap_3-1-.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Castor Troy at the airport with his custom holsters and 45s.]]

I don't think that the pistols are gold plated, too flat. I believe that it is a titanium gold finish.

== SIG-Sauer P226 ==
Sean Archer (John Travolta) uses a [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P226|SIG-Sauer P226]] with a nickel-plated slide during the movie's first gunfight. When he and Castor Troy (Nicolas Cage) switch faces and identities, Troy/Archer begins using the weapon, killing Dietrich (Nick Cassevettes) and another FBI agent with it before he loses it during the church's Mexican Standoff.

[[Image:SigP226TwoTone03.jpg|thumb|none|250px|Two-tone SIG-Sauer P226 9mm.]]
[[Image:Faceoff-1-.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Castor Troy/Sean Archer with his two-tone SIG P226.]]
[[Image:Facoff226.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A rather Clearer shot of the same scene above.]]

== Stechkin APS ==
A Stechkin APS automatic pistol is used briefly by Castor Troy/Sean Archer ([[John Travolta]]) during the church shootout, in the courtyard. At the conclusion of the fight, Sean Archer/Castor Troy ([[Nicolas Cage]]) picks the gun up and fires a long burst at Troy/Archer after he unsuccessfully tries to kill his daughter.
[[Image:Aps-1-1-.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Stechkin APS 9mm Makarov.]]
[[Image:118576-1-.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Sean Archer/Castor Troy firing the Stechkin at the final firefight.]]

== Skorpion SA Vz 61 ==
Used in the shootout at the airport by Castor Troy's brother Pollux.
[[Image:Skorpion-Sa.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Skorpion SA Vz 61 .32 ACP]]
[[Image:Pollox_Skorpion.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Pollux Troy (Alessandro Nivola) shooting a Skorpion machine pistol during the airport shootout]]

== Ruger Mini-14/AC556 ==

The prison guards on the oil drill platform are armed with [[Ruger Mini-14]]s or their full auto counterparts, the Ruger AC556.

[[Image:RugerAC556.jpg|thumb|500px|none|Ruger AC556 (the full auto version of the Mini-14) - 5.56mm]]

[[Image:Guard_Ruger_Mini-14.jpg‎|thumb|500px|none|Prison guard on the oil platform prison firing a Ruger AC556 rifle]]

During the prison break scene, Ivan Dubov (Chris Bauer), the inmate that helps Archer/Troy (Nicolas Cage) escape from the electro-shock chamber, picks up an AC556 rifle from one of the dead guards and kills several guards before Archer/Troy stops him.

[[Image:Dubov_Ruger_Mini-14.jpg‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Inmate Ivan Dubov (Chris Bauer) wielding a Ruger AC556 rifle that he took from a dead prison guard]]

[[Image:Dubov_Ruger_Mini-14_2.jpg‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Ivan Dubov (Chris Bauer) shooting a prison guard with a Ruger AC556 rifle during the prison break]]

== Milkor BXP ==
During the final firefight Castor Troy/Sean Archer (John Travolta) picks up a [[BXP]] as he flees from Sean Archer/Castor Troy (Nicolas Cage) who is firing at him.

[[Image:Fo_travol1-1-.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Castor Troy/Sean Archer firing the BXP.]]

== Smith & Wesson 5906 ==
During the final firefight stand off Castor Troy's girlfriend, Sasha Hassler ([[Gina Gershon]]) is armed with a [[Smith & Wesson 5906]].

[[Image:Pix1264003015.jpg|thumb|200px|none|Smith & Wesson 5906 9mm]]

[[Image:FaceOff_04-1-.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Sasha aims her Smith & Wesson at Sean Archer.]]

The thing is way too short to be a 59 series, so it's probably a 69 series.

== Walther PPK ==
On the plane the undercover FBI Agent pulls a [[Walther PPK]] on Castor Troy.
[[Image:Walther-PPK.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Walther PPK .380 ACP]]
[[Image:FaceOff_02-1-.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Agent Winters ([[Lauren Sinclair]]) pulls a Walther PPK .380 ACP]]

== Colt 9mm Submachine Gun ==
During the shootout in Dietrich's apartment, some of the FBI SWAT team members can be seen with [[Colt 9mm SMG]] rifles with reflex scopes. Used by Dietrich's sister Sasha during the shootout as well.

[[Image:Colt-9mm--SMG.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Colt 9mm SMG]]

[[Image:Sasha_Colt_SMG.jpg‎|thumb|500px|none|Sasha Hassler (Gina Gershon) with a Colt 9mm submachine gun and Archer/Troy (Nicolas Cage)]]

== Unknown Revolver ==
During the first major gunfight in the movie. Sean Archer briefly uses a backup revolver with his Sig P226 akimbo-style. Possibly a .38 special.

==Heckler & Koch MP5 submachine gun==

The Heckler & Koch MP5 series of submachine guns were extensively used by FBI on numerous occasions. During the FBI's assault on Dietrich's apartment, the assault team were armed with the MP5A2, the MP5A3 and the MP5SD3 series submachine guns.
[[Image:H&KMP5A2WideForearm.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch MP5A2 9mm with "tropical" Wide forearm]]
[[Image:MP5A3 StockCollapsed.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch MP5A3 9mm]]
[[Image:MP5SD3.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch MP5SD3 9mm with Stock Extended.]]

[[Image:FBI_MP5.jpg‎|thumb|none|500px|FBI agents carrying MP5 & MP5SD submachine guns preparing to raid Dietrich's apartment]]

[[Image:Sasha_MP5.jpg‎‎|thumb|none|500px|Sasha Hassler (Gina Gershon) firing an MP5A3 submachine gun at raiding FBI agents]]

==Remington 870 shotgun==

A sawn-off Remington Model 870 was used by Dietrich to fend off the FBI assault team attacking his apartment.

[[Image:Dietrich Remington 870.jpg‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Dietrich Hassler (Nick Cassavetes) defending his apartment from raiding FBI agents with a Remington 870 shotgun]]

==M60 Machine Gun==

During the oil platform prison escape, a helicopter with a mounted [[M60 machine gun]] chases down Sean Archer/Castor Troy ([[Nicolas Cage]]) just before he jumps off the platform.
[[Image:Helicopter_M60.jpg‎‎‎|thumb|500px|none|Prison guard on a helicopter with an M60 machine gun chasing down Sean Archer / Caster Troy (Nicolas Cage) as he escapes from the oil platform prison]]

==Mini Uzi==

[[Category:Movie]]

Talk:Face/Off

2009-02-05T23:41:18Z

Gunner313:

This article needs some expansion; I don't own a copy off this movie but I'm sure we can identify a lot of nice weapons here.

*Agreed. This habit of making what equates to 'blank pages' is becoming quite irksome. If people are going to make a page, they should at least try to put some effort into it. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 22:02, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

* To be honest I was the one that started it :-) Didn't have a copy of the movie at my hands so I just starter it ;-) Will make a better effort next time ... --[[User:Fox Mulder|Fox Mulder]] 09:44, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

== S&W 1911's ==

You know ever since I saw this movie for the first time I've been trying to find a set of 1911A1's that look like these that are real functioning guns. I dont care what the price is I just would like to ask if anyone knows where I could find a replica. It doesn't have to be real gold only simulated. I think they would make an excellent conversation piece framed on the wall. If anyone knows where to find some similar to these please e-mail me at bhatt86@hotmail.com. Thanks!

== new images ==

I'm going to update all the images on this page unless someone objects. Gunner313

User talk:MoviePropMaster2008 (Archive)

2009-02-04T08:56:38Z

Gunner313: /* Babylon .A.D/ SPAS 15 */

Most of my uploaded firearms pics were photographed by me and thus offered for use by IMFDB with my permission.

BTW: Please IDENTIFY yourself when you leave a message. I shouldn't have to sleuth your identity through the Wiki/History page to figure out who asked what. ;) Thanks.

==US Navy Mark 12 MOD X Special Purpose Rifle==
Hi I was referred by MT2008 that you may have access to a MK 12 SPR or a similar weapon. If you have access to an image to add to the Mk 12 SPR section of the M16 page that would be appreciated. The current image has a watermark and is a graphic from somewhere and probably copyrighted so It would be cool if that image could be replaced. thanks, -[[User:AdAstra2009]]

Well thanks for looking into it, I appreciate it -[[User:AdAstra2009]]

==YES!==

Thank you SO much! Those look great, and actually, they look very close to the ones that have appeared in quite a few movies. We can start replacing the two-tone SIG pics that we have on our other pages with these immediately! Again, I ''greatly'' appreciate you doing this for me. How will I ever repay you?

Out of curiosity, since you told me that they usually don't fit, how did you make them work together? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re: MP5A5==

Huh, that's interesting. I always figured Stembridge would have mostly -90 series guns that looked just like those "MP5s" that appear in so many productions they've rented to. Any idea why those HK94s were never converted further to make them look like more realistic MP5s? As my ''[[Air Force One]]'' page shows, Stembridge basically left those guns as-is well into the 1990s.

Thanks for the MP5A5 picture...I was actually close to replacing it myself (albeit with something from a Google image search). And yes, I'm sure more people than me appreciate them! At least, I hope so. You're pretty much the most important person we've got when it comes to gun images. I mean, how many sites out there get to have pictures of the same prop weapons used in many films?

==Thanks for the new pictures==

You've uploaded a lot of good pictures recently...I especially like the S&W 4506 and the SIG P220 Sport (is that the one from Cinema Weaponry that's appeared in several movies?) I thought of taking a picture of my own personal 4506 for a while, but gave up because I knew I couldn't take one as good as what you could do. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==One other thing...==

I know I keep asking for stuff from you lately, but this time it's talk only.

I just finished working on the ''[[Air Force One]]'' page for this site. That movie features some type of short-barreled AK which looks just like the one from ''[[True Lies]]''. Here's a picture:

[[Image:AFO-shortyAK-2.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

The next time you talk to Harry Lu, would you mind asking him what these guns are and who owns them (Stembridge?) Thanks! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:==

The new pictures are really cool, as usual. I especially love the M16A1 with A2 handguards picture, because there are a lot of Hollywood movies featuring guns with that config, and it's great that we now have a picture to prove to our visitors how you sneaky armorers have deceived so many of us common folk action movie fans with those fake M16A2s! Haha, just kidding. Anyway, how did you get your hands on a Diemaco? Remember Al Vrkljan, the Canadian armorer who helped me out on ''[[The Incredible Hulk (2008)]]''? He told me that Diemaco/Colt Canada wouldn't sell any of their guns to his company or any civilian companies, so where did it come from?

Also, you brought up an interesting point on the ''[[American Gun (2006)]]'' page...as an armorer who works in the film industry, how do you feel about the anti-gun attitudes that seem so prevalent in Hollywood? Does it ever frustrate you and make you not want to rent your guns out to people who are so overtly anti-RKBA? I've always wondered how armorers feel about the people they work with.

Appreciate the effort on the Type 84 and two-tone P226 pics. Whenever you get a chance!

==What do you think...==

...of the article on the [[Colt Flare Launcher]]? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

:Trust me, I'm not offended. I respect and share your commitment to ensuring accuracy on this site, especially since you're obviously far more qualified to talk about guns in film (and guns in general) than I will ever be. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== Oh, yes, and one other request...==

I have another request, this one a bit more unusual. I recently did a page for ''[[2 Fast 2 Furious]]'', which features a two-tone SIG P226 of West German manufacture that has a stainless frame and a regular black slide and barrel. It looks like the armorer just combined two existing guns to make it (since the two-tone P226s usually have black frame and stainless slide), and I'd love to have a picture of something identical for my page. So if you ever get out those two P226s that you photographed for IMFDB back in June, do you mind combining this:

[[Image:SigP226.jpg|thumb|none|250px|]]

..and this...

[[Image:SigP226Nickel.jpg|thumb|none|250px|]]

...to make this?

[[Image:2F2F-P226-10.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:2F2F-P226-13.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

...and then taking a picture of it for me? Also, if you put the slide and barrel from the stainless P226 on the frame of the black P226, you'd have a gun identical to the one from ''[[Face/Off]]'' which we could use for that page.

:Now THAT is news to me. I'm really surprised...finishes really make the fit of the parts THAT difficult? Wow. I don't think the gun above is a factory job because the two-tone P226s that SIG has sold are always black frame and stainless slide, not the other way around. Do you by chance know who supplied the weapons for ''[[2 Fast 2 Furious]]''?

:Thanks for the info, as always.

==Re: Back for a bit==

I do think you're right and that there are some SKS rifles in ''[[Platoon]]'' (which may or may not be Chinese Type 56 copies, for all I know). I own that movie on DVD, so as soon as I get back to my place, I'm gonna have to pop it in my laptop and watch again to be sure. Also, thanks for backing me up on the CAR-15 variants in the film - I was pretty sure they were 653s, and I know that particular model was exported in large numbers to U.S. allies during the 1970s (if you ever check out any Arab-Israeli war photos from the news, even today, you'll see many IDF personnel using them).

I was also suspicious of the "MAC-9" page, because I have never heard of that variant. On the other hand, I had no idea that the 9mm variant of the MAC-10 was called the "MAC-10/9"; I've usually just heard it referred to as a MAC-10. I figure "MAC-9" was just somebody butchering the spelling of "M11/9", which has appeared in lots of movies (I made the entry for that gun under the MAC-10 page myself, though someone else put down - inaccurately - that it was used in ''[[Blue Streak]]'').

Sorry to hear Josh Brolin broke a gun...indeed, how DO you bend a trigger guard? Then again, he's had some issues with the law lately, so maybe it's not too surprising. What film is he working on that required him to carry a Police Chief Special, anyway? Some period piece, I take it? I don't know how frustrating it is to be an armorer, but I can imagine...I mean, if you've rented out dozens of guns to one production, doesn't that make you lose your nerve to think how much those guns must be getting tossed around, even with armorers on-set to supervise their use? Also, remember when you sent me that picture of guns to ID from your vault? How many did I get right?

That's cool if you can get a picture of a Chinese Tokarev. Later. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Tokarev==

MP2008,

Nice to see you're back on the site! Hope you've seen some of GunMaster45's recent work (especially on ''[[Heartbreak Ridge]]'' and ''[[Platoon]]''.

Anyway, I'm curious...do you by chance have a Chinese Type 54 copy of a Tokarev in your company's inventory? I ask only because I've seen those in quite a few movies, and I figure we should have a picture of one for this site. Also, I thought that only Chinese Tokarevs have the frame-mounted safety? I have little experience with them, but I thought I remembered reading that...please educate me if I'm wrong!

==Re: A pic and an update==

Good lord, is that what Heaven on Earth looks like? I can see (from left to right), an AR with a triangular forearm (M16A1 or AR15 SP1, I can't tell, but the selector appears to be on semi!), an FN MAG, an MP5A2 with slim forearm, a shorty AR with a 10" barrel, an AKM variant, an FN Minimi, a G36E, two AR carbines with what appear to be 14.5"+ barrels, what I believe to be an MG3 and an MG42, and then a PK or PKM. Behind the MG3, I see the barrel shroud of what might be an M1919, but I can't tell for sure. All I know is that I seriously hope my own safe looks like that...some day (as it stands, my GSA-imported Chinese AK is the only "evil"-looking gun I own).

As far as changing the pages...totally fine. I never intended to leave our conversations on there permanently...only long enough to make sure that the guns were properly identified. Of course, I'm quickly learning that you're usually right!

Sorry you've got so many guns to clean...I've heard stories about the way that blanks wear guns in comparison to live rounds, so I know how busy you must be! As far as replacement parts go, please replace that slim forearm on the MP5 (which I see has a tag). I've always found those slim forearms on ANY H&K long gun to be annoying because I can't get a comfortable grip on them; they're just way too narrow (and this is coming from a guy with pretty small hands!) I imagine anyone who has to fire hundreds of rounds out of that gun (until the director gets a satisfying take of an action scene) would also start to hate it.

Haha...thanks for the vault picture. Talk to you later. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Long-barreled AK under-folder==

Here is the gun from ''[[The X-Files]]'' I mentioned to you. Found these on a fan site for the show. They're not great quality, but you can see it pretty well:

[[Image:X-files-Type84-4.jpg|thumb|800px|none|]]
[[Image:X-files-Type84-3.jpg|thumb|800px|none|]]
[[Image:X-files-Type84-2.jpg|thumb|800px|none|]]
[[Image:X-files-Type84.jpg|thumb|800px|none|(This one is from a different episode)]]

It's clearly an under-folder, it has a long barrel, but it also has what appears to be a .223 mag. And it seems to have a hooded front sight in the first pic. Any idea what this might be? It's appeared in several episodes of the show from a couple of seasons, and I always thought it was a Type 84 under-folder fitted with the barrel from an RPK clone. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

::Mike Sudrow is listed on IMDB as having worked on a few episodes of ''[[The X-Files]]''. Since the show lasted so long (nine years), I imagine they probably had many, many different armorers depending on the season/filming location.

::As far as Canadian armorers go, Al Vrkljan of Movie Armaments Group was on here a couple months ago. He corrected me on the ''[[The Incredible Hulk (2008)|Incredible Hulk]]'' page by telling me that, interestingly enough, Diemaco/Colt Canada won't sell its weapons to film armorers in Canada! He also told me more about those mystery grenade launchers we were discussing earlier, plus he updated the page with more guns that I had missed. I really hope he comes back; he said he might be able to get some pictures of the launchers for us.

::No worries on the ''[[Heat]]'' stuff, although I think you actually mean Gunmaster45, not me. As far as buying handguns go, I have yet to even try it in my home state (NC) because I live in Orange County and you have to get three "references" (people who are county residents) to apply for a purchase permit at the sheriff's dept. Sadly, Chapel Hill is full of overly-liberal people whom I wouldn't be comfortable asking to sign my permit application, so I've never bought a pistol here even though I'm of age - I've just inherited pistols from my grandfather. Ah, well, maybe if I wind up re-locating to Texas for this new job, I can finally buy that SIG P226 I've always wanted... -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:Re:Sahara==

Thanks for going so far out of your way to get the photo of the Type 84 with the AKM-style sight...I realize it must have been a hassle! However, I wasn't saying they put an AKM sight on a Type 84; I simply thought the front sight itself indicated the gun was a Type 84 because my eyes suck and it looked hooded to me from that perspective.

As far as the source goes, I believe Crowntower Limited supplied the weapons that were used in ''[[Sahara]]''. I say that based on a couple of deductions: Sascha Robey was one of the armorers who worked on ''[[Casino Royale]]'' as well as ''[[Sahara]]'', Crowntower is listed in the credits of ''[[Casino Royale]]'' (but not ''[[Sahara]]'') as the weapons supplier, and finally, if you look at our ''[[Casino Royale]]'' page, the AKs in that film top look identical to the one in ''[[Sahara]]'' that we were talking about. Perhaps this Sascha Robey rented the same guns for two films.

==Re:Sahara==

A lot of what you've said makes sense...BUT, there's still something bugging me about the third screenshot. Either my eyes really suck, or that is still a Norinco-style sight in that shot. HOWEVER, the first screenshot does, admittedly, show what appears to be a standard AKM-style front sight. Compare:

[[Image:ComparisonSaharaAK.JPG|thumb|800px|none|]]

I'm also confused because I have seen Type 84s fitted with mags that LOOK like the Romak mags, even if they aren't, like the one in the picture I posted. Anyway, is it possible that they used two different weapons for this "hero" gun use, and one was a Romak (or whatever) and the other was a Type 84 re-styled to look more like the Romak?

BTW, I didn't correct that typo; Gunmaster45 did. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

Oh, yeah, and the screens are really cool. As far as people's sudden interest in ignored pages, I guess it has to do with the fact that once they see somebody's worked on it in the "Recent Changes" section, they glance at it, and then they're more likely to spot mistakes they didn't see before.

:OK, you know what? My eyes ''do'' suck! I just stood way, way back from my monitor and squinted, and now I see that it's not a hooded Norinco sight; it's just the angle makes it appear circular. You are right; it can't be a Type 84, or anything that uses Type 84 parts. And I'm guessing that also means I could be wrong about the ''[[Casino Royale]]'' AKs, too.

:It's kinda strange, though...I wouldn't have figured British armorers would use civilian AK variants that were essentially geared towards the U.S. firearms market.

==I, Robot SMG==

Excellent, I'm glad to see you found the scene in ''[[I, Robot]]'' where it shows a close-up of the SMG's receiver and the Spectre's safety is visible. I was beginning to think my memory had failed me and that I was wrong...but I remember seeing this movie in the theater, on the big screen, and seeing that exact same image in your screenshot. Immediately, I thought to myself, "Spectre M4!" Actually, only a few months before the movie came out, I was at a gun show where one of the dealers had the semi-auto carbine version on his table...probably how I recognized it so quickly!

BTW, I believe the trigger and pistol grip are one unit on the Spectre. It looks to me like the armorers who worked on ''[[I, Robot]]'' just removed it and added that PSG1-style grip, but never bothered to put on a replacement trigger guard. - [[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==M70==

Hi,

Do you think we should really have a separate page for the [[Zastava M70]], instead of just putting it under the [[AK-47]] page, as we did for the [[AK-47#Norinco Type 56|Type 56]]? - [[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

:I see your point. However, my personal criteria is that we should keep all conventional 7.62x39mm AK-type assault rifles on one page. Although the M70 series are by no means straightforward AK-47/AKM copies (due to the ladder sight and the mix of stamped receiver with traditional AK layout, like on the Type 56), they are still basically pretty conventional rifles, as opposed to say, the Norinco Type 86 or the Saiga and Vepr series. I feel it'd probably be better to keep the M70 on the [[AK-47]] page, especially since I haven't seen any movies yet that feature weapons like the M76 or M77. This is, of course, sort of a gray area and one of the biggest problems with this site, IMO.

:Also, I feel compelled to point out...there's an episode in ''[[Ultimate Force]]'' where "Russian" soldiers are actually seen using M70Bs and Type 56s, which is of course ridiculously inaccurate (the episode takes place in the present-day Chechen conflict).

==RE: RE: Studio Weapons==
You more than answered the question, thank you. I have seen some pictures of places that do the rentals and, frankly, privately list them as places I would most want to work. ''"No we don't have a .50 cal minigun on the shelves but I can check in the back."'' Once again thanks for the info and for the earlier compliments. Incidentally, I am working on a new one..."Farewell to the King" (1989)..should have it ready in a few days.

Do studios still keep their own "arsenals"? I was given the impression that most, if not all, firearms for movies were in the private sector.

== RE: Images ==
No skin off of my nose what images you use mate. Fact of the matter is, when you boil it down, pretty much all the images we are using on here are not "legal". So which ones you use, from whatever site are ok with me. Frankly, as far as I go, I try to only use images which do not have another web site's watermark on them.

==RE:==

First of all, cheers for the update on the Type 84 picture. There's no hurry; I understand if it takes a while to get the appropriate mags (since obviously, a Type 84 doesn't look very different from a Type 56 without them).

Second, while I don't speak for everyone on here, I can say that I personally do not have any problem with you replacing pictures of guns on this site (even those that I uploaded) with any that you took. Nor do I see why anyone else would. The only reason I can imagine anyone getting offended would be if they went to the same effort you do to get the guns and photograph them on their own. But pretty much everyone else on here just uploads pictures they copied from other gun sites, in some cases ''airsoft'' web sites (like that picture we used to have of the SP89, which was just an airsoft MP5K fitted with an SP89 handguard from DenTrinity; terrible!). And it doesn't take much time or effort to copy and upload someone else's work.

Additionally, your gun photos are obviously of superior quality to anything else on here, and they're of guns that have actually appeared in movies (possibly the same movies as the pages they're on), so as far as I am concerned, there really isn't any reason why we can't replace any existing photos of guns with the ones you've taken. In fact, I would encourage you to ''not'' be so timid in the future when it comes to replacing photos. If you want an example of what I mean by this, take a look at the [[Armalite AR-18]] page. Your AR-18 picture is way better than any of those on the page, so I don't see any reason why you can't just remove some of the others (maybe keep ONE of the other photos of the gun with the scope, and even that could be replaced if you took an equivalent picture).

One thing I will point out, though: I have sometimes used pictures on my pages that are from the web site of Rick Washburn's company Weapons Specialists, Inc. (http://www.weaponspecialists.com/index.php). They provided the guns for ''[[I Am Legend]]'', so the page for that movie now features pictures of the guns used in the film that I copied and uploaded from them (including the tan-framed Mark 23). In cases like that, I'd prefer those particular photos stay up (you'll know them because I always provide links and info mentioning where they're from) because they feature the actual movie guns, and they're decent quality. Besides that, I don't have any problem with you replacing any and all photos of guns on this site with yours.

==Chinese Type 56==

First of all, I GREATLY appreciate the photo you took of one of the ''[[Goldeneye]]'' AKs for me. I didn't know you had access to any British armories?

However, I have one question: Do you think it's really appropriate to classify the Chinese Type 56 rifles with stamped receivers as "AK-47" and "AKS-47" clones, as opposed to AKM/AKMS derivatives? I realize that the Type 56s with stamped receivers lack just about all of the other features of the AKMs (including the muzzle break, ribbed receiver cover, rate reducer, grip rails, narrower front sight, etc.), but I've usually heard them described as AKM copies simply to distinguish them from the earlier milled-receiver versions. I know this is an over-simplification of sorts because the Type 56s aren't really orthodox AK-47s or AKMs (they're more like a weird hybrid version), but I figured it would be more appropriate.

:Well, I would say I know the differences between the two. I must point out that I own a Chinese AK (mine was imported by Golden State Arms and simply has 'AK47S 7.62x39mm - Made in China' stamped on the receiver). I was simply curious whether the presence of a stamped receiver on the Type 56 made it worthy of being designated an AKM variant or not.

:Personally, I think the best bet might be to literally just create a new sub-entry for the Type 56 under the [[AK-47]] page and then we can focus on finding any and all movies that feature the Type 56 and putting them under there. This would reflect best the fact that the Type 56 is sort of a weird hybrid AK-47/AKM with distinctly Chinese characteristics (such as the hooded front sight), which most other AK derivatives (like the Maadis) don't have.

::Haha, no offense taken, just wanted you to know I'm not a complete newbie when it comes to AKs, though obviously you completely blow me out of the water. Anyway, I would definitely appreciate the Type 84 pic whenever you get a chance. Not sure if there's anything else I need at the moment...but I would strongly encourage you to just take pictures of whatever you can get your hands on. As I've said, it's really great that we have you because this site is full of pictures that are copied from sites like world.guns.ru or (in some cases) AIRSOFT websites (i.e. the SP89 picture that we used to have before I replaced it).

::BTW, these are some incredible pics you've gotten us lately, moreso than usual. How on earth did you get that Romanian AIMS from "44 Minutes"? Do you know Thell Reed, too? Also, I'm going to do a LITTLE bit of additional work on the [[AK-47#Type 56|Type 56]] entry, and I think I'm also gonna ditch the AKS-47 one for now (simply because there don't seem to be any movies I'm aware of that have actual milled-receiver Russian AKS-47s or close copies) and move all the Type 56-1 entires down. If you disagree, you can revert (or partially modify) the edits and I won't mind. Also, good work on the [[RPG-7]] article getting the Type 69 mentioned (it's something I wanted to do myself - mostly because "Kingdom of the Crystal Skull" also has a Type 69).

==Re: Editing Dogs of War==

Thanks for the info. I've seen those guns in a whole bunch of movies and I always wondered what they were, who made them, and why. I think they've also appeared in a couple episodes of ''[[The A-Team]]'' and a Chuck Norris movie or two.

I have some great screenshots of the fake Uzis which I took for my ''[[Raw Deal]]'' page (I've been meaning to work on it for ages, but so far, I just never have managed to get around to it). Here they are:

[[Image:Vlcsnap-59410.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

[[Image:Vlcsnap-59747.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

== Re: image ==

Sorry for the mixup. Feel free to replace the image with a better one if you have one handy. It's good to have a professional armourer on the site to help out, you've been doing some good work so far. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 10:58, 8 June 2008 (UTC) Orca1_9904

== Contact? ==

I was wondering, is there any way we could chat off-site? I'd enjoy the opportunity to talk with you about your work as an armourer and about some various weapons and films. My contact info can be found on my user page. I hope to hear from you soon, and wish you well. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 22:43, 9 June 2008 (UTC) Orca1_9904

== Red Dawn ==

OK, I was simply confused because I thought you were saying that the Egyptians didn't call the full-auto version they made for their armed forces the Misr, which would contradict almost every book and web site on AKs I've read. You obviously know far, FAR more than I do, so I think it's perfectly fine if you want to edit the page to refer to the guns as Maadi ARMs. Perhaps it might also be reasonable to put in a note that the ARM is the semi-automatic version of the Misr or something? Also, please post the picture of the "Red Dawn" AKM you took.

Appreciate your contributions, and (especially) your photographs. It's really cool that we have somebody like you on here. Do you by chance have any pictures of the Norinco/Poly Tech AKs that the rental armories purchased in the 80s? A long, LONG time ago, somebody put one of them up for sale on GunBroker; I wish I had saved the picture. I'm also curious to know if you have pics of the Norinco Type 84...I've been trying to get a good one to add to the ''[[Casino Royale]]'' page and my ''[[Harsh Realm]]'' page for a while now.

:Wow, thanks! Yeah, I'd prefer the basic fixed-stock configuration since the ones in ''[[Casino Royale]]'' and ''[[Harsh Realm]]'' seem to have that (except the wood on the CR guns looks like it can't be factory), but I wouldn't encourage you to go TOO far out of your way, as I recognize you must be really busy.

:Which armory is it that you have access to?

==Re: My two cents on the Hulk Launchers==
Yeah, I think you're probably right...it looks to me that the armorers were shooting for an M32 look but couldn't get the real deal, so they took civilian launchers (most likely DefTech) and modified them heavily. I notice that there seem to be a lot of 37mm launchers which are depicted as HE grenade launchers in movies (i.e. Colt 37mm Flare Launchers substituting for M203s). I guess this is another case of the same deal.

Sure, you can re-post the CZ99 pic. It isn't "mine"; I took it from world.guns.ru, which is where many of the photographs of guns on this site come from (as you can imagine, that's why I'm happy to have someone like you who is willing to give us original photos, especially when they're of actual movie guns).

== Thanks ==

[[The Dogs of War]] was one of my first "efforts" here. I knew, already, that you saw a guy running around with a [[MAC-10]] during the weapons training phase but did not know there was one of those cheesy ass "fake" [[Uzi]]s. Oh, the same goes for the Car-15s.

Incidentally, I forget what movie I saw it in but there was a fake [[Uzi]] in it and the foregrip on it was rotated so that the front sight was actually pointed downward!!!

== Hey ==

Hey MoviePropMaster, I'm Alienqueen11, and I seen the images you have uploaded, and they're great. I also want to know if you can do me a favor, if you can upload a picture of a [[Remington 870]] with Ghost Ring Sights and a High Capacity Tube like the one in the screenshot below for the [[Dawn of the Dead (2004)]] page, I would greatly appreciate it, and great work so far.
[[Image:DotD_Mossberg2.jpg|thumb|none|350px|]]

== Thanks ==

Thanks for complitementing my knowledge on guns, I also reverted a version of one of your MP5 pictures because someone copied over it with an airsoft image, I really wish some people would checked the thing while they're uploading an image to make sure the name isn't already used to avoid mistakes like this. And once again, thanks for your contributions and keep up the good work. Alienqueen11.

== Heartbreak Ridge M16's ==

I just saw ''[[Heartbreak Ridge]]'' on TV this afternoon, and all the [[M16 rifle series|M16]]'s I saw on-screen were the A1 variant, complete with bolt-forward assist buttons at the rear of the upper recievers. Even saw one fitted with an [[M203 grenade launcher]] used by one of the Recon Marines under Gunnery Sergeant Highway's command.

[[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 08:01, 22 July 2008 (UTC) Orca1_9904
- He might want to look at my page and see they weren't ''all'' M16A1s.

==Question==
[[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]: Hi, I was just wondering how is it you take a picture of a gun and get a perfectly white clear background? What method is used to get that effect? My other question is that on the [[Hollow Point]] page I made recently, did I get the AK varient right? I figured I'd ask you as you seem to be the AK pro on the site. Thanks.
(My list of pages is on my profile if you feel like checking any of my other work as well.)

==M14 rifle==
I've noticed that the M14 and M21 rifle pictures on this site aren't really that great, is there any chance you could take some good shots? The pictures now are blurry, or black and white.

==37mm Launcher==
Thanks for fixing up that page, I was told by MT2008 it was a Colt Launcher, I guess it was a Cobray. Finding the pictures of them was probably the hardest thing on the page. Do you think we should keep the M203 to launcher comparison picture or is it irrelevant? -GM

::I built the colt launcher page based on what MT said, but your input greatly helped it. It's a shame taking professional pictures is so complex. The best I have is photoshop and an erase brush. I have a Norinco Type 54 pistol and I wanted to put pictures of it on the site soon. I'm not bad with editing, it should come out okay. I just need to find the time to do it. The M14 rifle pics came out great, let me know if you get your hands on an M21. I'll have plenty of films to be corrected in the future, my to do list touches the sky. One or two every friday or saturday. Stay cool. -GM

==Bren 10 "Peregrine Falcon"==
:Here's a tricky task, do you think you could find a Bren 10 "Peregrine Falcon"? Aparently it is what John Practice uses in [[Last Action Hero]] according to user input, and I can't find a good picture of it. Until I do find a good picture, I'll have to keep my horrible AR-24 picture I had on their before. If it isn't a Bren 10 PF, I'd assume you of all people would shoot me straight.
[[Image:StarMegastarLastActionHero.jpg|thumb|none|400px|This is the picture of him with the Bren 10 "Peregrine Falcon". His is a tutone model, but I'm not that picky. If both can be had, it would make a nice page in the Bren 10 gun section.]]
==M1911/M1911A1==
::I apoligize for asking one more thing of you, but the M1911 and M1911A1 pistols are infamous works of art in the firearms world, commonly used in films. We got a repro M1911 picture (modernized), a Springfield M1911A1 (when Colt M1911A1 is the genuine picture desired), another M1911A1 with pachmyr grips (better than springfield, but see how it sticks out on Platoon? It's ''too'' modern) So is their any chance you could find a genuine (or prefered, an ''authentic'' reproduction) of a Colt M1911 and Colt M1911A1 to snap some shots of, that would be awesome. I trust you know them apart, your a pro. Thanks. Good luck. -GM

==Re:Last Action Hero==
I saw [[Last Action Hero]] when I was young and loved it. Now, it is still one of my favorites. I like how it makes fun of action movies, by showing how Arnold can fire a billion rounds from a Desert Eagle and cars just explode for no reason. I'll fix those problems you mentioned. Your saying they are more likely civilian TEC-9s instead of TEC-DC9's? What physical traits help determine this, just the sling? And they were firing full-auto so they were probably converted.

== Hi! ==

Still no replacement grip for the M70?

Shame, it looks strange with that grip - I'm used to seeing them on M76s and M72s... which reminds me: about that mystery long barreled AK - I know that Crvena Zastava makes under-folder RPKs, namely the M72A (7.62 - based on M70), and the M90A (5.56 - based on an assault rifle of the same designation). The under-folder RPKs (those with an "A") have removable bipods (the standard, solid-stock ones have fixed), so w/ the folding stocks and w/o bipods they would look like those mystery AKs, no? Also, one more improtant fact: unlike the Yugo AKs (which have 3 holes), the Yugo RPKs have TWO holes in the forward grip (like the original AKs). http://pookieweb.dyndns.org:61129/Yugo/pics/m72a.jpg

I hope this was hepful, keep up the good work!

== Request ==

I'm sorry to ask, but if you get the chance, can you upload a [[Beretta M92F|Beretta M92FS]]? I know the ones on the site are already good enough, but I want to see how great one by you would be. I know you're already busy, so don't do it if you're too busy, and if you can't upload it, it's okay. Anyway, welcome back, the new pictures for the M16 and M14 are great. [[User: Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]]

== RE:870 ==

I think you're right about the Mossberg sights on the 870, they seem to match those on the Mossberg more then anything.

Here the picture I had on the page when I thought his shotgun was a Mossberg 500:
[[Image:Mossberg500.gif|thumb|none|335px|[[Mossberg 500]] 12 ga. with optional ghost ring sights.]]

And this is the image I have on the page now, seeing it now, they look nothing like the sights in the screencap:
[[Image:870p.jpg|thumb|none|335px|Remington 870 Police Magnum with magazine extention tube and ghost ring sights.]]

And it looks like the armorer must have put the Mossberg sights on the Remington:
[[Image:DotD Mossberg2.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]

Hope this helps, and thanks for the favor, I appreciate it. [[User: Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]]

== Done ==

Don't worry, he won't be able to edit again, if it happens again, I'll be sure to make so only registered users can edit the [[Commando]] page. [[User: Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]]

==Karabiner 98k sniper rifle==
:I recently noticed while working on the [[Saving Private Ryan]] page that we have no sniper rifle varient Kar98k rifle pic. I've noticed you [[Enemy at the Gates]] page is in need of this picture as well too. I apoligize for adding yet another gun to your to-do list but just let me know if you find one. -GM45

==Re: FINALLY==

Excellent! I already have a use for the 870 folder, too - just put it on the ''[[RoboCop]]'' page (which features an identical weapon). And thanks for the UMP-45 and the Gen 2 Glock-17 as well! There are so many movies that feature Gen 2 Glocks, yet all we have is that stock picture of a Gen 3. When I get back to my place later today, I'm going to start using your Glock in every movie page that features such a gun.

Also...that AR15A2 you photographed; can we consider it an M16A2? Is it converted to auto or burst? We really need a good M16A2 picture, because the one that appears throughout the site is yet another crappy airsoft picture.

==RE:==

Hmmm, I'll have to see. There's lots of loose women and great beer over here in Texas that I ''might'' be able to offer you, but the gold's gonna be hard to come by! Haha.

Thanks yet AGAIN for the improved two-tone P226 picture. Weirdly enough, I completely failed to notice that the one in ''[[Face/Off]]'' had a silver hammer until you pointed it out. But it's great that you have a better eye for detail than I do, and moreso that you corrected it. And, of course, thank you for answering my questions about movie guns to the best of your ability. I think your idea for a 12-gauge pump page is perfectly useful, though I must point out that if it can't be categorized, it's gonna be hard for other users to find it. In order to make sure people see it, please add links to it on pages for the shotguns it distinguishes from each other. That would be the best way to make sure your word gets out.

Hope you don't mind, but I've already shown your SIG pics on SIGforum.com to draw attention to our site. I'd show your H&K pictures on HKPRO forum (where I also post), too, if their forum wasn't down every other minute. I dunno if you post on any other gun-related boards, but if you do, show off your pics and point folks to IMFDB. The more attention, the better. We've already got 55,000 views from the ''[[Heat]]'' page (which features your P220 and M16A1 pictures, among others), so spread the word and more people will discover the beauty of IMFDB with its original movie gun pictures, taken by an actual movie armorer!

Oh, yeah, and I will respond to the topic of vandals on Bunni's talk page shortly. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:Dibbs==
Feel free, one less thing for me to do. I only ask that you keep the bow and knife on the page so it fits the other two. I'll eventually add them to [[Rambo (2008)]] so that one fits as well. If anything I'll likely just add some shots like I tend to do. Thanks for asking me and not just doing it. Can't wait to see it. -[[User:Gunmaster45|GM45]]
::Almost forgot, MT2008 may have asked already but we really need a Poly Tech Legend AK pic.

:::Nope, I forgot, too! Yeah, it wouldn't be a bad idea. I've been looking for one on Google image search, but no go on any good ones. Also, speaking of AKs (and here I go again making your request list longer), a new AKM pic would be nice. Not to sound unappreciative, but I tend to shy away from the one you took just because the red stock looks out-of-place and ugly, plus the magazine is the plastic type rather than the ribbed type. If you can get a picture of one of the Maadi AKMs with the right stock, plus a metal ribbed-style mag (which is more the "classic" style, if you will)...great. If not, no worries. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:Casino Royale==

Yep, that's the exact same picture I looked up to remind myself what an M76 was. Actually, I think I always thought that the M76 just referred to their long-range rifle, and I didn't remember that their smaller-caliber AKs were called M76. But I did know off the top of my head that it couldn't be Zastava because their full-sized AKs always have the folding GL sight, and the ''[[Casino Royale]]'' AKs don't.

BTW, any idea what's wrong with the [[Taurus PT92]] picture you gave us? I just put it on the page for ''[[The X-Files]]'', and now it's disappeared. A search of the page history indicates no act of vandalism.

Oh, yeah, and one other thing: I never thanked you for getting that Australian Automatic Arms carbine picture for ''[[The Matrix]]'' page. So...thanks! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== DotD 870 ==

I don't mean to bug you, but did you have any luck with the Dawn of the Dead Remington 870, and did the message I sent you about about the sights help at all, please let me know. Also excellent work lately, The new Mossberg 500 and Remington 870 pictures are great, and so are the many other pictures you uploaded lately, I really like the two tone Sig P226s you got for MT2008, those are one of kind. Good luck, and keep up the good work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:10, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

==Kelly's Heroes==
I was aware they were using FN BAR type D 8mm guns instead of american .30-06 BARs but I didn't know they were using the wrong mag pouches. Thanks for the info. -GM45

==Re:M1911 pistols==
The 1911 pictures are absolute perfection. The M1911 from 1913 looks great. I have one from 1913 too and yours puts mine to shame. Thanks very much. -GM45

:And thanks for the P38, too! Feel free to just delete the one that's been on the P38 already, and insert your image into any and all movie pages featuring P38s. I've been replacing old gun images on many pages with your new gun images (i.e. the Glock you uploaded earlier in the week). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== Need some help ==

Hello, I just added a few more guns in The Unit page and I need some help IDing some of them that I can't seem to put my finger on. Care to give me a hand if you can?

-Excaliber

== Re: Beretta M92FS ==

It looks excellent, I don't mind an American made Beretta, an Italian made one isn't too different, is it? If you come across an Italian one in the future, you can upload that, but you don't have to, like I said, I like the new one as it is. Thank you soo much for the favor, you never disappoint.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 23:28, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

==Thanks for the USP!==

I was thinking of asking you for a USP pic, but figured I should hold off on it, just to prevent you from getting bogged down.

As you can tell, we're embarking on a campaign to replace any and all older images of guns taken from other sites, with the pictures you've uploaded. I'm also curious...what would you think of a page dedicated to explaining the importance of your gun images to new users of the site, and featuring examples of your work? It would be linked from the main page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== Should cartoons be allowed? ==

I want to know if it is either no one cares about the fact that cartoons like Family Guy, The Simpsons, American Dad, and recently South Park had been allowed to this site. I have don't think these pages should exist because do you think about the rare guns that appears on those shows and wonder what they are? Cause I sure don't. I'm too busy laughing my ass off to how funny these series are, not wondering if the shotgun Homer used in the Zombie episode was a Winchester Model 1887 or that it never appeared in any other episode following. I don't care and I dont think anyone else should care. We're getting cartoon fanboys that thinks just because Family Guy has an episode where Stewie has a closet full of look alike guns, means we should write a page about them. Those guns are not the point of the show and the artist that drew them obviously didn't take much consideration for them or mention. I think Family Guy, The Simpsons, American Dad, and South Park be removed at once. None of them deserve to be on this site. And whoever puts them here doesn't respect this site enough.
::That's a little harsh. I added some of the info on those pages, thank you. I was eventually going to do the South Park movie, because it does in fact have some pretty obvious guns in it. Personally I think they shouldn't be removed but if they are to stay, someone should take the time to screencap them and show us what they are talking about. -GM45

==Reign of Fire==
I just finished screencapping [[Reign of Fire]] and before I upload them on the page, I wanted to see if you knew what this gun is. Based on what I see I'm assuming it is a .577 Nitro Tyrannosaurus Rex rifle built personally by the Mauser company's greatest gunsmiths based on the Mauser rifle type extractor/bolt release and the Mauser style firing pin striker seen on the gun. At first I thought it was a Model 70 or a Mauser sporterized and then they show what big ass rounds he loads in it so now I just don't know. I figured of all, you'd likely know best. Also, if it is a T-rex rifle, I'd likely need a picture of it because as usual, the internet sucks for finding gun pics. I know this gun is rare but so is the .600 Nitro double barreled rifle, but that is seen in [[The Lost World: Jurassic Park]] despite that. I'm not expecting a picture from you because I know how rare and expensive it is but I figured if it ever came up I could count on you.

Here's the pics:
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-1.jpg|thumb|none|500px|His rifle resting up against the table.]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-2.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Note the extractor/bolt release and Mauser style striker.]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-3.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-4.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-5.jpg|thumb|none|500px|This scope symbol looks familiar, what brand is this?]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-6.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Look at the monstrous rounds he loads it with. Only two fit in the gun! They look like either .577 or .600 Nitro rounds.]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-7.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-8.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-9.jpg|thumb|none|500px|He fires the rifle at the big bull dragon, which does nothing and tosses it away after two shots.]]

Hope you respond soon. -[[User:Gunmaster45|GM45]]
::I've decided to upload the movie tommorow to give you more time to respond. -GM

: I didn't expect you'd have one, after all it isn't a mass produced company gun. Major members of the Mauser company make it customly crafted. You'll see it all on the page in a sec. Also, the pic I uploaded I had to edit so it was horizontal and since it had 4 whited corners after turning it, I had to clone the corners in. Once you know, it is far more obvious to tell where I edited.

==Re: New Pics==

What I meant is that I want to make sure people on this site see how thorough you are, and how accurately you match guns to requests. Remember that AR15 Sporter that you visually modified to look like an XM177 from ''[[The Dogs of War]]''? Or the two SIG P226s you made to look the ones in ''[[Face/Off]]'' and ''[[Bad Boys II]]''? Those are the kinds of gun pics that I want to show off to new folks. What I would do is just make a page that briefly explains your contributions, and then shows guns you've photographed and how close they are to those in the movies. This is an unformed idea, I admit, but basically, I want people browsing this sight to understand (1.) That your images are exclusive to IMFDB, and (2.) That they're basically close representations of what those users have seen in movies. I know I'm not being terribly articulate, but do you understand what I mean?

And don't worry about replacing previous pics with your pics. The rest of us will continue to do that for you, as we've been doing. So far, we've pretty much replaced all of the old M16s, M4s, Berettas, Glocks, Kar98s, MP40s, etc. with your guns. I think I'm gonna start putting your USP pic on our pages, too (except those that feature the larger .45 variant of the USP, like ''[[Collateral]]'').-[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==AK-47 recognition page==
Now that you've made a Shotgun page, why not make an AK page to tell a Norinco from a Maadi from a genuine, from a poly tech, etc.
Also, maybe an M16 page for slab sides, A1s, A2s, etc.
It would probably help the users out a lot. I'm sure the shotgun page did. Personally, I have trouble telling a Norinco Type 56 aside from its hooded sight. Perhaps a couple of close ups of sight placement, recievers and all that will make me a more efficient I.Der. -GM45

== Dawn of the Dead ==

Hey, MPM2008, I uploaded some more shots of Ving Rhames' shotgun in [[Dawn of the Dead (2004)]] if you want to take a look, it's in the Custom Remington 870 section of the page. Thanks in advance.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:48, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

== Hey ==

Hey, MPM2008, do you want me to put protections on your images so no one can revert them if they've been upload over with images from the internet in the past, or upload over them? I'm asking this because some user keeps uploading a crappy picture from the internet over your H&K USP40 image. And if you want, I could ask Bunni to make you a mod or I can take the protections off them whenever you want to edit them or upload a new version of them. Let me know what you want to do.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:24, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

Update: I protected all your images, and I also asked Bunni to make you an adminstrator so you can upload new versions of or revert them if want. If you not made an admin right away, just tell me what image you want to access, and I'll unlock it for you. I'm sorry I had to do this, but I wanted to prevent idiots like the guy who kept uploading over your H&K USP40 from changing your pictures, and I promise, if I ever get the ability to block users back, I will undo the protections. See you soon and good luck.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:07, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

:Made you a mod, enjoy. [[User:WikiSysop|WikiSysop]] 22:42, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

== Response ==

Thanks, I will always make sure your images stay the way they are. And I didn't understand that user either, I told him politely a bunch of times to stop, but he wouldn't listen. What really intrigues me most is how somebody could prefer a crappy image they probably found on Google Images over an excellent well photographed image such as yours. As for being a mod, congratulations, but I most warn you that the block function is not working at this time, but Bunni is trying his best to fix it, but you will be able to delete any pages or images you don't want, and you will also be able to protect pages. And if we ever get the ability to block back, that one user is going to be the first on my list.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:20, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

As for the 870, take as much time as you need to, I'm sure it'll be worth the wait when it's uploaded. I will also have more requests in the future, but I won't bother you with them right now. And I also I have a question, I read your new project pictures thing on your user page, and when you say 870 riot configurations, do mean Remington 870s similar in appearence to the one seen in [[Walking Tall]]? Thanks, and good luck, I can't wait to see any future images you upload.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:20, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Update- MPM2008, you are now able to block vandals.

==Re:Special page==

Well, that's fine. But now that you're a mod and your images can be protected, I don't think there's much to worry about. I also think it would just be cool if new users understood right off the bat that IMFDB has essentially its own movie armorer. -MT2008

== Other Request ==

Hey, MPM2008, whenever you get the chance, is there a possiblity you can get me a Beretta 92FS Inox or Stainless model of the Beretta 92FS? Thanks in advance. Also, good work with your recent images, I really like the new Walther P99, I was going to ask for one, but you thought about it before I did. Keep up the great work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 21:51, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

==Sin City Yellow Bastard's custom 92FS==
YB's Beretta 92FS in [[Sin City]] is a unique blend of a factory black and an Inox model, similair to SIG-Sauer used in 2 fast 2 furious. Since AQ11 just asked for an Inox, if you get your hands on one, do yuo think you could mix the two together. This is the gun in the movie.
[[Image:SC92FS-3.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Note how it has reverse tutone rather than the typical factory style.]]

Thanks -GM45

== Re: Pop Quiz ==

I think that may be a [[Smith & Wesson Model 27]], as it comes in both .357 Magnum and .38 Special and looks similar to the one used in ''[[Bad Boys]]'' by the main villian. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 06:55, 27 October 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

:Isn't the Mod 27 a larger frame? That's what's stumping me. It looks like the frame of a model 10. MPM2008.

::That one in the ''Bad Boys'' screenshot looks pretty huge, unless the actor has small hands. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 07:38, 27 October 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

::Arghhh. I had better go back to the vault and check. I keep on thinking it's a Model 19-2, primarily because the Mod 27-2 barrel looks different than this one. Thanks so much for the effort. MPM2008

BTW, I'll let you know what I find out. :)

[[Image:S&WRev.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson Model 27 .357 Magnum?]]
[[Image:BB_Python.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Fouchet dual wields with both his [[Beretta Cheetah]] and a [[Smith & Wesson Model 27]].]]

==RE:animated gifs==
I have a lot of high-tec computer editing crap, I likely could do it. I just don't know how. My sister is computer wiz, I see if she can figure it out. I had all three of those Heat GIFs saved on my Myspace. Just a heads up, I'm gonna be doing [[The Punisher (2004)]] soon, so you can check that out. I can't make you any promises on the animated GIFs tho. -GM

==Re: Reign of Fire==
Thanks. Take your time on the Ultimax, it isn't a big deal right now. Wiki just made me an Admin. so I'm feeling pretty damn special right now. I'm going to get the Punisher (2004) on today, than I'm finally back on track with my original list. -GM45

=="Non Guns"==

I just made a page for the [["Non Guns"]], and I'm curious to know what you think of it. I don't know a whole lot about them besides what I've read online, whereas I imagine you've probably got some experience with them, since I've heard many armorers rent them for scenes where blanks are unsafe. Any thoughts? Would say the summary I've done at the top of the page is a pretty good description of what they do?

Cheers.-[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

:Haha, trust me, I hear you on the "fugly" part. I cringe every time I spot a Non Gun in a movie or TV show, because they're ''soooooo'' fake-looking and too many idiot directors don't even think to film them at angles/lighting conditions where it won't be so obvious what they are. But, like you've said, our goal here is to be educational and informative, and no matter how crappy Non Guns might look, they are still important to the topic of guns in cinema, and that's what we're here for. :) The images are from Weapons Specialists' web site, which apparently subrents them; ISS has their own pictures, but I prefer Weapons Specialists' because theirs don't have the measuring tape above the gun.

:Sorry to hear you've been sick, but don't worry...you never have to apologize for anything. I really like the idea of your "Hello IMFDB!" card and think it would be great for our site. I will, of course, not demand it or anything, but it would be awesome if we had something like that. I agree with the idea of using the IMFDB logo, though if I can think of anything else, I'll tell you. As usual, thanks for all the work you've been doing (for us AND Hollywood), and thanks for the kind words on my Non Guns page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== 2nd-Gen Glock 23 ==

Hey, I was wondering if you could possibly provide an image of a 2nd-Generation [[Glock#Glock 23|Glock 23]] for the article on ''[[The Fugitive]]'', since the image for that weapon on the page is of a 3rd-Generation model with accessory rails on the frame as opposed to the smooth-framed 2nd-Generation model seen in the screenshots? I already edited the [[Glock#Glock 22|Glock 22]] section similarly for that article and the sequel ''[[U.S. Marshals]]'', and was wondering if you could help me out with that one image so I don't have to chase down an image on Google. Thanks in advance. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 08:11, 1 November 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

:I asked for Second-Generation Glocks, those are 3rd generation (note the accessory rails at the front of the frame). Seeing as someone identified the compact Glock model in the film in question as a Glock 19 it's something of a moot point now. However, a 2nd-Generation [[Glock#Glock 19|Glock 19]] image would be appreciated as there's none available here yet and there's several pages here that could benefit from an image of that weapon. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 07:50, 12 November 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

== Get Well Soon ==

Hey MPM2008, I heard you were sick so I wanted to stop by and say get well soon.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:45, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

==My man!==

Awesome! The AKM and Type 84 look great; they're just what we needed. It's weird that I haven't been able to find a good picture of a standard fixed-stock Type 84 anywhere; yours might just be one of the best pics of this gun on the entire 'net right now. Question...is the AKM a Maadi, or is some other make? I would like to edit the entry on the AK-47 page to say if it is or not.

I will start phasing out the old pictures and replacing them, although it seems you guys have a head start on me. And thanks for the other new pictures as well - love that new PSG-1, the Uzi Carbine, and of course the "plain" 870 police (which, like you said, was something we REALLY needed). I'm also glad to see you're better, too. Take care. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:19, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

(BTW...dunno if you've noticed, but I only discovered this recently; if you hit the " ~ " key four times, it signs your posts automatically so that you don't have to type out your username. I've been using Wikis for several years now and I only just figured that out. Alienqueen discovered this long before I did, but just a heads-up.)

== Great work ==

Thanks for the police 870, it looks excellent. we really needed a standard since so many of the 870s on the site look like that. I'll be sure to replace all the 870s that need to be replaced with that. And also, I'm glad to hear you got better.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 18:27, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

== Oops ==

I didn't read correctly who gave me the PSG1 pic

==Pics==

Hi,

First of all, thanks yet again for the new pics! The SR9s are nice, but...I had no idea that some SR9s in movies are actually converted from HK91s? If that's the case, then by all means, you should still go ahead and put down those pics under the SR9 section of the G3 page. But does this also mean that the SR9(T) from ''[[The Replacement Killers]]'' is one of these guns? Again, this is just a huge revelation for me. I still see no reason to put them under the HK91 entry, simply because if they're meant to be SR9s, just as the converted HK94s are meant to be MP5s, then I think it's appropriate to label them as such.

And, thanks for the Type 56 that looks like the ''[[Goldeneye]]'' ones. If you want to shoot it again with the regular non-blued bolt carrier, that's fine by me. However, I should also point out that the ones in ''Goldeneye'' also have red bakelite magazines, so you might wanna give it one of those, too. Then, you'll have something identical to the ''Goldeneye'' "AKS-74s". But I will still use the picture you have in the meantime. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:15, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

:Hmmm. Yeah, I guess I figured when I noticed the trigger, but I wasn't sure if the gun from ''[[The Replacement Killers]]'' was genuine or not. Was this sort of thing done because real SR9s were too expensive? I figured since the SR9 used to be a readily available civilian "assault rifle", armorers would use it.

:However, if your guns are a fairly accurate representation of the SR9s that have appeared in movies, then it's better that you've given us images of these particular guns. I agree with you that our goal should be to have the most accurate representations of movie guns possible, and since you're an armorer, we can anticipate that yours represent what movies use.-[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:15, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

::''only 125 TCs were imported into the entire USA and only 100 T models''

::Wow, it was really that few? OK, that explains everything. I had no idea they were so rare to begin with. Even HKPRO, which has import data for most of the -90 series guns, didn't have that info. Thanks for those numbers.

::Like I've said, I think this means it's good that we have the pics you've taken because they are a very accurate representation of the SR9s actually used in movies. I would recommend you do one of those "Movie Armorer's Notes" in the SR9 section of the G3 page, just like you did for the Colt Commando section on the M16 page, explaining what you've told me. Hope it doesn't bother you that we're unmasking all of the various tricks that you armorers have been using over the years to convince moviegoers they're seeing one gun when it's actually another! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:59, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

==Re: SR9==

I think part of the problem is that there just aren't enough people who take Wikis in general seriously. As far as HK aficionados go, one of my pet peeves is that way too many of them I meet are way too arrogant towards non-HK owners for not being able to appreciate the "Teutonic superiority" (as Larry Correia put it) of HK weapons. Sorry to say that I dunno if you can please some of them no matter what you do. :)

Personally, I accept that there's some stuff that even Hollywood's people have to do in order to make our movie experience satisfactory. Like when we were talking about the ''[[Jarhead]]'' Abrams tanks...it's a necessary evil for Hollywood vehicle wranglers to dress up an English Centurion to look like an M1A1 simply because unless you're Spielberg, it's very hard to get the DoD to lend you a real one for a show. And likewise, in 1984, it was not possible to get real Soviet AKMs, RPG-7s, and DShKs, so the Stembridge armorers had to find the next best thing. But I also enjoy uncovering these tricks simply because I'm an enthusiast of firearms and military equipment in general, so I always like seeing how Hollywood's people think on the fly in adverse circumstances. There's an art to it, no? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:16, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the correction on the Four Brothers' HK33, it was labeled as a HK41 long before I started editing the page, I just took the screenshot. And also, thanks for the new images, I'm putting up the new M16A2 on pages right now.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 19:34, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

No problem, every image you upload is great. I also have a question, how do you get the pictures so perfect? Because your gun images are probably some of the best, if not the best gun images I ever seen on the internet. And yea, your new camera really does make a difference, the new versions of the images look great. Anyway, good job on your recent images, and can't wait to see your future M16s.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:33, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

I see, you put alot of effort into your images and that's exactly what makes them great. I agree that alot of gun sites have bad images, some gun books don't have the best pictures either. One problem with some sites is that they also don't use the best examples, like they'll have a picture of gun but it'll have a whole bunch of modifications on it when the unmodified one is what's really needed, and I agree which should replace as many as the old images as possible. And I think visitors do notice your images because if you look at your Remington 870 Riot Model's file page, it has almost 200 views anad it's only been there since Sunday. And good work on the new M4, if you noticed, Hieloco (the user who kept trying to replace your images with "Net" Images) uploaded a version of the ColtM4 file with similar attachments, but yours beats his by by a long shot. And also is that the same M4 you mentioned on MT2008's talk page that the actor dropped? Just wondering.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 21:40, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

==re:M16A2==

First of all, thanks so much for the new M16A2! The AR15 A2 picture was nice, too, but I just thought it'd be better to have the real deal, and it's nice that we have it now. AlienQueen's already been getting to work on replacing the old M16A2 with the new one, and I'll help out, too. The Luger is another image we needed - and the fact that it's from ''Hogan's Heroes'' is especially cool! As far as the HK91 goes, I didn't notice the shadow, but the new one is fine by me. There's only one that troubles - I think the newer Taurus 85 image is a bit fuzzier compared to the old one.

As far as future stuff goes, I have another recommendation. You know how we have an AR15 section under the M16 rifle page? I'd like to get some more un-modified, basic civvie AR15 variants on there, especially Colt Sporters, because I've seen them used in quite a few movies and TV shows that stand in for mil-spec M16s. We've already got an SP1 with an A2 hand guard that you took for the ''[[Heat]]'' page, but I think we should also have SP1s without the forward assist (both A1 and A2 forearms) and a carbine with a 16" barrel. What do you think? (Sadly, I have added more guns to your to-do list...inevitable.)

And yes, we definitely have some of the best gun pics on the 'Net thanks to you. I must admit I'm still smitten with the fact that Norinco Type 84 pics are basically non-existent in just about any gun image site around (even World Guns, which is usually pretty reliable)...except here. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:05, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Actually, one other thing occurred to me, something we need more than the Colt Sporter ARs...do you think you could get some pics of [[Thompson Submachine Gun]]s? All of our Tommy images are jacked from elsewhere on the Net. It's about time they were replaced. Of course, I know we've already given you a ridiculous number of requests, so I won't bug you too much. Thanks. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:41, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

==Sergio Leone Trilogy==
I finished the Leone Trilogy yesterday and I was wondering if you could I.D. the machine gun used in ''[[A Fistful of Dollars]]'', someone said it was a fake but wasn't very specific. I figured if it was some type of fake movie gun, you'd know best.

:Also, excellent Single Action Army picture, that's a beautiful gun. Care to tell me a little about the one you uploaded? Thanks. -GM

P.S. Check out [[Last Man Standing]], I just got that done.

Good job on the Luger P08, it looks great. I don't think the finishes are a big deal, to tell you the truth, I don't even notice it. And it's cool that it was used in Hogan's Heroes, because not only is it a special gun, but someone's destined to make a Hogan's Heroes page eventually, and it will be of a great use when someone does. Keep up the great work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 01:13, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

::Speaking of LMS, his two .45s uniquely have diamond grips and I was wondering if you could take a special picture of A1s with diamond grips. I made a rough draft picture of what I had in mind.
[[Image:CrossM1911A1s-w-diamondgrips-roughdraft.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Cross placed, fitted with diamond grips.]]
Let me know what you can do. -GM

==re: Taurus 85 & G3==

Haha...whoops, you're right. I keep forgetting, but...when you upload a new version of an existing image, IMFDB doesn't instantly replace it. Instead, the old image goes fuzzy for a period of time (which seems to vary from hours to days; no clue why) before the new image replaces it. I saw your Taurus Mod 85 pic when it was in this fuzzy "transitional" phase and the thought slipped my mind that this happens. The filter from my brain to my mouth (or rather, my keyboard) doesn't work sometimes, I guess.

As far as the G3 page goes, it is unfortunate. One thing I find annoying about Wikis is that there's apparently no way to confine an image to a particular section of a page when you use the "align" code, so when we follow page conventions and force an image to shift left, right, or center, it totally fucks up the formatting if the images are bigger than the text (which is going to be common for guns that don't have very many movie appearances listed). The only thing you can do is just add lots of space in between each section manually so that the images fit into the section.

But I do agree with you on one thing...why do we need a regular sporter SR9 with the thumbhole stock? Have you seen a movie with one? Do you or any of your fellow armorers have any in stock? Better yet, is there any movie or TV show that would NEED some heavily neutered civilian version of a G3? I kinda doubt it, so I would say it doesn't make sense to include the image. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 06:18, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

:Well, I ditched the other two SR9 pics. Til we get movies with them (and I know I haven't heard of any yet), no point in having them on there.

:Nice that you found those long-barreled AK folders. I'm pretty sure that Vollmer had at least one at sale (years ago, back when their sales site was still online), but they are quite rare in this country indeed. As far as the pics from World Guns go...it's a mix, just like here. Some of them are pics that the site's editors took themselves, others are jacked from other sites, and some are scanned from books or gun rags. I've usually just used them because (before us), they were one of the most comprehensive gun sites on the net. But I definitely think that because of you, IMFDB now has not only good movie gun images, but some of the best gun images, PERIOD.

:Good luck on your current projects, and don't let those idiot Obama-supporting actors fuck up any more of your guns. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:06, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

==The special page==

Remember how a while ago I asked you if I could try making a page that explained to new IMFDB users just how significant it was that we have a movie armorer who photographs his company's guns for us? Well, I finally got around to trying it out. Here it is:

[[MoviePropMaster2008: IMFDB's Own Armorer]]

The title is kinda cheesy, I admit, but it was the best I could think of. The other issue is that I'm not always sure my facts are straight, so if you want to correct anything, go right ahead. And I realize this might be kind of a lame idea - but I just feel it's important for everyone to understand how important your work is to this site. What do you think? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:32, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

:Oh, trust, I fully understand what you mean about wanting to remain anonymous. Even if you weren't a pro-RKBAer working in an industry that is hostile to gun ownership (and non-liberals in general), it would still be perfectly reasonable to want to remain anonymous. When you're a professional of any sort, working in any industry, you don't want to do post something on a web site under your own name that could get you in trouble. As far as the page goes, however, I don't think it should be too big a deal for your anonymity as long as you avoid giving us your name. It's mostly just a way for us to brag that we have someone who can provide us with such great pictures, and to make sure that our new users understand the significance of those pictures. :-) But if you really are uncomfortable with it, that's fine, too...I can ditch it. It took all of 15 minutes to make.

:BTW, I dunno if you're OK telling me this or not (if not I understand), but are you a member of the American Entertainment Armorers' Association? I remember Dan Shea announcing its creation on a forum I used to visit, a couple years ago now. I understand that it was created specifically to address the threat from Cali's gun laws upon your businesses? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:35, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

==More SAAs==
Your Colt Peacemakers are great, my western pages greatly need them. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Be sure to check out [[Hellboy II: The Golden Army]], I just finished it. -GM

==Image use on WIkipedia?==
Hi, I am an editor on the English Wikipedia. I came across this great site as it completes the media appearances lacking in our firearms pages. You've got some fantastic images of some obscure equipment in the idea configuration - that is, clear background and side profile shots. These would really help us illustrate some of our pages that are lacking in media content. Would you be kind enough to allow us to use these images on Wikipedia? We could upload them under an attribution license and provide a link to this Wiki in return. Kind regards, Koalorka from the WP:Firearms teams. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.219.131|99.232.219.131]] 12:09, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

:Any chance of obtaining a response? I can be reached at koalora at rogers.com. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.219.131|99.232.219.131]] 12:09, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

::If you are hesitant or have any further questions regarding licensing, feel free to ask. Wikipedia is by principle an entirely non-profit organization as you are probably aware and we could not compensate you financially for the images. I do recognize that there was some considerable effort involved in collecting some of these rare specimens (still salivating over the CETME Ameli) and then setting up a studio with professional lighting, hardware etc. What we can offer to do is attribute you properly and generate additional traffic and awareness for this site and any other organization you specify (even the armory/studio that owns the firearms). If you agreed to have your images uploaded to our server, every one of them would be licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 Unported license that requires the copyright holder to be properly credited every time the image is displayed, in either modified or unmodified form. The license does not impair or restrict your moral rights. Here is the [http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/ license description]. We can do a "test" image so to speak, upload an individual image to see if that satifies your expectations.

:In other words, don't make me beg.. :D At least the Ameli, pretty please.

:Regards.
:: To Koaloarka, I appreciate your kind words and gracious offer. As you can probably tell, I've been thinking about the offer. I'm obviously not jumping at the opportunity or else I would have communicated much earlier than now. I must assess what I've been trying to do for the last six months. Since I joined IMFDB I've been working extraordinarily hard to provide the site with exclusive gun images that are available nowhere else. Everyone here knows the hard work, time and $$ spent on trying to get the best quality images of the weapons available anywhere (on the net). And obviously I do it for the benefit of IMFDB. I'm torn by the upside of increased awareness to the site, but I am also not eagerly anticipating the inevitable diluting of the 'exclusivity' of IMFDB's images when they start showing up everywhere on the web.

:: Some background to my thinking - I would not have done the images for a simple firearms site. I probably would not have worked so hard for six months to get these types of images for a gun wiki. IMFDB's unique focus is that it mixes weapons and CINEMA, especially movie trivia and factoids which are not part of the 'regular gun owner's lexicon. '''That is the field I'm in''', and I welcomed the idea of a place where I can contribute my experience and information (mostly 'lost' on the 'regular firearms crowd'). Many of my images are hybrid guns (M16a2s with A1 features or vice versa), or some of custom guns made for the movies (Custom Type 84s or AMD-65s), or weird combinations of uppers and lowers (like the M16 variants, or the 2 toned handguns,etc). which are not factory standards nor are they historically accurate. I remember once, when a firearms historian and enthusiast looked at some of my handguns (SIG P226s and USPs) and was wondering what was wrong with my barrels. He didn't fathom nor appreciate the fact that these were REAL movie guns. He was just disdainful that they were 'ruined' because of the customization needed for blank firing in movies. Anyway, I was toying with the possibility of a limit release of images with a specific watermark or copyright. I was thinking of using similar but not identical images (but still identifying IMFDB.org as the source of the image) with a translucent copyright logo, but that would take some time. But I have not decided yet and I hope you understand my reluctance at this time. I've only been doing this for six months and I don't think I'm ready right now to 'give away' the work I've done when I'm not complete updating the gun images for IMFDB. Perhaps when I've stopped or retired from getting gun pics for IMFDB ....
::''Now there are some sites who already have MY permission to use some MY images, but each one of those entities provided weapons to be photographed, so they helped me personally with the photography itself. (some FFLs, a few collector friends, other armorers, etc.) So you might see a recognizable shot somewhere else, but they will be watermarked and copyrighted as license granted to that entity.

::Anyway I'm still thinking about it. Give me a little time. I am also conferring with other Administrators of IMFDB and I welcome their input. Ultimately, I will have to make some sort of decision (as the original photographer and copyright holder) as to where I wish to release the rights. Hope that helps.

::[[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 02:31, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

:::I agree with what you say about how many people in the gun-owning community aren't going to appreciate what these guns are if they see them on any random gun site. Like, who the hell is going to understand that in Hollywood, HK91s are converted to look like SR9s, or AR15 SP1 carbines converted to look like XM177s? However, one thing I think you should consider is that some of the guns you've photographed are hard to find pictures of, and your pictures represent not only good "movie gun" images, but good gun images, period. The Type 84 pics you've taken are a very good example, because like I said earlier, good pics of the Type 84 seem extraordinarily hard to come by. The new FG42 image is also one that I think can be considered particularly special.

:::I would say that at the very least, you should consider it on a case-by-case basis; whether the gun image you have stands as both an important gun image as well as an important "movie gun" image. But ultimately, these are your images, so the decision is yours. Take my opinion only for what it's worth. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:50, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

::::I was not asking for a blanket-release of your work into the public domain or any such thing, just a few individual photographs of authentic and obscure and unmodified firearms, i.e. the CETME Ameli, FG42. Cheers. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 18:11, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

:::::I KNEW that. But work on Wikipedia WILL be jacked and seen all over the web. And the more removed the image is from the original source (here) the harder it is to force people to remove pirated images on their own sites. I fully intend to slam pirates who steal my images (which is my right), but it's harder when they can say'' "Oh I got it from Wikipedia, who are you? What authority do YOU have to tell me not to use a stolen pic?"'' It might be helpful to make a list of what you are interested in. I am considering creating an alternate image of the same gun with watermarks and attributions for 3rd parties (though it's not something I was planning to do at this time). Let me know your list and we can discuss it. thanks [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 18:21, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

::::::The attribution license is for that purpose specifically, if you are not properly attributed when the image is displayed, that person has violated your rights to the image and is liable for prosecution under international or US copyright laws. Keep in mind that those willing to pirate your images will do so whether or not you agree with it, this will happen at a higher frequency once your sites gains in popularity; by letting Wikipedia use your images, your images will proliferate the net with the proper license, exposing your work and Imfdb.org to the mainstream. Right now, we can do just one image to determine if you'd be satisfied with the end result; how about the Ameli? The CETME Ameli page does not receive too many hits due to the scarcity of the gun. Kind regards. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 19:28, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

::Any progress here? You asked for a list, we would just like the AMELI at this time. Regards. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.219.131|99.232.219.131]] 17:21, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

==Smiths==

Thanks so much for the Smiths, but especially the Model 29! All the ones on the page before now were 629s, and I figured we needed an original blued M29. In fact, it seems almost like blasphemy that this is exactly what Dirty Harry used and we haven't had the right gun until tonight. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 06:04, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

:Oh, yeah, forgot about that other S&W 29, hehe. But still, an MPM2008 photo of a Smith is always preferable to some random image from Google. And to answer your question - yes, you should feel free to replace old pictures jacked from Google with yours. There's no reason why anyone should complain, because...

:*(A.) Your pictures are always vastly superior to the old ones
:*(B.) It takes no effort to copy an image off the web, whereas taking your own pics is a time-consuming process (especially the way you do it)
:*(C.) You're an administrator now, so you have the final word anyway.

:As far as the other Wiki guy's offer goes, I agree that you should only do it if you can mark the images as your own first, or if they give you proper credit (and link to this site, guaranteeing us more hits :). Come to think of it, it might not be a bad idea to do that with ALL of your gun images from now on, just to make sure that we mark them definitively as ours. But although I like being able to think of your gun images as exclusively IMFDB's, not so sure I like the idea of clamping down on other users. I mean, let's face it, we'd look like hypocrites because many of the images on IMFDB are still jacked from other sites (though this will change eventually, of course). World Guns would probably throw a fit if they saw this site. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:08, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

:Well, I suppose you're right...if World Guns did ask us to remove all of the images we've used without permission, I would immediately comply with their request. However, you gotta admit that it's still going to be kind of flattering if people decide that IMFDB is a great source of gun images (not just "movie gun" images) and want to use our pics.

:BTW, have you talked to any of the other armorers about IMFDB? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:04, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

==Predator==
I never knew they tend to used A1 muzzle breaks but it does make sense, A1 star flashes look cool (I'm still in awe over the shot when the muzzle flash is out 2ft in each direction)

I hope you don't mind that I edited your pictures together, I just used what I had. I'll just leave them on the page like that until you take some SP1 pics. Thanks. More to come on the Predator page. -GM

Same film different subject. Do you know who mounted the Shotgun under Billy's Rifle. It looks like a Ciener Ultimate only it uses a Mossberg 500 and it's several years before Jane's says such systems came out. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 08:31, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

==Hollow Point==
[[Image:Type84HybridRifle.jpg]]

Thanks for the Type 84S specific to the [[Hollow Point]] page. I really apprieciate it. Was the gun actually used in the movie or do you mean it is made to look the same? -GM

==The Mask==
I have it on my list, so I'll get it done eventually. -GM

Alienqueen11 here, sorry if I got in the way when you were uploading gun images when I was uploading those Resident Evil screenshots. --[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 00:38, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

==Thanks for the new guns==

I really like those new SIGs you uploaded (just ditched the old P220R image and replaced it with yours on all pages), as well as the Type 84 folder and the Madsen M50 (the movie ''[[City of God]]'' features those, so we gotta get that image on that page whenever someone screencaps it).

Also, can you by chance tell me what kind of shotgun this is (from my page for ''[[The Crow]]''):

[[Image:Vlcsnap-269025.png|thumb|none|500px|]]

Who makes that bullpup stock? I think it's a Muzzelite, but I dunno, and a Google search seems to turn up negative for info or images on this gun. I know I've seen it in at least a couple of action movies from the 1990s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:07, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

:Ah, OK, thanks for clarifying the type of gun used to kill Lee. I figured it was the 629 that killed him because I have heard from various articles that the gun was definitely a .44 Magnum, and the character of Funboy uses the 629 throughout the movie. Any idea why they switched to another gun for that one scene? Seems like it would have been identifiable as a continuity error had the scene been finished and Lee had not been killed.

:And don't worry; I do fully appreciate (have heard it many times) that the entire reason that the accident happened was because the production sent the armorer home in order to save money. And I have heard it was the fault of some clueless property assistant(s) who were responsible for the fuck-up that got Lee killed.

:Also, I appreciate the ID on Grange's shotgun. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:13, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

==Re:Dibbs==
I didn't think of it that way but I completely understand what you mean. I'll change the word. Dibbs is kind of declaring it is mine, simply saying that a movie is on my to-do list changes it sort of. The only movies I would really want to declare "dibbs" on are the ones I ordered on DVD, even when I own them on VHS already, just so I can screencap them. I'll remove my dibbs messages and just let people know I plan to do it, and if no one else plans to do it, I would like to. "Dibbs" was simply a poor choice of words. It's not like I'm locking the page from someone else to work on though. When Orca1 9904 asked to do [[Tears of the Sun]], I let him. (AQ11 even cut off the widescreen bars now). When you asked to do Rambo III, I let you. (P.S. Let me know if you need me to finish that.) I agree tho, it was a dumb idea.
P.S. I screencapped Iron Man, sorry. -GM

== One more request ==

Hey MPM2008, when I asked for the Beretta 92FS Inox, I happened to notice GM45 asked for a reversed Two Tone Beretta 92FS for use on the [[Sin City]]. If you happen to get ahold of them, I would like to know if you can combine them the factory style way as well and photograph it if you can, because a Beretta like that would be useful for pages such as [[Hostage (2005)]]. Here's a screenshot of the gun in the movie:

[[Image:HostageBerettatutone-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
[[Image:HostageBerettatutone-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

Thanks in advance.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 01:42, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

That's an awesome shot as always, aAnd you're right that has to be the best shot of the gun on the entire internet. I like it the way it is, and excellent work on your most recent images too, I really like the M16A4. Also, are you still considering the Wikipedia user's offer?--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 01:53, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

==AK-104==
It looks great. The magazine is no big deal. Even with that magazine, you still have the only well-taken AK-104 on the net. Don't worry about fixing it right away, it looks awesome even with the wrong mag. One thing though. You never know when one day a movie could have an AK-104 with a waffle mag so don't just cover over it if you take a new pic. You replaced the MAC-10 with the after market mag with the newer image, but you never know when one could be seen using one. Just a pointer. I'm almost done with [[Hot Fuzz]], then I'm gonna do [[Tropic Thunder]], [[Crank]], [[Shawshank Redemption]], and [[The Dirty Dozen]]. Should have them all done by the end of the month. (With deer season, my job to fix guns has been pulling me away. Plus, I hunt myself on occasion.) Keep up the good work. -GM

:If I use the word "sexy" to describe a gun picture, what does that say about me? LOL.

:I like it. And I agree with Alienqueen; I wouldn't worry too much about the mag. However, I must say that I'm a little more excited about some of the other pics you uploaded while I was at work today...thanks so much for re-doing that Type 56-1 picture for the ''[[Goldeneye]]'' page with the AK-74 muzzle break and plastic mag, and I also really appreciate you getting the Benelli M1 Super 90 (oddly enough, we don't have a page for that gun, for whatever reason). And the new XM177 pic is something we REALLY needed; time to ditch that old XM177 picture we've been using to represent "Colt Commandos" in movies (I think it's actually a Tokyo Marui airsoft replica, anyway).

:But...for now, I must do more GRE studying and personal statements for grad school apps. Sadly, I'm getting way too busy to make regular contributions these days, but real life keeps calling. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:44, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

:I wouldn't worry too much about the stock, because if you notice every image you upload always finds a use. There's no telling if a movie will come up with an AK 104 in the same configuration, plus if it's a movie gun, the movie it was used in will have to come up eventually. But if you want to upload a new one, that's entirely up to you.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:50, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

:So finishes can cause that much trouble when combining parts? Makes you wonder how they do it because I see soo many Berettas in wierd configurations in movies, I remember seeing a Beretta 92FS Inox with a black barrel in Kiss of The Dragon. And also, how rare is it to see a two tone Beretta 92FS? Because even if you search it on Google, there aren't many images of one.

And about the FG421, that is one wierd looking gun, is it German made? Because it resembles the MG42's from [[Saving Private Ryan]] a little bit, but I must say the grip dosen't look too comfortable with the way it's positioned. But another great image none the less.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 04:18, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

==FG-42==
Nice piece. It must be rare, I don't ever see them in my typical order books like Southern Ohio Guns or any other vintage firearms catalogs. Like AQ said, I think the grip is positioned ackwardly and seems uncomfortable. Like all the other cool German guns, I can't own it sadly. I don't see why they would make it a paratrooper gun, way too big. Nice pic. Glad you didn't ignore it in the back. -GM

==No Problem==
You're welcome. Despite not being such a great movie, it was quite interesting gun-wise :))

==Taps and Mr. & Mrs. Smith==
I don't own Tapps and have never seen it but I own the Extended Cut of Mr. & Mrs. Smith, which includes a scene with a Mini-gun and cool other things. It is on my list and once my to-do list pile is reduced, I'll get on it. Right now I'm working on Tropic Thunder and The Shawshank Redemption. -GM

==The FG42==

Damn, that thing is beautiful! Reminds me why one can never fail to give the Nazis points for ingenuity when it came to weapons. I seriously want one, along with a Sturmgewehr. Good news though! Have you heard about this? http://www.ssd-weapon.com/engl_web/produkte_en/fg42_en/fg42_en.htm Apparently, they've got civvie reproductions of these guns now! Dunno if/when they'll get imported/manufactured in the States. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:57, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

:Your choice, I guess. Are they being imported to the states yet, though? The site doesn't list a U.S. distributor, and I haven't seen any for sale yet. But yeah, it would be cool to have a picture of a nice new FG42, plus you can get the 2nd version which you told Alienqueen you didn't have.

:BTW, speaking of rare German weapons, do you have access to a Sturmgewehr (either -42 or -44)? There aren't too many movies with them that I'm aware of (besides ''[[Escape to Athena]]''), but they do appear in lots of WWII-themed games. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:51, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

==Remington 870==
Closest thing I can find is this bird gun in [[The Unit]].
[[Image:Unit-Mack'sshotty2.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

:I read your story on Brandon Lee, that's tragic. I sometimes make dummy bullets and I ''always'' fire the primers before I reload the bullet. Your supposed to use super glue to make sure the round stays in the brass. Then you go to a wire wheel and polish the brass and get rid of any super glue that seeped out. I wonder why they never made "dud" primers that could look live but not go "bang" when the hammer falls on them. I first made dummy rounds with 8mm rounds for my Kar98k, but I didn't super-glue them in, and eventually they all fell into the shells and got stuck. It sucked. I'm sick with something bad and Tropic Thunder is gonna have to wait because I feel like crap. Have a good day. -GM
==Re:Morita==
Thanks, I'm feeling a little better. I was filling out some of the fictional firearms pages and I figured of all of them, you'd like the Morita page since I remembered you said you owned one. I deleted my page because yours came out better than mine. You know more about the movie any way, I have yet to see it fully and last time I saw it was too long ago to remember. -GM
:Nice SMLE pic! And I forgot to mention, the Colt Navy is beautiful. -GM

==Bankok Dangerous==
You made the page look much better now. Your shots are ''far'' clearer than mine. Thanks. -GM

==Tropic Thunder==
A Sporter II pic would be much apprieciated. To test the whole blank safety distance, I tested various blank calibers to a piece of paper and found 10 yards to be the ''dead zone''. Since I'm trying to make a movie with a few friends of mine (maybe something to show a film school), I'm going to use some blanks and want to know my limits. Obviously, since I'm the only one with true experiance and weapons intelligence, I'll be handling the blanks, post-production edits on my computer will fill the rest. I'll try my best to make them look like they know what their doing with guns, but they are pretty dumb. If you have any movie making tips, please let me know.
:P.S. I plan to make it a DVD and might even screencap it as a section on my profile. -GM

==Re:590==
Go for it, fine by me. Your pics are always better than what we find on google. -GM

==The new Cobray M11 picture==

The new Cobray M11/9 picture looks really cool! Thanks so much for that! Also, do you think it's appropriate to classify the M11/9 under the MAC-10 page? I have been thinking about giving that guns its own page for a while now. What do you think? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 17:02, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

:First of all, I completely missed the MAC-11. I've just been getting busier and busier (currently at work - on a Saturday! - indexing prior art PDF files now), and you upload so many images that I've missed a few here and there. I did like the SG550, though, and the the AMD-65 pics were also something nice (it's cool that you found the same style BFA as the Israelis). But that Type 56 is just...ugh, who the hell treats a nice gun that way? (in Africa or Afghanistan, sure, but not here in the states!) It's odd because I had no clue that the Type 56 was imported to the U.S. back when Uncommon Valor was filmed (82-83). I remember hearing it wasn't until 1984 that they reached these shores.

:As far as the Cobray page goes, I know what you mean about the mistake, but then again, we have the [[Taurus PT92]] page separate from the Beretta 92 page even though the PT92 is commonly mistaken for the 92F. The best thing to do would put a note at the top of the page suggesting people look at the Cobray page just in case.

:Appreciate the effort on the Thompson pics...like I said, we REALLY need some good ones. I hate the fact that someone put an Auto-Ordnance semi-auto Thompson clone with a long barrel to represent an "M1921". Also, from now on, whenever you upload pictures, please do the same thing you did with the Cobray; just upload them as a new version over the old ones. The way, we don't have to go back and replace the old image with your new image on every single page that has the old one. And like I said before, nobody should mind if you get rid of the old images, because yours are always better and you're an admin anyway. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 21:55, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

::Yeah, it makes sense, what you're saying. Were the Type 56s from ''[[Deer Hunter]]'' also the same as the ones from ''[[Uncommon Valor]]''? I mean, let's face it...you don't see that many Chinese AKs (or AK-type firearms, period) in American movies before about the mid-80s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 22:26, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

==That Type 56==
Holy shit, who handled that gun to make it that FUBAR?! One of my main jobs in my dad's shop is to clean up guns, so I understand how horrible that is. Mail it to me, I'll clean it up. -GM

Woah, that thing looks like it's 70 years old with every thing it been through. What did they do to it? I'll give it credit for one thing, that's a very good example of how durable and rugged an AK type assault rifle can be, especially with that kind of treatment.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:25, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

==Couple of questions regarding Walther pistols==

1) Has the current-generation P99 been converted or modified into a movie blank-firing gun that you know of? I ask because I see on the back cover of one of Wesley Snipes' DTV movies that he's holding one that appears to be a new-model P99, but it also looks like they took an UMAREX airsoft model and painted the tip black. Insight?

2) Word on a couple of forums is that the Walther PPS makes an appearance in Quantum of Solace, wielded by Olga Kurylenko. If possible, could you confirm? --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 02:41, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

::I don't know, but I will keep it in mind when I ask around. MPM2008

==Request==

[[User:Revolver|Revolver]] here
Just curious, could you get a good picture of the M4s used by the Air force in Iron Man? The ones with the ISM-V Scopes?
Possibly other pictures from the movie? Like the G36Ks and G36Cs?
::I'll add it to the gigantic list of things to do. best regards. MPM2008

==.577 Rifle==
That would be awesome. Do you think you could one pic before he mounts a scope and one when he does? You'd have the best picture of such a rifle on the internet. [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]] 00:42, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

== Another Request ==

I was wondering, would it be possible for you to get your hands on a stainless steel [[Jericho 941]]? There's at least a couple pages here such as ''[[The Kill Point]]'' and ''[[Transporter 2]]'' that could benefit from it. I'm also still waiting for a 1st-gen [[Glock#Glock 19|Glock 19]] (or whichever version of the 19 it is that doesn't have rails on the frame). Thanks in advance. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 21:29, 25 November 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904
:I didn't know it was an order, rather than a request (re the Glock) and I don't have a 2nd gen of my own or I would have posted it already. I have to track down someone with one and take the time to do the photoshoot, a real hassle BTW. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 23:25, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

== About Png ==
Hi, for some strange reason VLC does not catches screenshots in jpg, only in png. In the future I will convert them in jpg before uploading. [[User:Fimvit|Fimvit]]

==Re: Goldeneye==

That's fine. In all honesty, it's a bad habit that I'm afraid I have, and I seem to be influencing other forum members to do it even though it does ruin the "encyclopedic" format of the pages, as you've said. I'll try to remember in the future; bad habits die hard for me. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:31, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

== Re: ==

I know, I had already changed the settings. Regardless, it takes the snapshots in png. Can't figure out why...
Kind regards [[User:Fimvit|Fimvit]]

==Crank==
Hahahahahahaha, Blu-ray. I can't afford half a Blu-ray player. I'm still using DVDs, I guess this one just looks a little better. I've noticed some people use png files now, but they take too long to load and if you click on the image, it's just as clear as a jpg, so that's what I use. Thanks. Sorry I'm taking so long with it, I keep getting sidetracked. Go check out AQ11's profile talk and see my list of movies in my pile. Ugh. It's gonna be a long month. -GM

==Thanks==

Thanks so much for the new images (i.e. the USAS-12), and thanks for getting the Benelli shotgun page in order. It really needed an overall badly, and it's crazy that we never even had an entry anywhere for the M1 series before now. Also, nice work on ''[[Ultraviolet]]''; I've had that DVD in my collection for a while, but, like a lot of movies, simply never got around to capping it. No matter; yours are better than mine would have been.

Hope you've had a great Thanksgiving! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:48, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

:Yeah, I agree, the Molotov cocktail doesn't need a page. This is the Internet Movie ''Firearms'' Database, not the Internet Movie ''Weapons'' Database. Also, dunno if you saw, but some anonymous user tried to delete your user page, and has thus been nuked. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 22:14, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

::Oh, yeah, almost forgot...I'm not really sure how to see page views besides going to "Special Pages" (under Toolbox on the left side) and there's a "Popular pages" section, but that's not quite what you need... -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:41, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

==Re: Molotovs==
I understand what you mean fully but many pages link to the Molotov page and it's one of those mistakes that kind of has to be there now. I'm making [[The Whole Nine Yards]] as we speak and that had a molotov. I don't think it is a weapon deserving a spot but too many pages already have it and it's just easier if it is there. [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]] 22:58, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

==Question about the SIGs from Double Team==

First of all, nice job so far on the ''[[Double Team]]'' page, even though it's not yet complete.

Anyway, I was looking at this picture:

[[Image:DoubleTeam-Gun-WallA.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

What type of laser controls are those on the grip of the SIGs? I ask because I've seen the same setup on a SIG P228 that Denzel Washington uses in the movie ''[[Virtuosity]]'', and I was wondering who makes it. Or was it something done just for both movies? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:07, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

==The Thompsons==

YES! They're awesome. Thanks so much...we ''really'' needed some good pics of Thompson SMGs. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:12, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

== Response (Sorry for being late) ==

Thanks for wishing me a Happy Thanksgiving, I hope you had a great one as well. As for improvised weapons, I agree with you, Propane tanks even though they were made to be bombs shouldn't be listed as weapons. But I agree the molotov should stay since it's already a page for it and it's on quite a few pages. Also good work on Starship Troopers, the page looks great, and the Thompson pictures are great as well. Keep up the good work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:05, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

==Thompson==
Sounds good to me, we need some Thompsons. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]] 21:22, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

:Please, in the future, never hesitate to replace the old pics with yours. Yours are always better, plus when you just upload over the old ones, we don't have to replace the gun pics on each movie/TV/video game page individually. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:49, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

== Good Job ==

Good job on replacing all the [[Thompson]]s, the new pictures look great. Also, are you still going to upload an M16A3? And also did some of the M16 type guns you uploaded come from Iraq? I mean like the M16A4, and the M4A1 with the scope and RIS Foregrip.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:02, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

==Taegukgi==
I can barely stand anime let alone flash animation shorts. I think it disrespects the hard work we do to screencap movies (and you great efforts to make sure we have images galore) and we have a page for some little short? I don't see why someone would watch it and wonder "Would someone like to know what guns are used in this?" Maybe if someone froze and capped the short it MIGHT be acceptable.

P.S I've been working on [[Wanted]] for 2 days, there are so many guns and continuity errors (guns switch to others in seconds), it is driving me crazy. While most I can figure out, some user input such as your own would be much apprieciated. I feel like I'm lying to the people who read my message at the top of the page that says "I'll have it done today" and can't because I busy. I hope they all understand. I'll make sure I give them the excellent page they've been waiting for (and get rid of the abismal bootleg images). - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

:I think at the very least, a re-direct is in order. The flash animation should be something like "Taegukgi (Flash Animation)". But personally, I'm really kinda skeptical of including stuff that's not professional media. Next thing we know, any kid who makes action movies with his friends and their airsoft guns is gonna try and make an IMFDB page. This is an even bigger problem with mods for first-person shooter games, because there are lots of user-made mods on the 'Net.

:That reminds me...when I get done with the GRE, I need to get the FAQ done that I've been meaning to do. Once I draft it, I would like all the Admins on here to take a look, and we should all agree on particular terms. In it, I will specify rules on stuff like including Flash Animation. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:19, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

::Agreed. I have already warned several users that I will not allow images from bootleg copies of movies not out on DVD to be posted on IMFDB, but I missed ''[[Tunnel Rats]]'' because I had no idea what it was or when it was coming out. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 21:25, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

::I also think Anime is ok because it is something licienced, and more official. It's like saying Anime is to films and TV shows is to Flash and Fan made shorts with their home cameras and posted on youtube. I mean, should we start looking up shorts that people film themselves and then upload on Youtube? I don't think so. It's annoying, kinda insulting and a waste of time at the same time to even think of it. I do some of the Anime because I believe how they draw the weapons make them worthy of mention and images worth showing to see how real they drew them. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

== Care to take a look at my RE:E movie page? ==

Since no one did this page since the DVD release, I decided to do so. I need some check ups cause I always have a hard time telling Taurus from Beretta. Also see if you can ID the Cobray M11 for me if it is one. The previous guy posted up and even I thought it was an MP7 until I looked closer. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

*''[[Resident Evil: Extinction]]''

== I can't be nice anymore ==

Someone has to draw the line. This guy Don whatever. He just posted a NEW flash animation on this site. What the hell? I've see the pics or trash that resembles pictures of guns and he thinks those are what they are? Is he high or some punk kid that thinks it's so cool that it deserves to be on this site. Sift Head and that other flash animation thing, Taegukgi. Those are pardon my language, pieces of shit that are NOT worthy of this place that some of us hold with respect. Yeah, they seem entertaining, but if we decide to let something this slide, then whose to stop from putting other flash animations that have "drawings" of guns on them because "Oh they have guns, so therefore they should be on this site". I want to remove it, but I like a majority vote instead of me acting pissed of. I'm asking everyone else their thoughts. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:05, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

== My airsoft ==

So what do you think of my airsoft? I know a lot of people have a bad idea about what airsoft is, so what do you think? I'm a guy who likes to show off sometimes, that's one reason why I ask since I've updated pictures on my page, but more to ask what others think, particularly people who are more into firearms. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:34, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

:Just the same, I know you can tell my ONE Glock is real over the others listed that aren't. I don't go to the range as often as I want. Bullets are expensive and so is renting time on the range closest to me. I only play with Airsoft because it's the only time where I get to shoot people and not feel the slightest remorse whatsoever. I'm killing them in a manner of speaking. I have ran into the types of guys that only knows Airsoft brand names. I on the other hand am really interested in the real life counter parts that inspires Airsoft, this is where I found out so much info on real guns...but I still have trouble telling Berettas from Taurus and between shotguns sometimes. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 10:23, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

== FN FAL ==

Could take a picture of an FN-FAL?[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 00:04, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

==Re:Predator==
Thanks, it wasn't on my list but I saw the page was incomplete so I made time for it. Sorry I edited your pictures, but it looks better than an empty spot for now.

Also, excellent job with the Uzi pic, it looks great. I too never liked that Uzi pic before. I just finished screencapping [[Unforgiven]] so be sure to check that out. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Winchester 1866 "Yellow Boy"==
Do you think you could check your armory for a [[Winchester 1866 "Yellow Boy"]] rifle? Also, a lot of the ones in films are used as Henry rifles by removing the forend, the advantage being the lack of a spring follower pinching the shooter's hand. So if you do find a Yellow Boy, could you remove the forend and snap a shot of that as well? Thanks. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== H&K USP and H&K MK 23 ==

Could you replace the pictures of the H&K USP .45 and the H&K MK23 with better images. Thanks.

==Type 84 Target/Match==

So you finally got to take pictures of them. Nice! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:19, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

And thanks for the new .308 Valmet. Those appear in lots of movies, so I can use it on my ''[[Hard Target]]'' and ''[[The Negotiator]]'' pages.

==The HK94/MP5 conversion==

Thank you so much for this! I wanted it as much as GM did. Where did you find it? And you've actually confirmed already that it's one of the ''[[Air Force One]]'' MP5s? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:38, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

:Nah, of course that doesn't ruin it. If it's a movie gun, and it's the same type of conversion seen in those action movies from the 1980s and 90s, it's fine by me. It's the same ''type'', and that's more than enough for us. As far as Jedi Mind Powers, yeah, I guess I got something like that. Actually, I've just been glued to Facebook extending Christmas wishes to people most of today, and I check IMFDB pretty regularly. Also was working on ''[[24: Redemption]]'' earlier today.

:As far as your watermarking idea goes, I encourage it. However, there may be some way to actually disable right clicking on just your images so people can't save them to their HDs and re-post them later. Or, there may be a way of embedding copyrights into them. Not sure. But we'll figure out something. Asking Bunni about this would be the way to go, I think.

:Hope you've had a great Christmas. Over here on the East Coast, I've only got 1 hr. left before it ends, but you're in Cali, so I guess you still get a few hours left to enjoy today. And thanks for all the wonderful Christmas presents you've given IMFDB (again, I appreciate the HK94, the M78, and the long-barreled Type 84s). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:08, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

:The HK94 is great, I felt really bad chopping your pictures. Now I can get rid of them. And I read about your water marking idea. You should put one of your own personal insignias and maybe an imfdb logo. I hope you had a happy holiday. I got lots of movies to screencap including [[The Great Escape]]. I'm going to buy Romeo + Juliet and a few other gun movies with the money I got as well. I'm stilling working on Starsky and Hutch right now though. Great work with Stripes btw, I loved that movie. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Terminator 2 page==
What do you think of the T2 page? Did I over do it on the "fun facts"? As far as the guns go, did I get my info right? Colt Commandos are kind of hard to ID for me. Hope you have a happy new year. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==re: the images==

First, thanks again for the new images. It's nice to have a USP45 (especially since ''[[Collateral]]'' is one of the more popular pages on here, and Tom Cruise used one in that movie). The FNC is another nice one to have. Did you ever find out if the ''[[Heat]]'' FNCs were chopped-down Sporters with auto sears and M16A1 flash hiders installed, as you suspected?

As far as copyrights go...yes, it was inevitable. I know people have been talking about IMFDB and its images on quite a few gun forums, but I had no clue anybody would have the audacity to take your images and claim them as their own! How has your electronic tagging worked? Any particular software you used? The last time you and I discussed watermarking, I did a quick search for software that might be used. I found this: http://www.filetransit.com/view.php?id=10611 . But if you have a better one, that works, too. I do think you should start getting the images tagged ASAP, because I don't think people should be stealing your stuff. I still do worry somewhat about the "hypocrite" accusations, though, but as long as you keep getting new images up, especially for well-known guns (like ARs, H&Ks, AKs, Glocks, 1911s, etc.), those cries will have little validity.

Anyway, sorry to add to your growing list, but I have another request. I recently did a major re-vamp on the [[Accuracy International Arctic Warfare series]] page, which used to be called just the "L96A1" page. All of the gun images I have on there now are jacked from Remtek's Accuracy International site, which I hated doing, but had no other choice. If you get a chance to photograph ''any'' of the AW rifles in your company's inventory, I'd be most grateful. I'm especially interested in the basic AW and the AWP (because my ''[[Jericho (TV series)|Jericho]]'' page has the latter), but anything else you have in stock would be great. Thanks so much for all your hard work. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:55, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

:The USP-45 looks great. As MT said, it will work well on the Collateral page (especially because I'm going to be adding shots to it later) and the FNC is excellent. Bravo. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::Check IMDB for gun-heavy movies (you won't find specific IMDB forum topics in a Google search). It's very common now to see somebody ask a question about a gun in a movie and some other forum user will point them to us. Last one I recall looking at was "Hitman" where somebody mentioned us. I have also seen people make topics about us on everywhere from the AR-15.com to the 1911 forum to the Firing Line.

::As far as reactions go, sorta mixed. Some people draw attention to our mistakes (and let's face it - we had a LOT, especially before you came in), others say we're neat. However, there don't seem to be a whole lot of folks so far who understand the fact that our images are exclusive to us - which is another reason why your watermarking is such a good idea. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 06:22, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

== Thanks ==

Hey MPM2008, I just wanted to say thanks for all your recent pictures, I really like the USP 45, and the Mossberg 590 Mariner. Thanks to you, Imfdb now has genuine pictues of all three calibers the USP is available in. Keep up the excellent work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 04:01, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

==Screencaps==
I was trying not to do too many shots in Commando since I didn't want to muck up your page but I didn't know your limit was 4. I add so many shots usually because they illustrate different users and different scenes. I don't try to spoil the story but I try to run a path with my images. I was trying to respect your format more than how many screencaps (you'll see I kept the calibers after each description like you do and kept the size image under 600px. I'll admit that LMS had too many shots but don't hold that on me every time I go a little over on my screencapping. Hope you had a happy new year. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Re:Finally Got It!==
The AKMS pistol looks great. Nice work. I just finished ''[[The Mist]]'' and ''[[X-Men Origins: Wolverine]]''. Now I'm gonna work on ''[[Van Helsing]]''. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== Re:Finally Got It! ==

That is one Sweet AK! Is that the actual gun used in the movie? Happy New Year By the way.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 07:01, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

== Re:Finally Got It! ==

It looks awesome! Where did you find? Is it one of Cinema Weaponry's guns, as I suspected? Also, that gun appeared again this past summer in ''[[Pineapple Express]]'', so I added it to that page. But nice job. And Happy New Year! Thanks for the wonderful gifts you have given us! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:33, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

==Rambo==
I noticed you are adding some new shots to Rambo. Do you think you could grab some shots of his knife and bow, since all the othe Rambo pages have them. If you can't, I'll do it eventually. If you can, note that he has two knives. His mini machete that Stallone actually made for the movie and the knife from Rambo II. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==The Auto 9==

You had access to the Auto 9? Wow, I had no idea they had any of them intact after all these years. Of course, ''[[Sin City]]'' features one, but theirs was actually a modified 92FS, not a 93R. How did you get your hands on this thing? Whatever...nice job, and thanks for the awesome pic. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:57, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

== RE: Finally Answering your questions ==

I understand now, thanks for the reply. So you can basically make it look like any kind of M16 if you have the right parts, anyway I can't wait to see your C7. Also, are you uploading more Mossbergs? Because if you want, I can edit the Mossberg 500 with the Heatshield out of the Comparision picture and upload it if want me to:

[[Image:MossbergComparisonMain.jpg‎|thumb|none|600px|]]

But if you prefer to upload your own image, it's okay.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:07, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

About the Mossbergs, So you do want me to edit it out? Anyway, A simple Mossberg 500 with a High Capacity magazine tube to replace this image would be nice:

[[Image:50577.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Mossberg 500 - 12 gauge]]

Also, if you can get an image of a Mossberg 500 with a pistol grip like the one in [[Training Day]] it would be apprecited. Thanks.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:37, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

== Mossberg 500 ==

Hey MPM2008, I cropped and edited the comparison image, and uploaded the Mossberg 500 with the heatshield as a seperate image. I just want to want to know if it's okay before I add it to the page. I wrote that it belongs to you in the image description. What do you think?

[[Image:Mossberg500withHeatShield.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

Thanks, I tried to make it looked as much like one of yours as possible. I'll put on the page now. Feel free to edit or overwrite it whenever you like.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:30, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

==The PT92C==

Thanks for this! I just put it on the ''[[Hard Boiled]]'' page. I'm guessing it might even be the same one seen in ''[[Gates of Hell (1995)|Gates of Hell]]''. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:11, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

==Re: 24 Redemption==

Yep, I understand. I was just giving a reason to everyone why I was. I realize you wouldn't make that mistake. I think the page used to have the USPc simply because it appears on the DVD cover, before I screencapped it and generally gave it a huge overhaul. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:53, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

==Thanks for the new FALs!==

They look great! We can always use more. Only question is...do you by chance have a picture of a 50.61 like the gun from ''Heat''? (or rather, something that looks like one)

The new Mossberg Bullpup also looks good. While I liked the one with the extended magazine tube, I like this new one better, simply because the standard models without the extended tube seem to be the ones which appear in movies most often. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 22:52, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

:Excellent, that 50.61 is perfect. Thanks again! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:24, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

==Trapdoor Springfield==
Thanks for uploading pics of the Trapdoor Springfield rifles, they complete a few of my pages better. I added your pictures to those pages as well.

I've been working on ''[[The Dirty Dozen]]'', have you seen it? I have the guns down but I've only seen the movie twice and don't know all 12 guy's names. If you have, can you help me out with that? - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== RE: Above ==
I am sorry in advance for the language I am about to use but this douche Gunmaster45 completely erased the "Dirty Dozen" page I had ALREADY created. Not a single piece of the page I had created still exists. Admin or not where does this asshole get off destroying a page I worked on???

==Help with ''Transformers'' 1911 pistol ID?==

Hey, I was wondering if you could take a look at the M1911 being used by Captain William Lennox ([[Josh Duhamel]]) in my screenshots of ''[[Transformers]]'' and see if you could ID it? It appears to be a mostly standard M1911 pistol but has a Kimber-style hammer and slight beavertail to the grip safety. Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 08:00, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

: Just took another look at the M1911 page and it almost looks like the [[M1911 pistol series#Colt XSE|Colt XSE]], only the weapon in the film lacked the second set of cocking serrations at the front of the slide. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 05:59, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

==Re:KIN93==

Not really. He has been warned before this, so being a bit frustrated is understandable. And yes, I agree that being released in theaters does not justify using bootlegs, and will certainly still be noticed by any studio police on the prowl. After all, if a movie hasn't been released on DVD yet, there's no way to get screenshots other than bootlegging. And that's why it's unacceptable. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:45, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

== About the images on the Predator 2 page ==

Could i replace them?[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:28, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

==Screencaps==
I've been trying to cut back on the amount but I have my specific way I make my pages. I don't just tell what guns are used. I tell you what guns are used, who uses them, goofs, and fun facts. It makes the page a little larger but I like to think of it as being thorough, more like an article then just a "page". Since we have pages for actors, guns, and films/TV, it is good to show you the info. Sometimes I just can't pass up good shots. If you notice on my Last Man Standing page, the shot is either good, or is telling information. I understand that some of my pages are cluttered, but I've been doing my best to keep them organized. My limit now is usually ten or less images, but I sometimes have to makd exceptions. You are free to remove screencaps I add if you find them to be to many on one of ''your'' pages. You are free to do whatever you want to your own pages, if I add something you find it not needed, you have the right to remove it. I took some of the Mini 14 shots off your ''[[Commando]]'' page for that reason. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
:I was looking at the [[Rambo (2008)]] page and saw some of the changes you made. As always, I was a little sad to see those images you removed go but it is your page and your right. While I understand the removal of the shot of the soldier sent airborne by the .50 caliber (I just thought it was worth noting how dumb "movie logic" can get, but it doesn't have a gun in it, so it is not needed), but why did you remove the shot of Diaz with his FN FAL Carbine? I thought it was a pretty clear shot.

I just added some shots to [[Flashpoint]] and soon I'm going to do [[Get Smart]] and a revamp on the Matrix series (the three films and that awful Animatrix) since I bought the four pack DVD - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== Thanks! ==

Thanks for your comments about my pictures from [[The Sting]]; it's always been one of my favorite movies (despite its use of suppressed revolvers!) Feel free to make the screencaps any size you feel appropriate, I appreciate your comments and interest! - [[User:Speakeasy804|Speakeasy804]]

== A little help ==

I just started my [[Police Story 3: Supercop]] page, but I need some help IDing some of the guns. Can you give me a hand? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:36, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

== Question About Bond Actor Category ==

I was wondering, in the "James Bond Actor" category page, should we limit it to actors who've played James Bond himself, or should we allow 'supporting' actors such as Bond girls (ie, [[Halle Berry]] & [[Honor Blackman]]) and villians (such as [[Robert Carlyle]] & [[Gert Fröbe]])? I'm proposing this to several admins and would like to get some feedback on this before making a decision. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 22:09, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

== Screencap limit? ==

Hey, I was just looking at some of my own pages and seeing that I tend to really really overdo it with screencaps (which makes some pages take way too long to load). I was just wondering if you know what a good suggested amount might be for the same gun? Thanks - [[User:Speakeasy804|Speakeasy804]]
:That sounds like a very good amount for each. I'll try and go through some of my pages (especially ''[[Dillinger (1973)]]'' and ''[[Bonnie and Clyde]]'') and reduce some of the redundancy. I'll keep it in mind from now on. Thanks for getting back to me so soon! - [[User:Speakeasy804|Speakeasy804]]

==Hi!==

Sorry I haven't been on IMFDB in a few days. To answer your question: It's not so much that life is kicking me in the ass, it's mostly that I'm in Washington, DC right now without my laptop. Even though I didn't vote for Obama, I came here for his inauguration, mostly because my Mom is a big fan, and because my boss got us the tickets, and well...you know, I do try to do nice things for Mom, even if I don't like the guy she helped elect President. Plus, I got several days off from work, which is always nice.

I should be back tomorrow, and I'll catch up on everything I've missed for the past few days. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:16, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

==Request==

I really like how you edit those jacked pics and make them look so much better. So, I figured I'd ask...if you get time, do you want to edit this pic of a Gen 1 Glock 19 that we've been using on several pages?

[[Image:Wviewpoint 0430.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 19 9mm]]

If you get around to it, cool, but I realize it might be a while. It could use some removal of white space and shadows, and any other touch-ups you can do. Thanks! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:58, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

:Ah, alright, well, that's fine then. Just figured I'd ask because I thought I remembered you telling Orca that you didn't have a Gen 1 Glock 19 in stock at the time, and I wasn't sure if that had changed recently. And yes, DC was a whole lotta fun...until I had to go to the party where all the people from my firm were celebrating the inauguration. Try being the only Libertarian in a room full of mindless liberal douchebags and it's quite awkward. I loved how they were all clapping and cheering even when Obama was saying things that weren't really all that profound or moving. I don't think it matters how good or bad Obama turns out to be as President...this Stalin-esque cult of personality around the man is something I will never get used to. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:21, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

::It looks WAY better. Only thing is, next time, please just upload a new version over the old one. Thanks for doing this. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:55, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

::By the way, is there really a difference between the T3 AKMS pistol and the ones from Rambo and Pineapple Express? I keep comparing photos and I still can't see the difference in barrel length. The only thing I see is that the Rambo one may or may not have a smooth receiver cover (like the standard Type 56) instead of the AKM-style ribbed. And the True Lies gun is a different one entirely. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 21:03, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

==Rambo (2008==

Just to give you a heads up I changed the info on Rambo M2 Brownings. I talked to Kevin @ ISS about them and he told me they were M2. He was with the show in Thailand working on the 50's. As for the designation AN/M2 was used by the military to discribe the Browning Aircraft gun both 50cal and 30cal unitl 1944 it was changed in September 44 to M2 Aircraft. Thanks. - [[User:Phoenixent|Phoenixent]]

== Thanks ==

Thanks for the new 870, It looks amazing. Even the color of the stock and pump match the gun in the movie, excellent work. So are you working on the ghost ring version right now or still looking for the accessories? Either way, I'm sure it'll be worth the wait. Thanks again, and keep up the great work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:10, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

==M1-C Garand==
Beautiful M1-C, thanks for uploading it. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Browning M2==
That is definately useable! It's great! I was going to ask that you replace the M2 pic but figured you had enough to do already. You might want to take a picture of it on a pintle mount though because that is the most commonly seen .50 in films. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

:I like your picture! If you can do the pintle mount, great, but right now, I'm just happy we have a picture of an M2 at all that we can call our own. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 20:11, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

== Browning M2 ==

Thanks for the M1 Garand info, that picture helped me alot, I now understand how the scope and gun work. As for the M2, That is definitely a usable picture, it's excellent! .50 cals are huge, and I would say that type of format is perfect for them. If you want my photo wishlist again, it is these besides the ghost ring 870:

Beretta 92FS Inox

Two Tone Beretta 92FS (If you're able to combine the parts)

Heckler & Koch Mark 23 ("SOCOM")

And if it's possible, can you obtain a U.S Military issue Beretta M9, I know it's very much the same as a Beretta 92FS, but I heard there were some slight differences, and it would go great with the M9A1 you uploaded before. But if you can't get ahold of it, it's okay. The 870 and the Beretta 92FS Inox are the main things I want. Thanks.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 19:36, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Nevermind the M9 actually, MT2008 is right. We don't need it.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:14, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

==Re: Help on Alex Reid==

Looks like my Jedi Mind Powers are at work again. Creepy, eh?

Alex Reid uses several types of weapons in ''[[Ultimate Force]]''. She uses a SIG-Sauer P226 in at least a couple of episodes. In the episode where the SAS goes against the IRA, she uses an MP5KA1 to shoot at the terrorists during the ambush, and later briefly has a Glock 17 (the same one you see being pointed at her) before the bad guy takes it away. In the season 1 finale, she is given a PPK, but never gets to fire it herself. In another episode where the SAS goes after a Christian cult, she has an MP5SD3. In the season 2 finale where Red Troop goes to South Ossetia, she uses an FN Minimi. Here are some pics from the ''[[Ultimate Force]]'' page:

[[Image:Vlcsnap-77839.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Caroline Walsh ([[Alex Reid]]) unloads a SIG P226 at French special forces in Episode 2.1, "Communication".]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-136363.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Captain Caroline Walsh ([[Alex Reid]]) firing an FN Minimi in Episode 2.6, "Dead Is Forever".]]

Only problem is, these don't really show her face that clearly, so you can't tell who she is. I'll see about getting others... -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 20:23, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

I think I got one. Give me a sec to cap it. Season 1, and the episode was "Just a Target" [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:34, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Also, just remembering, in season 1, forgot which episode, she is seen with a full length double barrel shotgun, but never fires it. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:34, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Here's the pic of her with her SIG

[[Image:UFCWalsh.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

== Wikipedia pirate? ==

Hi, I requested several images from you a while back, but there appears to be an editor on Wikipedia going by the name Josh Woolstenhulme who appears to be uploading some of your gun photos and claiming to be the author. Here are his uploads: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Josh_Woolstenhulme

If this isn't you, just a heads up.

[[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 21:31, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

::Thanks. He IS stealing images. A quick pass and I noticed these.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/51/Simonov-Russian-SKS45.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/10/M1_Garand.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/74/M1903Mark1.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/71/AKMRifle.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/27/SMLE.jpg

so how do I complain and get these down?

:I'm not a Wikipedia member at present (I usually post anonymously), but it seems this user is already setting himself up to get your images removed. Note on the AKM image, it now says this:

:''This image or media does not have information on its copyright status. Unless the copyright status is provided, the image will be deleted after Friday, 6 February 2009. Please remove this template if a copyright license tag has been added.''

:But you should keep working with Koalorka to make sure your stuff isn't being taken, because I'm afraid I dunno what to do besides leave requests on a moderator's talk page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:45, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

::Yes, that was me that put up the warning tags. All violating images have now been removed and the pirate warned. Thanks again for the Ameli, you can find the article [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CETME_Ameli here]. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 16:46, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

==My requests==
I don't have much but here's a few I thought of:

* [[MG42]]

* [[MG34]]

* [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] with/without 33 round mag

* I mentioned before how I'd really like a [[Winchester 1866 "Yellow Boy"|Winchester 1866]] with the forearm and without it fro when they mimick Henry rifles in movies.

* Any western guns are great, I'm one of the few who can apprieciate them (since about 90% of the western pages are mine)

* We still need a [[Mossberg 500]] with wood furniture for pages like ''[[Heat]]''

* Some more [[Desert Eagle]]s. The images are all .50AEs, we need some .44s and .357 DEs. We also need a black model.

* [[RPG-7]] (still using that ugly picture taken off google)

* [[M60]] series machine guns

That's all I got for now. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::Was the extra holding that M60 an extra or someone well known? By the way, I could never do your job. The idea of so many idiots handling and breaking my guns would drive me to insanity. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== Good Luck ==

I would like to wish you good luck on your most recent business trip, and I hope you have a good time or try to, and thanks for notifying us about it. Also, sorry to put more requests on your list, but can you look around for these as well?:

* Browning Automatic Rifle or B.A.R

* Mossberg 500 with High Capacity Magazine tube

* Mossberg 590 with Ghost ring sights (I think this is what the Remington 870 on the [[Hostage]] page really is, and I seen them in movies such as The Last Castle)

* M1 and M1A1 Thompson

Thanks, and I wish you the best of luck on your trip.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:20, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

:Have fun! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:53, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

==Revolvers==
I have a question. I know auto pistols need to be milled and threaded to fire blanks but do revolvers need to be modified to fire reliably? I once had some acorn crimped .45 LC blanks which I put through a SAA. The primers backed out from a lack of recoil and the gun locked up. I tried putting it though a Colt M1917 and it hardly fired unless I angled it right. I've seen in movies how some of the firing pins are removed from the hammers (like the S&W 36 from ''[[Running Scared]]''). If they do need to be modified, could you tell me how exactly? Thanks.

P.S. If we have any more things to add to your list, can we just add them directly or should w ask you first in discussion? - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
::I also forgot to ask, what movie was the M60 used on? - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Push==
Have you seen the trailers for the new movie ''[[Push]]'' coming out soon? I'd screencap the hi-def trailer but my computer is too slow to do it right. If you're free, could you give it a look? I'd rather you made a page with HD trailer shots than some anonymous user making an empty page. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==RE: Got a gift for you! ;) More coming==
You are awesome! These guns are great! I'll be sure to add them to the page. I'm going to have to go back and snap a shot of Ace with an SAA (they didn't show him too clear but I think I can find one). I can't wait to see what else is coming. Thanks! - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
:I'm glad to see you've gotten more famous guns, they look great. It's quite impressive how many guns you're uploading that are well known as used guns by the actors. Did you meet with some important people lately? Keep up the good work, the pics look great. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::All I can say is...Oh, my, God. You have outdone yourself this time. This is one of the best updates you've given us yet. I don't even know how to begin thanking you. I can't even express how giddy with excitement I am that we have these pictures. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:37, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

:::Yep, I saw those too! Really awesome. More than awesome, actually. And the new Desert Eagles and the Mark 23 are also VERY highly appreciated, too. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Desert Eagle==
The Desert Eagles are great! We really needed a black model and you gave us all three! Thanks much. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==H&K Mk 23 SOCOM==
Outstanding work with the SOCOM pistols! How did you come across a REAL knight's arament suppressor? You've really outdone yourself this time! Keep up the good work. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Photos==
Nice photos you got the other day from our friend. I did not mean to rub you the wrong way last week. We could work better together and put this behind us. - [[User:Phoenixent|Phoenixent]]

== Babylon .A.D/ SPAS 15 ==

I don't think the gun under the M4 is a SPAS 15. The gun pictured has a full lengh forend and the reciver doesn't match. I have seached every where and can't figure out what the gun pictured is. But thanks for help. Gunner313

User talk:MoviePropMaster2008 (Archive)

2009-02-04T08:56:08Z

Gunner313: /* Babylon .A.D/ SPAS 15 */ new section

Most of my uploaded firearms pics were photographed by me and thus offered for use by IMFDB with my permission.

BTW: Please IDENTIFY yourself when you leave a message. I shouldn't have to sleuth your identity through the Wiki/History page to figure out who asked what. ;) Thanks.

==US Navy Mark 12 MOD X Special Purpose Rifle==
Hi I was referred by MT2008 that you may have access to a MK 12 SPR or a similar weapon. If you have access to an image to add to the Mk 12 SPR section of the M16 page that would be appreciated. The current image has a watermark and is a graphic from somewhere and probably copyrighted so It would be cool if that image could be replaced. thanks, -[[User:AdAstra2009]]

Well thanks for looking into it, I appreciate it -[[User:AdAstra2009]]

==YES!==

Thank you SO much! Those look great, and actually, they look very close to the ones that have appeared in quite a few movies. We can start replacing the two-tone SIG pics that we have on our other pages with these immediately! Again, I ''greatly'' appreciate you doing this for me. How will I ever repay you?

Out of curiosity, since you told me that they usually don't fit, how did you make them work together? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re: MP5A5==

Huh, that's interesting. I always figured Stembridge would have mostly -90 series guns that looked just like those "MP5s" that appear in so many productions they've rented to. Any idea why those HK94s were never converted further to make them look like more realistic MP5s? As my ''[[Air Force One]]'' page shows, Stembridge basically left those guns as-is well into the 1990s.

Thanks for the MP5A5 picture...I was actually close to replacing it myself (albeit with something from a Google image search). And yes, I'm sure more people than me appreciate them! At least, I hope so. You're pretty much the most important person we've got when it comes to gun images. I mean, how many sites out there get to have pictures of the same prop weapons used in many films?

==Thanks for the new pictures==

You've uploaded a lot of good pictures recently...I especially like the S&W 4506 and the SIG P220 Sport (is that the one from Cinema Weaponry that's appeared in several movies?) I thought of taking a picture of my own personal 4506 for a while, but gave up because I knew I couldn't take one as good as what you could do. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==One other thing...==

I know I keep asking for stuff from you lately, but this time it's talk only.

I just finished working on the ''[[Air Force One]]'' page for this site. That movie features some type of short-barreled AK which looks just like the one from ''[[True Lies]]''. Here's a picture:

[[Image:AFO-shortyAK-2.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

The next time you talk to Harry Lu, would you mind asking him what these guns are and who owns them (Stembridge?) Thanks! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:==

The new pictures are really cool, as usual. I especially love the M16A1 with A2 handguards picture, because there are a lot of Hollywood movies featuring guns with that config, and it's great that we now have a picture to prove to our visitors how you sneaky armorers have deceived so many of us common folk action movie fans with those fake M16A2s! Haha, just kidding. Anyway, how did you get your hands on a Diemaco? Remember Al Vrkljan, the Canadian armorer who helped me out on ''[[The Incredible Hulk (2008)]]''? He told me that Diemaco/Colt Canada wouldn't sell any of their guns to his company or any civilian companies, so where did it come from?

Also, you brought up an interesting point on the ''[[American Gun (2006)]]'' page...as an armorer who works in the film industry, how do you feel about the anti-gun attitudes that seem so prevalent in Hollywood? Does it ever frustrate you and make you not want to rent your guns out to people who are so overtly anti-RKBA? I've always wondered how armorers feel about the people they work with.

Appreciate the effort on the Type 84 and two-tone P226 pics. Whenever you get a chance!

==What do you think...==

...of the article on the [[Colt Flare Launcher]]? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

:Trust me, I'm not offended. I respect and share your commitment to ensuring accuracy on this site, especially since you're obviously far more qualified to talk about guns in film (and guns in general) than I will ever be. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== Oh, yes, and one other request...==

I have another request, this one a bit more unusual. I recently did a page for ''[[2 Fast 2 Furious]]'', which features a two-tone SIG P226 of West German manufacture that has a stainless frame and a regular black slide and barrel. It looks like the armorer just combined two existing guns to make it (since the two-tone P226s usually have black frame and stainless slide), and I'd love to have a picture of something identical for my page. So if you ever get out those two P226s that you photographed for IMFDB back in June, do you mind combining this:

[[Image:SigP226.jpg|thumb|none|250px|]]

..and this...

[[Image:SigP226Nickel.jpg|thumb|none|250px|]]

...to make this?

[[Image:2F2F-P226-10.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:2F2F-P226-13.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

...and then taking a picture of it for me? Also, if you put the slide and barrel from the stainless P226 on the frame of the black P226, you'd have a gun identical to the one from ''[[Face/Off]]'' which we could use for that page.

:Now THAT is news to me. I'm really surprised...finishes really make the fit of the parts THAT difficult? Wow. I don't think the gun above is a factory job because the two-tone P226s that SIG has sold are always black frame and stainless slide, not the other way around. Do you by chance know who supplied the weapons for ''[[2 Fast 2 Furious]]''?

:Thanks for the info, as always.

==Re: Back for a bit==

I do think you're right and that there are some SKS rifles in ''[[Platoon]]'' (which may or may not be Chinese Type 56 copies, for all I know). I own that movie on DVD, so as soon as I get back to my place, I'm gonna have to pop it in my laptop and watch again to be sure. Also, thanks for backing me up on the CAR-15 variants in the film - I was pretty sure they were 653s, and I know that particular model was exported in large numbers to U.S. allies during the 1970s (if you ever check out any Arab-Israeli war photos from the news, even today, you'll see many IDF personnel using them).

I was also suspicious of the "MAC-9" page, because I have never heard of that variant. On the other hand, I had no idea that the 9mm variant of the MAC-10 was called the "MAC-10/9"; I've usually just heard it referred to as a MAC-10. I figure "MAC-9" was just somebody butchering the spelling of "M11/9", which has appeared in lots of movies (I made the entry for that gun under the MAC-10 page myself, though someone else put down - inaccurately - that it was used in ''[[Blue Streak]]'').

Sorry to hear Josh Brolin broke a gun...indeed, how DO you bend a trigger guard? Then again, he's had some issues with the law lately, so maybe it's not too surprising. What film is he working on that required him to carry a Police Chief Special, anyway? Some period piece, I take it? I don't know how frustrating it is to be an armorer, but I can imagine...I mean, if you've rented out dozens of guns to one production, doesn't that make you lose your nerve to think how much those guns must be getting tossed around, even with armorers on-set to supervise their use? Also, remember when you sent me that picture of guns to ID from your vault? How many did I get right?

That's cool if you can get a picture of a Chinese Tokarev. Later. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Tokarev==

MP2008,

Nice to see you're back on the site! Hope you've seen some of GunMaster45's recent work (especially on ''[[Heartbreak Ridge]]'' and ''[[Platoon]]''.

Anyway, I'm curious...do you by chance have a Chinese Type 54 copy of a Tokarev in your company's inventory? I ask only because I've seen those in quite a few movies, and I figure we should have a picture of one for this site. Also, I thought that only Chinese Tokarevs have the frame-mounted safety? I have little experience with them, but I thought I remembered reading that...please educate me if I'm wrong!

==Re: A pic and an update==

Good lord, is that what Heaven on Earth looks like? I can see (from left to right), an AR with a triangular forearm (M16A1 or AR15 SP1, I can't tell, but the selector appears to be on semi!), an FN MAG, an MP5A2 with slim forearm, a shorty AR with a 10" barrel, an AKM variant, an FN Minimi, a G36E, two AR carbines with what appear to be 14.5"+ barrels, what I believe to be an MG3 and an MG42, and then a PK or PKM. Behind the MG3, I see the barrel shroud of what might be an M1919, but I can't tell for sure. All I know is that I seriously hope my own safe looks like that...some day (as it stands, my GSA-imported Chinese AK is the only "evil"-looking gun I own).

As far as changing the pages...totally fine. I never intended to leave our conversations on there permanently...only long enough to make sure that the guns were properly identified. Of course, I'm quickly learning that you're usually right!

Sorry you've got so many guns to clean...I've heard stories about the way that blanks wear guns in comparison to live rounds, so I know how busy you must be! As far as replacement parts go, please replace that slim forearm on the MP5 (which I see has a tag). I've always found those slim forearms on ANY H&K long gun to be annoying because I can't get a comfortable grip on them; they're just way too narrow (and this is coming from a guy with pretty small hands!) I imagine anyone who has to fire hundreds of rounds out of that gun (until the director gets a satisfying take of an action scene) would also start to hate it.

Haha...thanks for the vault picture. Talk to you later. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Long-barreled AK under-folder==

Here is the gun from ''[[The X-Files]]'' I mentioned to you. Found these on a fan site for the show. They're not great quality, but you can see it pretty well:

[[Image:X-files-Type84-4.jpg|thumb|800px|none|]]
[[Image:X-files-Type84-3.jpg|thumb|800px|none|]]
[[Image:X-files-Type84-2.jpg|thumb|800px|none|]]
[[Image:X-files-Type84.jpg|thumb|800px|none|(This one is from a different episode)]]

It's clearly an under-folder, it has a long barrel, but it also has what appears to be a .223 mag. And it seems to have a hooded front sight in the first pic. Any idea what this might be? It's appeared in several episodes of the show from a couple of seasons, and I always thought it was a Type 84 under-folder fitted with the barrel from an RPK clone. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

::Mike Sudrow is listed on IMDB as having worked on a few episodes of ''[[The X-Files]]''. Since the show lasted so long (nine years), I imagine they probably had many, many different armorers depending on the season/filming location.

::As far as Canadian armorers go, Al Vrkljan of Movie Armaments Group was on here a couple months ago. He corrected me on the ''[[The Incredible Hulk (2008)|Incredible Hulk]]'' page by telling me that, interestingly enough, Diemaco/Colt Canada won't sell its weapons to film armorers in Canada! He also told me more about those mystery grenade launchers we were discussing earlier, plus he updated the page with more guns that I had missed. I really hope he comes back; he said he might be able to get some pictures of the launchers for us.

::No worries on the ''[[Heat]]'' stuff, although I think you actually mean Gunmaster45, not me. As far as buying handguns go, I have yet to even try it in my home state (NC) because I live in Orange County and you have to get three "references" (people who are county residents) to apply for a purchase permit at the sheriff's dept. Sadly, Chapel Hill is full of overly-liberal people whom I wouldn't be comfortable asking to sign my permit application, so I've never bought a pistol here even though I'm of age - I've just inherited pistols from my grandfather. Ah, well, maybe if I wind up re-locating to Texas for this new job, I can finally buy that SIG P226 I've always wanted... -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:Re:Sahara==

Thanks for going so far out of your way to get the photo of the Type 84 with the AKM-style sight...I realize it must have been a hassle! However, I wasn't saying they put an AKM sight on a Type 84; I simply thought the front sight itself indicated the gun was a Type 84 because my eyes suck and it looked hooded to me from that perspective.

As far as the source goes, I believe Crowntower Limited supplied the weapons that were used in ''[[Sahara]]''. I say that based on a couple of deductions: Sascha Robey was one of the armorers who worked on ''[[Casino Royale]]'' as well as ''[[Sahara]]'', Crowntower is listed in the credits of ''[[Casino Royale]]'' (but not ''[[Sahara]]'') as the weapons supplier, and finally, if you look at our ''[[Casino Royale]]'' page, the AKs in that film top look identical to the one in ''[[Sahara]]'' that we were talking about. Perhaps this Sascha Robey rented the same guns for two films.

==Re:Sahara==

A lot of what you've said makes sense...BUT, there's still something bugging me about the third screenshot. Either my eyes really suck, or that is still a Norinco-style sight in that shot. HOWEVER, the first screenshot does, admittedly, show what appears to be a standard AKM-style front sight. Compare:

[[Image:ComparisonSaharaAK.JPG|thumb|800px|none|]]

I'm also confused because I have seen Type 84s fitted with mags that LOOK like the Romak mags, even if they aren't, like the one in the picture I posted. Anyway, is it possible that they used two different weapons for this "hero" gun use, and one was a Romak (or whatever) and the other was a Type 84 re-styled to look more like the Romak?

BTW, I didn't correct that typo; Gunmaster45 did. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

Oh, yeah, and the screens are really cool. As far as people's sudden interest in ignored pages, I guess it has to do with the fact that once they see somebody's worked on it in the "Recent Changes" section, they glance at it, and then they're more likely to spot mistakes they didn't see before.

:OK, you know what? My eyes ''do'' suck! I just stood way, way back from my monitor and squinted, and now I see that it's not a hooded Norinco sight; it's just the angle makes it appear circular. You are right; it can't be a Type 84, or anything that uses Type 84 parts. And I'm guessing that also means I could be wrong about the ''[[Casino Royale]]'' AKs, too.

:It's kinda strange, though...I wouldn't have figured British armorers would use civilian AK variants that were essentially geared towards the U.S. firearms market.

==I, Robot SMG==

Excellent, I'm glad to see you found the scene in ''[[I, Robot]]'' where it shows a close-up of the SMG's receiver and the Spectre's safety is visible. I was beginning to think my memory had failed me and that I was wrong...but I remember seeing this movie in the theater, on the big screen, and seeing that exact same image in your screenshot. Immediately, I thought to myself, "Spectre M4!" Actually, only a few months before the movie came out, I was at a gun show where one of the dealers had the semi-auto carbine version on his table...probably how I recognized it so quickly!

BTW, I believe the trigger and pistol grip are one unit on the Spectre. It looks to me like the armorers who worked on ''[[I, Robot]]'' just removed it and added that PSG1-style grip, but never bothered to put on a replacement trigger guard. - [[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==M70==

Hi,

Do you think we should really have a separate page for the [[Zastava M70]], instead of just putting it under the [[AK-47]] page, as we did for the [[AK-47#Norinco Type 56|Type 56]]? - [[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

:I see your point. However, my personal criteria is that we should keep all conventional 7.62x39mm AK-type assault rifles on one page. Although the M70 series are by no means straightforward AK-47/AKM copies (due to the ladder sight and the mix of stamped receiver with traditional AK layout, like on the Type 56), they are still basically pretty conventional rifles, as opposed to say, the Norinco Type 86 or the Saiga and Vepr series. I feel it'd probably be better to keep the M70 on the [[AK-47]] page, especially since I haven't seen any movies yet that feature weapons like the M76 or M77. This is, of course, sort of a gray area and one of the biggest problems with this site, IMO.

:Also, I feel compelled to point out...there's an episode in ''[[Ultimate Force]]'' where "Russian" soldiers are actually seen using M70Bs and Type 56s, which is of course ridiculously inaccurate (the episode takes place in the present-day Chechen conflict).

==RE: RE: Studio Weapons==
You more than answered the question, thank you. I have seen some pictures of places that do the rentals and, frankly, privately list them as places I would most want to work. ''"No we don't have a .50 cal minigun on the shelves but I can check in the back."'' Once again thanks for the info and for the earlier compliments. Incidentally, I am working on a new one..."Farewell to the King" (1989)..should have it ready in a few days.

Do studios still keep their own "arsenals"? I was given the impression that most, if not all, firearms for movies were in the private sector.

== RE: Images ==
No skin off of my nose what images you use mate. Fact of the matter is, when you boil it down, pretty much all the images we are using on here are not "legal". So which ones you use, from whatever site are ok with me. Frankly, as far as I go, I try to only use images which do not have another web site's watermark on them.

==RE:==

First of all, cheers for the update on the Type 84 picture. There's no hurry; I understand if it takes a while to get the appropriate mags (since obviously, a Type 84 doesn't look very different from a Type 56 without them).

Second, while I don't speak for everyone on here, I can say that I personally do not have any problem with you replacing pictures of guns on this site (even those that I uploaded) with any that you took. Nor do I see why anyone else would. The only reason I can imagine anyone getting offended would be if they went to the same effort you do to get the guns and photograph them on their own. But pretty much everyone else on here just uploads pictures they copied from other gun sites, in some cases ''airsoft'' web sites (like that picture we used to have of the SP89, which was just an airsoft MP5K fitted with an SP89 handguard from DenTrinity; terrible!). And it doesn't take much time or effort to copy and upload someone else's work.

Additionally, your gun photos are obviously of superior quality to anything else on here, and they're of guns that have actually appeared in movies (possibly the same movies as the pages they're on), so as far as I am concerned, there really isn't any reason why we can't replace any existing photos of guns with the ones you've taken. In fact, I would encourage you to ''not'' be so timid in the future when it comes to replacing photos. If you want an example of what I mean by this, take a look at the [[Armalite AR-18]] page. Your AR-18 picture is way better than any of those on the page, so I don't see any reason why you can't just remove some of the others (maybe keep ONE of the other photos of the gun with the scope, and even that could be replaced if you took an equivalent picture).

One thing I will point out, though: I have sometimes used pictures on my pages that are from the web site of Rick Washburn's company Weapons Specialists, Inc. (http://www.weaponspecialists.com/index.php). They provided the guns for ''[[I Am Legend]]'', so the page for that movie now features pictures of the guns used in the film that I copied and uploaded from them (including the tan-framed Mark 23). In cases like that, I'd prefer those particular photos stay up (you'll know them because I always provide links and info mentioning where they're from) because they feature the actual movie guns, and they're decent quality. Besides that, I don't have any problem with you replacing any and all photos of guns on this site with yours.

==Chinese Type 56==

First of all, I GREATLY appreciate the photo you took of one of the ''[[Goldeneye]]'' AKs for me. I didn't know you had access to any British armories?

However, I have one question: Do you think it's really appropriate to classify the Chinese Type 56 rifles with stamped receivers as "AK-47" and "AKS-47" clones, as opposed to AKM/AKMS derivatives? I realize that the Type 56s with stamped receivers lack just about all of the other features of the AKMs (including the muzzle break, ribbed receiver cover, rate reducer, grip rails, narrower front sight, etc.), but I've usually heard them described as AKM copies simply to distinguish them from the earlier milled-receiver versions. I know this is an over-simplification of sorts because the Type 56s aren't really orthodox AK-47s or AKMs (they're more like a weird hybrid version), but I figured it would be more appropriate.

:Well, I would say I know the differences between the two. I must point out that I own a Chinese AK (mine was imported by Golden State Arms and simply has 'AK47S 7.62x39mm - Made in China' stamped on the receiver). I was simply curious whether the presence of a stamped receiver on the Type 56 made it worthy of being designated an AKM variant or not.

:Personally, I think the best bet might be to literally just create a new sub-entry for the Type 56 under the [[AK-47]] page and then we can focus on finding any and all movies that feature the Type 56 and putting them under there. This would reflect best the fact that the Type 56 is sort of a weird hybrid AK-47/AKM with distinctly Chinese characteristics (such as the hooded front sight), which most other AK derivatives (like the Maadis) don't have.

::Haha, no offense taken, just wanted you to know I'm not a complete newbie when it comes to AKs, though obviously you completely blow me out of the water. Anyway, I would definitely appreciate the Type 84 pic whenever you get a chance. Not sure if there's anything else I need at the moment...but I would strongly encourage you to just take pictures of whatever you can get your hands on. As I've said, it's really great that we have you because this site is full of pictures that are copied from sites like world.guns.ru or (in some cases) AIRSOFT websites (i.e. the SP89 picture that we used to have before I replaced it).

::BTW, these are some incredible pics you've gotten us lately, moreso than usual. How on earth did you get that Romanian AIMS from "44 Minutes"? Do you know Thell Reed, too? Also, I'm going to do a LITTLE bit of additional work on the [[AK-47#Type 56|Type 56]] entry, and I think I'm also gonna ditch the AKS-47 one for now (simply because there don't seem to be any movies I'm aware of that have actual milled-receiver Russian AKS-47s or close copies) and move all the Type 56-1 entires down. If you disagree, you can revert (or partially modify) the edits and I won't mind. Also, good work on the [[RPG-7]] article getting the Type 69 mentioned (it's something I wanted to do myself - mostly because "Kingdom of the Crystal Skull" also has a Type 69).

==Re: Editing Dogs of War==

Thanks for the info. I've seen those guns in a whole bunch of movies and I always wondered what they were, who made them, and why. I think they've also appeared in a couple episodes of ''[[The A-Team]]'' and a Chuck Norris movie or two.

I have some great screenshots of the fake Uzis which I took for my ''[[Raw Deal]]'' page (I've been meaning to work on it for ages, but so far, I just never have managed to get around to it). Here they are:

[[Image:Vlcsnap-59410.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

[[Image:Vlcsnap-59747.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

== Re: image ==

Sorry for the mixup. Feel free to replace the image with a better one if you have one handy. It's good to have a professional armourer on the site to help out, you've been doing some good work so far. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 10:58, 8 June 2008 (UTC) Orca1_9904

== Contact? ==

I was wondering, is there any way we could chat off-site? I'd enjoy the opportunity to talk with you about your work as an armourer and about some various weapons and films. My contact info can be found on my user page. I hope to hear from you soon, and wish you well. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 22:43, 9 June 2008 (UTC) Orca1_9904

== Red Dawn ==

OK, I was simply confused because I thought you were saying that the Egyptians didn't call the full-auto version they made for their armed forces the Misr, which would contradict almost every book and web site on AKs I've read. You obviously know far, FAR more than I do, so I think it's perfectly fine if you want to edit the page to refer to the guns as Maadi ARMs. Perhaps it might also be reasonable to put in a note that the ARM is the semi-automatic version of the Misr or something? Also, please post the picture of the "Red Dawn" AKM you took.

Appreciate your contributions, and (especially) your photographs. It's really cool that we have somebody like you on here. Do you by chance have any pictures of the Norinco/Poly Tech AKs that the rental armories purchased in the 80s? A long, LONG time ago, somebody put one of them up for sale on GunBroker; I wish I had saved the picture. I'm also curious to know if you have pics of the Norinco Type 84...I've been trying to get a good one to add to the ''[[Casino Royale]]'' page and my ''[[Harsh Realm]]'' page for a while now.

:Wow, thanks! Yeah, I'd prefer the basic fixed-stock configuration since the ones in ''[[Casino Royale]]'' and ''[[Harsh Realm]]'' seem to have that (except the wood on the CR guns looks like it can't be factory), but I wouldn't encourage you to go TOO far out of your way, as I recognize you must be really busy.

:Which armory is it that you have access to?

==Re: My two cents on the Hulk Launchers==
Yeah, I think you're probably right...it looks to me that the armorers were shooting for an M32 look but couldn't get the real deal, so they took civilian launchers (most likely DefTech) and modified them heavily. I notice that there seem to be a lot of 37mm launchers which are depicted as HE grenade launchers in movies (i.e. Colt 37mm Flare Launchers substituting for M203s). I guess this is another case of the same deal.

Sure, you can re-post the CZ99 pic. It isn't "mine"; I took it from world.guns.ru, which is where many of the photographs of guns on this site come from (as you can imagine, that's why I'm happy to have someone like you who is willing to give us original photos, especially when they're of actual movie guns).

== Thanks ==

[[The Dogs of War]] was one of my first "efforts" here. I knew, already, that you saw a guy running around with a [[MAC-10]] during the weapons training phase but did not know there was one of those cheesy ass "fake" [[Uzi]]s. Oh, the same goes for the Car-15s.

Incidentally, I forget what movie I saw it in but there was a fake [[Uzi]] in it and the foregrip on it was rotated so that the front sight was actually pointed downward!!!

== Hey ==

Hey MoviePropMaster, I'm Alienqueen11, and I seen the images you have uploaded, and they're great. I also want to know if you can do me a favor, if you can upload a picture of a [[Remington 870]] with Ghost Ring Sights and a High Capacity Tube like the one in the screenshot below for the [[Dawn of the Dead (2004)]] page, I would greatly appreciate it, and great work so far.
[[Image:DotD_Mossberg2.jpg|thumb|none|350px|]]

== Thanks ==

Thanks for complitementing my knowledge on guns, I also reverted a version of one of your MP5 pictures because someone copied over it with an airsoft image, I really wish some people would checked the thing while they're uploading an image to make sure the name isn't already used to avoid mistakes like this. And once again, thanks for your contributions and keep up the good work. Alienqueen11.

== Heartbreak Ridge M16's ==

I just saw ''[[Heartbreak Ridge]]'' on TV this afternoon, and all the [[M16 rifle series|M16]]'s I saw on-screen were the A1 variant, complete with bolt-forward assist buttons at the rear of the upper recievers. Even saw one fitted with an [[M203 grenade launcher]] used by one of the Recon Marines under Gunnery Sergeant Highway's command.

[[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 08:01, 22 July 2008 (UTC) Orca1_9904
- He might want to look at my page and see they weren't ''all'' M16A1s.

==Question==
[[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]: Hi, I was just wondering how is it you take a picture of a gun and get a perfectly white clear background? What method is used to get that effect? My other question is that on the [[Hollow Point]] page I made recently, did I get the AK varient right? I figured I'd ask you as you seem to be the AK pro on the site. Thanks.
(My list of pages is on my profile if you feel like checking any of my other work as well.)

==M14 rifle==
I've noticed that the M14 and M21 rifle pictures on this site aren't really that great, is there any chance you could take some good shots? The pictures now are blurry, or black and white.

==37mm Launcher==
Thanks for fixing up that page, I was told by MT2008 it was a Colt Launcher, I guess it was a Cobray. Finding the pictures of them was probably the hardest thing on the page. Do you think we should keep the M203 to launcher comparison picture or is it irrelevant? -GM

::I built the colt launcher page based on what MT said, but your input greatly helped it. It's a shame taking professional pictures is so complex. The best I have is photoshop and an erase brush. I have a Norinco Type 54 pistol and I wanted to put pictures of it on the site soon. I'm not bad with editing, it should come out okay. I just need to find the time to do it. The M14 rifle pics came out great, let me know if you get your hands on an M21. I'll have plenty of films to be corrected in the future, my to do list touches the sky. One or two every friday or saturday. Stay cool. -GM

==Bren 10 "Peregrine Falcon"==
:Here's a tricky task, do you think you could find a Bren 10 "Peregrine Falcon"? Aparently it is what John Practice uses in [[Last Action Hero]] according to user input, and I can't find a good picture of it. Until I do find a good picture, I'll have to keep my horrible AR-24 picture I had on their before. If it isn't a Bren 10 PF, I'd assume you of all people would shoot me straight.
[[Image:StarMegastarLastActionHero.jpg|thumb|none|400px|This is the picture of him with the Bren 10 "Peregrine Falcon". His is a tutone model, but I'm not that picky. If both can be had, it would make a nice page in the Bren 10 gun section.]]
==M1911/M1911A1==
::I apoligize for asking one more thing of you, but the M1911 and M1911A1 pistols are infamous works of art in the firearms world, commonly used in films. We got a repro M1911 picture (modernized), a Springfield M1911A1 (when Colt M1911A1 is the genuine picture desired), another M1911A1 with pachmyr grips (better than springfield, but see how it sticks out on Platoon? It's ''too'' modern) So is their any chance you could find a genuine (or prefered, an ''authentic'' reproduction) of a Colt M1911 and Colt M1911A1 to snap some shots of, that would be awesome. I trust you know them apart, your a pro. Thanks. Good luck. -GM

==Re:Last Action Hero==
I saw [[Last Action Hero]] when I was young and loved it. Now, it is still one of my favorites. I like how it makes fun of action movies, by showing how Arnold can fire a billion rounds from a Desert Eagle and cars just explode for no reason. I'll fix those problems you mentioned. Your saying they are more likely civilian TEC-9s instead of TEC-DC9's? What physical traits help determine this, just the sling? And they were firing full-auto so they were probably converted.

== Hi! ==

Still no replacement grip for the M70?

Shame, it looks strange with that grip - I'm used to seeing them on M76s and M72s... which reminds me: about that mystery long barreled AK - I know that Crvena Zastava makes under-folder RPKs, namely the M72A (7.62 - based on M70), and the M90A (5.56 - based on an assault rifle of the same designation). The under-folder RPKs (those with an "A") have removable bipods (the standard, solid-stock ones have fixed), so w/ the folding stocks and w/o bipods they would look like those mystery AKs, no? Also, one more improtant fact: unlike the Yugo AKs (which have 3 holes), the Yugo RPKs have TWO holes in the forward grip (like the original AKs). http://pookieweb.dyndns.org:61129/Yugo/pics/m72a.jpg

I hope this was hepful, keep up the good work!

== Request ==

I'm sorry to ask, but if you get the chance, can you upload a [[Beretta M92F|Beretta M92FS]]? I know the ones on the site are already good enough, but I want to see how great one by you would be. I know you're already busy, so don't do it if you're too busy, and if you can't upload it, it's okay. Anyway, welcome back, the new pictures for the M16 and M14 are great. [[User: Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]]

== RE:870 ==

I think you're right about the Mossberg sights on the 870, they seem to match those on the Mossberg more then anything.

Here the picture I had on the page when I thought his shotgun was a Mossberg 500:
[[Image:Mossberg500.gif|thumb|none|335px|[[Mossberg 500]] 12 ga. with optional ghost ring sights.]]

And this is the image I have on the page now, seeing it now, they look nothing like the sights in the screencap:
[[Image:870p.jpg|thumb|none|335px|Remington 870 Police Magnum with magazine extention tube and ghost ring sights.]]

And it looks like the armorer must have put the Mossberg sights on the Remington:
[[Image:DotD Mossberg2.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]

Hope this helps, and thanks for the favor, I appreciate it. [[User: Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]]

== Done ==

Don't worry, he won't be able to edit again, if it happens again, I'll be sure to make so only registered users can edit the [[Commando]] page. [[User: Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]]

==Karabiner 98k sniper rifle==
:I recently noticed while working on the [[Saving Private Ryan]] page that we have no sniper rifle varient Kar98k rifle pic. I've noticed you [[Enemy at the Gates]] page is in need of this picture as well too. I apoligize for adding yet another gun to your to-do list but just let me know if you find one. -GM45

==Re: FINALLY==

Excellent! I already have a use for the 870 folder, too - just put it on the ''[[RoboCop]]'' page (which features an identical weapon). And thanks for the UMP-45 and the Gen 2 Glock-17 as well! There are so many movies that feature Gen 2 Glocks, yet all we have is that stock picture of a Gen 3. When I get back to my place later today, I'm going to start using your Glock in every movie page that features such a gun.

Also...that AR15A2 you photographed; can we consider it an M16A2? Is it converted to auto or burst? We really need a good M16A2 picture, because the one that appears throughout the site is yet another crappy airsoft picture.

==RE:==

Hmmm, I'll have to see. There's lots of loose women and great beer over here in Texas that I ''might'' be able to offer you, but the gold's gonna be hard to come by! Haha.

Thanks yet AGAIN for the improved two-tone P226 picture. Weirdly enough, I completely failed to notice that the one in ''[[Face/Off]]'' had a silver hammer until you pointed it out. But it's great that you have a better eye for detail than I do, and moreso that you corrected it. And, of course, thank you for answering my questions about movie guns to the best of your ability. I think your idea for a 12-gauge pump page is perfectly useful, though I must point out that if it can't be categorized, it's gonna be hard for other users to find it. In order to make sure people see it, please add links to it on pages for the shotguns it distinguishes from each other. That would be the best way to make sure your word gets out.

Hope you don't mind, but I've already shown your SIG pics on SIGforum.com to draw attention to our site. I'd show your H&K pictures on HKPRO forum (where I also post), too, if their forum wasn't down every other minute. I dunno if you post on any other gun-related boards, but if you do, show off your pics and point folks to IMFDB. The more attention, the better. We've already got 55,000 views from the ''[[Heat]]'' page (which features your P220 and M16A1 pictures, among others), so spread the word and more people will discover the beauty of IMFDB with its original movie gun pictures, taken by an actual movie armorer!

Oh, yeah, and I will respond to the topic of vandals on Bunni's talk page shortly. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:Dibbs==
Feel free, one less thing for me to do. I only ask that you keep the bow and knife on the page so it fits the other two. I'll eventually add them to [[Rambo (2008)]] so that one fits as well. If anything I'll likely just add some shots like I tend to do. Thanks for asking me and not just doing it. Can't wait to see it. -[[User:Gunmaster45|GM45]]
::Almost forgot, MT2008 may have asked already but we really need a Poly Tech Legend AK pic.

:::Nope, I forgot, too! Yeah, it wouldn't be a bad idea. I've been looking for one on Google image search, but no go on any good ones. Also, speaking of AKs (and here I go again making your request list longer), a new AKM pic would be nice. Not to sound unappreciative, but I tend to shy away from the one you took just because the red stock looks out-of-place and ugly, plus the magazine is the plastic type rather than the ribbed type. If you can get a picture of one of the Maadi AKMs with the right stock, plus a metal ribbed-style mag (which is more the "classic" style, if you will)...great. If not, no worries. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Re:Casino Royale==

Yep, that's the exact same picture I looked up to remind myself what an M76 was. Actually, I think I always thought that the M76 just referred to their long-range rifle, and I didn't remember that their smaller-caliber AKs were called M76. But I did know off the top of my head that it couldn't be Zastava because their full-sized AKs always have the folding GL sight, and the ''[[Casino Royale]]'' AKs don't.

BTW, any idea what's wrong with the [[Taurus PT92]] picture you gave us? I just put it on the page for ''[[The X-Files]]'', and now it's disappeared. A search of the page history indicates no act of vandalism.

Oh, yeah, and one other thing: I never thanked you for getting that Australian Automatic Arms carbine picture for ''[[The Matrix]]'' page. So...thanks! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== DotD 870 ==

I don't mean to bug you, but did you have any luck with the Dawn of the Dead Remington 870, and did the message I sent you about about the sights help at all, please let me know. Also excellent work lately, The new Mossberg 500 and Remington 870 pictures are great, and so are the many other pictures you uploaded lately, I really like the two tone Sig P226s you got for MT2008, those are one of kind. Good luck, and keep up the good work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:10, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

==Kelly's Heroes==
I was aware they were using FN BAR type D 8mm guns instead of american .30-06 BARs but I didn't know they were using the wrong mag pouches. Thanks for the info. -GM45

==Re:M1911 pistols==
The 1911 pictures are absolute perfection. The M1911 from 1913 looks great. I have one from 1913 too and yours puts mine to shame. Thanks very much. -GM45

:And thanks for the P38, too! Feel free to just delete the one that's been on the P38 already, and insert your image into any and all movie pages featuring P38s. I've been replacing old gun images on many pages with your new gun images (i.e. the Glock you uploaded earlier in the week). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== Need some help ==

Hello, I just added a few more guns in The Unit page and I need some help IDing some of them that I can't seem to put my finger on. Care to give me a hand if you can?

-Excaliber

== Re: Beretta M92FS ==

It looks excellent, I don't mind an American made Beretta, an Italian made one isn't too different, is it? If you come across an Italian one in the future, you can upload that, but you don't have to, like I said, I like the new one as it is. Thank you soo much for the favor, you never disappoint.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 23:28, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

==Thanks for the USP!==

I was thinking of asking you for a USP pic, but figured I should hold off on it, just to prevent you from getting bogged down.

As you can tell, we're embarking on a campaign to replace any and all older images of guns taken from other sites, with the pictures you've uploaded. I'm also curious...what would you think of a page dedicated to explaining the importance of your gun images to new users of the site, and featuring examples of your work? It would be linked from the main page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== Should cartoons be allowed? ==

I want to know if it is either no one cares about the fact that cartoons like Family Guy, The Simpsons, American Dad, and recently South Park had been allowed to this site. I have don't think these pages should exist because do you think about the rare guns that appears on those shows and wonder what they are? Cause I sure don't. I'm too busy laughing my ass off to how funny these series are, not wondering if the shotgun Homer used in the Zombie episode was a Winchester Model 1887 or that it never appeared in any other episode following. I don't care and I dont think anyone else should care. We're getting cartoon fanboys that thinks just because Family Guy has an episode where Stewie has a closet full of look alike guns, means we should write a page about them. Those guns are not the point of the show and the artist that drew them obviously didn't take much consideration for them or mention. I think Family Guy, The Simpsons, American Dad, and South Park be removed at once. None of them deserve to be on this site. And whoever puts them here doesn't respect this site enough.
::That's a little harsh. I added some of the info on those pages, thank you. I was eventually going to do the South Park movie, because it does in fact have some pretty obvious guns in it. Personally I think they shouldn't be removed but if they are to stay, someone should take the time to screencap them and show us what they are talking about. -GM45

==Reign of Fire==
I just finished screencapping [[Reign of Fire]] and before I upload them on the page, I wanted to see if you knew what this gun is. Based on what I see I'm assuming it is a .577 Nitro Tyrannosaurus Rex rifle built personally by the Mauser company's greatest gunsmiths based on the Mauser rifle type extractor/bolt release and the Mauser style firing pin striker seen on the gun. At first I thought it was a Model 70 or a Mauser sporterized and then they show what big ass rounds he loads in it so now I just don't know. I figured of all, you'd likely know best. Also, if it is a T-rex rifle, I'd likely need a picture of it because as usual, the internet sucks for finding gun pics. I know this gun is rare but so is the .600 Nitro double barreled rifle, but that is seen in [[The Lost World: Jurassic Park]] despite that. I'm not expecting a picture from you because I know how rare and expensive it is but I figured if it ever came up I could count on you.

Here's the pics:
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-1.jpg|thumb|none|500px|His rifle resting up against the table.]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-2.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Note the extractor/bolt release and Mauser style striker.]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-3.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-4.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-5.jpg|thumb|none|500px|This scope symbol looks familiar, what brand is this?]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-6.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Look at the monstrous rounds he loads it with. Only two fit in the gun! They look like either .577 or .600 Nitro rounds.]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-7.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-8.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
[[Image:ROFbigrifle-9.jpg|thumb|none|500px|He fires the rifle at the big bull dragon, which does nothing and tosses it away after two shots.]]

Hope you respond soon. -[[User:Gunmaster45|GM45]]
::I've decided to upload the movie tommorow to give you more time to respond. -GM

: I didn't expect you'd have one, after all it isn't a mass produced company gun. Major members of the Mauser company make it customly crafted. You'll see it all on the page in a sec. Also, the pic I uploaded I had to edit so it was horizontal and since it had 4 whited corners after turning it, I had to clone the corners in. Once you know, it is far more obvious to tell where I edited.

==Re: New Pics==

What I meant is that I want to make sure people on this site see how thorough you are, and how accurately you match guns to requests. Remember that AR15 Sporter that you visually modified to look like an XM177 from ''[[The Dogs of War]]''? Or the two SIG P226s you made to look the ones in ''[[Face/Off]]'' and ''[[Bad Boys II]]''? Those are the kinds of gun pics that I want to show off to new folks. What I would do is just make a page that briefly explains your contributions, and then shows guns you've photographed and how close they are to those in the movies. This is an unformed idea, I admit, but basically, I want people browsing this sight to understand (1.) That your images are exclusive to IMFDB, and (2.) That they're basically close representations of what those users have seen in movies. I know I'm not being terribly articulate, but do you understand what I mean?

And don't worry about replacing previous pics with your pics. The rest of us will continue to do that for you, as we've been doing. So far, we've pretty much replaced all of the old M16s, M4s, Berettas, Glocks, Kar98s, MP40s, etc. with your guns. I think I'm gonna start putting your USP pic on our pages, too (except those that feature the larger .45 variant of the USP, like ''[[Collateral]]'').-[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==AK-47 recognition page==
Now that you've made a Shotgun page, why not make an AK page to tell a Norinco from a Maadi from a genuine, from a poly tech, etc.
Also, maybe an M16 page for slab sides, A1s, A2s, etc.
It would probably help the users out a lot. I'm sure the shotgun page did. Personally, I have trouble telling a Norinco Type 56 aside from its hooded sight. Perhaps a couple of close ups of sight placement, recievers and all that will make me a more efficient I.Der. -GM45

== Dawn of the Dead ==

Hey, MPM2008, I uploaded some more shots of Ving Rhames' shotgun in [[Dawn of the Dead (2004)]] if you want to take a look, it's in the Custom Remington 870 section of the page. Thanks in advance.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:48, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

== Hey ==

Hey, MPM2008, do you want me to put protections on your images so no one can revert them if they've been upload over with images from the internet in the past, or upload over them? I'm asking this because some user keeps uploading a crappy picture from the internet over your H&K USP40 image. And if you want, I could ask Bunni to make you a mod or I can take the protections off them whenever you want to edit them or upload a new version of them. Let me know what you want to do.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:24, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

Update: I protected all your images, and I also asked Bunni to make you an adminstrator so you can upload new versions of or revert them if want. If you not made an admin right away, just tell me what image you want to access, and I'll unlock it for you. I'm sorry I had to do this, but I wanted to prevent idiots like the guy who kept uploading over your H&K USP40 from changing your pictures, and I promise, if I ever get the ability to block users back, I will undo the protections. See you soon and good luck.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:07, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

:Made you a mod, enjoy. [[User:WikiSysop|WikiSysop]] 22:42, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

== Response ==

Thanks, I will always make sure your images stay the way they are. And I didn't understand that user either, I told him politely a bunch of times to stop, but he wouldn't listen. What really intrigues me most is how somebody could prefer a crappy image they probably found on Google Images over an excellent well photographed image such as yours. As for being a mod, congratulations, but I most warn you that the block function is not working at this time, but Bunni is trying his best to fix it, but you will be able to delete any pages or images you don't want, and you will also be able to protect pages. And if we ever get the ability to block back, that one user is going to be the first on my list.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:20, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

As for the 870, take as much time as you need to, I'm sure it'll be worth the wait when it's uploaded. I will also have more requests in the future, but I won't bother you with them right now. And I also I have a question, I read your new project pictures thing on your user page, and when you say 870 riot configurations, do mean Remington 870s similar in appearence to the one seen in [[Walking Tall]]? Thanks, and good luck, I can't wait to see any future images you upload.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:20, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Update- MPM2008, you are now able to block vandals.

==Re:Special page==

Well, that's fine. But now that you're a mod and your images can be protected, I don't think there's much to worry about. I also think it would just be cool if new users understood right off the bat that IMFDB has essentially its own movie armorer. -MT2008

== Other Request ==

Hey, MPM2008, whenever you get the chance, is there a possiblity you can get me a Beretta 92FS Inox or Stainless model of the Beretta 92FS? Thanks in advance. Also, good work with your recent images, I really like the new Walther P99, I was going to ask for one, but you thought about it before I did. Keep up the great work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 21:51, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

==Sin City Yellow Bastard's custom 92FS==
YB's Beretta 92FS in [[Sin City]] is a unique blend of a factory black and an Inox model, similair to SIG-Sauer used in 2 fast 2 furious. Since AQ11 just asked for an Inox, if you get your hands on one, do yuo think you could mix the two together. This is the gun in the movie.
[[Image:SC92FS-3.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Note how it has reverse tutone rather than the typical factory style.]]

Thanks -GM45

== Re: Pop Quiz ==

I think that may be a [[Smith & Wesson Model 27]], as it comes in both .357 Magnum and .38 Special and looks similar to the one used in ''[[Bad Boys]]'' by the main villian. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 06:55, 27 October 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

:Isn't the Mod 27 a larger frame? That's what's stumping me. It looks like the frame of a model 10. MPM2008.

::That one in the ''Bad Boys'' screenshot looks pretty huge, unless the actor has small hands. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 07:38, 27 October 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

::Arghhh. I had better go back to the vault and check. I keep on thinking it's a Model 19-2, primarily because the Mod 27-2 barrel looks different than this one. Thanks so much for the effort. MPM2008

BTW, I'll let you know what I find out. :)

[[Image:S&WRev.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson Model 27 .357 Magnum?]]
[[Image:BB_Python.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Fouchet dual wields with both his [[Beretta Cheetah]] and a [[Smith & Wesson Model 27]].]]

==RE:animated gifs==
I have a lot of high-tec computer editing crap, I likely could do it. I just don't know how. My sister is computer wiz, I see if she can figure it out. I had all three of those Heat GIFs saved on my Myspace. Just a heads up, I'm gonna be doing [[The Punisher (2004)]] soon, so you can check that out. I can't make you any promises on the animated GIFs tho. -GM

==Re: Reign of Fire==
Thanks. Take your time on the Ultimax, it isn't a big deal right now. Wiki just made me an Admin. so I'm feeling pretty damn special right now. I'm going to get the Punisher (2004) on today, than I'm finally back on track with my original list. -GM45

=="Non Guns"==

I just made a page for the [["Non Guns"]], and I'm curious to know what you think of it. I don't know a whole lot about them besides what I've read online, whereas I imagine you've probably got some experience with them, since I've heard many armorers rent them for scenes where blanks are unsafe. Any thoughts? Would say the summary I've done at the top of the page is a pretty good description of what they do?

Cheers.-[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

:Haha, trust me, I hear you on the "fugly" part. I cringe every time I spot a Non Gun in a movie or TV show, because they're ''soooooo'' fake-looking and too many idiot directors don't even think to film them at angles/lighting conditions where it won't be so obvious what they are. But, like you've said, our goal here is to be educational and informative, and no matter how crappy Non Guns might look, they are still important to the topic of guns in cinema, and that's what we're here for. :) The images are from Weapons Specialists' web site, which apparently subrents them; ISS has their own pictures, but I prefer Weapons Specialists' because theirs don't have the measuring tape above the gun.

:Sorry to hear you've been sick, but don't worry...you never have to apologize for anything. I really like the idea of your "Hello IMFDB!" card and think it would be great for our site. I will, of course, not demand it or anything, but it would be awesome if we had something like that. I agree with the idea of using the IMFDB logo, though if I can think of anything else, I'll tell you. As usual, thanks for all the work you've been doing (for us AND Hollywood), and thanks for the kind words on my Non Guns page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

== 2nd-Gen Glock 23 ==

Hey, I was wondering if you could possibly provide an image of a 2nd-Generation [[Glock#Glock 23|Glock 23]] for the article on ''[[The Fugitive]]'', since the image for that weapon on the page is of a 3rd-Generation model with accessory rails on the frame as opposed to the smooth-framed 2nd-Generation model seen in the screenshots? I already edited the [[Glock#Glock 22|Glock 22]] section similarly for that article and the sequel ''[[U.S. Marshals]]'', and was wondering if you could help me out with that one image so I don't have to chase down an image on Google. Thanks in advance. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 08:11, 1 November 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

:I asked for Second-Generation Glocks, those are 3rd generation (note the accessory rails at the front of the frame). Seeing as someone identified the compact Glock model in the film in question as a Glock 19 it's something of a moot point now. However, a 2nd-Generation [[Glock#Glock 19|Glock 19]] image would be appreciated as there's none available here yet and there's several pages here that could benefit from an image of that weapon. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 07:50, 12 November 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904

== Get Well Soon ==

Hey MPM2008, I heard you were sick so I wanted to stop by and say get well soon.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:45, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

==My man!==

Awesome! The AKM and Type 84 look great; they're just what we needed. It's weird that I haven't been able to find a good picture of a standard fixed-stock Type 84 anywhere; yours might just be one of the best pics of this gun on the entire 'net right now. Question...is the AKM a Maadi, or is some other make? I would like to edit the entry on the AK-47 page to say if it is or not.

I will start phasing out the old pictures and replacing them, although it seems you guys have a head start on me. And thanks for the other new pictures as well - love that new PSG-1, the Uzi Carbine, and of course the "plain" 870 police (which, like you said, was something we REALLY needed). I'm also glad to see you're better, too. Take care. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:19, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

(BTW...dunno if you've noticed, but I only discovered this recently; if you hit the " ~ " key four times, it signs your posts automatically so that you don't have to type out your username. I've been using Wikis for several years now and I only just figured that out. Alienqueen discovered this long before I did, but just a heads-up.)

== Great work ==

Thanks for the police 870, it looks excellent. we really needed a standard since so many of the 870s on the site look like that. I'll be sure to replace all the 870s that need to be replaced with that. And also, I'm glad to hear you got better.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 18:27, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

== Oops ==

I didn't read correctly who gave me the PSG1 pic

==Pics==

Hi,

First of all, thanks yet again for the new pics! The SR9s are nice, but...I had no idea that some SR9s in movies are actually converted from HK91s? If that's the case, then by all means, you should still go ahead and put down those pics under the SR9 section of the G3 page. But does this also mean that the SR9(T) from ''[[The Replacement Killers]]'' is one of these guns? Again, this is just a huge revelation for me. I still see no reason to put them under the HK91 entry, simply because if they're meant to be SR9s, just as the converted HK94s are meant to be MP5s, then I think it's appropriate to label them as such.

And, thanks for the Type 56 that looks like the ''[[Goldeneye]]'' ones. If you want to shoot it again with the regular non-blued bolt carrier, that's fine by me. However, I should also point out that the ones in ''Goldeneye'' also have red bakelite magazines, so you might wanna give it one of those, too. Then, you'll have something identical to the ''Goldeneye'' "AKS-74s". But I will still use the picture you have in the meantime. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:15, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

:Hmmm. Yeah, I guess I figured when I noticed the trigger, but I wasn't sure if the gun from ''[[The Replacement Killers]]'' was genuine or not. Was this sort of thing done because real SR9s were too expensive? I figured since the SR9 used to be a readily available civilian "assault rifle", armorers would use it.

:However, if your guns are a fairly accurate representation of the SR9s that have appeared in movies, then it's better that you've given us images of these particular guns. I agree with you that our goal should be to have the most accurate representations of movie guns possible, and since you're an armorer, we can anticipate that yours represent what movies use.-[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:15, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

::''only 125 TCs were imported into the entire USA and only 100 T models''

::Wow, it was really that few? OK, that explains everything. I had no idea they were so rare to begin with. Even HKPRO, which has import data for most of the -90 series guns, didn't have that info. Thanks for those numbers.

::Like I've said, I think this means it's good that we have the pics you've taken because they are a very accurate representation of the SR9s actually used in movies. I would recommend you do one of those "Movie Armorer's Notes" in the SR9 section of the G3 page, just like you did for the Colt Commando section on the M16 page, explaining what you've told me. Hope it doesn't bother you that we're unmasking all of the various tricks that you armorers have been using over the years to convince moviegoers they're seeing one gun when it's actually another! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:59, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

==Re: SR9==

I think part of the problem is that there just aren't enough people who take Wikis in general seriously. As far as HK aficionados go, one of my pet peeves is that way too many of them I meet are way too arrogant towards non-HK owners for not being able to appreciate the "Teutonic superiority" (as Larry Correia put it) of HK weapons. Sorry to say that I dunno if you can please some of them no matter what you do. :)

Personally, I accept that there's some stuff that even Hollywood's people have to do in order to make our movie experience satisfactory. Like when we were talking about the ''[[Jarhead]]'' Abrams tanks...it's a necessary evil for Hollywood vehicle wranglers to dress up an English Centurion to look like an M1A1 simply because unless you're Spielberg, it's very hard to get the DoD to lend you a real one for a show. And likewise, in 1984, it was not possible to get real Soviet AKMs, RPG-7s, and DShKs, so the Stembridge armorers had to find the next best thing. But I also enjoy uncovering these tricks simply because I'm an enthusiast of firearms and military equipment in general, so I always like seeing how Hollywood's people think on the fly in adverse circumstances. There's an art to it, no? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:16, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the correction on the Four Brothers' HK33, it was labeled as a HK41 long before I started editing the page, I just took the screenshot. And also, thanks for the new images, I'm putting up the new M16A2 on pages right now.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 19:34, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

No problem, every image you upload is great. I also have a question, how do you get the pictures so perfect? Because your gun images are probably some of the best, if not the best gun images I ever seen on the internet. And yea, your new camera really does make a difference, the new versions of the images look great. Anyway, good job on your recent images, and can't wait to see your future M16s.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:33, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

I see, you put alot of effort into your images and that's exactly what makes them great. I agree that alot of gun sites have bad images, some gun books don't have the best pictures either. One problem with some sites is that they also don't use the best examples, like they'll have a picture of gun but it'll have a whole bunch of modifications on it when the unmodified one is what's really needed, and I agree which should replace as many as the old images as possible. And I think visitors do notice your images because if you look at your Remington 870 Riot Model's file page, it has almost 200 views anad it's only been there since Sunday. And good work on the new M4, if you noticed, Hieloco (the user who kept trying to replace your images with "Net" Images) uploaded a version of the ColtM4 file with similar attachments, but yours beats his by by a long shot. And also is that the same M4 you mentioned on MT2008's talk page that the actor dropped? Just wondering.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 21:40, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

==re:M16A2==

First of all, thanks so much for the new M16A2! The AR15 A2 picture was nice, too, but I just thought it'd be better to have the real deal, and it's nice that we have it now. AlienQueen's already been getting to work on replacing the old M16A2 with the new one, and I'll help out, too. The Luger is another image we needed - and the fact that it's from ''Hogan's Heroes'' is especially cool! As far as the HK91 goes, I didn't notice the shadow, but the new one is fine by me. There's only one that troubles - I think the newer Taurus 85 image is a bit fuzzier compared to the old one.

As far as future stuff goes, I have another recommendation. You know how we have an AR15 section under the M16 rifle page? I'd like to get some more un-modified, basic civvie AR15 variants on there, especially Colt Sporters, because I've seen them used in quite a few movies and TV shows that stand in for mil-spec M16s. We've already got an SP1 with an A2 hand guard that you took for the ''[[Heat]]'' page, but I think we should also have SP1s without the forward assist (both A1 and A2 forearms) and a carbine with a 16" barrel. What do you think? (Sadly, I have added more guns to your to-do list...inevitable.)

And yes, we definitely have some of the best gun pics on the 'Net thanks to you. I must admit I'm still smitten with the fact that Norinco Type 84 pics are basically non-existent in just about any gun image site around (even World Guns, which is usually pretty reliable)...except here. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:05, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Actually, one other thing occurred to me, something we need more than the Colt Sporter ARs...do you think you could get some pics of [[Thompson Submachine Gun]]s? All of our Tommy images are jacked from elsewhere on the Net. It's about time they were replaced. Of course, I know we've already given you a ridiculous number of requests, so I won't bug you too much. Thanks. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:41, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

==Sergio Leone Trilogy==
I finished the Leone Trilogy yesterday and I was wondering if you could I.D. the machine gun used in ''[[A Fistful of Dollars]]'', someone said it was a fake but wasn't very specific. I figured if it was some type of fake movie gun, you'd know best.

:Also, excellent Single Action Army picture, that's a beautiful gun. Care to tell me a little about the one you uploaded? Thanks. -GM

P.S. Check out [[Last Man Standing]], I just got that done.

Good job on the Luger P08, it looks great. I don't think the finishes are a big deal, to tell you the truth, I don't even notice it. And it's cool that it was used in Hogan's Heroes, because not only is it a special gun, but someone's destined to make a Hogan's Heroes page eventually, and it will be of a great use when someone does. Keep up the great work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 01:13, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

::Speaking of LMS, his two .45s uniquely have diamond grips and I was wondering if you could take a special picture of A1s with diamond grips. I made a rough draft picture of what I had in mind.
[[Image:CrossM1911A1s-w-diamondgrips-roughdraft.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Cross placed, fitted with diamond grips.]]
Let me know what you can do. -GM

==re: Taurus 85 & G3==

Haha...whoops, you're right. I keep forgetting, but...when you upload a new version of an existing image, IMFDB doesn't instantly replace it. Instead, the old image goes fuzzy for a period of time (which seems to vary from hours to days; no clue why) before the new image replaces it. I saw your Taurus Mod 85 pic when it was in this fuzzy "transitional" phase and the thought slipped my mind that this happens. The filter from my brain to my mouth (or rather, my keyboard) doesn't work sometimes, I guess.

As far as the G3 page goes, it is unfortunate. One thing I find annoying about Wikis is that there's apparently no way to confine an image to a particular section of a page when you use the "align" code, so when we follow page conventions and force an image to shift left, right, or center, it totally fucks up the formatting if the images are bigger than the text (which is going to be common for guns that don't have very many movie appearances listed). The only thing you can do is just add lots of space in between each section manually so that the images fit into the section.

But I do agree with you on one thing...why do we need a regular sporter SR9 with the thumbhole stock? Have you seen a movie with one? Do you or any of your fellow armorers have any in stock? Better yet, is there any movie or TV show that would NEED some heavily neutered civilian version of a G3? I kinda doubt it, so I would say it doesn't make sense to include the image. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 06:18, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

:Well, I ditched the other two SR9 pics. Til we get movies with them (and I know I haven't heard of any yet), no point in having them on there.

:Nice that you found those long-barreled AK folders. I'm pretty sure that Vollmer had at least one at sale (years ago, back when their sales site was still online), but they are quite rare in this country indeed. As far as the pics from World Guns go...it's a mix, just like here. Some of them are pics that the site's editors took themselves, others are jacked from other sites, and some are scanned from books or gun rags. I've usually just used them because (before us), they were one of the most comprehensive gun sites on the net. But I definitely think that because of you, IMFDB now has not only good movie gun images, but some of the best gun images, PERIOD.

:Good luck on your current projects, and don't let those idiot Obama-supporting actors fuck up any more of your guns. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:06, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

==The special page==

Remember how a while ago I asked you if I could try making a page that explained to new IMFDB users just how significant it was that we have a movie armorer who photographs his company's guns for us? Well, I finally got around to trying it out. Here it is:

[[MoviePropMaster2008: IMFDB's Own Armorer]]

The title is kinda cheesy, I admit, but it was the best I could think of. The other issue is that I'm not always sure my facts are straight, so if you want to correct anything, go right ahead. And I realize this might be kind of a lame idea - but I just feel it's important for everyone to understand how important your work is to this site. What do you think? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:32, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

:Oh, trust, I fully understand what you mean about wanting to remain anonymous. Even if you weren't a pro-RKBAer working in an industry that is hostile to gun ownership (and non-liberals in general), it would still be perfectly reasonable to want to remain anonymous. When you're a professional of any sort, working in any industry, you don't want to do post something on a web site under your own name that could get you in trouble. As far as the page goes, however, I don't think it should be too big a deal for your anonymity as long as you avoid giving us your name. It's mostly just a way for us to brag that we have someone who can provide us with such great pictures, and to make sure that our new users understand the significance of those pictures. :-) But if you really are uncomfortable with it, that's fine, too...I can ditch it. It took all of 15 minutes to make.

:BTW, I dunno if you're OK telling me this or not (if not I understand), but are you a member of the American Entertainment Armorers' Association? I remember Dan Shea announcing its creation on a forum I used to visit, a couple years ago now. I understand that it was created specifically to address the threat from Cali's gun laws upon your businesses? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:35, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

==More SAAs==
Your Colt Peacemakers are great, my western pages greatly need them. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Be sure to check out [[Hellboy II: The Golden Army]], I just finished it. -GM

==Image use on WIkipedia?==
Hi, I am an editor on the English Wikipedia. I came across this great site as it completes the media appearances lacking in our firearms pages. You've got some fantastic images of some obscure equipment in the idea configuration - that is, clear background and side profile shots. These would really help us illustrate some of our pages that are lacking in media content. Would you be kind enough to allow us to use these images on Wikipedia? We could upload them under an attribution license and provide a link to this Wiki in return. Kind regards, Koalorka from the WP:Firearms teams. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.219.131|99.232.219.131]] 12:09, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

:Any chance of obtaining a response? I can be reached at koalora at rogers.com. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.219.131|99.232.219.131]] 12:09, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

::If you are hesitant or have any further questions regarding licensing, feel free to ask. Wikipedia is by principle an entirely non-profit organization as you are probably aware and we could not compensate you financially for the images. I do recognize that there was some considerable effort involved in collecting some of these rare specimens (still salivating over the CETME Ameli) and then setting up a studio with professional lighting, hardware etc. What we can offer to do is attribute you properly and generate additional traffic and awareness for this site and any other organization you specify (even the armory/studio that owns the firearms). If you agreed to have your images uploaded to our server, every one of them would be licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 Unported license that requires the copyright holder to be properly credited every time the image is displayed, in either modified or unmodified form. The license does not impair or restrict your moral rights. Here is the [http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/ license description]. We can do a "test" image so to speak, upload an individual image to see if that satifies your expectations.

:In other words, don't make me beg.. :D At least the Ameli, pretty please.

:Regards.
:: To Koaloarka, I appreciate your kind words and gracious offer. As you can probably tell, I've been thinking about the offer. I'm obviously not jumping at the opportunity or else I would have communicated much earlier than now. I must assess what I've been trying to do for the last six months. Since I joined IMFDB I've been working extraordinarily hard to provide the site with exclusive gun images that are available nowhere else. Everyone here knows the hard work, time and $$ spent on trying to get the best quality images of the weapons available anywhere (on the net). And obviously I do it for the benefit of IMFDB. I'm torn by the upside of increased awareness to the site, but I am also not eagerly anticipating the inevitable diluting of the 'exclusivity' of IMFDB's images when they start showing up everywhere on the web.

:: Some background to my thinking - I would not have done the images for a simple firearms site. I probably would not have worked so hard for six months to get these types of images for a gun wiki. IMFDB's unique focus is that it mixes weapons and CINEMA, especially movie trivia and factoids which are not part of the 'regular gun owner's lexicon. '''That is the field I'm in''', and I welcomed the idea of a place where I can contribute my experience and information (mostly 'lost' on the 'regular firearms crowd'). Many of my images are hybrid guns (M16a2s with A1 features or vice versa), or some of custom guns made for the movies (Custom Type 84s or AMD-65s), or weird combinations of uppers and lowers (like the M16 variants, or the 2 toned handguns,etc). which are not factory standards nor are they historically accurate. I remember once, when a firearms historian and enthusiast looked at some of my handguns (SIG P226s and USPs) and was wondering what was wrong with my barrels. He didn't fathom nor appreciate the fact that these were REAL movie guns. He was just disdainful that they were 'ruined' because of the customization needed for blank firing in movies. Anyway, I was toying with the possibility of a limit release of images with a specific watermark or copyright. I was thinking of using similar but not identical images (but still identifying IMFDB.org as the source of the image) with a translucent copyright logo, but that would take some time. But I have not decided yet and I hope you understand my reluctance at this time. I've only been doing this for six months and I don't think I'm ready right now to 'give away' the work I've done when I'm not complete updating the gun images for IMFDB. Perhaps when I've stopped or retired from getting gun pics for IMFDB ....
::''Now there are some sites who already have MY permission to use some MY images, but each one of those entities provided weapons to be photographed, so they helped me personally with the photography itself. (some FFLs, a few collector friends, other armorers, etc.) So you might see a recognizable shot somewhere else, but they will be watermarked and copyrighted as license granted to that entity.

::Anyway I'm still thinking about it. Give me a little time. I am also conferring with other Administrators of IMFDB and I welcome their input. Ultimately, I will have to make some sort of decision (as the original photographer and copyright holder) as to where I wish to release the rights. Hope that helps.

::[[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 02:31, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

:::I agree with what you say about how many people in the gun-owning community aren't going to appreciate what these guns are if they see them on any random gun site. Like, who the hell is going to understand that in Hollywood, HK91s are converted to look like SR9s, or AR15 SP1 carbines converted to look like XM177s? However, one thing I think you should consider is that some of the guns you've photographed are hard to find pictures of, and your pictures represent not only good "movie gun" images, but good gun images, period. The Type 84 pics you've taken are a very good example, because like I said earlier, good pics of the Type 84 seem extraordinarily hard to come by. The new FG42 image is also one that I think can be considered particularly special.

:::I would say that at the very least, you should consider it on a case-by-case basis; whether the gun image you have stands as both an important gun image as well as an important "movie gun" image. But ultimately, these are your images, so the decision is yours. Take my opinion only for what it's worth. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:50, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

::::I was not asking for a blanket-release of your work into the public domain or any such thing, just a few individual photographs of authentic and obscure and unmodified firearms, i.e. the CETME Ameli, FG42. Cheers. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 18:11, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

:::::I KNEW that. But work on Wikipedia WILL be jacked and seen all over the web. And the more removed the image is from the original source (here) the harder it is to force people to remove pirated images on their own sites. I fully intend to slam pirates who steal my images (which is my right), but it's harder when they can say'' "Oh I got it from Wikipedia, who are you? What authority do YOU have to tell me not to use a stolen pic?"'' It might be helpful to make a list of what you are interested in. I am considering creating an alternate image of the same gun with watermarks and attributions for 3rd parties (though it's not something I was planning to do at this time). Let me know your list and we can discuss it. thanks [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 18:21, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

::::::The attribution license is for that purpose specifically, if you are not properly attributed when the image is displayed, that person has violated your rights to the image and is liable for prosecution under international or US copyright laws. Keep in mind that those willing to pirate your images will do so whether or not you agree with it, this will happen at a higher frequency once your sites gains in popularity; by letting Wikipedia use your images, your images will proliferate the net with the proper license, exposing your work and Imfdb.org to the mainstream. Right now, we can do just one image to determine if you'd be satisfied with the end result; how about the Ameli? The CETME Ameli page does not receive too many hits due to the scarcity of the gun. Kind regards. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 19:28, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

::Any progress here? You asked for a list, we would just like the AMELI at this time. Regards. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.219.131|99.232.219.131]] 17:21, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

==Smiths==

Thanks so much for the Smiths, but especially the Model 29! All the ones on the page before now were 629s, and I figured we needed an original blued M29. In fact, it seems almost like blasphemy that this is exactly what Dirty Harry used and we haven't had the right gun until tonight. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 06:04, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

:Oh, yeah, forgot about that other S&W 29, hehe. But still, an MPM2008 photo of a Smith is always preferable to some random image from Google. And to answer your question - yes, you should feel free to replace old pictures jacked from Google with yours. There's no reason why anyone should complain, because...

:*(A.) Your pictures are always vastly superior to the old ones
:*(B.) It takes no effort to copy an image off the web, whereas taking your own pics is a time-consuming process (especially the way you do it)
:*(C.) You're an administrator now, so you have the final word anyway.

:As far as the other Wiki guy's offer goes, I agree that you should only do it if you can mark the images as your own first, or if they give you proper credit (and link to this site, guaranteeing us more hits :). Come to think of it, it might not be a bad idea to do that with ALL of your gun images from now on, just to make sure that we mark them definitively as ours. But although I like being able to think of your gun images as exclusively IMFDB's, not so sure I like the idea of clamping down on other users. I mean, let's face it, we'd look like hypocrites because many of the images on IMFDB are still jacked from other sites (though this will change eventually, of course). World Guns would probably throw a fit if they saw this site. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:08, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

:Well, I suppose you're right...if World Guns did ask us to remove all of the images we've used without permission, I would immediately comply with their request. However, you gotta admit that it's still going to be kind of flattering if people decide that IMFDB is a great source of gun images (not just "movie gun" images) and want to use our pics.

:BTW, have you talked to any of the other armorers about IMFDB? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:04, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

==Predator==
I never knew they tend to used A1 muzzle breaks but it does make sense, A1 star flashes look cool (I'm still in awe over the shot when the muzzle flash is out 2ft in each direction)

I hope you don't mind that I edited your pictures together, I just used what I had. I'll just leave them on the page like that until you take some SP1 pics. Thanks. More to come on the Predator page. -GM

Same film different subject. Do you know who mounted the Shotgun under Billy's Rifle. It looks like a Ciener Ultimate only it uses a Mossberg 500 and it's several years before Jane's says such systems came out. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 08:31, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

==Hollow Point==
[[Image:Type84HybridRifle.jpg]]

Thanks for the Type 84S specific to the [[Hollow Point]] page. I really apprieciate it. Was the gun actually used in the movie or do you mean it is made to look the same? -GM

==The Mask==
I have it on my list, so I'll get it done eventually. -GM

Alienqueen11 here, sorry if I got in the way when you were uploading gun images when I was uploading those Resident Evil screenshots. --[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 00:38, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

==Thanks for the new guns==

I really like those new SIGs you uploaded (just ditched the old P220R image and replaced it with yours on all pages), as well as the Type 84 folder and the Madsen M50 (the movie ''[[City of God]]'' features those, so we gotta get that image on that page whenever someone screencaps it).

Also, can you by chance tell me what kind of shotgun this is (from my page for ''[[The Crow]]''):

[[Image:Vlcsnap-269025.png|thumb|none|500px|]]

Who makes that bullpup stock? I think it's a Muzzelite, but I dunno, and a Google search seems to turn up negative for info or images on this gun. I know I've seen it in at least a couple of action movies from the 1990s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:07, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

:Ah, OK, thanks for clarifying the type of gun used to kill Lee. I figured it was the 629 that killed him because I have heard from various articles that the gun was definitely a .44 Magnum, and the character of Funboy uses the 629 throughout the movie. Any idea why they switched to another gun for that one scene? Seems like it would have been identifiable as a continuity error had the scene been finished and Lee had not been killed.

:And don't worry; I do fully appreciate (have heard it many times) that the entire reason that the accident happened was because the production sent the armorer home in order to save money. And I have heard it was the fault of some clueless property assistant(s) who were responsible for the fuck-up that got Lee killed.

:Also, I appreciate the ID on Grange's shotgun. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:13, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

==Re:Dibbs==
I didn't think of it that way but I completely understand what you mean. I'll change the word. Dibbs is kind of declaring it is mine, simply saying that a movie is on my to-do list changes it sort of. The only movies I would really want to declare "dibbs" on are the ones I ordered on DVD, even when I own them on VHS already, just so I can screencap them. I'll remove my dibbs messages and just let people know I plan to do it, and if no one else plans to do it, I would like to. "Dibbs" was simply a poor choice of words. It's not like I'm locking the page from someone else to work on though. When Orca1 9904 asked to do [[Tears of the Sun]], I let him. (AQ11 even cut off the widescreen bars now). When you asked to do Rambo III, I let you. (P.S. Let me know if you need me to finish that.) I agree tho, it was a dumb idea.
P.S. I screencapped Iron Man, sorry. -GM

== One more request ==

Hey MPM2008, when I asked for the Beretta 92FS Inox, I happened to notice GM45 asked for a reversed Two Tone Beretta 92FS for use on the [[Sin City]]. If you happen to get ahold of them, I would like to know if you can combine them the factory style way as well and photograph it if you can, because a Beretta like that would be useful for pages such as [[Hostage (2005)]]. Here's a screenshot of the gun in the movie:

[[Image:HostageBerettatutone-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
[[Image:HostageBerettatutone-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

Thanks in advance.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 01:42, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

That's an awesome shot as always, aAnd you're right that has to be the best shot of the gun on the entire internet. I like it the way it is, and excellent work on your most recent images too, I really like the M16A4. Also, are you still considering the Wikipedia user's offer?--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 01:53, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

==AK-104==
It looks great. The magazine is no big deal. Even with that magazine, you still have the only well-taken AK-104 on the net. Don't worry about fixing it right away, it looks awesome even with the wrong mag. One thing though. You never know when one day a movie could have an AK-104 with a waffle mag so don't just cover over it if you take a new pic. You replaced the MAC-10 with the after market mag with the newer image, but you never know when one could be seen using one. Just a pointer. I'm almost done with [[Hot Fuzz]], then I'm gonna do [[Tropic Thunder]], [[Crank]], [[Shawshank Redemption]], and [[The Dirty Dozen]]. Should have them all done by the end of the month. (With deer season, my job to fix guns has been pulling me away. Plus, I hunt myself on occasion.) Keep up the good work. -GM

:If I use the word "sexy" to describe a gun picture, what does that say about me? LOL.

:I like it. And I agree with Alienqueen; I wouldn't worry too much about the mag. However, I must say that I'm a little more excited about some of the other pics you uploaded while I was at work today...thanks so much for re-doing that Type 56-1 picture for the ''[[Goldeneye]]'' page with the AK-74 muzzle break and plastic mag, and I also really appreciate you getting the Benelli M1 Super 90 (oddly enough, we don't have a page for that gun, for whatever reason). And the new XM177 pic is something we REALLY needed; time to ditch that old XM177 picture we've been using to represent "Colt Commandos" in movies (I think it's actually a Tokyo Marui airsoft replica, anyway).

:But...for now, I must do more GRE studying and personal statements for grad school apps. Sadly, I'm getting way too busy to make regular contributions these days, but real life keeps calling. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:44, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

:I wouldn't worry too much about the stock, because if you notice every image you upload always finds a use. There's no telling if a movie will come up with an AK 104 in the same configuration, plus if it's a movie gun, the movie it was used in will have to come up eventually. But if you want to upload a new one, that's entirely up to you.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:50, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

:So finishes can cause that much trouble when combining parts? Makes you wonder how they do it because I see soo many Berettas in wierd configurations in movies, I remember seeing a Beretta 92FS Inox with a black barrel in Kiss of The Dragon. And also, how rare is it to see a two tone Beretta 92FS? Because even if you search it on Google, there aren't many images of one.

And about the FG421, that is one wierd looking gun, is it German made? Because it resembles the MG42's from [[Saving Private Ryan]] a little bit, but I must say the grip dosen't look too comfortable with the way it's positioned. But another great image none the less.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 04:18, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

==FG-42==
Nice piece. It must be rare, I don't ever see them in my typical order books like Southern Ohio Guns or any other vintage firearms catalogs. Like AQ said, I think the grip is positioned ackwardly and seems uncomfortable. Like all the other cool German guns, I can't own it sadly. I don't see why they would make it a paratrooper gun, way too big. Nice pic. Glad you didn't ignore it in the back. -GM

==No Problem==
You're welcome. Despite not being such a great movie, it was quite interesting gun-wise :))

==Taps and Mr. & Mrs. Smith==
I don't own Tapps and have never seen it but I own the Extended Cut of Mr. & Mrs. Smith, which includes a scene with a Mini-gun and cool other things. It is on my list and once my to-do list pile is reduced, I'll get on it. Right now I'm working on Tropic Thunder and The Shawshank Redemption. -GM

==The FG42==

Damn, that thing is beautiful! Reminds me why one can never fail to give the Nazis points for ingenuity when it came to weapons. I seriously want one, along with a Sturmgewehr. Good news though! Have you heard about this? http://www.ssd-weapon.com/engl_web/produkte_en/fg42_en/fg42_en.htm Apparently, they've got civvie reproductions of these guns now! Dunno if/when they'll get imported/manufactured in the States. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:57, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

:Your choice, I guess. Are they being imported to the states yet, though? The site doesn't list a U.S. distributor, and I haven't seen any for sale yet. But yeah, it would be cool to have a picture of a nice new FG42, plus you can get the 2nd version which you told Alienqueen you didn't have.

:BTW, speaking of rare German weapons, do you have access to a Sturmgewehr (either -42 or -44)? There aren't too many movies with them that I'm aware of (besides ''[[Escape to Athena]]''), but they do appear in lots of WWII-themed games. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:51, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

==Remington 870==
Closest thing I can find is this bird gun in [[The Unit]].
[[Image:Unit-Mack'sshotty2.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

:I read your story on Brandon Lee, that's tragic. I sometimes make dummy bullets and I ''always'' fire the primers before I reload the bullet. Your supposed to use super glue to make sure the round stays in the brass. Then you go to a wire wheel and polish the brass and get rid of any super glue that seeped out. I wonder why they never made "dud" primers that could look live but not go "bang" when the hammer falls on them. I first made dummy rounds with 8mm rounds for my Kar98k, but I didn't super-glue them in, and eventually they all fell into the shells and got stuck. It sucked. I'm sick with something bad and Tropic Thunder is gonna have to wait because I feel like crap. Have a good day. -GM
==Re:Morita==
Thanks, I'm feeling a little better. I was filling out some of the fictional firearms pages and I figured of all of them, you'd like the Morita page since I remembered you said you owned one. I deleted my page because yours came out better than mine. You know more about the movie any way, I have yet to see it fully and last time I saw it was too long ago to remember. -GM
:Nice SMLE pic! And I forgot to mention, the Colt Navy is beautiful. -GM

==Bankok Dangerous==
You made the page look much better now. Your shots are ''far'' clearer than mine. Thanks. -GM

==Tropic Thunder==
A Sporter II pic would be much apprieciated. To test the whole blank safety distance, I tested various blank calibers to a piece of paper and found 10 yards to be the ''dead zone''. Since I'm trying to make a movie with a few friends of mine (maybe something to show a film school), I'm going to use some blanks and want to know my limits. Obviously, since I'm the only one with true experiance and weapons intelligence, I'll be handling the blanks, post-production edits on my computer will fill the rest. I'll try my best to make them look like they know what their doing with guns, but they are pretty dumb. If you have any movie making tips, please let me know.
:P.S. I plan to make it a DVD and might even screencap it as a section on my profile. -GM

==Re:590==
Go for it, fine by me. Your pics are always better than what we find on google. -GM

==The new Cobray M11 picture==

The new Cobray M11/9 picture looks really cool! Thanks so much for that! Also, do you think it's appropriate to classify the M11/9 under the MAC-10 page? I have been thinking about giving that guns its own page for a while now. What do you think? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 17:02, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

:First of all, I completely missed the MAC-11. I've just been getting busier and busier (currently at work - on a Saturday! - indexing prior art PDF files now), and you upload so many images that I've missed a few here and there. I did like the SG550, though, and the the AMD-65 pics were also something nice (it's cool that you found the same style BFA as the Israelis). But that Type 56 is just...ugh, who the hell treats a nice gun that way? (in Africa or Afghanistan, sure, but not here in the states!) It's odd because I had no clue that the Type 56 was imported to the U.S. back when Uncommon Valor was filmed (82-83). I remember hearing it wasn't until 1984 that they reached these shores.

:As far as the Cobray page goes, I know what you mean about the mistake, but then again, we have the [[Taurus PT92]] page separate from the Beretta 92 page even though the PT92 is commonly mistaken for the 92F. The best thing to do would put a note at the top of the page suggesting people look at the Cobray page just in case.

:Appreciate the effort on the Thompson pics...like I said, we REALLY need some good ones. I hate the fact that someone put an Auto-Ordnance semi-auto Thompson clone with a long barrel to represent an "M1921". Also, from now on, whenever you upload pictures, please do the same thing you did with the Cobray; just upload them as a new version over the old ones. The way, we don't have to go back and replace the old image with your new image on every single page that has the old one. And like I said before, nobody should mind if you get rid of the old images, because yours are always better and you're an admin anyway. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 21:55, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

::Yeah, it makes sense, what you're saying. Were the Type 56s from ''[[Deer Hunter]]'' also the same as the ones from ''[[Uncommon Valor]]''? I mean, let's face it...you don't see that many Chinese AKs (or AK-type firearms, period) in American movies before about the mid-80s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 22:26, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

==That Type 56==
Holy shit, who handled that gun to make it that FUBAR?! One of my main jobs in my dad's shop is to clean up guns, so I understand how horrible that is. Mail it to me, I'll clean it up. -GM

Woah, that thing looks like it's 70 years old with every thing it been through. What did they do to it? I'll give it credit for one thing, that's a very good example of how durable and rugged an AK type assault rifle can be, especially with that kind of treatment.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:25, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

==Couple of questions regarding Walther pistols==

1) Has the current-generation P99 been converted or modified into a movie blank-firing gun that you know of? I ask because I see on the back cover of one of Wesley Snipes' DTV movies that he's holding one that appears to be a new-model P99, but it also looks like they took an UMAREX airsoft model and painted the tip black. Insight?

2) Word on a couple of forums is that the Walther PPS makes an appearance in Quantum of Solace, wielded by Olga Kurylenko. If possible, could you confirm? --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 02:41, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

::I don't know, but I will keep it in mind when I ask around. MPM2008

==Request==

[[User:Revolver|Revolver]] here
Just curious, could you get a good picture of the M4s used by the Air force in Iron Man? The ones with the ISM-V Scopes?
Possibly other pictures from the movie? Like the G36Ks and G36Cs?
::I'll add it to the gigantic list of things to do. best regards. MPM2008

==.577 Rifle==
That would be awesome. Do you think you could one pic before he mounts a scope and one when he does? You'd have the best picture of such a rifle on the internet. [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]] 00:42, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

== Another Request ==

I was wondering, would it be possible for you to get your hands on a stainless steel [[Jericho 941]]? There's at least a couple pages here such as ''[[The Kill Point]]'' and ''[[Transporter 2]]'' that could benefit from it. I'm also still waiting for a 1st-gen [[Glock#Glock 19|Glock 19]] (or whichever version of the 19 it is that doesn't have rails on the frame). Thanks in advance. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 21:29, 25 November 2008 (UTC)Orca1_9904
:I didn't know it was an order, rather than a request (re the Glock) and I don't have a 2nd gen of my own or I would have posted it already. I have to track down someone with one and take the time to do the photoshoot, a real hassle BTW. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 23:25, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

== About Png ==
Hi, for some strange reason VLC does not catches screenshots in jpg, only in png. In the future I will convert them in jpg before uploading. [[User:Fimvit|Fimvit]]

==Re: Goldeneye==

That's fine. In all honesty, it's a bad habit that I'm afraid I have, and I seem to be influencing other forum members to do it even though it does ruin the "encyclopedic" format of the pages, as you've said. I'll try to remember in the future; bad habits die hard for me. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:31, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

== Re: ==

I know, I had already changed the settings. Regardless, it takes the snapshots in png. Can't figure out why...
Kind regards [[User:Fimvit|Fimvit]]

==Crank==
Hahahahahahaha, Blu-ray. I can't afford half a Blu-ray player. I'm still using DVDs, I guess this one just looks a little better. I've noticed some people use png files now, but they take too long to load and if you click on the image, it's just as clear as a jpg, so that's what I use. Thanks. Sorry I'm taking so long with it, I keep getting sidetracked. Go check out AQ11's profile talk and see my list of movies in my pile. Ugh. It's gonna be a long month. -GM

==Thanks==

Thanks so much for the new images (i.e. the USAS-12), and thanks for getting the Benelli shotgun page in order. It really needed an overall badly, and it's crazy that we never even had an entry anywhere for the M1 series before now. Also, nice work on ''[[Ultraviolet]]''; I've had that DVD in my collection for a while, but, like a lot of movies, simply never got around to capping it. No matter; yours are better than mine would have been.

Hope you've had a great Thanksgiving! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:48, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

:Yeah, I agree, the Molotov cocktail doesn't need a page. This is the Internet Movie ''Firearms'' Database, not the Internet Movie ''Weapons'' Database. Also, dunno if you saw, but some anonymous user tried to delete your user page, and has thus been nuked. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 22:14, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

::Oh, yeah, almost forgot...I'm not really sure how to see page views besides going to "Special Pages" (under Toolbox on the left side) and there's a "Popular pages" section, but that's not quite what you need... -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:41, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

==Re: Molotovs==
I understand what you mean fully but many pages link to the Molotov page and it's one of those mistakes that kind of has to be there now. I'm making [[The Whole Nine Yards]] as we speak and that had a molotov. I don't think it is a weapon deserving a spot but too many pages already have it and it's just easier if it is there. [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]] 22:58, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

==Question about the SIGs from Double Team==

First of all, nice job so far on the ''[[Double Team]]'' page, even though it's not yet complete.

Anyway, I was looking at this picture:

[[Image:DoubleTeam-Gun-WallA.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

What type of laser controls are those on the grip of the SIGs? I ask because I've seen the same setup on a SIG P228 that Denzel Washington uses in the movie ''[[Virtuosity]]'', and I was wondering who makes it. Or was it something done just for both movies? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:07, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

==The Thompsons==

YES! They're awesome. Thanks so much...we ''really'' needed some good pics of Thompson SMGs. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:12, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

== Response (Sorry for being late) ==

Thanks for wishing me a Happy Thanksgiving, I hope you had a great one as well. As for improvised weapons, I agree with you, Propane tanks even though they were made to be bombs shouldn't be listed as weapons. But I agree the molotov should stay since it's already a page for it and it's on quite a few pages. Also good work on Starship Troopers, the page looks great, and the Thompson pictures are great as well. Keep up the good work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 03:05, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

==Thompson==
Sounds good to me, we need some Thompsons. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]] 21:22, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

:Please, in the future, never hesitate to replace the old pics with yours. Yours are always better, plus when you just upload over the old ones, we don't have to replace the gun pics on each movie/TV/video game page individually. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:49, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

== Good Job ==

Good job on replacing all the [[Thompson]]s, the new pictures look great. Also, are you still going to upload an M16A3? And also did some of the M16 type guns you uploaded come from Iraq? I mean like the M16A4, and the M4A1 with the scope and RIS Foregrip.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:02, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

==Taegukgi==
I can barely stand anime let alone flash animation shorts. I think it disrespects the hard work we do to screencap movies (and you great efforts to make sure we have images galore) and we have a page for some little short? I don't see why someone would watch it and wonder "Would someone like to know what guns are used in this?" Maybe if someone froze and capped the short it MIGHT be acceptable.

P.S I've been working on [[Wanted]] for 2 days, there are so many guns and continuity errors (guns switch to others in seconds), it is driving me crazy. While most I can figure out, some user input such as your own would be much apprieciated. I feel like I'm lying to the people who read my message at the top of the page that says "I'll have it done today" and can't because I busy. I hope they all understand. I'll make sure I give them the excellent page they've been waiting for (and get rid of the abismal bootleg images). - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

:I think at the very least, a re-direct is in order. The flash animation should be something like "Taegukgi (Flash Animation)". But personally, I'm really kinda skeptical of including stuff that's not professional media. Next thing we know, any kid who makes action movies with his friends and their airsoft guns is gonna try and make an IMFDB page. This is an even bigger problem with mods for first-person shooter games, because there are lots of user-made mods on the 'Net.

:That reminds me...when I get done with the GRE, I need to get the FAQ done that I've been meaning to do. Once I draft it, I would like all the Admins on here to take a look, and we should all agree on particular terms. In it, I will specify rules on stuff like including Flash Animation. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:19, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

::Agreed. I have already warned several users that I will not allow images from bootleg copies of movies not out on DVD to be posted on IMFDB, but I missed ''[[Tunnel Rats]]'' because I had no idea what it was or when it was coming out. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 21:25, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

::I also think Anime is ok because it is something licienced, and more official. It's like saying Anime is to films and TV shows is to Flash and Fan made shorts with their home cameras and posted on youtube. I mean, should we start looking up shorts that people film themselves and then upload on Youtube? I don't think so. It's annoying, kinda insulting and a waste of time at the same time to even think of it. I do some of the Anime because I believe how they draw the weapons make them worthy of mention and images worth showing to see how real they drew them. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

== Care to take a look at my RE:E movie page? ==

Since no one did this page since the DVD release, I decided to do so. I need some check ups cause I always have a hard time telling Taurus from Beretta. Also see if you can ID the Cobray M11 for me if it is one. The previous guy posted up and even I thought it was an MP7 until I looked closer. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

*''[[Resident Evil: Extinction]]''

== I can't be nice anymore ==

Someone has to draw the line. This guy Don whatever. He just posted a NEW flash animation on this site. What the hell? I've see the pics or trash that resembles pictures of guns and he thinks those are what they are? Is he high or some punk kid that thinks it's so cool that it deserves to be on this site. Sift Head and that other flash animation thing, Taegukgi. Those are pardon my language, pieces of shit that are NOT worthy of this place that some of us hold with respect. Yeah, they seem entertaining, but if we decide to let something this slide, then whose to stop from putting other flash animations that have "drawings" of guns on them because "Oh they have guns, so therefore they should be on this site". I want to remove it, but I like a majority vote instead of me acting pissed of. I'm asking everyone else their thoughts. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:05, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

== My airsoft ==

So what do you think of my airsoft? I know a lot of people have a bad idea about what airsoft is, so what do you think? I'm a guy who likes to show off sometimes, that's one reason why I ask since I've updated pictures on my page, but more to ask what others think, particularly people who are more into firearms. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:34, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

:Just the same, I know you can tell my ONE Glock is real over the others listed that aren't. I don't go to the range as often as I want. Bullets are expensive and so is renting time on the range closest to me. I only play with Airsoft because it's the only time where I get to shoot people and not feel the slightest remorse whatsoever. I'm killing them in a manner of speaking. I have ran into the types of guys that only knows Airsoft brand names. I on the other hand am really interested in the real life counter parts that inspires Airsoft, this is where I found out so much info on real guns...but I still have trouble telling Berettas from Taurus and between shotguns sometimes. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 10:23, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

== FN FAL ==

Could take a picture of an FN-FAL?[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 00:04, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

==Re:Predator==
Thanks, it wasn't on my list but I saw the page was incomplete so I made time for it. Sorry I edited your pictures, but it looks better than an empty spot for now.

Also, excellent job with the Uzi pic, it looks great. I too never liked that Uzi pic before. I just finished screencapping [[Unforgiven]] so be sure to check that out. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Winchester 1866 "Yellow Boy"==
Do you think you could check your armory for a [[Winchester 1866 "Yellow Boy"]] rifle? Also, a lot of the ones in films are used as Henry rifles by removing the forend, the advantage being the lack of a spring follower pinching the shooter's hand. So if you do find a Yellow Boy, could you remove the forend and snap a shot of that as well? Thanks. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== H&K USP and H&K MK 23 ==

Could you replace the pictures of the H&K USP .45 and the H&K MK23 with better images. Thanks.

==Type 84 Target/Match==

So you finally got to take pictures of them. Nice! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:19, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

And thanks for the new .308 Valmet. Those appear in lots of movies, so I can use it on my ''[[Hard Target]]'' and ''[[The Negotiator]]'' pages.

==The HK94/MP5 conversion==

Thank you so much for this! I wanted it as much as GM did. Where did you find it? And you've actually confirmed already that it's one of the ''[[Air Force One]]'' MP5s? -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:38, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

:Nah, of course that doesn't ruin it. If it's a movie gun, and it's the same type of conversion seen in those action movies from the 1980s and 90s, it's fine by me. It's the same ''type'', and that's more than enough for us. As far as Jedi Mind Powers, yeah, I guess I got something like that. Actually, I've just been glued to Facebook extending Christmas wishes to people most of today, and I check IMFDB pretty regularly. Also was working on ''[[24: Redemption]]'' earlier today.

:As far as your watermarking idea goes, I encourage it. However, there may be some way to actually disable right clicking on just your images so people can't save them to their HDs and re-post them later. Or, there may be a way of embedding copyrights into them. Not sure. But we'll figure out something. Asking Bunni about this would be the way to go, I think.

:Hope you've had a great Christmas. Over here on the East Coast, I've only got 1 hr. left before it ends, but you're in Cali, so I guess you still get a few hours left to enjoy today. And thanks for all the wonderful Christmas presents you've given IMFDB (again, I appreciate the HK94, the M78, and the long-barreled Type 84s). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:08, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

:The HK94 is great, I felt really bad chopping your pictures. Now I can get rid of them. And I read about your water marking idea. You should put one of your own personal insignias and maybe an imfdb logo. I hope you had a happy holiday. I got lots of movies to screencap including [[The Great Escape]]. I'm going to buy Romeo + Juliet and a few other gun movies with the money I got as well. I'm stilling working on Starsky and Hutch right now though. Great work with Stripes btw, I loved that movie. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Terminator 2 page==
What do you think of the T2 page? Did I over do it on the "fun facts"? As far as the guns go, did I get my info right? Colt Commandos are kind of hard to ID for me. Hope you have a happy new year. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==re: the images==

First, thanks again for the new images. It's nice to have a USP45 (especially since ''[[Collateral]]'' is one of the more popular pages on here, and Tom Cruise used one in that movie). The FNC is another nice one to have. Did you ever find out if the ''[[Heat]]'' FNCs were chopped-down Sporters with auto sears and M16A1 flash hiders installed, as you suspected?

As far as copyrights go...yes, it was inevitable. I know people have been talking about IMFDB and its images on quite a few gun forums, but I had no clue anybody would have the audacity to take your images and claim them as their own! How has your electronic tagging worked? Any particular software you used? The last time you and I discussed watermarking, I did a quick search for software that might be used. I found this: http://www.filetransit.com/view.php?id=10611 . But if you have a better one, that works, too. I do think you should start getting the images tagged ASAP, because I don't think people should be stealing your stuff. I still do worry somewhat about the "hypocrite" accusations, though, but as long as you keep getting new images up, especially for well-known guns (like ARs, H&Ks, AKs, Glocks, 1911s, etc.), those cries will have little validity.

Anyway, sorry to add to your growing list, but I have another request. I recently did a major re-vamp on the [[Accuracy International Arctic Warfare series]] page, which used to be called just the "L96A1" page. All of the gun images I have on there now are jacked from Remtek's Accuracy International site, which I hated doing, but had no other choice. If you get a chance to photograph ''any'' of the AW rifles in your company's inventory, I'd be most grateful. I'm especially interested in the basic AW and the AWP (because my ''[[Jericho (TV series)|Jericho]]'' page has the latter), but anything else you have in stock would be great. Thanks so much for all your hard work. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:55, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

:The USP-45 looks great. As MT said, it will work well on the Collateral page (especially because I'm going to be adding shots to it later) and the FNC is excellent. Bravo. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::Check IMDB for gun-heavy movies (you won't find specific IMDB forum topics in a Google search). It's very common now to see somebody ask a question about a gun in a movie and some other forum user will point them to us. Last one I recall looking at was "Hitman" where somebody mentioned us. I have also seen people make topics about us on everywhere from the AR-15.com to the 1911 forum to the Firing Line.

::As far as reactions go, sorta mixed. Some people draw attention to our mistakes (and let's face it - we had a LOT, especially before you came in), others say we're neat. However, there don't seem to be a whole lot of folks so far who understand the fact that our images are exclusive to us - which is another reason why your watermarking is such a good idea. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 06:22, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

== Thanks ==

Hey MPM2008, I just wanted to say thanks for all your recent pictures, I really like the USP 45, and the Mossberg 590 Mariner. Thanks to you, Imfdb now has genuine pictues of all three calibers the USP is available in. Keep up the excellent work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 04:01, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

==Screencaps==
I was trying not to do too many shots in Commando since I didn't want to muck up your page but I didn't know your limit was 4. I add so many shots usually because they illustrate different users and different scenes. I don't try to spoil the story but I try to run a path with my images. I was trying to respect your format more than how many screencaps (you'll see I kept the calibers after each description like you do and kept the size image under 600px. I'll admit that LMS had too many shots but don't hold that on me every time I go a little over on my screencapping. Hope you had a happy new year. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Re:Finally Got It!==
The AKMS pistol looks great. Nice work. I just finished ''[[The Mist]]'' and ''[[X-Men Origins: Wolverine]]''. Now I'm gonna work on ''[[Van Helsing]]''. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== Re:Finally Got It! ==

That is one Sweet AK! Is that the actual gun used in the movie? Happy New Year By the way.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 07:01, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

== Re:Finally Got It! ==

It looks awesome! Where did you find? Is it one of Cinema Weaponry's guns, as I suspected? Also, that gun appeared again this past summer in ''[[Pineapple Express]]'', so I added it to that page. But nice job. And Happy New Year! Thanks for the wonderful gifts you have given us! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:33, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

==Rambo==
I noticed you are adding some new shots to Rambo. Do you think you could grab some shots of his knife and bow, since all the othe Rambo pages have them. If you can't, I'll do it eventually. If you can, note that he has two knives. His mini machete that Stallone actually made for the movie and the knife from Rambo II. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==The Auto 9==

You had access to the Auto 9? Wow, I had no idea they had any of them intact after all these years. Of course, ''[[Sin City]]'' features one, but theirs was actually a modified 92FS, not a 93R. How did you get your hands on this thing? Whatever...nice job, and thanks for the awesome pic. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:57, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

== RE: Finally Answering your questions ==

I understand now, thanks for the reply. So you can basically make it look like any kind of M16 if you have the right parts, anyway I can't wait to see your C7. Also, are you uploading more Mossbergs? Because if you want, I can edit the Mossberg 500 with the Heatshield out of the Comparision picture and upload it if want me to:

[[Image:MossbergComparisonMain.jpg‎|thumb|none|600px|]]

But if you prefer to upload your own image, it's okay.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:07, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

About the Mossbergs, So you do want me to edit it out? Anyway, A simple Mossberg 500 with a High Capacity magazine tube to replace this image would be nice:

[[Image:50577.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Mossberg 500 - 12 gauge]]

Also, if you can get an image of a Mossberg 500 with a pistol grip like the one in [[Training Day]] it would be apprecited. Thanks.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:37, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

== Mossberg 500 ==

Hey MPM2008, I cropped and edited the comparison image, and uploaded the Mossberg 500 with the heatshield as a seperate image. I just want to want to know if it's okay before I add it to the page. I wrote that it belongs to you in the image description. What do you think?

[[Image:Mossberg500withHeatShield.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

Thanks, I tried to make it looked as much like one of yours as possible. I'll put on the page now. Feel free to edit or overwrite it whenever you like.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:30, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

==The PT92C==

Thanks for this! I just put it on the ''[[Hard Boiled]]'' page. I'm guessing it might even be the same one seen in ''[[Gates of Hell (1995)|Gates of Hell]]''. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:11, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

==Re: 24 Redemption==

Yep, I understand. I was just giving a reason to everyone why I was. I realize you wouldn't make that mistake. I think the page used to have the USPc simply because it appears on the DVD cover, before I screencapped it and generally gave it a huge overhaul. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:53, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

==Thanks for the new FALs!==

They look great! We can always use more. Only question is...do you by chance have a picture of a 50.61 like the gun from ''Heat''? (or rather, something that looks like one)

The new Mossberg Bullpup also looks good. While I liked the one with the extended magazine tube, I like this new one better, simply because the standard models without the extended tube seem to be the ones which appear in movies most often. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 22:52, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

:Excellent, that 50.61 is perfect. Thanks again! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:24, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

==Trapdoor Springfield==
Thanks for uploading pics of the Trapdoor Springfield rifles, they complete a few of my pages better. I added your pictures to those pages as well.

I've been working on ''[[The Dirty Dozen]]'', have you seen it? I have the guns down but I've only seen the movie twice and don't know all 12 guy's names. If you have, can you help me out with that? - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== RE: Above ==
I am sorry in advance for the language I am about to use but this douche Gunmaster45 completely erased the "Dirty Dozen" page I had ALREADY created. Not a single piece of the page I had created still exists. Admin or not where does this asshole get off destroying a page I worked on???

==Help with ''Transformers'' 1911 pistol ID?==

Hey, I was wondering if you could take a look at the M1911 being used by Captain William Lennox ([[Josh Duhamel]]) in my screenshots of ''[[Transformers]]'' and see if you could ID it? It appears to be a mostly standard M1911 pistol but has a Kimber-style hammer and slight beavertail to the grip safety. Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 08:00, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

: Just took another look at the M1911 page and it almost looks like the [[M1911 pistol series#Colt XSE|Colt XSE]], only the weapon in the film lacked the second set of cocking serrations at the front of the slide. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 05:59, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

==Re:KIN93==

Not really. He has been warned before this, so being a bit frustrated is understandable. And yes, I agree that being released in theaters does not justify using bootlegs, and will certainly still be noticed by any studio police on the prowl. After all, if a movie hasn't been released on DVD yet, there's no way to get screenshots other than bootlegging. And that's why it's unacceptable. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:45, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

== About the images on the Predator 2 page ==

Could i replace them?[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:28, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

==Screencaps==
I've been trying to cut back on the amount but I have my specific way I make my pages. I don't just tell what guns are used. I tell you what guns are used, who uses them, goofs, and fun facts. It makes the page a little larger but I like to think of it as being thorough, more like an article then just a "page". Since we have pages for actors, guns, and films/TV, it is good to show you the info. Sometimes I just can't pass up good shots. If you notice on my Last Man Standing page, the shot is either good, or is telling information. I understand that some of my pages are cluttered, but I've been doing my best to keep them organized. My limit now is usually ten or less images, but I sometimes have to makd exceptions. You are free to remove screencaps I add if you find them to be to many on one of ''your'' pages. You are free to do whatever you want to your own pages, if I add something you find it not needed, you have the right to remove it. I took some of the Mini 14 shots off your ''[[Commando]]'' page for that reason. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
:I was looking at the [[Rambo (2008)]] page and saw some of the changes you made. As always, I was a little sad to see those images you removed go but it is your page and your right. While I understand the removal of the shot of the soldier sent airborne by the .50 caliber (I just thought it was worth noting how dumb "movie logic" can get, but it doesn't have a gun in it, so it is not needed), but why did you remove the shot of Diaz with his FN FAL Carbine? I thought it was a pretty clear shot.

I just added some shots to [[Flashpoint]] and soon I'm going to do [[Get Smart]] and a revamp on the Matrix series (the three films and that awful Animatrix) since I bought the four pack DVD - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== Thanks! ==

Thanks for your comments about my pictures from [[The Sting]]; it's always been one of my favorite movies (despite its use of suppressed revolvers!) Feel free to make the screencaps any size you feel appropriate, I appreciate your comments and interest! - [[User:Speakeasy804|Speakeasy804]]

== A little help ==

I just started my [[Police Story 3: Supercop]] page, but I need some help IDing some of the guns. Can you give me a hand? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:36, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

== Question About Bond Actor Category ==

I was wondering, in the "James Bond Actor" category page, should we limit it to actors who've played James Bond himself, or should we allow 'supporting' actors such as Bond girls (ie, [[Halle Berry]] & [[Honor Blackman]]) and villians (such as [[Robert Carlyle]] & [[Gert Fröbe]])? I'm proposing this to several admins and would like to get some feedback on this before making a decision. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 22:09, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

== Screencap limit? ==

Hey, I was just looking at some of my own pages and seeing that I tend to really really overdo it with screencaps (which makes some pages take way too long to load). I was just wondering if you know what a good suggested amount might be for the same gun? Thanks - [[User:Speakeasy804|Speakeasy804]]
:That sounds like a very good amount for each. I'll try and go through some of my pages (especially ''[[Dillinger (1973)]]'' and ''[[Bonnie and Clyde]]'') and reduce some of the redundancy. I'll keep it in mind from now on. Thanks for getting back to me so soon! - [[User:Speakeasy804|Speakeasy804]]

==Hi!==

Sorry I haven't been on IMFDB in a few days. To answer your question: It's not so much that life is kicking me in the ass, it's mostly that I'm in Washington, DC right now without my laptop. Even though I didn't vote for Obama, I came here for his inauguration, mostly because my Mom is a big fan, and because my boss got us the tickets, and well...you know, I do try to do nice things for Mom, even if I don't like the guy she helped elect President. Plus, I got several days off from work, which is always nice.

I should be back tomorrow, and I'll catch up on everything I've missed for the past few days. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:16, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

==Request==

I really like how you edit those jacked pics and make them look so much better. So, I figured I'd ask...if you get time, do you want to edit this pic of a Gen 1 Glock 19 that we've been using on several pages?

[[Image:Wviewpoint 0430.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 19 9mm]]

If you get around to it, cool, but I realize it might be a while. It could use some removal of white space and shadows, and any other touch-ups you can do. Thanks! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:58, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

:Ah, alright, well, that's fine then. Just figured I'd ask because I thought I remembered you telling Orca that you didn't have a Gen 1 Glock 19 in stock at the time, and I wasn't sure if that had changed recently. And yes, DC was a whole lotta fun...until I had to go to the party where all the people from my firm were celebrating the inauguration. Try being the only Libertarian in a room full of mindless liberal douchebags and it's quite awkward. I loved how they were all clapping and cheering even when Obama was saying things that weren't really all that profound or moving. I don't think it matters how good or bad Obama turns out to be as President...this Stalin-esque cult of personality around the man is something I will never get used to. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:21, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

::It looks WAY better. Only thing is, next time, please just upload a new version over the old one. Thanks for doing this. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:55, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

::By the way, is there really a difference between the T3 AKMS pistol and the ones from Rambo and Pineapple Express? I keep comparing photos and I still can't see the difference in barrel length. The only thing I see is that the Rambo one may or may not have a smooth receiver cover (like the standard Type 56) instead of the AKM-style ribbed. And the True Lies gun is a different one entirely. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 21:03, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

==Rambo (2008==

Just to give you a heads up I changed the info on Rambo M2 Brownings. I talked to Kevin @ ISS about them and he told me they were M2. He was with the show in Thailand working on the 50's. As for the designation AN/M2 was used by the military to discribe the Browning Aircraft gun both 50cal and 30cal unitl 1944 it was changed in September 44 to M2 Aircraft. Thanks. - [[User:Phoenixent|Phoenixent]]

== Thanks ==

Thanks for the new 870, It looks amazing. Even the color of the stock and pump match the gun in the movie, excellent work. So are you working on the ghost ring version right now or still looking for the accessories? Either way, I'm sure it'll be worth the wait. Thanks again, and keep up the great work.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 22:10, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

==M1-C Garand==
Beautiful M1-C, thanks for uploading it. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Browning M2==
That is definately useable! It's great! I was going to ask that you replace the M2 pic but figured you had enough to do already. You might want to take a picture of it on a pintle mount though because that is the most commonly seen .50 in films. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

:I like your picture! If you can do the pintle mount, great, but right now, I'm just happy we have a picture of an M2 at all that we can call our own. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 20:11, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

== Browning M2 ==

Thanks for the M1 Garand info, that picture helped me alot, I now understand how the scope and gun work. As for the M2, That is definitely a usable picture, it's excellent! .50 cals are huge, and I would say that type of format is perfect for them. If you want my photo wishlist again, it is these besides the ghost ring 870:

Beretta 92FS Inox

Two Tone Beretta 92FS (If you're able to combine the parts)

Heckler & Koch Mark 23 ("SOCOM")

And if it's possible, can you obtain a U.S Military issue Beretta M9, I know it's very much the same as a Beretta 92FS, but I heard there were some slight differences, and it would go great with the M9A1 you uploaded before. But if you can't get ahold of it, it's okay. The 870 and the Beretta 92FS Inox are the main things I want. Thanks.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 19:36, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Nevermind the M9 actually, MT2008 is right. We don't need it.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:14, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

==Re: Help on Alex Reid==

Looks like my Jedi Mind Powers are at work again. Creepy, eh?

Alex Reid uses several types of weapons in ''[[Ultimate Force]]''. She uses a SIG-Sauer P226 in at least a couple of episodes. In the episode where the SAS goes against the IRA, she uses an MP5KA1 to shoot at the terrorists during the ambush, and later briefly has a Glock 17 (the same one you see being pointed at her) before the bad guy takes it away. In the season 1 finale, she is given a PPK, but never gets to fire it herself. In another episode where the SAS goes after a Christian cult, she has an MP5SD3. In the season 2 finale where Red Troop goes to South Ossetia, she uses an FN Minimi. Here are some pics from the ''[[Ultimate Force]]'' page:

[[Image:Vlcsnap-77839.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Caroline Walsh ([[Alex Reid]]) unloads a SIG P226 at French special forces in Episode 2.1, "Communication".]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-136363.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Captain Caroline Walsh ([[Alex Reid]]) firing an FN Minimi in Episode 2.6, "Dead Is Forever".]]

Only problem is, these don't really show her face that clearly, so you can't tell who she is. I'll see about getting others... -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 20:23, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

I think I got one. Give me a sec to cap it. Season 1, and the episode was "Just a Target" [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:34, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Also, just remembering, in season 1, forgot which episode, she is seen with a full length double barrel shotgun, but never fires it. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 06:34, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Here's the pic of her with her SIG

[[Image:UFCWalsh.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

== Wikipedia pirate? ==

Hi, I requested several images from you a while back, but there appears to be an editor on Wikipedia going by the name Josh Woolstenhulme who appears to be uploading some of your gun photos and claiming to be the author. Here are his uploads: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Josh_Woolstenhulme

If this isn't you, just a heads up.

[[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 21:31, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

::Thanks. He IS stealing images. A quick pass and I noticed these.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/51/Simonov-Russian-SKS45.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/10/M1_Garand.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/74/M1903Mark1.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/71/AKMRifle.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/27/SMLE.jpg

so how do I complain and get these down?

:I'm not a Wikipedia member at present (I usually post anonymously), but it seems this user is already setting himself up to get your images removed. Note on the AKM image, it now says this:

:''This image or media does not have information on its copyright status. Unless the copyright status is provided, the image will be deleted after Friday, 6 February 2009. Please remove this template if a copyright license tag has been added.''

:But you should keep working with Koalorka to make sure your stuff isn't being taken, because I'm afraid I dunno what to do besides leave requests on a moderator's talk page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:45, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

::Yes, that was me that put up the warning tags. All violating images have now been removed and the pirate warned. Thanks again for the Ameli, you can find the article [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CETME_Ameli here]. [[Special:Contributions/99.232.226.200|99.232.226.200]] 16:46, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

==My requests==
I don't have much but here's a few I thought of:

* [[MG42]]

* [[MG34]]

* [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] with/without 33 round mag

* I mentioned before how I'd really like a [[Winchester 1866 "Yellow Boy"|Winchester 1866]] with the forearm and without it fro when they mimick Henry rifles in movies.

* Any western guns are great, I'm one of the few who can apprieciate them (since about 90% of the western pages are mine)

* We still need a [[Mossberg 500]] with wood furniture for pages like ''[[Heat]]''

* Some more [[Desert Eagle]]s. The images are all .50AEs, we need some .44s and .357 DEs. We also need a black model.

* [[RPG-7]] (still using that ugly picture taken off google)

* [[M60]] series machine guns

That's all I got for now. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::Was the extra holding that M60 an extra or someone well known? By the way, I could never do your job. The idea of so many idiots handling and breaking my guns would drive me to insanity. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

== Good Luck ==

I would like to wish you good luck on your most recent business trip, and I hope you have a good time or try to, and thanks for notifying us about it. Also, sorry to put more requests on your list, but can you look around for these as well?:

* Browning Automatic Rifle or B.A.R

* Mossberg 500 with High Capacity Magazine tube

* Mossberg 590 with Ghost ring sights (I think this is what the Remington 870 on the [[Hostage]] page really is, and I seen them in movies such as The Last Castle)

* M1 and M1A1 Thompson

Thanks, and I wish you the best of luck on your trip.--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 02:20, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

:Have fun! -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:53, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

==Revolvers==
I have a question. I know auto pistols need to be milled and threaded to fire blanks but do revolvers need to be modified to fire reliably? I once had some acorn crimped .45 LC blanks which I put through a SAA. The primers backed out from a lack of recoil and the gun locked up. I tried putting it though a Colt M1917 and it hardly fired unless I angled it right. I've seen in movies how some of the firing pins are removed from the hammers (like the S&W 36 from ''[[Running Scared]]''). If they do need to be modified, could you tell me how exactly? Thanks.

P.S. If we have any more things to add to your list, can we just add them directly or should w ask you first in discussion? - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
::I also forgot to ask, what movie was the M60 used on? - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Push==
Have you seen the trailers for the new movie ''[[Push]]'' coming out soon? I'd screencap the hi-def trailer but my computer is too slow to do it right. If you're free, could you give it a look? I'd rather you made a page with HD trailer shots than some anonymous user making an empty page. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==RE: Got a gift for you! ;) More coming==
You are awesome! These guns are great! I'll be sure to add them to the page. I'm going to have to go back and snap a shot of Ace with an SAA (they didn't show him too clear but I think I can find one). I can't wait to see what else is coming. Thanks! - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
:I'm glad to see you've gotten more famous guns, they look great. It's quite impressive how many guns you're uploading that are well known as used guns by the actors. Did you meet with some important people lately? Keep up the good work, the pics look great. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::All I can say is...Oh, my, God. You have outdone yourself this time. This is one of the best updates you've given us yet. I don't even know how to begin thanking you. I can't even express how giddy with excitement I am that we have these pictures. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:37, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

:::Yep, I saw those too! Really awesome. More than awesome, actually. And the new Desert Eagles and the Mark 23 are also VERY highly appreciated, too. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==Desert Eagle==
The Desert Eagles are great! We really needed a black model and you gave us all three! Thanks much. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==H&K Mk 23 SOCOM==
Outstanding work with the SOCOM pistols! How did you come across a REAL knight's arament suppressor? You've really outdone yourself this time! Keep up the good work. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

==Photos==
Nice photos you got the other day from our friend. I did not mean to rub you the wrong way last week. We could work better together and put this behind us. - [[User:Phoenixent|Phoenixent]]

== Babylon .A.D/ SPAS 15 ==

I don't think the gun under the M4 is a SPAS 15. The gun pictured has a full lenght forend and the reciver doesn't match. I have seached every where and can't figure out what the gun pictured is. But thanks for help. Gunner313

Babylon A.D.

2009-02-02T21:40:57Z

Gunner313: /* M4A1 */

File:Babylon 55.jpg

2009-02-02T21:36:53Z

Gunner313: category:screenshot

[[category:screenshot]]

Babylon A.D.

2009-02-02T21:35:47Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG 552 */

Babylon A.D.

2009-02-02T21:32:44Z

Gunner313: /* M249 Paratrooper SAW */

Babylon A.D.

2009-02-02T21:31:26Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG 552 */

File:Babylon 54.jpg

2009-02-02T21:27:46Z

Gunner313: category:screenshot

[[category:screenshot]]

File:Babylon 53.jpg

2009-02-02T21:26:52Z

Gunner313: category:screenshot

[[category:screenshot]]

Babylon A.D.

2009-02-02T21:23:43Z

Gunner313:

Babylon A.D.

2009-01-27T07:44:54Z

Gunner313: /* Unknown Launcher */

Transformers (2007)

2009-01-27T07:41:27Z

Gunner313: /* Brügger & Thomet GL-06 */

'''The following weapons were used in the movie ''[[Transformers]]'':'''
[[Image:Transformers.jpeg|right|400px]]

==M4A1 Carbine==

There are several appearances throughout the early stages of the film of the [[M16 rifle series#M4/M4A1 Carbine|M4A1 carbine]], used by U.S. military personnel at the U.S. Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT) base during Blackout's attack, as well as by Captain William Lennox ([[Josh Duhamel]])'s special forces team. The M4A1's used by the special forces team are fitted with various SOPMOD accessories including ACOG scopes, AN/PEQ-2 IR designators (which are erroneously shown emitting a laser beam that can be seen by the naked eye instead of the real AN/PEQ-2's invisible Infra-Red laser), RIS foregrips, and camougflage paint schemes. Captain Lennox's M4A1 is perhaps the most heavily customized, featuring both M68 Aimpoint and AN/PVS-17 night-vision scopes, a Surefire M900 weaponlight foregrip, and a custom muzzle brake, as well as the aforementioned AN/PEQ-2.

[[Image:ColtM4.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M4A1 Carbine with M68 Aimpoint scope and RIS foregrip 5.56mm]]
[[Image:Trans-ColtM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Members of Captain Lennox's team flee from Scorponok while carrying M4A1's]]
[[Image:Transformers_01-1-.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox and Technical Sergeant Bobby Epps ([[Tyrese Gibson]]) armed with M4A1's]]
[[Image:TransformersM4A1 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Jorge "Fig" Figueroa ([[Amaury Nolasco]]) provides cover fire for Captain Lennox with his M4A1]]

== M203 Grenade Launcher ==

In addition to the accessories mentioned above, several M4A1's used by Lennox's team are equipped with [[M203 grenade launcher]]s, most notably Air Force Technical Sergeant Bobby Epps ([[Tyrese Gibson]]).

[[Image:CM4-M203.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M4A1 5.56mm with M203 grenade launcher 40mm]]
[[Image:TransformersM4A1M203 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Technical Sergeant Bobby Epps wields his M4A1/M203 during the battle with Scorponok]]
[[Image:TransformersM4A1M203 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A member of Lennox's team paints Scorponok with his M4A1/M203's AN/PEQ-2 IR designator, the beam erronously shown being visible to the naked eye]]

== M16A2 Rifle ==

There are two brief appearances of [[M16 rifle series#M16A2 Rifle|M16A2 rifles]] in the film, first in the hands of soldiers responding to Blackout's arrival at the SOCCENT base when he begins his attack, and later in the hands of soldiers guarding Air Force One as Frenzy sneaks off the plane.

[[Image:M16A2.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M16A2 5.56mm]]
[[Image:TransformersM16A2 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|The soldier on the right aims his M16A2 rifle at Blackout just before he begins his attack]]
[[Image:TransformersM16A2 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A soldier stand guard over Air Force One armed with an M16A2 rifle]]

==Custom Mossberg 590==

A heavily-customized [[Mossberg 500-series shotgun#Mossberg 590|Mossberg 590]] (similar to that seen in ''[[Rambo (2008)|Rambo]]'') is seen in this film, as used by Agent Reggie Simmons ([[John Turturro]]) and Maggie Madsen ([[Rachael Taylor]]). It has a Magpul M93A rear stock attached to a Mesa Tactical M4 adapter block and a Mesa Tactical Top receiver Rail with an EOTech holographic Sight.

[[Image:Mossberg 590.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Mossberg 590 12 gauge]]
[[Image:TransformersMossbergTactical 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Maggie Madsen dodges Frenzy's shurikens while wielding a customized Mossberg 590 shotgun]]

==Milkor M32 MGL==

There are several appearances throughout the film of the [[Milkor MGL#M32 MGL|M32 MGL]] grenade launcher. It can first be seen as the alternate weapon of ACWO Jorge "Fig" Figueroa ([[Amaury Nolasco]]), carried in a custom scabbard on his back when not in use, and later on by other members of Captain Lennox's teams as well as Sector Seven personnel including Agent Simmons. The M32's seen on-screen appear in both standard black and desert tan finishes and are fitted with the factory Armson OEG reflex sights as well as at least one fitted with a C-More red dot sight. Captain Lennox's M32 is also shown mounting a laser target designator on the side of the barrel.

[[Image:Milkor M32.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M32 MGL 40mm as used in the film]]
[[Image:TransformersM32 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A member of Captain Lennox's team aims an M32 MGL fitted with a C-More red dot sight during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersM32 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox aims an M32 MGL at Devastator during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersM32 3.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Agent Simmons loads up an M32 MGL]]

==DefTech 37mm Launcher==

In addition to the M32 MGL's, Sector Seven soldiers and some of Captain Lennox's men can also be seen using [[DefTech 37mm launcher|DefTech 37mm grenade launchers]] during the final battle, equipped with folding stocks.

[[Image:Federallabs37.jpg|thumb|none|350px|DefTech 37mm launcher with folding stock]]
[[Image:TransformersDefTech37 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier aims his DefTech 37mm launcher at Blackout during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersDeftechGL 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|One of Captain Lennox's men loads up a DefTech 37mm launcher in preparation for the final battle]]

==L6 Grenade Launcher==

During the final battle, Tech. Sergeant Bobby Epps uses an [[L6 grenade launcher]] fitted with a C-More red dot sight (similar to that used in ''[[Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines]]'') as his weapon of choice.

[[Image:Mod._L6_37mm-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|L6 grenade launcher 37mm with C-More red dot sight as used in the film]]
[[Image:TransformersL6 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Tech. Sergeant Epps with an L6 grenade launcher during the final battle in Mission City]]

==Custom M1911A1==

Captain Lennox can be seen carrying a customized [[M1911 pistol series#M1911A1|M1911A1]] as his sidearm, using it to threaten Sector Seven agents during the standoff.

[[Image:M1911Colt.jpg|thumb|none|300px|M1911A1 .45 ACP]]
[[Image:1911.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox aims his M1911A1 at Sector Seven personnel]]
[[Image:TransformersM1911A1 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Closeup of Captain Lennox's M1911A1 as he holds it on Agent Simmons]]

==SIG SG 552==

During the standoff between Sector Seven and Captain Lennox's team, one of the Sector Seven soldiers can be seen aiming a [[SIG SG 550#SIG SG 552|SIG SG 552]] at Captain Lennox.

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|350px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]
[[Image:TransformersSG552.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier aims his SIG SG 552 at Captain Lennox]]

==M249 SAW Para==

Several members of Capt. Lennox's team can be seen carrying [[FN Minimi#M249-E1 / M249-E2 / M249 Paratrooper SAW|M249 Paratrooper SAW]]s fitted with an unknown scope as their main weapons, primarily during the battle with Scorponok.

The scopes look like Leopold (sp?) CQ/Ts to me. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 17:50, 21 January 2009 (UTC) Spartan198

[[Image:Fn_mg_m249para11-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M249 SAW 5.56mm paratrooper version with 200 round ammo drum]]
[[Image:TransformersSAWPara 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Special Forces team members wielding paratrooper M249 SAW's during the battle with Scorponok]]

==Heckler & Koch UMP==

Sector Seven soldiers can be seen using [[Heckler & Koch UMP]]'s in several scenes during the film, fitted with vaying accessories including C-More red dot sights.

[[Image:UMP 45.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch UMP .45 ACP]]
[[Image:TransformersUMP 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier (right) disembarks from a Blackhawk helicopter carrying a Heckler & Koch UMP]]
[[Image:TransformersUMP 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier with a Heckler & Koch UMP during the final battle in Mission City]]

==Brügger & Thomet GL-06==

Another weapon used by Sector Seven soldiers and Captain Lennox's team during the final battle are several heavily-modified [[Brügger & Thomet GL-06]] grenade launchers, covered in Hollywood embellishments and fitted with an unknown red dot sight (appeares to be a Bushnell Halo Sight). Captain Lennox most notably uses one when he charges Blackout on a comandeered motorcycle, skidding underneath the Decepticon to get a clear shot at the robot's weakly-armored lower body.

[[Image:B&T-GL-06.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Brügger & Thomet GL-06 40mm with EOTech red dot sight]]
[[Image:TransformersGL06 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox fires a GL-06 grenade launcher as he slides under Blackout during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersGL06 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|One of Captain Lennox's men aims a Brügger & Thomet GL-06 during the final battle]]

==Lee-Enfield No.1 Mk III* Rifle==

Members of a village militia in Qatar were seen armed with [[Short Magazine Lee-Enfield (SMLE)|Lee-Enfield No.1 Mk III* rifles]] during the battle with Scorponok.

[[Image:SMLE.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Lee-Enfield No.1 Mk III* .303 British]]
[[Image:TransformersEnfield.JPG|thumb|none|400px|villiage militia members carrying SMLE No.1 Mk III* rifles following the battle with Scorponok in Qatar]]

==AK-47==

One of the village militia members in Qatar was seen armed with an [[AK-47]] at the beginning of the battle with Scorponok.

[[Image:Ak_54.jpg|thumb|350px|none|AK-47 7.62x39mm]]

==RPG-7==

While at Sector Seven HQ, the power of the Allspark is demonstrated when Glen Whitmann ([[Anthony Anderson]])'s cellphone is used to create a new transformer, the feral robot producing several weapons including a shoulder-mounted [[RPG-7]] launcher.

[[Image:Rpg-7-1-.jpg‎ |thumb|none|350px|RPG-7 40mm]]
[[Image:TransformersRPG7.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A transformer created from Glen's cellphone sprouts a shoulder-mounted RPG-7 launcher]]

== GE M134 Minigun ==

In addition to the RPG-7 mentioned above, the feral transformer created from Glen's cellphone is also armed with a [[GE M134 Minigun]], mounted underneath its' body.

[[Image:M134.JPG|thumb|none|300px|GE M134 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:TransformersRPG7.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A transformer created from Glen's cellphone is armed with a GE M134 Minigun mounted beneath its' body]]

==SIG-Sauer P226==

Secret Service agents onboard Air Force One can be seen using [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P226|SIG-Sauer P226]] pistols as their sidearms (an anachronism; the Secret Service never used the P226, only the [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P228|P228]] and [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P229|P229]]). A cop at the police station ([[Rick Gomez]]) also brandishes a P226 while threatening Sam Witwicky ([[Shia LaBeouf]]) during his interrogation.

[[Image:SigP226.jpg|thumb|none|300px|SIG-Sauer P226 9mm]]
[[Image:TransformersP226 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Secret Service agent wields a SIG-Sauer P226 aboard Air Force One]]
[[Image:TransformersP226 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|"You eye-ballin' my piece Fifty Cent?" A cop dislays his SIG-Sauer P226 while threatening Sam during his interrogation]]

==Beretta 92FS==

The [[Beretta 92 pistol series#Beretta 92FS|Beretta 92FS]] can be seen in the hands of a police officer who arrests Sam when he reports his car stolen.

[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Beretta 92FS 9mm]]
[[Image:Transformers92FS 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A police officer aims his Beretta 92FS at Sam as he arrests him]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5K==

The [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5K|Heckler & Koch MP5K]] can be seen being used by Secret Service agents onboard Air Force One, as well as by a Sector Seven agent ([[Brian Stepanek]]) when meeting the Autobots, the latter being disarmed of his weapon by Jazz.

[[Image:MP5KA3.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Heckler & Koch MP5K 9mm]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5K 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Secret Service agents arm themselves with Heckler & Koch MP5K's during Frenzy's attack aboard Air Force One]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5K 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven agent draws a Heckler & Koch MP5K during the confrontation with the Autobots]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5A5==

Sector Seven agents can be seen brandishing [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5A5|Heckler & Koch MP5A5]]'s in their first meeting with the Autobots, but are promptly disarmed by Jazz. FBI agents cn also be seen carying them during the raid on Glen's home, fitted with Surefire dedicated forend weaponlights.

[[Image:H&KMP5A5.jpg‎|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch MP5A5 9mm]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5A5 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Sector Seven agents brandishing Heckler & Koch MP5A5's when meeting the Autobots]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5A5 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An FBI agent brandishes a Heckler & Koch MP5A5 during the raid on Glen's home]]

==Heckler & Koch G36C==

When the FBI storms Glen's home, several agents can be seen armed with [[Heckler & Koch G36#Heckler & Koch G36C|Heckler & Koch G36C]]'s fitted with tactical flashlights. Sector Seven soldiers can also be seen carrying G36C's, as well as one of Captain Lennox's men during the standoff at Sector Seven HQ.

[[Image:Hkg36c.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Heckler & Koch G36C 5.56mm]]
[[Image:TransformersG36C 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An FBI agent with his Heckler & Koch G36C slung as he tackles Glen's cousin ([[Omar Benson Miller]]) into a swimming pool]]
[[Image:TransformersG36C 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier brandishes a Heckler & Koch G36C as he arrests Sam and Mikaela Banes ([[Megan Fox]])]]
[[Image:TransformersG36C 3.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A sector Seven soldier and one of Captain Lennox's men aim Heckler & Koch G36C's at each other during the standoff]]

==Winchester Model 1912==

A [[Winchester Model 1912]] pump-action shotgun was used by Secretary of Defense John Keller ([[Jon Voight]]) at Sector Seven headquarters, in which Keller used the Model 1912 shotgun to fight off Frenzy.

[[Image:Winchester Model 1912.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Winchester Model 1912 12 guage]]
[[Image:Transformers1912.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Secretary of Defense John Keller fires a Winchester Model 1912 at Frenzy]]

== Browning M2 Heavy Machine Gun ==

Several [[Browning M2]] heavy machine guns were seen mounted on the roofs of US military Humvees in Qatar when Blackout attacked the SOCCENT base. The Decepticon Devastator can also be seen with a pair of M2's atop the turret of his tank form.

[[Image:BrowningM2.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Browning M2 .50 BMG]]
[[Image:TransformersM2BMG 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An M2 Browning mounted atop a Humvee during the SOCCENT base attack]]
[[Image:TransformersM2BMG 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Devastator in his tank form, complete with a pair of Browning M2 heavy machine guns atop his turret]]

==M240G Machine Gun==

During the attack on the SOCCENT base in Qatar, [[FN MAG#M240 Machine Gun|M240G machine guns]] can be seen mounted on several Humvees as well as UH-60 Blackhawk helicopters shown searching for survivors following the attack.

[[Image:Fn_mag_g.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M240G 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:TransformersM240 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A U.S. soldier opens up on Blackout with an M240G machine gun]]
[[Image:TransformersM240 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An M240G machine gun door-mounted on a Blackhawk searching for survivors of the SOCCENT base attack]]

==M60D Machine Gun==

During the final battle, several UH-60 Blackhawks sent to airlift Sam and the Allspark out of Mission City can be seen armed with door-mounted [[M60 machine gun#M60D Machine Gun|M60D machine gun]]s.

[[Image:M60d.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M60D machine gun 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:TransformersM60D 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An M60D machine gun door-mounted on a U.S. Army UH-60 Blackhawk]]

[[Category:Movie]]
[[Category:Science-Fiction]]
[[Category:Action Movie]]

Babylon A.D.

2009-01-26T21:06:26Z

Gunner313: /* M249 Paratrooper SAW */

Terminator Salvation

2009-01-21T22:44:49Z

Gunner313:

[[Image:Terminator Salvation.jpg|thumb|right|350px|]]

[[Category: Movie]]

==HK416==

Used by John Connor ([[Christian Bale]]) in a movie still.

The correct name of the weapon is "HK416", not "H&K 416". There's no ampersand or space in the name. Here's proof, directly from Heckler & Koch itself: [http://www.hkpro.com/hk416.htm] [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 17:08, 21 January 2009 (UTC) Spartan198

I wonder why it has YHM style iron sights instead of H&K sights. Gunner313

[[Image:Terminator_Salvation.PNG|thumb|none|350px|]]

==M60D==

Seen in the above pic, behind Connor

== Unknown Revolver ==

In the trailer, there was for a split second, someone holding a revolver

Counter-Strike Online

2009-01-20T22:43:54Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG552 Commando */

'''The following weapons are used in Counter-Strike Online '''
[[Image:CSOnline.jpg|thumb|right|300px|Counter-Strike Online (2008)]]

Counter-Strike Online is a remake of Counter-Strike: Condition Zero targeted towards Asia's gaming market. It is being developed by Nexon Corporation with oversight from license-holder Valve Corporation. It uses a micropayment model that is managed by a custom version of the Steam back-end. Now can play on Taiwan , Hong Kong , China and Korean .

Weapons

Counter Strike Online features the same weapons that have appeared in previous installments of Counter Strike, but further supplements these with some new weapons, such as the K1A and the QBB-95 and new player models. In the case of Zombie mode 2, fictional specially-remodeled weapons such as Double MP7A1, Double Night Hawk(Desert Eagle), and CV47(AK-47)-R60 appear in supply boxes, which only appear in Zombie mode 2, fallen from the sky.

Gameplay

Counter Strike Online features four game modes compared to the original: Death Match, Team Death Match, Zombie Mode, and Zombie Mode 2.

[[category:Video Game]]
=knife=
==knife==
==Dagger==
==Zombie Claw==

= Pistols =
== Glock 18 ==

[[Image:Glock18c 01-1-.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOGLOCK18.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== SIG P228 ==

[[Image:SIG-P228.jpg|none||thumb|300px]]

== FN Five-seveN ==

[[Image:Fn FiveseveN usg.jpg|none|thumb|300px]]
[[Image:CSOFN57.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== Beretta 92G Elite II (Dual) ==

[[Image:Beretta92GEliteII.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]

== H&K USP .45 ACP Tactical ==

[[Image:Hk-usp45tac.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOHKUSP45.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:CSOUSP.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== IMI Desert Eagle .50 AE ==

[[Image:DesertEagle50AE.jpg|thumb|none|300px|]]
[[Image:CSODE50.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

===Gold Desert Eagle .50 AE===

==Colt Python Elite ==
[[Image:Python6in.jpg|thumb|400px|none|[[Colt Python]] .357 6in (in game is .50)]]
[[Image:CSORevolvers.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
= Shotguns =

== Benelli M3 ==

[[Image:F1ead049.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:CSOBenelliM3.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== Benelli M4 Super 90 ==

[[Image:Benelli m4 2.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOBenelliM4Super90.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
==USAS12==
[[Image:usas-12.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Usas 12]]
[[Image:CSOUSAS12.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

= Sub-Machine Guns =

== Steyr TMP ==

[[Image:Steyr-TMP.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOSTEYRTMP.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== Heckler & Koch MP5A5 ==

[[Image:Hkavt.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOHKMP5A5.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== Ingram Mac-10 ==

[[Image:IngramMAC10.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Real MAC-10 - .45 acp]]
[[Image:CSOMAC10.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== Heckler & Koch UMP ==

[[Image:UMP 45.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOHKUMP45.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== Heckler & Koch MP7A1 ==

[[Image:Hk mp7 b-1-.jpg|thumb|none|450px|H&K MP7A1 4.6x30mm with Zeiss Z-Point sight. This MP7 shown in SMG configuration.]]
[[Image:CSOHKMP7A1.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== FN P90 ==

[[Image:FNP90.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOFNP90.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== K1A ==

[[Image:Daewoo k1.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Daewoo K1A1]]
[[Image:CSOK1A.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
= Assault Rifles =

== AK-47 ==

[[Image:AK-47.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:CSOAK47.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

===Gold AK47===

== IMI Galil ==

[[Image:Galilarm-05.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOIMIGalil.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== FAMAS ==
[[Image:Famas.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOFAMAS.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== SIG SG552 Commando ==

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|400px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]
[[Image:CSOSIGSG552.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== Steyr AUG ==

[[Image:AUG A1 508mm 04.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOSTEYRAUG.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== M4A1 Carbine ==

[[Image:ColtM4 FirstVersion.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Colt M4A1 Carbine ]]
[[Image:CSOCOLTM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
=== M4A1 Carbine ===

== Heckler & Koch XM8 ==

===XM8===
[[Image:Xm8 rightmed.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch XM8 5.56mm]]
[[Image:XM8 s1.gif|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch XM8 5.56mm]]
[[Image:CSOHKXM8.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
[[Image:CSOXM8.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
[[Image:CSOXM81.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
===XM8-H===
[[Image:XM8 s4.gif|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch XM8 6.8MM]]
[[Image:CSOHKXM8H.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== FN SCAR ==

=== FN SCAR - L ===

[[Image:Scar l-1.jpg|thumb|400px|none|FN SCAR-L 5.56mm with Aimpoint CompM2 scope and Grippod foregrip]]
[[Image:CSOFNSCARL.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:CSOSCARL.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
=== FN SCAR - H ===

[[Image:FN_SCAR_-1-.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Fabrique Nationale SCAR-H 7.62x51mm NATO with Aimpoint CompM2 scope and Grippod foregrip]]
[[Image:CSOFNSCARH.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

==M249 PARA SAW==
[[Image:fn_minimi_para.jpg|thumb|none|350px|FN M249 PARA SAW]]
[[Image:CSOM249.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:CSOM249CS.jpg|thumb|none|800px|Christmas Special]]
[[Image:CSOM249CS1.jpg|thumb|none|800px|Christmas Special]]

== QBB95 ==
[[Image:Type95-1.jpg|thumb|none|250px|Norinco QBZ-95, 5.8x42 Chinese]]
[[Image:CSOQBB95.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== MG3 ==
[[Image:mg42_02.jpg|thumb|none|350px|MG 3]]
[[Image:CSOMG3.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:CSOMG31.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
= Sniper Rifles =

== Steyr Scout ==
[[Image:Scout-1-.gif|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:CSOSTEYRSCOUT.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== Heckler & Koch G3SG/1 ==

[[Image:H&KSG1.jpg‎ |thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch G3SG/1 - 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:CSOHKG3SG1.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== SIG SG550 Sniper==

[[Image:SG550sniper.gif|thumb|none|500px]]
[[Image:CSOSIGSG550S.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
== VSK94 ==

[[Image:VSK94.jpg|thumb|none|500px]]
[[Image:CSOVSK94.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

== Accuracy International Arctic Warfare Magnum (AWM) ==
[[Image:Accuracy International Arctic Warfare - Psg 90.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Accuracy International AWM .338]]
[[Image:CSOAIAWM.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:CSOAIAWMCS.jpg|thumb|none|800px|Christmas Special]]
[[Image:CSOAIAWMCS1.jpg|thumb|none|800px|Christmas Special]]

== Sako TRG ==
[[Image:CSOTRG.jpg|thumb|none|800px|]]

==Cheyenne Tactical M-200 Intervention==
[[Image:M200.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

=may be have=
==Double Desert Eagle==
[[Image:CSODDE.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

==Double MP7A1==
[[Image:Hk mp7 b-1-.jpg|thumb|none|450px|H&K MP7A1 4.6x30mm with Zeiss Z-Point sight. This MP7 shown in SMG configuration.]]
[[Image:CSODMP7A1.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
==L85==
[[Image:Sal8.jpg|thumb|none|400px|SA80 5.56mm]]
==AKM==
[[Image:AKMRifle.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|AKM, Stamped Steel Receiver w/ slant muzzle brake 7.62x39mm]]
==AK47 Long Magazine==
[[Image:CSOAK47LM.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]
==HK416==
[[Image:Hk416-1.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Heckler & Koch HK416 with 10 inch barrel, 5.56x45mm NATO]]
==Blaser 93==
[[Image:Blaser93SniperRifleA.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Blaser 93 sniper rifle]]

==PSG90==
[[Image:Accuracy International Arctic Warfare - Psg 90.jpg|thumb|none|300px|7.62X51MM]]

==AW50==
[[Image:AW50F.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Accuracy International AW50F .50 BMG]]

==AK47 HD==
only High definition
==M4A1 HD==
==HK MP7A1 HD==
==FN SCAR HD==
==HK XM8 HD==

=External links=

* [http://www.gametrailers.com/player/usermovies/174588.html Counter-Strike: Online Official Trailer]
* [http://cso.tiancity.com Chinese Counter-Strike: Online website]
* [http://csonline.nexon.com/CSO/Page/Gnx.aspx?Url=Home/Index Korean Counter-Strike: Online website]
* [http://tw.csonline.gamania.com/ Taiwanese Counter-Strike: Online website]
* [http://www.gamania.com.hk/game/CSO/index.html/ Hong Kong Counter-Strike: Online website]

Counter-Strike: Source

2009-01-20T22:43:22Z

Gunner313: /* Swiss Arms SG 552 Commando */

'''The following weapons are used in the online multiplayer game Counter Strike: Source'''
[[Image:CSS.JPG|thumb|right|390px|Counter Strike:Source box cover. The game also includes Half Life 2: Deathmatch and Day of Defeat: Source]]

[[category:Video Game]]

== Pistols ==

=== [[Desert Eagle|IMI Desert Eagle .50 AE]] ===

Described as the 'Night Hawk 50C' in the game. The weapon is extremely powerful and is the gun of choice for players during Round 1, which is often a pistol round. It holds 7 rounds, reloading is slow and has a large amount of recoil. Yet, when aimed right, can kill in one shot.
[[Image:DesertEagle50AE.jpg|thumb|none|300px|]]
[[Image:Deagle.jpg|thumb|none|300px|In game version of the Desert Eagle]]

=== [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] ===

This gun is called '9X19 Sidearm' in the game. This gun is capable of burst fire which fires 3 rounds every time the trigger is pressed. The gun itself has 20 rounds yet is underpowered compared to other handguns in the game. This gun is standard issue for Terrorists. This is more of a 'run and shoot' type of gun as it has very little recoil and reloading takes very little time. Although, this gun has a very large bullet spread when fired rapidly.
[[Image:Glock18c 01-1-.jpg|thumb|none|300px]] [[Image:Glocksidearmcs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 18 in the game]]

=== [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P228|SIG P228]] ===

The SIG P228, called the .228 Compact in the game, is a mid-range gun with moderate power and accuracy. It holds 13 rounds which are quite effective on Kevlar armour. This gun comes with no extra attachments or firing modes. It is chambered in-game as a .357SIG model, as opposed to the .40S&W or the 9mm Luger.
[[Image:SIG-P228.jpg|none||thumb|300px]]
[[Image:Sigybird.jpg|none|thumb|300px|The SIG P228 in Counter Strike]]

=== FN Five-seveN ===

The gun, called the ES Five-Seven in the game, is fairly accurate but with a very low power. It holds 20 rounds and is capable of rapid fire if you tap the mouse fast enough. This gun is only available to Counter Terrorists.
[[Image:Fn FiveseveN usg.jpg|none|thumb|300px]]
[[Image:FNfiveseven.jpg|none|thumb|300px|The Five-seveN in CS:S]]

=== [[Beretta 92 pistol series#Beretta 92G Elite II|Beretta 92G Elite II (Dual)]] ===

The Beretta 92G Elite II is a dual-wielded weapon and is called the '.40 Dual Elite' in the game. The guns are only available to the Terrorist faction, where they are used as back up sidearms but are sometimes used as primary in the first three rounds. The guns themselves are more aesthetically pleasing weapons than the others and hold 15 rounds each. The guns are medium range, medium power and can take up to 4 rounds to kill. With there being 2 guns, reloading is slow and are the most expensive handguns in the game.
[[Image:Beretta92GEliteII.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:Beretta.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Dual Beretta 92G Elite II's]]

=== [[Heckler & Koch USP#Heckler & Koch USP Tactical|H&K USP .45 ACP Tactical]] ===

The USP.45 ACP Tactical comes with a silencer and is standard issue with Counter Terrorist. It can be fired just as fast as the FN Five-seveN and the Glock, although it only has 12 rounds. Aiming at the chest/head will lead to a kill within 2/3 rounds.
[[Image:Hk-usp45tac.jpg|thumb|none|300px]] [[Image:Usp.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The USP .45 ACP Tactical with the silencer attachment.]]

== Shotguns ==

=== [[Benelli M Series Super 90 Shotguns#Benelli M4|Benelli M4 Super 90]] ===
The Benelli M4 Super 90 is called the 'XM1014' in Counter Strike. It is a rapid firing 12 gauge shotgun used by both Terrorists and Counter Terrorists. It's a semi-automatic and is best used in close quarter combat, as it has a short range but is very powerful. As you'd expect from a shotgun, full reloading of 7 shells takes a long time. However, the gun can be reloaded quickly after 2-3 rounds.

[[Image:Benelli m4 2.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:Benelli.jpg|thumb|none|300px|M1014 in Counter Strike:Source]]

=== [[Benelli M Series Super 90 Shotguns#Benelli M3|Benelli M3 Super 90]] ===
The pump action version of the shotgun in CS, called the 'Leone 12 Gauge Super'. It is a very underused weapon, which is very deadly up close. Like the M4 Super 90, it is most used to close quarter combat. The range, however, is short. Reloading is the same process
with the M4, with the exception that the M3 can hold 8 rounds, compared with the M4's 7. One feature that is not included in the game, however, is the ability to switch from pump action to semi-automatic operation, which can be done to the real life counterpart.

[[Image:F1ead049.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:Benellisuper90cs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The 12 Gauge in Counter Strike]]

== Rifles ==

=== [[AK-47]] ===

Called the CV-47 in the game. The gun can shoot through very thin walls and doors and is seen as a safe buy due to its cheap and effective build. It is standard issue (if you have the correct funds) for all terrorists. The gun has a very large bullet spread when firing full auto.
[[Image:AK-47.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]
[[Image:Cv-47.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The AK-47 in Counter Strike]]

=== [[Galil|IMI Galil]] ===

The IMI Galil, called the 'IDF Defender', is another gun which is seen as a safe buy when money is an issue. It's magazine size of 35 rounds gives the player an extra edge when in an intense battle. The weapon has a medium range and less power than other rifles, like the AK-47. Unlike the AK, the recoil can be more controllable and spraying a little more accurate. This gun is available to Terrorists only. It is modeled after the 7.62 model, but in-game is calibered for 5.56
[[Image:Galilarm-05.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:IMIGalil.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The Galil in Counter Strike]]

=== [[FAMAS]] ===

The FAMAS is a low cost rifle for the Counter Terrorist. It is fairly cheap to buy, with an accurate three shot burst fire. The gun has medium-low range, with medium power. When used in full auto mode, the gun is very inaccurate, with the gun better used in close quarter combat.

[[Image:Famas.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:Famascs.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]

=== Swiss Arms SG 552 Commando ===

The 552 Commando (called the 'Krieg 552') features an early-model ACOG scope, fast rate of fire and long, single shot range. As a result, it is used widely by those which are new to the game. The fast rate of fire allows the gun to drain the 30 round magazine in seconds with average accuracy. When in firing full auto, the range and accuracy is medium, even in scoped mode. However, when in single shot scoped mode, it is very accurate with a very long range. The gun is only available to Terrorists.

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|500px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]
[[Image:552commandocs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The 'Krieg Commando 552' in Counter Strike]]

=== [[Steyr AUG ]]===

A very powerful long range weapon similar to the Terrorist's 552 Commando. It's scope allows the player to zoom in close to a far way opponent and get a hit 70% of the time. Doesn't have as higher rate of fire as the Commando, but is just as powerful, if not more. This gun is only available to Counter Terrorists.

[[Image:AUG A1 508mm 04.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:AUGCs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The AUG in Counter Strike]]

=== [[M16 rifle series#M4/M4A1 Carbine|M4A1 Carbine]] ===

The M4A1 is the most used weapon in the game and is only available to Counter Terrorists. The gun has an optional sound suppressor which decreases the power a little. Overall, some regard it as the best weapon in the game due to its high power and accuracy. Burst firing allows the gun to reach a long distance. The gun is very effective when running and shooting, offering well balanced characteristics with controllable recoil.

[[Image:M4A1 ACOG.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:M4A1cs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The M4A1 in Counter Strike]]

=== [[M249 SAW]] ===

The M249 SAW (sometimes called the 'Para' in the game) is a 100 round defensive weapon, with a very powerful short range configuration. It's large spread over a large area leaves this gun better suited to close quarter combat. The gun is the most expensive weapon in the game, costing over $5000.

[[Image:Fn m249saw mk2 10-1-.jpg|thumbs|none|300px]]
[[Image:M249Sawcs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The M249 in the game Counter Strike]]

== Sub-Machine Guns ==

=== [[Steyr TMP]] ===

The TMP is a rapid firing, short ranged weapon available only to the Counter Terrorists. In Counter Strike, the is named the 'Schmidt Machine Pistol'. It is a weak gun, but is very fast and can kill within 4 rounds at close range. The Counter Strike version features a non removable silencer which takes the power from the rounds but makes it almost silent.
[[Image:Steyr-TMP.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:TMPcs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The TMP in Counter Strike. Note the attached (and hard to miss) silencer. ]]

=== [[Heckler & Koch MP5|H&K MP5 Navy]] ===

Another highly used weapon in the game, due to it's fast rate of fire, quick reloading and good accuracy. Not as powerful as the more expensive rifles, but for the beginning rounds it is a safe buy.

[[Image:Hkavt.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:MP5Ncs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The MP5N in Counter Strike]]

=== [[MAX-10|Ingram MAC-10]] ===

The MAC-10 is a powerful but inaccurate terrorist weapon. It's short range, high power and fast rate of fire makes it a very underestimated weapon.

[[Image:MAC-10.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Digital rendering of a MAC-10 for use in video game]]
[[Image:IngramMAC10.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Real MAC-10 - .45 acp]]
[[Image:MAC10cs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The MAC-10 during mag change]]

=== [[FN P90]] ===

The 50 round magazine size gives an advantage to the other sub machine guns featured. The gun's medium-short range and medium power makes this a great close quarter action gun.

[[Image:FNP90.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:P90cs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The P90 in Counter Strike]]

=== [[Heckler & Koch UMP|Heckler & Koch Universal Maschinenpistole (UMP)]] ===

It's medium to high accuracy and range makes this a more powerful parallel with the MP5 Navy, but holding only 25 rounds and a very slow rate of fire makes this a gun that's only used by players who are experienced with it or who are new to the game and do not know about its drawbacks.

[[Image:UMP 45.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:HKUMPcs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The UMP in Counter Strike.]]

== Sniper Rifles ==

=== Steyr Scout ===

The cheapest bolt action sniper rifle in the game which occasionally misses but, being a sniper rifle, has a very high range and very good accuracy. It has medium-high power and 10 round magazine. Pretty much useless in close quarter combat unless the player is extremely skilled in no-scoping.

[[Image:Scout-1-.gif|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:Scoutcs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The Scout in Counter Strike]]

=== [[Accuracy International Arctic Warfare series|Accuracy International Arctic Warfare Magnum (AWM)]] ===

Known in game as the AWM, this is undoubtedly the most powerful in the game with very high range and accuracy. One shot anywhere on the opponents body will almost always lead to a kill. However, like the Scout, this gun is useless in close quarter combat.

''Contrary to popular belief the real Arctic Warfare Magnum (AWM) is offered chambered in .338 Lapua. The common reference to this rifle as an AWP (Arctic Warfare Police), though partially correct, is misguided. The biggest reason for this is due to the fact that it was drawn for the game with a smooth barrel (like an AWP) while the real AWM comes standard with a fluted barrel.'' [http://www.ketmer.com/ai/defense/awm/index.htm]

[[Image:Accuracy International Arctic Warfare - Psg 90.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:AIAWMcs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The AWM in Counter Strike]]

=== [[Heckler & Koch G3#H&K G3SG/1|Heckler & Koch G3SG/1]] ===

The Terrorist's semi-auto sniper rifle. Holding 20 rounds, the medium-high power and long range is not as effective as the bolt action rifles on a large, open map. Instead, this gun should be used in small or medium sized maps, with it's point-and-shoot characteristics more suited to close quarter combat.

[[Image:H&KSG1.jpg‎ |thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch G3SG/1 - 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:1cs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The G3SG/1 in Counter Strike]]

=== SIG SG550 Sniper===

Apart from a bigger magazine and less power, this is pretty much the same as the Terrorist's G3SG/1. Features a scope and only available to Counter Terrorists.

[[Image:800px-Stgw 90.jpg|thumb|none|300px]]
[[Image:SIG550cs.jpg|thumb|none|300px|The SIG SG 550 in counter strike]]

Kane & Lynch: Dead Men

2009-01-20T22:42:45Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG 552 */

===SIG SG 552===
* This is Kane's main weapon in the game, also featured on box art
[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|500px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]

===[[Browning Hi-Power]] or [[Browning BDM]]===
* Only featured on box art

===FN P90===
* Kane uses the P90 in the LA bank robbery level.

===Heckler and Koch USP .45===
* Most common pistol in the game

===Taurus Raging Bull===
* Lynch's Revolver

===Remington 870===
* Lynch's shotgun

===Franchi SPAS-12===
* Used by Lynch in the Cuba levels.

===Ruger Mini 14===
* Used by prison guards during the jailbreak level.

===M4A1 Carbine===
* Used by Tokyo SWAT, Cuban soldiers, and LA SWAT. Serves as Shelly's primary weapon.

===AK-101===
* Used by Cuban Soldiers, but mostly by Cuban rebels.

===AKM===
* Found on dead cuban rebels. Cannot be used by player.

===PKM===
*Seen in the first cuban mission. Can be mounted by player.

===Heckler and Koch MP5A3===
* Used by SWAT teams and gangsters in Tokyo club, one variant has a Surefire light

===M249 SAW para===
* Used by one of the gangsters in Retomoto's skyscraper and later seen in Cuba.

===RPG-7V===
* Used by Cuban soldiers.

[[Category:Video Game]]

Hitman: Blood Money

2009-01-20T22:42:24Z

Gunner313: /* Sig 552 */

'''The following weapons are used in the video game Hitman: Blood Money:'''
[[Image:HBM.jpg|right]]

== AMT Hardballer ==

The [[M1911 pistol series#AMT Hardballer|AMT Hardballer]] appears in the game as the "Silverballer", it can be fitted with everything to silencers to long slides to lasersights and scopes. Dual wielding can also be bought for it.
[[Image:AMT Hardballer - Hitman.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Airsoft replica of Hitman's AMT Hardballer]]
[[Image:Hardballer_Longslide.jpg|thumb|300px|none|AMT Hardballer with a Long slide, 45. ACP]]
[[Image:Silverballer.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heavily modified "Silverballer"]]

== Heckler & Koch MP5 ==

The [[H&K MP5]] appears in the game as the "SMG Tactical", and modified with a large variety of accessories such as A3 and A4 buttstocks. Delahunt's bodyguards, Secret Service agents, and the assassin Maynard John use fixed stock MP5s.

[[Image:H&KMP5A4.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MP5A4, 9x19mm]]
[[Image:SMGtactical.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heavily modified "SMG Tactical"]]

== Desert Eagle ==

The Stainless 357. Magnum version of the [[Desert Eagle]] appears in the game, it is used by targets such as the gangster leader Spook, the Vice President and the assassin Raymond Kulinsky.It's also used by the former CIA agent and used by the guards in the basement in the level "A Dance With The Devil".
[[Image:Desert-Eagle.jpeg|thumb|300px|none|Desert Eagle, 44. Magnum]]

== Heckler & Koch USP ==

The normal pistol for most guards in the game is the [[H&K USP#Heckler & Koch USP|H&K USP]]. The name of the weapon in-game is "SLP .40"

A silenced version is carried by the assassin Angelina Mason and the South African white supremacist Hendrick Schmutz.

An interesting bit of info is that the name of the gun is the SLP.40, but the ammo is called 45ACP ammo, and then the newspaper says it is a 9mm. Kind of odd a gun is three different calibers at once.

[[Image:Usp40compact.jpg|thumb|none|280px|H&K USP, .40 S&W]]
[[Image:SLP40.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The "SLP .40" in first person view]]

==Smith & Wesson Model 66==

The ''[[Smith & Wesson Model 66]]'' appears in the game as the "Snub-Nosed"
It is used by Don Fernando Delgado in "A Vintage Year" and the steamboat sailors in "Death on the Mississippi."

[[Image:Smith-&-Wesson-686.jpg‎|thumb|none|250px|Smith & Wesson Model 66 Snub with 2" barrel & Custom Grips.]]

==Mauser C/96==

Found in the mission "Curtains Down". Referred to in game as WW1 Pistol. This weapon cannot be added to your collection.

[[Image:Mauser_c96_bolo.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Mauser C96 7.63x25mm Mauser]]

==Custom 1911==

Used by Mark Parchezhi III and Leland "Jack" Alexander. This weapon cannot be added to your collection.

[[Image:80elite6-1-.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Colt Combat Elite .45 ACP with Pachmayr grips]]

== Heckler & Koch MP7 ==

An early version of the [[Heckler & Koch MP7A1]] appears in the game. It is used by FBI Agents in-game.
[[Image:Hk_mp7_b-1-.jpg‎ |thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch MP7A1 4.6x30mm]]
[[Image:MP7hitman.jpg|thumb|none|300px|FBI Agent aiming an MP7]]

== Ruger MP9 ==

The [[Ruger MP9]] appears in the game. It is used by the chicken suit guards in the mission "Murder of Crows"

[[Image:Ruger MP9.gif|thumb|none|350px|Ruger MP9 9mm]]

== FAMAE S.A.F. ==

The Chilean sub-machine gun FAMAE S.A.F. appears in the game as the "SAF SMG", and it is used by the casa guards in the mission "A Vintage Year"
[[Image:SAF.jpg|thumb|none|350px|FAMAE S.A.F, 9x19mm]]
[[Image:FAMAE.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Casa guard with a "SAF SMG"]]

== SPAS-12 ==

The [[SPAS 12|SPAS-12]] appears in the game as the "SP12 Shotgun", it can modified with a large variety of accessories, such as a buttstock and an Aimpoint.
[[Image:Franchi-SPAS12.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Franchi SPAS-12 12-guage]]

== Walther WA 2000 ==

The [[Walther WA 2000]] is the main sniper rifle in the game, it can be fitted with better scopes, lightweight frame, silencers and bolt-action.
[[Image:WA2000.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Walther WA 2000, 7.62x51mm NATO, 300. Winchester Magnum and 7.5x55mm Swiss. ]]

== Sig 552 ==

The [[SIG SG 550#SIG SG 552|SIG SG 552]] appears in the game as the "SG552" is in Mark Puriyah Jr.'s command room in the mission "Murder of Crows"

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|500px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]

== Sako TRG-42 ==

The [[Sako TRG-42]] appears in the game as the "Kazo TRG" it is the rifle of choice for the assassin Raymond Kulinsky when he tries to kill the Secretary of the Interior.
[[Image:Sako trg42.jpg|thumb|none|420px|Sako TRG-42, 338. Lapua]]
[[Image:Sako.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Agent 47 sniping with the "Kazo TRG"]]

== M4A1 Carbine ==

The [[M16 rifle series#M4 Carbine|M4A1 Carbine]] appears in the game, it can modified with a large variety of accessories, such as a Beta C-MAG and an ACOG sight.

[[Image:‎Icsm4ris2006.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Modified M4A1 5.56x45mm NATO]]
[[Image:M4Cmag.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Agent 47 with an M4A1 with Beta C-Mag and a pistol grip]]

== Schofield Model 3 ==

The [[Schofield Model 3]] revolver appears in the game as the "Six Shooter" guests carry it in the level "Till Death do us Part"
[[Image:Schofield.jpg|thumb|none|330px|Schofield Model 3 .45 Schofield]]

== Taurus Raging Bull Model 480 ==

The [[Raging Bull]] appears in the game as the "Bull. 480" it is used by the Gator gang and Vinnie "Slugger" Sinistra. The Raging Bull in the game appears to be the Model 480, chambered in .480 Ruger cartridge.
[[Image:Rb1.jpg‎|thumb|300px|none|Taurus Raging Bull Model 454, .454 Casull]]
[[Image:Ragingbull.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Agent 47 with a "Bull 480."]]

== Remington 870 ==

The [[Remington 870]] appears in the game as the "Shotgun" it is used by vineyard guards in the mission "A Vintage Year" and a member of the Gator gang. It is also placed in the tutorial level "Death of a Showman"
[[Image:Remington870NewModel.jpg‎|thumb|400px|none|Remington 870 in black finish]]
[[Image:Remmy.jpg‎|thumb|400px|none|Agent 47 with a Remington 870 after killing a gangster]]

== Fabrique Nationale F2000 ==

The [[FN F2000]] is in the game in the security room in "Death on the Mississippi" and carried in a briefcase by a CIA Agent in "A Dance with the Devil"

[[Image:F2000.jpg‎|thumb|380px|none|FN F2000, 5.56x45 NATO]]

== Steyr TMP ==

The [[Steyr TMP]] is used by various guards throughout the game.

[[Image:Steyr-TMP.jpg|thumb|none|250px|Steyr TMP, 9x19mm]]
[[Image:TMP.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Agent 47 shooting a gangster with a Steyr TMP.]]

==Browning BAR Mk. II Safari==

Found mounted on a wall in Pappy's home in "Till Death Do Us Part". Referred to in game as the Elephant Gun.

[[Image:Browning BAR.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Browning BAR Mk. II Safari, .30-06 Springfield]]

== Dragunov SVD ==

The [[SVD Dragunov|Dragunov SVD]] is used in the mission "Death of a Showman" to kill 3 gangsters. It can also be found in a briefcase next to the laptop in "A Dance with the Devil."
[[Image:SVD.jpg‎|thumb|450px|none|Dragunov SVD, 7.62x54mm]]

== M14 ==

The [[M14 Rifle|M14]] is used by U.S. Marines in the mission "Amendment XXV".
[[Image:M14Rifle.jpg|thumb|left|450px|M14, 7.62x51mm NATO]]

[[Category:Video Game]]

Rainbow Six: Vegas

2009-01-20T22:42:00Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG 552 */

'''The following weapons were used in the video game Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Vegas:'''
[[Image:vegasbox.jpg||right|300px]]

== Beretta M92FS ==

The [[Beretta M92F#Beretta 92 FS|Beretta M92FS]] appears in the game as the "92FS", can be modified with silencer, laser and high capacity magazines like the other pistols. It can also be found on a LVPD officer's body in one of the levels.

[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Beretta M92FS 9mm]]

== Heckler & Koch USP ==

The [[H&K USP]] appears in the game as the "USP 40.", can be modified with silencer, laser and high capacity magazines like the other pistols.

[[Image:H&KUSP40.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Heckler & Koch USP .40 S&W]]

== IMI Desert Eagle XIX ==

The [[Desert Eagle]] appears in the game, it can be modified with laser and high capacity magazines, but not a silencer.

[[Image:DesertEagle50AE.jpg|thumb|300px|none|IMI Desert Eagle XIX, .50 Action Express]]
It's recoil is greater than all other sidearms except for the Raging Bull. The Raging Bull and Desert Eagle often get one shot kills with a less than perfect shot. The one advantage to the Desert Eagle is that it has a larger ammo capacity than the Raging Bull.

== Taurus Raging Bull ==

The [[Raging Bull]] revolver appears in the game, it can only be modified with laser.

[[Image:Rb1.jpg‎|thumb|300px|none|Taurus Raging Bull, .454 Casull]]

== Heckler & Koch Mk 23 Mod 0 ==

The [[H&K Mk 23 Mod 0]] appears in the game, and can be modified like all the pistols. It is the most popular pistol on online servers.

[[Image:Mk23.jpg‎|thumb|300px|none|Heckler & Koch Mk 23 Mod 0 .45 ACP]]

== Glock 18 ==

The [[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] appears in the game and can be modified with a laser.

[[Image:Glock18c_01-1-.jpg|thumb|none|300px|[[Glock#Glock 18|Glock 18]] 9mm]]

== Heckler & Koch MP5A5/MP5N ==

The [[H&K MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5A5|H&K MP5A5/MP5N]] is in the game as the "MP5N" cosign used by the United States Navy and is modifiable like all weapons in the game.

[[Image:H&KMP5A5.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Heckler and Koch MP5A5 9mm]]
[[Image:MP5vegas.jpg|thumb|none|350px|MP5A5s being fired in ''Rainbow Six: Vegas'']]

== Ingram MAC-11 ==

The [[MAC-10|Ingram MAC-11]] is in the game and like the other weapons, it can be modified. It is incorrectly shown firing from a closed bolt instead of open-bolt.

[[Image:Mac m11 9k.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Ingram MAC-11, .380]]

== Fabrique Nationale P90 ==

The [[FN P90]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:FNP90.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Fabrique Nationale P90, 5.7x28mm]]

== Heckler & Koch MP7A1 ==

The [[Heckler & Koch MP7A1]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything. The MP7A1 is the Secondary weapon for Jung when he isn't using a G36C and for Walter when he isn't using a Mk.48 machine gun.

[[Image:Mp7a1.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch MP7A1, 4.6x30mm]]
[[Image:MP7A1Vegas.jpg|thumb|none|400px|H&K MP7A1 in action, teammate Jung with H&K G36C and teammate Walter with Mk. 48]]

== Heckler & Koch UMP ==

The [[H&K UMP]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:UMP 45.jpg|thumb|none|350px|H&K UMP45 factory standard model - .45 acp]]

== Brügger & Thomet MP-9 ==

The [[Steyr TMP#Brugger & Thomet MP-9|Brügger & Thomet MP-9]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:Mp9tmp.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Brügger & Thomet MP-9 9x19mm]]
[[Image:MP9.jpg|thumb|none|400px|B&T MP9 with Reflex sight seen in third-person view, Xbox 360 version]]

== SIG SG 552 ==

The [[SIG SG 550#SIG SG 552|SIG SG 552]] appears in the game as the "552 Commando" and can be modified with everything.

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|500px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]
[[Image:Sig552vegas.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The "552 Commando" in ''Rainbow Six: Vegas'']]

== Kalashnikov AK-47 ==

The [[AK-47]] is used by enemies in the Mexican levels, it can be modified with a lasersight, ACOG, holographic sight, and 3X Scope.

[[Image:AK-47.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Kalashnikov AK-47, 7.62x39mm]]
[[Image:AKOG.jpg|thumb|none|300px|AK-47 fitted with ACOG sight, Xbox 360 version]]

== Steyr AUG A3 ==

The [[Steyr AUG|Steyr AUG A3]] is in the game as the "AUG A3" and can be modified with everything.

[[Image:SteyrAugA3.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Steyr AUG A3 5.56mm with tactical flashlight/foregrip combo and red dot sight]]

== GIAT FAMAS F1 ==

The [[FAMAS]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:Famas.jpg|thumb|none|350px|GIAT FAMAS F1, 5.56x45mm NATO]]
[[Image:FAMASacog.jpg|thumb|none|400px|FAMAS in the Xbox 360 version fitted with an ACOG sight.]]

== Heckler & Koch G36C ==

The [[Heckler & Koch G36#Heckler & Koch G36C|H&K G36C]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:Hkg36c.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Heckler & Koch G36C 5.56x45mm NATO]]

== Heckler & Koch G3KA4 ==

The [[Heckler & Koch G3#H&K G3KA4|H&K G3KA4]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:G3KA4.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch G3KA4, 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:G3KA4vegas.jpg|thumb|none|400px|H&K G3KA4 fitted with ACOG scope]]

== IMI Tavor TAR-21 ==

The [[Tavor TAR-21]] is in the game as the "MTAR-21" even though the MTAR-21 is actually the micro version, it can be modified with everything. It is very popular on online servers due to their high rate of fire. Players who have taken a liking to the Tavor have often been called "MTARDs".

[[Image:Tavor-tar.jpg|thumb|none|350px|IMI Tavor TAR-21 5.56x45mm NATO]]

== Heckler & Koch XM8 ==

The [[Heckler & Koch XM8]] is in the game as the "M8", it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:XM8.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch XM8 5.56mm]]
[[Image:XM8vegas.jpg|thumb|none|400px|XM8 in-game, teammate with MG36]]

== Fabrique Nationale SCAR-H ==

The [[FN SCAR#FN SCAR-H|FN SCAR-H]] is in the game, it can be modified with everything.

[[Image:FN_SCAR_-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Fabrique Nationale SCAR-H 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:SCAR.jpg|thumb|none|400px|FN SCAR-H in action.]]

== Benelli M3 Super 90 ==

The [[Benelli M3 Super 90]] appears in the game, it can be modified with lasersights, Rifle scope and Reflex sights.
[[Image:Benelli_m3-1-.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Benelli M3 Super 90, 12 Gauge]]

== Remington 870MCS (Modular Combat Shotgun) ==

The [[Remington 870]] appears in the game as the "870MCS", it can be modified with lasersights, Rifle scope and Reflex sights.
[[Image:Rem870mcs 14.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Remington 870 MCS 12 gauge]]

== Franchi SPAS-12 ==

The [[SPAS 12|Franchi SPAS-12]] appears in the game, it can be modified with lasersights, Rifle scope and Reflex sights.
[[Image:SPAS12.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Franchi SPAS-12, 12 Gauge]]
[[Image:Spas.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Spas 12, Xbox 360 version.]]

== XM-26 LSS ==

The [[XM-26 LSS|XM-26]] appears in the game, it can be modified with lasersights, Rifle scope and Reflex sights.
[[Image:XM26.jpg|thumb|none|300px|XM-26 LSS, 12 Gauge]]
[[Image:LSS.jpg|thumb|none|400px|XM-26 LSS, Xbox 360 version]]
In reality, the M26 is a under barrel mount system for a M4 carbine or a stand alone system. It does not have a semi auto or automatic capability.

== M40A1 Sniper Rifle ==

The [[M40 sniper rifle]] appears in the game, like the other sniper rifles, it can be modified with bigger scopes.

[[Image:M40a1standard-1-.jpg‎|thumb|none|400px|Remington M40 sniper rifle 7.62x51mm NATO]]

== Izhmash SV-98 ==

The SV-98 appears in the game, like the other sniper rifles, it can be modified with a 12x Scope.
[[Image:SV98.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Izhmash SV-98, 7.62x54mm]]

== Steyr Scout Tactical ==

The Scout appears in the game, like the other sniper rifles, it can be modified with a 12x Scope.
[[Image:Scout.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Steyr Scout Tactical, 7.62x51mm NATO]]

== Heckler & Koch PSG-1 ==

The [[Heckler & Koch PSG-1]] is in the game, like the other sniper rifles, it can be modified with a 12x Scope.
[[Image:H&KPSG01.jpg‎ |thumb|none|450px|Heckler & Koch PSG1 7.62x51mm NATO]]

== Mk 46 Mod 0 Light Machine Gun ==

The [[Mk 46 Mod 0 light machine gun]] is in the game, it can be modified with Reflex sight, laser sight, rifle scope and better stock.

[[Image:MK48.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Mk 46 Mod 0 machine gun 7.62x51mm NATO]]

== Heckler & Koch HK21E ==

The [[Heckler & Koch HK21E]] is in the game, it can be modified with Reflex sight, laser sight, rifle scope and better buttstock.
[[Image:HK21MachineGun.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Heckler & Koch HK21 Machine Gun - 7.62x51mm NATO]]

== M249 SAW ==

The [[M249 SAW|M249 SAW]] is in the game, it can be modified with Reflex sight, laser sight, rifle scope and better buttstock.
[[Image:Fn m249saw mk2 10-1-.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M249 SAW 5.56x45mm]]

== Heckler & Koch MG36==

The [[Heckler & Koch MG36]] is frequently used by enemies in the game, it can be modified with Reflex sight, laser sight, rifle scope and better buttstock.

[[Image:MG36.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch MG36 5.56mm with Beta-C drum magazine]]

[[Category:Video Game]]

The Unit

2009-01-20T22:41:07Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG 552 */

Transformers (2007)

2009-01-20T22:40:36Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG 552 */

'''The following weapons were used in the movie ''[[Transformers]]'':'''
[[Image:Transformers.jpeg|right|400px]]

==M4A1 Carbine==

There are several appearances throughout the early stages of the film of the [[M16 rifle series#M4/M4A1 Carbine|M4A1 carbine]], used by U.S. military personnel at the U.S. Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT) base during Blackout's attack, as well as by Captain William Lennox ([[Josh Duhamel]])'s special forces team. The M4A1's used by the special forces team are fitted with various SOPMOD accessories including ACOG scopes, AN/PEQ-2 IR designators (which are erroneously shown emitting a laser beam that can be seen by the naked eye instead of the real AN/PEQ-2's invisible Infra-Red laser), RIS foregrips, and camougflage paint schemes. Captain Lennox's M4A1 is perhaps the most heavily customized, featuring both M68 Aimpoint and AN/PVS-17 night-vision scopes, a Surefire M900 weaponlight foregrip, and a custom muzzle brake, as well as the aforementioned AN/PEQ-2.

[[Image:ColtM4.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M4A1 Carbine with M68 Aimpoint scope and RIS foregrip 5.56mm]]
[[Image:Trans-ColtM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Members of Captain Lennox's team flee from Scorponok while carrying M4A1's]]
[[Image:Transformers_01-1-.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox and Technical Sergeant Bobby Epps ([[Tyrese Gibson]]) armed with M4A1's]]
[[Image:TransformersM4A1 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Jorge "Fig" Figueroa ([[Amaury Nolasco]]) provides cover fire for Captain Lennox with his M4A1]]

== M203 Grenade Launcher ==

In addition to the accessories mentioned above, several M4A1's used by Lennox's team are equipped with [[M203 grenade launcher]]s, most notably Air Force Technical Sergeant Bobby Epps ([[Tyrese Gibson]]).

[[Image:CM4-M203.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M4A1 5.56mm with M203 grenade launcher 40mm]]
[[Image:TransformersM4A1M203 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Technical Sergeant Bobby Epps wields his M4A1/M203 during the battle with Scorponok]]
[[Image:TransformersM4A1M203 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A member of Lennox's team paints Scorponok with his M4A1/M203's AN/PEQ-2 IR designator, the beam erronously shown being visible to the naked eye]]

== M16A2 Rifle ==

There are two brief appearances of [[M16 rifle series#M16A2 Rifle|M16A2 rifles]] in the film, first in the hands of soldiers responding to Blackout's arrival at the SOCCENT base when he begins his attack, and later in the hands of soldiers guarding Air Force One as Frenzy sneaks off the plane.

[[Image:M16A2.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M16A2 5.56mm]]
[[Image:TransformersM16A2 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|The soldier on the right aims his M16A2 rifle at Blackout just before he begins his attack]]
[[Image:TransformersM16A2 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A soldier stand guard over Air Force One armed with an M16A2 rifle]]

==Custom Mossberg 590==

A heavily-customized [[Mossberg 500-series shotgun#Mossberg 590|Mossberg 590]] (similar to that seen in ''[[Rambo (2008)|Rambo]]'') is seen in this film, as used by Agent Simmons ([[John Turturro]]) and Maggie Madsen ([[Rachael Taylor]]). It has a Magpul M93A rear stock attached to a Mesa Tactical M4 adapter block and a Mesa Tactical Top receiver Rail with an EOTech holographic Sight.

[[Image:Mossberg 590.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Mossberg 590 12 gauge]]
[[Image:TransformersMossbergTactical 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Maggie Madsen dodges Frenzy's shurikens while wielding a customized Mossberg 590 shotgun]]

==Milkor M32 MGL==

There are several appearances throughout the film of the [[Milkor MGL#M32 MGL|M32 MGL]] grenade launcher. It can first be seen as the alternate weapon of ACWO Jorge "Fig" Figueroa ([[Amaury Nolasco]]), carried in a custom scabbard on his back when not in use, and later on by other members of Captain Lennox's teams as well as Sector Seven personnel including Agent Simmons. The M32's seen on-screen appear in both standard black and desert tan finishes and are fitted with the factory Armson OEG reflex sights as well as at least one fitted with a C-More red dot sight. Captain Lennox's M32 is also shown mounting a laser target designator on the side of the barrel.

[[Image:Milkor M32.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M32 MGL 40mm as used in the film]]
[[Image:TransformersM32 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A member of Captain Lennox's team aims an M32 MGL fitted with a C-More red dot sight during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersM32 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox aims an M32 MGL at Devastator during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersM32 3.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Agent Simmons loads up an M32 MGL]]

==DefTech 37mm Launcher==

In addition to the M32 MGL's, Sector Seven soldiers and some of Captain Lennox's men can also be seen using [[DefTech 37mm launcher|DefTech 37mm grenade launchers]] during the final battle, equipped with folding stocks.

[[Image:Federallabs37.jpg|thumb|none|350px|DefTech 37mm launcher with folding stock]]
[[Image:TransformersDefTech37 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier aims his DefTech 37mm launcher at Blackout during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersDeftechGL 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|One of Captain Lennox's men loads up a DefTech 37mm launcher in preparation for the final battle]]

==L6 Grenade Launcher==

During the final battle, Tech. Sergeant Bobby Epps uses an [[L6 grenade launcher]] fitted with a C-More red dot sight (similar to that used in ''[[Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines]]'') as his weapon of choice.

[[Image:Mod._L6_37mm-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|L6 grenade launcher 37mm with C-More red dot sight as used in the film]]
[[Image:TransformersL6 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Tech. Sergeant Epps with an L6 grenade launcher during the final battle in Mission City]]

==Custom M1911A1==

Captain Lennox can be seen carrying a customized [[M1911 pistol series#M1911A1|M1911A1]] as his sidearm, using it to threaten Sector Seven agents during the standoff.

[[Image:M1911Colt.jpg|thumb|none|300px|M1911A1 .45 ACP]]
[[Image:1911.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox aims his M1911A1 at Sector Seven personnel]]
[[Image:TransformersM1911A1 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Closeup of Captain Lennox's M1911A1 as he holds it on Agent Simmons]]

==SIG SG 552==

During the standoff between Sector Seven and Captain Lennox's team, one of the Sector Seven soldiers can be seen aiming a [[SIG SG 550#SIG SG 552|SIG SG 552]] at Captain Lennox.

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|500px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]
[[Image:TransformersSG552.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier aims his SIG SG 552 at Captain Lennox]]

==M249 SAW Para==

Several members of Capt. Lennox's team can be seen carrying [[FN Minimi#M249-E1 / M249-E2 / M249 Paratrooper SAW|M249 Paratrooper SAW]]s fitted with an unknown scope as their main weapons, primarily during the battle with Scorponok.

[[Image:Fn_mg_m249para11-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M249 SAW 5.56mm paratrooper version with 200 round ammo drum]]
[[Image:TransformersSAWPara 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Special Forces team members wielding paratrooper M249 SAW's during the battle with Scorponok]]

==Heckler & Koch UMP==

Sector Seven soldiers can be seen using [[Heckler & Koch UMP]]'s in several scenes during the film, fitted with vaying accessories including C-More red dot sights.

[[Image:UMP 45.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch UMP .45 ACP]]
[[Image:TransformersUMP 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier (right) disembarks from a Blackhawk helicopter carrying a Heckler & Koch UMP]]
[[Image:TransformersUMP 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier with a Heckler & Koch UMP during the final battle in Mission City]]

==Brügger & Thomet GL-06==

Another weapon used by Sector Seven soldiers and Captain Lennox's team during the final battle are several heavily-modified [[Brügger & Thomet GL-06]] grenade launchers, covered in Hollywood embellishments and fitted with an unknown red dot sight. Captain Lennox most notably uses one when he charges Blackout on a comandeered motorcycle, skidding underneath the Decepticon to get a clear shot at the robot's weakly-armored lower body.

[[Image:TransformersGL06 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Captain Lennox fires a GL-06 grenade launcher as Blackout during the final battle]]
[[Image:TransformersGL06 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|One of Captain Lennox's men aims a Brügger & Thomet GL-06 during the final battle]]

==Lee-Enfield No.1 Mk III* Rifle==

Members of a village militia in Qatar were seen armed with [[Short Magazine Lee-Enfield (SMLE)|Lee-Enfield No.1 Mk III* rifles]] during the battle with Scorponok.

[[Image:SMLE.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Lee-Enfield No.1 Mk III* .303 British]]
[[Image:TransformersEnfield.JPG|thumb|none|400px|villiage militia members carrying SMLE No.1 Mk III* rifles following the battle with Scorponok in Qatar]]

==AK-47==

One of the village militia members in Qatar was seen armed with an [[AK-47]] at the beginning of the battle with Scorponok.

[[Image:Ak_54.jpg|thumb|350px|none|AK-47 7.62x39mm]]

==RPG-7==

While at Sector Seven HQ, the power of the Allspark is demonstrated when Glen Whitmann ([[Anthony Anderson]])'s cellphone is used to create a new transformer, the feral robot producing several weapons including a shoulder-mounted [[RPG-7]] launcher.

[[Image:Rpg-7-1-.jpg‎ |thumb|none|350px|RPG-7 40mm]]
[[Image:TransformersRPG7.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A transformer created from Glen's cellphone sprouts a shoulder-mounted RPG-7 launcher]]

== GE M134 Minigun ==

In addition to the RPG-7 mentioned above, the feral transformer created from Glen's cellphone is also armed with a [[GE M134 Minigun]], mounted underneath its' body.

[[Image:M134.JPG|thumb|none|300px|GE M134 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:TransformersRPG7.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A transformer created from Glen's cellphone is armed with a GE M134 Minigun mounted beneath its' body]]

==SIG-Sauer P226==

Secret Service agents onboard Air Force One can be seen using [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P226|SIG-Sauer P226]] pistols as their sidearms (an anachronism; the Secret Service never used the P226, only the [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P228|P228]] and [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P229|P229]]). A cop at the police station ([[Rick Gomez]]) also brandishes a P226 while threatening Sam Witwicky ([[Shia LaBeouf]]) during his interrogation.

[[Image:SigP226.jpg|thumb|none|300px|SIG-Sauer P226 9mm]]
[[Image:TransformersP226 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Secret Service agent wields a SIG-Sauer P226 aboard Air Force One]]
[[Image:TransformersP226 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|"You eye-ballin' my piece Fifty Cent?" A cop dislays his SIG-Sauer P226 while threatening Sam during his interrogation]]

==Beretta 92FS==

The [[Beretta 92 pistol series#Beretta 92FS|Beretta 92FS]] can be seen in the hands of a police officer who arrests Sam when he reports his car stolen.

[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|300px|none|Beretta 92FS 9mm]]
[[Image:Transformers92FS 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A police officer aims his Beretta 92FS at Sam as he arrests him]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5K==

The [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5K|Heckler & Koch MP5K]] can be seen being used by Secret Service agents onboard Air Force One, as well as by a Sector Seven agent ([[Brian Stepanek]]) when meeting the Autobots, the latter being disarmed of his weapon by Jazz.

[[Image:MP5KA3.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Heckler & Koch MP5K 9mm]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5K 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Secret Service agents arm themselves with Heckler & Koch MP5K's during Frenzy's attack aboard Air Force One]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5K 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven agent draws a Heckler & Koch MP5K during the confrontation with the Autobots]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5A5==

Sector Seven agents can be seen brandishing [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5A5|Heckler & Koch MP5A5]]'s in their first meeting with the Autobots, but are promptly disarmed by Jazz. FBI agents cn also be seen carying them during the raid on Glen's home, fitted with Surefire dedicated forend weaponlights.

[[Image:H&KMP5A5.jpg‎|thumb|none|350px|Heckler & Koch MP5A5 9mm]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5A5 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Sector Seven agents brandishing Heckler & Koch MP5A5's when meeting the Autobots]]
[[Image:TransformersMP5A5 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An FBI agent brandishes a Heckler & Koch MP5A5 during the raid on Glen's home]]

==Heckler & Koch G36C==

When the FBI storms Glen's home, several agents can be seen armed with [[Heckler & Koch G36#Heckler & Koch G36C|Heckler & Koch G36C]]'s fitted with tactical flashlights. Sector Seven soldiers can also be seen carrying G36C's, as well as one of Captain Lennox's men during the standoff at Sector Seven HQ.

[[Image:Hkg36c.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Heckler & Koch G36C 5.56mm]]
[[Image:TransformersG36C 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An FBI agent with his Heckler & Koch G36C slung as he tackles Glen's cousin ([[Omar Benson Miller]]) into a swimming pool]]
[[Image:TransformersG36C 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A Sector Seven soldier brandishes a Heckler & Koch G36C as he arrests Sam and Mikaela Banes ([[Megan Fox]])]]
[[Image:TransformersG36C 3.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A sector Seven soldier and one of Captain Lennox's men aim Heckler & Koch G36C's at each other during the standoff]]

==Winchester Model 1912==

A [[Winchester Model 1912]] pump-action shotgun was used by Secretary of Defense John Keller ([[Jon Voight]]) at Sector Seven headquarters, in which Keller used the Model 1912 shotgun to fight off Frenzy.

[[Image:Winchester Model 1912.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Winchester Model 1912 12 guage]]
[[Image:Transformers1912.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Secretary of Defense John Keller fires a Winchester Model 1912 at Frenzy]]

== Browning M2 Heavy Machine Gun ==

Several [[Browning M2]] heavy machine guns were seen mounted on the roofs of US military Humvees in Qatar when Blackout attacked the SOCCENT base. The Decepticon Devastator can also be seen with a pair of M2's atop the turret of his tank form.

[[Image:BrowningM2.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Browning M2 .50 BMG]]
[[Image:TransformersM2BMG 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An M2 Browning mounted atop a Humvee during the SOCCENT base attack]]
[[Image:TransformersM2BMG 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Devastator in his tank form, complete with a pair of Browning M2 heavy machine guns atop his turret]]

==M240G Machine Gun==

During the attack on the SOCCENT base in Qatar, [[FN MAG#M240 Machine Gun|M240G machine guns]] can be seen mounted on several Humvees as well as UH-60 Blackhawk helicopters shown searching for survivors following the attack.

[[Image:Fn_mag_g.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M240G 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:TransformersM240 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|A U.S. soldier opens up on Blackout with an M240G machine gun]]
[[Image:TransformersM240 2.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An M240G machine gun door-mounted on a Blackhawk searching for survivors of the SOCCENT base attack]]

==M60D Machine Gun==

During the final battle, several UH-60 Blackhawks sent to airlift Sam and the Allspark out of Mission City can be seen armed with door-mounted [[M60 machine gun#M60D Machine Gun|M60D machine gun]]s.

[[Image:M60d.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M60D machine gun 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:TransformersM60D 1.JPG|thumb|none|400px|An M60D machine gun door-mounted on a U.S. Army UH-60 Blackhawk]]

[[Category:Movie]]
[[Category:Science-Fiction]]
[[Category:Action Movie]]

The Incredible Hulk (2008)

2009-01-20T22:40:09Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG-552 */

[[Image:Incredible-Hulk-poster.jpg‎|thumb|right|300px|The Incredible Hulk (2008)]]

'''The following firearms appear in ''[[The Incredible Hulk (2008)]]'':'''

== Pistols ==

=== SIG-Sauer P226R ===

All of the soldiers in the movie use [[Sig Sauer P220 pistol series#SIG P226|SIG-Sauer P226R]] (rail-frame) pistols as their sidearms. Emil Blonsky ([[Tim Roth]]) uses his to threaten Dr. Sterns.

[[Image:P226R.jpg|thumb|400px|none|SIG-Sauer P226R 9mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-182278.png|thumb|500px|none|The soldier behind Blonsky is armed with a SIG-Sauer P226R.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-215162.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky threatens Dr. Sterns with his SIG P226R]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-212898.png|thumb|500px|none|A close-up of the P226R being held on Sterns.]]

=== Beretta 92F ===

The [[Beretta M92F|Beretta 92FS]] is used by many of the New York City police officers during the final battle between Hulk and the Abomination.

[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|255px|none|Beretta 92FS 9mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-222852.png|thumb|500px|none|NYPD officers firing their Beretta 92Fs at the Abomination.]]

=== Glock 17 ===

[[Glock#Glock 17|Glock 17s]] are also used by some of the New York City police officers.

[[Image:Glock17EarlyModel.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 17 9mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-232451.png|thumb|500px|none|More NYPD officers, armed mostly with Glock 17s.]]

=== Smith & Wesson Model 10 .38 Special Military & Police ===

In the alternate opening of the movie, Bruce Banner ([[Edward Norton]]) walks on top of a glacier, and pulls out an older Smith & Wesson Model 10 revolver. He aims the gun and cocks the hammer, only to transform into the Hulk, and crush the gun in his hand.

This early Model 10 appears to have had the standard 4-inch barrel cut down to about 3-inches.

[[Image:Hulk-Revolver-AO.jpg|thumb|420px|none|Bruce pulls out an unknown revolver.]]
[[Image:Hulk-Revolver-AO-2.jpg|thumb|420px|none|Bruce cocks the hammer of his revolver.]]
[[Image:Hulk-Revolver-AO-3.jpg|thumb|420px|none|Closeup of Bruce's revolver before he turns into the Hulk.]]

== Submachine Guns ==

=== Heckler & Koch MP5A3 ===

Emil Blonsky's ([[Tim Roth]]'s) weapon during the commando operations is a heavily modified [[Heckler & Koch MP5#Heckler & Koch MP5A3|Heckler & Koch MP5A3]], fitted with a tri-rail and a Surefire flashlight with a IR filter and cover. Apparently this and the other strike team with Blonsky had tranquilizer ammo in their magazines before switching to live ammo (in the movie's universe, apparently they can swap between tranq and live ammo without modifying the weapon externally in any way).

[[Image:MP5A3 StockCollapsed.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Heckler & Koch MP5A3 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-238431.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky prepares to enter Bruce's apartment in Brazil with his H&K MP5A3 ready.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-238699.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky in the apartment with his MP5A3 at ease.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-246391.png|thumb|500px|none|A close-up of the muzzle of Blonsky's MP5A3, showing off the accessories.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-249450.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky firing his MP5A3 at Hulk in the soft drink bottling factory.]]

=== FN P90 ===

An [[FN P90]] is used by one of the commandos.

[[Image:FNP90Side.jpg|thumb|none|400px|FN P90 5.7x28mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-240404.png|thumb|500px|none|One of the commandos pursuing Bruce with his FN P90 in hand.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-247153.png|thumb|500px|none|The commando with the P90 firing at Bruce in the soft drink bottling factory]]

=== Heckler & Koch UMP ===

A [[Heckler & Koch UMP]] is used by one of the commandos. It has a straight magazine, so it's either the .40 S&W or the .45 ACP model.

[[Image:UMP 45.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch UMP .45 acp]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-242879.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky leading the commandos into the factory; the one on the left behind him has an H&K UMP, either a .40 S&W or a .45 ACP model.]]

== Assault Rifles ==

=== M16A2/A4 ===

Nearly all of the U.S. military personnel in the movie use [[M16 rifle series#M16A2 Rifle|M16A2]] and [[M16 rifle series#M16A4 Rifle|M16A4]] assault rifles, and mostly the latter. A close inspection of many of the rifles reveals that they have the removable carry handles (which have been left on in the movie), which means they're M16A4s.

[[Image:M16A2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M16A2 - 5.56x45mm.]]
[[Image:M16A4Standard.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M16A4 5.56x45mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-174842.png|thumb|none|500px|U.S. soldiers firing at Hulk. The one in the lower left has an M16A2, but the other two appear to have M16A4s, judging by the removable carry handles.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-179002.png|thumb|500px|none|Hulk charges a group of soldiers who are firing their M16s at him.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-179745.png|thumb|500px|none|A soldier unloads his M16A2 into Hulk's back as Hulk rips apart a Humvee.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-220516.png|thumb|500px|none|Soldiers pursuing the Abomination in a Humvee; note the knobs on this soldier's M16 for the removable carry handle, indicating that the gun is clearly an M16A4.]]

=== M4A1 ===

[[M16 rifle series#M4/M4A1 Carbine|M4A1 carbines]] are also used by the U.S. military personnel in the movie, and by one of the commandos in Brazil. During the shootout at the university, Blonsky briefly grabs an M4 dropped by one of the soldiers and empties it at Hulk futilely. All of the M4s in the movie seem to have the older-style stocks even though the 6-position stock is much more common today.

[[Image:ColtM4 FirstVersion.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Colt M4 Carbine 5.56x45mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-247801.png|thumb|500px|none|One of the commandos firing at Hulk in the soft drink factory with a heavily kitted-out M4 Carbine.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-186157.png|thumb|500px|none|A discarded M4 lying on the grass before Blonsky picks it up.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-186673.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky takes aim at Hulk.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-186729.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky fires the M4 at Hulk.]]

=== SIG SG-552 ===

At least one of the commandos in the first battle with Hulk wields a tricked-out [[SIG SG 550#SIG SG 552|SIG SG-552]].

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|500px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-237478.png|thumb|500px|none|A commando with a SIG SG-552 prepares to breach Bruce's hideout in Brazil.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-242074.png|thumb|500px|none|The commando chases after Bruce, while showing off his SG-552's kit.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-249805.png|thumb|500px|none|The commando with the SG-552 fires at Hulk in the soft drink bottling factory.]]

=== Heckler & Koch G36C ===

A [[Heckler & Koch G36#Heckler & Koch G36C|Heckler & Koch G36C]] is used by one of the commandos.

''Note: The actor playing this particular commando is [[Al Vrkljan]], who was also one of the movie's armorers. Mr. Vrkljan has also posted on IMFDB and provided much of the info on particular types of weapons seen here, for which IMFDB is extremely grateful!''

[[Image:Hkg36c.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Heckler & Koch G36C - 5.56x45mm.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-238020.png|thumb|500px|none|The commando with the H&K G36C prepares to breach Bruce's apartment.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-251687.png|thumb|500px|none|The G36C-toting commando blasts away at Hulk in the soft drink bottling factory.]]

== Machine guns ==

=== M240B ===

During the battle at the university, an [[FN MAG|M240B]] general-purpose machine gun is fired at Hulk by one of the soldiers.

[[Image:M240-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M240B 7.62x51mm NATO with newer style lower hand grip (designed to attach RIS rails via hex nut)]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-174292.png|thumb|500px|none|A soldier fires an M240B at Hulk.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-20103.png|thumb|500px|none|]]

=== Browning M2 ===

The [[Browning M2]] heavy machine gun is mounted on Humvees in the film.

[[Image:BrowningM2.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Browning M2 .50 BMG]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-175361.png|thumb|500px|none|A soldier manning a Browning M2 on a Humvee racks the charging handle before firing at Hulk.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-178787.png|thumb|500px|none|A Humvee chasing after Hulk with an M2 on top.]]

=== GE M134 Minigun ===

An [[GE M134 Minigun|M134 Minigun]] is mounted in the doorway of the CH-53 helicopter and fired at the Abomination unsuccessfully.

[[Image:Minigun.jpg|thumb|none|400px|GE M134 with flash suppressor, 7.62x51mm]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-227022.png|thumb|500px|none|General Ross ([[William Hurt]]) orders the door gunner in the Sea Stallion to fire at the Abomination with his M134 Minigun.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-227515.png|thumb|500px|none|The door gunner blasts away at the abomination with the Minigun.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-230753.png|thumb|500px|none|Betty Ross ([[Liv Tyler]]) shouting a warning to Hulk from the crashed helicopter; note that she's grasping the barrels of the Minigun with her bare hand. Considering that the weapon has just been firing on full-auto for an extended period of time, it would be impossible for her to do this in real life without badly burning her hand.]]

== Sniper Rifle ==

=== Steyr HS.50 ===

A .50 BMG [[Steyr HS.50]] long-range rifle is used by a military sniper to fire a tranquilizer dart at Bruce Banner in New York City.

[[Image:Steyr50hs.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Steyr HS.50 .50 BMG]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-210670.png|thumb|500px|none|The marksman prepares to fire his Steyr HS.50 at Bruce.]]

== Heavy Weapons ==

=== Unknown multi-shot grenade launcher ===

Some of the soldiers in the movie use multi-shot grenade launchers to fire at Hulk, including Emil Blonsky. They look like they might be Defense Technologies 37mm launchers with Hollywood embellishments, or they might be the SL6.

[[Image:Deftech37(2).jpg|thumb|400px|none|Defense Technologies 37mm launcher.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-173149.png|thumb|500px|none|Two soldiers fire their multi-shot grenade launchers (Def Techs?) at Bruce while he's trapped in an overpass at the university library.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-172744.png|thumb|500px|none|A close-up of the business end of one of the launchers.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-183240.png|thumb|500px|none|Blonsky takes one of the launchers and fires HE grenades at Hulk.]]

===Unknown (fake?) rocket launcher===

The soldiers who are chasing the Abomination, realizing the futility of firing at him with their M16s, grab an anti-tank rocket launcher from the back of their Humvee, but this also proves useless, because the Abomination grabs the rocket from the air. The launcher does not appear to be based on any type of existing weapon, and was most likely a prop fabricated almost completely from scratch.

[[Image:Vlcsnap-223304.png|thumb|500px|none|Two soldiers open up a case containing a (fictitious) RPG-type rocket launcher.]]
[[Image:Vlcsnap-223546.png|thumb|500px|none|One of the soldiers fires the launcher.]]

== Other weapons ==

===M84 'Flash and bang' Grenade ===

Used by one of the commandos.

[[Image:Vlcsnap-13442.png|thumb|500px|none|]]

[[Category:Movie]]

Assault on Precinct 13 (2005)

2009-01-20T22:39:16Z

Gunner313: /* SIG SG 552 */

[[Image:precinct13.jpg|thumb|right|300px|Assault on Precinct 13 (2005)]]

'''The following guns were used in the movie [[Assault on Precinct 13 (2005)|Assault on Precinct 13]]'''

==SIG SG 552==
One of the weapons in which Marcus Duvall's men use are heavily customized [[SIG SG 550|SIG SG 552]]. These 552s have Aimpoint M68 red dote sights, suppressers, red lasers, flashlights, and forward rail grips. Sgt. Jake Roenick ([[Ethan Hawke]]), Marion Bishop ([[Laurence Fishburne]]), and and Beck ([[John Leguizamo]]) also use this rifle.

[[Image:SIG_SG552.jpg|thumb|500px|none|SIG SG 552 5.56mm]]
[[Image:AOP13-SG552-1.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Roenick grabs an SG 552 off the body of one of Duvall's men.]]
[[Image:AOP13-SG552-2.jpg|thumb|400px|none|One of Duvall's men wielding a SG 552.]]
[[Image:AOP13-SG552-3.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Beck with a SG 552.]]
[[Image:AOP13-SG552-4.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Bishop with a SG 552, notice how there's no trigger guard.]]

=== Special ===

[[Image:AOP13-Special-SG552.jpg|thumb|400px|none|The Armorer of the movie, Charles Taylor shows off one of the Sig SG 552s used in the movie.]]

== Beretta 92FS ==

The Beretta shows up in the hands of Jasper, the secretary, Marcus Duvall,as well as his men. It's also used by the corrections officers,and Bishop ([[Laurence Fishburne]]). It appears to be the standard issue sidearm of the police department.

[[Image:BerettaM92FS.jpg|thumb|none|350px|[[Beretta M92F|Beretta 92FS]] 9mm]]
[[Image:AOP13-Beretta-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|An undercover cop grabs a Beretta from behind a stereo in the beginning of the movie]]
[[Image:AOP13-Beretta-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The female undercover cop armed with a 92FS in the beginning of the movie]]
[[Image:AOP13-Beretta-3.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Two of Duvall's men armed with suppressed 92FS handguns.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Beretta-4.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Sgt. Jasper ([[Brian Dennehy]]) fires his 92FS out a window.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Beretta-5.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Roenick turns off the safety on Sabian's ([[Maria Bello]]) 92FS.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Beretta-6.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Bishop holds a 92FS on Ferry ([[Drea De Matted]]) after escaping Precinct 13]]
[[Image:AOP13-Beretta-7.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Mike Kahane ([[Currie Graham]]) with a 92FS towards the end of the movie.]]

==Beretta 92FS Inox==

Beretta 92FS Inox handguns are used by the two Russian gangsters in the beginning of the film. One of Bishop's men also uses one at the church.

[[Image:Beretta-Inox.jpg|thumb|none|300px|[[Beretta M92F|Beretta 92FS Inox]] 9mm]]
[[Image:AOP13-92FS-Inox-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A Russian gangster fires his Beretta Inox while fleeing from Roenick and his unit.]]
[[Image:AOP13-92FS-Inox-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of Bishop's men fires at the police with a Beretta Inox before being shot himself.]]

== Para Ordnance Carry LDA 1911 ==

A crooked cop in the church holds a Para Ordnance Carry LDA 1911 on Bishop, but Bishop disarms him and kills him with a knife before he can use it.

[[Image:AOP13-LDA.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A crooked cop pulls a Para Ordnance Carry LDA 1911 on Bishop in the church.]]

=== Special===

[[Image:AOP13-Special-LDA.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Movie's armorer, Charles Taylor shows off the Para Ordnance Carry LDA 1911 used in the movie.]]

== SIG Sauer P226 ==
Marion Bishop ([[Laurence Fishburne]]) is carrying a two tone SIG P226 when he is captured at the church.

[[Image:SigP226TwoTone03.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Two-tone [[SIG-Sauer P220 pistol series|SIG-Sauer P226]] 9mm]]
[[Image:AOP13-P226-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Bishop fires his P226 in the air in the church to create a distraction.]]
[[Image:AOP13-P226-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Bishop about to drop his P226 after being surround by police.]]

=== Special ===

[[Image:AOP13-Special-P226.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The Movie's armorer, Charles Taylor shows off the two tone Sig Sauer P226 used by Lawrence Fishburne in the movie.]]
Hmmm, this makes me wish I hadn't deleted the old picture of the two-tone P226. The one in the movie is a newer production P226 with a milled slide, whereas the one we have now is the older production model with the stamped slide.

I see what you mean, oh well. It shouldn't make too much of a difference, it's still the same gun overall.

:Yeah, I guess. Also, it's pretty rare to see the milled ones in movies. Even though the stamped-slide P226s have not been produced for over 10 years, most of the movies being made even today still use them, just because armorers don't rush out to replace something they already have in inventory when the difference between old and new versions amounts to minor design changes. That's also why you see older-model Taurus PT92s, Gen 2 Glocks, etc. in many movies.

:Also, seems like he filed down the top of the barrel a bit too much; it looks almost like it was ground straight into the chamber.

I see, that makes sense, and there's nothing like the classic versions. That's how they modify guns to fire Blanks? I'll have to look for that in other movies, and yea it looks like he did overdo the filing, it looks like a good amount of the top of the chamber is gone.

:Yeah, some pistols need to have the top of the barrel filed down in order to function reliably with blanks. Most of the P220 series do, and so do H&K USPs, I believe.

==PARA ORDNANCE P-13 Limited==
Sgt. Jake Roenick ([[Ethan Hawke]]) carries a stainless Para Ordnance P-13, a high capacity .45 semi-auto.

[[Image:AOP13-P.14-1.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Roenick's P-13 laying in the snow as he fights with one of Duvall's men near the bus.]]
[[Image:AOP13-P.14-2.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Roenick firing his P-13 out a window.]]
[[Image:AOP13-P.14-3.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Roenick draws his P-13.]]
[[Image:AOP13-P.14-4.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Roenick walks throught the woods cautiosely with his P-13 drawn towards the end of the film.]]
[[Image:AOP13-P.14-5.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Closeup of Roenick's P-13 as he walks through the woods.]]

=== Special ===

[[Image:AOP13-Special-P.14.jpg|thumb|400px|none|The movie's armorer, Charles Taylor shows off the Para Ordnance P-13 used by Ethan Hawke in the movie.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Special-P.14-2.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Closeup of the P-13.]]

==Accuracy International AWP ==
Another weapon in which Marcus Duvall's men use is the [[Accuracy International Arctic Warfare series#AWP|AWP]] sniper rifle.

''Just another trivia note: This is yet another of [[Al Vrkljan|Al Vrkljan's]] film roles.''

[[Image:AWP.gif|thumb|none|500px|Accuracy International AWP]]
[[Image:AOP13-L96A1-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of Duvall's snipers readies his L96A1.]]
[[Image:AOP13-L96A1-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of Duvall's snipers aims his L96A1.]]
[[Image:AOP13-L96A1-3.jpg |thumb|none|400px|Closeup of the bolt on the L96A1.]]
[[Image:AOP13-L96A1-4.jpg |thumb|none|400px|Another sniper aims his L96A1.]]
[[Image:AOP13-L96A1-5.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of the snipers takes aim on Smiley ([[Ja Rule]]).]]

==Heckler & Koch MP5A3==

Another weapon in which Duvall's men are armed with are heavily modified H&K MP5A3 submachineguns.

[[Image:MP5A3.jpg||thumb|none|300px|[[Heckler & Koch MP5|Heckler & Koch MP5A3]] 9mm with Stock Extended.]]
[[Image:AOP13-MP5.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of Duvall's men fires a heavily modified H&K MP5A3.]]

=== Special ===

[[Image:AOP13-Special-MP5.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The movie's Armorer, Charles Taylor shows off one of the Heckler & Koch MP5A3s used in the movie.]]

==M4A1==
One of Duvall's men is armed with an [[M16|M4A1]] assault rifle with a 40mm M203 Grenade Launcher attachment.

[[Image:ColtM4 FirstVersion.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Colt M4 Carbine - 5.56mm]]
[[Image:AOP13-M4-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of Duvall's men with an M4A1/M203 combo.]]
[[Image:AOP13-M4-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One Duvall's men aims his M4A1/M203 combo.]]

''That's not an M4, its a Colt Commando of some type, look at the permanent carryhandle. [[User:AdAstra2009]]''

The M4 Carbine had an integral carrying handle, the M4A1 has a removable carrying handle.

== M203 Grenade Launcher ==

One of Duvall's has an [[M203 grenade launcher]] on his M4A1, which he fires at the Precinct with destructive results.
[[Image:M203.jpg|thumb|none|300px|M203 grenade launcher 40mm]]
[[Image:AOP13-M203-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of Duvall's Men loads a 40mm grenade into his M203]]
[[Image:AOP13-M203-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Closeup of the trigger of the M203 before he fires.]]

== Mossberg 500 ==

One of the police that escorts Bishop to the prison bus is armed with a [[Mossberg 500]] shotgun. One of Duvall's men can also be seen using a Mossberg 500 with an extended magazine tube.

[[Image:Mossberg500.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Mossberg 500 Shotgun - .12 gauge]]
[[Image:50577.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Mossberg 500 - 12 gauge]]
[[Image:AOP13-Mossberg-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A police officer armed with a Mossberg 500 escorts Bishop to the prison bus.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Mossberg-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|One of Duvall's men armed with a Mossberg 500 with an extended magazine tube]]
[[Image:AOP13-Mossberg-3.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Closeup of the pump action on the Mossberg 500 before he uses it to breach a door.]]

== Remington 870 ==

The guards on the prison bus carry [[Remington 870]] shotguns, and Roenick also carries a Remington 870 in some scenes.

[[Image:Remington870PoliceStd.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Remington 870 Police Magnum Riot Shotgun - 12 gauge]]‎
[[Image:AOP13-Remington-870-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A guard on the prison bus aims a Remington 870 at Beck, demanding he sit back down.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Remington-870-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Another guard with an 870.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Remington-870-3.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Roenick holds an 870 on Bishop.]]

== Molotov Cocktail ==

After getting out of his cell, Bishops makes two Molotov Cocktails which he uses with deadly results on one of Duvall's men.

[[Image:AOP13-Molotov-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Bishop comes in with two Molotov.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Molotov-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Bishop lights up one of Duvall's men with two well placed Molotovs.]]

== M1928 Thompson ==

In the beginning of the film, Sgt. Jasper can be seen examining and talking about an [[Thompson Submachine Gun|M1928 Thompson]] in the evidence room. Anna ([[Aisha Hinds]]) also takes this weapon for her own use later in the movie.

[[Image:M1928.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M1928 "Tommy Gun" .45 ACP, made famous through countless classic gangster movies]]
[[Image:AOP13-Thompson-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Sgt. Jasper examines the "Tommy Gun" in the evidence room.]]
[[Image:AOP13-Thompson-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Anna with her freshly fired "Tommy Gun".]]
[[Image:AOP13-Thompson-3.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Anna with her "Tommy Gun"]]

===Special===
[[Image:AOP13-Special-Thompson.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The movie's armorer, Charles Taylor shows off the "Tommy Gun" used in the film.]]

[[Category:Movie]]